A Wiser Retirement®

273. How Early Retirement Affects Pilot Benefits

• Wiser Wealth Management • Episode 273

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Are you a pilot contemplating the possibility of retiring early? Join us on this episode of A Wiser Retirement® Podcast, where we explore the complexities surrounding the decision to leave the cockpit before the traditional retirement age. We dive deep into the unique emotional and financial considerations that come with this choice, focusing on the benefits and potential pitfalls of retiring around age 55. We shed light on crucial aspects such as healthcare coverage before turning 65, the option of part-time work for maintaining financial stability, and the importance of understanding your company’s travel benefits after retirement.

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Related Podcast Episodes:
- Ep 259: What Pilots and Others Should Consider 5 Years Before Mandatory Retirement
- Ep 234: Pilots, Maximize Your 401(k) Contributions!

Related YouTube Videos:
- Delta Pilots - Market Based Cash Balance Plan
- Why Financial Planning is Different for Pilots

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This podcast was produced by Wiser Wealth Management. Thanks for listening!

Introduction and Pilot Perspectives

Speaker 1

I get it, guys, I get it, and gals, I get it. Why You're like I don't want to do this anymore. I'm tired of doing this. But think about this You're flying across the world at six plus miles per hour in a tin can. There's less than 1% of you that gets to do this for a living, which is so cool. Welcome to Wiser Retirement Podcast Pilots. Are you curious about how retiring early could affect your benefits? I'm Casey Smith. Today I'm joined with Shauna Theriault, one of our pilot specialists. Each week, we bring you practical advice on retirement investing, planning for your financial future. Don't forget to subscribe to our podcast wherever you're listening. Let's get started, shauna.

Speaker 2

Absolutely Good morning.

Speaker 1

Good morning. So I, you know, we do a lot of pilot plans and I like doing a podcast dedicated to our pilot client base, which is a large and rapidly growing. Yeah, and you and I both come across situations where people say, hey, plan me to 55. I went out earlier, plan me to 50, which some of these young people could probably pull off. I thought we would just do a quick little episode on pilots retiring early because, well, there's there's many reasons why you would not want to retire early, in my opinion, but sometimes the walk in someone else's shoes is very different than walking in our own shoes watching them.

Speaker 1

Do that Right. Leaving your family to 15 days out of the month to travel is is different. Different to do it Right. I learned a long time ago when I was a pilot that flying a Boeing triple seven to Japan or someplace far away it sounds really cool. Uh, doing it is totally different on your body and on my uh. When we were doing uh speaking engagements back in the day, uh about exchange rated funds which had not been created in Asia yet, uh, I did a couple of checks across that side of the pond and I quickly realized that my body is not cut out for massive time change.

Speaker 2

You've said that on multiple occasions actually.

Speaker 1

If I had moved on to a major airline, I would have been the guy flying up and down the East Coast. Only that's what my body likes, so let's talk about this for a second. Here's my biggest concern is being an airline pilot. It can be very busy. You pick up extra trips, you're flying your assigned line that you get. But it could also be the best part-time job ever and in some scenarios, at some airlines, on some airplanes uh, there's a you have the ability to hide out. You have the ability to maybe do some alpha work uh, some management type work that keeps you home on the same time zone, more of a nine to five kind of a thing, right, yeah.

Speaker 1

So before you say I want to be out, maybe you find a place that you don't have to fly as much. And I know it at United, uh, delta somewhat at American you can. You can drop a lot of trips. You can drop down If someone's willing to take your line and you're senior enough to have the good line that people will say, hey, I'll, I'll take that. Um. You can drop down to maybe doing a trip a month, maybe a three day, four day um once a month and your pay's going to come way down. But you have to look at it as you're just part-time retired, right, and while you're part-time retired you're still getting the next year at Delta be 18% contribution into the 401k plan uh, 17% in other places.

Speaker 1

So you're still getting the, the defined contribution, into the 401k plan. I mean, if you were making $450,000 a year, that's probably roughly $81,000 at 18% that you're walking away from. Now, that's probably working your normal line. It would be less than that if you worked less.

Speaker 1

Also, too, if you were were disabled, you definitely would not be quitting right most airlines are still contributing to your 401k plan the defined contribution on your old pay, right, right and and you're collecting a paycheck until you're you're 65. So I I would say you just need to be cautious and understand what it is, why it is that you want to do this.

Speaker 2

Well, and plus, you know you have to think about the biggest thing is health insurance, right? So if you think about it, as even if you're working that part-time scenario you're talking about now, they're contributing that 18%, so you're not drawing from your portfolio for living expenses, maybe, you know, depending on what you're spending is. But you know, maybe you have that part-time income and maybe that does cover your expenses. So now you're not drawing, but you also have health insurance, right? So that's huge for you and your spouse?

Speaker 1

Um, you know, let's talk about that. Health insurance prior to 65 can get very expensive completely.

Speaker 2

So you have to get private insurance or you can go through the exchange Um, and there are subsidies in place and you may qualify for them, depending on your other income, or the government has, you know, given some subsidies to help pay for that. It offsets some of the costs, but it may be very costly for you. So now you're withdrawing from your portfolio and your pay and has to last you longer because you retired earlier and now you're paying for health insurance. Honestly, I feel like and I don't know if you see this, this is what I see I see a lot of pilots that come in and they're like okay, let me see what it looks like at age 55. And they can do it. I mean, you know they can do it, but the reality is most of them don't just like you're describing, because they could go to a lot of times. They get to 65 and they don't want to stop. It's like they want the age to go beyond A lot of times they get to 65 and they don't want to stop.

Speaker 2

You know, it's like they want the age to go beyond.

Speaker 1

A lot of people hoping for age 67. That didn't happen.

Speaker 2

Exactly so. You know it's you could be retireable, but you have to think about all the other things that go with it.

Speaker 1

So let's put a number to that. So you, in order to get the subsidy, you have to keep your income below 70,000 for your family, for healthcare. So think about that. You're retired, but you can't live on more than $70,000 in taxable income. If you have brokerage money, you can always pull that out, obviously, which?

Speaker 2

is an argument to have brokerage money, but you have to look at all of it, because dividends interest capital gains on that. And so I've been in a situation where someone retired and they had millions in retirement account $5 million and they had some brokerage money and it wasn't a ton and they were getting subsidies, and so we literally put this in a non-interest bearing account because it was. It was only a few hundred thousand that they had, which is not insignificant, but we couldn't get enough cashflow on it to warrant the subsidies they were getting if we were investing in stocks et cetera, because it was such a small amount to be invested. So many pilots have a lot in brokerage money and so it really depends on what the income is from that.

Speaker 1

Yeah, I would say, if you were trying to retire early, I wouldn't be doing like mega backdoor Ross at that point. I would just be putting it everything into brokerage account, anything extra. You still want to try to max out the 401k, that the normal way, but, um, uh, yeah, you want that flexibility at that point. You don't.

Speaker 1

You don't want to have to, um, have everything locked into your into retirement account or have to do a 72 t right you know where you have to take substantial and equal payments over five years or until age 65, whichever comes, whichever is longer right yeah, so, and you can do that, to access it without penalty, that's not a problem, but still yeah yeah, it limits you, though, if you needed extra money, right absolutely so I don't know. I would just want to start the conversation off saying, hey, I would just be careful. I think other things that you have to think about is life insurance. Hopefully, if you've done your retirement planning, you can retire at 55.

Speaker 2

And you don't need life insurance.

Speaker 1

Hopefully you won't need life insurance, right. But if you are trying to limp it along and life insurance, right, but if you, if you are trying to limp it along, uh, and life insurance closes the gap, if something happens to you, then, uh, your life insurance would, would not, um, would not, stay with you, uh, in a group setting. Uh, if you did the GVUL policies that most of the airlines have now, then you could pay for it to be ported. But can you really afford that at that point?

Speaker 3

That's a lot of money to port that out.

Speaker 1

Um, let's. Let's talk about travel benefits. You know, have you been at the airline long enough? Are you old enough to check the box that you can use your travel benefits, if that's what you're trying to do? So you want to double check what the your airline's policy is? Uh, on, on that kind of retirement, I think most of them. I think years of service and 55. Typically, we'll check box, yeah, but I would not want to be surprised and find out that you didn't get any travel benefits when you walked away.

Speaker 2

Absolutely.

Speaker 1

When you think about people who say they want to retire early. You just made a comment that kind of jogged my memory. I don't know A lot. Very often we will run that hey, can I retire early number. But it's also psychologically so much easier to go do something when you know you don't have to do it.

Speaker 2

Right, it kind of puts a different pep in your step If you're no. I'm re, I'm retireable. I'm coming here because I want to, not because.

Speaker 1

I have to Exactly.

Speaker 2

It kind of changes your perspective a little bit.

Speaker 1

Right when you, when you know that you can just walk away. And I would say in the airline world for pilots things are more stressful now there aren't as many one-leg, two-leg trips, at least on the narrowbodies that what this is just working with. Hundreds of people tell me In our world, at the regional level, we would do four, five, six, seven legs in a day and then get minimum night rest and go to the next day and do it again, and some of that efficiency is probably the proper term to use is has has come to the majors, where it didn't used to be that way, and so you're working harder. It used to be, you know, at least in the Delta system seven, five, seven, six. There was an international side, there was a domestic side. Now it's all mixed in so you can do pretty much anything, and so that creates more wear and tear. If one day you're here, next day you're way over there.

Speaker 2

Right, just different, different types of schedules and Just different type schedules.

Speaker 1

And then also now, just looking at recent news, there's some new people in charge of the FAA. And after this recent Southwest go-around which is normal, with a flex jet taxiing across the runway, the captain did his job. He said oh, there's someone on the runway, I'm going to go around. It happens all the time, and yet this becomes sensationalized after the last two crashes. But the FAA director came out and was like hey, if any pilot violates anything, they're going to have their license revoked immediately. Well, that doesn't really produce a culture of of safety. It's a fear, right? Yes, and you have to understand that it's. It's not a whole lot different than driving your car. You drive your car every day. You get complacent. You, when you, when you're a new driver, you got two hands, ten and two. You're driving down the road and you're just like, okay, I'm a new driver, I'm not gonna mess this up. You know what? Probably six months, let's. Let's just say, for example, two years later, you're eating a burger.

Speaker 3

You're, you're you got you got a client on your cell phone. You get the knee holding the car.

Speaker 1

Uh, and aviation is not exactly like that, but you do get complacent because it's routine. It's over and over and over and over again. One one leg after another, right.

Speaker 2

Yeah.

Speaker 1

Uh, and so we're human and mistakes tend to happen. Uh, and so this, this would add more job pressure to people where they're like, oh my gosh, like if I screw up, um, you know. I may be out of my livelihood, which will, which will kind of crash with uh, our clash with um, with the, with the unions and how all that works. And even loss of license. We think medical, but loss of license might have to be something else. Yeah, Might need different type of insurance, If that even exists?

Speaker 4

I don't know. Hey, fellow aviators, Before we dive back into this episode, I've got some awesome news to share. On our website, we've got a freebie just for you. Our team of financial advisors has done the legwork to provide you with free 401k allocations for all the major airlines. Getting your hands on your airline's specific allocation is a breeze. Just click the link in the episode notes or head over to pilotretirementcom. Now let's get back to the good stuff in this episode.

Speaker 1

This is an old story that usually I've known. I don't think I've ever told too many pilot stories on the podcast, but there's this old story that this is one of my last flights and there was a very senior Delta captain jump seating, and he was. He was riding to Charleston, south Carolina, and uh this was to kind of put I was at Atlanta Southeast airlines and when we got sold by Delta we started flying for other airlines. So I was actually working in United flight that was going from Dallas to Charleston. So this guy was jump seating. For whatever reason, I don't know how he got there, but he was there. And he he says I'm retiring this is 10 years ago because I'm retiring at just the right time. He's like I've been flying the same route, which, for those of you who are not in aviation pilots did not follow the same route over and over, unless you're in like the top 1% and you get to bid first on what you want. That is a possible thing.

Speaker 1

But he liked flying the flight to Greece, atlanta to Greece and he'd been doing this for years. And of course, the flight attendants, who were super senior, who were probably like our grandma's age, they also liked doing this flight and so they all kind of gravitated over the years that they would do this flight very often together. So he came in and he asked he came in and he realized that there was, this was not the normal crew. Well, they had taken all the flight attendants on a reschedule and they sent them somewhere else. And they sent a different crew. Of course it's a younger crew. And they said or he walked in, he grabbed a whole stack of bananas to eat, you know, on the trip it's a long trip, right, a lot of bananas. And the flight attendant told him hey, captain, those are for the first class passengers, those aren't for you. And he says I'm the captain, I'm taking the bananas. So he takes, he just takes them anyway. The flight attendant writes them up for creating a hostile work environment.

Speaker 1

He gets a call from the chief pilot's office. But he'd never been called from the chief pilot's office in the 35 years he'd been flying for Delta airlines, right, he gets a call from the chief pilot's office. He thought it was his buddy and so his buddy, his buddy, uh, was not calling him, it was a real cheap pilot. But he didn't know that. So he kept hanging up on him, going dude, this is not funny. Like this is my off day, leave me alone, you know I'm trying to do something. And finally he says this is a land ship pilot and you will not hang up again.

Speaker 1

He's like oh, okay, so sorry, I really thought you were my buddy playing the joke. He goes we need to talk about this flight. You know you've created a hostile work environment. We're just going to let you know that that please, you know you need to refrain from doing this again. Bananas are for the passengers, not for the pilots. You have a crew meal or something like that. And he was like, oh my gosh, this is ridiculous. I've been here for and this has never happened to me before. So then he ends up going back to the normal trip. They got the normal flight tents where it had spread, and so they found every banana they could on the concourse. They took all the bananas and he filled the cockpit up with nothing but bananas. You could hardly step in it because there are bananas everywhere, right?

Speaker 2

Oh my gosh.

Speaker 1

So that's. I think that's the funniest story of a symbolization of like the old world and then the new world.

Pilots Early Retirement: Reasons and Considerations

Speaker 1

These are the pressures that new pilots are working under this PC environment, versus the good old days where everyone just kind of laughed and had a good time in a safe environment, right? So I get it. Guys, I get it, and gals, I get it. Why are you like I don't want to do this anymore? I'm tired of doing this. But think about this. You're flying across the world at six plus miles per hour in a 10 can. There's less than 1% of you that gets to do this for a living, which is so cool. It's so cool. So it's a real privilege to be in the industry and you have to think about that.

Speaker 1

We work with pilots from all over the spectrum on on airlines and I'd say the most angry people that we've worked with have been jet blue pilots. The jet blue pilots are just not happy a bunch. I don't. I don't know why, but I've gotten several phone calls over the years go, hey, you left the industry. You started a business. I want to start a business. Tell me about this. I said well, what do you want to start? Well, I don't know yet. Okay, just not be here.

Speaker 1

I have to give him a pep talk. I'm like you have the coolest job ever. What's your favorite? What's the favorite part of your job? He's like oh, you know mornings and just kind of watching the sunrise or the sunset or the night flights. When we're up high and clear night, I see the shooting stars or all the really cool things. Yeah, that are places I would never have gone my own but ended up there. So think about the positive things about what you're doing, because, for whatever reason, pilots can tend to be a negative, negative bunch. Uh, I joke and I and I've said this in other podcasts uh, a lot of pilots tend to be preppers and have prepper tendencies. They're not actually preppers but have prepper tendencies. Uh, and they can be a little negative at times. But you know, just think about how hard you've worked to do what you do, yeah, and now that contracts are paying fair wages, the benefits you have to your family going forward.

Speaker 1

I mean the things that you can do for even the next generation if you manage your money well.

Speaker 2

Yeah.

Speaker 1

We don't have too many pilots that hit the the uh stereotype of four four wives, all former flight attendants, and, you know, 25 kids around the world. We don't see any of those here. But, uh, for the good savers and the people that are that are really benefiting, looking to benefit their family, I mean what a great opportunity.

Speaker 2

Absolutely so. There's not many. There's not many places you work where they contribute that much to your plan, whether regardless of you do. Yeah, you know, I mean that's, I mean I know that wasn't pension, but seriously, why?

Speaker 1

is there the 6% match?

Speaker 2

Which is good.

Speaker 1

I mean it's very generous and I were in a planning meeting last week and she goes yeah, you get 17%, that's amazing. And she kind of pet this guy up and I was like hey, you get sick. She's like, yeah, that's not bad, that was better than what everybody else everybody else is doing. Um, so anyway, I digress with with the story, but thanks, thanks for for for listening to that. Uh, let's, uh. So really, it comes down to this you got to have a health insurance plan.

Speaker 2

Yep.

Speaker 1

Meaning not like like literally, a health insurance plan. But how are you going to pay for it? Um, you need to make sure that, if you do walk away, that you can support yourself off your portfolio.

Speaker 2

Yeah.

Speaker 1

Um, if you just really hate what you're doing, perhaps, um, having a side gig. I know we work with a pilot that flies as little as possible and she's building her real estate practice and that, and that's her passion. That's that's her, her passion. I mean that that's what. That's how I built this. I flew at night so I could. I could be here during the daytime. This was my passion. I'm still passionate about aviation.

Speaker 1

I just don't want to get up at four 30 in the morning to go pre-flight an airplane somewhere, and I don't like the cold and I always ended up in the cold. If it was warm, I was not going there. Uh, so, so it's, it's um, uh, anyway, uh, so have the healthcare plan. Uh, make sure you can still use your travel privileges, that if that's important to you. Um, you know also, if you think you would return to flying I've never been told this by pilot, cause they all understand it, but let's just make sure we're all on the same page. You walk away from the sonority number, you go back. You're not getting that sonority number back.

Speaker 1

You have to start over as if you know nothing. And the right seat at the lowest pay, yeah. So it's not a good idea to walk away if you think you're never, if you think you're going to.

Speaker 2

Yeah.

Speaker 1

While you figure things out. Yeah, and you know I held on, probably for a little bit too long, but I stayed there because of healthcare. Health care is one of our biggest expenses at this firm. Yeah, and when I was just starting out, I piggybacked on my airline's healthcare.

Speaker 2

Well, you have children too While I was building this Family, oh yeah, with the family Right Exactly.

Speaker 1

Even back then it was gonna be two grand a month. Now it'd be. It'd be double that, yeah. So yeah, that that that if you're thinking about making a transition, uh, try to do both for a little while to see how it feels, and at some point you have to pull the pull the plug and and make a decision on what you want to do.

Speaker 2

But it is hard.

Speaker 3

You know when, when you're you know, before age 55, most of you have children and so you're traveling and you are away from your kids and then, once they move out, then you can take a step back a little bit. It seems like sometimes life is backwards right.

Speaker 2

It's like when we need to spend the most time with our kids is when we're building our career, and that's so hard, but I think everybody faces that and so well, let's let's talk about the opposite for a second.

Speaker 1

So a lot of the things that I've done is help people figure out if they should go to the wide body before they retire. So they're flying domestic and then they go. Hey, do I want to go to this bigger airplane to get bigger pay? My last three or four years and in our planning, typically no, you don't need to do that.

Speaker 2

Yeah.

Speaker 1

And so it's not about. It's not. You know why would you put yourself in a situation where you're further away, unless it's just something? I've always want to have this type rating. I've always wanted to fly this airplane. Then go do it yeah that's totally different, yeah it.

Speaker 1

It goes back to the 80 year old test. When you're 80 years old and you look back, what do you wish you have would have accomplished? Yeah, was it more type ratings? Was it it flying something internationally or is it making probably the same amount of money if you picked up an extra trip? Saying domestic focus on your longevity as a human, at least in my case.

Speaker 1

I was like this is not going to work out for me. I will be dead Exhaustion, exactly so. So think, you know. Think about that as well. Is is it's about quality of life, usually, and unless you don't have enough for retirement, if you don't have enough for retirement, which the guys that flew during my time I flew in the worst time of aviation. We had September 11th, we had the financial crisis, we had furloughs all over the place.

Speaker 1

It was not a good time to to be to be an airline pilot. So for the people of my generation, you should be caught up by now. But if you're not, then then I would say yeah, you know, you plan to work till 65. You might be trying to find as much money as possible to fill up your coffers and your retirement account.

Speaker 1

Yeah, just hustled for a short period of time just to make sure you're okay um, I think, going back to, if you disagree with everything I've said and you said I just want to be done, then let's set somebody up for that. Yeah, so if you want to be, if you want to be done by 55, you'd go through our retirement planning process. We would put 55 as a hard stop. Our software understands what private health care costs, so we create a line item for that, right? Yeah, retirement.

Speaker 2

Exactly.

Speaker 1

And what would you say the biggest thing people need to focus on?

Speaker 2

They're spending. That's the number I mean. That is when you say what, how much do I need to retire? It depends what you spend. So living within your means and saving wisely and investing. Yes, eliminating debt.

Speaker 1

Because if you're debt free by 55, you wouldn't. Your spending would just be your utilities and whatever you want to do for fun Right and food Right.

Speaker 2

I mean there's a chance that the mortgage may not be paid off by retirement, but as long as you can handle the cashflow to pay it off, like shortly after retirement because if you retire at age 55, it depends when you move but hopefully you are able to pay, pay it off, especially with interest rates where they are right now not that they're super large as they have been in years past, but they're still higher than we're used to right for a period of time. And you know we all have amnesia about that and it's painful. Going from three to seven percent, it's double. You know three and a half to seven percent is double. So, um, so, paying off debt, definitely, definitely. But if you're, if you're in debt, that means maybe you're living beyond your means.

Speaker 2

Not mortgage counting, obviously, you know most of us can't just outright buy a house, but, um, maybe you are living beyond your means and getting that in check is really, you know, the the. The biggest part of the plan is what you spend. Sure, absolutely. I mean that's what drives the whole, thing, the biggest part of the plan is what you spend.

Speaker 2

Sure, absolutely. I mean, that's what drives the whole thing.

Speaker 1

So, yeah, I mean that's true because we we have people who retired with less than a million dollars 10, 15 years ago. They're still doing just fine.

Speaker 2

They are.

Speaker 1

They're just. Their costs of living is very low.

Speaker 2

Right. So it really depends, you know. If you that question, well, how much do I need to retire? Well, tell me how much you spend and I can tell you that I mean that's the biggest driver of that.

Speaker 2

Now I realize, when people come in, they're raising children at the time, and your, your expenses will change when, hopefully when children move out of the house. I mean, they're just expensive. It's expensive to raise kids in college and insurance and all the stuff. You, you know all of that, and so it will change slightly. But you, you know, if you get used to a certain living, um, it's going to be hard to scale back, and so it really is dependent on what you spend. If you, if you as as if your your pay increases significantly as a pilot, and if you let your expenses level out at some point, while it's increasing and saving and paying off the house and all of that, then you should be golden, um, especially with the amount that's going in the retirement accounts between the employer and you, between the airline and you.

Speaker 1

Yeah, so we're. We had this big push, uh, when the market-based cash balance plan came out at Delta, uh, I guess over a year ago now almost two years ago.

Speaker 1

Um, that there was a big push for planning because people are trying to understand it, how does it work into their plan, and it's so cool to meet with those people. Now, I just did a review meeting yesterday and or I guess it was last week, um, and their overall financial picture was totally different because we said, hey, we need you to go tackle these, these few things.

Speaker 2

Yeah.

Speaker 1

In this case it was cleaning up some debt, like debt is almost gone and they have all this free cashflow. Now it was, it was, it was it made me. It was like this is why I do this.

Speaker 3

This is awesome. We're making a difference.

Speaker 1

Yes. So I would say that you are correct Eliminating debt, managing your expenses. And then, once you understand what your expenses are and I'm not talking about when we say budget, we're not talking about bare bones budget who wants to retire on a bare bones budget? But figure out what your lifestyle is going to be like and then we can back into the dollar amount that needs to be in those retirement accounts or brokerage accounts.

Speaker 1

Yes, Well, and the other thing too is just making sure, because if you do retire early, you're going to maybe be retired for a very we hope for a very long time 40 years if you want to go that early.

Speaker 2

So it needs to last. But also, if you have some sort of healthcare event what long-term care event? You know we stress test the portfolio and say, okay, what if you have a long-term care event during this 40 years? What does that do to the portfolio? You know you can always get long-term care insurance to help offset some of the costs as well. That is generally expensive.

Speaker 2

So you know, many pilots can what we call self-insure, meaning that if they have a healthcare event or a long-term care event, they just pay for it out of pocket on their own. But what does that look like? And so you know, we, we, we have to take that into consideration too, which is important to do the planning upfront, to know that, okay, you know, this is what it looks like if I spend this. But what if we have, you know, a market downturn? What if? And we, we stress, test all of that? What if we have a large market downturn and don't recover from it? What if we, you know, have a long-term care event? So that way you know and you can walk into it, even if you do retire early and incur those extra expenses in the beginning with healthcare et cetera that you're still going to be okay, and then you can just make the decision yeah, you know whether do you really want to walk away from this or not.

Speaker 1

Right, yeah, it's, um, I think that'd be tough, but it's, it's very doable and you might have better things, better things to be doing with your time, potentially things we don't haven't thought about even. But uh, all right, good, good, good conversation. Shauna, thanks for joining me on this.

Speaker 1

We have some other episodes um two 59, what pilots and others should consider five years before mandatory retirement. Uh, we have episode two 34, Pilots Maximize your Forward Gain Contributions. And we also have a YouTube channel. You can go there. It's called A Weiser Retirement. We do talk about, we link to our market-based cash balance plan discussion. I think most people understand what that is, why financial planning is different for pilots. It is very different for pilots. We have a little segment on that on the YouTube channel. Thanks for watching and we'll see you guys next week.

Speaker 3

Thanks for listening to a Wiser Retirement Podcast. We hope you enjoyed today's episode. Make sure to subscribe wherever you're listening. That way you don't miss any new episodes. We'd also appreciate if you could leave a rating and review. If you have any questions about anything that was discussed today, head to wiserinvestorcom and reach out.

Speaker 3

This episode was produced by Rachel Dotson. This podcast is strictly for informational purposes only and is not to be considered as investment advice or solicitation to buy or sell any financial products, securities, digital assets or any other investment vehicles or a basis to make any financial decisions. Wiser Wealth Management Incorporated is a registered investor advisor with the SEC. The host and or guests may personally own securities, digital assets or other investment vehicles mentioned on this podcast. Neither the host nor guests of the show are compensated for their participation and no referral fees are paid to or received by any host or guest for clients, listeners or similar interests. Investments involve risk and, unless otherwise stated, are not guaranteed. Be sure to first consult with a qualified financial advisor, tax professional, insurance professional and or legal professional before implementing any strategy discussed herein. Past performance is not indicative of future performance.