Remember the time when we let our insecurities steer us away from seeking help? What if there was a way to turn those insecurities into your most powerful tool for personal growth? Join us as Suzi and George Foreman III talk about the importance of physical health and mental wellness.
George' approach of creating supportive and inclusive space is unique! He discusses the importance of his meticulous process of personally interviewing the first 150 gym members prior to joining the Craft Boxing Club to ensure a cultivated community.
Join us as we explore the power of community, and the journey to personal growth in this episode of Be Crazy Well.
Music credit to Kalvin Love for the podcast’s theme song “Bee Your Best Self”
Tune into our CHW Streaming Radio and the full lineup at cominghomewell.com
Download on Apple Play and Google Play
Online-Therapy.com ~ Life Changing Therapy Click here for a 20% discount on your first month.
Contact Suzi at suzigma@gmail.com or (818) 470-2013 and share your story.
suzilandolphi.com
vetsandplayers.org
wildhorserescue.org
Thank you for listening! Be sure to SHARE, LIKE and leave us a REVIEW!
Remember the time when we let our insecurities steer us away from seeking help? What if there was a way to turn those insecurities into your most powerful tool for personal growth? Join us as Suzi and George Foreman III talk about the importance of physical health and mental wellness.
George' approach of creating supportive and inclusive space is unique! He discusses the importance of his meticulous process of personally interviewing the first 150 gym members prior to joining the Craft Boxing Club to ensure a cultivated community.
Join us as we explore the power of community, and the journey to personal growth in this episode of Be Crazy Well.
Music credit to Kalvin Love for the podcast’s theme song “Bee Your Best Self”
Tune into our CHW Streaming Radio and the full lineup at cominghomewell.com
Download on Apple Play and Google Play
Online-Therapy.com ~ Life Changing Therapy Click here for a 20% discount on your first month.
Contact Suzi at suzigma@gmail.com or (818) 470-2013 and share your story.
suzilandolphi.com
vetsandplayers.org
wildhorserescue.org
Thank you for listening! Be sure to SHARE, LIKE and leave us a REVIEW!
I'm Susie Landolfi, and welcome to be crazy. Well, no, there's no bullshit between you and I about pretending. Hi, welcome to be crazy. Well, I'm with George. No, the number. You won't know who the fuck you're talking to.
Speaker 1:That's why. That's why I love our relationship, because there's no, there's no, no, there's no BS, there's no. What do you call it? Arrangements there's no arrangements.
Speaker 2:We don't look any better than we look now. You walk in through your house. I'm in my messy bedroom. I can't even put on the regular. I have to blur everything where you'd see all this stuff hanging out. There's busy people. You know we have to sacrifice somewhere, right? Amen, so you and I, we couldn't get together in the same room because I'm going this way, you're going that way, we're going everywhere at the same time.
Speaker 1:Yep, then I get to see you in a few days.
Speaker 2:That's right. So here's what we had to do everybody. So George and I are going, together with the support of his wonderful wife, who makes all of this happen. Let's just be honest, George.
Speaker 1:She does.
Speaker 2:The only reason you can go and do all this shit is because of Sarah. So, sarah, don't think I don't know that and don't think I don't tell him every day, like we know how this all happens. Anyway, we're going to go to Jake's fight and I can just say Jake, and now most people, it's like share. If I said, oh, we're going to share the conflict, you can just say Jake now, and everybody knows who knows who that is. But just for some of you who are not cool enough to know about Jake, paul. So here's my life, george. I want to start working out again and I want to start getting healthy again, because I go through these kind of sprints and and, and I go through these, you know, sessions or problems in my life where I work out more than I don't and and I should work out more than I am. In all of that, and those of us that have the luxury and the training to know how important it is to keep ourselves physically healthy, we're like the plumbers with the leaky faucet.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's exactly right.
Speaker 2:Right. So you and I look great, you know. And everybody said, oh, you're in such good shape or anything. And little do they know. Because we know that's a bunch of crock and that we're not as healthy as we look. We're not as in great shape.
Speaker 1:So busy trying to help everybody else stay healthy, right?
Speaker 2:That's exactly right. That's exactly right, right. So I am on social media and everybody like, says social media, and I'm like what do you mean? What would? What would I know about the world? I'd have to go to an encyclopedia, like you, probably old enough to barely remember encyclopedias, but that's.
Speaker 1:I remember I I had a. I said I think it was Britannica.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's right, and you had it for 10 years, so all the information you got was probably out of 10 years old by the time I got it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, exactly. So it kind of paid it off, right, because they had to pay it off. So I go on in. This thing pops up going, oh, craft boxing, we're going to open this brand new boxing gym in Calabasas. And like what? Like that's right. And I'm like let me get on quick. Like, ok, hi, can I, can I buy a membership? And they go no, you have to have an interview with George. I have an interview to oh my God, this is fucking serious and I want to do this more than ever now because someone is taking the time to meet the people who are going to join this gym. I'm going that's a bad business model, but a wonderful community model.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:I didn't take a while and I don't know how this is going to work, but I want in. Now I find out who. You are Right, keep going yeah.
Speaker 1:No, no, I was just saying it was. It was at the time and I still I wasn't sure at the time, I was like I don't know if I can keep this up, but I do know that the, you know I, you know no one's going to like wake up and be like yeah, you know we're, you know I don't feel like we're selling a gym, I feel like we're selling a community. But you can't say that and say like yeah, come, you know we're, you know where the. I guess you can and maybe that's what people should say but and that you know I'm opening a community, right, or I'm opening a community center. Maybe we should say that. But long story short, I feel like once.
Speaker 2:Got there. Once I got on the call with you said I want to create a community. Well, it was the first thing.
Speaker 1:And so to me, whether I could keep up my you know, one on one interviews of everybody day one or not, I wanted to make sure that the first batch, so to speak, speak of people first hundred and fifty people, so to speak yeah, about hundred and fifty that I knew every single one of them, number one, and that when people after that initial one fifty or so were coming in, I was walking them into a community that I had curated right or had a chance to.
Speaker 1:I can actually tell you these are great people. I know every single one of them. I've actually sat and spoken to them for at least 30 minutes or so, so that, essentially, whether I told them I'm selling, selling them a community or not, that's what it was. So when they walked in and took a class, they would feel comfortable and so on and so forth, and I didn't feel like that was possible with the new gym If it was just a free for all. So thanks for going through that. I know that was kind of weird, like we have to interview you for your you can be a part of this gym, but it wasn't to keep people out, it was making sure that that the people that came in were around the right people.
Speaker 2:You know that we're going to help them grow and you might not have done this from a therapeutic point of view, it was absolutely imperative that you do that, because what you also did was you let me know you, let me know what I could expect. You, let me know that you were investing in your own community. You let me know that you were investing in me as much as I was paying, and investing in you.
Speaker 1:Amen.
Speaker 2:You let me know that I don't come to the gym with your iPods, your ear pods, whatever.
Speaker 1:And your ears.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'd be put them in my eyes that's why I call them iPod your ear pods and think you're going to go work out and not talk to anybody. Don't come in here and think you're not going to be able to say hi to everybody and know everybody and that there's going to be people here to support you, the staff and the other members, because it's a community. I just need to tell you this I don't know if you know this it's very hard to build community in such a transient place, a place that wasn't built on history. That's like. I came from a community. I lived in a house once that was built in 1640. So generations of people have lived there and helped build that community.
Speaker 2:That's not as little area is, so a whole bunch of people that came out here to find their fortune and their dreams and all of that, and then they leave very quickly as well. And let's just talk about the elephant in the middle of the room, which would be the fact. It's not very diverse. You look like my family, like this is what I grew up with, and I'm like, oh, wait what I'm going to be able to walk into place and see a whole bunch of different shapes, sizes, colors, genders and whatever's in here. That doesn't happen here.
Speaker 1:No, I mean that's that's definitely. I've learned a bit since I've been here, but that is not the way you would describe Calabasas.
Speaker 2:No, I'm just going to tell you something that people, when the Black Lives Matter movement started, my white daughter, kersha, who had a black grandfather, said, mom, we have to do a. You know, we have to start a Black Lives Matter demonstration not necessarily a protest, but a support and get out on the streets and all like that. So she and her girlfriend started that and had a Black Lives Matter. And so, yeah, it's important to understand how we build community is that you make allies and you invite people in. You let people know it's safe to be here, that you're wanted, that we don't want to be here without you, and I can't even tell you how many African American motorists stopped at our little protest with tears in their eyes and thanked us. So so I'm telling you that what you did was absolutely let all of us who are allies, and the people in the community that don't necessarily feel welcomed here, like we just had a protest on one of the overpasses of a white supremacist group. I'm like 10 miles down the road.
Speaker 2:That happens here just months ago. So I just want to say that when we talk about health, we talk about wellness and we're talking about, you know, building community. You did it with every fiber of your being, on principles. You did that on principles. You just didn't say I'm going to teach you how to punch someone in the face. Really well, because I would like to know how to do that.
Speaker 1:You know how to do that really well already.
Speaker 2:I know now.
Speaker 1:I know.
Speaker 2:And what you said was everything matters, it's all connected, and community was the first part, so I knew I wanted to talk to you and get you on this podcast of be crazy well, because you are one of the craziest well people I know, and getting more crazy and well all the time, and this idea that you came here and you are continually to add to this community. You've done an event on fentanyl awareness. You're now bringing in people to talk about their lives, and you invited me and encouraged me to do a mental health wellness session program. I'm on the calendar Like you put it on the calendar to sign up, to be able to say to do that. That's not how you grew up, though.
Speaker 1:No no.
Speaker 2:Not how I grew up either. I never see a therapist when I was younger.
Speaker 1:No, that was taboo. It's still somewhat taboo, so funny.
Speaker 2:What do you think that's about?
Speaker 1:I don't know. I think it's unfortunate because I feel like there's a I mean obviously not all, but I think there's a healthy amount of mental wellness or emotional health challenges that people face. I think there's a healthy amount of. You know, if you look at the whole pie of people that face mental health challenges and I think we all do at different times in our life I think there's a sizable amount. You'd know better to me that their challenge is insecurity. Right, it's rooted in some sort of insecurity that was created through an experience, something they experienced. Maybe it was their parents, a friend, a job. You know that they were fired from a failed business opportunity or something you know way more traumatic. Right, but it's some sort of insecurity that is called that has created an emotional health challenge, or mental health challenge, if you will. But then it's that same insecurity. In addition to that it's another, I guess, but it's an insecurity that keeps you from seeking help or being comfortable telling people I need help, or being comfortable just getting on the phone and being like yeah, like this thing between my ears is not working the way I want it to work, even though it's all connected. Your whole body is connected and I think it's funny. Like I said, insecurity creates a lot of issues for people and, like I said, insecurity stops people from reaching out, and just as a way that it is, but I think I don't know. My opinion is all bad behavior, all poor behavior are all suboptimal behavior, stem some insecurity, and this is definitely one of them. I am too proud to ask for help and on you know.
Speaker 1:What we're finding, though, is that the closer you get to the top, so to speak I see the top of the chain of administrators, families, a husband and wife couple that have been able to withstand the test of time the higher you get to the one percenters of leadership, whether it's local leadership in the community or, you know, leading a Fortune 500 company or big startup you find that the majority of these people do have therapists, and they're proud of it.
Speaker 1:It's almost like you know I have a Lamborghini, I have, you know I have a big congregation, or have a school of 2000 kids, and 90 percent of them go to whatever they're boasting about. They also boast about, like I have a therapist that I've been seeing for 10 or 15 years, and that's something I learned. So it's just a shame that the same people who look up to the people who have these accolades of. I've been married for 40 years, I have a PhD, I just sold a company for a billion dollars. We look up to all these people but we're not doing the things that help to get them in there, help to maintain that same success, and a big part of that is therapy.
Speaker 2:So I appreciate you saying that, since I was just outed on Jake's podcast.
Speaker 1:So how did he? Outed you?
Speaker 2:Yeah, he just put me, I don't know. He just posted it and we did an hour and 35 minutes podcast together with two of his staff, who I adore, and we went through our whole story and his stuff and what he's learned and all of that. So he just posted that on BS. Another guy that doesn't do BS, bs with Jake Paul. And so you're right, like when you look at people that want to get better physically, emotionally, intellectually, spiritually and financially, they're going to go and figure out who's going to help me get there? What do I change to get there?
Speaker 2:You're in a boxing ring and if someone says to you look, one of the reasons why you're not being able to throw that punch as hard as you want is you're starting from here. You're not starting from here, you're starting from here. Well, the same with your mental health. The reason why you're not able to have that deep conversation with your partner or work with your kids is because you're starting from here. You're starting from something that happened to you years ago that you haven't addressed, and you get to now figure that out what happened to you and how it affected you, both good and bad, or effectively and not effectively and you get to change it, you get to practice something different. And if everybody hasn't figured out who I'm talking to right now, I should probably tell you George Borman III and, like I said, the idea that now we can even see some of what your dad went through in the movie. We can start to see your generational trauma, your family's generational struggles, right, and then you add on what we would call historical trauma, like racism, poverty, all of that. That all comes down into the next generation.
Speaker 2:And the funny thing is, george, if you don't ask for help and you don't go and try to change those things that are not working, that you didn't even ask for, that were put upon you, they get worse with each generation. You find it more difficult for success than even your dad, even though he came from such poverty and racism and everything else say more severely than what you've experienced. Because that mental health, that part of you that was never addressed, can actually weaken you, which people don't understand. They should say well, gee, if my dad did well, I should be able to do 100 times better. Right, because it's newer, better, I'm younger, I have more, he gave me more stuff. No, because the mental health that comes down that generation actually makes it harder. The lack of mental health I should say.
Speaker 1:I'd say the vast majority of people don't understand that.
Speaker 1:I'm just now fully becoming awakened to this idea, since I've known you, but I'd say most people have no idea. Right, the idea is each generation is supposed to be better and better and better, and it might even be from financial standpoint sometime, from an education standpoint they can be, and there's other areas but that doesn't necessarily mean the mental health is better, if not. I mean, look at, it seems like statistically I don't know, obviously, when we're tracking all this data years ago, but it seems like statistically the collective mental health of the United States. I'll just speak for our country it seems like it's the worst it's ever been, but we're also. The country as a whole is where the biggest economy in the world, where the biggest military in the world, where the biggest driver of culture in the world, we're all be. You know, we're at our height in so many other areas, but it seems like the mental health has deteriorated to all time lows. And what you just said would explain that. I never thought about it, so you said it.
Speaker 2:And what's interesting is, everything you mentioned is the things outside of us that make our life easier, better, richer, you know, richer in many ways. What hasn't happened is we haven't grown from the inside out. We grow from the outside in. We try to build a life from the outside in. What then happens is your core strength, your mental health, core strength. So let's talk about that for a minute. The metaphor of boxing, the metaphor of physical health, is so powerful Because I can look like I have a whole bunch of muscle on the outside, but if I don't have that core strength from the top of my chest to the top of my thighs, all of that other strength is not going to help me when I need to make sure that I'm solid.
Speaker 1:You can't transfer it through the end of your fist if the core is not there, right? You like all that.
Speaker 2:If I'm only worried about from this to this, that's all I got and I've got nothing here. Or I'm working out think of that as opposed to working in. So if I'm working out and inside I'm going, oh I don't think I really have got it, or I'm not as good as the other person over there, or I'm afraid and I don't want anybody to know it because can't let anybody know that I'm afraid. So all of that inside starts to eat away. It's almost like termites. It's like not realizing that that big tree that's in front of you is actually dead on the inside, because the bugs got inside or your header beam or whatever those beams are.
Speaker 1:They've been eating away, yeah.
Speaker 2:And so what you've done with craft boxing. And of course, I don't even know how you came up with the name Crafted or if it's someone's last name or whatever. I love it because, first of all, for women, crafts we're allowed to do crafts, you're not? We're like no, let's go get all the men to help us make these ornaments and these crafts, right?
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Right for yet. For thousands of years we had craftsmen. There's a whole bunch of tools called craftsmen tools. Yeah, I think of this shit. I mean, I spent hours thinking of this shit. I go wait a minute. They always had craftsmen and craftmen.
Speaker 1:Not a coincidence.
Speaker 2:It's not a coincidence, right? If you want to make something, you have to craft it. So when you and I are doing this mental health stuff. We're going to craft yourself and we really mean it and we really mean that you don't let go of the inside, you don't ignore it. You actually have to use the inside to get better outside.
Speaker 1:Yep. Otherwise, yeah, there's just no way. There really is no way. You can run from it for as long as you want, but essentially you're going to have to deal with it at some point, and then your kids are going to have to, unfortunately too.
Speaker 2:That's exactly right. So you did a couple of things that I want to share with the people. So not only did you have this wonderful, aesthetically beautiful gym and functional at the same time because there is that Some people think that something is functional, it doesn't have to look good. The gym looks beautiful and it's so functional, it's so easy to navigate. You have a staff that are not perfect people. They are dedicated people, they work their ass off and many of them I would say all of them now are understanding this idea of their own mental health as well, not just helping us do our physical workout.
Speaker 2:You can't walk in that gym and just think you're going to be able to work out all by yourself and be ignored. That ain't happening there. You've already probably been in there. We're not going to do that, so that's not going to happen.
Speaker 1:You'll get caught out as soon as you walk.
Speaker 2:That's exactly right. So there's always that as well. And then what I wanted to share with people about what you've also instituted there, or you live, is oh my god, you work out too Like you're there not just crunching the numbers, you're in there working your ass off, and you started to highlight some of the people that go there. So when you say you're building a community, you're letting us know who's in there, right, yep? And so that's called 5 AM in Calabasas, which is wonderful, and I never felt as good as I did when you made me get up at 4 and get there at 5 AM and start.
Speaker 2:You're one of the first guys and I'm learning so much more about so many of our other members. Then you did another one recently and I want to talk about this because I thought it was so important. One of the things that therapists are told not to do is to self-disclose. We're not supposed to really tell you about ourselves and, of course, at our session with Kraft yourself, I share a lot about my struggle and things I'm still working on. I was just talking to a therapist who said, yeah, one of the best things we can do and actually it was a client said you know, I love coming here because you guys talk about yourself, you share.
Speaker 2:We're not the only ones fucked up. You can talk about what you're doing as well. You did a video of yourself recently, called Monk, which I love, and you started. You put up there all the things that people say to you because of your lineage, because of your dad as a great boxer, a great humanitarian in many ways as well, and you shared the things that are oftentimes said to you as the son and the child of somebody who was one of those one percenters. Right, why did you do that? What did you do?
Speaker 1:Yeah, I think the reason I, when I posted that video, the reason I called out some of the things that people say, is is, you know, and maybe it's just unique to me Like I'm just one of those people I'm not just I'm not really externally motivated, I'm actually like externally demotivated. So if I were ever a preacher, and people say what's that?
Speaker 2:Say, explain that when you're externally. Yeah, that's a.
Speaker 1:I would say yeah, no, the reason I said externally demotivated is because I, like I really am driven by the passion to complete things that I want to complete, you know, and the minute other people want me to do it, I kind of get turned off. I don't know why I've been like that. I'm sure there's an explanation for it, but I'll give you a quick example. Like if I were a preacher, right, and I was preaching and people started saying Amen, amen, amen, I'd probably change the subject, you know. Or I'd actually tell them to stop. Or if I was giving a speech and you know I was getting a lot of ovations, like mid speech, right, that would turn me off. Right, if it's a joke and people laugh, that's cool, right, that's what you're supposed to do. And I feel like people cheering you on or amenning you or whatever it is. I think that's a very positive thing. Don't get me wrong. It's just not how I'm wired, right. And so with me and my boxing career, the minute I started training and what always happens with boxing in general all sports but boxing especially, because there's no league no one actually understands how the sport really works. I think I'd say 99% of fans have 99.5%, 99, probably 99.9% of boxing fans have no clue how the industry works, how the sport works, how you get fights, how they're judged, all the inner workings, like. People have no clue how it works, and even people who are in it sometimes fighters who are in it don't understand how it works. This is the Wild Wild West of sports. But everybody wants to come to your fight and they want to ask you when's your next fight? When's your next fight? When's your over and over and over. And it becomes, you know, it just becomes very much like okay, let me know, let me know, everybody's telling you like you have to check in with them on your fight career. You know, because they can't go and see your standings, obviously they can't go to ESPN and there's no ticker and so.
Speaker 1:And then there's a lot of questions, right, if you're for some reason, there's just misnomer that if you're not from the worst neighborhood in whatever your respective city, if you're not from extreme poverty, if you're not from extreme trauma, that there's no reason for you to want to compete as a pro boxer. But people don't bring that to. People don't say that about basketball players, football players as much, definitely not golf, right, not tennis and so on and so forth, and and obviously I know it's because people are like well, why would you expose yourself to such pain, potential pain or such potential damage if you didn't need the money? And then you have to deal with all those questions and then, obviously, when you have a father or someone in your family who, or mother, who's, who's achieved great success in the field that you're in, then you have all these questions around are you doing it because they did it? Are you in? So on and so forth, right, are you can? Are you wondering if you can live up to their? You know whatever and I know for sure people whose parents were legendary lawyers, doctors, writers or whatever go through the same thing.
Speaker 1:None of that drives me. None of it. I'm not. It's not like a you know, none of it. I guess.
Speaker 1:None of it drives me. In fact, it turns me off because, once again, maybe for me, it takes the attention away from my inspiration and the work, right, and so me kind of in that video, calling it out, is my way of kind of saying hey, everybody, shut up. This is about me, this is about my passion, something I enjoy doing. I'm sharing it with you, right, because my hope is that in sharing it with you, maybe some of you guys will be motivated, because I got motivated by watching Muhammad Ali on YouTube, sugary Robinson on YouTube Thank God for YouTube Sugary Leonard, even my father. I got motivated by watching other people fight. I got motivated by hearing stories about Bernard Hopkins, who spent time many years in prison, lost his first pro fight and became a Hall of Famer and held his title for 10 years. So I think finding inspiration from others people's stories is super valuable, which is why I share.
Speaker 1:But I, for some reason, I'm just turned off by cheers. I'm not really turned off by booze, but I just, I guess, even now, like I'm kind of like waiting for everybody to get off my back about when I'm going to fight next, who I'm going to fight next, asking me the same questions over and over. God bless them. I know they're just, it's all well intentioned, especially when, but like half the time people ask you that they're just trying to make conversation, they don't really care, but you got to answer and give them a whole explanation about something they don't even understand. So for me it's like I'm kind of waiting for the death to settle. Yes, I'm going to box again. Yes, I love boxing. Yes, I'm 16.
Speaker 2:I know that I've already done this before.
Speaker 1:Yes, I've been teaching boxing. My yes, yes, yes. All right, stop asking about it, forget, I'm even going to do it and then I can be left to left to peace. And I think like the last thing I'll say is I feel like I'm not like a celebrity, like Jake Paul or or Barbara Streisand or anybody who's a big celebrity. But I think you can feel one eyeballs are on you. You know whether you're you know one one was talking.
Speaker 1:My dad told me the story once about how a little person and I believe there's a right term but someone who's smaller, you know, they said they walked around, some people call them dwarfs, some people call them midgets, etc. But he said to my dad how stressful life is right and he was asking him why. He's like is it because things are made for you and so on and so on. He's like no, it's just like when I walk into a room, people are looking at me and he's like I can feel it, you know, I can feel it and for me I'd like there's nothing wrong with the tension and I'm completely fine with it. But when you have a lot of eyeballs on you, when you're trying to like work on your craft, it's like, almost like I'm trying to like imagine like an artist, like painting his art, his masterpiece, and he's got 200 people. That's why I said it's not about the celebrity, just 200 people watching him all times. How's the painting? How's the painting? How's the painting? When are you going to post it? Where are you going?
Speaker 1:to post it and then physically watching him in the midst of it, maybe making pottery or something, how that would probably, it would probably take, I don't know. I'm feeling in my opinion will pull out a lot of his creative energy and I don't know that most artists would be able to create under that environment. Now, when they're done and they say, look what I've done, take a look, you can buy it. That's different, but I just feel like the eyeballs. Every time you step out, everybody's wondering what you're doing. They want to have a question. It just it takes away some of your creative player and that's how it is. For me, Boxing is not like a profession. It's definitely not a profession. For me, it's an art form and I'm working on my craft, I'm trying to get better and it's just not about anybody but me. For me. I'm not. This is really hard for people to understand that you know. So that's what that post is all about.
Speaker 1:There's my seven minute explanation.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I asked. That's why I asked, because it was so that video and we'll add it to this was so powerful and it was so important to remind people why you do something Can't be for the outside. It's come from the inside and it's yours, it's your craft, it's your event, it's your experience. It's why I say to parents all the time don't tell children what a great job they did in their game or, if they lost, oh I'm so sorry you lost, and you know, don't let it be their experience. I said the only thing I used to say to my grandson when he played sports ago so how was that for you? How was that for you? It's sucked, all right, why did suck? Well, we didn't play as a team. And then I go got you. I hear you, or you'll say, oh, it's great. Why was it great? What happened? I didn't make it. It's not for me, it's for him, it's his joy or his struggle, right.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Right and. I was so happy because I happened to ask you in months I think I asked you once when are you boxing and where?
Speaker 1:No, it's, it's okay. I don't want it. I don't want people to not ask me so grateful that I realized I stopped.
Speaker 2:I asked you once and I went that's his, that's his.
Speaker 1:No, and, like I said, and I agree and I think you're I'd love to ask you more about what you said about children, because I've always wondered about that. But I feel like I feel like work, you know, can be for show right, work right, and for some people boxing or basketball or whatever it's just work. I feel like some people are extrinsically or not extrinsically what do you call it Extrinsically or like intrinsically, extrinsically. Like some people are motivated by recognition or whatever. Like I don't want to be recognized by, like, my boxing skill. I do buy by me, you know, or by somebody who really understands the craft, and there's like seven people that I could think of. To me those matter. But I guess my point is I feel like some people are driven by all these things, but I feel like true artists. Some people are driven by accolades, some people are driven by money, some people are driven by likes, claps and whatever. But I think true artists are driven by, like you said. How did you experience that? Like you said, with the youngster, they're driven by just feeling like they've accomplished something that they're happy with, or maybe someone else who's been through what it takes to become a great artist, whether it's a musician or someone who pays or draws, someone who's been through that journey and says, yo, I see what you're doing, like respect, you know, I think people, artists are driven like that, and I think, for me, boxing I'm into it because it's an art form, I'm into the art side of it.
Speaker 1:I'm not into everything else. And to me, like, if it's about like competing at the highest level and fighting it, it's fighting. You know somebody who could potentially seriously hurt me, then you know, I do it because I want to know whether I can do it or not. Obviously, you have to get paid, because there's risk involved and your whole team has to get paid right. You have to have managers, promoters, your trainers and all that, but it's about the art. For me, it's about the art. I wanted to ask you, though tell me about why you ask your. You said with children, you asked them. How did you experience it? Or, as opposed to just saying, good job, that was great or that was amazing, can you?
Speaker 2:tell me why you said that? Yeah, because I've imposed my opinion on the craft of that child, on the experience of that child, that how they performed made me happy. You made my opinion more important than your experience. Because when I say good job and they know they didn't do a good job, they didn't feel like they did, they didn't put all their in, they may have, you know, whatever, then I'm assuming I'm putting on them what they have to do to make me say a good job, to get my validation for them. And what you just talked about was your own personal validation. So here's what happens If we train people to seek outside validation for something that they love and they don't get it.
Speaker 2:Someone doesn't like their art, someone's not buying their art, or they lose a match, or they lose a game. They are at risk. They are at personal risk, even to the point of suicide, because this joy that they had and wanted to do this because it brought them joy, is now dismissed by other people's opinions. So I wanted to make sure that I didn't put his joy of baseball in my life. I didn't play the game, I didn't go to all those practices.
Speaker 2:I don't know if what he did out there, even though they lost, was a huge struggle for him and he felt great about what he accomplished. And then I go gee, how come you didn't strike so many people? What the fuck is my opinion got to do? Why am I sitting in the bleachers giving my opinion? This young man might have played his best game in his mind and yet I've got an opinion about it and I put that on him. And or it could be the other way around I might think that he did a great job and he thinks he did his worst job. I want him to be able to know what he did well under his context, his conditions not mine.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I love that.
Speaker 2:And then I get to ask him questions. I sucked, it was awful. You know how come. What happened? Well, I was tired and then the team was looking at videos more than paying attention to the game, and then I got mad at myself because I was throwing a bunch of balls and I couldn't shake it off and I go OK, what do you think you need to do? What do you want? What is it? Is there anything I can do to help, or is it? No, I got it, it's all on me. I got to figure it out.
Speaker 2:I mean, what a lesson. Internal strength, not external validation. And that's why I was so moved by your video, because I said I don't think he knows what he's done. You're so intuitive that I think you don't know exactly how brilliant you are until after the fact. I've got a lot of people in my life like that you do something because of a thought or a feeling and then don't understand the greatest magnitude of what you just shared with people. You told people in that video to do what you love, because you love what you're doing. Yeah, period. It doesn't matter about whether your father was good at it or not. It doesn't matter if you're old, it doesn't matter anything about when you do it, how you do it like Underwork, it matters that you're doing it and it's your choice and it brings you joy.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I feel like, in my opinion to your point, it just hit me, as we were talking, being able to have the time too, but do what you love for you, not because your mother wants you to do it, your father wants you to do it, your coworkers wants you to do it, your fans wants you to do it, whoever it is, but not for any external reason, but to just do it because you love it and to be able to follow that passion and have the internal reward. I just feel like that's the ultimate form of freedom.
Speaker 2:It really is, absolutely is.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:It's your time, your energy, your days. Days are numbered. We know that we're not going to live past 100. Most of us, some of us, won't even make it there. So the point being is, how you spend them has to be from your heart, from your being.
Speaker 2:And so then what happens is when I go into the gym, so just, I'm going to take it to a step further, knowing that you're doing it because you love it, I get to go in there and do it because I love it. I get to give myself, I get to say I deserve this joy, I deserve this community. I don't have to prove anything to anybody, I don't have to do anything. I can just go in and George, there's all shitload of people in that gym that feel the same way. They have a whole bunch of them that are in there because they have learned to love what they're doing for themselves. Then it goes in deep, it stays. And the same thing for mental health, for any of those classes that we offer in sessions that we offer they're doing it now for their own core strength. Then they can use that core strength for so much more in their life.
Speaker 1:Just like boxing, boxing I'm telling you.
Speaker 2:I'm telling you, I'm like, yeah, you can only fight for three minutes. Then you have to go to your corner and figure out what did I do wrong there? What could I have done better? The only difference is you want two winners. If it's an argument, you don't want one, you want two, you want one right.
Speaker 1:You want to be Not a draw.
Speaker 2:Two winners, not a draw, absolutely, because then if you have a draw, you're going to have to go back and do it again. There's that I was so grateful and I'm so excited about going to this wonderful event. Here's what's funny about Jake Having worked with him now for over these past two years and he is, like you, so committed to wanting to know, I mean, I always say there's two kinds of people in the world People want to know and people don't want to know. They already think they know. Don't try to confuse them with giving them facts.
Speaker 1:Yeah, little things call facts right.
Speaker 2:All right, and they just don't want to hear it and they don't want to change. And okay, fine, I'm not going to torture you and try to tell you any way that. So you want to hang out with people who want to know. And what's interesting is if you've noticed and people say this look how much he's changed, and even in terms of his own personal life and boxing life. I want to. I want to be a world champ. I want to prove to myself that I love this and I want to do this and all the outside stuff that he used to love and do is not so wonderful anymore.
Speaker 2:He's like oh wait, he just did the funniest video. He's gone. I don't even like these photo shoots anymore. How did I even know he's at one time and it's wonderful to, what's good, what happened Like, I don't even like them. Now, when you start to get to know yourself and you have your own goals and your own purpose and your own mission, that you'll find that there's a whole bunch of stuff that was given to you or presented to you or you were indoctrinated. Whether you thought you had to do that starts to fall by the wayside and the two authentic use come forward.
Speaker 1:No, I couldn't agree more with what you just said. I liken it to, I think, of one of the two analogies, and I'm big on analogies because that's just the way I think, like I visualize everything I don't like. I think my wife discovered the other day I may not have an inner dialogue. Actually, I don't think I talk to myself in words, I just see images.
Speaker 1:Yes so bear with me, but I think, like I like it to like if your cup spent empty, like it's not a good feeling when your cup is empty, right, but there are things that can, for momentarily, take away that empty feeling, right, without your cup being full. And so that could be a party. It could be someone like supposed to use force, right. It could be people cheering you on. It could be money, right, crush this deal I just made you know 20 bucks, 200 bucks, 200,000 bucks, whatever it is. It could be a car. I think it could be a trip, a vacation, botox like, or even like your child doing really good on the sports field, right, it could be a lot of things that like take, take your attention off or distract you from the fact that your cup is empty.
Speaker 1:And I feel like a lot of people, when their cup is empty, emotionally, they have a whole schedule of these things, so they never have these little spaces in time where they can feel that emptiness. And when they do, they're just like looking for the next thing. Right, could even be drugs, but when your cup is full, I think you start to look around like what in the hell has happened? What in the hell have I been doing? And like, why do people do that and why don't I want to do it anymore, why did I just do it? And I don't feel anything. In fact, I feel lower and I think to me that that's, that's what, that's what I hear, you know, when you talk about that story, or you know the other thing, I like, I think, and I think it's the same thing, like if you have a house I'm just imagining the most simple, simple house you could ever imagine that has like four legs on it right and one leg's missing, which I think even people who do engineer engineering might call that an insecurity, right, or a fault, potential fault, and you do things so like that insecurity isn't like an issue, right, but the reality is there's a leg missing right and when you actually have that leg up under you, so there's no insecurity on all four corners.
Speaker 1:Once again, you don't need these things that you do to protect that insecurity. To sure up, you know, like if it was a house, I would put like a rope on top of it to hold that leg up, or I'd press a big brick, a big rock up against the house where the legs missing, so it wouldn't lean over. But none of that's ideal and it's hard to maintain. So I guess, once we're sure I feel like we all do things to manage our insecurities so we don't have to deal with them. But when that insecurity is gone, you just look back at yourself like how stupid was it Right or how silly was it Right. And you can also look at other people like how silly it is, like I don't drink right now. It didn't last what's that.
Speaker 2:Like, you have to keep doing more and more. It didn't even last.
Speaker 2:So, those things you did. You have to keep doing them and doing them, which means you're on that wheel again, because it doesn't worry if your cup is full, if you know who you are and you've got your joy and you don't need something outside of you. That insecurity is now full. You know it's already been taken care of. If you will, or it's cared for in a really solid way, then you don't have to keep adding more and more. If the cup is already full, I can walk around, you know, and say, no, I got everything I need right here. Get everything.
Speaker 2:I just went full circle in the conversation you started with the words insecurity and we've just gone a whole hour with you now going back to that idea. It's an inside job. You craft yourself from the inside out, not from the outside in. That's what we have to do and it's a daily, daily bunch of practices. That's what it is based on principles. So principles shore me up. When my those four legs are my four principles, then whatever else is happening outside, when someone says, oh, you probably never be as good as your dad and a couple, of questions to that is I hope not, I hope I will won't be.
Speaker 2:You're right, right, that's it, I know my dad's got it and there's just wonderful ways to answer. It's like yep, I never will. Thank you.
Speaker 1:And it's so funny for me, like he's so far like my dad, is my dad, like that's what I call it Like like talk about horses and like some sports or like talk about my marriage and stuff like that, like, and we taught boxing because he was good at it and he was my coach, but like he's just not in my realm of, like I don't even think about him when it comes to what I'm going to accomplish in the sport. Right, I don't think about him at all. I enjoy watching him and I try to take from him. Like I look at other fighters, right, but it's just the, it's the furthest thing away from it. But I and I really feel bad.
Speaker 1:For there are people who come from, you know, like you said, parents who were one percenters in their category, right, in terms of their accomplishments, that have that hanging over them. And it's not that I feel bad, I, just I I don't even know how to relate to it. You know, now I have my, I'm sure I have my own insecurities, like any, like anybody else, you know. But that's not one of them, you know. So it's just hard to even like respond to that. But anyway, go ahead.
Speaker 2:This one thing. And then I know you're home and I know that little girl is there and Sarah and you, we have long days, I get it. So Lots of people are getting to know me and my work, which is great. That's fine. Or you think you know me, or you know the parts that you see. And One day a young woman Hmm, it's inner 20s kept saying to me I bet you was such a great mother.
Speaker 2:I wish I had had you for a mother. You're so what? And I go no, no, I really wasn't that great of a mother. I did a lot of fucked up shit. My poor daughter still paying for. No, I don't believe that. I just bet you are great mother. And I go okay, hang on one second. And she doesn't believe what a fucked up mother I was. Can you tell her? And I go, like my daughter goes oh my god, she was such the craziest buck, that mother. You have no idea. I'm still going to therapy because of her.
Speaker 2:So it's this idea that one of the things we can do and now that you're a dad and you have it, still have a dad and a mother, and I am a mother and a grandmother that we can help pave the way for each generation, whether they're, whether they're part of our blood generation or not, to encourage them to work from the inside out, to not worry and not be Stigmatized, because you deserve to ask for help, you deserve to talk about how you're thinking and feeling and acting and are they coming together and are they helping you. So we get to be the wise elders that get right, so that that someone like a Jake has the courage to be able to say I need to talk to someone, I'm not doing well and get all this and yet this isn't working right. So I or that you can actually get a mental health session in a boxing gym, because it should be everywhere, because it should be everywhere.
Speaker 2:So I just can't thank you enough and I look forward, I remember, and so we're going down to go see this young man Get in the ring again and I'm so grateful that you're coming with me and I always appreciate that when you and I walk together. You don't know this, but how to your six five?
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's five, and I'm not even five, six, so 11. So so when we're together, there's this wonderful thing where I end up like this Sit down so I can stand and look. So bless you. Thank you, george. I love you To call you my friend and to be a part of craft boxing, and I'm gonna just tell everybody listen, if you want to see real crazy well, follow this guy, because he's as crazy well a human being as I know. Great for you.
Speaker 1:Get in there and so, so grateful for for you, susie, it's funny, you talked about our height, it's? I don't, I don't feel like I'm taller than you at all. It's the funniest thing I have to like ever so, like, ever so often I realize I am and I'm like well here, but, um, but I really don't, I really don't. I see people like I see them, how I see them emotionally, and you're a giant to me. And I mean that like I had a sparring partner who was in his 50s in my old, previous career and he would come in and he was trying to explain something to me, some with yet one day, about why he was able to hit me with a specific punch.
Speaker 1:And I've been sparring with them Maybe Six, five, with six times five, thirty, so call it a hundred and twenty rounds a week, for I Mean a hundred and twenty rounds a month, or maybe six months at the time or whatever. And he was like, well, she's like, george, the reason I'm able to, to hit you with. You know, cuz, I don't know, don't, because you're so tall I have to reach up. But oh, I looked at him. I said I am taller than you. I Didn't realize it.
Speaker 1:I've known him since I was a kid and I was part of it, you know. So I've always I was so used to looking up to him and he's an elder and he's taught me a lot. That in my brain he was taller to me, which is really funny, and it was that time he was like 511, so it wasn't like that much shorter to me, but I really feel like that. So you're, you're, but yeah, you're a giant Susie. So thank you for everything you've given to me and everything you've taught me. Most of what I discussed on this podcast I discussed through Converse. I learned or arrived at, whether right or wrong, through my discussions with you. So I appreciate it and thanks for all the growth.
Speaker 2:My pleasure. We're just beginning. We're gonna keep Just getting started. All right, have a great night. I'll see you soon. I'll see you Bye. Bye, bye. Thanks, george you.