Living, Breathing Stories
Living, Breathing Stories is a podcast about faith lived out through real people and real stories.
Hosted by Deacon Leila Quinlan, each episode features a heartfelt conversation with a fellow church member or believer. Together, they explore the experiences, questions, challenges, relationships, and moments of grace that have shaped each person’s journey of faith.
Join Deacon Leila as she listens to the living, breathing stories of the people who make up our church community and discovers the many different ways God is at work in their lives.
Living, Breathing Stories
Emmie Chase
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This week, Leila has a conversation with Emmie about her faith formation.
You are listening to Living Breathing Stories. Join Deacon Leela Quinlan as she listens to the stories of the people who make up our church community and discover the many different ways God is at work in their lives.
SPEAKER_01Welcome once again to Living Breathing Stories. We know that the stories of God are contained in the Holy Scriptures, but we also call it Living Breathing Stories because those stories of faith and the journey that each of us has walks around with us. We are living breathing storytellers and story holders. So today it's my privilege to be with Emmy Chase. And um I know some of her story, but I'm guessing that today I might learn a few new things.
SPEAKER_04Let's hope so.
SPEAKER_01So thank you for being with us, Emmy. Thank you for having me. I'm excited to be here. Well, I love to start just by finding out more about, you know, some people are blessed to grow up in a faithful household where church is just part of the fabric. Some people don't. And some people find their their way in other, you know, at other times. So what about you? Did you grow up in a house that followed a particular faith tradition? What was that rhythm like if there was a rhythm? I had both. Okay. If that's an option. We have to talk about the Amy Grant thing. I j that just popped into my mind. Okay. If if you don't mind.
SPEAKER_04So um I grew up in an Episcopal church, and um my parents uh were really involved in the community, and um, we did not really do a lot of Sunday school. Um, so for my faith growth, I really just you know stared at the stained glass windows at church and didn't pay attention and didn't really, you know, understand a lot about God and Jesus. And um, but starting at a really young age, I had these glimpses of God and am so very thankful for that. When I was um around five or six, uh, my parents put me in the children's choir and um our choir master, Joseph Golden, um, was amazing. We would sit on the floor and just sing songs and worship songs and hymns, and I loved it, and I just felt at that early age um a presence of God and not really understanding it, but just this desire and uh love that was um surrounding me. And so I grew up and went to church and um around middle school, junior high, uh started doing mission trips with the church, and then my freshman year in high school got really involved in young life. Yeah, so kind of stopped going to church. Well, didn't stop going to church, but wasn't active in church.
SPEAKER_01And young life is a parachurch organization, it is, it is very well structured to help young people um fellowship together, learn Bible stories, and apply it to their lives, correct?
SPEAKER_04Yes, yeah, and it was so exciting for me because that was the first time I had a Bible and actually read it. Yeah, and I was like, oh my gosh, these wonderful stories. I don't know any of these Daniel and the Lions done. You know, these stories that we take for granted that we learn as children, I really didn't learn those until high school. And so it's very involved in young life and um Bible study there. So uh, but I also joined the adult choir at church. I love to sing and to worship, and I was the only high schooler in the adult choir, but loved that.
SPEAKER_01Um did you have to get special permission? I did. Because I was the only young person in our choir, in the Presbyterian church, and especially they were it was right around Christmas they were doing the Messiah, yeah, and I could not keep up, but I I just faked it the best I could. Sounds like you were very comfortable.
SPEAKER_04We have very similar paths, yeah. Yes, yes. Um, and high school was uh an amazing time of growth for me, just learning about Jesus and growing. And I was at a young life camp and decided at that point it was the summer between my sophomore and junior in high school. And I was like, okay, you know what? I love Jesus and I want to follow him, whatever that looks like.
SPEAKER_01Right.
SPEAKER_04So started the process of surrendering my life to his life and his calling on my life. And that summer I also went on a mission trip uh with our church to Costa Rica, and this is um where the story kind of takes a left-hand turn. On the mission trip, I became very sick.
SPEAKER_01Okay.
SPEAKER_04We were in Costa Rica and you know, I was working and getting eaten up by bugs and you know, all of that type of thing. And when I came home, I actually had mononucleosis.
SPEAKER_01Okay.
SPEAKER_04Um, but did you know that right away? Did they diagnose it quickly? They did. Okay. And um, which is very common for high schoolers to get that. The problem was I couldn't get over it. Okay. And antibiotics after antibiotics, I could not get well. And so finally, um, and I grew up in Georgia. My parents brought me here to Mayo. Because I've been Costa Rica to Costa Rica, they're like, is something else going on? She's not getting well. Um, and Mayo ran a bunch of tests, and they were like, it is minonucleosis, and she has a really like severe case of it. So they sent me back home and I was bedridden for three months because my spleen had been enlarged, and they were worried it would rupture. So during that time, my faith really changed. Uh, Ron Greiser was the associate rector at Trinity Episcopal Church in Columbus, and he taught me how to meditate on scripture and how to pray. And that just really resonated with me. And back then, I know it's hard for kids to uh realize, but we didn't have TVs in every room. You know, we had one TV in a den with a clicker and 12 channels. So it was not no cell phones. So you had time. I had time, I was stuck in bed for three months. Yeah. And so I would sleep and I would stare out my window and um meditate and listen to music, um, which is funny. Uh, our Amy Grant story. I used to love Amy Grant.
SPEAKER_01And was this around the time that you were really getting, really loving Amy Grant? Yes. And learning all her songs. Absolutely. And tell us what and what happened with your parents and how how they responded to that. I think they um didn't know what to do with me.
SPEAKER_04They my parents are very kind and loving and encouraging people. Um, but I was really um on fire for God. And I think they felt that was a bit uncomfortable for them. It was a bit extreme. And so I would just listen to Amy Grant singing worship songs in in my room. And um, I was involved in Bible study and choir and young life, and it was something every night, and I think that overwhelmed my parents. And so my mom came in one day and she was like, What are you listening to? And I was like, Oh, Amy Grant, mom, why? And she was like, What in the world? You know, so it was, I think, a lot for them to handle. Um, but I just felt that pull and that desire to to worship him and serve him. And so then went through college, continued young life, and graduated from college with an English major, still felt that call to serve the Lord. So I went on staff with Young Life. I did that in numerous positions in different cities, uh, Dallas, Asheville. I went on property staff at Wendy Gap, one of their camps.
SPEAKER_01Did they um did they ask you to move these different places or did you have some choice in where you were gonna go serve? I didn't really have a choice.
SPEAKER_04Well, I did have a choice, actually, because of David's job. We had gotten married uh right out of college. So I went where he went.
SPEAKER_01Okay.
SPEAKER_04So when I was in Dallas, so they plugged me in where I was. Okay. So when I when he was in Dallas, I was on staff in Dallas. Then we moved to Asheville, and then I worked in Asheville and then went to property staff. And then we moved back to Columbus, Georgia, where I'm from, and I applied for a job at my church as a youth director and loved it and um really thrived there. After that, um, we moved for David's job to Colorado, and um that is where I went to seminary and graduated with a master's in theology. And a funny, embarrassing story. Uh please tell us how I got to seminary um when I was youth directing. Tom Jones, who was the head pastor at our church, was like, Amy, I think you need to go to seminary. And I said, No, no, I don't feel like God is calling me to that. And being an outspoken person, I told him that. Not probably, not probably, I'm sure it was not gracious. And I said, God hasn't told me that. You've misheard, you know. And then a year later, had to call him back and say, Okay, Father Tom, um, I do think God wants me to go to seminary, and I need you to write me a recommendation. So that was definitely eating some humble pie.
SPEAKER_01So let me ask you this. What was it um you think did you feel already equipped to do everything you were doing? What was it that made you feel like you didn't maybe need that further education? And then what was it that convinced you that you did?
SPEAKER_04It was my lack of understanding. I thought if you went to seminary, you had to become a priest. I had no idea that there were so many options. And once I uh we were living in Colorado Springs, which has the headquarters for young life, the headquarters for compassion. Right. Uh Fuller Seminary has a branch there, which is where I went. Um, and I started getting information and realized I always felt passionate about small intimate um walking together with people, um, shepherding.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_04Um, and so I didn't feel like I needed seminary to preach to the masses. That was not my desire. Yeah. But when I started hearing about spiritual direction, yeah, um, things like Ko-High, yeah, Community Hope of International, where you were um wholly listening and walking with people in everyday life, I was like, oh, that's what I want to do.
SPEAKER_01So would you say that at first your conception of the way that seminary could equip you was too narrow? And then once you figured it out that even if you were weren't gonna be a minister or a priest in the formal sense, that it would equip you for the many different ways that you might serve God.
SPEAKER_04Yes, absolutely. I had no idea. Yeah, I just thought you went to seminary, you became an ordained priest. I thought that's what that was for. Yeah. Boy, was I wrong. And I'm so thankful. Um so yes, then I learned um and got a spiritual direction uh certificate, which back then this was oh gosh, was that 20 years, 25 years ago? They didn't even have like now they have masters of spiritual direction, which I'm like, oh my gosh, I missed out on that.
SPEAKER_01They didn't have spiritual direction international, they didn't, which is our overarching organization. Yes. And it was very hard to even find a spiritual director or a spiritual companion then because it was more word of mouth.
SPEAKER_04Absolutely. So even when I was at Fuller Seminary, they did not have any type of certificate or program for spiritual direction, but they allowed me to go to Denver Seminary, okay, who did have spiritual direction, and so I was doing classes actually at both both seminaries.
SPEAKER_01Now, did you have any kids yet at this point? No. Okay. Dave and I were married, so you could devote lots of time to this. Yes, and you need it. Yes.
SPEAKER_04When you're doing that type of intensive study, yeah. You know, there's a lot of research and writing papers, and you need every ounce of brain cell possible. Yes.
SPEAKER_01I'm wondering if we might switch gears a little bit. Um, I met you I don't know how long ago, but I do have a very um vivid memory of a conversation that we had where I was asking you to do something or to join me in in leading something, and you told me that it probably wasn't the right time. And that was at least 10 years ago. Yes. And but we talked about the kinds of things that you would hope to do one day. And I remember thinking, oh, I have to wait. And so I I want to talk to you about waiting and about your experience of waiting on God until the timing for something is right. Absolutely.
SPEAKER_04One of the hardest things, you know, don't put the cart before the horse. Um, I remember that very vividly. And um, I think I've even told you before, I feel like I have always been a race horse who is on the track, ready to go, and the gate's closed. And I'm waiting for that gate to open.
SPEAKER_01Uh-huh.
SPEAKER_04And I'm ready to be productive and fruitful and do all the things that God wants me to do, and that gate's not opening.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_04And um through that process, I have learned um that we have to wait on God. It is his timing and it is his work, not ours. Um, I have struggled with um, I have an autoimmune disease, which stems back to the mono that I had in high school.
SPEAKER_03Okay.
SPEAKER_04Um, and when you and I met, it was rearing its head. So it's chronic fatigue syndrome, um, which means I have um a faulty cell phone battery. Okay. So it's like it runs out very quickly. Very quickly. And through the process of that, um, learning how to listen to my body, learning how to pay attention to God when He says go and when He says stop, and learning how to manage my very limited energy envelope. Um, and with that, um, I became very ill, I think it was about 15 years now, right along the time that you and I were I was hoping to do spiritual direction and get really involved here. Um, I became sick again and was bedridden for about a year. Um, and at this time I had two little children in elementary school. And it was extremely difficult.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_04Um, because I couldn't do anything. I didn't have the energy to take them to school, yeah, didn't have the energy to pick them up, like functioning really was just not happening. And so that there again, it gave me a lot of time to be angry at God and say, why is this happening? I'm trying to serve you, you know, to I can't even care for my family, yeah. Um, dealing with depression. Um if I can't physically do anything, what is my self-worth? And where does the doing and being the doing and being. Our culture is you are successful if you do. Right. So what does that mean for me when I can't do?
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_04And what does it mean when my value is in doing? So I had to shift completely to my value in being that God loves me not because I do.
unknownYeah.
SPEAKER_04He doesn't even love me if I'm fruitful. Yeah. He loves me because he created me. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Period. And that's hard. That is so hard. There's some people that struggle with that idea for much of their lives, if not all of their lives, that a dichotomy or duality of if I do do do, if I am successful at all these things, if I'm busy, uh, then I'm doing, then I'm I'm gaining uh maybe favor with the Lord. Knowing, but knowing maybe deep down that we are not earning God's love, that God loves us unconditionally, and that God knows us better than anyone. So God knows if we if we need to rest in bed. Absolutely. And would want us to do that, right? Yes, yes, yeah, but shifting that um from the cultural view or the world's view, you know, the the uh rewards that we get, the external reward for being a very productive person, yes, to only caring or caring the most about who we are in God. And absolutely, yeah. And it's a struggle. And I'm guessing um that CFS and some other autoimmune diseases are not obvious to the people you're around. So that must have been hard because I'm guessing that people might have been judgy when you said, I can't be the room mom this year. Yes. Or Leela, I can't teach that Sunday school. Well, it was Catherine, I can't teach that Sunday school class. Right. Yeah.
SPEAKER_04And it is a hidden illness. Yeah. Because I look normal on the outside. Yeah. I look great, I look full of energy, and twice a day I have to lay down for an hour because I won't function if I can't. Yeah. If I don't do that. Um, yeah, it was very difficult because you know, and I'm not very forthcoming about telling people about it or have not been in the past. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01Um how did you know when how how did you feel it or experience it when you were are ready to do more? Because there was a time when you came to me and said, I think it's the right time for me to re-engage or to engage more deeply in what God is doing here in this place. It's very slowly.
SPEAKER_04So as I started learning more about um, I love that verse. I was telling Caleb earlier, it's uh John 15, 5, where Jesus says, I am the vine and you are the branches. Remain in me, and I will remain in you. And um, and he talks about how we will be fruitful, and then he says, Apart from me, you can do nothing. Yeah, and the main part of that verse is not the fruitfulness, it is the remaining. And when we tune our radio to hear God and to try to discern where He's guiding us and directing us, then each day you can take a step and say, Okay, Lord, what who do you want me to encounter today? How can I show your love today? How can I be that conduit to lift somebody or encourage somebody? And even if you don't have any energy, you can compliment the person at the grocery store or you know, try to encourage somebody if I don't have the energy to teach a Sunday school class. Um so it through that illness, I learned um how to slowly. You know, listen to God and follow where He's leading. And through that process as well, David researched and found a path for me for chronic fatigue to help heal me, but not completely, to help me expand that energy envelope. And it's interesting with, you know, when Peter says, you know, he has the thorn in the side, you know, Lord, remove this. And of course, we always pray for healing, but sometimes God says no. So what do we do when God says no? And I struggled with that because God was like, Nope, you're gonna have this for the rest of your life. And and I was like, why, Lord? Why? And I felt like he was saying, Because I want you to remain in me. I want you to be my person that is available to pray when I call you to pray. I want you to be available for a stranger that's hurting that you meet in the grocery store. So you won't be rushing home. You can stop and say, Let's pray about that, or let me hear more about that.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_04So um that staying connected to the vine and really trying to say, okay, God, I don't want to do anything that would not be beneficial for you, that would not be loving, but also that would not spend my energy on something that's wasteful.
SPEAKER_01Speaking of which, I remember um it's funny as we're talking, different things are popping up in my mind. I remember specifically at the beginning of a summer several years ago, we ran into each other at the Hallmark store. And um you were about to go to Europe hiking with your family, and I think we were moving Parker to Chicago, and you've you just as we were talking, you said, Well, is there anything I can pray for you about? So I told you that, and then you told me about your family going to Europe hiking, and we said, Yes, we're gonna pray for each other, and you actually pulled out your phone, and anybody that knows Emmy knows that she does this, you made a note about who it who it was, what the prayer request was, and it signals, you know, many people say, I'll pray for you. But you when you do that, you signal to people that you're actually gonna do it. And then the other thing is you follow back with the person. So um, God has certainly given you the ministry of prayer, and I'm so grateful for that.
SPEAKER_04Oh, well, thank you. I do try, I don't always succeed, um, but you will laugh because I do, I still have that list, and it goes back like four years.
SPEAKER_03Yeah.
SPEAKER_04And I will just start praying and then I'll come across a prayer. I have no idea who they are. Uh-huh. I'm like, okay, I don't know who this person is, Lord. I don't remember how I got their name or what their request really is. But you're lifting it up to you again. Yes, and God knows that you've got it, even though I don't remember.
SPEAKER_01Let's talk uh a little bit before we close up about this idea of looking for God's guidance and hearing God and intuiting or discerning God's will. Because especially, I mean, some of us are used to hearing that language, but it is very kind of coded language in Christian circles, especially for someone who does not have um that kind of background to know what that means, how would you? This is a hard question. Somebody that does not have a rich Christian tradition to pull from, but really does want to know how to communicate with God, how to how to get that guidance from God that we all hope to have, how might you say to that person what that is? Oh that is a very difficult question, but what a joy.
SPEAKER_04Because we don't limit God, God speaks through everything, whether it's a sunrise at the beach, you know, if you are grieving and you're sad and you go take a walk on the beach and you see, you know, some birds or the ocean waves, and it gives you that joy. That's the Lord pouring into you. If you are, you know, looking at beautiful paintings in an art museum and you feel that joy, that's God pouring into you. If you are enjoying a glass of wine with a bunch of friends, that is God pouring his love into you through your community and through friends. It's not about um God necessarily speaking to us, it's us opening our eyes and seeing where he already is. Yeah, he already is giving us love when we see a butterfly in the butterfly garden or when you hear a child laugh. Yeah, it I feel like so much of the time we miss it because we're too busy to slow down and see it. And also in Christian communities, I feel like a lot of times we make it ooh, like yeah, too woo-woo too woo-woo, too, you know, mystical or spiritual or what have you. But no, God is with us every day. He created everything, yeah, so he can show up through music or through, you know, anything that brings joy through a puppy dog, or you know, I've had some conversations with people too where they had no clue what I was maybe going through at the time, and they would say something, and I was like, that's what I needed to hear.
SPEAKER_01And they had no clue. And not even there was no reason to even bring attention to it except to notice.
SPEAKER_04Right.
SPEAKER_01Oh, there's there it is. There it is. There's what I needed. There's that encouragement or that guidance. Yeah.
SPEAKER_04And the thing that makes me laugh so much, especially being in a Christian community, when you read the old testament, God uses people who wouldn't even acknowledge him. Yeah, he uses people who were rejecting him, and he's like, Oh, yeah, you think, but watch how I'm gonna use you. Yeah. And it always makes me chuckle because God uses everything and everybody. Yeah, we just have to slow down to notice.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, that is wonderful. I'm so glad that you were willing and able to spend this time today because you haven't packed your schedule too full. You could come and be here, and um, you're usually at centering prayer, you're usually at contemplative book study, and um you're helping coordinate the healing prayer ministry. So I'm just grateful that this is a time in your life where you do have good energy, and also that you're watching that and paying attention to how much you do and how how much rest you might need. Absolutely. It's a really good model for everyone.
SPEAKER_04Yes, a balance, yes, you know, we have to keep balance in our lives. And I think it was even Father Tom that preached one Sunday on make sure you have margins. Yes, you know, if we make if we don't fill our life to the edges of our you know, being and we leave room, yeah, we have that flexibility uh flexibility to kind of see God moving and see where he wants us to go.
SPEAKER_01I really like that um image because none of us take out a notebook and write from one corner all the way to the edge of the page. So having those margins.
SPEAKER_04Why do we do that with our life? Why do we pack in from the time we wake up to the time we go to bed?
SPEAKER_01I think it's that false belief that the more productive we are, the better we are, or the more loved we are, and that is a lie.
SPEAKER_04It is.
SPEAKER_01I think we've we've yeah, I think. You can rest in him. Yes, yeah. Well, thank you for having me. Thank you for being with us.
SPEAKER_04Always enjoy coffee time with Leela. I will never miss that.
SPEAKER_01Well, friends, we thank you for being with us today, and we look forward to having you again on Living Breathing Stories. Thank you. Thank you.