235. Adepticon 40k Reveals: 11th Edition 40k, Armageddon, Kill Team Nemesis

Philip is joined by Tim and Richie as they discuss all the Warhammer 40,000 reveals from Adepticon 2026. Covering everything from Yarrick and the new Asrta Militarum vehicles through to the Red Terror and what we know about 11th edition. Watch along on YouTube: https://youtu.be/sqPJ9YkWc0w

TIMESTAMPS: 
0:00 - Into
1:46 - Armageddon
1:27:24 - Red Terror / Kill Team Nemesis
1:51:58 - 11th Edition Warhammer 40k
2:58:38 - Outro

Transcript

SPEAKER_06 0:25

Hello everyone. It is episode two hundred and thirty-five of the Lookouts for the podcast. My name is Philip, and I will be joined this episode by Tim and Richard. Lovely chaps. They're not here yet. Um they they've been here and they've gone, and it is me pulling in a late shift, just doing the intro for everyone. Um, but it's a great episode. We are talking about Adepticon, the reveals, the exciting reveals of Warhammer 40k. So we're going through all the model reveals from Armageddon, Commissar Yarrick, the Still Legion, um God, what else was there? And a bunch of other stuff. And then also 11th edition. Yay! It's it's finally here. So yeah, we're talking about all of those things. Um, I was hoping to do the Age of Sigmar reveals as well. But we just talked for so long, and uh, they wanted to go to bed, and um, yeah, they've gone to bed already, basically. So it's a good episode. Hopefully, you enjoy it. Uh, there was a few technical issues, so hopefully that won't disrupt the show too much, and I will seamlessly edit them all together. But yes, that's everything. I hope you enjoy the episode. We're gonna get on with the transitional noise. Before we get on to the actual reveal show itself, let's just have a quick discussion about the watching of the reveal show. Tim, you uh you watched the the show, I watched uh the show, Richard didn't, probably under the advice of us to avoid it because it was quite bad. In terms of the technical issues, um what did you make of it, Tim?

SPEAKER_08 2:10

Generally, from the bits I could make out, it it was okay. The reveals were great, it was the usual padding out of material to stretch out the show as long as possible. Felt a little underwhelmed when they showed the 40k stuff, to be honest. Like the cinematic was epic, it was amazing, so much so I was like, I want to do Blood Angels now. But um, in terms of what they showed what 40k would be and what you'd get in the box was very minimal. Obviously, we they're gonna drip feed stuff over the months leading up to the actual release of the new edition. But for me personally, I I just would have liked to have seen a little bit more of what's what's in the box or what's coming our way, not just two minutes. Yeah, that's fair. That's fair.

SPEAKER_06 3:02

Yeah, I mean we we can talk about that in more detail when we get to that section of the podcast. Um but yeah, in terms of the actual live stream itself, it was actually at Adepton, sort of in a live haul, so there was a lot of background noise from the crowd. Um, there was an awful lot of technical issues uh around both the mics and then also the sound level kept dipping in and out. So even when they got their both both of their mics working, um the audio level was really low, so you had to turn up your uh volume really high. But then every time they kind of cut back to the presenters, the audio level went back up really high, so you had to constantly adjust it. Um, so that was uh a bit of a pain. It was a bit odd that for the big reveal of 40k 11th edition, they didn't do it in a slightly more professional studio environment like they normally have, because I feel like they've gotten those down to a bit of a T and a bit of an art form now. But I think because it is also a 40k launch edition, they wanted the hype of the crowd, I guess. So I think maybe that's why why they did it.

SPEAKER_08 4:10

Didn't they do something similar for 8th edition, where it was a live stream kind of thing?

SPEAKER_06 4:16

Yes, that was uh I think Warhammer Fest though, 8th edition.

SPEAKER_08 4:20

Yes, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It wasn't at AdeptCon, but it was it was uh like uh in front of a live audience.

SPEAKER_06 4:26

It was because actually 8th edition, we played the game at Warhammer Fest, so it wouldn't have been revealing the sho uh uh revealing the contents and the the game itself, so maybe that was done somewhere else. Um I can't quite remember. Can you remember, Richard?

SPEAKER_00 4:42

No, I can't remember. And I didn't watch this one because you told me not you told me that you advised of the technical issues there were with the with the broadcast. And it I was like, I'll just I'll just read the articles. Fair ones. It was me.

SPEAKER_06 4:56

I think it was meant to be like an hour and end up being like an hour 45, and there was a lot of and there was a bit where the video just went completely dead as well that you had to then skip through. And uh initially I thought it was a problem with streaming on Twitch, and I had actually just a bunch of problems watching the Twitch video, like on my laptop, it just didn't work for some reason, so I had to watch it uh on my other computer. Um so yeah, I yeah, it was just it was a really frustrating watch, which meant my experience was somewhat marred um both from my technical issues and the audio video technical issues of of the streamers themselves. Um the reveals themselves were really good. Um but yeah, I feel now I should watch it though.

SPEAKER_00 5:39

Maybe just for the just for the let's have an opinion on it. I mean because it when when I think back to like what I've done through my career, like I remember what one of my old bosses was was a firm believer in never doing live streams, if you can help it. Like just just pre-record everything so you can't so you can't have technical issues. Because there's something like the scale, they what it sounds like they would do because I I I I can't comment because I've not actually watched it or how they'd set it up, but it sounds like they were in a room doing it live to an audience and streaming on to the internet at the same time.

SPEAKER_06 6:12

Yes, which normally they don't do, or the times they have done it previously, they very rarely do that. So I remember at Warhammer Fest, they would just do a show that wasn't being streamed to an audience, and pretty much at the same time, pre-recorded live show were sorry, a pre-recorded show was going out live on Warhammer Community, but was kind of in sync with the reveals that were happening at the at the like Adepton or Warhammer Fest or wherever. So that's how they had done it previously. Um, and then the last few times it's just been it's either been pre-recorded or it's been just live but from the Warhammer Studio which I guess they can control and they can test here they're at an events hall, which I assume they don't have access to much beforehand in terms of doing a technical setup.

SPEAKER_00 7:04

Yeah, it it's cool they've attempted that, but at the same time, it is ill ad it is not advisable to do so because you add so many variables of what can go wrong on it. Sounds like they've had the kind of technical issues you could have if you were doing such a thing. But yeah, if we if we're not I would expect to see a more higher higher produced uh full like stream or when they do the full reveal. If they weren't going to already, I think they will they will now either either way, because you uh you kind of want to make it look as polished as possible when you reveal that the the new Yeah, that's true, because the initial video which covers the first section that we're going to talk about, which was Yarrick and Armageddon.

SPEAKER_06 7:47

So that initial video you couldn't hear the audio over the top, which was basically a joke because the guy saying, What would what would Yarrick do? You know, and it's basically bring on the Steel Legion. Um so that whole joke was completely lost on everyone because all you could hear is the sound of the uh the background crowd chatting away as as this video was playing live. So yeah, there was a few sort of things like that which sort of marred the overall um the wow factor of the show.

SPEAKER_00 8:18

It also sounds like a thing Americans like. American Mike says American executives love to have crowds getting excited when they're doing reveals.

SPEAKER_06 8:25

Well, that is true, yeah. They did a few shout-outs, uh, there were a few whoops, there was definitely a few QA's. Uh so one person, when they were trying to kill time as they fixed one of the mics, someone asked, How come Yarrick's back from the dead? And they basically said, Well, we will answer that in 15 minutes, of which they didn't really answer because they said the answer's in a book. So on that note, let's go talk about Yarrick and Wazdaka Gutsmeck um and the fate of Armageddon. Noting that this is meant to be like a really exciting reveal talking all about Armageddon, though we uh well the book's been out for a while, but the last battle for Armageddon featured Angron and the Grey Knights. Um Orcs did barely feature in that in that campaign book whatsoever. So it's interesting that all of a sudden orcs are back on the menu and and and they're back. Um, you know, but I'm not sure.

SPEAKER_00 9:24

Which I if I if I may, it feels like going back to basics of the lore. Classics. Going back to yeah, classic lore and vibes, which I think is consistent with how how we see the extra looking at the new edition as well. But so I think what we're seeing in this Armageddon book going bringing back the orcs because it's the orcs are Armageddon, I think is it's going back to what people remember that almost a nostalgia almost going playing on a nostalgia because this is like what Warhammer was, this is what 40k was, and where it where it came from. Let's go back to that.

SPEAKER_08 9:54

They're definitely playing on the nostalgia button. That was the feel I got from this reveal of 40k.

SPEAKER_06 10:00

Yeah, no, that's true. Because yeah, so Armageddon in the last campaign book, it was basically riddled with demons, chaotic energy. Angron comes to the planet, gets beaten back into the warp, he then comes back again as the Grey Knights are basically trying to dismantle this great uh chaos gate that is basically sucking all the warp energy and empowering all the demons. But that gets closed, Angron gets banished, the Grey Knight Grandmaster dies along with a couple of the other slightly lesser named characters. So I guess in theory, at the end of I assume that's like maybe technically the fifth war for Armageddon, but they didn't reference it as being a particular war in terms of number. So maybe it doesn't get one. But in theory, all the demons should have gone because of the gates being closed. So now maybe that gives you space for the orcs to thrive once more. So yeah, let's talk about some of the minis. We've got uh Wazdaka uh Gutsmeck uh is our first miniature, who feels to me reminds me a little bit of the uh Warboss on Trike or bike from the Forge World uh range from many years ago. Um yeah, it's a beautiful mini. Uh it's got some great uh elemental effects in terms of the engine blast and the smoke, and he sort of doing a cool like leap. It's like a ready um ready-made golden demon miniature, I would say. And there's our Resident Orc aficionado, Richard. What is your take on this miniature?

SPEAKER_00 11:34

I think it's really cool. It's it I think it's really cool because it's the first time there's been someone in the comments might prove might might say I'm wrong here. I believe this is the first time there's been like an actual war boss on a bike in plastic. Historically, it's only been a Forge World mini, has been there's been a war boss on a bike. But this thing is the first time we've actually had one. Um because when we're gonna be able to do that.

SPEAKER_06 11:54

I think there's been rules for it, but maybe not an actual miniature other than uh counts as.

SPEAKER_00 11:59

Yeah, because there's been the the we've had the trike, the war trike, which came out, which was which was kind of cool. It it is a cool mini zone where it's not quite, it wasn't like you want you won't you wanna have a bike boss with all your bikes. And what I love about this is the is the gun, is it's not like the two flanking side guns. So I'm assuming slash hope. Lopsided.

SPEAKER_03 12:19

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 12:19

Yeah, because the guns, is the gun on the front? The guns like on the front of it. Guns on the front. Yeah, the guns on the front, and in the past they've they've always had like two autocans or boot shooters on the on the on the side. It's like a plane. So I'm wondering if this is indicative of the of how the I'm assuming from this that there will be new bike minis in the in the in the big box. Or when the they'll or they'll be good we uh we'll be finally having new bikes, because the bike minis minis are pretty old now, so I'm assuming this could be a a style of how they're gonna look. Um they look cool because the the speedwire minis they had a few years ago a few years ago now, or it might be more than a few years, but that range of the speedwire was some of the coolest minis that they are in 40k. And so this looks on the on par with that kind of vibe, so it's really cool.

SPEAKER_08 13:04

Nice. What do you think of it, Tim? I think it's super cool. I think it's on the edge of being maybe over slightly too busy. There's quite a lot going on with this model, and that's not to say that it's like an uncool model, it's just more of like all the intricate details that you're gonna have to paint to get this guy on the table if you wanted to paint him to a nice standard. However, he is a character model, so you you kind of expect it. And the rumors are that this edition was supposed to be more of like a bike heavy or fast attack kind of themed box set, if I remember correctly. So as long as the other bikes are a little bit more simplistic or simpler, then yeah, it it's absolutely fine. But if all the bikes are like this, I I would I would struggle getting like all these painted in a decent spike.

SPEAKER_06 13:56

I mean, that is just the general problem with Games Workshop miniatures, regardless of whether it's a small infantryman or a character, they're always overloaded with details, it seems. Uh, and yeah, this guy's got a lot because he's got um I mean he he feels visually like a bit of an explosion because he's got spiky bits going out in all directions. So he's got these uh front sort of uh bumpers that are poking out in one direction. He's got his uh power claw arm up in the air, he's got his totem on the back, and then the sort of exhaust jets, uh, and then all the smoke and rock as well, and even the base detail. I mean, they've actually added some nice like real-world uh bit of foliage in there by the like the br little branch sort of bits, like their actual tiny roots or something, maybe. But yeah, it's a beautiful mini, a great paint job, very dynamic.

SPEAKER_00 14:45

Yeah. I d I I I disagree with Tim. I think we should expect the bikes to be as detailed, as complicated. I I remember the I I I I I recall vividly that it was when I was doing the speedwall minis, was the first time I I had to do subassemblies. I I've I've done it, I mean I've I've done it with like nights where it's like I'll paint this arm of this night before, but with like a smaller models, it were the spe the speedwall minis was the first time it's like, well, I'm gonna have to paint this before I assemble it. Uh because it's just impossible. And with this and with some of the other minis we'll see through the the rest of the reveals, I think they are they Games Workshop miniature designers are really embracing making the coolest minis possible, but that is they're like make it's they're making it now so you have you're gonna have to do subassemblies and stuff. Like there are certain minis that are cut that like this one and some others we'll see later where it's like you will have to paint the you will have to paint these before you glue it all together, which is not something I'm that I've become more used to that as I've got more involved in the hobby, but I still just like do I'm gonna build the ho build the thing, play with it, and then slowly paint it. Stuff like this you can't do that with. It's like a it's an it's uh it's almost it's forcing, you know, it's in a way forcing you to subassembly and then paint it. And I'll be curious to see how that kind of pans out with people like because I know I know lots of people who who every time I go to any kind of hobby club or Warham World, there's lots of people who are playing with plastic minis or got like undercoated or they people like to play with them as they're be uh paint them as they're as they play with them. They don't paint them instantly and then play. So with more and more minis which are very clearly to do to look good, you're gonna have to paint them and before the assembly. I'm curious to see how that's gonna be embraced by people.

SPEAKER_08 16:25

Yeah, well, I'm gonna I think sorry, uh yeah, I was just gonna say like obviously this has been something that's been developing over the years anyway, where more detail has been creeping into the models, and I think it works if like okay, so if you're gonna paint a model just using contrast paints or speed paints, the amount of detail there works really well because the contrast paints can pick up on it. Equally, if you're gonna try and go down like the heavy metal route or like the high-end standard of painting, it works because there's a lot of detail there, and so you've got a lot of materials and textures to work off to really show your skills. It's it's kind of like if you're stuck in the middle ground, it kind of works and it kind of doesn't. It because if you just let's say you just do like like just tabletop, what is it called, battle standard, where you just do like base coating, the model won't look that great, in my opinion, because you'll miss out on all the detail and stuff, and that's where too much detail becomes a problem, in my opinion.

SPEAKER_06 17:33

Yeah, no, that's true. In one way, it's a having lots of detail aids contrast paint because you've got lots of recesses for the contrast paint to go into, but you have lots of individual elements that all need to be painted different colours to make that work. Whereas a plain t-shirt um just gets painted one colour and you're done. But now it's like a t-shirt with a bandolier and a waistcoat and shoulder pads, and it's like all of those things now need to be individually painted. But potentially with a lower skill set, the model would just look better because there's more detail inherently on the model and not these like big flat surfaces that feel a bit empty, but at the same time, it would be a lot quicker just to paint models up that don't have that detail on. Um, I think this model in particular, you could probably get away with maybe not subassembling because it doesn't seem like there's too much overlaying details. Obviously, maybe painting up the orcs separately would be a bit more beneficial, and maybe things like the totem pole, um, maybe some of that exhaust and smoke stuff you could add on later. I think the problem with subassemblies is you know, I try and avoid them if I can half time because as Richard you're saying, I kind of want to be able to play with the minis. Um, although it's a nice, um, nice uh sort of motivation to not be able to at all paint it and sorry play with it until you can paint it. But if you've got a ton of subassemblies all over your desk, I'm invariably going to lose something. So I'd rather just stick it on the model and struggle slightly with painting it. But yeah, when it comes to actual subassemblies, I don't think Games Workshop does a great job of designing the kits with subassemblies in mind. So it's half the time it's like, cool, I've got to add, let's say, this power claw onto this orc, but it isn't like a seamless join, and actually half the time it's like something I'm gonna need to gap fill or something uh to blend those two pieces together. Uh actually a power claw is a really bad example because one's metal, one's flesh. But imagine it's like an arm and a head, or a torso and an arm, and actually you want to blend that skin in with um like some green stuff or something, so it's smooth, but the subassembly just doesn't really work for that. So yeah, I think sometimes subassemblies is uh more of a pain than it's actually worth doing. But if you're doing a really high-end paint job, then it's probably worth doing either way. But the problem is the assembly bit once it's all been painted, I find that's uh that's where it can go wrong.

SPEAKER_00 20:01

Um yeah, let's move on. I would I would say the the or the speedwell kits were pretty good at saying, hey, you'll want to like pointing out in the instructions. That's good. Yeah, they yeah, they like I mean you have to be good, you have to know what you're looking for, but it's like they've got like a symbol to let you know that this is where it's got like symbols like don't glue this or paint or uh paint this before you assemble it.

SPEAKER_06 20:23

Yeah, because I remember the like combat patrol and spearhead magazines were actually really good at that. They would call out specific places where it's like don't glue these bits together until you've painted the model, like very explicitly. And I thought those build instructions were a lot better than the uh you know the language agnostic build instructions that you get in the boxes. But yeah, maybe I'm just not looking at the right symbol to clock that.

SPEAKER_00 20:51

My experience is that they've that Games of Workshop have been doing a better job of that over uh as someone who's been in the hobby for 20 odd years, they've done a really good job of how of that kind of stuff. Yeah, looking at the back here, it's like you're it's like you're definitely there's so much detail on there, but it's it's really cool the amount of detail that they do add for the orcs.

SPEAKER_06 21:07

Yeah, I was gonna say that there's not a grot on it, and actually there is, he was just hiding around the other side. And you here you can see a version where they that sort of um exhaust explosion isn't on there, so that is clearly an optional piece that you could easily subassembly and add on at a later date. Um so that's quite cool. And it it's great that it gives you people choice, because I always say a lot of people hate those extra bits of environmental aesthetics when it comes to smoking, you know, yeah, s smoke and explosions and stuff like that. So that's quite cool. I love the um the the biker jacket detail that they've uh painted on with freehand, that's very cool. Um yeah, it's a nice mini. Uh and then on to the real uh you know, the real champion of the of the of the show, Komisar Yarek. Uh he's got a new mini that obviously was already revealed to us uh a little bit before. Um he's very cool. Um I've got my own one here that I can show off that I've uh that I've got uh there we go. Um so you say it's a copy, Phil.

SPEAKER_00 22:12

Your one is better, Phil. Your pose is better. I remember I remember having to talk you into changing the pose so we'd look better.

SPEAKER_06 22:20

That is true, yeah, because the new kit is an exact replica of the old kit, uh, which is the one I use. So mine was fine cast, but I just reposed it to look like some different uh artwork. I'm currently trying to edit a very old video which uh where I filmed the entire conversion process and and try and put that out on my uh Beyond the Tabletop channel, but it's gonna take forever because it's like a three-hour long uh video so far, but I'll edit it down into effectively you know a few half-hour chunks, I think. Um but yeah, Yarek's a cool miniature, it's great to see he's back. Um I've seen loads of people speculate that he was never really dead, um, and it was all you know YouTubers' faults for implying that he was dead. But yeah, Games Workshop's grand plan all along was for him to come back, which I think personally was complete nonsense because the timelines match up with in Fedition, he had to disappear because they got rid of his model, and that was about three years ago. And as we saw in this reveal show, their lead time is at least well, is around about two years because they've just announced some Steel Legion um artwork, which I don't think they've actually mentioned in this article. So we'll have to if it's not at the at the bottom of this, we will talk about it then. Um so yeah, I think there was a good uh six months to a year where they were like, yeah, Yarek's dead. We are comfortable with that fact, and then after the community backlash, they were like, Oh, actually, maybe we should bring him back, and he's been brought back specifically um with this in mind. Uh, but it's a very cool miniature. I sort of wish he was on a bigger diorama base, like my guy. I sort of wish he was a bit Leontis scale, um, but I don't mind that too much. Um I was also hoping he might have a Fortress of Arrogance or mini Fortress of Arrogance option, but we see someone else has now claimed that Thunder. You know, ultimately it's a cool miniature, but I don't think I'll buy one just because I've I've got my one that I spent ages on and I want to make the most of that. And I think scale-wise fits my uh you know, Forge World Krieg a little bit better, but it is an undeniably cool miniature.

SPEAKER_08 24:36

Um it is a super cool miniature. Just going on off the point of like having a little diorama base. I think it would have been really cool to see him maybe posed up on like a like a fallen eagle bust, like half wedged into the ground or something, just some kind of like imperial imperial symbol that he can stand on instead of just like some generic rubble, would have maybe just elevated it a little bit more. Obviously, he would have needed a bigger base and be like Leonidas, but I guess you can't do that because of like the rules and stuff that will come with him as well. Because he is a commissar, although the best commissar, but he is still just a commissar. Yeah, that's true. Uh Richard, what's your uh take on him?

SPEAKER_00 25:20

I think he's a really cool model. I'm glad he's come back from the dead. I might based on the fact that I mean he he it's a it's a cool, like the the previous model I didn't like. I thought it was Rabbit just why to convince you to change the pose. This is a better version of that old pose. I'll give um I will give him that. I think it's this is this is one of the best versions of Yarrick they've ever made. It does feel though that they w they were trying they were they in I I my personal feeling is I think they intended to kill him off and replace him with a female version like they did with other factors. And if if only there was any evidence of this to suggest that that was the plan.

SPEAKER_06 25:57

Which we will look on to very shortly.

SPEAKER_00 26:00

Either way, the way history's panned out, we have a really cool new Yarick Mini. I hope he's got cool rules to go with it. Um be good to have. I hope there's there's some some kind of thematic stuff they'll do with like him and Gaz or something to uh something something along those lines within the campaign book because Gazcool and old Bay Lai in general are is a cool historical dynamic and it's the best thing, it's still the best thing on Warhammer TV. Um even though there's lots of good stuff on there, that's still the best thing that's on there.

SPEAKER_06 26:26

Yeah, it was like the first or one of the first Hammer and Bolter animations that they did.

SPEAKER_00 26:32

It's phenomenal. There's lots there's lots of really good stuff on there, including the first uh well I'll talk a bit more about it later because it was the first I remember years ago we saw one of the minis which was part of this reveal in Warhammer TV.

SPEAKER_06 26:44

Oh yes, yeah, yeah. Well we also get to that when we get to the AOS section. Um but yeah, I remember when um uh when uh Gaz came and got his new miniature and they were like, and we've got his ultimate opponent with him, and it was Ragnar Blackmane, and I was like, what do you want about Games Workshop? It's Yarrick, everyone knows it's Yarek. So I think Yarek was just living in limbo of having a terribly old sculpt, so they were promoting Ragnar Blackmane, his his latest uh you know, anti-hero or opponent to go up against. But I I think my one criticism of this model is that it is just a formulaic redo of an old sculpt, which is it just feels like that's what all games workshop seems to do nowadays when it comes to redoing old sculpts. They just take a previous one and completely one-to-one redo it. Obviously, um we got that with uh Minus Kalgar. We've had it with all of pretty much the Blood Angel characters, and sometimes it works really well. And in this one, it arguably is a beautiful sculpt, but it's just um not very imaginative and it's not um yeah, it's it's not very creative in terms of what they could have done. They could have, like I said, put him inside of a vehicle or had him surrounded by attendants and officers on a mini diorama base. They could have even put him in a kind of Titus or Huron style command squad, so he could have had a bunch of extra models with him. And they could have been really creative in that regard, and they haven't, which I feel is a little bit unfortunate. Or maybe he will. Maybe he will. Maybe that is still something that they've just not revealed yet, which would be interesting.

SPEAKER_00 28:32

Because they did because they did do that with whose name is Titus.

SPEAKER_06 28:37

Titus. They revealed Titus Centuron separately first, and then those other characters later on. And pretty much in all the campaign books, the lead person has also come in a box with a bunch of other miniatures. Obviously, I don't think they've done that with the um the Eye of Terror one, which is because the only character model with that is the um turn. So he hasn't kind of got a retinue, so that kind of breaks the trend. But two out of the possible four so far definitely have. This is, I guess, is the fourth, and I assume final one as well. So that would be interesting to see. But yeah, they can only redo sculpt so many times. I feel like this is the ultimate sculpt of Yarrick. They can't give us in 10 years' time another sculpt that just looks like this, but in a slightly better, but slightly even more detailed somehow, if that was at all possible. Um, they do need to start innovating. I think innovating is the word I was really looking for.

SPEAKER_00 29:35

Or go back to the OG Yarrick. I want to see the OG Yarrick again.

SPEAKER_06 29:38

Well, I the crab claw I I would really like. Yeah, yeah. That was my favourite one. He's missing his back banner, so that is probably what they would do. They'd be like, cool, give him a back banner, have his claw up in the air, um, and yeah, make it. I mean, the crab claw, I just don't think fits the orc uh design aesthetic now, but it was quite iconic, I think. Um yeah, uh has anyone got anything else to say on Yarrick before we move on to the pretender of Yarrick? Nah, move on. I could talk about him for ages, but yeah. And next up we've got Commissar Graves, who is a really interesting model. Firstly, I will point out when I first saw it, I assumed Graves was a man, but the presenters told me it was a lady. Looking at the artwork, it also looks like a guy. So it either Games Workshop struggles to sculpt female faces particularly well, or it's a very sort of gender-neutral presenting character. Um, or they just said it was a lady when it was potentially a very young boy commissar, potentially. And I think they had that a similar issue with the other named female commissar, which was from Black Library, is it just looked like a young guy rather than a woman in particular. But this one, this commoisseur, comes with a vehicle. Hold on, has it got a name? If it does, it's a bit.

SPEAKER_00 31:03

Can James stop trying to make the Torox happen? I've it I think a Torox.

SPEAKER_06 31:11

Torox. It's a stretch limo version of a Torox for sure. It's I like the sort of eagle elements to it. Um it does kind of work as a mini fortress of arrogance. This is sort of what I would almost want Yarrick to have, noting that she does have an oversized power fist and is on a effectively mini fortress of arrogance with a bunch of attendants. Does make me think that your theory and my theory that we had independently is a bit Tim Foil hat, but also 100% correct. This was meant to be a new version and a replacement of Yarrick in the same way that they did a Slacreed to replace the OG character. Yarrick was so beloved by the fans, all the backlash was there that they decided to just do both. That feels completely legit as a thing. Otherwise, why isn't Yarrick in this as a thing that he's riding around in? They go, oh, but we he has to be in his fortress of arrogance. Um but you know, maybe this could have been the Batmobile of a Fortress of Arrogance, is the front half that detaches from the rest of the Fortress of Arrogance when it gets slightly damaged. Um, and I have the the Dark Knight.

SPEAKER_00 32:19

Uh I wait, I'll wait to see it in the flesh, but the the the the the Torx half-track visual vibe thing never jailed with me, never liked it. I remember there was like some people some of the third-party kits did like they could replace the tracks with more wheels and that's what I think.

SPEAKER_06 32:34

Yeah, so there were models and minis, it was one of the more famous ones where the front tracks could become wheels, so it looked more like a half-track like this. Um I think they're doing a relatively good job of trying to marry the aesthetics of the uh the Torox with the new half-track um Centaur model, I think it's called, with a sort of a pimpmobile version for Greaves as a character vehicle. I think, and this is the first time since Commander PASC that we've had effectively a named character vehicle, I guess. Um, but what's cool about her is she actually gets an on-foot version as well, and I think the foot version is very cool. I really like it. Um I think both sculpts of her are really fantastic, both her in the vehicle and on foot. But I think, yeah, the vehicle's just a bit of a a stream, I think. Also, so much to paint up because you've got all those people plus the back banner. It's not like it's just the top half of her sticking out of a coppola hatch um like you would get in a tank commander. It's like a bunch of extra people to do. So there's a lot of work to paint up. Um I quite like the it's almost like um it feels very Fiora-esque with the two little flags waving at the front, like you got on like World War II, um, you know, Hitler Hitler mobiles for one of a better word. That that's the vibes it's giving, and I I don't know if that's necessarily deliberate or it's you know, whatever villain is in Indiana Jones, they had a similar thing. Uh the little flags. The Nazis, basically, yeah. They were still the Nazis, yeah. Uh Tim, what is uh Save me, Tim, what's your take on this? Do you not mention the Nazis?

SPEAKER_08 34:29

I will try not mention them. Um I I think it's pretty cool, and I'm kind of interested to see what will come of this because is this just one variant and there's many more variants to come in the works to sort of support the rest of the uh Imperial Guard? I know we'll see there's other reveals later on, but uh going off Richie's comment earlier of like just let the Torex die, I'm like, no, don't let it die. Try try and drag it along, keep on kicking it down the road because I think Tempest of Scions are cool, and so if we can have a more viable army of Tempest of Science with more viable Torex, I say let's go for it.

SPEAKER_06 35:11

Well, the the two guys on the back kind of look a bit scion-esque with the helmets, although the photos aren't super detailed, so it's a bit hard to tell. Um, and then when we get to the APC variant and the half-track variant, if you were to assume, and we could talk about this more when we get to the point, if we were to assume they're based on the German uh versions of those tanks from World War II, um they had a ton of different variants. So they had ones with you know, like sort of autocannons on the back as anti-aircraft vehicles or anti-tank weapons or missile launchers, which ultimately is sort of how the Chimera currently operates. So I could imagine that they're actually using this spaces of a chassis with a lot of modular options that they could give a small variance of these vehicles, which is a shame because while this is definitely better than the Torox, it's still not as cool as a Chimera. So, yeah, personally, I'd I'd prefer Chimera's offer this to have been some kind of Lehman Russ tank. Because Lehman Russ commissar tanks used to be a thing. So I I wouldn't have been opposed to something like that. And I guess you could convert one up if you really hated this model. Um obviously you don't really have room for the crew, but they could be gunners at the back, they could just be they could be chilling out on the hole and and and riding along, and then yeah, uh Greaves could be coming out of the hatch. So yeah, there's definitely options for it for sure.

SPEAKER_00 36:42

I do really like the the drive me closer so I can stab it with my sword vibes, it gives.

SPEAKER_06 36:47

It's a it's a classic one. I mean, I have that model as well somewhere, although I think the sword uh snapped off, unfortunately, of my uh tank commander that with his sword in the air. Um so yeah, it's uh it's a it's a meme for a reason, uh, and it's very cool. And I do like the bulldozer at the front that's an eagle, reminds me of the wasn't that also something like the Fortress of Arrogance? Or no, it was uh Fortress of Red uh was it the redemption, the Dark Angels um one.

SPEAKER_08 37:15

Do you remember what I mean? I can't remember the one you mean. I was actually going to say this reminds me of the Gene Steeler Cult limo back in the day.

SPEAKER_06 37:22

Well, it has that element to it, and I imagine there are Gene Stealer Cult fans that will happily take this and convert it, and I think that actually that would work really well and sort of makes sense actually if you think about how gene stealers have access to Astra Militarum. So now I this could easily be a reimagining of that um limo because it is it feels like a very stretched version of the Torox, so it does does work for that.

SPEAKER_08 37:48

Um definitely stick a magos on top of there with like a flag and away you go.

SPEAKER_02 37:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 37:54

Yeah, I think it could uh work really uh nicely.

SPEAKER_00 37:59

So look looking at the on the on foot version is yeah, you mentioned already it's one of it is one of the coolest commissars that I think there's ever been. Yeah. And it's just it's it's a really cool, it's a really in terms of the poses that they've they've had, just the casual confidence of just like the way she's poses it posed in the on foot version, it's like I'm a badass. Yes. What are you gonna do about it? It's it it's this like confident pose of you can't mess with her, and it's it's such a great pose.

SPEAKER_06 38:25

Yeah, it's interesting because in the in the live stream they mentioned that her sort of introduction is she gets to the planet and then she immediately kills um like a high-ranking person. And I'm like, that is literally the story of Yarrick. So it's like if this isn't a clue that this is a Yarrick replacement with the giant power fist, it's like I don't know what else is. Um, but it was interesting that that was the the law. So it'd be interesting to see how uh I guess when we get to the story, um, how they introduce them all and uh uh introduce Yarrick back from the dead. So Tim, you wanted to say something?

SPEAKER_08 39:00

I was just gonna say that like all the commissars have quite a stoic pose as it is. Um, and I'm actually a fan of the one that's in the current range at the moment, just the bulk standard commissar. Again, just because he's just standing there quite historically with the chainsaw down by the side and the trusty bolt pistol of justice also just kind of like down by his side as well. He's just looking like, come at me.

SPEAKER_06 39:25

Yeah, I like this one too. I think that if I was to rank all the commissars, obviously Yarak would be number one, but number two would be this one, the Omfort version, I think is really cool. Um, definitely better than some of the Krieg uh sort of commissars that we've had. And I would say this one's better than the standard Cadian one, personally.

SPEAKER_00 39:44

I'm I'm gonna be controversial and say this is cooler than Yarrick. I mean to be honest, the Yarrick pose where he's the the key the Yarrick pose where he's he's pointing forward with his claw doesn't make any sense, it's never made sense to me. Right, yeah, because he thinks he should be shooting. If he should be he's not gonna be pointing with his claw, that's just for me that's always felt weird as a pose, but th this pose is just a cooler pose. Like the way it's like it's gonna it's dynamic too, because they're just like walking down these steps.

SPEAKER_06 40:10

Like just what I like about it, is it's um this is a really cool model.

SPEAKER_00 40:16

Yeah, that's what I want.

unknown 40:18

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_06 40:18

That's all I've got to say. I agree. I feel like there's just some innate loyalty to Yarek which tips it, but this one is actually up there, so I um I wouldn't complain with your your ranking. Then we get onto probably the most maddest um reveal of the entire weekend, Inquisitor Croyle, who is uh uh Inquisitor Xenos, um like hunter. He looks like he's from the feudal guard, he almost looks like he's from the Empire of Man, uh from Warhammer Fancy Battle, riding a multi-limbed alien weird beast thing with a almost Kree gas gas mask on the horse, or one of the riders, I guess, and he's got a massive sniper rifle on him as well. Um then he's got a variant where I love actually the variant where you don't see the gas mask and you see the weird mouth because it just makes it so disgusting, and then it's got these two little shrimp-like arms at the front as well, and it's the last of its race as well. Yeah, uh Tim, give us your first impressions. It's mental.

SPEAKER_08 41:25

It's like for a 40k model is insane, and I love it. I know I'm sort of contradicting myself here with like the level of level of detail on this thing, but man, how intricately designed is this? And I kind of just want to know more about this inquisitor and where he's come from and like the law behind him. Inquisitors are always fascinating to me as one of like the character types that you get within the world of 40k, because they've always had such interesting and varied backgrounds, and sometimes controversial and sometimes just quite straight down the line. But it would also be interesting to see how he plays because we don't know all the ins and outs of the 11th edition, and with the whole like leaders are leaders, like, what does this actually mean for lone heroes? Because this does not seem to be like a HQ unit in the air quite tuning.

SPEAKER_06 42:32

Which is sort of almost unusual for what inquisitors should be. They're normally like individual foot heroes, uh, with the exception, I guess, of the uh Fortress of No, uh was it Fortress of Judgment? Um Yeah, Fortress of Judgment, I think it was called, which was the Walker variant. That was the only sort of big-based version of an Inquisitor that we've had so far. So it feels like this could be a very different playstyle. It's just not what anyone was expecting, and that's sort of what I love about it. I feel like someone was just probably someone was given a very thankless task in the design studio, uh, and then this was their reward to just basically go nuts on something and do whatever you want. And this is what they've come up with. That's what it it comes across because it's so left-field, it's um yeah, it's pretty cool. Uh Richie, what's your uh take on that?

SPEAKER_00 43:21

It reminds me of when Inquisitor Draxus came out, but turned up to 11. Because I remember when when she was released, it was like this is like she's an Inquisitor with some weird alien bird and an Eldar shuriken gun thing. And it's like, what on earth is this? How is this even allowed within the Inquisition? Oh, it's okay because they're they're in the Xenos. The Inquisitor Xenos, so they're allowed to do that. Oh, okay. What's the what what's the most extreme version of that that there could be? This. And I don't like the helmet. I feel the helmet looks just to me. I don't know if the guy on the expression is yeah, I it what for me it it feels a bit too much what's the what Who were the the the con like the conquistadors, like the span the Spanish like that? But I when he's with the version without the helmet, that's really cool. As this like kind of like old aristocrat guy who's to have but who's had access to all the information and technology in the universe, and he just he's decided this is the best horse. So he's gonna have the best horse that exists anywhere. It's a bit too mad for me.

SPEAKER_06 44:27

It's a bit gross looking, but in a good way, I think. Yeah, conceptually it's even weirder than the deaf riders, which were historically very weird horses.

SPEAKER_00 44:38

I mean, if you remember, I was not a fan of the deaf rider's weird feet. So this is for me, this is like what is going on here?

SPEAKER_06 44:44

Um I think I think the feet here are more normal than the Deaf Rider feet, but it's the weird kind of four-limb claws that it's got. And the sheer number of feet, yeah, that's the weird thing for sure. And the mouth is just insane, but but I I'm kind of here for that.

SPEAKER_00 45:02

As an indication of where they can be, of where 40k can go, it's very it's it's very exciting. This as a conception of this model, what it represents really exciting.

SPEAKER_06 45:12

Yeah, it's like when they did the amble, it's like it's a great snippet of it's like a slice of 40k that you'd never get to see. It doesn't need to be a whole race or a new faction, but it's just adding in the weirdness of 40k, and I do love it when they show us these other alien races that are meant to be out there, although with this one, this is the the last remaining one. Um narratively that's a good way of getting around it, I guess, to stop people going, I want more. I want a whole I want a whole Def Ridus unit of them. It's like, well, you technically can't have that. I mean it would be a very expensive kit bash, even if you did. Yeah, I know what I sort of know what you mean about the Comquestor hat. It is a little bit too much. Um, yeah, very feudal guard though. Um, but uh yeah, the non-helmeted version is pretty cool as well. Uh I think the mount is the thing Stephen Bachet though.

SPEAKER_00 46:05

If this is the only one in the universe, has Trazen already got one? Because if he d that's that's my that's my like with my lore hat on. Does Trazen have one already, or is Trazen have gonna be that beeling for this?

SPEAKER_08 46:17

Trazen's gonna come for this thing straight away.

SPEAKER_06 46:20

That would be a fun uh mini-game. Yeah, when they're both on the battlefield. Um cool. Okay, that's round uh round roundly successful. So next up we've got Intrazia Frey, the Dogmato Superior, on her own little walker, the throne of judgment, I believe it is. I keep getting Freyne and Fortress mix up. And the previous one that this is clearly based on was the Throne of Arrogance, not to be confused with Fortress of Arrogance, which was an old Inquisitor model. So Games of Shop, clearly borrowing from themselves, but concept-wise, very cool, miniature-wise. Yeah, I I really like it. I think personally it's very cool. Um the legs look very similar to the old Armages, or not maybe that old. Um, I don't think they look like the war suits. Um, Richard, you might have a better idea because you you did you have the war suits?

SPEAKER_00 47:13

Yeah, yeah, I've got the Pelagon Warsuits. They're basically like legs, like regular human human-style legs. Whereas these are these, I mean these literally look like the legs of an Armager, but just slightly with a little more declaration.

SPEAKER_06 47:27

But I I assume they're a bit smaller as well in scale, but I who knows for sure. Because she's uh yeah, her base I would say maybe could be smaller than uh Armager's, but the feet definitely look like Armage, especially with the armor, but as you say, with just more uh detailing on her.

SPEAKER_00 47:46

No, you're no you're no you're right. These are more the well, they're a cross between the the Sentinel and the Armager. It looks like the feet the the feet themselves look like the Sentinel. But the kind of design no, they are they're Sentinel legs. This is this is a con this is a modified sentinel, is what this is. And it looks like the old Inquisitor Karamazov or something was his name.

SPEAKER_06 48:10

Yeah, that's right. Because what was interesting is in the latest um what was it called? Well have I got it here? No, I don't think I do. The latest book that had Huron in for the Huron Black Hawk campaign, and as we you know, Richie, because we talked about it, the Imperial Knights do not get customizable characters in the sort of special rules expansion pack that they've done for it. But one of the ones that you could do for uh Imperial agents is you could turn an Inquisitor, effectively an Inquisitor, into a Walker model, noting that there was literally no way to convert one up because the mod old Inquisitor Mini doesn't exist anymore. But I guess you've now got this as a potential way of doing it. But it was interesting that they gave us rules to eventually recreate uh charac cameras of, I think it is. Um no way of actually sculpting the the the mini that they've given us rules for until now, I guess. Um, which is very cool. But what's your take on the mincher as a whole?

SPEAKER_00 49:13

I think it's awesome. I think it's really cool. It's it's a nice addition to the Sisters of Battle Range, and that here is a because previously the only like larger character has been um I can't remember her name, but she was specific. Fruzane Fruse No, I forget her name, but she's she's I can it's like a special character specific to one of the things. Yeah, on the podium. Yeah, podium, yeah. Yeah, it's on like a like a yeah, uh like a uh yeah, the podium lecton type thing. Um, which was a cool mini, but I remember I remember having I don't know if I might I might have that mini, I've never built it. But it you could you could only use her with that particular faction.

SPEAKER_06 49:54

Yes, for order, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 49:55

That order for her. Whereas well, this it look it looks really cool. I love that it's got what appears to be uh uh two heavy bolters and two heavy flamers, or some kind of it was like half a flamer, maybe it's two flamers and two and two heavy bolters. I don't know. I don't know if that's customizable to have melters on there instead. Uh I think it's gonna be like a nice cool like hero mini to have in the sisters range. Because yeah, it looks it looks really cool.

SPEAKER_06 50:21

I think it's pretty good. It looks like it, I guess it's two standard flamers, because the heavy flamers tend to look like that, but they're like double. So maybe they're two regular flamers rather than heavy flamers, but yeah, I'm not sure. Or it's a combi, maybe it's a combi heavy bolter flamer thing. Doesn't seem to say. Uh Tim, what's your take on it?

SPEAKER_08 50:41

Yeah, I I I think it's super cool. It's a nice as you you guys were just saying earlier, it's a nice alternative to like Juniph, the lady on the the flying Plimph East.

SPEAKER_04 50:54

Spoilers I googled.

SPEAKER_08 51:00

And so it'll be really interesting to see her painted up in the different uh colours of the other orders and how well th the model will carry across then. But yeah, uh it'll be super cool to see on the on the tabletop for sure.

SPEAKER_06 51:16

Yeah, and I always love a a good cherub as well, so that's great to see. I I have to say I don't think the helmeted version is maybe as cool as the unhelmeted one, but yeah, I d I like everything else. I like the weapon sponsons and how they've sort of yeah, the the arch mo motif across the whole model looks very cool.

SPEAKER_08 51:35

Um part of me wants a stand-in version. As in the the She's stood up or something, yeah.

SPEAKER_06 51:42

I mean potentially you could just do that with a different model and you just combine the two so you don't fit the seated mini in, and then you could have someone standing on the podium, like giving a lecture or something. And I guess potentially if you're an Inquisitor fan, that's how you could go about converting this up, potentially. Yeah. Because I think walkers in general, so obviously you've got the paragon morse suits, but you've also got the uh Penitent engine, for example, and the other variant of the Penitent Engine that I did. Uh I'm saying Multifactor, but I can't remember.

SPEAKER_08 52:18

With a little bit of work, you could actually make your own Inquisitor, say like with this kit as well. And you could take the sorry, like the kit of the old school, and you could probably take the new Ministorian priest that's in the Adapter Satoritus range.

SPEAKER_06 52:33

Yeah, and there's um yeah, quite a few options that you could probably use for this. Yeah, I guess in a way it's sort of lacking the sort of servitor bodies that you used to have in the old Inquisitor, but I I mean I don't mind it just being generic sponsors on this one. It kind of makes it a bit more clean-cut and more suitable. Maybe less grimdark, but more suitable for the sisters range, I think. Uh yeah, so moving on to the Centaur RSV, uh, which is the newest Astro Militarum vehicle, other than the one that we'd just seen, but clearly based on the same chassis. It is a yeah, stretched version of a Torox. It's open-topped. It is based on the, I think it's called Sodkifus 250, if you were a German in World War II, but there's also the I think it's the M and M if you're Americans, which this also does look like, especially the uh front half, which was the American half-track, and the American effectively Puma equivalent, which is the other variation that we've got here. In my book, I'm calling it now, this is going to replace the Chimera down the line. They're not they haven't said it, but why would you have these two things when they're very similar? And again, as I was teasing Tim earlier, historically, the vehicle this is based on has loads of modular options where it has loads of extra things that you can attach to the back. And it feels like this, if you didn't have the crew in place, you could stick extra things on and easily make it modular to represent lots of different things. Um, and it feels like the direction that they're pushing the guard range in is a re-primaricified um in terms of they're just redoing everything, but it giving us older new kits alongside each other, and then eventually most people will predominantly have these because these are the new cooler kits and probably have better rules, and things like dare I save Lehman Russ, I keep saying it, and the Chimera will one day disappear because visually this has a lot of elements that marry it to the the new Sentinel design and the Rogaldorn as well, as well as the the the Torx and the other Torx variant. But yeah, yeah, I'm not sure how I feel about it. It kind of looks good, but I'm not I don't know, I'm not wowed by it. It feels almost like they're trying to uh get some bolt action players into Warhammer because that the the the references are very unbeknowns with what it's coming from.

SPEAKER_08 55:05

I feel like the inevitable of the Chimera Garan will probably happen because otherwise how are they gonna get you to buy more models for the same army that you collect if they don't just push stuff to legends and then have something to replace it?

SPEAKER_06 55:18

They do sometimes, and they've they did it with at some of the Tyranids, but not necessarily all of them, where they give you a near-identical thing to the replace thing it was meant to replace, but they gave it a new name and a new data sheet, so you could still have those old kits. Uh, and then sometimes Games Workshop could you may turn me into a liar by re also redoing those old kits as well, but not always. Um, and it feels like this one uh I mean maybe that they are gonna keep chimeras, and this is a lighter version of a chimera, and that the chimera will just get a redone kit. But the the general direction tends to be a new kit of something, yeah, a new kit, something new that's very similar to an old kit, and then they make you buy this kit, and then eventually they will be like, Well, we can kind of safely replace the old kit because we've also made you buy these new kits as well. So rather than if they just released a new Chimera kit, most people will be like, Well, I already own a Chimera, so I I don't need to buy it. Whereas this forces your hand to an extent to uh buy a new kit. Now, that's me being very cynical in terms of uh maybe the reasons behind it. Um maybe there are other reasons, maybe they just want to, you know, change the direction. I feel like with Cadians especially, they're leaning more into sort of slightly more modern American style vehicles and designs. Um in a way that's almost the downside because yeah, I sort of liked, you know, nothing the Chimera and Lehman Rust did look like other vehicles, but not necessarily as obvious as this does. It still felt very 40k, whereas this doesn't really feel particularly 40k, but it does look like a Torox, um, which in my opinion was when that came out was one of the worst vehicles ever. So I don't in a way it's I don't whose mad idea was to try and build upon that, but buying it by making it. But then potentially they could do away with the Torox and be like, oh, this is the new new standard now. Um we're gonna do away with the Torox kit as well. Um and they've killed two birds with one stone by getting rid of the Torox and Vicarmia, potentially.

SPEAKER_08 57:33

They could do. It's it it's gonna be interesting to see how the if this model does have any furthermore like adaptations. I I agree with you. I think it will. Like it's you can already see where you've got guys popping out of the back there at the hatch where that could just simply be replaced with like a leverage. It feels like they could have a lids. Yeah, or a mortar or a mortar, you know. Yeah, it's it's very reminiscent. Yeah, it's very reminiscent of the current uh warfare um like armoured vehicle warfare stuff like the striker, they can be converted into like various different use cases. Some just have rocket launchers, one's a mortar, one's an APC, one's a command variant. That's like very common across like um mechanized warfare at the moment, is to have like one base and then it kind of like has like these add-ons that you can interchange.

SPEAKER_06 58:23

Yeah, that makes sense. Uh so it would be interesting to see if they that they do that. Richard, what's your um take on this kit?

SPEAKER_00 58:31

I think this is in line with what we saw with the local Dawn, in that it's trying to appeal in the the aesthetic they're going for with with Astro Modern vehicles now is feels very much more like a military like a modern military fan or historical military fan of the real world, but I think it's slightly s slightly sci-fi version of a real world historical tank type because it looked similar to the Rogel Dawn, didn't look like any of the existing tanks in the Astra Militar and Range. It felt it had its own kind of new style and vibe to it.

SPEAKER_06 59:10

Yeah, it was a very sort of Sherman inspired, I think. And then when we get onto the hippogriff, there's elements of a Rogel Dawn in terms of a turret design in that as well.

SPEAKER_00 59:20

It it feels their style of vehicle is changing for like who they're targeting at with the designs, yeah. Which might be like more like a more military enthusiast rather than something like some because I think the Torox was an attempt to make the K the old Astral Militar and 40k version of something like this. Whereas what this is is saying is them saying, let's just make a half-track. Yeah. Because military infusions would be really into that. And if you'd like if you're like a fan of like minimal uh just like 20th century military history stuff, this is kind of that, but with a slightly sci-fi vibe, like the 40k kind of vibe from the astral.

SPEAKER_06 59:57

Yeah, cuz the the old Torox had people doing conversion kits where you replace those front tracks with wheels to make it a proper half-track, and it feels like they've just gone, cool, let's just embrace that because it was a popular design. It and it does look arguably better, even though it makes it look l a little less 40k because the sort of the half-tracks with front tracks as well as rear tracks feels more 40k to an extent that just didn't really work visually, I don't think, on the Torox, whereas here, uh yeah, as you say, it's just leaning in more to the obvious but works. I still don't necessarily think yeah, I don't necessarily like it because it's so um stylistically different from the existing guard range, and I need to almost divorce that mentality for myself to appreciate that this is a cool kit in its own right, it just doesn't really fit in with how I want and how my army actually currently looks. Because you you you've got lots of you've got the super heavy, you've got lots of Lehman Russes, yeah, and I've got chimeras and chimeras and stuff like that. I'm very much an old school guard collector, but I think if I was to, and it's you know, when the new Cadians came out, I did buy the box set but with the you know the field ordnance batteries and stuff like that, and I was originally going to convert them up into my Krieg. But I was always thinking maybe I'll just do a brand new regiment and I'll lean into the new kits, and I think with these, if I was to do something like Praetorians or something, that would almost be a great way of going, cool, this is modern guard now, it's not the old kits, I can completely separate the two. Would I want to do something like Praetorians because maybe one day they'll do them, but then chances are they probably won't. So I could, yeah, maybe I just need to lean into that Acadian aesthetic.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:44

Um I think this this is like when we saw all the Primaris vehicles being hover.

SPEAKER_03 1:01:50

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 1:01:51

With within this is the new direction. This yeah, this is the visual, this is the aesthetic style they're going with. It's still it feels a little different to me. To me, it feels a little bit different, it's not the classic kind of Imperial Guard or Astrum. I mean that's how long I've been playing. I saw them when they were called the Imperial Guard. But it's it's a different style, it's not like the light Lehman Ross, it's not like the Chimeras and the Hellhounds, but it is it is definitely in line with the new visual style and aesthetic they're going for. I don't know, it doesn't I I it's gonna take a while for me to go on me. This is better than the Torux, because the Torux just looks silly. Whereas this if if anything, I have negative feelings towards this because of the Torx, which looks silly, which looks so silly. Yeah, whereas if this came out first, I might have before the Torux, I might have thought this was better. But yeah, it's it's an it's an interesting design. It's it's not it's going for a different aesthetic. I think it does it it it looks different and it map but it does match when when we see the the box they've got, they've got like a new box which has got basically all of the new style vehicles, it fits the it fits the vibe. But if you just see this out on its own and you're thinking about the historical Astro Motor vehicles, it does look a bit a little bit odd.

SPEAKER_06 1:03:02

Yeah, but I think if you were to let's say you've got Scions as well, because they want it, let's assume they're keeping those kits, then visually these still fit in more with them than they do with Lehman Russ's and Chimera's, for example, which is maybe good and bad depending on how much you like the Torox. But let's move on to the one that looks a little bit more like the Torox, the Hippogriff AFV, which has got the turret sort of element of the Torox, a turret that also looks similar to a mini Rogaldorn turret. Uh, and then it's got three um wheels on each side, so a six-wheeled mini uh scout vehicle looks a bit like the Puma from uh World War II if you're a German player. I think it was something like a Saladin or yeah, Saladin tank um for the British Army. Uh they had a very similar looking vehicle. I think even the Americans. The Saracen, yeah. Every army effectively has a little six-wheeler, so it's you know not a unique design. Models and minis, which is no more, sadly. They also did a conversion kit for the Chimera, which had this as well to make six-wheelers. The front bit, which actually looks like a frog, if you look at the lenses and the front bit. The curved front plate is similar to the Regul Dawn and the Sentinel tank, because that was a stylistic element that was uh shared between them. I mean the absolutely huge um periscope lenses on this uh vehicle on the whole, uh pretty massive. Um I think to me the turret is a little bit too big. I would have liked it to have been a bit more smaller. But I think the it wasn't called the hippogriff, it was called the Centaur ATV, was an old kit bash, very similar to this, where it was like a wheeled uh, I think you took like the Lehman Russ and inverted the hull or something back to front, and you gave it wheels and a turret. Um, and that was like from Citadel Journal, I believe, which is where a lot of people got these kind of kit bash ideas. So it is harking back to old Games Workshop um kits, even though they weren't official ones, but it obviously is referencing you know World War II and onwards style vehicles as well. Um Richie, what's your take on uh this one?

SPEAKER_00 1:05:11

Uh again, everything I said around the previous vehicle, it's got there is a very clear, like visual design they're going for, which is like the 20th century um military vehicles. What's odd about if you scroll down if if for those on the video for watching this the this the turrets look better when the gun isn't so big.

SPEAKER_06 1:05:27

Yes, yeah, I think so.

SPEAKER_00 1:05:28

Or at least the way they've photographed it. Because when you look at it above, the battle cannon doesn't that look that big. But when you if you scroll back up to the the It looks really long on the top picture. Weird and the maybe just the way it's been photographed, it just looks the the whole turret just looks too big. Yeah. With that gun. And but that might just be from that angle. Because when you look at it from above here, it looks fine. And it's called a di the difference. I think this is it completely matches this. So I think it's a cool I think size wise to me, it feels like it's just it's very slightly bigger than. Than the the which was by the Elysian drop troops and is in Necromunda now. I think it's it looks like it's slightly a very slightly bigger version of that because when you see how big like the guy is, this is not a big vehicle at all. This is like a really dinky little car thing. So you I expect you to see I would expect this to come in a box of at least two.

SPEAKER_06 1:06:20

Yeah, well you see lots of these running around. That has more of them uh is in like the the Battle Force box has two of them in it. So maybe you're right, maybe they come in sets of two, which would actually be quite cool. It feels like uh sort of utility-wise on the tabletop was very similar to the old Krieg Centaur, which was like a light personnel carry carrier um and had some small arms to it, whereas this is highly mobile but got more of a weapons platform, so it's slightly different, but visually a very small vehicle. So um part of me is thinking, oh, could I convert those up to represent this if I wanted it to look more like my old Krieg aesthetics? But probably not. I think I just have to embrace these if I was going down this route. But yeah, there's a sort of three no four main sort of guns. You've got the mini battle cannon, you got a Punisher cannon, you got a Laz cannon, and you got a Melter cannon, and then sort of side um coaxle options, you've got stubber and melter as well, um, which is quite cool. And the stubber variant looks yeah, very old school style World War machine guns.

SPEAKER_00 1:07:28

So I I definitely think with this, if you're an Astro Matarium player, you're gonna be able to have a fully mechanised army now. Because you've got big you've got big tanks, lit now you've got little tanks.

SPEAKER_06 1:07:39

This is like a little armager, basically, isn't it?

SPEAKER_00 1:07:42

You've got your artillery. What what's interesting is will they replace because if we if on a long enough timeline the chimera is going to be replaced uh and might be phased out over time, what's gonna happen to the Griffin, the is it Griffin? Yeah, the Griffin, the the basilisk, a hell of a version everything else that uses that Chimera chassis as a baseline. I think we I would be expecting to see some kind of weapon platform variant of the not Torex vehicle as well for like artillery from like an artillery perspective or something, because this is this feels like the the the nippy driving around. When you look at it, it's it's it's got one gun and the car actually, it's got like a Laz cannon or a melter gun or an anti-mill game. So you you have lots of these little lots of these probably in squadrons.

SPEAKER_06 1:08:34

Like this is this is a bit like a sentinel in a way, but first I was gonna say that it feels like a replacement for a sentinel. It almost surprises me that they've given us this because there's a field role with the existing army. They they do very similar things, a mobile but very small weapon platform with only a couple of guns that can nip around the tabletop. So this is like a tracked version of a centaur. So it's a bit odd that they almost redid the sentinel first and then they've given us this. Like if they had sort of phased out the sentinel and this was its replacement, that would feel more in line with what would make sense. But to, you know, I imagine this and the sentinel are going to be competing in the same space. But maybe if you are just a tank head and you just want tanks, you would take this over the sentinel because yeah, sentinel's sort of a tank, but it's you know not uh it's it's got legs, so maybe purists out there just want, you know, treads, the tread heads out there. Maybe that's what they want.

SPEAKER_00 1:09:33

So they didn't have sentinels in World War II.

SPEAKER_06 1:09:35

No, they did not. So yeah, it feels like it's definitely leaning much more into that aesthetic.

SPEAKER_08 1:09:41

I would say like they probably won't get rid of the sentinels because it's a smaller footprint on the board and they're new as we go down, and obviously we've already mentioned this as well, like there's the box set uh which comes with all these videos.

SPEAKER_06 1:09:54

Or we can skip to like and then we will go back to um the Armageddon book. So yeah, the battle call. Because I was gonna go on.

SPEAKER_08 1:10:03

No, no, go on, Tim. I was gonna say, like, the one thing I've noticed in this is that there's no Lehman Russ.

SPEAKER_06 1:10:09

No, because it's old. But I've been inclined to think that the Rogaldorn's been the Lehman Russ replacement for a long time. Yeah. What's interesting is you the Lehman Russ does fill a gap between these two because you can really see the size difference between like the hippogriff and the Rogaldorn, like there's a massive size difference. So a Lehman Ross does fit bang in between that as a um middle ground option, much like how we've got the nightstreer um as the new middle night between the standard like chassis and the new art and the armages. It feels like the Lehman Ross still has a visual place in terms of size. Maybe they're just gonna redesign it, right? And it's just gonna look like a small version of a regal dawn, but aesthetically it's got to fit now into this visual design language, and that's what they're gonna do. So it's not necessarily the end of the world if that is the case. But I could also see a world where they go, Well, we've got these two new kits now, you don't need the Lehman Rust, no matter how iconic it is. Or Games Workshop's gonna do a classic backtrack and they'll go, Yeah, cool, we're gonna phase it out, and then people complain and they will change their mind and then they'll give us uh a new version, potentially. I mean, who knows? I mean, this feels like a quite a cool box set because you get some Cajun in it, you get the half-track, you get two of the little uh hippogriffs, which as Richie point out, l speculatively makes you go, maybe you get two in a box, like the drop pods, which you know I'm kind of cool. I think that's maybe a good idea. Um, yeah, because I guess they're not troop transports in any way, but there have been many troop transports in the game where you can only uh you know transport five men in each vehicle, so you've got to split your squad with uh was it uh uh Adeptus Mechanicus and the Votan vehicles, they will do that. This feels like it's a bit more than a lot of people. There's no way they're no way that's a troop transport.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:09

They don't look big enough. No way. The Vogel Dawn doesn't transport troops, there's no way that does.

SPEAKER_08 1:12:14

I mean, like if you're going off the aesthetics of like World War II and stuff, they could be converted into troop transports, and in fact, they were like the old Saracens and stuff. And I'm just gonna say I do like them, and I want to see them go OTT with it though. I want them I want to see one with like an earth shaker cannon just bolted on the back just to like have a real high mobile howitzer just running around.

SPEAKER_06 1:12:41

I could almost see them doing that more with the half-track um rather than the little hippogriffs. Um probably would be make sense for the half-track. But kind of a cool uh box set for sure.

SPEAKER_00 1:12:54

I'd I don't know, I think it'd be cool to see that. I don't know if we would because they they've they've got the they've got lots of like artillery options now. There's the lot there's like this the heavy weapon squad with a bunch of different like little mortars, if I remember.

SPEAKER_06 1:13:04

Plus you've got the really big battery and the Krieg stuff.

SPEAKER_00 1:13:08

And the ones with loads of sandbags on it. They've got they've there's options for the artillery there. And no, I've I've not mobile artillery, like the basilisk. I mean I'm just looking at this and I've I'm I would be inclined to if I if if I had the time and the and the money and the s well I have the time. If I had the money and the and like the intent, I wouldn't mind getting just an army of the little of like logo dorns and the little uh I've griff tanks. Because it looks cool.

SPEAKER_06 1:13:35

No, they do. I I think they do look quite cool. I think especially with the um like Steel Legion coming out in a couple of years' time, that would be a good kind of little combo. It feels like if someone was really on the fence about doing a tank army in bolt action, it's like, well, I can just scratch that itch with this now. I don't need to bother with bolt action. Uh it feels like that's someone's gone, let's try and steal even more market share from bolt action, not that we need to, but we're just gonna tick that box for people that that like though that kind of aesthetic. Um let's um quickly go up and do the Armageddon campaign, which is called Armageddon, and the return of Yarrick War Without End. Surprise, surprise. Yeah, it feels like it's got uh less books though. Uh I feel like the others had four rather than three, but it's obviously got the return of Yarrick, uh the armored gauntlet, which is tank warfare, which again is a cool concept. Um, and then uh detachments, which is going to be detachment rules. Tank warfare is uh yeah, a great idea.

SPEAKER_00 1:14:41

I've I mean I I've got there is normally four free book like free that the detachments isn't isn't usually a book, that's just like a pamphlet.

SPEAKER_06 1:14:49

Yes, a pamphlet, yeah. And there's normally a campaign system plus some other things. So uh the last one with Huron, uh there was a uh there was a campaign system, but there was also Build Your Own Characters, and then in the Titus one, it was an entire campaign, but then it had a load of uh boarding actions uh stuff as well, in addition to the law book and the detachments. I can't remember what's in the Eye of Terror one because that's not out yet, but that was Yeah, I can't remember. I assume that had a campaign in it as well. Um and another oh, and that had multiplayer, wasn't it? It wasn't quite multiplayer roles. Um wasn't quite Armageddon uh Armageddon, apocalypse level games, but it was multiplayer games. So yeah, they've all got a mode of play which is good. Um my one worry was that come the new edition, all these books are going to be worthless and these modes of play will be lost. Um, but it's good that they've clarified when we get to the Lemped section that all of these books are still valid and you can still play with them, which is great. Part of me wishes that they've given us so much choice now at the very end of an edition. It's like, could you not have given us one of these books per year? So we could have spent more time playing these campaigns. Instead, we've got four different campaigns effectively to try and play uh over the next. I mean, technically we can play all over the next edition, but uh currently the buzz is to play these, and it's like we're currently doing the 500 Worlds campaign, so we we haven't even had a chance to look at the other campaign systems, let alone this one that's coming out, and um you know, spike you would do 500 worlds mentioned, oh, this would be a great um one to do as well. So yeah, they they if they space these out, I think people would appreciate the the game mechanics more. But I guess people are just going to pick their favourite one and and focus on that for the next you know, foreseeable future.

SPEAKER_00 1:16:52

I do feel a little rushed because we started the 500 World campaign pretty soon after it was released. Yeah. And we we're trying to play it quite regularly, but we will nowhere near finish that campaign before all the rest of these have been released by the looks of it. Yeah. For sure.

SPEAKER_06 1:17:09

I think we're not playing it at the fastest pace, but we are doing, I think, one phase per month, which is the slow pace, not the fast pace, because I think one phase per week is the fast pace we're playing. So it should take us four months to play. We're in month two at the moment. Are we month two or month three? No, we're we're going into month three, I think, because we've done two lots so far. So yeah, in theory, we've got another month to go, but I think this will be out by then, I suspect. And um yeah, so maybe we could get another system in before 11th edition crops up. And then even though these are still valid, everyone's going to be focused on just playing 11th edition as a base game, and that these will, you know, dwindle by the wayside for a little bit until maybe the main game gets a bit boring, and then people will maybe hopefully go back to look at these. But yeah, I mean it looks interesting. The law behind Yarek coming back will be interesting. I 100% think it's a retcon and a boo-boo from Games Workshop that they are just going back on because they did give him an obituary in the ninth edition book. Um, Games Workshop can have it have its cake and eat it by saying, Oh, well, it was an unreliable narrator. Oh, they didn't know he was lost, or maybe he does die and they've because they've mentioned there's something to do with space wolves. So potentially he did die, but he's been resurrected by you know Space Wolf Magic on Federus or something, who knows? But it feels like they had intentionally killed him off, gave him a replacement uh character. Uh community backlash has meant they've brought him back alive. As a hill I will die on to my to my grave. Yeah, are you guys excited for this book? Would you would either of you buy it at all?

SPEAKER_08 1:18:44

Oh, if I had more time, I I would buy it, but unfortunately, my time's already split between so many different factions and hobbies and game systems that yeah, trying to fit this in is just nigh impossible these days.

SPEAKER_06 1:18:57

I was going to point out that they it's the old Orc War bikes on the cover, and they're not new or anything, but they've got the new Imperial Guard tanks and yeah, so that would potentially make sense if those bikes are either coming out in the Lymph Ed box sets. This predates that, so they can have those new minis even if they were in that box set, and it's not to say they necessarily are, but it might be that they will come out at some point, but they can't feature in any artwork until they're out. Mainly. And they have done that. I think they did it with some of the I want to say it was like the last Armageddon book had some old stuff in, but then new kits came out shortly afterwards. But I can't necessarily remember for sure if that was the case. But there have been previous examples where they do that, where they yeah, they're showcasing old stuff even though newer stuff is just round the corner. But due to the timing, they don't feature basically.

SPEAKER_08 1:19:56

Uh I'm just forever hopeful that they kind of put like sneaky little Easter eggs on covers and stuff to be like, here it is.

SPEAKER_06 1:20:04

I wish they did that a bit more. Yeah, they don't I think they're sort of two on it, I think, in that regard. Yeah. I'm Rich Richard.

SPEAKER_00 1:20:14

I'm curious what actually this is or if this is all of it, because everything else has had every I should I I haven't checked on the I of Terror one, but at least for the first two um of these type of releases, you had three books and a detachment guide in there. This is one book and a detachment guide. That's it. Yeah. And this image makes it look like it's three books, but it's not. The foot the thing on the far left is the slipcase, and then there's the campaign book as well as the book.

SPEAKER_06 1:20:43

No, no, this is return of Yarrick. That's well, it's the slipcase artwork, but it's also the book. Because if you look at here, there's a spine.

SPEAKER_03 1:20:51

Right. And then this is the slipcase.

SPEAKER_06 1:20:53

So if you see here the slipcase plus three books, and it says Yarrick there, CK, and it's the same artwork.

SPEAKER_00 1:20:59

But the description says that it's one book and a d and a and a booklet. That's why I'm that's what I was curious. Okay, oh wait, so okay, no, you're right. In that picture there is there is another book. Okay.

SPEAKER_06 1:21:14

Uh yeah, it's split into three books containing a decorative slip case, all new rules, background law in one convenient package. Uh so it's maybe it's poorly worded. Yeah, the main book covers a story.

SPEAKER_00 1:21:26

Because yeah, because the others have all had they've had like a storybook, which has got they've had a storybook, a campaign book, and the new rules book. Of some kind. And then the booklet of the detachments.

SPEAKER_06 1:21:37

So maybe this is this is a way to play plus a campaign or rolled into one, because it's like armored warfare, so maybe that is both a campaign and tank warfare rules. But you're right. So maybe they've got so much lore to explain how Yarrick's come back from the dead. So that's got to be extra thick.

SPEAKER_00 1:21:59

Maybe. Because Yeah, because it it 'cause isn't it it's interesting on the description he talks about three books when the book it's that it looks more like potentially two books. It's yeah, it's unclear what's actually in what's fully in the box. There may be reasons they can't talk about they haven't revealed everything just yet that's gonna be in there. But I could be interested in it because I like I I like the idea of the armored gauntlet side of things. I like orcs and I like the idea of having like a tank army. And it seems like it does give infant like rules for running tank tank armies. But I suppose if this is the last one, is this gonna how what what's the distance between this and 11th? How what will I be able to even how much of this will I be able to use? They've implied that lots of this stuff can still be used in 11th. But how how how that actually overlaps and stuff is interesting. I don't know. I'm uh it depends what's what's in, I guess, and how much it's gonna cost. But I'm kind of I'm kind of intrigued by some of the rules, especially like the mechanized attachments.

SPEAKER_06 1:22:56

Yeah, that'd be cool. Yeah, it'd be interesting to see if it's a way of having tank armies or if it's a specific mode of play where it's like, yeah, we're right we're we're doing tank warfare, so it's not like you can be like, I'm gonna use these rules to supplement my Astro Militarum army when I take a tank list. It feels like this is no, this is tanks versus tanks only, and there's nothing else, and it's got a whole bunch of extra rules to to cover that kind of game mode in the same way that boarding actions is a game mode. So yeah, that'd be interesting to see basically how they're gonna do it. Um so yeah, we can skip past that uh bat box, but there's a couple more that we can kind of talk about very quickly. Uh, there's a Sisters of Battle one with a bunch of Repencia, some of those paragon warsuits, the Novitiates, I want to say they're called, the younglings of the sisters, uh, and then a couple of characters, all old models but quite cool. Then you've got the Death Watch, which is basically a much smaller version of the Imperial Agents box that I bought a few years ago because it was the uh the fighter transport, the flyer plus the old Deathwatch, and now this is the new Deathwatch plus the flyer, uh, which is kind of cool, and the flyer still works, um, looks really awesome. Then we've got the orc buggies plus uh the deathcopters, and they said specifically that this will plug and play pretty much as an expansion to go alongside your um new War Boss on bike, which is cool. Does this one tempt you at all, Richie? Or maybe the sisters one out of the three uh for you to get?

SPEAKER_00 1:24:35

If anyone was gonna tempt me, it's the sisters one. Yeah, well I've already got I I'm I the the the trike I've not I'm not I'm not a fan of the trike one. And if I was gonna get some more sisters I mean it uh to be fair, I've I've got I think I've got all those models anyway. But if I it's got if I was going to build a a a new like a new army, I think this is a this is a cool centrepiece set with this because then you because it gives you the rip entry, it gives you the uh novitiate squad, which I think you can buy they're like a kill team, they originally came out and killed them. Yeah, like the kill team, yeah. Plus you get the w some of the war suits. So this is I think this is a nice you get like a nice army or like a nice set of units with this. The def yeah, isn't it's like it feels like a nice force that you're getting here. The def watch one just feels a little sparse, but that could just be because it's like here's a squad and it's a plane.

SPEAKER_06 1:25:29

But this is a perfect add-on for any Imperium player because it's Imperial agents and it's like it thematically looks great. So it's like oh I've got space marines, but you could have this as well. You've got guard or sisters or knights, but you can take this in your army. This is uh, you know, the what was it, the regiments of renowned for 40k from AOS equivalent. Anyone can take this as long as you're an Imperium player, so that's probably worth bearing in mind. And I think some people will go for it. Um I won't because I've got the flower already, even though I don't have the new sculpt, so I've got the old uh Death Watch. But yeah, so some of those new Death Watch minis look really great, and then some of them don't really look particularly good. Uh so I'm still on the fence with those ones. But the flower I do think is awesome.

SPEAKER_00 1:26:12

Um it's a yeah, I I don't the the yeah, the orc box I don't that is I don't really like that cut selection minis. The squid buggy's okay. Um I've already got a squid buggy, but I don't think it it it it doesn't hold together like the other two do for me. It's like here's some it's like here's some deathcopters, yeah. It feels here's a trike, here's a bug.

SPEAKER_06 1:26:30

I think it would work with the the war boss, but then it feels like you've got a decent amount as a force, but I think the sisters one's the most substantial uh out of a lot. Yeah, Tim, do you have a preference for which one you like? Not that you would necessarily want to buy them. Uh I would actually go for the guard one out of all of these. If we got that one, yes, the guard one. If we're including that, yeah, I mean obviously. Yeah. Okay, cool. Because I think it's a nice little starter set. Oh, I mean, it feels much more substantial than the others as well in terms of what you're getting.

SPEAKER_08 1:27:02

Yeah, but it's guard, so it'll probably only come to like 400 points.

SPEAKER_06 1:27:06

Is there anything else? I think we're actually at the end. No, yeah. Well, so we're at the end of that section, uh, and then we will go on to the next bit of 40k uh reveals, and I will do a transitional noise the first time in front of everyone, so please don't laugh. A transitional noise. Uh okay, so next up in the 40k part of the Adepticon previews is the Red Terror and Elite versions of Cajun's in a kill team expansion, and we're talking about it because obviously it's still 40k related. So it's the Terror on Devlan. Devlan. Um, yeah, so it looks cool. You get a big tyranid, quribbly monster and a kind of quite cool looking uh kill team of Acadians, but the red terror itself looks absolutely Huge. Quite similar, I think, in terms of the new Necrom model that we've had on that kind of large size, uh probably 60 to 70 mil base. Maybe it's even bigger. This guy though, god, he doesn't even fit on the screen. But hopefully you can see it if you're watching along. Um has very like Forge World aesthetics, I would say, in terms of the um the face and virtuous uh parts of him. Yeah, he looks um looks pretty interesting. Uh Richie, what's your take on this uh tyranid monstrosity?

SPEAKER_00 1:28:30

It's really cool. It's a basically a special character version of not the Trigon, the other one, isn't it? Morloc. That's it. So basically, yeah, so it's like a special character Morlock. And it looked it looks so cool. I was gonna say it looks so cool because it looks like an AOS mini in the nicest possible way. This is like a really cool and dynamic model that's not just because all the previously these minis have they've just been tall whenever they've done these. This when they've done that the the Morlocks and the Trigons in the past, I've seen them, they've always just been like tall, like it's coming out of the ground. Uh whereas with this is like it's kind of like a snake coiling around, but it's not as high, it just looks really cool. It's an it's a really cool model.

SPEAKER_08 1:29:10

Yeah. What's your take, Tim? So when they redid the Tyranids, I wasn't actually a fan of the way they were going with the ascetic direction. But this this is a great reimagination, a reinvention of the the old Red Terror.

SPEAKER_06 1:29:28

Yeah, because was that in Fine Cast?

SPEAKER_08 1:29:30

I hope it's kind of bigger.

SPEAKER_06 1:29:31

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 1:29:32

Yeah, it was. I hope I hope this is bigger than the original Red Terror as well, which I think it does look like. So I think your prediction of it being on a 60 mil is pretty cool. But yeah, it's it's a great looking model. And I hope the rules do it justice as well.

SPEAKER_06 1:29:47

Yeah, I think so. It'd be interesting to see what it's got. I assume it's gonna have deep strike. It would be cool if it uh has an ability to pop up near people and uh attack them. Yeah, its head is very big, uh, but it's got a quite a small body, but I guess that's very indicative of it being, you know, a bit snake-esque. And the scenery looks very cool in terms of like the the statue. It actually looks if you see here with the boots, it looks a bit like the old Creed mini to an extent with the jacket and stuff. Who knows if it's actually meant to be him or just someone else? But yeah, I mean it's a cool model, yeah. I do like it, and it'll be interesting to see how people paint it up and stuff like that. And then we've got Spectre Squad Kill Team, which is very reminiscent of the Vivotan minis I hate because it's uh well they're scouts, so how do we make them look like scouts? I know, we give them jackets, but to be fair, these guys look a lot cooler. So you've got a veteran sergeant with a flat cap and a bionic arm, you've got a plasma gunner. That's what we've got, we've got a cool sniper mini, and we've got a heavy weapons guy with uh a stubber and a very cool eye patch uh and Tash. I like his model. Uh we've got a grenadier guy, a medic, uh and then we I've got we've got loads of people. Uh the missile launcher I particularly like because it's like a really old school style uh missile tube, nice and simple. Uh, and then a guy reloading, and they're on two separate bases, which is quite unusual for the heavy weapon teams, um, or at least for sizes that we've got uh for them. A Vox operator and a mini vox reload with uh which looks cool, but the servo skull's sort of ruining the aesthetics, even though it's kind of a bit gothic. Uh, and then we've got a guide and a trooper. Uh there's one more. No, we're back to the beginning. Uh so yeah, we've got quite a mix of characters. Uh Tim, what's your thoughts on these Cadians?

SPEAKER_08 1:31:52

I agree with you. It does suffer from the problem of like, oh, let's throw a cape on it, and now they're scouts. But they're super cool. They are super cool, and I disagree. I think the relay beacon is the best miniature out of all of them.

SPEAKER_06 1:32:05

It's like the equivalent of having a little perfect mini with all the kill teams, um, and they've uh given it. I because I think it would almost just look better without the sevo skull in there, to be honest, and they just lean into that more utilitarian look rather than the gothic elements of 40k. But I feel like they've got to to make it look 40k and not just, you know, modern military.

SPEAKER_08 1:32:30

I think I I'm quite curious as to like if kill team's going to be the way that we're going to see the other sort of Imperial Guard, sorry, Astra Militarum regiments, like the Mordian Guard, the Fosterans.

SPEAKER_06 1:32:42

So um except between recording this uh section and the last section, uh we realised we've got to talk about Still Legion because uh it was revealed in the reveal show uh or previewed in the reveal show, but not shown in any of the articles. And it was basically some concept sketches, which I literally think they smashed out in a week uh based on the backlash of loads of content creators complaining that there's no still legion. Um it's odd that they're kind of implying we're getting still legion before other stuff, because I think Cadians, or Cadians, sorry, Caschan have been in the running for a long time to get a redo because some of those sculpts still exist. Um this would have been actually a perfect example of doing catchan because it's kind of scouts exploratory, jungle-esque fighters, they're fighting tyrannids. It could have been a cat-chan force for Kill Team. Kill team is the perfect vehicle for introducing other regiments because that's how Krieg came about, and then it was obviously, I assume, a test bed to go, oh, it's popular enough, it's selling, let's do a full range. And I assume if Steel Legion comes out, it'll just be a kill team, and if it is successful, they'll do more minis for it. And I would like them to do all the regiments, it's sort of standard infantry squads. Personally, they should just make them all the same, so you don't need a separate data sheet for each and every one, they've all got the same wall gear and loadout, it would just make things a lot easier from a gaming perspective. Whereas the Krieg and the Catchan, sorry, Krieg, technically Catchan, but in terms of nuke it's Krieg and Cadians uh all have different like weapons and war gear and special weapons, which makes the rules for them all so much more complicated than it actually needs to be. Yeah. Richie, what's your take on this and also uh you know, future regiments and steel legion?

SPEAKER_00 1:34:35

On this particular um squad, I think they are one of the coolest units um in Astro Militarum, um, one of the coolest looking kill teams. The kill teams always have always been really cool. My favourite kill team was be was the commandos, because there's so much character into that squad. It's one it's probably one of the best units that's ever been made, I would say the commandos. And I get the same vibe from the from these guys. I think that they are really cool. It's like the the they do have the oh let's just put a cloak on it vibe, but there's so much character in the poses. I don't know, I don't know how much customization there'll be for those. Sure.

SPEAKER_06 1:35:08

But I reckon just going through what what you'll get is you'll get five other two weapon options and that's your customisation, you're picking which things you want.

SPEAKER_00 1:35:17

I mean, all I know is from what or when I've done previous kill team boxes, and there's usually a bit more customisation in them for what you can kind of give just outfit them as, but there there's such there's such a these are even as the even if you can't, and I I think you will be able to there's a lot of character in these models and how they're put together. It's like it feels like if you want to live out your Predator 1 squad team or any military unit of different characters and personalities going on a mission and with distinct with distinct character personalities, this this set has that, and I think it's I think it's a really cool set. They are they are guardsmen, so they all have really for potentially underwhelming rules, and if you ever use them in 40k, that's 40 points. But that as m as miniatures they look really cool. I think they all look great. There's lots of personality in them. I hope there's lots of customization options for them to be.

SPEAKER_06 1:36:09

For example, in kill team, normally the gunner option has different special uh weapons that it could run. So here it's got the plasma, but there'd probably be like a grenade launcher or melter gun variant uh that it can have. Maybe the sergeant will have a different weapon uh options, like a sort of sword and pistol option as well. Um uh and maybe some of the things.

SPEAKER_00 1:36:33

Because the sergeant looks like he's got a slightly different type of gun to the rest of the squad anyway. You've already mentioned the missile launcher. I think the missile launcher looks really cool.

SPEAKER_06 1:36:41

That's probably my favourite one with a heavy stubber guy. Um, dude out of Call of Duty.

SPEAKER_00 1:36:49

The medic's the medic looks cool as well. I wish that they had like you could see the reverse of the mod of these movies because I would I bet there's more, there's lots of cool little details and flourishes that uh built into these models.

SPEAKER_06 1:37:01

I can imagine that as well. Lots of backpacks and stuff. Yeah, the the missile launcher really reminds me of the old was it Cadian, or actually maybe the Catch and uh missile launcher team uh from the old metal uh minis that sort of really yeah, just a utilitarian tube. Um yeah, looks really good. Uh or maybe also the um uh the last chance is it last last chances, I think had a similar uh missile guy there.

SPEAKER_00 1:37:29

Um I think it might be in Lady. What's one thing that's interesting actually is the loader looks like he's got a mortar.

SPEAKER_06 1:37:35

Yes, but I assume that is the missile itself, and he's gonna load it in the back. Uh, because yeah, you can see the tube. It says heavy gunner. So you can see it it's all hidden behind the pistol, but it feels like there's a tail fin poking out, and it's not just a shell on its own.

SPEAKER_00 1:37:51

I'll be interested to see if you can build different versions of that, those two, because that looks more like to me, that looks more like a mortar than a missile, and for that, because it looks slightly too big for that model. But that's all I think these men's are great. On the topic of the different like the other the future of Astron Motarm regiments, my feeling is that Steel Legion is just Krieg with different helmets.

SPEAKER_06 1:38:16

That's I mean even when they when they should let the concept die, I was like, if it wasn't the fact it said Steel Legion in the corner of the image, I think it was just a slightly it was a variation of Krieg because they are both trench coat, they are they are like leather a slightly shorter trench coat with gas masks, and that's why they gave you a paint guide for here's how you can get Steel Legion in the game. You paint your you paint your Krieg as uh you know khaki colours, the trench coats instead of grey, um, which annoyed clearly a lot of Steel Legion fans, I think. Sort of understandably, because I think as a Steel Legion fan you would notice the difference uh between the two, but they are uh uh essentially very similar from a grand from a macro scale, uh very similar to Krieg.

SPEAKER_00 1:39:05

I d I don't want to offend Krieg and Steel Legion Bone players by saying that they're both the same, but compared to the Cadachan jungle fighters or the Valhalla or the Valhalla distinct looks. The Mordian Iron Guards, the Talan Desert Raiders, other fac there are other styles or themes or aesthetic weight like our military units within the Astro Military that have been historically in the range that are far different. And to add Steel Legion, which is which literally could just be a pallet swap of Krieg, I it feels like I'm curious as to why there's that's I mean I can understand what why um because we uh we talked about this in in a in a outtake that they that the steel legion were on Armageddon, so that would be a very like from a law perspective, they should they would there'd be expectation they would be there, but visually they're very similar to Krieg. I don't know that you're adding much to the range. My impression was that kind of like well everything's almost everything is uh seems to be referred to as Cadian, but Cadia doesn't exist anymore anyway. It's just everyone it yeah, it's like every it's like every every member of the Astromotarum is for Cadia, but you can paint them however you want. That's just that's that the the that style of armor they were in. It's meant to be generic standard Astro Modotarum. It's meant to be generic, but yet it's still referred to as Cadian. So even in this article, these guys are referred this unit is referred to as a Cadian unit. But and if that's the case, and I I I would I I don't think it makes sense in this day and age to have huge variety of ranges of of the Astro Modern, but having cool units in like kill teams would be cool, but I'd I'd sooner see I would I would be more inclined to see like what we had with like the Rough Riders, which were which had that Attila and Rough Rider vibe. I'd love to see units that have real character. I don't know.

SPEAKER_06 1:40:57

Do we have Attila and Rough Riders or we have Attila Rough Riders and Death Riders and Creek Creek Death Riders? So what's interesting is before you had um Attillon Rough Riders was the only one where it was like this is a unique unit styled in a regiment that doesn't have any other models, whereas everything else was it's generic infantry, and everything else was, you know, you would go from there, so you'd have a command squad uh based on that regiment and stuff. Attilans are the only ones where it's like, okay, here's a dedicated unit for a unique role themed in a regiment. So no matter what army you had, even if you had an Arcadian army, you still had to have Attilan Roughriders because you can get any other variant of it. And I sort of feel like that's kind of what they're doing now, where they've given us Krieg models, but they've made them all distinct from the Cadian models. So the heavy weapon teams aren't really the same, the artillery are isn't the same, even the standard infantry don't really marry up in terms of the weapon options that you can get and the rules that they've given them, they've all made them kind of unique. So in theory, you could have an army with everything, both Cadian and Krieg, and they're all doing different things with your tin and rough riders thrown in for good measure as well. Uh whereas personally, I'd almost like just make them all the same, but you're buying different boxes to represent visually a difference. And I guess that's where you get into the sort of similarities between you know space marine chapters, but they've all got unique things as well that do uh their own different things, even though they have a lot of visual crossover sometimes, and sometimes they are just shoulder pads. These are a bit more than just shoulder pads, right? They're like unique models for each one.

SPEAKER_00 1:42:41

Yeah, I don't if I I think if we're gonna see other regiments for yeah, regiments by the right terminology, for Astro Militarum, it will be in Kills. Yeah, or it will be as a custom as a K a Like a an upgrade sprue or something. Yeah, like an upgrade sprue like we have for in space marines, you have if you want to buy if you want to do Dark Angels, for example, most of your models are just regular space marines. But you buy the the upgrade sprue so you can make them look more dark angels. And which in that sense, maybe Steel Legion is possible because you could theoretic you could realistically do an upgrade sprue for Krieg to give them some head swaps or some other uh I can only to make what is basically Krieg look a bit more like Steel Legion. But I think that's only because they as I said before they are a bit too similar. Maybe we could see some different units. Um I'd really love to see the Val Hallens have a unit. If if Kill Team is the way to do that, then great. I think that Kill Team could be a way we can you can we could see that happen. Um but then it might not be. I was I was really hopeful that we would get we'd see Elysians coming through Kill Team, but they would say we got Saiyan.

SPEAKER_06 1:43:50

Which were doing a very similar thing. Yeah, I sort of felt like that was a missionary.

SPEAKER_00 1:43:55

Yeah, yeah, but I I've but I mean I yeah, I I don't I'm curious about the the why Steel Legion is is so so yeah, I can see why it's definitely important for us a vocal part of the community, and it does definitely seem that Games Workshop is listening more to the community in that sense. Or or maybe not listening more is not the right word, but they're more receptive of yeah, more receptive to how the community is feeling. We see wings with like Yarek returning and the fact that they're saying, Oh yeah, Steel Legion is something that people want to see. I can't see it being a full range because it doesn't make it.

SPEAKER_06 1:44:29

I mean it I think it will be if it's popular, and I think what they do is an initial kill team, and then if it's because I think even with Krieg it was like that we got the kill team, and then it was at least two years or more before we got the full range come out. So I think it'll be a similar thing where they will test it, test the waters, see if people are you know trying to convert loads of those infantry squads up into like a full range, and then they go, Okay, yeah, cool, it seems popular enough. We'll give you some, you know, still legion on bikes or whatever, or still legion um, you know, mini tanks or something, whatever it might be. I I I feel like that would be the way to go. I wouldn't be surprised if there's a different regiment coming between now and then and that we are getting something like Catchan or something else that's probably been planned in the pipeline, whereas I feel like Steel Legion is just a reaction to some community uh outrage. Um, and that's why they've smashed out some concept art. That was never meant to happen. That's why there's no there isn't anything to that reveal other than some some sketches.

SPEAKER_00 1:45:35

Yeah. I predict a kilty for an upgrade spree. Yeah.

SPEAKER_06 1:45:39

I mean it would be c clever if they could make it an upgrade sprue for Krieg, but I don't feel like that would be possible unless though that Krieg line was designed with a uh upgrade sprue in mind. Even though they've got gas masks and uh trench coats, it's like the trench coats are shorter, the gas masks are a different style, the guns are a different pattern, so nothing, even though you s if you squint they look similar, but everything about them is still completely different. So I don't think there's really anything other than maybe the legs, and even then, I think they've got a different style boot. So there's not really anything that's super compatible to make it just an upgrade sprue for a Krieg at least.

SPEAKER_00 1:46:23

I mean if anything they need they I don't know if they were if they were thinking about this when they were doing it, but where with the standard Astro Militarum unit units, they should be it would be good if they were up they were if they if you have if they were able to provide upgrade sprues for the standard then they could so then similar to how it is with the space marines, so you can buy stuff buy upgrade kits to the standard astral military armor stuff to make them.

SPEAKER_06 1:46:51

I I wouldn't be opposed to because I think there was a Praetorian piece of artwork which I feel like was in an RPG, one of the RPG books, but it's a very good piece of artwork that looks quite official of a Praetorian guard. So he's got the Piff helmet, but ultimately he's wearing the Cadian armour, like the modern uniform of Cadians, just painted in a or or you know, coloured differently to look like the Praetorian uh I think it's blue or black trousers and you know red uh jackets, but he's got the flak armor on him still and a pith helmet. So ultimately that could have just been a head upgrade sprue to the Cadians, and actually I wouldn't mind that, even though it's a slightly different dress, you know, it's not for dress uniform that they used to have from like Zulu, it's much more modern military, but they've got the heads. And I can imagine they do that with a few others, like they do, you know, Mordi and Igard, uh Cadians, but just different hats, right? And I I feel like that could be a way of doing a very low-level version of different regiments without having to do full body sculpts for stuff. And even if that was almost like a stopgap measure until other kits came out, I wouldn't mind too much. Like these guys with gas masks would look a bit still Legion because they've got that kind of I mean it's a bit more of a cape kind of uh overcoat rather than a trench coat, but it would have still Legion vibes if you painted it right and had the right heads for this unit, for example, even though it's not exactly still Legion, but it'd be close enough, I think, for a lot of people to make it work. Cool. Right, let's move on to the uh next section, which is just the kill team uh book, which we don't really need to go into too much detail. But the interesting thing is the nemesis operatives, which is a way of playing with bigger models, but also doing joint ops, which is basically a co-op game where you both have kill teams versus a boss. So in this example, you could have a dreadnought as a boss, uh, but the two models they've given us is an Amble, uh, which is an old model from Blackstone Fortress, and also Vizot, uh, another model from Blackstone Fortress that you could basically both play as and uh against. I've just realized Vizot's gun looks like a bughead. I assume that's deliberate. Richie, what's your take on this game mode and model release?

SPEAKER_00 1:49:24

I think it's a great way of trying to shift these models.

SPEAKER_06 1:49:27

These old models.

SPEAKER_00 1:49:29

Which already exists in the range.

SPEAKER_06 1:49:31

Yeah, that have been.

SPEAKER_00 1:49:32

Yeah, I mean I think I mean I I've I don't know, I don't play enough Kill Team to have a strong opinion on what this means for the four players of Kill Team. This might be really, really cool for them, this new like mission types of playing with playing with a f uh a friend rather than against them to take down some bigger threat or to bring on uh additional units to help you take on these bigger threats. Otherwise, it's like a cool way they've got they've got these Zotes and they've got these ambles that exist, and what can we do to Make them useful in if in a system. I think it could be fun, but that's I can't I can't comment the model on the minis because really because they already exist.

SPEAKER_06 1:50:07

They've been around a while. I guess it's great for people that maybe wanted a Black Same Fortress but couldn't get those expansions. But uh although I guess technically you're missing all the card stuff unless there's ways of printing those online. But as we were talking about with the Inquisitor, it's just great to see expansions to the 40k universe with these little uh sort of bolt-on units that aren't necessarily being fleshed out into four factions. And yes, these are old models that we've seen before, but it's great for new players to see them, but also new players to get access to them if they wanted them. The concept of the Nemesis operatives or operations reminds me a bit of the I think it was the one of the final expansions to the was it like 2015 kill team? It was like the first proper box version of Kill Team that had obviously Rogue Trader in it and then the tournament version. But there was like a commanders expansion where you could take like a Terminator captain or captains and heroes for your army and add them into your kill team, and this is a similar thing, but maybe expanding it to vehicles like dreadnoughts or ogrins or whatever it might be. Um so yeah, I think interesting and yeah, great great uh for a kill team player, freshening up the game with a new game mode, I think, is good. Tim, have you got uh a preference in these or any thoughts?

SPEAKER_08 1:51:27

I'm afraid not because I don't really play kill team. They're cool models, and they were cool in Blackstone Fortress, like the Ambol is a classic, a classic model, and yeah, like you say, it's just another way for people to get hold of these models if they missed the opportunity first time around.

SPEAKER_06 1:51:41

True. That is uh indeed. So, yes, we are at the end of that version of the reveal show. So we're now going to go on to our final parts for 40k, which is talking about 11th edition. Uh, so we will do a transitional noise. So, in our final part of the uh reveal show for 40k, it is 11th edition, the world's worst kept secret, because we all knew it was coming because it has been three years since 10th edition. So, yeah, there was a lovely cinematic trailer. Tin, what was your thoughts on the cinematic trailer?

SPEAKER_08 1:52:19

Cinematic trailer was awesome. Like they they really upped their production game. Was it 9th edition with the Necrons? Was that 10th? Yes. That was nice. Yeah, that was ninth. Uh 10th was doing it. That was it. Thank you. Like, yeah, it the 9th edition Cinematic Trailer was also one that stuck that came to my mind. Um, it was epic. It just made me want to collect Blood Angels, or at least start doing blood angels, or at least paint red on something.

SPEAKER_06 1:52:49

Yeah, true. It did look good. It had the uh very Iron Man style like look at inside the helmets, where it's just the guy's head in a floating black void, which feels like it's so influential because it's used everywhere now, because it's a great way of visualizing who's inside uh a helmet. So yeah, that was quite cool. There was an element at the very beginning where I was like, it was like a sort of long shot out. So you saw um, I think it was all the Yorks shooting at the Marines, and it I was like, Oh, this is the Dawn of War trailer that they're showing, because that's sort of visually what it looked like. It was so far out, it looked like it was part of a like a game visually looking like the gameplay of Dawn of War. And then after a little bit, I was like, oh no, it is a length edition. Okay, because I was thinking at one point, oh, they've not they've not done it, it's not gonna be at this uh event. So yeah, it was interesting. So I was slightly wrong for a few seconds.

SPEAKER_08 1:53:44

When I was watching the trailer, sorry, it did did remind me and trigger off like, oh, it's like the Dawn of War trailer. Like the original one, yeah. Like the original Dawn of War trailer. And I think that's kind of like a a theme that's gonna run through this conversation is like they are trying to hit the nostalgia button now that we mentioned earlier.

SPEAKER_06 1:54:03

Yeah, yeah, because obviously the well, we get to it when we talk about the box art, but uh yeah, Richie, what's your take on the trailer?

SPEAKER_00 1:54:11

Any particular highlights? I think the trailer's really cool. One one thing I do like is because they've haven't showed us any of the models really, it means that um which which is frustrating in its own in a way, but it does mean what I'm I can I can watch the trail trailer, which is awesome. To speculate what models are gonna be. There's gonna think and I can say that because the most obvious thing, the most glaringly obvious thing is there's now we're now gonna have chaplains with jump packs. Yes. Yeah. We're gonna have there's a new land speeder coming. Yes. There's some weird new Orc mech walker thing. Yes, yeah, there's a new weird boy with some awesome powers.

SPEAKER_06 1:54:53

There is uh there was the orc mega boss that they've already previewed because he was leaked a while back. He's in the trailer as well, so that confirms that he's coming in the box, but also coming separately as well, because I think when he was leaked, it was because it was like him in a standalone box. But yeah, he's in the trailer. There is a ballista streadnought in the trailer, but I don't think he's gonna show up in the box. That feels quite unlikely because the box is always completely new kits. Um, and then there's not Vanguard vets. No, yeah, it's Vanguard vets because they're Stone Guards already come out, so uh yeah, Vanguard vets with their jump packs are uh with the jump back chap pleno gonna be in there as well by the looks of it.

SPEAKER_00 1:55:37

Yeah, so other trailer it looks really cool. I think as we're talking about like kind of an like a nostalgic vibe to it. I I've I think it's nostalgic and a good getting back to I don't want to say getting back to basic, but getting back to its core roots of why. It feels like it's with like going back, it feels like going back to the kind of second edition and it is orcs and space marines and it's the blood angels. And so I've seen comments on social media like finally it's not just blue marines, but there are blue marines in the trailer.

SPEAKER_06 1:56:03

That's true, they do sneak some in.

SPEAKER_00 1:56:05

Which I like, I really like the implication there that it's multiple space marine chapters fighting together. That could for me that's exciting, and does that mean you can you can ally with different space marine chapters in one in in one army? Um that would be cool. Uh but it's it's it's no, it's just it's a really cool trailer. It it it's the one of the coolest, I think it's one of the coolest trailers they've done since the most recent one for AOS, where we saw the new Skaven using all their new weapons the first time. The Skaven tide one, that was really cool. Not that's not to say that like even Ninth Edition's one was awesome, where you had the the drama of that ninth edition trailer with the story of the sister and then the angel, the the space when the angel coming to say the day was really special, but it was you could also tell it was what it that was an early foray into that space because it was it they did an awful lot with quite quite little in a way. Whereas now, after that they've been ramping up their uh experience of whomever they're working with to make bigger and better and more bombastic trailers, it's just like this is really damn cool. And this is getting back to basics of what 40k was at its core. I mean it's good to move away I think it's good to move away from Tyranids because I think with 10th edition, like the focus on Space Moons Tyranids as as that thing was interesting, but I think Space Moons versus Orcs is so classic as a starting point, I think it's a really good place they're coming back to.

SPEAKER_06 1:57:31

Because it literally goes back to second edition, which is probably how a lot of players that still older seasoned veteran gamers remember fondly is a good thing to do. They start off uh with a lore section, which is interesting in itself. It follows on directly, by the sounds of it, from Armageddon, The Return of Yarrick. The very last book that they're giving us sets up the new edition, which is not what we had in previous editions. Um, I guess the closest was the gathering storm leading into the Primaris project, I guess. But story-wise, it went on to the Plague Wars, which narratively wasn't actually linked whatsoever. But in the last edition, we had the Arcs of Omen stuff, and that left on a cliffhanger, which still has not been resolved to this day because it went straight on to Leviathan, which was not linked whatsoever. So it's it feels maybe like the VK teams are much more aligned in terms of what they're doing now in terms of these overall stories, and it's like, cool, we're gonna set up the new box set, and then it's going to be about Armageddon because that's like a classic um place to go to. And maybe because it's self-contained being Armageddon, it can be sort of like a one and done story with whatever number war is now, fifth or sixth. Um, or it will be something that will be ongoing throughout the entire edition. It'll be interesting to see. They do talk about a coalition of spaceman chapters, which is why we get Ultramarines in the animation. It makes me think it won't have anything to do with like allies in the game. It's just more the setting of Armageddon has multiple chapters in, so we're seeing it in the video. That's all I think it relates to potentially.

SPEAKER_00 1:59:24

We can come back, we can come back on this in a month or so's time, Phil.

SPEAKER_06 1:59:29

And then we can see, well, yeah, we can we can see see from Yarrick what that setup is, but also how it might pay off as well. So, yeah, we've got the Armageddon box set and artwork, which is reminiscent of the second edition, a box set that was originally by John Blanche. I don't know who this guy is, but he's the guy that does all the spacemean artwork, it seems. It looks very cool though, very iconic and a great kind of reimagining of those old things. But as I was saying with Yarriken about innovation, it's great when they they give us this nostalgia, but it feels like they can't really do it again. Or maybe they will. Maybe they will, like in another 20 years' time, they do a third version of this artwork because everyone would have remembered this one when they were young, because there's 15-year-olds buying this box set and then they will want to repeat. Yeah, maybe it's becoming secular and uh eating itself, but at the same time, I I I I'm here for it.

SPEAKER_00 2:00:25

There's no giant yellow power fist, Phil. This is not the this is this is not the remake. This is some new fangled version. It's great.

SPEAKER_06 2:00:34

And they have not just a tactical rock, they've got a tactical head made of stone, which if that's not on the miniature, I will be sorely disappointed, but I hope it is. Um but I presume you're both very positive on the artwork.

SPEAKER_08 2:00:47

Totally. Totally. As you said, it's very reminiscent of um second edition, which they did mention in the stream, so so I'm all for it. I'm interested to see what else comes with the box.

SPEAKER_06 2:00:59

Yeah. There's also some Thunderhawks in the artwork, so maybe we're gonna get plastic thunderhawks this edition. Come on, everyone, let's manifest it. Yeah, so that's very good. The models, and it's like the most underwhelming reveals. However, our caveat that with at least they gave us some models and talked about some of the rules and the box art because I think it was the last heresy box gave us the trailer and then literally nothing else. And it was like, okay, cool, you got all this hype for a really cool trailer. It was either the second edition one or the third edition one, I can't remember which, and then they gave us nothing else. So at least they've given us something here. But we start off with an intercessor who, as they point out, is painted as a blood angel, but has nothing blood angels sculpted on them, so you can paint it however you want. It's a new intercessor squad, but it has some mixes of armor, so we've got the old Mark 7 helmet, and then the only noticeable other thing I can think of is the knees uh don't exist on this one, and it's just all sort of uh front leg, uh bottom leg all the way up and includes the knees as well. So that's the only difference. And as Rich pointed out in our little chat that we have, um mentioned they've still got the knee pad like uh campaign markings on the knee, even though it doesn't have a knee. Yeah, which I which I am not a fan of. It does look a touch odd, but I think it works. Um and I think the bolter still just looks like a standard bolter. I can't tell if those bolters have been drilled out or if they've perfected the art of pre-drilled bolters, because I definitely know with the latest version of the eradicators when they did the heavy eradicators, they came sculpted in, so you didn't need to drill those out. Um but with this one it's a bit hard to tell. What what's what's people's thoughts on this model?

SPEAKER_08 2:02:58

Well, f they've kind of painted it in heresy colours, which is interesting, which I know is only like a small change, but no no no, as in the black trim and black aquilla, although the latest one does have a black aquilla, but they just have normal red trim. But also you could equally say, well, it's from the fifth company, which has black trim as well.

SPEAKER_06 2:03:22

Yeah, true. I wonder if it's to to hearken back to how the models in the original uh second ed were painted, perhaps. I'm not sure.

SPEAKER_08 2:03:32

I can't remember. Can't remember. Yeah. I'd have to look up the box a lot.

SPEAKER_00 2:03:38

The most the most important thing is that's a real space marine helmet. Like old school grills. It's it's it's like it was I it was to the extent I didn't realise it at first. Because I just thought it's just a space moon. Because in my head, that's what a space marine looks like. Right. But that is not what a space marine looks like today. That is not a the primary space marines have this weird like crisp like diagonal lines, grill face things.

SPEAKER_06 2:04:04

Yes, yeah. I think similar to is it the Mark III kits or Mark IV? I can't never remember which ones, but they've got Mark IV. Yeah, they've got similar Tim off the bat on the fact checking. Yeah, so uh I'm so used to those ones and I do like I think they are visually better looking, but the Mark VII is the most iconic version.

SPEAKER_00 2:04:28

Get out, Phil. I don't I I know this is your podcast, but yeah, no, this is the discount.

SPEAKER_08 2:04:33

I'm with I'm with Phil on this, sorry to talk over you here, but Mark 7 is like the primo of all armor marks. The Aquila.

SPEAKER_07 2:04:42

The it's good.

SPEAKER_00 2:04:45

No This is a proper Space Marine helmet we've got here. This is I mean, if I don't know it's it's great, there's gonna be option size. But for me, this is like this is like a space marine looking like a space marine. Going going like being not sad, but going back to when the arguably the game was at its peak, when you're like when you're thinking like they they've made what they've done here is they've made the space marine that you remember real. Because the the space the old the tactical marines that we that I grew up with had that kind of helmet, but they looking like you you can Google them. They actually look derpy as derpy as hell now, and they were tiny. Whereas this is a big versioned proportion-wise, it's like primary scale of the of a tactical marine, and it looks really cool. And it's to the extent that when I first saw it, it I it didn't really register because it was so this is what it should be.

unknown 2:05:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 2:05:40

But it's like it's like it's a tactical, it's how I rema how I imagine tactical marines in my mind versus what they actually look like. This is what they should look like in people's minds. So it's I think this is really cool. And I think it gives a great visual I I think it's good that they release this just as one mini because it means that everyone has to look at it and people can see they got there is like a harking back to the uh the earlier versions of of 40k visually with space marines. So maybe we're gonna get tank maybe there's gonna be some vehicles that which don't all hover or something, who knows? But just going back to something the this cooler visu, this like old school visual, but in a new in a more modern uh sculpted way. And for me, uh for me that's really cool.

SPEAKER_06 2:06:21

Yeah, it's because I think the problem because I do like the intercessor kits, and I I think that they're now giving us a bit more choice for those that either like the it feels like they're getting braver with going, actually, we want to bring back some of that classic space marine aesthetics, a mix of armor marks, uh, not have it all just be the Mark X armour. So I I think that's a good sign. I mean, they're not like overly grim dark and gothic, and they don't have a load of extra detail, like they're still quite simple, or at least this model is. Obviously, he's got like a purity seal wrapped around his gun, which is slightly more, you know, grimdark than perhaps uh a standard primaris guy is, but yeah, it feels like they're slowly leaning more into that and style of spacemane that we've seen with things like the Stanguard and stuff like that. So it's good. I guess it means that intercessor kit's been around for about nine years and that's being replaced with this one. Is that annoying? I think I've got three squads of ten-man intercessors built, and I've got another unit built but not painted because I had all the different bolter variants. So do I need another squad of intercessors? No. Would this even make me inclined to buy this? Well, probably not, but am I gonna have it because I'll probably buy the box at this time? Probably, yeah. So but am I desperate for new intercessors? Not at all. But I think there will be a lot of people that do want it because they like the old helmets. And what would be really cool to see is if they do at least some kind of helmet upgrades so you can just mix and match for any squad that you've got uh to add these sorts of uh yeah, older marks uh on. And a lot of the greaves as well, if I remember rightly, are just like front plates that stick on. So potentially even those leg plates you could swap with like a bunch of other kits as long as the pose of the leg is roughly correct.

SPEAKER_08 2:08:26

Yeah. I'm looking at the current intercessor sort of kit at the moment on the GW website, and I'm trying to find the set of legs that match, and I think I have found them. I say you think it is quite similar. Yeah, I think I think they have like just taken the old intercessor kit and just sort of swapped a few bits and swap.

SPEAKER_06 2:08:48

Yeah. Which makes sense. In theory, they could have done it as an upgrade sprue, but they've already done uh, I think an upgrade sprue with the kill team stuff that was for the standard intercessors. Yeah, it'd be interesting to see how that how how this kit it will be all new, but it'd be interesting to see how similar it is to the old.

SPEAKER_08 2:09:05

Well, the difference with this is that it also comes with like um I'm not sure if that's a different bolt bolter. It's hard to tell.

SPEAKER_00 2:09:13

It looks like a it looks like a bolt a standard bolt rifle.

SPEAKER_08 2:09:15

Yeah. It does, but they kind of make I swear they said in the stream or in the article, like, it's even got a bolter. It's in like an old school bolter.

SPEAKER_06 2:09:27

Yeah. The new kit has all sorts of nostalgic callbacks. Different helmet, shoulder pads, and greaves. The shoulder pads are ever so slightly different.

SPEAKER_05 2:09:36

Are they? Do you think they're a bit thinner? They're they're a little bit thinner on the trim. Yeah, I don't know if they're mostly how it's painted.

SPEAKER_06 2:09:44

Possibly. Could be the the yeah, the paint giving an optical illusion. It'd be odd that if I change that style, that maybe.

SPEAKER_08 2:09:53

Yeah, but going back to your point, I'd be happy to like own these and paint them up.

SPEAKER_03 2:09:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_08 2:09:58

I I I actually quite like painting the Space Marines just randomly. I think they're a cool little model to paint as like a little sort of paddle cleanser.

SPEAKER_06 2:10:06

That's true. Yeah. I mean, if I was to paint up more standard intercessors, I think I'd just have to do a completely different chapter because I've already got enough uh mine towards uh intercessors as it is. Um yeah, let's move on to the orc, who I really like the look of. Um I had a quick look before we started on the orc uh Facebook group, and I think a bunch of people complain they're not multi-pose and that they're gonna be monopose. And it's like, what uh what world are you living in? It's not 2015 anymore, guys. You know, multi-pose just doesn't exist for these kind of kits, really. I mean, um I can't I can't even say like where would you even put the multi-pose joints on these things? You might have a few different arm options, perhaps, but I would put it that this is an easy build kit. Yeah, exactly. They I mean they all will be easy-build kits, right? Um even in a more complicated version, you won't really get the posability of like the older editions where the arms were going into like ball sockets so you can swing them around wildly and the torso pivots at the hip. Like those days are long gone. But at best you will get maybe let's say boys come in a squad of 10, but you'll get 20 in of the box optimistically. Kit could be built with two two different variants. That is the closest you get to multi-pose, I think, in Games Workshop kits these days. And you know, with a scalkle and some green stuff, you can repose them, I think. But the base dynamic poses are so much better than the old multi pose kits. This guy looks really cool. I like how hunched over he is, and he's got like a little top knot, he's got a gun on his back, and he's got an axe and a bolt pistol. So he looks really cool. I like the look of him. What's everyone else's take? Richard, the orc aficionado. Uh, do you like? Like this guy.

SPEAKER_00 2:12:01

I think I I think he looks cool. I at the same time it's interesting because I'm sure I've been trying to see like how is he different to the existing kind of range that they've got. And he does feel like he's going he feels more quite inspired by a few editions ago, like ten years ago and orc, because orcs haven't I don't think orcs have had like a top-not style hair squig for a while.

SPEAKER_06 2:12:26

And that kind of like they're squiggs, aren't they? And they're not actual hair.

SPEAKER_00 2:12:31

Yeah, or like this that the kind of like dungarees kind of look he's got is a bit different to what they've been having more lately. Um at least from what the kind of more generally what they've shown. But otherwise he's got uh they've pointed out in the article he's got a shooter and a slugger, so you don't have to you no longer have to worry about which version of the choices, yeah. How have you built the mini? Which I think is good because there's a there's definitely a vibe they've given out about this edition that they want to simp they they want to make things simpler, and which will be interesting to see how you know how that ultimately manifests will s will you know will time will reveal that. But I think this might be just it looks like an orc, it looks like a cool orc, he's got like a biker's glove on. Um which they have I don't think they've had orcs with gloves for a little while. It's an it's an interesting it's an interesting model, it's got some character to it, but it's not it's yeah, it's uh and it's more like okay, okay, they these are orcs and they're gonna be they're like our focus for it. Yeah. But I don't it's not as much like if there's for me at least there's not as much obvious nostalgia as there is there's been other than like there is the top knot, which is a thing, okay, that's a that's a thing we haven't seen in the while before a lot of orcs have been mostly wearing like helmets or just being bald.

SPEAKER_06 2:13:45

Yeah, like I was just trying to think what the orcs from second edition look like, and to be honest, if they had a Gretchen that look like the hordes of Gretchen you got in that box, that that would have been a more iconic thing to call back to. And maybe there are some in there that the uh because those ones had helmets on, I think, in terms of the orcs at least. I think actually both the Gretchen did as well. But it it's a cool pose. I like I like the sort of proportions of this guy. I remember seeing a load of people complain about the orc war boss that they previewed a while back. He had like small arms or something, but I actually really liked the look of him. I thought he was a nice like evolution of the orc design that wasn't just like hulking everywhere, had some, you know, big bits and small bits, and it sort of yeah, it just seemed to flow better as a miniature, I thought. Cool. Right, if that's it for the orc, let's move on to the rules. So the first bit's about army building. They talk about we're going to get 70 new detachments, some of which are new, some of which are updated old detachments. The key thing is that all the codexes and campaign supplements are going to be valid for the new edition, so nothing's being indexed, which actually I'm really pleased about because while it was fun in 8th edition to index, and there's an element of a feeling that everything is new, um, it also got really tiresome constantly doing it every single edition, and also the fact that it basically meant you, yes, you got some rules for free, but you basically were buying the index cards for your army, then you were buying a codex, then you were buying the codex version of the cards as well, probably. It just sort of all added up to an expensive purchase if you wanted to get all the fun little gubbins for your army. Whereas actually keeping your codex still valid is really good. It does ultimately mean they're probably not going to be huge sweeping changes within the core rules itself, unless there's going to be, you know, extra universal special rules, but they're just not applied until a new codex comes out, for example, but the the base elements are there. What do people think about this as a prospect for uh the game for the army building?

SPEAKER_08 2:16:05

I think it's a cool idea. 70 detachments is quite a lot. So I feel like that's a a bit of bloat there.

SPEAKER_06 2:16:13

Well they did say it was to bring life to miniatures that aren't often used in their army. So I guess they're looking at underutilised portions of your army and giving you reasons to play them, which I think is positive. But yeah, it's a lot of stuff to get through.

SPEAKER_08 2:16:31

Definitely, definitely a positive move. Like I'm really interested to see what kind of forces people are gonna build and put together now because it's just it makes it sound like you could just take have a little bit of this faction mixed with a little bit of this faction.

SPEAKER_06 2:16:44

Yeah, well they talk about detachments. Yeah, they talk about m modular detachments, so it feels like you can take like too many detachments and form them into one big detachment, which is an interesting concept, but maybe you know it potentially makes balance a lot harder, or in a way, it's it's great that it empowers people to have more flexibility, but the downside is you know you're giving them too much choice sometimes, but it hopefully means some things should play how you want them to play and not be forced to. Well, I've taken a detachment that predominantly just benefits Terminators, so I would be mad to take anything but Terminators in this detachment, and that's the one sort of downside that we've had with detachment so far is you're just encouraged to lean into a couple of units because they're the only things benefiting from that detachment, whereas maybe broader stuff uh allows you to sort of pick and mix uh a much more balanced army. Richard, what do you think about these uh army building aspects?

SPEAKER_00 2:17:47

I have no idea what it means. There's no context, it could mean anything. I mean, it says with these new detachment rules, you'll be able to have greater flexible what what's the exact wording? The detachments are changing to give you more flexibility. As far as I'm aware, the game right now is the most flexible it's ever been. In you can take a character and then whatever the hell you want. Right, yes, that's true. So I can't see how they could make that any more flexible.

SPEAKER_06 2:18:14

Well, I think it was down to what I was saying, where your detachment encourages you to only take certain units due to the benefits of stratagems and the arm.

SPEAKER_00 2:18:24

That's less flexibility though. That's that that's less flexible than right now. In terms of what you want to take in your army, right now in the game, you could you can as long as you have a character, you can take whatever you want. Well, I think that will still be there. What I mean is I don't understand what they this detachments and flexibility means. Because in terms of building your army, the units you take, there is nothing they could do to improve the flexibility. Unless you didn't have to take a character. Whatever they're adding to the whatever this new way they use detachments, is that going back to force org charts? Is it becoming more like various regiments of renown type thing from AOS? Like if you take this particular type combination of units, it gives you these special abilities with them or something. It could or it's you could have like a fast attack detachment or another type of detachment. If you take certain types of units from your army, you get different abilities. I think it's going to give you more flexibility potentially in the abilities you bring to the army. But I when it talks about how the flexibility on building it, I don't I I that doesn't mean anything because right literally right now there is infinite flexibility. So it I don't know right now it's like it's just words. 70 detachments also sounds a lot until you realise there's over 20 factions.

SPEAKER_01 2:19:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 2:19:38

So if every detachment has three. So if every so if every faction has three detachments, that's you've already got to 60. That's a that's grouping all the space marines into one or two. The 70 is a big number, but it also if if if that's a if that's broad spectrum and anyone can take any type of detachment, then yeah, that's a lot. If certain army, if certain factions have a have acts to different detachments, it's may i it may only be a few. Again, without con wider context of what's going on with the army building, it doesn't really make sense what any of that means or what additional roles you get. But I do question the flexibility in building your army because there is currently infinite flexibility. So I think that's a bit misleading.

SPEAKER_06 2:20:22

Right, that's fair. I think it's just going to be encouraging you to take um, yeah, a wider selection of models based on the detachment that you pick. But as you say, the option to do a you know one character plus a maximum of you know three or six if it's the battle line won't change. The next one is missions, and it says your choice of detachments also affects your missions. Your objectives in a game will now be part dictated by the type of army you bring to the field and force your opponent, uh, and the force your opponent has bought. Armies that specialise in holding ground will be rewarded for doing so, like Tau, I guess. While other forces may be optimised for disrupting enemy plans or just killing lots of enemies, you will be rewarded for doing that too. So it sounds like there's some kind of matrix based on what the two forces have, their kind of play style, and that picks your mission, which sounds very thematic. My two concerns is how would this work for tournament play, or where you're doing an event where multiple people are uh traditionally all playing the same mission at the same time, will they still be doing that? And tournament plays its own sort of slightly separate thing now. Um or uh and then the other thing is is if let's say me and Richie, we're playing a game and we're doing we've got a whole weekend to play games, so we're bringing the same force um and we're gonna play five games between ourselves. Are we technically playing the same mission five times because we bought the same type of force and that's the one mission option? Uh or we rolling on a table and there's like five or six different tables that we roll on depending on the combination of these sort of detachments that people are bringing. Like it sounds interesting, but I I need to see how it actually works to see if this is a good thing or not. Because it feels like it could get a bit samey unless you're taking a different army all the time, uh, or you're playing different types of armies all the time. Tim, what's your uh thought on this one?

SPEAKER_08 2:22:35

It sounds cool. I am a little bit concerned that we we it could get broken quite easily. For example, you pointed out Tao straight away when it comes to holding ground, and like obviously Tau are notorious for being a castle shooter yami, although you can build them in a different way, and I'm not sure how the twins play now, but apparently they are very good. So so so that is my concern. Fair. Have you got similar thoughts, Richard, or are you a bit more positive?

SPEAKER_00 2:23:06

I will I mean again, again, this is just having to having to like who knows. It re it reads though a bit more like they've taken a leaf out of the current Age of Sigmar General's handbook, in that you can choose what your in the sense that you can choose what your objective your mission objectives are going to be. The important things in terms of you know putting my communications director out. What's important is the objectives in a game will now be in part dictated by the type of army you bring. So that suggests that there'll be primary objectives and there'll be secondary objectives and you can choose what your secondary objectives are.

SPEAKER_06 2:23:44

Yeah. Because it's oh yeah, go on, carry on, sorry.

SPEAKER_00 2:23:48

Yeah, and those secondary, and it says you the force your opponent has brought, which suggests that you have that you will have a selection of secondary objectives that you can choose to you to be how your army plays into that. Now, what's interesting is the first sentence of this your choice of detachments now also affects your missions, which would suggest that detachments is where those that you choose is where your secondary objectives potentially come in.

SPEAKER_06 2:24:16

Yeah, because I was reading that as it literally determines the mission you're playing, but I think you are correct, because that seems mad that it actually determines effectively your secondary missions that you are going to do. And I can imagine it being similar to the Age of Sigma ones, but you're being a bit more locked in based on your detachment rather than you just picking, which is good because I think one of the problems with the AOS one is you almost it's up to you to have enough skill to determine what you've built and work out what it's good at, whereas this will hopefully be giving you some on-rails guidance to be like, cool, you've taken a detachment that's mostly about manoeuvrability. So we're recommending you pick the go out and grab objectives secondary versus the killing one secondary, even if you think you might be good at that. That's not really what this detachment's about.

SPEAKER_00 2:25:14

Yeah, it I think it lends the idea that this that the detachments is some kind of force organization chart, in the sense to take an example. In the con if you're if I'm just trying to imagine what it could be. It could be like, let's take their example of your defensive army. So maybe your defensive army is or the second mechanism let's say you're a mechanized army. So you your detachment is a HQ choice and at least five heavy support choices. Hyper using previous how it used to be in previous versions, so you have a bunch of say heavy support or fast attack, and that builds you that detachment, and have it when you have that then that detachment, that gives you objectives that you can then achieve. It gives you a selection of secondary objectives, which you have to achieve through the game. How exactly that matters? But I think uh the way it's and admittedly this is in a Warcom article, which they have to be in there's only so much they can tell us, and they might have to be more vague than they might intend, which could lead us down the wrong path by accident. It suggests that you when you build your army, you build it in such a way that gives you certain missions, that gives you certain objectives that you'd want to achieve. But it can it sounds like they give you a choice because you could say have uh you depending on who your opponent is, it may not be uh the default may not be good for you. You could be like kill you if you're saying your default detachment is kill lots of kill quantity of units, and then you're up against knights. That's no good. It could so it could be something different. Um so I'm very intrigued by what it means from this. Um, but it definitely feels like there will be there'll be missions you go on that have a primary objective, and whatever the secondaries are is determined by your army faction or whether detachments you've used.

SPEAKER_06 2:26:49

Yeah. And obviously they talked about you could potentially take multiple like modular detachments, which potentially gives you a bit more flexibility and choice about types of secondaries you might be able to get if each detachment gives you an option for those secondaries. Um I think I don't think necessarily say they mentioned in the article, but they definitely said it in the live stream where they want to blend narrative and tournament play together, like the match play and narrative. They wanted every game to be narrative, which is why uh things like these missions are being a bit more driven by your army. And also when we go on to the next thing, which is objectives, but there's no more round objective markers because it's now terrain footprints that determines key locations, relics, or fortifications. What was interesting here is in the live stream, they seem to have a photo or screenshot of um one of these terrain footprints, and it looks like a cardboard cutout of like a floor plan of like uh the you know the ground floor of a ruins that you would have in your box set and you would use to represent one of your objective markers. And maybe each one's a bit different. Maybe one of them, you know, it looks like a bunch of crates or something, and then some look like buildings, which is cool visually and conceptually, obviously it's killing off a whole bunch of, or temporarily killing off of a whole bunch of third-party objective marker makers and also Games Workshop's own objective markers that they sell at their events. But I wonder how flexible these are or if people will be wedded to the exact size and shape of the ones that they've initially provided with us. So when there's a terrain footprint one, rather than just going, yeah, cool, just use a building roughly that size, because uh a a ruin that's an actual ruin will look a lot better than a piece of cardboard put down on the table. Or if people are obsessed about the exact size and dimensions and be like, well, no, I'm using this piece of cardboard in even though the rest of the terrain looks great, and in which case that potentially ruins the immersion rather than increases the immersion of it. That was my only concern with this one, I think. But conceptually, getting rid of circles is a great idea because visually going back to uh you know cool pieces of terrain or crates or relics or whatever it might be, but visually represented with models is a lot better than yeah, these sort of pie plates that just get put on the table everywhere.

SPEAKER_03 2:29:27

Tim, tell me your thoughts.

SPEAKER_08 2:29:31

Sorry, a little stool there. I no, I I I I I agree. Um I don't think it'll be too much of an issue as long as like footprints are clearly defined and that mission or sorry, mission maps are for I'm thinking from a competitive point of view here, are clearly describing where all these different terrain pieces need to be placed. Because essentially, like an objective marker is just a footprint, it doesn't really it shouldn't really matter how you change that footprint. Yes, it's nice to have circles to make it all like uniform and concise from a competitive point of view, but let's say I have a squiggly shape in my bottom left-hand corner, which is uh an objective, and you have a squiggly terrain shape that's in your bottom left-hand corner, then it's still equally like it's still equally distributed in terms of where the objectives are placed from a competitive point of view. Yeah. If they're equal, which I assume they would do because they're trying to cater to everyone, which is fine. Um and and that's kind of like maybe a way they would go about doing it. But I am all for having like more narrative looking sort of objective markers and terrain pieces. I want to go back to I want to go back to the days of where uh you used to take like polystyrene from like old sort of cardboard boxes that had like electrical equipment that like your mum and dad may have got like a toaster from or something. Right, yeah. And then that makes like a bunker, you know, and you would slap like polyfiller all over it, um, because that's what the GW magazine told you to do, where you would stick like cocktail sticks in there to make cacti. But it made the tabletop more thematic, and and I'm all for that. So anything that goes in that direction, I think is a good positive move.

SPEAKER_06 2:31:19

Yeah, that's true. I mean I never I think it was uh I want to say it was 8th edition chapter approved, and it basically came out with a bunch of like objective. I think you they even sold objective markers, and like one of the objective markers was a bomb, one of them was like a comms relay tower, one of them was like the Xenos tube with a dead alien in it or something. And I was like, and you could stick them on bases or not, but they were meant to sort of just visually represent your objectives on the tabletop, and they were all roughly the same size. It's like I don't mind them being that, and I always want to do things like a escape craft or uh you know a cockpit from a crashed um you know fighter ship or something. Do these little dioramas to represent the objectives, and something like that just feels much more narrative than, as you say, a flat bit of neoprene on a tabletop. Um Richard, what is your view on these uh circles versus or non-circles?

SPEAKER_00 2:32:27

I think this is the best thing to happen to 40k in years because there's nothing I love just for the purposes this is audio, I'm being sarcastic in the following thing. There's nothing I love more than seeing a beautiful battlefield covered in garish neon circles with insert my pro gamer name team on the battery, they're the worst. I I loathe that. It's like I want to see you set up a lovely battlefield and then you slap it with try-hard gaming circles everywhere. And it's like it's uh it's ugly. I want to I I want to battle, I want to have a game for where I'm on a battlefield. I want it to look and feel like a battlefield.

SPEAKER_06 2:33:04

To be fair to go shop, I didn't mind their official objector markers because they're the ones I used and not the ones I mean that you could buy from the events because those neoprene ones that were ridiculously expensive. I think they were like 50 quid or something. Yeah, they were but they had the faction branding on them. But the generic set that you could get a few years ago sort of merged in with the terrain, and then it looked like you had an all-spec scan sort of thing going on. That those were no things. That's not the ones I'm talking about. No, I know. The the yeah, the the the the hobby team ones uh pretty garish, I thought, and just looked a bit ugly.

SPEAKER_00 2:33:45

Yeah, they usually they usually have people who've got they've got a shirt, they're wearing a shirt that matches their objective mask or something. Um, if it's you're uh if people want to really get into the game, that's pr that's great for them. But I want to see a na I want to see a battlefield and fire over it. And that's what I that's what. I think this is really exciting. That's what I think they're trying to do. They gave a little more details in the um like um FAQ, like answering some of the questions article that came out the day after, where they clarify that you're the battles will be fighting over quote pieces of terrain such as bunkers, ruins, or relics rather than to to give a more narrative and immersive game, as opposed to it being like, what is the footprint of this L shape that has to be here? Or Webby. So I think this could be really cool. I'm really excited for fighting over battlefields again rather than fighting over certain generic spaces.

SPEAKER_06 2:34:35

Yeah, because I think that was always a problem, is often the objective markers couldn't be in terrain because the rules specifically stated that. So it's like, cool, I'm fighting over this random empty piece of ground a metre away from this building, but not the actual building itself, which feels much more strategically located. That always felt really annoying. I got used to it, and there was an element of gameplay that having those pie plates down to represent objective markers was really useful because you could just be like, cool, I need to um, you know, have my guys on this circle. I don't need to measure from an objective marker for the aura or anything. It made it quite convenient. But having a piece of a terrain footprint, for example, that I can just put models on and it still visually look appropriate, that would be good. I mean, part of me would love it if they go, here's a prescribed set of objective markers. Do not use these in all your games. Like, do what you want. If you've got a different ruin, use that and just pick that. Don't use this piece of cardboard. They can all be different sizes, they don't need to be balanced. We don't care that that much about parity between the two sides of the tabletop because the rest of the game should shake out and be balanced in other ways. Personally, I would love that even more, but who knows what they'll actually do. It'll be quite interesting. Do you guys have anything more to say on objectives before we go on to terrain?

SPEAKER_00 2:36:02

I think the thing you said about how the competitive well, well you both said it, like how the competitive scene um ruined how they take on it. Oh, that's what I was gonna say. They've already ruined the game enough over the last few editions. And I with their with the with the the with the way they want to take the game, I want to it feels like Games Workshop um and the 40k the current 40k team are wanting to bring back a more narrative immersive game mode to it. I hope they can stick to their guns on that and have it be like you said, like encouraging player people to use certain types of terrain or just say this terrain is what you is hack what you're fighting over. So um two people aren't measuring out very specific types of perspects to be on the table with certain terrain pieces on it, or just be like, here's a cool bunker, here's a cool thing. It'd be awesome if they had had like an objective set of terrain, or maybe that's what's gonna be in the box. Like in like spear in like Spearhead, you get a couple of little bits of terrain um in AOS. Maybe that's gonna be in the new box. You'll have a couple of like a bunker or some kind of ruins that represent what you're gonna be fighting over. That's the kind of I'd love to see exciting battlefields again, yeah, rather than just mirror matches over the same circles. I'm very excited by this.

SPEAKER_06 2:37:12

I could almost imagine that they go, There are six objective markers, two of which are ruins of a set size. Another two are medium sizes, which are basically like rubble or something, and then there's two small ones which are like barrels or crates. So you get a not all objectives are exactly equal, but you could argue that there's enough balance because there's one of each and you get one of each. So what you and your opponent has is relatively equal in terms of how they're spaced out on the battlefield, but that they can be of different sizes. Um it doesn't matter actually too much that you're not using the exact ones. And I can imagine that they're gonna give us some cardboard ones in the box, but maybe there'll be an objective terrain set that you can buy um at a later date. Speaking of terrain, they've updated the rules. So they say the default bonus for cover now impacts hit rolls and not saves, and units are generally far easier to hide than they previously were. And then in the live stream, they basically said that if you are in a building, you cannot be shot unless you have shot yourself first, unless you are within 15 inches of the attacker, which obviously they've not put here. It's very similar to how kill team operates. So kill team operates on a hidden or engaged, I think of two terms, sort of activation. So you've got one token that you can flip over to say you're hidden or engaged, and you're only engaged basically once you've shot. You can then go back into hiding at a later date, but for by default, you're engaged and then you can be shot. But if you're hidden and you're behind cover, you can't be shot at, uh, basically. And it feels like this solves that whole turn one issue of everyone not hiding in ruins, but hiding behind ruins, because that's the only way of guaranteeing you're not being shot at. Instead, now you can have things set up in ruins, and it doesn't matter if you're going second, you can't be shot at, because most things won't necessarily be within 15 inches unless it's got a fast enough movement and you're right on the table edge, but you know something still might be able to shoot you, but you're really minimizing it. Um so this seems like a great thing. Affecting hit rolls probably is also good rather than saves. Um, so because obviously that's gonna make a much uh bigger difference, basically. So yeah, this seems really positive. Solves my other issue that no one is hiding in terrain or being on terrain features, they're just too busy being behind it because that's where the real benefit comes from. Richard, what's your take on terrain?

SPEAKER_00 2:39:52

No, I completely agree. I think being able to do every game starts the same these days, most games start the same as everyone's behind no one's in a building because if you're in the building, you can be shot. So everyone's behind the buildings or behind the the the other footprint, and making it so that I think I really like the idea that you that you can't be shot until you've been f first shot unless you're like at close range. I think that's a really cool mechanic. Um we'll make I I'll be interested to see how that affects things like Overwatch or stuff. I think in general this seems like a good way of making the games feel more narrative, more dynamic um as a game rather than the kind of everyone's hiding behind uh you put it on there, but now there's a reason to start in a building rather than behind it.

SPEAKER_06 2:40:34

Yeah, and that is just visually more narrative, right? And uh, you know, it gives you potentially an excuse to be on a second floor of a ruin rather than the first floor, because you know, now you can set up some shooting in your turn and not worry about being shot if you're not going first. So things like that I think would be quite positive, and that visually feels more thematic as well. I presume you basically are just going to echo what we say, Tim, or have you got some dark secret negative thing to say about this? No, no, no. I I agree with you guys on this. So I I don't really have anything more to add. Perfect. Well, we can get on to combat where it says there have been a range of subtle changes to combat that add up to quite a few differences and cleaner fight phase. Changes include flexibility for picking targets when charging, which basically is like AOS, where you just roll the dice, then you get to select your target to charge. So you don't have to um and arm for ages about who you're gonna you're gonna take that risky 12-inch charge versus the safe five-inch charge. Changes to the activation order, where they basically say you do all your pile-ins first, then you do your fight phases, then you do your consolidations, so that mitigates some of the people charging, like trying to get towards objectives and things like that. I'm not necessarily sure how I feel about that one, but I guess that is fine. It doesn't really make a huge difference. And then they talk about fast dice rolling for dealing damage is the default, because historically everyone does technically well, everyone fast dice rolls out of expedience, but you're technically rolling each dice individually. So there are some instances where you slow the game down and go, okay, well, let's do these rolls one at a time because we've got to this certain character or whatever, but now you just fast dice roll over things, that speeds it up. Um oh actually, no, now they talk about the consolidation and piling. So the changes to the order of activation order was basically saying if you charge and you have fight first, you will fight first. Whereas currently, if you charge into someone that has fights first and you have fights first, you both have fights first, the defender gets the priority because it's not their turn, so they would actually fight before you, which is great for Sanesh. Um, but obviously that's seemingly too penalising, so getting rid of that, which which does make sense, I think. Um personally, I would rather it just be you alternate picking um things that are fighting, and you don't really have fights first for charging. Basically, I would make it more like AOS because I do find if everything charges in uh in your turn, it's just far too punishing. You your opponent is just as like dead, and then for before you get to fight back, basically, it's not great. Um so that to me would be a bigger change, but I they haven't implied they're doing that.

SPEAKER_00 2:43:33

Um Yeah, well what they put in the FAQ for that was they they're changing the order of activation to help balance the dominance of fight first units, but they don't go into more details. My hope would be they just they do take the that if you have fights first, you have fights first, but if you charge you don't get fights first, like AOS is what I think would be better. Because what you just described, the idea that they've discovered that if units have fights first, they fight before people who charge them is too powerful. It's like surely that's the point of the the rule for fights first. Yes. I think they I think they need to address fights first as a whole.

SPEAKER_06 2:44:07

If you get rid of fights first from charging, would also yeah, it solves that problem as well, right? If you combine them so but they haven't said they're gonna do that here, but maybe they don't want to announce that yet, or maybe they're just not doing it because it feels I don't know, better or something. 40k.

SPEAKER_00 2:44:25

We'll see, we'll see how they actually do it. I think the AOS system of combat is very good. One one again, one thing that they put in there about the yeah, fast rolling for damage. What they've said is that they were in the FAQ. So what's a fake about this? It went up. It went up today. It went up today, which is the which is the 26th of March for people who are tuning in to this the day of the recording, at least. Um they've said that there'll be a faster faster system uh for assigning wounds. My hope here is they just steal from AOS the idea that damn all damage spills over. Because that's the problem the reason it takes so long is because you have to micromanage every kind of attack based on what attacks you've got, who you're attacking. Weapons have to have different profiles. It's like do you do you have the sweep profile or the crush profile? When you could just have one profile if you didn't have to be thinking about how the wounds are being assigned to things. So I think they could they could be doing that.

SPEAKER_06 2:45:30

They could also do it like in AOS where you allocate um the wounds go on to the unit and not a model, and you only decide which model gets removed once you know the wound counters have gone up sufficiently. So it intercesses, okay, cool. I've taken two damage, I now pick which one of those models I elect to remove versus currently it's oh, I've got to place this dice next to a specific model that has taken that damage, but then there are instances where precision will go directly to the character and not the unit, and maybe those things might be able to change, or that or they because I I do like that that I don't need to worry in AOS which where that dice is, um it's just on that unit as a whole.

SPEAKER_00 2:46:16

I hope it's the AOS way of if it's so if you've got like weapons that do if you've got weapons that do one damage, it's not really an issue. But when you've got weapons that do multiple damage, so you've got weapons that do free damage against models that have got four health or something, and then you end up making multiple saves, and oh I failed one save. Well, I I'm not gonna take multiple saves because I need to keep making the saves for this you this for when one model dies, and which is bad enough when it's on feel well it it can be bad enough on Feel No Pains as well because you're assigning each one, each uh each attack is like this is two damage, but if I make the feel no pains, it doesn't it doesn't spill over to the next one. Everything is quicker if you just after you've done rolled all your wounds and then then the person who makes their say fails their saves that says this is how many wounds you've got to allocate to the unit, rather than you have to write all individually for the saves for how they get how you start taking models off because there's a difference between the amount of wounds caused per weapon, but versus the amount of health each unit, each model in the unit has.

SPEAKER_06 2:47:30

Yeah, I mean I guess it might be the way the bodyguard mechanic is working is now going to be slightly different, but um to to to aid that, because that's where it really comes in because you that's where you get these mixed toughness or mixed armor save units. Um but maybe you just go cool, you roll it on whatever the bodyguard is and hope the bodyguard is tougher. But I mean who knows? It's it's it's very vague at this stage. Um but yeah, I mean overall seems to be all quite sensible. The other thing they didn't mention here is they go stratagems can't stack anymore. So in each phase, basically a unit, each unit can have a stratagem put on them, which feels sensible, but it does make me wonder that there's probably a lot of detachments that are worded where it involves stacking multiple stratagems. So I guess those are the ones that are getting updated as part of the 70 to to uh remove that uh necessity or or remove update those stratagems that can get benefits from multiple um yeah, multiple stats tracks, because I think there are some where um it's cool. Your stratagem does this, but if it's already had this applied to it, it now also does this. It's like a a double double whammy. Well, I feel like the majority of those are maybe around uh uh detachment mechanics or army rules rather than other stratagems, but I can't can't say for certain. Um but yeah, I think that's it for all the rules I previewed, unless Richie, from your FAQ, was there anything else that we've somehow missed?

SPEAKER_00 2:49:12

I do like the like the fact that they are just uh potentially sticking their fingers up at the competitive scene in objective markets. I really hope that's true.

SPEAKER_07 2:49:21

Potentially.

SPEAKER_00 2:49:22

Because it definitely feels that way.

SPEAKER_07 2:49:25

It is a big market for them as well though.

SPEAKER_00 2:49:27

Yeah, well it's it's like you um always said I didn't want to I I I skipped over because I didn't want to get into a debate with Phil about it because it's getting late. Yeah. Because they put in the FAQs about unified experience, so there's not going to be match narrative and open play, there's just one way to play. And I really hope they are they do move away from the competitive objective market scene, which in theory they can do, because they've got to the point where they have completely absorbed the ITC and the competitive scene. It's gone. It's theirs now. It doesn't exist in it's in an independent form anymore. So if they wanted to say, yeah, we're not doing that anymore, someone would have to start it again. Right? Because there's no it's it's not like it already exists. They built this this this independent alternative to the way to play 40k took ye years to build up. Now everyone's just been playing 40k. They could totally do it. But I love the idea of they're not being objective markers, like pie plates on the board.

SPEAKER_07 2:50:30

I don't care how I am super excited about it.

SPEAKER_00 2:50:32

I don't care how tastefully designed they are. It's one of the few things I don't like about AOS. Even though the I I've got some of the official AOS markers, they're really nice. And I like the way that AOS uses them, but I would I'm so here for 40k without pie plates.

SPEAKER_08 2:50:48

But the thing is with AOS, like, I'm not I don't associate AOS with like a thematic board because I don't know enough about the law, right?

SPEAKER_00 2:50:56

It's well we've AOS has never had a theme has never had if iOS has always has has always had as a game system, it's always had pie plates.

SPEAKER_08 2:51:05

Yeah. Essentially. So it's it's been there from the start, whereas 40k hasn't.

SPEAKER_00 2:51:11

Did you ever did you ever see people play early, like first edition AOS Tim? Yeah, I was there. No, but did you see the size of the pie plates?

SPEAKER_08 2:51:20

Oh, they were really big, weren't they? They were huge.

SPEAKER_00 2:51:23

They were huge. Five inch or something? Five inch because you had like c had three inches and five inches. When some people had these like but huge, transparent perspective pie plates, it was ugly.

SPEAKER_06 2:51:36

Because it just covered most of the board. Was there anything else we wanted to say about uh not really 40 gate? I realised I I dropped off mid-talk because my laptop can't handle me changing tabs while recording at the same time, uh, it seems. I think I was just sort of talking about stratagem stacking. Did you catch any of that?

SPEAKER_00 2:51:55

Uh they put in the FAQ that stratagem that stratagem stacking is no longer a thing, or you can only use one stratagem per a unit can only be affected by one stratagem at a time or per phase probably, which I think is good. And that's I think that's it.

SPEAKER_06 2:52:08

Yeah. I think the bit I was trying to say before while I dropped off and didn't realise was um I imagine a lot of the updated detachments are ones where maybe stratagems are worded where they rely on other stratagms also being active potentially, which I think is quite rare, but there might be some, and that was my my theory. But yeah. What our thoughts on a length edition? Are we positive about it? Are we negative? Are we just we don't know it's too early?

SPEAKER_08 2:52:39

I'm I'm gonna sit in the camp of like it's too early. I was saying earlier that I'm gonna see how much stuff comes over from the age of six age of sigma game system. Like it's it feels like they are pinching bits from that, and I think the charge is the indication of that. Um but I'm excited, I'm excited to see what comes of this, and hopefully it will reinvigorate me to play more 40k.

SPEAKER_06 2:53:06

That's good. Yeah, I remember uh one time uh I was playing against Matt, I can't remember his surname, of the AOS uh designer. Uh and he was saying, Oh, what elements of 40k would you want in AOS? And my answer was none. Like I want 40k to have more elements of AOS because it's a better designed game. That's why we're that's why we're playing it, basically. So yeah, potentially if they are nabbing elements of AOS rules, I think that is probably a good sign for 40k.

SPEAKER_00 2:53:36

Um just nab everything except the double turn and we'll be good.

SPEAKER_06 2:53:39

Yeah, yeah, that can go. Um yeah. Richard, what are your thoughts on the 11th ed?

SPEAKER_00 2:53:46

I am cautiously optimistic about it. I remember I remember being really excited about 10th edition because one of the articles said there was going to be less re-rolls. And that because there was 9th edition had loads of re-rolls, there's gonna be less of that in tempt, which as as things transpired that was that was probably that didn't actually quite come out to pass as as as it was as definitely I I as I took it to mean in the same in the there was actually more re-rolls than ever before in 10th edition. So I'm cautious about how they are able to word things in the previews because they obviously can't get tell us everything that's going on. But the removal of pie plates, fighting over real battlefields and fighting over pieces of terrain like bunkers or ruins and places like that, that sounds really cool. Bringing over some of the ideas from AOS, that sounds exciting as well. Yeah, there's a it I think there's a lot that could be really cool from this, but I am cautious because I don't I I I've been disappointed before by getting overly hyped up by how things are kind of proposed. I'll be I I will be probably trying to avoid I'll try to avoid like more rules leaks. I say try, but I'll it'll be in my social feed, so I'll have to read up on it, no doubt. But I will I I really want to see be at the point where I can see all the rules in context.

SPEAKER_06 2:55:05

Right, yeah, because that was always the problem with the other editions is that they're drip feeding us rules, but we're not seeing the rules surrounding those rules for any kind of context as to how it plays, because it's like, oh yeah, cool, they've made this thing much stronger. You know, are saves now better, or is just AP getting worsened? Like, what's the deal? It's a bit hard to um Yeah, I think you are right to be cautiously optimistic. I do think because codexes are staying the same, there's only so much they can really change in the core rules without breaking the codexes. So so much of the game probably does have to be quite similar, and it is just little tweaks here and there that they're gonna be able to make, you know. So, but I mean, but maybe not. It'll be interesting to see. I would personally like to see more less, uh, maybe more universal special rules, but less reliable. Reliance on sustained hits and lethal hits, but unfortunately they're baked into the codexes, not the core rules. So, you know, maybe that there will be effectively two versions of the game once at launch, and then once all the codexes are sort of finally up to date and they've they they've tweaked how all the units work and they've maybe gotten rid of the egregious use of sustained and lethals, potentially. But one can hope, basically.

SPEAKER_00 2:56:27

I mean I mean we're just on the wording is you'll still be able to use your current codex in the new edition. So well that that could just mean that they're gonna give everyone a free update to the new edition.

SPEAKER_06 2:56:37

They could say you have a codex, but we are FAQing all the detached uh data sheets potentially.

SPEAKER_00 2:56:43

Yeah, well every every codex common uses the app, right?

SPEAKER_06 2:56:47

So if they can they did talk a little bit about the app as well in the live stream, so they're saying it's gonna have more language support. But I think that was really it, basically. But I think they will want to encourage people to use the app. So yeah, that's good. Yeah, Tim, any final thoughts before we leave?

SPEAKER_08 2:57:06

Let's just hope they make army sizes smaller somehow. Well, that should be doable.

SPEAKER_06 2:57:10

Yeah. And then Richard, do you have anything else?

SPEAKER_00 2:57:13

Raise yeah, like Tim said, let's raise the points of the units. I'm r I'm really yeah, I'm really excited. I like I love the idea of the battlefields looking like battlefields again, and I hope they can balance that new that kind of immersive narrative drive with whatever they need for the competitive scene as well. That's what I I want to see a good balance there because I'm really excited about having actual battlefields again. That's what that sounds really cool.

SPEAKER_06 2:57:36

Yeah. I think more narrative sort of elements to games. I always thought it'd be better to more separate out tournament play and narrative play, but maybe they're merging them together for that is hopefully going to be a good thing. Potentially, with terrain being such a feature in objectives, we will get new terrain kits to either come in coincide with the game or just at some point in the edition, that would be good. Yeah, the fact that you can keep our campaign books and they're still be working is really positive. Um I guess it's all too soon to tell, but overall quite positive about the experience, and other than the sort of technical difficulties of the reveal stream, I thought all the models were pretty good. Um obviously we've just talked about 40k here, uh, and we won't be talking about any of the others this episode, but we will move on to the end of the show, uh, where it'll probably just be me slugging it out for a brief goodbye. So we will transitional noise now. Uh well that is it for this episode. Uh it's been a very long recording. Uh it's a very late night. Um I would like to go to bed. So um I'll have a quick ramble about what I've been up to this week and last week. Obviously, I did the last episode, and then I um was editing that episode into smaller chunks to put out on the Beyond the Tabletop channel, which took quite a long time to actually get done in terms of video editing. Um, but it got done, which is good. Um, this episode hopefully will be a bit quicker to edit because uh well at least put together because there wasn't any preamble in terms of the presentation side of things. Uh, I feel like that design breakdown uh videos uh went down quite well. I feel like the content from this reveal show would also be great for a design breakdown episode, especially around those Imperial Guard tanks, although we talked about some of those elements during the show. So yeah, uh what else have I been doing? If you can see on the screen, I've been painting up an Inquisitor model, which is the old Erasmus uh Cartavona Cartavolus mini, but I've combined him with the base miniature of Huron Black Hearts, the popheary at the bottom. So instead of stabbing a demonic book, he's stabbing a space marine with demonic flames coming out of him. Um so that's been a fun little project. So that is for the 500 Worlds um campaign that I'm involved in. I think I talked about the last um 500 worlds that we've done. Since then, we've worked out who we are attacking next in that campaign. I am both attacking and defending against the Imperium. So I think I am attacking Dan with his Blood Angels, and then Spike with his ultra means will be attacking me, or vice versa. I can't remember which, but it doesn't make too much difference. But basically, I need to organize some games to play with them. Hopefully, I can get my Inquisitor painted up in time because that will be a useful addition to my army. That's what I've uh basically spent a lot of today working on finishing off that mini because I had to wait ages for that bit um of the Huron uh the Space Marine base. Basically, I had to wait for that to turn up. Um in other news, if you can also see behind me, I have two bits of artwork from WarhammerArt.com. Um, I've got an Inquisitor, um, which is a John Blanch sketch. Then I've got the old black and white Adrian Smith uh Huron versus the Emperor with the dead sanguiness uh down below. Uh so I got those two framed, um, which was quite cool. Um I got two frames. There was a pack from IKEA, I can't remember exactly which one it was called. But basically that allowed me to get frames for the artwork because the artwork is slightly smaller uh or slightly larger than A4. It's like a really odd shape. Um is it A4? A3, yeah. Yeah, A3. Slightly bigger than A3. However, the white frames that go around and go over the artwork um crop off ever so slightly on that kind of the the tops and bottoms, I believe, cropped off some of the artwork. So um I think on the Inquisitor I've lost John Blanche's signature that's hidden behind uh the frame. And then weirdly, the the artwork itself is too big for the frame. So I trimmed off five millimetres from the top and bottom with a knife, not damaging the actual artwork because there's a load of excess white space around, but it meant they could actually fit in the frames themselves, and that saved me like a hundred plus pounds by doing that rather than buying the official ones, which would maybe look sort of slightly nicer but was ridiculously priced. So, yeah, if I get some more artwork, I will probably do that. Personally, I would love much smaller bits of artwork. It's the one annoying thing about that Warhammer art um website is all the prints are the same size or bigger, like you can't get smaller than effectively A3, which is a shame because I'd love just some really small, you know, A6 size, I think. Yeah, really small pieces to have dotted around. I have some space, if you can see on uh the YouTube video. I've got a big blank space here in my wall in the shed where some more artwork is going to go. Uh I do have some tubes, which you can't quite see here. Hold on if I move the microphone. You can see just some uh some tubes of artwork. These are old pieces of artwork that I got from the old, I guess it was Warhammer art back back in the day, but they were massive pieces of artwork. They are pretty much like A2 or A1 in size. They're they're really big, they're like a meter across. That used to cost five pounds. That's how much it costs for a roll of artwork. One of which is the old second edition Warhammer 40k artwork. One of the others is a man of war. And then the other one is the I think third edition Blood Bowl, or maybe fourth edition, I can't remember which. So I've got three pieces of jumbo-sized artwork. I did measure them all to get them framed. They are each a slightly different size from each other, which is puzzling in and of itself. Um, so at some point I will probably get a frame that's large enough for all of them and just put them all in there uh and then just rotate which ones at the front, I think, at some point, assuming I can find a frame that's reasonably affordable to fit them all in. But they are also a bit wrinkly because as a kid I had them up on my wall and I squished them slightly. So I might need to, I don't know, iron them or something, or do do something that I can sort of flatten out the artwork in some way. I'm not really too sure how to do that. If anyone has a suggestion, please let me know down in the comments. Yeah, there's um if I had time, I would have maybe prepared some five-star reviews. I had some on YouTube videos, uh, which I am going to honour and read out, but I I just I've run out of time tonight, I'm afraid, and I'm dreadfully tired. So, yes, I'm going to go to bed now. I suggest you too also go to bed. Uh, so thanks very much. Uh, thank you for listening. Next episode, hopefully I will do the Aegis Sigmar reveals because there just wasn't time to do any of them from AdeptCon. If I'm lucky, I might do it next week, but I'll probably just keep the usual format and you will have to wait a fortnight for those to appear. And with luck, Tim and Richard will join me for those as well. So thank you for those two for coming to join me. Uh the usual like and subscribe, support me on Patreon and all of that lovely uh goodness. Uh by all means. Uh thank you very much. Good night. Sleep well uh and goodbye. Goodbye, everyone. Bye bye.