Jamie Geller is BACK!! "I Saw What Fame Does to People"

www.moraledge.com

Chanale sits down with Jamie Geller to talk about fame, faith, Israel, and what people don’t see behind the spotlight.

Jamie had the career people dream about: CNN, red carpets, and celebrity interviews. But after seeing what that world really does to people, she chose Shabbos, Torah, family, and a mission deeper than applause.

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Listen on Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/7ceq9fSrTwrffva8qftmSy

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:00

So I cannot keep Shabbat and keep my job. So I walk into my boss Scott's office and I tell him, like, I'm leaving, and no one leaves willingly. And he was like, good luck, Jamie. Ever finding a job in the TV industry with this new Shumer Sabbath thing of yours? I stand on the red carpet holding the mic in my hands. Camera is next to me, capturing my interview with Beyonce, Ben Affleck, Wenneth Paltrow, Kate Hudson, Eminem, Snoop Dogg, Babs. I interviewed Barbara Walters herself. This life of working in TV and television in Hollywood, it takes everything from you, including your relationships. Once you've seen it, behind the curtain, you know what it's all about. You know that nothing is real, it's all fake.

SPEAKER_00 0:39

It's not the need for attention. It is the recognition that Hashem gave us the talents to communicate and inspire other people. We are vessels. Like you said, it's a shame not to use it. It's a responsibility to use it.

SPEAKER_02 0:51

I always say at the backdrop of the Western Wall, we're heaven and earth meeting.

SPEAKER_00 0:54

You could have been sitting anywhere. You're sitting across the coatel.

SPEAKER_02 0:58

It literally has come full circle. Yeah, I could have been at NBC Studios at Rockefeller Plaza, and now I'm at H Studios at Western Wall Plaza. And October 7th happened. He said, Jamie, could you introduce this evening and get on in front of the cameras and in front of the live stream and in front of millions?

SPEAKER_00 1:15

You became Jamie from Israel. Jamie from Ash Torah.

SPEAKER_02 1:19

Thank you, God, every day that I live here, and I would never want to live anywhere else.

SPEAKER_00 1:27

I'm Hanala, and this is the weekly squeeze on Marl Edge. I want to introduce you to a five-year-old girl performing on a stage in the Schubert Theater in Philadelphia. She's the only child in the adult dance troupe. The lights are on, the audience is watching, and during that performance, something magnificent falls into place that will drive almost every decision she makes for the next 40 years. She described it herself recently, and I could totally relate. She says, I'm addicted to applause. I was hooked before I had words for it. That five-year-old grew up to be Jamie Geller. And before you think you know where this is going, hang on. Because Jamie Geller is one of the most genuinely complicated people in the Jewish public world. And the easy version of her story, the cheerful queen of kosher, who made Aliah and found God and built an empire and now runs media for Aish. Well, that version leaves out almost everything worth talking about. So let's start at the beginning. She grew up in Pennsylvania in a Jewish home that wasn't particularly observant, attended Hebrew Academy, then went to NYU to study broadcast journalism and Hebrew literature. Graduated Magna Kamlade, PHI beta kappa. I don't even know these terms. I went to SEM. Landed at HBO, then CNN, then Food Network. By the time she was in her late 20s, she had a career. Most people would spend their whole lives trying to build. And then she became religious. The way it tends to happen when someone of Jamie's intensity discovers something all the way in. And almost immediately she channeled that same energy that she had been giving into the television production, into food. Because food was the container she found for everything she wanted to say about Jewish life. Joy of Kosher launched in 2010. Cookbooks followed, seven of them bestsellers, a PBS Hanukkah special, a million followers, five million, a billion followers, a billion video views. The New York Times called her the Jewish Rachel Ray, CBS called her the queen of kosher. I call her my friend Jamie the Queen. And somewhere in the middle of building all that, um, she wrote a letter in The Times of Israel that most people in her position would never put in writing. She wrote, I am a person whose faith, whose trust in God, and joie de vivre wavers on a regular basis. I fall asleep at night feeling like a failure. Realizing I could have been a better daughter, wife, mother, and citizen of the world, I neglected myself and my relationships in the name of my career. That's not the queen of anything. That's a real feeling person. In 2012, she made Aliyah, packed up her family, husband, Nachem, six kids, the whole media operation, and moved to Beitchemesh. And if you think running a media empire from a new country wall, raising six kids, and figuring out where to buy the right size garbage bags is easy. You have not made Aliyah. She built anyway, kept building. And then in 2021, Aish came calling. She's now their chief of media. Jamie Keller, I'm so happy you had time to make it today.

SPEAKER_02 4:45

I have to tell you, I was in a bad mood today.

SPEAKER_00 4:47

And I reply?

SPEAKER_02 4:49

I literally have chills everywhere to like hear my life story, which I obviously know so well because I lived it, but through your eyes and through your words, literally my hair is standing on edge at Moral Edge. That exactly.

SPEAKER_00 5:02

That's what we're doing at Moral Edge. We are bringing our audience, people who live here, real, true, patriotic Israelis, and we're breaking down their stories, who they are, their struggles, the complexities of living here, and just what keeps them going. Because, girl, you are going. We both are, by the way.

SPEAKER_01 5:23

We're both going.

SPEAKER_02 5:23

And if you call me a patriotic Israeli or you said that's what your like guest list looks like, is it ever funny? Like the first time I read on Wikipedia that I'm like an Israeli American or an American Israeli, I was like, I'm Israeli? Like that's so crazy. Even though, of course, I have my identity card. Of course I'm a citizen. But do you get like, do you wear that title very easily?

SPEAKER_00 5:41

So people, when I tell people I do hasbara, Israelis, they're like, wow, call a cavot. I'm like, you're giving me credit for, but yes, every bro every person who lives here and and contributes and plays a role is a card-carrying Israeli. And the Israelis can respect it. It doesn't matter what language you think or do math in. Correct. You, my friend, have a new show, a filmed rooftop of the Aish World Center with the coatel in the background talk show called No Reservations. So we just renamed it Breaking News Here. Breaking News Here. Okay, perfect. I'm gonna put a link in the show notes so people can watch it. Thank you. You had Nissan Black on. You spoke about his life growing up in a drug house. Eve Barlow was on. She spoke about her um professional life being destroyed for telling the truth. And you ask every guest the same question. What breaks you? Yeah. Okay. Which tells us something. You don't ask that question unless you're deep and you thought hard about that. Yeah. That that answer. So let's talk a little bit about the person behind the the brand. Um, starting with filling in people, how you grew up and became a religious mom.

SPEAKER_02 6:48

So um you told the story that I love the stage at age five. My mom actually went to sign up for dance classes in Center City, Philadelphia. And I was just waiting in the waiting room and I was bored, and I heard the music and I started dancing. And that's when the choreographer saw me and he said, I want her to be in my show. And I was the only child in the pro adult performing dance troop called The Waves, and I was the only soloist there. And that's when I fell in love with the stage. And so I love the stage and I loved my life also. I went to a nice Jewish day school. We marched every year in this really day parade. Such a fond memory in Philadelphia and something that I brought my kids to later on in life when we lived in Manhattan and New York City. And um, I just learned about like being a strong, outspoken, proud, young Jewish woman. My grandparents were survivors of the Holocaust. My parents were born in Europe after the Holocaust. They moved from Transylvania to Pennsylvania. My mom started a group, Children of Survivors of the Holocaust, to help like children of survivors cope with everything that they were dealing as first generation born to Holocaust survivors. So just like Jewish history, Jewish identity, a love of Israel was very much part of our life. So then I head to NYU to go become famous. So you're like, why? What's the connection? So basically, even though I can dance really, really well, my mom did not want me to be a chorus girl. She didn't think there was like a lot of money in that, or like a nice future for a nice Jewish girl. And unlike you, Hanala, I feel like I'm always in confession with you. Like every time I see you, I remind you, I can sing.

SPEAKER_00 8:14

So I was just gonna say, I can't dance. Like the thought of me dancing. We complete each other. Exactly. The thought of me dancing in public is enough to that's a horror show. So, but I understand the the the the desire to express yourself. Yeah. So one is through emotion, one is through your vocal cords, just different.

SPEAKER_02 8:32

Yeah, but like a better career if you can sing and act if you want to be famous, and just if you could dance.

SPEAKER_00 8:36

Well, it's always good to have the gift of gap, to use your to use your mouth. That's for sure. The moneymaker.

SPEAKER_02 8:41

But I'm I'm for sure. Um boy, have we worked on that. Yes. Yes. But um, so I head to NYU because I'm thinking I want to be famous, but I can't sing or act for my life. So what am I gonna do? I decided I'm gonna become a broadcast journalist. I grew up with my mom watching Oprah and Barbara Walters, and Barbara used to do Babs, we called her. Um she used to do a yearly special at the end of the year, like the 10 most fascinating people of the year. And she would pick the top three to interview, and we would be like gallowed to our seats. I love it.

SPEAKER_00 9:08

She was so glamorous. Yeah, the show was glamorous and the whole thing.

SPEAKER_02 9:11

She becomes famous in her own right just by interviewing famous people.

SPEAKER_00 9:14

She's an amazing journalist.

SPEAKER_02 9:16

Yes, yes. And just she knew how to like pull the story out of someone and make them feel so comfortable and say things that they would never say anywhere else. And the whole thing, I was like, I could do that, you know? So I head to NYU to study broadcast journalism. And it's also, though, like this industry, not about where you go to school and your alma mater, not about the five beta cap or the GPA or the accolades of like, you know, what you graduate with, it's about the industry is about who you know.

SPEAKER_00 9:41

So I was gonna say is luck, where you end up, who you end up connections, connections, networking and who you know.

SPEAKER_02 9:47

And I knew that from a very young age. So after my freshman year in the summer, I called up the person who I knew to get me an internship at CNN. And so I called up, her name is Lori, and this is how I know Lori. You've got to hear this. My mother's best friend growing up, Betty's ex-boyfriend Sam, is on his second marriage to Bonnie, whose daughter from the first marriage is Lori, who I met outside the bathroom at Russia Shana Services like four years ago. She said to me, I work at CNN. Look me up when you get to New York.

SPEAKER_00 10:14

Even if that's not Buch Shared, if that's not directly from guys.

SPEAKER_02 10:17

It's like twins separated at birth. Lori and I. I called her up, and true to her word, she got me an internship at CNN. So I think I'm landing like international news, CNN. Like, I know not on day one, but I want to be like involved with like decision makers, world leaders, politicians. And I know at the beginning I'll have to make coffee and like, you know, take people to the makeup chair, but I thought like I'm an international news. What was the But Lori worked in Showbiz today in entertainment news? So I end up at the Oscars, the MTV Music Awards, the Beach One Fashion Awards, interviewing everyone.

SPEAKER_00 10:46

See, are there video clips of this? Because I've never seen them. Or have you not released it? No.

SPEAKER_02 10:49

Um basically I'm a producer. So what does that mean? I stand on the red carpet holding the mic in my hand. So my handwritten is very famous. So you're exactly the camera is next to me, okay, capturing my interview with Beyonce, Ben Affleck, Wenneth Paltrow, Kate Hudson, Eminem, Snoop Dogg, Babs. I interviewed Barbara Walters herself. I was like, that was my most famous. Like it was, it was just an amazing, amazing life. So you see.

SPEAKER_00 11:13

How old were you at that time?

SPEAKER_02 11:14

At that time I was 18. I was 18.

SPEAKER_00 11:16

Okay, so when you were 18, I was, and when I was 18, about that same time, we were living completely parallel, like different lives. Yes. You were in New York. No, I was in Florida. I mean Florida girl. I had got to, I was in, I finished seminary, I think I went to Hawaii on Schluchos. I was in the Shirk scene.

SPEAKER_02 11:33

At one point in the story, you got to New York, though. I thought I remembered.

SPEAKER_00 11:36

No, I was in New York for a couple years. I was saying my my world at that time as a religious woman was maybe one day I'll be like, you know, I'll be a singer in the religious world. Right. I can't even imagine having those aspirations or even having the that the that those opportunities at such a young age. But if you don't live the religious life, anything's possible.

SPEAKER_02 11:59

Anything's possible. I just told this story recently that I had forgotten for so many years, but I was at the VH1 Fashion Awards in Bono, the lead singer of U2, just like grabbed me and hug me. And he said, actually said the weirdest thing. I think he was on something, but he says to me, like, stay innocent, my darling, stay innocent.

SPEAKER_00 12:13

I bet they loved you though in that business. Because you're so wholesome and natural and charming and friendly. Well, I love people.

SPEAKER_02 12:21

I love life. Right. I I do love life.

SPEAKER_00 12:24

And you connect to people on their stories.

SPEAKER_02 12:26

Very much so. And I and I want to connect on a on a soul level, on a deeper level. And I love that. I loved interviewing people. I interviewed Giselle Bunch in there. Like she's now, you know, like quite famous zipper bottle. I'm saying, like, it was really unbelievable. I had the opportunity to meet and interview so many people.

SPEAKER_00 12:40

And what are you gathering? What are what is being garnered from speaking to these people whose entire lives revolve around materialism, acquiring more wealth, their looks, looking beautiful, the superficial things that we know don't really provide true satisfaction. So what what what did that have a role? Did that play a role in in triggering you to find the shadow to find Judaism?

SPEAKER_02 13:04

Exactly what expedited my spiritual journey. Who knows if I would have gone like that?

SPEAKER_00 13:09

Like you met Puff Daddy and you're like, I'm out. Yeah, he was Puff Daddy, and then he was P.

SPEAKER_02 13:13

Diddy. Now he's Sean Duddy. Whatever it is, I don't have anything to do with that. Oh, now I mean horrifying. I know.

SPEAKER_00 13:18

You see, now it's funny. Here we are a couple decades later. We are seeing the fallout. We are seeing what happened to Britney Spears. I wanted to be Britney Spears. I'm embarrassed to admit it.

SPEAKER_02 13:27

Well, it's so funny. We're so connected on such a like deep level because my sister always says, like, that I could have been Britney Spears because I was a good dancer, and you could use auto tune. You don't need to sing it. You could use auto-tune for your voice. You know, we kind of let you know that. And I just and I have the stage presence, and she actually used to say, like, to my mom, like, you ruined Jamie's life because she could have been the next Britney Spears.

SPEAKER_00 13:49

I know, but the irony She saved my life. She saved your life.

SPEAKER_02 13:52

We all know it now. I'm just saying. That was like us, you know, at 18, 20 years old, like, you know, thinking that we know the answer to what we're doing.

SPEAKER_00 14:00

Don't get me wrong, Britney Spears' money would not be.

SPEAKER_02 14:03

I don't know. But it's not worth it. It's not worth it. You have to pick up, there's a Yiddish saying, you have to pick up the whole pecola. You have to pick up the whole package. You can't just take the money. You have to take the failed marriages, the mental instability, the estrangement from the family, from her own children, the drugs, the alcohol, living now alone, how many divorces, more than we can count. You want that money? The money comes with that. That's the crazy thing. Like, and that's what's so hard to separate because they're even so, like, and the real train wreck and disaster that our life is, they're still an allure like, I want that money. Oh, I want that house. Oh, I want that body.

SPEAKER_00 14:37

Because they are in the business of making it look so appealing. Now we could this is we could cross this over to social media where influencers became the new celebrities. Yes, yes. And they depict this perfect life that revolves around what they're buying and where they're going and what they have. And even though we are already, let's say, a decade in to knowing that social media is not what you see, it's all smoke and mirrors, you still can't help but think that you but to compare and to be affected by it. So even if you know it doesn't mean that you're even if you know it doesn't mean you're immune.

SPEAKER_02 15:08

Right. And jealousy is probably so probably one of the most powerful like traits that um characteristics that we have that are the hardest to overcome. Right. And even when you know, you still like fool yourself as you're watching it. And every single time there's a fall from grace from a celebrity, that's one of the things we did at CNN, is we would help lift them up and make them a huge star. And then we would rush to cover them. Correct, exactly. And their fall from grace. Literally. And everybody experienced it. And it's literally almost just a matter of time. And even so, we still still like glamorize.

SPEAKER_00 15:43

So just for people watching, I gotta ask, in your most difficult moments, what and we all have them, whether they're uh financially, family issues, the wars in here in Israel, your career, ups and downs, all the challenges of being a religious mom. And a woman in this. And a woman in general in this world. But I'm saying specifically this lifestyle. Yes, okay. Have you ever, ever thought a tiny tiny, I just want to hear you say it out loud. Wouldn't that wouldn't that it have been cool to maybe be a superstar in that other world? Because you could have. You could have been Megan Kelly, and then we wouldn't have to be listening to Megan Kelly. Yeah, Baron.

SPEAKER_02 16:21

Do you see how she turned on us?

SPEAKER_00 16:22

I don't listen. I don't say she's turned on us. I don't try I try not to take it personally. I just think there's a whole um deluge of of of anti-Semitic you know, conversations that are happening between all these think tanks. I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 16:38

I used to be a regular on her show. I went on for every single Jewish holiday when she had the Megan Kelly show and the hour on the on NBC.

SPEAKER_00 16:45

I thought she was juice.

SPEAKER_02 16:46

And let me just tell you, I believe it. She had such a love. Being just like a New York cosmopolitan woman, such a love for the Jewish people and the culture and the holidays. I know friends of hers, she so warmly embraced me on her show.

SPEAKER_00 16:59

Semitism is a virus, it is a mind virus, and no one is, like you said, immune. Yeah. Even Mali Megan Callie is deceptive. That's the bottom line. I and I really feel that and I and I'm not the type of person that would call her out to her face.

SPEAKER_02 17:11

I mean, uh, you've always been very um um like confident. Yes, and you've been able to speak like to Candace like that. Like I feel like I never could do that.

SPEAKER_00 17:22

It's not that. I just I I'm a really I'm a people's person. Yeah and I'm a people pleaser. Yeah. So I always assume people have their best, you know, my best interests, their best interests just people are good. Yeah. So I I lead with that assumption too. Right. But you you have to have a when you deal with these people, not not everyone's coming at it the same way we are.

SPEAKER_02 17:42

I know, but I think that if you don't lead with that assumption, that's when you change. And okay, I'll be disappointed by someone else and I'll be surprised. But I want to I didn't sell myself out. I want to assume the best in others. That's an important character trait to hold also. Well, we need to rid ourselves of jealousy. We need to still go in with a a good eye, a positive think of people in a positive light, assume the best. I'm not saying in a in a vulnerable, um, irresponsible way, but I'm just saying Well, why don't people do that for Israel?

SPEAKER_00 18:11

That's what I wish. I wish people would just look at Israel with a with with a more positive frame and and give us a little more credit and and just stop pulling us apart and scrutinizing us. I mean, even I get I get that Megan Kelly is America first, and I get that she's part of she's not just it's not just her voice, she's part of a whole team and a whole messaging system. But yeah, well, I mean, I was hopeful that her that that that her ideas would be consistent with ours, but you know, like you said, it's it's it's not it's it's it's a fake world, and we cannot assume that people have good intentions or are not motivated by nefarious reasons, unfortunately, and you've seen that behind the curtains. So let's so so you step out of that world, there's so much going on. I I'm already thinking in my world, you're not so much Jamie the chef and the cook and the the I had a whole life before that. I know, but and after that too. Then after that too. So I'm like, there's so many chapters we have to get to. Secret for episode 19 with Jamie Geller. Okay. So you have me back? Yes, of always. So you step out of this this world. Was there any like did they know you were becoming religious? Like, what was any was there anyway?

SPEAKER_02 19:27

So the issue is my mom was so pleased and so proud with my career. Like I didn't become a chorus girl, but I'm like rubbing elbows with the biggest celebrities known to man at the time. But she also really wanted me to find a nice Jewish guy to settle down with. And she didn't think I'd find him at the after parties of the Oscars, you know, or the after-after party.

SPEAKER_00 19:46

Right, but not like the ones you want to settle down with, people's nice Jewish home with.

SPEAKER_02 19:49

Exactly. And so uh she didn't want me to meet the wrong guy in the wrong place. So she sent me to these young professional Jewish singles events at Aish on the Upper West Side in Manhattan. And I went there and they would speak about uh there'd be a class about the weekly Torah portion and how you could apply it to your life and make yours a better, like we said before wife, daughter, future spouse, woman, citizen of the world, etc. They were just so they were speaking to young professionals. They knew who they were speaking to, and they made the Torah portion relevant. So it wasn't just this like old-time history book, but like, wow, this could help me in my life today. And then after there's like sushi and wine and mingles, singles and mingles, you know, that type of thing. And I actually liked the Torah even more than the guy than the guys that were showing up at the event. And I decided I went to a weekend seminar. It's called a Shabbaton, where there was this age discovery seminar, which sort of reconciles Torah and God and science and the Big Bang Theory and all the all these types of things. And I was like, I love it. I'm all in. I want to start keeping the Sabbath. But I decide to start keeping the Sabbath in December when Shabbos starts at like four. Right. Now Shabbat is still night. Well, but but I'm saying it starts with Sundown and it it like, you know, it fluctuates based on the time of year. Now the show I work for at CNN called Showbiz Today is live every single day at 4:30. So I cannot keep Shabbat and keep my job. So therein lies the conflict. So that's the first, like, you know, coming to Moses moment, we'll call it. So I walk into my boss Scott's office, who is a really nice Jewish guy, and I tell him, like, I'm leaving. And people can't believe people will give their right lung, their left kid, like you're their kidney, their left leg, like everything to be there. And no one leaves willingly. Like you've got to drag people out kicking and screaming. You know, and with security, by the way, like no one's leaving this opportunity. And he's like, Good luck, Jamie. Ever finding a job in the TV industry with this new Shermer Sabbath thing of yours. He's like, Don't let the door hit you on the way out. Like, I cannot believe you're leaving. Like, say andara, goodbye, ciao, shalom. And that's when I head to Israel for the first time. And I go to seminary to learn what it means to be an observant Jewish woman and keeping Shabbat. Cause you grew up with that. I grew up very Jewish. But not observant, like very culturally Jewish.

SPEAKER_00 22:03

I can't wrap my mind around having an opportunity like that. I'm just thinking, let's say I grew up religious and I got into singing and then someone said, well, you can um continue to sing and produce eight records and go on to do your podcast, or you could embrace sharia and you know, and never sing again in public. Like you made that choice knowing that it would take certain things off the table permanently.

SPEAKER_02 22:28

Yeah, but you know it's so interesting. I did make a choice. You're talking about this like theoretical thing where if it was both in front of me, what would I do? When you have it, then it's much easier to say what was the rainbow.

SPEAKER_00 22:39

What did you think was waiting for you?

SPEAKER_02 22:41

So for me, I kind of was like, been there done that. This place is not so glamorous, these people are not so great. And I'm not even talking just about the celebrities. When you look around you at the people you surround yourself with, you want to surround yourself with people that you respect, that you like, like, that you love, that you want to, that you look up to, that manual advises that that are living lives like the life that you're hoping to build and dream. And I'm looking at people who are in their second, third, or fourth marriage or living at home with a significant other and a cat because this life of working in TV and television and Hollywood, it takes everything from you, including your relationships. You are on set 20, 22, 24 hours. Affairs happen. I was living in the penthouse at the time in Manhattan, a block from CNN. Um, and we were subletting it from the owner, me and another producer, one of the anchors, it was his penthouse. And he was on his third marriage. He just married a beauty queen, and they moved down to, I think, um Battery Park, but he wanted to keep the penthouse just in case this was going to be his third failed marriage. He wanted to have his bachelor pad back. So we were like keeping it warm from him as a subletter. So I'm just saying, like, this is the life. This is like, it's almost then. Once you've seen it behind the curtain, you know what it's all about. You know that nothing is real, it's all fake. And even the people that work in it do do not have a life that you aspire to. That's like, but is there even a choice?

SPEAKER_00 24:03

Because some people end up getting caught up in the money, caught up in addictions, caught up in the lifestyle, and not everyone finds the light. Yeah, correct. And also, it's the Atha Dashmaya. I mean, it's a hand that almost reaches Divine Providence. Divine providence. God wanted you, kind of, I would say, almost plucked you out of that environment and said, Okay, Jamie, Hanala, we're gonna try something else, and you're gonna flourish and grow there as well. I say that all the time. Yeah, and you're gonna plucked me out. And you're gonna find a different reward that's not materialistic and not instant and not based on dopamine and all that instant gratification. And then social media came around and ruined all that plan. Oh, definitely. We want to get into social media human. By the way, I feel like social media, it has its like these, the the like these um kufot, like these uh periods. Periods. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 24:52

And unlike um, you know, you're so Israeli now that I'm translating your Hebrew. Yeah, I know, right? There we go.

SPEAKER_00 24:58

I know, yeah. I'm proud. So we when I I was saying on when uh when I did an interview with Avi Proctor that I was inside about your Facebook posts when I made Aliyah because Facebook was all the crazy, all the rage. All the rage, and that's where the successful people were. It was like YouTube. That was the and then you know, we have now there's Instagram and LinkedIn and Twitter and threads and X and TikTok and TikTok and so on. Okay. So there was, I think for us also, we are the generation that transitioned onto social media. Correct. We are the guinea pigs. Correct.

SPEAKER_02 25:32

And I And we remember life before it.

SPEAKER_00 25:35

Remember life before, and also we had, I think, the biggest impact on us because we kind of went from a place where news was private, your life was private, what you ate was private, if you were divorced, that was private. Yeah. To having no choice. If you were a professional, you had no choice but to overshare.

SPEAKER_02 25:49

Yeah anything in order to be relevant, in order to further your your career and your financial.

SPEAKER_00 25:56

Look at me, look at me, and also look at me all the time. My windows all I always look at it like airplane windows. Yeah. You know, you open and close them, yeah. And some people open them and everyone just speaks in, yeah, you know, and and looks and I like that.

SPEAKER_02 26:09

Yeah, because that is so contradictory to modesty, yeah, to Jewish privacy.

SPEAKER_00 26:21

You know, we speak about it, we pray every morning, Matovo, Lachayakov, Mishkonah, Sekha Yisrael. The the tents that were arranged in the desert were aligned in a way that the windows and doors didn't face each other because privacy is so important in Judaism. So we were kind of it was thrust on us completely. And we had to, I you know, when I was feeling like it's unfair. When I started recording my albums, I didn't put my face on my my albums because and they I was saying they put them on the bottom shelves because women's faces were nowhere.

unknown 26:52

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 26:53

Then you were supposed to put your face online, which you did right away. Yeah. So speak about that, like that was also groundbreaking and also bold in our world. Were you ever afraid like people are gonna say Jamie's pushing the envelope? Or were you just saying, you know what? I am doing this in a kosher, pardon the button, but a kosher, wholesome way, and this is what I have to do to succeed.

SPEAKER_02 27:14

I have to say I didn't know better. I didn't come from this world. So I didn't know that what I was doing was such a let's call it faux pas, or so so controversial. I thought, I am a religious woman, I am an accomplished woman, I am dressed modestly, I'm speaking with a nice voice, without foul language, about things like at that time it was kosher food. Like I even picked an area that I thought was very like like domestic. Yeah, correct. And I thought, like, like what could be wrong with what I'm doing? I had like little did I know that I was, you know, opening a door for something and for a conversation around things that like I knew nothing about. I didn't know about no women's pictures and you know albums on the on the lower shelf of the of the music store.

SPEAKER_00 28:02

Like, but you change things, it's almost like ignor ignorance is bliss.

SPEAKER_02 28:06

Um I guess so, right. I I totally did it unknowingly. I thought I was doing something good.

SPEAKER_00 28:10

Describe to people what you did though, because at the at your at the high point of Facebook, yeah, when you were thriving in your or not, um you're always thriving, but what I'm saying, when you were big into the whole cooking scene, yeah, okay, describe a little bit what what what what your life was like. So because it seemed from the outside, Jamie Geller, super successful living in Israel, doing living the dream.

SPEAKER_02 28:35

Uh-huh and that's actually what I called the the film. So basically, what I did is the first thing I did. I always say you could take the girl out of TV, but you can't take the TV out of the girl. So I wrote this kosher cookbook that I think you know I'm going on tour with and I'm gonna be doing cooking demonstrations in front of crowds of women. Like it's such a nice little kosher, modest career. I'm thinking like, and women audiences only, and like what the kitchen. It's like I put myself as like a modern liberal woman back in the kitchen. Jim's like, like, what did I what would I do that's so controversial? But then I just thought, like, oh my gosh, like, we don't have any kosher cooking videos. So I start making kosher cooking videos.

SPEAKER_00 29:08

There was one video with Hannah Winner, and she did a Shabbat video and we watched it a thousand times. We learned how to make Chatzilim and we learned how to make Kala.

SPEAKER_02 29:17

Yeah, Chatzilim being eggplant. Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 29:19

And when we watched it, we watched it because it was so awful. It was like so.

SPEAKER_02 29:25

It was it was I don't know her, so I'm sorry.

SPEAKER_00 29:27

It was expensive to produce it. But her name was Kana too. That's so expensive. Yeah, it was expensive to produce, and she made a beautiful Shabbat, but it was so rare, we must have watched it until the ribbon ran thin.

SPEAKER_02 29:35

But so yeah, it was it was it was so I started making kosher cooking videos. And then when we decided to make aliyah, so I looked out there and I saw there's no like documentary of making aliyah. And I was like, I called up Nefesh Benefesh, which is like the primary aliyah agency for um American-based jury, North American-based jury coming to Israel. And I said to them, Look, I'm Jamie Geller, I'm a TV producer, I'm also a cookbook author. Um, I don't know if you know me, but I'm making Aliyah. And I think I'd like to produce a documentary in real time, following my family's journey. We made a 10-part series called Joy of Aliyah, and each episode had a name, and the last one was called Living the Dream.

SPEAKER_00 30:14

And you inspired me to make Aliyah. And I sat there watching your videos in the middle of the night crying, thinking, I cannot believe this is gonna happen to me. And because I also love the attention and love that it's not that you love the attention. I I I wanna I want to address that. Good, go for it. It's not the need for attention, it is the recognition that Hashem gave us the talent to communicate and inspire other people through words, through motion, through through connection, through all of that that tells another Jew, I'm here for you, I love you, I want to know your story, and I want to give to you and make your life better. And that's how we get get get our our our nourished. That's how I I like that word nourish. Yes, I need it. I need to record my episodes, I need to communicate my experiences, I need to write them into songs or whatever it is. And I appreciate that Hashem gave me the skills and the talents and the the the savvy to sit down and hone those skills because I'm not at the It's almost a crime not to use them, by the way. It's a crime not to use them. It's my responsibility to use them. Yes, right. Those are a gift to me. So I don't look at it like I'm desperate for attention. I just look at it, what I do needs attention.

SPEAKER_02 31:24

Right. But can I also say that knowing that you impacted someone, that feedback also nourishes me. People stop me all the time. Can I take a picture? Or they want to say that I'm so sorry to bother you. I go, I live for this. I don't live to be, it's not a bother.

SPEAKER_00 31:39

You're a soul.

SPEAKER_02 31:41

Something that I did impacted you. It made you make want to make aliyah. Like, thank you, God.

SPEAKER_00 31:46

Like this was all someone's watching. But again, I want to I want to just it just make it very clear the difference between Jewish celebrities and secular celebrities. Yeah. We are vessels. I am a passage through which Hashem sends with through God sends whether it's music or conversation or whatever it is my skills are in Hasbara, and you're with your cooking and your what what all your multi-talents and like you said, it's a shame not to use it. It's a responsibility to use it, but there's never this feeling like entitlement, like I need to be respected. No, I'm I'm as skilled as the guy who fixes my washing machine. I just have a different talent.

SPEAKER_02 32:26

Yeah, yeah, no, I like that very much. No, it's not about it. You're right, it's like a with a different focus. And the focus is part of just like bringing your gifts to the world and making the world a better place because of it, and connecting to other people and helping elevate them and understanding everyone has a mission. If you have the gift of identifying what your special gifts are and your mission in this world, it's like thank you, God.

SPEAKER_00 32:51

Right. And some of us are givers in the sense that we like to project. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, and some of us are more introverted and we do things behind the scenes, and that's great too. Everyone has different roles, correct. Right? And it doesn't mean that either of us are struggling more or less. It's just a different dimension to what we do. Okay. I wanted to put that, make that clear because people sometimes ask me, we'll be like, okay, I have your audiograph or so on my guitar. And I'm like, the same thing, like me. Like, but at the same time, that means that they're listening to the music. That means it had an impact. That means I matter. Totally. And I gave them something valuable. I'm not a Britney Spears. You're not uh you know, a Megan Kelly that goes with whatever is the the better agenda that day to get her likes. You have integrity.

SPEAKER_02 33:35

So we try, we hope, and um Yeah, and we try to I don't want to say preach, but we try to reach with like the right teachings, you know, and the right messages to help like a lot of people. And none of us are living like this world.

SPEAKER_00 33:47

So you can't say, Oh, we're taking I'm saying none of us we're we're not being we're not taking advantage of anyone. Like it's almost selfless in a way. Like we, you know, like this video. Thumbs up, subscribe to Morrowed, and to Jamie Thamie Keller show. Okay, let's talk about your day-to-day jobs.

SPEAKER_01 34:02

Okay.

SPEAKER_00 34:03

Um three million Jews engaged on learning tour in 2030.

SPEAKER_02 34:08

Is that yeah, that was the goal. That was Ace Vision 2030. And the idea was to get over three million Jews to be like learning Jewish wisdom on a regular basis. So already two or three years ago, we crossed four million Jews following four million followers online, and over almost, we're this year about to cross a billion video views at Aish, and now we're sort of taking it to the next level. So we're developing something called HU, which is basically an online university. So, how do we take all these people that have been liking this like fun, quick microbytes of like Jewish wisdom, Jewish content, and Jewish learning, and then take them through like structured learning paths that are perfectly catered to them in their language with AI now, everything that we dreamed of doing five years ago.

SPEAKER_00 34:48

Simplifying in a snap.

SPEAKER_02 34:50

Like it will be we're already in beta and we're seeing it tremendously.

SPEAKER_00 34:52

Do you spend your days mostly in the old city?

SPEAKER_02 34:55

So um the Dan Family Ace World Center is headquartered in the old city, as you know, across from the Western Wall. So definitely spend a few days a week there, whether it's shooting the new podcast, which is now called the Jamie Geller Show. Yes.

SPEAKER_01 35:08

Where can people watch? Um, people can watch on YouTube. Jamie Geller. Amazing. YouTube. And you're having guests every week? Yes, yes. And the coatel? Yes, the backdrop is the coatel.

SPEAKER_00 35:16

Are we having people who come into town?

SPEAKER_02 35:18

Is it specifically Israelis or uh it's anybody who we think we can have an interesting conversation with, but we definitely want to do it in person. I always say the backdrop of the Western Wall, we're heaven and earth meet.

SPEAKER_00 35:28

I was just gonna say, yeah, I get the chills thinking about Jamie Geller, that you could have been sitting anywhere, not anywhere, somewhere specific in Hollywood. I can't. And you're sitting across the coatel, it literally has gone full circle.

SPEAKER_02 35:40

Yeah, I could have been in NBC Studios at Rockefeller Plaza, and now I'm at A Studios at Western Wall Plaza. Like I built H Studios with a beautiful lead gift from the Tratt family, and it was a dream the first day I came into A. I said, I want to build H studios here at Western Wall Plaza. And now it's not just me. We have Rabbi Daniel Rowe, we have Rabbi Joe Burcohn, and we hope to have many more um personalities, educators, and come through and be able to like host their own shows and start sharing like Jewish wisdom with the world.

SPEAKER_00 36:08

I'm so happy we're gonna see more of you.

SPEAKER_02 36:10

That's what makes me happy. Yeah, I came out from like I I went I went a little bit like behind the scenes with the went to age for a few years.

SPEAKER_00 36:16

Sure. You were like more like behind the scenes.

SPEAKER_02 36:18

To say I I sort of came out of the closet. I love that.

SPEAKER_00 36:20

I love that. Um okay. Let's talk about the let's go back to what we were saying originally, the Israeli and you, because here on the Moral Edge, we're very pro-Aliyah, we're strong Zionists. We I should have worn blue. I feel like you were very natural. No, you look very earthy, earthy tones. No, no, this is working. It's working. So like you were saying earlier, sometimes you feel more Israeli than Israelis, or you're not sure how Israeli you should feel. You have an outsider syndrome. And tell us about the experience, your career aside, Jamie Geller as a Jewish wife and mother, raising children in Israel through October 7th, now through the Iran wars, and with this constant I don't want to say fear. We don't live on we don't live in fear, but this there we we do have a constant reminder that we are unliked around the world and that we live in a content in the most contentious place on the planet, and that we can't just live here carefree and la di-da, because unfortunately, we're a country at war and it affects our lives, it affects our neighbors, it affects our children, it affects our schedules. You know, I was saying our uh, you know, Purim was canceled, the Purim celebrations were canceled because of the war, and my kids were so excited for the holiday of Lagba Omer because thank God there wasn't a war or COVID or something crazy. We had crazy COVID restrictions, you know, we experienced that together as Americans living in Israel, being criticized by the world for having such a dictatorship forcing us to wear masks. So you you really go through the ringer when you live here. Like now that you, you know, when you start thinking about it, yeah, it's not the two-car garage, you know, Florida life, Costco swimming pool version. Yeah. It's a little more rough around the edges. So tell us your experience as an Israeli. Um, if you want to start with maybe October 7th. Sure.

SPEAKER_02 38:12

So, first of all, I would have described it if I did the intro and I was interviewing you, I would have like had such a different perspective. Not that anything you said is not true. Everything you say, but it's like I look at it so different. First of all, maybe you have better medication than I do.

SPEAKER_00 38:26

You're just in a better mood. You're more chirpy enough to do it.

SPEAKER_02 38:29

Like I got all my like negative energy before I got here. But I actually, first of all, would I feel so blessed to live here. I feel every day and every moment is a gift, and I feel it. It hasn't gotten old. It's gonna be 14 years, and it's still, thank you, God, every day that I live here, and I would never want to live anywhere else. And I actually travel a lot for work and I actually get anxious to leave here. You know, it's so funny that's so it's really like if there's a war, you want to run back and you don't want to leave in case something should happen while you're away because you want to be back here with your family and with your people. So um, my he's now 16, but my son has been saying, and he came here when he was three, um, or two and a half, actually. Uh, he always looks out and says, because we have beautiful views here in Beit Shemesh where we live, look at God. So he says, look at Hashem's beautiful mountains. And I always like, I'm so proud of him that he says that. He's been saying it since such a young age. My husband's like, Em, he got it from me. Like, but that's what we say. Sure. We look out there and we're like, What is that? Look at these beautiful mountains, look at the blessings that we have.

SPEAKER_00 39:31

Yeah, I feel like And it's ours, and and and the blood that's been shed to be here. It is part of our education, and it's a big conversation in your house.

SPEAKER_02 39:40

I feel so privileged, and we all feel so privileged to be here. And I never think about the fact that no, I don't have a two-car garage. And I don't think about the fact that, like, yeah, um, we until the local store started carrying the Costco brand Kirkland garbage bags. That was the number one thing that I s left back, but they're like 50 pounds, by the way. I paid for a whole extra suitcase for them. Right. Because it's like, I don't know, we're Americans, we make a lot of garbage. I can't live without those bags. I can't live in a lot of bags. We can do a whole episode on Israeli garbage bags. Yeah. So it's like, but I I don't even like think about that on the day to the day if I would think about describing my experience. But you said to go back to October 7th. I think October 7th was like so um incredibly emotional.

SPEAKER_00 40:23

Yeah, because you're a public person. Yeah. So you just digest it and then we need you needed to respond.

SPEAKER_02 40:28

That's the first time that I stepped back out in front of the camera for October 7th.

SPEAKER_00 40:33

You did or you didn't?

SPEAKER_02 40:34

I did. I'm saying it was a few years. I came to Aish and I said all the things that you said about social media and being toxic and look at me. And I said, like, I ran away from all this. Suddenly I fell backwards into this place, this place. When someone said to me you should open up a Facebook page, and I'm like, oh, you think so? Like, I didn't realize, we didn't realize what we were signing up for, Hanala. There are people now who go into this industry, like, I want to be an influencer, and they know with their eyes wide open what they are signing up for. We didn't know what we were doing. We thought like we're opening a Facebook page, like, you know, as if you're opening a website. It was just like the cost of doing business. It's like as if you're having a business card. And I really, really, it affected my mental health. Like it was not good for me what was happening and showing my whole world. And I felt so immodest and so uncomfortable.

SPEAKER_00 41:19

And I felt like And also, people were rough in the comments.

SPEAKER_02 41:22

Yeah. And I felt like exploiting my family. Like, what do I have to show my family like this for? Like out there and put them out there on display and on parade. So I took a step back from social media in the limelight after all that success. And I went to Ace and I said, Look, I've got all these amazing skills. I know new media, I know traditional media, I know social media, I know digital media. I'm a producer, I'm a work, I'm a marketer, I'm a brander. Let me build this brand for someone other than myself. Let me build it for Jewish wisdom, for Torah, for God, for the Jewish people. And that's what I did for like four years. And then October 7th happened. And at Aish, we actually had a global day of unity and prayer.

SPEAKER_00 41:56

I remember, first of all, Aish was amazing.

SPEAKER_02 41:58

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 41:58

You guys were there for your audience, streaming, make making films, interviewing hostage families. And people felt like you cared because this was a very per it was it happened here, not there. Yes. But Aish kept kept the We connected. You're right. You kept people involved.

SPEAKER_02 42:17

Desperate to feel, to connect, to hold hands, to pray, to understand.

SPEAKER_00 42:22

So to keep yourself together, because you're such an emotional person.

SPEAKER_02 42:29

Okay, I have so much to say. But you're right. But you're right. Like I'm such an emotional person. I wear everything on my sleeve. I didn't think I I so I was helping to produce this. And I'm thinking our CEO, Rabbi Stevenberg, is going to introduce and open this global day of unity and prayer to the millions that are live streaming. We have the chief rabbis, I mean the hostage families. And this is like in the days after October 7th, like where everyone is still shaking and comatose and like the walking dead and with tears in their eyes. And he couldn't make it in because the skies were shut, the airports were shut. He said, Jamie, could you introduce this evening and get on in front of the cameras and in front of the live stream and in front of millions? And that was the beginning of the beginning of this like third, fourth, or fifth act, whatever you want to call it in my code.

SPEAKER_00 43:11

And also that you became not Jamie from the cookbooks. You became Jamie from Israel.

SPEAKER_02 43:16

Correct.

SPEAKER_00 43:17

Jamie from Isha Torah. Correct. Jamie from you know the interview that that brought people into what's happening here.

SPEAKER_02 43:24

Yeah, and you were there at the special screening. You came and sat next to me when we did the first film on October 7th. Then we had another one called After October. Our film this year is called While We Were Celebrating. Because they came for us this year all over the world while we were celebrating. Manchester, Yom Kippur, Bandai Beach, Hanukkah, and the Israel-Iran War, Puramp Pesach, as you just said, your kids. So that's what this film is this year. So I hope you'll sit next to me at the Panari screen.

SPEAKER_00 43:50

You bet, you bet, you bet, you bet. I am, you know, I when I was preparing the intro for this, I was thinking I this is not gonna fit into an hour interview. I could talk to Jamie all day. But the truth is we managed to- We'll finish on my show.

SPEAKER_02 44:05

On the Jamie Deller show, okay?

SPEAKER_00 44:07

And also we manage to call it. We have a special episode lined up for you, but we we managed to cover the things that we really taught that are really important to us here on the on the the show. First of all, the realization that a life well lived, where you're dedicated to a higher purpose, where you think about the future, you have, thank God, beautiful children. I'm a guest at your house from time to time, and then you have a lot of nachas from them. You should you know continue to you to the most gorgeous kids in Pell. Thank you. But what I'm saying is like we're at the stage when the work we put in, the investments and the sacrifices we made are starting to come into fruition. Yeah. So I thought it was so important to bring what you're doing to our audience, and I want people to follow you. And from what you know, what I've seen over the years, everything you you do is always tasteful and in line with our Jewish values, thank you, and with the values of Jewish women, of course. Really, really, really hard. So listen, thank you. Nobody's perfect. We're all, you know, behind the scenes trying to keep it together, and Israel has all its challenges. I don't even think we spoke enough, but you know, you touched upon all the things you did after October 7th, but we're still healing.

SPEAKER_01 45:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 45:17

Like I could still fall apart talking about October 7th.

SPEAKER_01 45:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 45:21

There's so many triggers, you know. Those things are personal, and those things affect us and our families in our little world.

SPEAKER_02 45:28

Um but I always say to everyone, we feel the embrace of the Jewish people all around the world and the people that love Israel all around the world. And that makes a huge difference to us. And I think that that helps with the healing so much. So, yes, we could talk forever and a day about the haters, but there are plenty people I know with the people who are watching the show who love us and support us here in Israel, and we and we feel that loving embrace, and that gives us a lot of strength.

SPEAKER_00 45:52

And we're here to show you that we're like everyone else, we don't have horns, we're not I and I'll like it's crazy. It it's so it's crazy that we have to even do this. And some of the comments that I've read on on the episodes we've put out so far, you know, you mention Israel and people just come they go ballistic.

SPEAKER_02 46:08

They go ballistic.

SPEAKER_00 46:09

And we we wanna we wanna excuse the you know, probably we say though we pull back the curtain and show you that at the end of the day, yes, we're professionals, and yes, we're doing great things here, and yes, Israel is the most incredible place in the world, but we're ordinary people, yeah, just like you. And um it takes all the ordinary people to come live here in Israel to make it one extraordinary feeling.

SPEAKER_02 46:31

Yeah, we are waiting to hug and welcome everyone home. Yes, like I like we'll be the first to hug you. Like Han and I will go to the airport, guys.

SPEAKER_00 46:36

We will be waiting in the airport. Um every week I am so lucky to sit across from somebody who chose this place, who fought for it, um, who just really hold on to something that the rest of the world doesn't always see. Um, and to if today's conversation if today's conversation moved you, be sure to follow us on moraledge.com. You can watch us on YouTube. Be sure to subscribe, tell your friends that you're enjoying our content, and um be sure to be back next week for the weekly squeeze on Moral Edge. Thank you so much, Jamie. Thank you, Hanal. I love you. I love you too.