Burial Reimagined: The Green Reaper's Advocacy

Elizabeth Fournier, known as "The Green Reaper," runs a one-woman funeral service from a repurposed goat barn in Boring, Oregon, specializing in environmentally friendly burial options and natural death care.

Elizabeth Fournier

• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/elizabeth-fournier-32211b5/
• Website: http://www.cornerstonefuneral.com/
• Email: elizabeth@cornerstonefuneral.com
• Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/elizabethgreenreaper/

• Operating out of a 40-acre property where nature and wildlife are part of the funeral experience
• Provides traditional services alongside green burial options across Portland and surrounding areas
• Green burial means no embalming, using biodegradable containers, and burial without concrete liners
• Advocates for "shades of green" - small sustainable choices like potted plants instead of cut flowers
• Newer eco-options include human composting, aquamation (water cremation), and ocean burials
• Personal philosophy influenced by being an introvert who finds peace in quiet spaces
• Originally from California but appreciates Oregon's leadership in sustainability initiatives
• Author of The Green Burial Guidebook focused on affordable, environmentally friendly burial options

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Chapters

• 0:03 Introduction to Friends from Wild Places
• 1:15 Meeting Elizabeth Fournier, The Green Reaper
• 6:38 True Crime Discussion: Rio Vale Case
• 16:14 Quote of the Day: Silence is Golden
• 21:36 Understanding Green Burial Options
• 26:32 Elizabeth's Background and Oregon's Sustainability

Transcript

Voiceover: 0:03

Tales from the wild, stories from the heart. A journey into the mind and soul of fired up business professionals, where they share their vision for the future and hear from a different non-profit organization every month as they create awareness of their goals and their needs. Dive into a world of untamed passion. As we join our host, Shireen Botha, for this month's episode of Friends from Wild Places.

Shireen Botha: 0:35

All right, shireen here, welcome back. I am your virtual boutique bookkeeper and QuickBooks advisor. Did you know that 82% of small businesses fail due to poor cash flow management? At Shireen's Bookkeeping, we turn that statistic around. Our expert team will keep your finances in check, ensuring you understand your cash flow, maximize profits and avoid costly mistakes. Don't let numbers hold you back. Contact Shireen's Bookkeeping Services today, where your financial clarity is our priority. If you want to know more, go check me out at www. shireensbookkeeping. com and allow me to keep your books clean so you don't have to welcome back. You beautiful, wild-hearted people. You are listening to friends from wild places, with myself, Shireen, and my amazing co-host with many hats, Tanya. Welcome, Tanya. I haven't seen you in a while and also we were just saying we haven't caught up on a phone call so I miss you. How are you doing? How's things going?

Tanya Scotece: 1:49

Yes, good, good, shireen, miss you too. A lot going on here in Miami and in Florida, so, yeah, a lot going on, but all is good. Just keeps the day going and the days just turn into weeks, even before you can blink your eyes. So glad to see you and I'm super excited for our wonderful guests this morning. And, yeah, so I'll turn it back to you, shireen, and you can do our further introductions.

Shireen Botha: 2:17

Oh, that's amazing. Tanya, won't you just do me a favor and just let the listeners I'm trying to sort my mark out here let the listeners know about the extra bonus content that we create for them and the subscription.

Tanya Scotece: 2:29

Yeah, at Friends from Wild Places we have a paid subscription, so for as little as $5 a month, you can listen to the unedited raw content where we dive deeper onto subjects that maybe just you have more of an interest on. It could be life's challenges, it could be dealing with imposter syndrome, it can be dealing with aging, anything related men, women, topics all alike. Feel free to drop us a line if you would like us to dive deep into certain topics that maybe you want more information on. So, other than that, please share our podcast. More information on so other than that, please share our podcast. Shireen does a great job on getting it through YouTube and Spotify and all of the social media venues, but Friends from Wild Places is where it's happening. So back to you, shireen. Thank you.

Shireen Botha: 3:17

Yeah, it's $5, guys, it's really it's not just a subscription, it's more like support for us. Tanya and I just do this for fun. We really enjoy meeting all these wonderful guests that we have on our show. I mean, last month we had a very interesting guest, joseph, who is a hypnotherapist, and so we had great interesting discussions and some got a little little like paranormal wise. I don't know if anyone out there is interested in the paranormal, but we got into some interesting conversations regarding that as well. So go check that out. But if you want to get a little juicy and just just support us a little bit just with $5 a month, we'd really appreciate it. But other than that that, I'd love to introduce Elizabeth. I'm super excited.

Shireen Botha: 4:10

Elizabeth Fournier began her career in 1990 in Portland, so if you don't know where Portland is, it is a town in the state of Oregon, usa, where she was employed as the live-in nightkeeper sleeping in a trailer in Finley's Sunset Hill Cemetery. 35 years later, she is a one-woman funeral service in the rural town of Boring, oregon. Elizabeth owns and operates Cornerstone Funeral Services, where she is affectionately known as the Green Reaper services, where she is affectionately known as the Green Reaper for her green burial advocacy. I'm so interested to go further into that, elizabeth. Elizabeth is also the author of the Green Burial Guidebook Everything you Need to Plan on Affordable, environmentally Friendly Burial Popular Topics and I'm very excited to get further into that. So welcome Elizabeth. We're so excited to have you on the show this month.

Elizabeth Fournier: 5:09

I love to be here with you. Lovely, sparkly lit ladies, thank you for having me.

Tanya Scotece: 5:15

Yes, elizabeth, you've got to tell us Okay. So I know Cherie did a marvelous introduction on you, so I love it because I'm over here in Miami, florida, and you're over there on the opposite end of the United States, the West Coast. It's boring and it's. Can you go over the pronunciation Because I always used to say Oregon? Please share.

Elizabeth Fournier: 5:37

Yes, it's just like your, your spleen or your liver Oregon, boring, Oregon. I think people say Oregon for some reason, and then when they say boring, how do you spell that? It's just boring Oregon. So nothing too fancy over here.

Tanya Scotece: 5:56

Well, I remember when I first met you and I had you come into our funeral classes at Miami Dade College and I would introduce you from boring Oregon and the students would be like, why are you being rude to her? She can't help where she lives. If it's boring, I'm like, excuse me, this is the name of the place where she lives. It is called boring Oregon. It is such a place. I am not being facetious in any way, so we always, we always, have a good chuckle on that.

Elizabeth Fournier: 6:24

It never gets old, it really never does.

Shireen Botha: 6:26

I love it.

Elizabeth Fournier: 6:27

I think that was so cute.

Shireen Botha: 6:31

Talk about mispronunciations. I'm probably going to butcher this person's name next. So yeah, as you know, listeners, tanya and I and Elizabeth I don't know if you know but Tanya and I are very much interested into true crime. We love it, it's a passion. We follow all the different trials that are going on on the crime and network channels and many of the other channels in the news. That's that's on today. But this case that I want to talk about, it's finished, it's over. This case that I want to talk about it's finished, it's over. But it's a very interesting case in the sense of wow in the times that we're living. It's another one of those eye openers. The name is of the young lad that we're going to talk about is and this is where I'm probably going to butcher it rio vale, rio vale.

Shireen Botha: 7:37

Now the case of rio vale, the nicknamed the case the preppy party murder trial, um, a connecticut jury today actually cleared rio vale of the most serious charge out of all of them, where he faced for the death of a 17-year-old, james McGrath, but deadlocked on all the other charges. And I'm going to get into it, listeners. I'm going to give you some details. You can look it up for more details. It is quite an interesting case, mcgrath, who is the unfortunate 17-year-old that lost his life in all of this? This was a beloved high school junior and lacrosse star. He was fatally stabbed during a chaotic night of violence in may 2022. More specifically, it was a teenage house party. Yes, vale, who was 16 at the time and is now 20, was on trial for murder and three counts of assault after a fight between teens from rival schools escalated into a deadly stabbing. Vale pleaded not guilty and argued he was just acting in self-defense. After several notes over three days, stating that were deadlocked, the jury reached not guilty verdicts on each of the top charges Vale had faced, but deadlocked on the lesser included charges. The judge actually ended up declaring a mistrial on the remaining counts. So the prosecutors said Vale got into a fight at a house party for St Joseph's High School students. After the initial confrontation ended, vale and a group of friends drove to a second party about a mile away, where students from Shelton High School were gathered. Witnesses testified that what started as teenage tension exploded into an all-out brawl. Vale pulled out a knife and stabbed four people in the scuffle. Three survived and James McGrath, unfortunately, was the one that did not. Vale rejected two plea deals offering 40 years in prison If convicted. He faced up to 60 years behind bars, wow, okay.

Shireen Botha: 9:45

So my brain is fried with this one, because what on earth, at 16-year-old, are you walking around with a knife at a teen house party, like in my? I mean, this is probably just reflecting just my age and there's the time difference of how I grew up. I was never thinking of bringing any sort of weapon towards any party at all. Tension between different teams of different high schools, that was normal growing up. That was healthy, that was. You know. If you didn't have that, you know that wasn't normal. We'd always have at galas, at sports teams meetings, at big games between the opposing schools. This was all fun and games. We loved it. It was so much fun. Yes, of course, there was competition between the two teams, the two schools that were playing against one another, but there was never, ever, a sort of I'm going to stab, you, shoot you, you're going to die, kind of attitude towards that the opposing team.

Shireen Botha: 10:59

Nevertheless, let's, before I continue in getting into too much of it, my question to you, ladies, and to you listeners. You know, think about it. My question to you, ladies, and to you listeners. You know, think about it. Do you think the final judgment was fair and just for Rayul Vale, or do you think maybe he should have at least got some kind of a reprimand or punishment for even carrying a knife around? You know, let's talk about it. You know, let me hear what you have to say and feel about it. It's just a safe space. Your opinion is your opinion and we're happy to chat about it. So go ahead, elizabeth. What do you think?

Elizabeth Fournier: 11:39

The older I get, the more I feel very resolute and nothing good happens after dark and I realize you can stab somebody at 7 o'clock at night, midnight, what have you. But yeah, there's something a little bit premeditated about having a weapon, because that means are you maybe looking for something to happen? Are you someone who likes to incite this sort of thing? Do you get yourself in a lot of conflict? So something's a little bit premeditated there. But a lot of these trials, especially these younger people, I'm finding that a lot of the charges are being let go. Well, the proof, sort of, is in the pudding. He hurt four people. One person died. He's still alive. So there needs to be something for that. I wish it was more like West Side Story where they could dance it off.

Shireen Botha: 12:25

But even there they had a knife involved.

Elizabeth Fournier: 12:27

So I would have liked to see a little bit more justice in this situation. I'm sure this man's family would like to see that. And gosh I just again. Why do you have a knife in your pocket? That's a pretty good conversation piece. I suppose you could have taken a ballpoint pen and caused damage too. But why can't we communicate? Why can't we talk? Why can't we talk? Why can't? If you don't like something that's happening, why can't you merely just get in your car and drive the other direction? I think there's. I would have made different choices. I've been in a place when I've been 16 or 17,. Somebody was maybe making me feel uncomfortable, and I would have never thought to pull out a knife and stab four people.

Elizabeth Fournier: 13:08

So it's just mind blowing to me.

Shireen Botha: 13:12

Tanya what do you think?

Tanya Scotece: 13:14

Yeah, I agree, I agree with Elizabeth. You know, I think you know, here in the US, as far as you know crimes being committed by underage, there's always this kind of leniency right, like oh, it's the first time, they won't do it again. And I understand the you know the judge that presides over these cases. You know they're in a position to provide safety to the community, safety to the individual. And then the question comes are some of these offenses rehabilitated, like you know? Like if the person does do time to pay for their you know, for their act would, is that rehabbable or not? And I believe if you probably survey judges, there's probably many things that they would agree on that are just not rehabbable, like I mean, no matter what type of time somebody is doing. So I guess you know, I think here it's always like this leniency, like let's give it a second chance, let's give it a third chance, and then, but the trajectory is there, I think, a lot of times too.

Tanya Scotece: 14:17

You know social media, in my opinion, has just played. I mean, think about the violence with even just simple video games. I mean everybody's killing people, like you know, even fictitiously, through social media games and gaming, and I mean I know a lot of friends that do game and I'm not saying that it's not a good thing. I'm just saying that when kids are brought up with, this is normal to kill somebody you know, and you know actually carrying weapons and the gun violence and I don't know. Just the conversation gets so big and I just think, again, going back to the social media, there's so many factors when they deliver a verdict that I think there's so many behind the scenes aspects of it that we don't, we never see.

Tanya Scotece: 14:58

So the jury, after the fact, if they get to talk and share, there are always details that they didn't know, they didn't have access to. We don't know, so yeah it's, I don't know they didn't have access to. We don't know, so yeah it's. Uh, I don't know, but you gotta. And again, you know. But on the opposite side it can be argued well, if it's the first time this person has gotten into trouble, you know he's still young, what are we gonna do? Just lock him up for the rest of his life? So there's always that two sides to every coin and fair.

Shireen Botha: 15:27

But I think he got his second chance, I think, by the fact that he was found not guilty on the biggest major charges of murder. That is his second chance. Do I think that the other counts? Possibly he should have had some community service or some kind of a reprimand of carrying a knife and not trying to sort it out through, you know, verbally or just um. Stabbing someone is not the answer, sorry, um, so I just, uh, I feel like that he did get a second chance, but being found not guilty to the two major counts and then all the other counts up. You're lucky should have at least gotten some sort of a community service or a reprimand, um to say you know, this is your punishment for that. You can't walk away not getting absolutely anything. You've hurt three people and you murdered someone. Your actions do need to have some sort of consequence. But that is just me. Um, ladies, thank you so much for chatting about this. I always find that these cases are quite interesting and, just um, I love hearing your opinions and hearing your points of views. I think it's also really interesting to see how others see it and different points of views, and, elizabeth, your one was really really interesting and a good point. So thank you, ladies.

Shireen Botha: 16:54

Uh, yeah, we've come to quote of the day. Quote of the day. I still haven't got that little jingle up. I think we need to make a jingle for that. But the quotes of the day? Uh is, silence is golden, and this one was brought to us by our elizabeth here. So, elizabeth, won't you just share with the listeners what does this quote mean to you and why?

Elizabeth Fournier: 17:21

through that moment we just had there. Isn't it wonderful? Three vibrant, energetic people who can just enjoy being together. I I think that's gorgeous. I wonder if we, as humans, feel the need to fill the void with words, with conversation no-transcript.

Shireen Botha: 17:43

I love that that's so true, Because I think I think we need to learn that sometimes something doesn't always need to be said. There are many times to sit in each other's company and be comfortable just doing that is also very important as well. So thank you very much, Elizabeth. I appreciate that.

Tanya Scotece: 18:08

Elizabeth. I appreciate that, elizabeth, can you share with us from the silence is golden. When did that become your quote Like? Was it something like in in funeral service that you've kind of, you know, adapted that, or is it something that you had from childhood? When did that quote really have an impact on you to say that's my favorite quote?

Elizabeth Fournier: 18:24

I'm an introvert and my feeding comes from time alone and time in nature and time where I'm not having to process anyone else's thoughts and feelings and words, let alone my own. When I was younger, I would walk in cemeteries. That would be my thing. I would go study in a cemetery, and not in a morbid goth way, just for the absolute silence. Because you can go to a library but guess what? Lots of people in there, lots of conversation, lots of hustle and bustle, but people ain't cruising through the cemetery. So it was just nice to have silence. And the older I get, the more I respect the fact that you truly have a good friend If the two of you can just walk or sit or be in a car and just truly have that knowing of. Yeah, this is all right, this is good.

Tanya Scotece: 19:12

Yeah, that's funny that I think. I think. I mean, I know myself and you, elizabeth, are introverts. Shireen, you're introvert too, would you say, by nature, definitely. So we have three introverts on the call. It's exciting, it's exciting.

Elizabeth Fournier: 19:24

So I love being an introvert. An introvert is such a funny thing. It's so confusing to people because they say wait a second, you're outgoing, you're not shy, you don't know. It's not that it's a matter of you can be confident, it's just that. Would you rather on a Friday night does it feed your soul to go out disco dancing, or would you rather maybe find time in a luxurious bubble bath? What would fill your soul more?

Tanya Scotece: 19:50

And you know some of those changes just in the meantime.

Shireen Botha: 19:53

Don't? We know that Tony loves bubble baths? Oh my gosh. But you're so right, eh? There is something called an introverted extrovert, which means very much we can go out and we can socialize. It's not that we can't, but we get very tired very quickly in groups and crowds of people and when you're done, you're done and you just want to leave. Like that's me, like I get very tired in groups of people when I socialize and I get to a point where I'm like, okay, I can't do this anymore, I need to leave. Thank you very much. Good night, goodbye, have a good day, and that's just. Yeah, I would rather be out in nature, as you ladies have mentioned, doing something by myself. I isolate a lot, which has its pros and cons, but yeah, that's a lovely quote. Elizabeth, why don't you tell the listeners a little bit more about your background and a little bit about who you are?

Elizabeth Fournier: 20:49

Sure. So spending my days in Boring, oregon, is a real perk. I work out of a repurposed goat barn. I'm on 40 acres. I have birds and deer walk through where I am and I walk barefoot in the grass and water my flowers and plants and it's just idyllic. Pour myself a cup of tea and get going with the day, and the most fascinating lovely humans come through my doors there at the parlor. It's just an honor to serve my people here locally. And then I have a further reach where I take care of people.

Elizabeth Fournier: 21:23

Our big city is Portland, which is about 20 miles away. So I've got my country people, I've got my country people, I've got my city people and then, on a broader scale, I've got people who seek out this parlor because we take care of a lot of natural burial and burial in people's backyards and my days are always different and I get to be by myself in the funeral home, which I think is a big plus. There isn't a lot of chatter at the water cooler, so to speak. I don't know if people even have water coolers nowadays, but there isn't a lot of conversation about what somebody watched on TV last evening or something else. Necessarily, that isn't again feeding my soul, getting into the work life, all those things. So days are great and I do typical funeral stuff and alternative funeral stuff. It's really whatever somebody needs Well that's interesting, elizabeth.

Tanya Scotece: 22:16

My favorite quote that I always quote you on is that there are many shades of green, and I say quoted by Elizabeth, so can you share with us? When people hear green burial, green burial movement, the industry's buzzwords are the aquamation, watermation or alkaline hydrolysis and burying without a casket. Can you just give our listeners what does it mean to be a green funeral home and or offering green services from your perspective?

Elizabeth Fournier: 22:52

Thank you for asking, because I think that clarity is really important. People will hear this green thing and say, oh, that sounds too hippie or oh gosh, you know that's not for me. I can't put somebody in my backyard, I don't want to talk about that. So green options are really thinking about things we did back before the funeral industry got booming with embalming and got bigger with the idea of cremating people. We would do something a little bit more simple. We would have maybe your local carpenter put together a casket and we would have ladies from the community or the street bathe a body, and then we would do something a little bit more simplified when we're going to have all the metal caskets, all of these options. So we did something green. Ultimately it's taking a body and keeping it in a pretty natural state, not embalming, not doing anything much to the body that way From there, putting it in something that can biodegrade and is that going to be a simple pine box or a sheet off your bed and then laying it into a space which is pretty natural. There isn't going to be a concrete grave liner around the casket or something stainless steel. Everything can go back to nature and with that we've broadened that.

Elizabeth Fournier: 24:13

Now here in the United States we have more options. So the real concept of what a natural burial or a green burial is, it's really the same thing. It's going to be a natural body. So we're looking at maybe not having any sort of embalming or chemicals. We're going to have that body placed in something that will biodegrade, which could be a sheet off your bed or a cardboard box or simple pine, wicker, wool, all of these natural materials, and then put into a grave space. That is going to be just the natural earth and this can be at many, many cemeteries that they allow this to happen. So that will be a green burial or a natural burial, but the shades of green. We have moved on to many things here in the United States that people do. We can have a full body burial in the ocean. We can actually compost somebody where the body is put into wood chips and actually becomes soil. We can cremate people with water and that's very eco-friendly.

Elizabeth Fournier: 25:14

So different things are coming about. There's different processes and even if you have a traditional looking funeral, I tell people wonderful, do whatever you need to do for your family. Maybe consider a shade of green, such as, rather than cut flowers, what if we gave a plant and then that plant can be taken home by the family and can be used and it's sustainable and it's not going to be just cut flowers for a couple hours? Or what if the memorial programs or the funeral pamphlets were recycled paper? I mean, there's ways. Again, we can have shades of green. How about carpooling? That's a classic, that's a good one, carpooling. So shades of green.

Tanya Scotece: 25:58

Wow, Well, and Elizabeth, where did you? Where were you born and raised? Because I don't believe you are from Oregon originally, are you?

Elizabeth Fournier: 26:07

Right, I was born in San Jose, California, and that's the San Francisco Bay area. I lived there till I was four. Then we came up to Portland. My mother had health issues and it was either going to be Reno, Nevada or Portland Oregon because of the air quality, and I'm really thankful my parents had such foresight to think about Portland Oregon. I'm thrilled to be from this area. I'm thrilled to have grown up here. I feel like we've done great things. We were the first state with curbside recycling and getting rid of some plastic bags and bringing your pop cans to the store for money. I think Oregon has just been a real leader in sustainability, and little did I know that this would be such a great move as a child.

Tanya Scotece: 26:52

Tune in next week for part two from Friends from Wild Places.

Voiceover: 26:58

You've been listening to Friends from Wild Places with Shireen Botha. Be sure to subscribe to the podcast from the links to catch every episode and unleash your passion.