Grief With Gentle Hands

A shocking grave robbery case collides with a tender, transformative conversation about grief and the ways we honor the dead and protect the living. We open with hard questions about the oddities market, consent, and the law, then move into the steady ground of compassion as grief companion and educator Terri Chaplin joins us to share how devastating loss reshaped her life’s work.

Terri Chaplin

• Website: https://www.myhealingheartscommunity.com/
• Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/terri.chaplin/
• Email: tchaplin@livingingratitudewtlc.com
• Tel: +1 301-481-1291
• LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/teresa-terri-chaplin-54043352/

Terri’s story spans years of caregiving, the death of her first husband, and the sudden loss of her son—a moment that shattered what she thought healing looked like. From that breaking came a brave reimagining: leaving a decades-long corporate role, relocating for renewal, and building a heart-centered grief practice rooted in presence instead of platitudes. She walks us through the simple, powerful tools that help mourners feel safe enough to feel—grounding the nervous system, making space for emotion without timelines, and honoring continuing bonds through small, meaningful rituals.

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Chapters

• 0:00 Welcome And Sponsor Message
• 1:38 Hosts Check In And Subscription
• 3:43 Introducing Grief Companion Terry Chaplin
• 6:12 True Crime Detour: Cemetery Thefts
• 10:05 Ethics And Law Of Human Remains
• 12:00 Expert Insight On Regulations
• 14:26 Quote Of The Day: Brene Brown
• 15:15 Why We Must Sit With Grief
• 17:48 Terry’s First Loss And Its Impact
• 22:00 The Night Everything Changed
• 25:30 Seeking Purpose After Tragedy
• 28:00 Building A Life In Florida
• 29:30 Turning Pain Into Service

Transcript

Voiceover: 0:03

Tales from the Wild. Stories from the Heart. A journey into the mind and soul of FIDA business professionals where they share their vision for the future. And hear from a different non-profit organization every month as they create awareness of their goals and their needs. Dive into a world of untamed passion. As we join our host, Shireen Botha, for this month's episode of Friends from Wild Places.

Shireen Botha: 0:35

Well, hello there and welcome. I combine meticulous accuracy with a personal touch, offering customized solutions that fit your business needs. With my innovative tools, bookkeeping becomes engaging and understandable. Say goodbye to the Dell Financial Statements and hello to Insight. Are you a business owner that never hears from your bookkeeper? Well, email me today. And if you want to know more, why don't you go check me out at Shireensbookkeeping.com and allow me to keep your books clean so you don't have to. Welcome back, listeners. You are listening to Friends from Wild Places with myself, Shireen, and my most beautiful co-host, Tanya. Tanya, how are you doing?

Tanya Scotece: 1:50

What's going on? Hello, Shireen. Uh, doing great here in Miami, trying to weather the cold. We had a cold front come in. So anything under seven degrees, 70 degrees, you have all the Floridians uh running wild. So you'd never know I was born and raised in Connecticut, but I'm happy to be here and super excited to have our guest here today. So uh we have Miss Terry, and um I'm gonna turn it back over to you, um Shireen, and then you can do a formal introduction.

Shireen Botha: 2:22

Well, Tanya, if you don't mind just taking a few minutes just to tell our listeners a little bit more about the subscription for extra content, if they want to get more involved with us, that'll be great.

Tanya Scotece: 2:34

Sure. So at Friends from Wild Places Podcast, we have a paid subscription for as little as five dollars a month. And you can get the uh raw, unedited material on topics that we dive a little bit deeper in. Um, so if you have any requests that you would like us to dive deeper on a subject that maybe you're interested in, or check out what we have available. We've been doing these podcasts for Sharina. Is it almost five years? Is that it's it's going on quite a few years. How many years is it?

Shireen Botha: 3:03

It's three at this point. We're going on the fourth.

Tanya Scotece: 3:08

I might I probably have known you for five. I think that's what it is. So it's been a while.

Shireen Botha: 3:12

Yeah.

Tanya Scotece: 3:12

Yeah. So we do these podcasts once a month and we get them out on all social platforms, including YouTube. So again, if you are interested in uh joining a uh a paper subscription, feel free to do so. And um, you can donate more if you'd like, but for as little as five dollars a month, you can have topics that you want more information on.

Shireen Botha: 3:33

Oh, thank you, Tanya. Yeah, listeners. It's worth it. If you want to come and listen to us a little bit more, um, we'd love to have you. This is a safe space for everybody here. So um, Terri Chaplin, wow, she is a grief companion and educator. Her heart is in walking alongside those who are grieving. After experiencing a deep personal loss in her own life, she realized that grief doesn't need to be rushed or fixed. It needs to be witnessed, honored, and held with compassion. For over six years she's been holding space for others in their grief through private sessions, group settings, retreats, and through her writing. She believes healing begins when we feel safe enough to be seen in our own pain. Her approach is very gentle, heart-centered, and rooted in presence. She doesn't give quick fixes or forces timelines. She simply walks beh beside others wherever they are in their journey. She also trains others to do this sacred work through her accredited healing heart certification program and other grief-informed training for professionals who desire to better understand grief and provide a safe, sensitive, and effective support to those they serve in times of loss. It's so good to have you on the show, Terry. How are you doing?

Terri Chaplin: 5:12

I'm doing great. Thank you. It's an honor to be here. So I appreciate the invitation to come and talk about something that's near and dear to my heart. So thank you both for having me. Yeah.

Tanya Scotece: 5:22

We can't wait. We can't wait. We're so excited, Terri. Yeah, this is uh a great way, I think, to um, you know, kind of, you know, go into the new year in 2026 um with maybe a different perspective on a topic that you know resonates with everybody from different backgrounds, uh, different cultures, different religions. Um, but grief is central to humanities. So we're really interested in taking it a deep dive into your work and um you know what you do and how we can support you on your mission.

Shireen Botha: 5:55

Thank you. I'm looking forward to it. Yeah. Well said, Tanya. Absolutely, Terri. We were looking forward to this conversation. Um, but let's break a little bit of the ice, right? It's the month of love, February. Tanya and I are true crime enthusiasts. We love to chat about some of the latest true crimes that are um undergoing uh trials. And one of them is the Jonathan Gerlach trial. Listeners, if you don't know much about Jonathan Gerlach, in January 2026, he was arrested in connection with a series of grave robberies at the historic Mount Moria Cemetery, which spans southwest Philadelphia and Yedon, Pennsylvania area. The case has been described by Delaware County District Attorney Tana Rouse as the horror movie come to life. Here, let's just chat about some of the summary facts so we can get into it. So, regarding the investigation and the arrest, they had to stake out her what was going on first because following a two-month investigation into cemetery burglaries, police conducted surveillance on January 6th. Um, they spotted Gerlach's car with bones and skulls visible in the back seat. Um, when they caught him, detectives observed Gerlach exiting the cemetery with a crowbar and a burlach bag. Inside the bag, they found mummified remains of two children, three skulls, and other bones. He also left a digital trail, which was also evidence held against him. Investigators linked Gerleg to the site using licensed plate readers and cell phone records. Tips also pointed towards his social media activity where he allegedly put participated in human bones and skull selling groups. So upon searching Girlek's home and storage unit, uh authorities discover over a hundred sets of human remains. I mean, we're talking, as I said, from human skulls, mummified hands, decomposing human torsos, you know, jewelry and a pacemaker still attached to some remains, and many more. The legal status in charges right now is Gilak admitted to stealing at least 30 sets of remains from Mount Moria, but is facing nearly 575 charges, including 100 counts of abuse of a corpse, 100 counts of theft, and 26 counts of burglary, multiple counts of desecration of venerated objects, historical burial sites. So it's quite an interesting case, I must be honest. Uh the question that I want to ask us here and for the listeners to think about is in the wake of the Girlak discovery, where should the law draw the line between dark hobbyist collecting and criminal desecration? And does our current lack of regulation on the oddities market effectively provide a shield for people to hide these types of crimes in plain sight? Because, yeah, um, it is quite interesting uh the the route that this case specific case has gone down. So um go ahead, Terry. Do you want to give us your opinion?

Terri Chaplin: 9:27

Sure. Yeah, I so I found it to be extremely grueling. Um, nothing I'd ever heard of or or read about before, but I think that it it there's like there's a a line being crossed when you know it's it's an obvious lack of respect for someone's loved ones. There's no consent being given for you know going in and breaking into these vaults or you know, into the gravesites and stealing the remains. And I feel like the lack of you know regulations in the oddities market definitely makes it easy because I was floored. How how can there be a group where people are selling and buying human remains? Like I I don't know how that's possible. So I feel like there's there's obviously um some things that need to change and more regulation and oversight that needs to be done so that these people that's that that's not a dark hobby when you're you know, there's you don't have consent to dig up these or break into these vaults. That's you know, that's theft and breaking and entering and and and just morally wrong. So I feel like there definitely needs to be some um rules and regulations in place because it there should have been red flags that there's a group that is selling. I'm sure that group he was in is probably not the only group. So um, yeah, I think more definitely needs to be done in this case is a prime example of of that and and why.

Shireen Botha: 11:19

Yeah, right. But I mean, even there's some career paths that actually use uh body parts for education purposes, but I think you need to get permission, which is why I want to hear Tanya's point of view here. Um, Tanya, go ahead. What do you think about this whole case and what's going on?

Tanya Scotece: 11:37

So so I I serve as expert witness quite regularly for attorneys. Um so here in the United States, each state is regulated um differently. So each state has its own rules and regulations. Um currently I am a licensed funeral director and bomber in the state of Florida, and I serve on many, many cases of this nature. Um, all kinds of abuse of corpse, uh mutilation of a corpse, um, grave robberies. Um what happens is, you know, there is, as you mentioned, Shireen, there is a very um dark side of I want to say humanity that thrive in the oddities world where body parts are being sold, um, all kinds of things, um jewelry, human remains, animal remains. Um, and there it's it's not that it's not regulated. I mean, if people, but it's it's kind of like um, you know, there's this group, I mean, and I even hear it in the classroom discussion, um, you know, teaching moratory science, um, that some of the students have a fascination for um, you know, interesting things. Now, um, you know, where it draws the line is one thing can have a curiosity for perhaps like you know, interesting things, interesting items. Um, but when you actually go and take things that don't belong to you or desecrate a human being, that's where the law steps in. So for in Florida, we are operating under Chapter 497, which is our state statute. So if I get assigned a legal case, I have to become familiar with all the findings, go through the state statutes, and then I get hired as an expert witness. So in this specific case, um, you know, it's out of the jurisdiction of Florida, but nonetheless, it um for whatever reason somebody is doing that, whether they're if if the even if they are working in a funeral home setting, cemetery setting, or for their own morbid curiosity going to rob graves, um, there are penalties that are quite serious. Um, some are felony charges. So each state is operating differently. Um so it'll be interesting to see what happens and how many people are kind of brought in, you know, for this kind of underground. Um but I remember I think it was a year or two ago, even Harvard Medical School, their morgue attendant was um that was public knowledge, um, was selling body parts. So I mean, so sometimes people are in the field, sometimes they're not. But again, there are laws to protect the deceased, there are laws um to speak for the voiceless, which is my mission in life. So I I am hoping that um you know the wrongdoings, um there is penalty for that.

Shireen Botha: 14:18

Right. I agree. Yeah, yeah. Um, yeah, it's it's a fascinating, uh, fascinating trial. So if you want to listeners, stay tuned, go check out Law and Crime, um, Crime TV, they're all covering it. It is quite an interesting trial. So follow that. Um, but back to you, Terry. It is that part of the podcast which is so important. It's the quote of the day. So today, Terry shared with us a really uh close quote to her heart. And it's only when we are brave enough to explore the darkness will we discover the infinite power of our light. That's let me say that again. Only when we are brave enough to explore the darkness will we discover the infinite power of our light. And that's from Brene Brown. And what does this mean to you, Terry?

Terri Chaplin: 15:15

Well, for me personally, um it I think it's really important, and something that I instill in my clients and I show up every day and talk about is the need to really give your grief the attention that it requires. Because I hear so many times people say, Oh, I'm doing fine, I'm keeping busy, you know, I'm staying busy with work, I'm I'm doing this, I'm doing that. And that doesn't it that that doesn't work. Um grief is very real, it has very real physical and emotional effects on us. And when it is knocking on the door, I feel like it's important that we sit with our grief. We have to give ourselves permission to just stop, to focus on ourselves, give ourselves permission to sit and let the emotions come and let them flow. And that takes courage. It's scary to some people. They don't want to sit with it. And they'll say, you know, no, I can't think about it. I can't let myself go there. But it's imperative that you let yourself go there. You have to let yourself go there because it's when you go there that you see the beauty of what can come from loss. And for me personally, I feel like it wasn't until I recognized that I had to really allow myself to accept and explore the emotions that were coming from some of my own losses that I was able to grow from those experiences and my true light, you know, come out. I I say, you know, losing my son was the greatest teacher of my life. And he taught me more lessons in his passing than he ever did, you know, when he was alive. And it's it's so true. But if we don't afford ourselves the opportunity to do that, we won't have the opportunity to see the beauty that can come from it or the light at the end of the tunnel, if you will.

Shireen Botha: 17:15

Yeah.

Tanya Scotece: 17:17

Terry, do you mind do you mind walking us through um, you know, your journey as far as how you know how how you come to be who you are today, like based on your losses? Like how did your light shine? Like what was that journey like for you? So for those of us that um know maybe parts of the story, but our listeners who probably maybe are not familiar with um you and your work, can you share with us your journey about what your mission has become?

Terri Chaplin: 17:44

Sure. Um, so it it really started. The first major loss that I had in my life was in 2005. My first husband, Troy, um, he had been sick for about five and a half years with renal failure, and he had undergone two kidney transplants and was in the process. Both of them failed. He was in the process of getting a third um from a cadaver donor, and he passed away completely unexpected. You know, we he was on dialysis, but he had some complications, and so um he passed away and and that was a really that was my first really hard loss. I had lost my grandparents, but you know, I became the head of my household, the only parent to our son, Tyler. And so my life completely changed. And at the time I didn't realize that I wasn't really addressing my grief, if you will. I was focused on Tyler. He took it, my son, he took it really hard. He was 10 at the time, and he really struggled with losing his dad, you know, especially at the age of 10. It was just an extremely vulnerable time with him. And he had so much hope for his dad getting better because, you know, he spent five years seeing him sick, and there were so many things they weren't able to do together. And he always operated on the hope that dad's gonna get a transplant and he's gonna be better, and we're gonna be able to play ball together, and we're gonna be able to do all these things that you know, fathers and sons are supposed to do. And so he was heartbroken and and I I focused my attention on getting care for him. Um, I did go through my employee assistance program and tried getting some support for myself, but I never really found anything or anyone that resonated with me. I went to two or three different uh therapists at the time. And it just, I never felt like they really understood what I was going through and it didn't seem to be helping me any. So I honestly just put it, you know, tucked it in the back of my mind and focused all my attention on Tyler and making sure that he was okay. Um I met my current husband uh about a year after Troy passed away. And uh we dated for many years. Um, we're and and I got remarried. Um so he was a big part of Tyler's life, too. Um, that was a whole nother story, you know, another man coming into taking his dad's place was a difficult transition for all of us. Um, but they really became close and and created a very close bond. And in Tyler had started volunteering for our local sheriff's office, working on a history project with them. That was history was something he was really passionate about, and so was the sheriff's office. And so we we had Del and I had gone uh zip lining with friends one day and on a Saturday, and I remember texting Tyler throughout the day, and we came home, you know, that night. And I thought it was odd that he wasn't there because he was very regimented. He was either at his grandmother's house at work or at the sheriff's office, you know, one of the three. And he did a lot of ride-alongs with the sheriff's office. So um, when we got home and his car wasn't parked on the curb where he parked it, I just assumed he was doing a ride-along. Um, and it was weird that he didn't tell us, but that's that's you know, that's that's what I attributed it to. And I tried calling him and his phone kept going to voicemail. And I remember, you know, like thinking, okay, this is so weird. And and my husband was like, but he's he's a teenage boy. He is, you know, it's I'm sure he's fine. But as a mom, you kind of know, like, no, he he doesn't ever turn his phone off and he would never ignore my call. That's just not the relationship. We had a very, very close relationship. So uh we went to bed and my husband fell right to sleep, but I couldn't go to Sleep. And I kept texting him and I kept trying to call his phone. And then I heard a knock on the door, like an incessant knock on the door. It was just like over and over. And I was trying to put on clothes to go down and open the door. And I was thinking, you know, that Tyler had come home and came through the garage, but couldn't get in because maybe we had accidentally locked the door. So I was getting madder and madder the more he was pounding on the door. And I I remember opening the door and seeing uniformed officers walking up the driveway. One was standing on the porch, and there were like a couple walking up our driveway. And I looked and I didn't see his car. And I thought, oh, okay, they're bringing him home from a ride along, or he he did some activity, they're bringing him home. And um, and then someone spoke to me and and I turned my head, and there was a gentleman in a suit and a bow tie standing there, and you know, they said, Are you are you are you home alone? You know, can we come inside? And uh I'm getting emotional and I I don't get emotional anymore about this, so I apologize. Um he said, you know, can we come inside? And and I said, you know, sure. My uh, you know, my husband's here. What do you what do you want? Like, where's Tyler? Where, you know, that's all I kept saying is where's Tyler? Where's Tyler? Where's Tyler? And they they uh were calling from for my husband, but he wasn't hearing them. And one of them actually went upstairs and to our bedroom and and got him. And then they told us, um, you know, when my husband came downstairs, I said, you know, we're sorry, Tyler was involved in a car accident tonight, and uh, he didn't make it. And it was something about that loss that changed everything for me. It was like losing my husband was one thing, but it it really was when when people say, you know, your grief journey is unique to the individual, I think it's also not only unique to the individual, but it's also unique to the individual and the the specific loss, because losing my husband was different than you know, losing my son. And it was almost immediately I started getting this feeling like uh there's something more I need to know. There's something like I don't know how I'm gonna get through those. And and I said that to my husband the morning after our house was flooded with people that night. And we came down the stairs the next morning and he was behind me. And I turned around and said, I wish I could just fast forward a year because I'm not sure I don't know how we're gonna do this. I have no idea what I'm gonna do with all this stuff that's inside of me. And and so I kept feeling like my life uh wasn't enough. What I was doing in my life, it it had no purpose. And I felt this really strong desire to do something to honor Tyler. Um I felt like, you know, I I need to live big now because he is no longer here. His life was cut short. So I need to live for both of us, and I need to do something with purpose. And and at the time I was I was doing outside sales for an energy company. I'd been there for 29. Well, when I walked away from that job, I had been there for 29 and a half years. So it was a little over 20 years when Tyler passed away. Um, but it just wasn't, it it didn't feel adequate. And I don't even know how to explain, but there was something that was just like nudging at me all the time. Like you have to do something else. And living in Southern Maryland, the winters were cold and wet and brown and dreary, and it was depressing. And so I came in 2019. Um, I I just made a very quick decision that um my job was no longer serving me. I I had a greater purpose to honor Tyler in some way, didn't even know what that way was, but I knew it wasn't what I was doing. So I walked away from my job um at 29 and a half years. And my husband was about to come on a business trip to Florida. So I said, Well, you know what? I'm gonna go with you. And I came with him. And while we were here, I said, Well, why can't we live here where the sun shines all the time? And uh literally three months later, we pulled up with the U-Haul, all of our belongings and our dogs, and have been here ever since. And it's been the best decision. But um, after we got here, I decided, um, you know, I found myself reaching out to other moms when I saw people in our community had lost a child. It was like I became obsessed with just finding them and somehow getting a message to them, if it was on social media or whatever, and just saying you're you're not alone. Like if you ever have something you want to say and you feel like you have no one to say it to, you can say it to me because I I didn't have that. And I felt like I was on an island by myself and nobody understood what I was going through. I didn't know anyone had lost a child. Um, and my husband was my greatest supporter, always checking on me, always forcing me to talk about whatever was going on with me and paying close attention to my emotions, but you still feel like nobody understands because there's these weird things that you think and experience that only another person who's lost a child would really get. And so I decided then that I wanted to pursue, you know, supporting others who were going through the same type of loss. And um really there there isn't a lot of, I I have, you know, there are a lot of therapists, there are a lot of counselors in the world, but um many of them have told me personally that they don't learn about grief and they don't know a lot about grief. I have some that are my clients um because they've suffered losses and they're not sure how to handle grief. And so I wanted to do something. My I had gone to college and studied psychology, but I didn't learn about grief. And so I wanted to, you know, I found a lady who was uh certifying others to be um a grief coach. Um and so I went through her certification program. I read a lot of books and really educated myself on, you know, what grief really is, how it really affects us both physically and you know, emotionally, and the things that we can do to help ourselves, which I'd already been doing because I really, you know, taught myself how to, you know, regulate my nervous system and and get myself grounded and and you know, help myself process my emotions. And so that's where this was this was born out of a desire to honor my son in some way that for me has meaning. And there's nothing more motivating for me to get out of bed every day than to know that I come in here to my office and I'm doing something that is helping other people and making such an impact because when somebody tells me that something I said or something I did or a session that we had changed their life or changed the trajectory of their life, it it and I know that's that's because of Tyler. Um, it just it's very fulfilling and it's just um something that I'm really passionate about doing.

Shireen Botha: 30:04

That's amazing. First of all, I just want to say you are so brave and wonderfully beautiful to share that story with us and the listeners. Because that's a very venerable story to actually share and to tell. And we're so thankful and grateful for you for sharing that story first of all.

Tanya Scotece: 30:23

Tune in next week for part two from Friends from Wild Places.

Voiceover: 30:34

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