Kathleen Smith  00:00

It's Kathleen at ClearedJobs.Net and we have this really exciting podcast that we've done for several years. But behind the scenes of the podcast, Security Cleared Jobs: Who’s Hiring & How, we always ask our guests this really interesting question, what is your most difficult recruiting challenge, and what are the tools, skills or strategies that you use to overcome it? And it's been a wonderful journey finding out the various solutions that people have come up with. So we have come through a whole variety, and one that has come up frequently is our shrinking talent pool.

Rachel Bozeman  01:03

Absolutely. This talent pool is getting smaller. It's getting a little drier. There might be a little less talent to go around. Remember, we talked about how people were leaving the cleared community to really start pursuing remote opportunities. In fact, y'all did a survey over there at ClearedJobs.Net that asked cleared job seekers if they would consider a position that didn't require a clearance. 49% of them said yes, they're open to all opportunities, whether they're cleared or not. Another 30% said they'd take a non-cleared position if remote was an option. So we know that we're at risk of losing some of this incredible cleared talent. So Kathleen, tell us a little bit more.

Kathleen Smith  01:50

Before I get there, I just want to remind everyone, you can go back to one of our earlier episodes that we did on SCIF stress and getting people on site. We're now listening to how the commercial world is really not having those wonderful hybrid or remote jobs anymore. There are all of these mandates for people to go back to the office. So be sure you're going back and listening to that episode. So yes, we have some data. We have some numbers that are not really pretty to look at. We have a shrinking talent pool. But if you look at the numbers reported in the most recent Trusted Workforce 2.0 Quarterly Progress Report, we actually see that there's an increase in the number of DoD clearances over the last decade. So for instance, we had about 4.6 million DoD clearance holders in 2013. Now, in 2024 when the report was written, we have about 5.4 million. That does sound promising at first glance. However, the issue is what is In Access. And the In Access clearance holder population is only about 2.5 million. So really, we're dealing with people who have clearances, but they're not necessarily using them. And that is, to me, just so heartbreaking that we have a national security population with only 45% of them using their security clearance. So you may see the numbers of people reporting that we have a lot of people with security clearances, but it's making sure that the people who have the security clearances are using them. So it goes back to building a better pipeline and really understanding that, because the demand for clearing talent is not slowing down, we really need to keep going out there, making sure that we're digging a deeper pool, that we're making it wider. Because industry projections are, we're having such an increase in demand for various different roles, cybersecurity, data analytics, and AI. Every year there's going to be new customer needs. Let's talk about some of the ways that we as a community can go and make sure that we have more talent in this pool.

Rachel Bozeman  04:17

But it's not all doom and gloom, because really what we're here to talk about is not just all the things that are happening, but how we can solve for those. So let's talk about a solution here. I think a good place to start is really thinking about our veteran talent pool, because the military does an incredible job. They're one of the largest contributors to the number of DoD clearance holders. In fact, about half of the DoD clearances belong to military personnel, whether active duty, National Guard, Reserve, whatever the case may be. They’re a really great source for those clearances that we're looking for. That's a pretty dang big pool of clearance holders. But how does that help you to fill your open reqs? So you know where the pool exists. How do you get that pool into those roles that you're trying to fill? Well, about 200,000 veterans transition out of the military each year. Yes, 200,000. That's a pretty incredible sized pool to source from, of highly skilled talent that’s familiar with supporting the mission, and largely cleared already. Our friend Tony Kuhn explained in our podcast, veterans have two years of eligibility after they leave the military to get cleared positions and reactivate their clearance, so let's make sure we're targeting this transitioning hero pool of military personnel effectively so we can add them back, so they can get actively using their clearance.

Kathleen Smith  05:45

I'm glad that we're talking about transitioning military in the veteran talent pool, because we are a veteran-owned firm, and I am a military spouse. Many of our team members are veterans and military spouses. So we really love supporting our military job seekers. We actually have a show, Military Monday, that is hosted by Bob Wheeler, one of our veterans, on helping military personnel transition by talking to recruiters who focus on that. So if you're looking for an opportunity to talk to the veteran talent pool, that's one place you can do it. But as I said, we love making sure that people understand the true aspects of recruiting our veteran talent pool. Sebastian Lambert of Iron EagleX explained in one of our episodes, defense contracting is specifically a great place for transitioning veterans because they're sometimes in the same environment, doing the same kind of work, they're just wearing a different uniform – usually a very cool polo instead of fatigues. So let's talk about some of these really in-depth strategies for accessing the veteran talent pool. First and foremost, using those base hiring events. I know that I go up to several of them up at the fort, and it's really great to go. I mean, yeah, sometimes they're huge. Sometimes they're really busy, and you're on your feet for about 9-10 hours, but you're getting a really good reach for that military personnel who are on base, that you can't access all the time. Another way is going to our Cleared Job Fairs, because we do reach out to a very large transitioning military population. But remember, you really need to build your brand as a military-friendly employer. You really need to connect with transitioning military folks at these events, rather than, “Are you a DevOps engineer with the Full Scope Poly?” You need to get to know what they're looking for. Also understand that military personnel talk to other military personnel. I think I shared on an earlier episode, a time I was sort of shadowing a four tour Army veteran with two languages, two graduate degrees, and a very high clearance. And he was walking around a job fair, not one of ours, but somebody else's, and he said, “Nope, nope, nope, nope. Not going to talk to any of those companies, because my brethren, my sisters in the military, all said really bad things about that company.” So understand that you really need to build your brand. You can also use online platforms like ClearedJobs.Net. We have a search function to source based on military experience. So that's two solutions there. Another is understanding that the military community uses social media. They connect through social media and LinkedIn. LinkedIn has really geared itself toward being a transitioning military personnel community. And understand, don't forget the military spouses, because I can tell you the number one person that they're going to go to for finding recommendations on the next employer or what recruiter to work with, they're going to go to their spouse. Another one is understanding that there are military transition programs. I can't tell you how many of the panels I've been on. Sometimes you go to these and you're like, oh, there's only 10 people in the audience. As I said, the military community is a very tight-knit community. Even if there's only 10 people at your transition presentation looking for advice, be sure you treat them all very well, because that is going to spread throughout the community.

Rachel Bozeman  09:34

Absolutely. Taking some of those tips and tricks that Kathleen just mentioned is going to do one thing. It's going to expand your network and your pipeline of those transitioning military folks. But an important consideration is how you're communicating with this new network and this new talent pool that you're building. A common question that veterans are going to ask, especially in the job seeking space, is when should I start looking for that job? Your job is to help educate them. If you reach them early, help them understand when you'll be ready to consider them for a specific position and what they should be doing in the meantime. And as they start to officially enter the hiring process, fill in some of the blanks for them. Explain to them, step by step, what they can expect in the hiring process. Proactively explain those industry-specific terms, like being a sub on a contract. What does that mean?

Kathleen Smith  10:33

Yeah, especially to those who are submariners. Are you going to put me back on another submarine? We're trying to keep my water references going here. In the water, in the sub, down deep, deep dive. Yeah, explain those terms.

Rachel Bozeman  10:48

And the pay and benefits also work very differently in the military. So help them understand what it looks like on the civilian side of things. So think about how you can become an employer of choice and a great landing place for those veterans. Now, once you've obtained this veteran talent, it's also important to not think, hey, I got them, my job's done. It's about retaining that great talent and keeping your pool well stocked, if you will. Studies have shown that nearly half of all veterans leave their first post-military position within a year. Eek, not something you want to think about. You did all of that hard work. They thought they found the perfect career, and then they leave. Surely there's some things that you can do. Consider offering continued support beyond the onboarding process. Assign mentors in your organization to offer them guidance. Provide ongoing training and development opportunities so that they feel valued, seen, and appreciated in the role that they're contributing in. Provide opportunities for veterans to network and connect with each other via events or employee resource groups. By nurturing these connections, you can create a supportive environment that encourages veteran employees to stay and grow within your company. As the demand for skilled, cleared talent continues to grow, really investing in your veterans is not only a smart business decision, but also a way to say thank you for all they've done for our country.

Kathleen Smith  12:18

Yes, I know we all say thank you on Veterans Day, and we all remember on several other holidays. But I think we need to say thank you a little bit more and help out our transitioning veterans. And I really want to say that in some of the small to medium-sized companies, you may not have a dedicated veteran recruiter. You might not have a dedicated person like some of the large companies have, but you do have veterans who are on your staff. Sit down with them. Ask them questions about, “How was it when you were transitioning?” And “I have this job, and I have no idea how this would translate to someone transitioning out of the military.” Or “Could you sit in on the interview with me so that we can make this veteran feel comfortable through the process?” Because I think tapping into your own veterans -- who are maybe the founder of your company, maybe there's someone who sits right next to you -- but you have that resource within your company on how to perfect your military talent acquisition efforts. So moving on to other ways that we can add to this talent pool, making sure it doesn't shrink too much. We've talked about wonderful Sebastian Lambert over at Iron EagleX. Just a reminder, he has partnerships with universities to get people into their internship program. If those who are in the internship are interested in cleared work, they help them get their security clearance. Yes, not all of them will come work for Iron EagleX, but Sebastian knows that he is adding to the talent pool and paying it forward. Another interesting solution that I just loved, and I'm glad we were talking about it today, because this was so unique, and I just loved it from John Martin of ProObject. I don't know if you remember him, Rachel, but he's the musician, and we were talking about jazz. He had a really fabulous idea. They do both commercial and cleared work, and he makes sure their commercial work sort of aligns with their cleared work. So then they build people in through the commercial side, have them get experience, have them get to know what's going on, and then get them cleared. And I think that's a really great way to grow your own. I mean, you're still adding value to your company, but you're also adding to the over talent pool. And John is just one of those great guys who definitely pays it forward. Some of the other things out there, we're starting to see the intelligence community and DHS has been offering internships. And if you know young people in your community, get them involved in one of the internships. Let them see if this is something that they really want. I know a lot of people that I've introduced to the DHS internships and the IC internships, and they just come back to me three or four years later and just say, “Wow, thank you. I would have never, ever thought of this kind of career.” I really have to give kudos to the Fort Meade Alliance. They created an organization called Project Scope, which really helps high school students and college students understand the security cleared careers and the security clearance process. So kudos to John Martin, Project Scope, Sebastian Lambert, and all these people who are going above and beyond to make sure we have additional talent in this talent pool.

Rachel Bozeman  16:00

Good on you friends, good on you. So this point in the conversation, we've already talked about retaining our transitioning military clearance holders and greening the workforce with fresh civilian talent. But now let's dive a little bit further into strategies to make sure that you're adding people to your talent pipeline effectively. I think that's the key word, effectively, since we really do not have the luxury of letting great candidates just fall off our radar. So we've talked about events and job fairs as a way to engage veterans, but it's a great tactic across the board for our veteran and non-veteran cleared professionals alike. Frank Trigueros at Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory said they look for talent across the nation that wants to support the mission by being creative, going to conferences, going to career fairs, but also doing talks to engage your younger talent pool as well. It's about meeting your candidates where they're at, whether that's on base, a job fair, or an industry conference. And then making sure that you're adding them to your pipeline for the future. Also, our friend Kate Copley at Odyssey Systems Consulting Group, explained how important it is to pipeline candidates for quick turnarounds required on contracts. She said she has multiple examples of talking with someone at an event and then staying in touch with them and setting calendar reminders to check in. Yes, if we don't help remind ourselves, it's likely we're going to forget, so I think that was a great reminder from Kate to make it a priority. Put it on your calendar so that you can go out there and keep that conversation going. She's been able to turn around roles incredibly quickly by building rapport with candidates and checking in with them frequently.

Kathleen Smith  17:52

Great tip. Again, a lot of these techniques, they're sort of old school basics. I know that one thing we thought when we were asking this question throughout the last three years was, we thought we would find some silver bullet tool that can do it all. Sorry, friends. This is sales 101. This is relationship building. This is organization. It's communication. It's all of it. So these are just wonderful reminders that you have the tools within your capability. It's just putting it together. Like we mentioned earlier, military talent knows other military talent. Well, data analysts know other data analysts, and admins know other admins. What am I talking about? I'm talking about referrals. And we talked to Katie Sargent over at TwoSix Technologies about their referral program. She said between 35 and 40% of their employees are hired through their employee referral program. Their recruiting team follows up with referrals -- wait for it -- within 48 hours of hearing of the referral. 48 hours, a quick turnaround. But they've branded the program. They've launched it. They've made it easily accessible to everybody in the company. And be sure your referral program is easy to understand by the employees and by the people in your community. It's easy to launch, easy to get into. It's going to be one of your really great pipeline additions. We also talked about alumni associations, alumni groups, making sure that those people who have been part of your company know that they can always come back, know that they're still considered part of your family. Invite them to events, make sure you're keeping in touch with them. These are all things that will make sure your talent pool is always fresh.

Rachel Bozeman  19:43

These are great ways to really build that healthy talent pipeline. But let's not forget about the candidates that maybe we had to reject for a specific role or maybe a contingent position that just didn't get awarded. Jess Matthias at Core4ce said she can't tell you how many times that she's hired someone six months, maybe even a year later, because they were able to keep that relationship and conversation going. Maybe it isn't the right fit right now, but she offered feedback and made sure her pipeline was rich and ready for the future, and it really paid off.

Kathleen Smith  20:22

Yes, so we've had some really great ideas here, and hopefully you've gone back and listened to some of the components and taken notes. Before we wrap up, I want to talk about retention. It's something that we don't really talk about a lot in this industry. If someone wants to leave, if someone goes to a different contract, oh, well, boo hoo. No, let's meet the need before it happens, before that person leaves. There aren't enough candidates to go around. So before you lose them, you might want to find out how you can keep them. And I recall a conversation with Mike Giovannetti at Axiologic Solutions. He talked about retention passionately. He really talked about, if candidates are leaving, they don't want to just put a little band aid on the problem and simply keep trying to hire more people and having more churn. He and his company really wanted to go in and find out why people were leaving. And sometimes it’s a quality of hire issue. Sometimes it's, as he said, a quality of opportunity issue. You might have someone who's really stellar, but you brought them in and they got bored. They thought they were here for some really grand job, but you were just trying to put that square peg in a round hole. And Mike really got excited about, let's talk about the opportunities, and are we making sure we're putting the people in the right opportunity? So he goes back and he checks in with the people that he hired. Are you really happy here? And do you see yourself staying here? What's your career like? He’s really proactively looking at that retention. And I think that something that we also don't talk a lot about, but has been brought up in several defense and workforce talent strategy studies that have been done over the last three or four years, is that we don't really talk about career development. And this is just the nascent issue that a lot of people are starting to talk about, is that you don't bring in someone just to fill a butt in a seat, just to fill a specific contract. Through the whole recruitment, hiring, and onboarding process, check in. Talk about their career development. Where do they want to go? A lot of people don't want to be a program manager for the rest of their life. Some people are DevOps and they want to do offensive strategy. Be sure that you go in. I've seen a lot of companies now are adding a department of retention and making sure that they have a strategy for the people that they have worked so hard to get on board. They're making sure that they have a career opportunity. So at the end of the day, it's not, again, a silver bullet. It is about facing the recruiting challenges and knowing that you have those skills, those tools, within your team, within yourself. You have to be disciplined and push yourself for that pipeline for tomorrow, not just for today. As Molly O'Boyle said way back in the beginning of our podcast, you have to set up routines for yourself, check everything routinely, and get to know the industry, so that you can keep looking at candidates in fresh, different ways. And speaking of routines, I want to make sure that I hear from Rachel. What are some of the things that you've really thought was great about retaining talent, career development, and making sure that these people that we have in this talent pool, we keep them>

Rachel Bozeman  23:58

No, I love it. I think retention is such an important part of the conversation. And retention really does come through career development. It's about investing. We talk about investing in the recruitment process, making sure you're building that pipeline and doing all of those things. But no pipeline, it doesn't matter if you can't keep people in there. If you're constantly having to go to that pipeline, it's going to continue to shrink. So by just investing in them, having the conversations, talking to those employees about, “Where do you see yourself? What is it going to take to get there?” Driving that accountability. Development doesn't happen to you. It happens with you. So it's a two-way conversation with those employees and saying, “Well, where do you see yourself going? Why is that of interest to you, and how can I help you get there?” And by doing that, it just builds loyalty. It builds commitment. And ultimately, what we're all driven for and driven by are getting results, taking care of the mission, and doing the right thing for our organizations. And so it's simple. Listen, invest, and really help build that retention and that incredible workforce that is going to project that organization in a way that's going to surpass all of those other organizations out there.

Kathleen Smith  25:09

So we've covered a lot of challenges, everything from communication, salary, getting people on site. I just want to thank everyone for listening to these episodes. This is great. We do have one more episode, so be sure you're sharing this with your colleagues. Rate, review us, be sure you go back and listen to some of the other episodes if you're feeling a little stuck at that time. And we look forward to talking to you on our next episode. Bye, bye. See you later.