Stop Saying Sorry: Unlocking the Power of Confident Communication

About the Guest:

Kellie Bibler is the founder of Golden Pear Voice and Image and a seasoned speaker, particularly at events focusing on leadership and communication skills. 

Episode Summary:

In this episode of Chamber Amplified, Doug Jenkins, from the Findlay Hancock County Chamber of Commerce, delves into the habit of excessive apologizing with communication expert Kellie Bibler. Recorded back in September 2023, this episode revisits the issue of over-apologizing, especially in professional settings, and its negative impact on personal and professional perception. 

Kellie Bibler explores the psychology behind why people, particularly Midwesterners and women, feel compelled to apologize excessively. She underscores the importance of reframing communication habits to build confidence and professionalism. Throughout the episode, Kellie offers practical advice, grounding her insights in scientific studies that reveal gender differences in how apologies are perceived. With a focus on replacing "I'm sorry" with appreciation and factual statements, the episode provides actionable steps for listeners to become more effective communicators.

Key Takeaways:

• Over-apologizing can undermine your confidence and authority in professional communication.
• Women are statistically more likely to apologize excessively due to societal conditioning and emotional empathy.
• Reframing apologies with gratitude can significantly enhance communication effectiveness.
• Recognizing and recording instances of unnecessary apologies is crucial for breaking the habit.
• The difference between empathy and sympathy plays a role in communication dynamics, affecting how and when apologies are offered.

Resources:

• Kellie Bibler's Website: Golden Pear Voice and Image
• Email for Contact: KBibblerW@oh.rr.com
• Book Mentioned: Girl, Stop Apologizing by Rachel Hollis
• Book Mentioned: Girl on Top by Nicole Williams (Discussion on speech weakeners)

Music and sound effects obtained from https://www.zapsplat.com

Transcript

0:00:00 - (Doug Jenkins): Hi everybody. Doug Jenkins from the Findlay Hancock County Chamber of Commerce. Once again, it is a best of you already knew that that was coming up. So this was my week getting back from the conference and after the holidays. So just trying to get caught up. Wasn't sure if I would have time to really get another interview put together while trying to get everything ready to roll here in 2025. So this is the last best of Congratulations, you have made it. I hope you've enjoyed the last several episodes. Digging into our archives what's fun is that we have an archive of episodes to dig into.

0:00:31 - (Doug Jenkins): We recorded this one back in September of 2023, one of our more than 130 episodes. I think we're coming up on episode 140 here. Before too long this the featured interview here is Kelly Bibler from Golden Pair Voice and Image. She spoke at the initial Bravely Leading conference at the University of Findlay back after we recorded this or before we recorded this interview. And her discussion I thought was really interesting. We have a tendency to over apologize and we're still in the first month of the year. So maybe you're still thinking about the habits that you want to develop this year and maybe some of the things that you want to work on.

0:01:08 - (Doug Jenkins): A really fun conversation with Kelly. If you know Kelly, you know she's full of energy and has a lot of great information. If you don't know Kelly, you're really going to enjoy the interview, but we're going to talk about reframing communication habits and addressing that tendency of over apologizing. I think you're really going to like it habit to work on here in 2025. Final best of episode for a while. We're back with original episodes next week. Thank you for tuning in and we will see you next time on Chamber Amplified. Actually, that should be at the end of the podcast. You're going to listen to this episode of Chamber Amplified and then we'll see you next week for the latest new edition of it.

0:01:43 - (Doug Jenkins): Coming up next on Chamber Amplified.

0:01:45 - (Kellie Bibler): And we've been doing this our whole lives. You mentioned that we're Midwesterners. It's like ingrained in our DNA very early age. If you're someone like me, like you're a people pleaser or you're a perfectionist. So because you're that way, you're always feeling like you're letting someone down.

0:02:08 - (Doug Jenkins): Hello and welcome to the show. I'm Doug Jenkins from the Findlay Hancock County Chamber of Commerce. On each episode of Chamber Amplified, we're examining issues impacting the local business community, whether it be employee recruitment, retention, marketing, IT issues, leadership development. That's what we'll get into today. It's really anything that can be impacting your business or the business community as a whole. Our goal is to give our members tips each week on at least one way they can improve operations and thrive in the current business environment.

0:02:35 - (Doug Jenkins): One thing we do strive to do here at the Chamber is help with professional development, whether it be our small business workshops, women's leadership events, or the leadership development programs that we have. One of our goals is to help develop better leaders in our workforce. So that's kind of where we're going with today's podcast, except we we're focusing directly on you. My guest is Kelly Bibler, who recently spoke at the Bravely Leading conference at the University of Findlay. Now, Kelly talked about how you need to stop apologizing all the time and why that's important.

0:03:03 - (Doug Jenkins): And when I got to thinking about it, man, I actually apologize a lot when I probably don't need to. And we all probably do it. It's an interesting topic that will help you with communicating with clients, customers and employees, maybe even potential employers. And it will probably make you freak out a little bit about how many times you actually say you're sorry every day. Thanks again for tuning in. Remember, if you're listening on Apple Podcasts or on Spotify, rate and review the show. It really does help spread the word.

0:03:29 - (Doug Jenkins): Now let's get into it. I know this has been a long time goal of yours to do some public speaking and we'll get into what you were talking about and the stop saying sorry in the message there because it's what I want to really focus on. But first, congratulations on the speaking engagement and second, how did that feel to finally get to that point to do the public speaking?

0:03:48 - (C): Thank you. It was amazing. I. I feel like I've been learning my whole life so that I can make mistakes and then help other people do better and not make the same mistakes that I have. So I, a couple years ago it was on my bucket list to really dive into this and figure it out. So I took a course online from someone that I had been following for a while and that course helped me figure out how to structure a speech and it's from someone who's been doing it professionally. So it really gave me a place to start and, and then I just started figuring out topics and found this one that I felt like was something that I had conquered in my life and, and Then now I'm starting to take note of other things that people want to hear or interested in hearing about.

0:04:35 - (Doug Jenkins): So to give some backstory and some context to everything, the Bravely Leading conference at the University of Finley. This was a women's Leadership forum type of thing. What was the overall theme of the day for that?

0:04:47 - (C): So the overall theme was really. It's really the title of it is Women Bravely Leading. And maybe doing things that we aren't always comfortable with, or maybe outside of our comfort zone, or maybe we're scared to do it. But how do we take those steps, and how do we lead with confidence?

0:05:07 - (Doug Jenkins): I want to focus on the getting out of our comfort zone part of it for just a second, because whenever we talk women's leadership here at the Chamber, it feels sort of odd for me to talk about because of the obvious, but it's a great. There's just a great leadership curriculum for women through the Chamber, through what the University is doing. There's a lot of great resources in the community for women's leadership.

0:05:34 - (Doug Jenkins): And I don't know if I'm the one that should be talking about it or not, but I'm happy to.

0:05:40 - (C): So here's the thing, is that this was delivered in a women's leadership forum.

0:05:44 - (Kellie Bibler): And y. We have a lot of those here in Finley, because I think you're trying to empower all. All leaders, really, but you target that. But anyone who is leading or wants to lead can benefit from any of the content that you're putting out there.

0:06:00 - (Doug Jenkins): And that's kind of what I figured and why I thought this would be great, not just for any women listening, but really anybody who listens to Chamber amplified. So stop saying sorry, because I knew. I told you we'd eventually get to it.

0:06:11 - (Kellie Bibler): Yeah.

0:06:12 - (Doug Jenkins): That was the. The theme of your talk.

0:06:15 - (Kellie Bibler): Yes.

0:06:16 - (Doug Jenkins): What genesis for that? What were the conclusions that you come to?

0:06:20 - (Kellie Bibler): So the problem is that when we continually say we're sorry is that we devalue ourselves. And it portrays a lack of confidence in ourselves. And then other people stop taking us seriously or having confidence in us. So. And it's not just actually the phrase I'm sorry. That's a big piece of it. And that's what a lot of people do, and they don't realize they're doing it. But the other things that we do are different phrases that we use or different ways that we start a conversation, and we don't even realize that we're doing it or we do or we're devaluing ourselves while we're doing it.

0:07:02 - (Doug Jenkins): So when we talk about saying sorry, are we talking about the, the, you know, the stereotypical. We're all Midwestern and we like to say oh, sorry whenever we bump into somebody. Are we talking about that or is it something a little bit deeper than that?

0:07:14 - (Kellie Bibler): So it's really everything. So find is a lot of times that we are saying sorry because we feel bad because we have to deliver bad news. We feel bad because we have to say no. We don't feel confident or feel like we're subject matter experts, we're fearful or we are afraid of offending someone. And let's face it, we live in a society today where we really are fearful of offending somebody in the consequences of that.

0:07:45 - (Doug Jenkins): So when you say sorry, it sounds like it's a verbal crutch, but also more than a verbal crutch, we just kind of go to it and it. In our, I guess in our minds, it helps alleviate some of the burden of having to give bad news or having to step in and be the big bad boss, that type of thing.

0:08:00 - (Kellie Bibler): Yes. So sorry should never be a sentence starter. We are really serial sorry sayers. Like, we're a sorry society. And so what I discovered in my journey was that I was like consistently starting sentences or starting thoughts conversations personally and professionally with I'm sorry. And you can just take out the I'm sorry. You don't even need it there because it is really becoming a barrier and it's setting yourself up for failure or to not be taken seriously.

0:08:39 - (Kellie Bibler): So the idea behind this was to realize that we're doing it, number one, is because we're, it's a habit and we've been doing this our whole lives. You mentioned that we're Midwesterners. It's like ingrained in our DNA from very early age.

0:08:55 - (Doug Jenkins): Absolutely.

0:08:56 - (Kellie Bibler): If you're someone like me, like you're a people pleaser or you're a perfectionist. So because you're that way, you're always feeling like you're letting someone down or someone's not gonna like you. So I'm sorry is your for it, for it forte your entry point into getting that feedback or, or just trying to excuse yourself from a mistake that you made that really probably no one else even saw. Makes sense.

0:09:29 - (Doug Jenkins): That's a really good point. Especially that last one. A mistake that probably nobody else even picked up on.

0:09:34 - (Kellie Bibler): Yeah, I have, I talk to people about public speaking and being confident and, and help give speaking tips to people and people get nervous and then they, they say something that wasn't part of what they wanted to say. And then there's that awkwardness. And really no one knew what you were supposed to say. And most people wouldn't have the confidence to get up and do what you're doing anyway. So just go on with it. Like, you don't need to make excuses for the fact that you said something wrong that no one even knew you were.

0:10:09 - (Kellie Bibler): No one even knew what was supposed to be there in the first place.

0:10:12 - (Doug Jenkins): Like you said, this is, I think, great advice for anybody and not, not just at women in particular. But it does feel like women have a societal pressure to possibly apologize even more, to maybe soften that big bad boss image type of thing.

0:10:29 - (Kellie Bibler): Yeah. And so, I mean, there have been studies done, like, it's a scientific fact that women apologize more than men. Like, I don't know how much they paid for that study. I could have told them that for free, but. And also, their women seem to have a lower threshold for offending people. So because of those two things, like, scientifically, we're already apologizing for the fact that we may offend or.

0:11:02 - (Kellie Bibler): And you know, let's face it, like, I'm not telling you or anybody else anything that you don't already know that women are more emotional leaders just by the nature of who we are as people. Estrogen versus test, testosterone, you know, like, that's science and that's how your body works. So because we come at it as more of an emotional, we have more emotions that play into that. It. It also comes into the fact of us not wanting to offend somebody or make people feel sorry.

0:11:33 - (Kellie Bibler): And the other thing too, is that it's the difference between empathy and sympathy. So if you're more on, on the sympathetic side, you're going to feel more apt to say you're sorry. I'm sorry you feel that way. I'm sorry you are going through this. I'm sorry you're. If you're more empathetic, you're not trying to put yourself in their shoes. You're just trying to see what they see and maybe help them through it. So you're using like, oh, if I'm hearing you right, this is what you're. This is what you're feeling, this is what you're understanding, using that feel felt found. So women tend to be more sympathetic just by the nature of who we are. And sometimes we have to work a little bit harder to be more on the other side.

0:12:15 - (Doug Jenkins): So we're kind of getting to the root of the issue. What is the first step in recovery here.

0:12:21 - (Kellie Bibler): So the right. That you have to realize you have a problem before you. Before you get help. Right. So it's realizing how much you're doing it. So taking time to go back through and review your emails or your social media post or that correspondence that you're writing or. And make a tick mark. Right. Whenever you do it, or having an accountability partner who will sort of, you know, say, hey, you, you just said sorry, like, but you've got to record it and you've got to realize that you're doing it or have a co worker or someone like, let them know that you're really trying to fix this habit and then going back and seeing how much you're doing it and then going back and correcting it or learning other phrases or other things that you can use that, that aren't I'm sorry. And sometimes it's just as simple as take out the I'm sorry.

0:13:20 - (Kellie Bibler): It's just a statement. You don't even need to have I'm sorry.

0:13:24 - (Doug Jenkins): I. I think that's a good point. I had an earlier podcast that we did maybe the beginning of this year, last year. I don't know, we've been doing a bunch of these. It's almost the email technique where, you know, I hope this email finds you well, or I hope all is well your way. Just get into it and the person's probably going to respond more favorably or just as favorably as they would have if you put that filler sentence at the beginning.

0:13:47 - (Kellie Bibler): Yeah. So sometimes thank you is a phrase that we can use. So instead of saying like, I'm sorry for complaining, you say, thank you for listening.

0:13:59 - (Doug Jenkins): That's very good.

0:14:00 - (Kellie Bibler): Instead of saying, I, oh, I'm so sorry I made that mistake. Right. Like I talked about being a perfectionist or, you know, feeling bad, you say, thank you for catching that. Or instead of saying, oh, I'm sorry I'm late, you say, thank you for waiting on me.

0:14:15 - (Doug Jenkins): And I would imagine that you have to give yourself some grace in this whole rewiring of that. I know one thing that I've been striving to do, and I'm still failing at it miserably, but I'm at least cognizant of it, is I try not to refer to everybody as guys, even though that's about as Midwestern as, oops, sorry, same. You know, that type of thing where you're just, all right, I want to change the way I say this, but I know that is going to take. Take time. I would Imagine it works the same way when, when you say I'm sorry and to start every sentence.

0:14:46 - (C): Yeah, you know what?

0:14:46 - (Kellie Bibler): Like, it's a habit that you've been doing your whole life. Like, I realized that I. My whole first part of my adult life that I was a serial sorry sayer. And so it took time to change that habit. It's just like anything else, right? Like, we want to start walking, we want to start drinking water, we want to stop drinking coffee, whatever it is. It. I mean, there are studies on, you know, how long it takes to develop that habit. And this is really no different. You're changing a habit.

0:15:17 - (Doug Jenkins): So are there any resources you would direct people to if they're maybe would like to make this change or they realize that they need to make this change?

0:15:25 - (Kellie Bibler): There are so many books and articles out there. I mean, there's a book that I read by Rachel Hollis. The whole book was called Girl, stop apologizing. And that's more geared towards women. But there are lots of professional references. I mean, Forbes has written lots of articles and information on stop saying you're sorry. And, you know, a lot of it is just. There's another author, her name's Nicole Williams, she wrote a book called Girl on Top, and she talks about these things we do called speech weakeners.

0:15:58 - (Kellie Bibler): And I didn't even know there was a name for them. But you start things by saying, oh, I might be wrong about this, but. Or I don't know if anybody else.

0:16:07 - (Doug Jenkins): Feels this way, but those are great examples.

0:16:11 - (Kellie Bibler): It's. That's just the same as saying I'm sorry. Right. It devalues you. Any books about stop saying no or learning how to say no? Because a lot of times we're saying sorry because we have to say no. So you have to figure out what your priorities are and what your boundaries are and protect those. And then you have to be comfortable with saying no, because if you're comfortable with that, then you're not going to say I'm sorry as much because you're not going to feel bad because you're protecting what's there. And people will actually start to respect you more because you are protecting those boundaries.

0:16:48 - (Doug Jenkins): Kelly, one last thing for you. This isn't to say never apologize. This is to say apologize where appropriate and don't always be in apology mode.

0:16:59 - (Kellie Bibler): Right. I mean, so we, we all have read those books that talk about, like, yes, when you do something wrong, when you make a mistake and it affects other people or it has a negative impact on them, you should always apologize. For something specific and then work on a solution to how you're not going to do that again and then put that into action so it backs up your. Sorry. But really, it's, you know, these are, we're serial. We're saying it like, and we're irritating people. We're decreasing our value. Right? Like we're, we're just making them tune us out.

0:17:40 - (Kellie Bibler): They're, they're empty words. So if you're not apologizing for something specific and you're just using these as a sentence starter or as a way to, you know, make yourself feel better about something, then that's probably not a good use of it.

0:17:55 - (Doug Jenkins): Kelly, this has all been very interesting. If people want to talk to you more about this, how can they best get in touch with you?

0:18:00 - (Kellie Bibler): Yeah, absolutely. So I have an email address. It's K Bibbler B I B L E R W O h.rr.com or you can reach me through my website, which is golden pear. Like the fruit. Voiceandimage.com Very good.

0:18:17 - (Doug Jenkins): Kelly, thanks for joining us today.

0:18:19 - (Kellie Bibler): Thank you for having me.

0:18:24 - (Doug Jenkins): Thanks again to Kelly for joining us. And it seems like it's maybe time to drop our Midwestern pretenses and stop apologizing out of habit. Although we are still allowed to say ope, though that's probably not going anywhere. That'll do it for this week's episode. If you have any ideas for topics that we should cover on future episodes, just send me an email. Djenkinsindlayhancockchamber.com Remember, if you're listening on the website, you can have every episode of Chamber Amplified delivered straight to your phone. You don't even have to think about it. Just search for us in your favorite podcast player and click that subscribe button on Chamber Amplified.

0:18:56 - (Doug Jenkins): Thanks again for listening. We'll see you next time on Chamber Amplified from the Findlay Hancock County Chamber of Commerce.