{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":39.525999999999996,"endTime":40.661,"body":"Well would"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":39.525999999999996,"endTime":40.661,"body":"you look at the time?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":40.721000000000004,"endTime":45.311,"body":"It's time for another episode"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":40.721000000000004,"endTime":45.311,"body":"of Therapy Natters the podcast"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":45.311,"endTime":49.061,"body":"series all about talk therapy,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":45.311,"endTime":49.061,"body":"mental health, and a little"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":49.061,"endTime":52.721000000000004,"body":"bit about why we do what we"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":49.061,"endTime":52.721000000000004,"body":"do feel the way that we feel"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":52.721000000000004,"endTime":55.421,"body":"and think the way that we"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":52.721000000000004,"endTime":55.421,"body":"think I'm Richard Nicholls"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":55.451,"endTime":57.521,"body":"and with me is Fiona Biddle."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":57.521,"endTime":60.221000000000004,"body":"And between the two of us,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":57.521,"endTime":60.221000000000004,"body":"we'll see what questions of"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":60.221000000000004,"endTime":61.751,"body":"yours we can answer today."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":61.991,"endTime":65.291,"body":"First question to ask"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":61.991,"endTime":65.291,"body":"though, Fiona, how"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":65.291,"endTime":66.251,"body":"are you doing today?"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":67.051,"endTime":67.831,"body":"I'm doing really well."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":67.831,"endTime":68.251,"body":"Thank you."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":68.67099999999999,"endTime":69.061,"body":"I've got,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":69.166,"endTime":70.301,"body":"the height"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":69.166,"endTime":70.301,"body":"of an English summer."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":70.86099999999999,"endTime":71.131,"body":"yes."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":71.281,"endTime":71.521,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":71.521,"endTime":72.331,"body":"So it's cold."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":72.811,"endTime":76.17099999999999,"body":"Um, but I've got"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":72.811,"endTime":76.17099999999999,"body":"well, it's true."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":76.17099999999999,"endTime":76.711,"body":"It is."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":77.23599999999999,"endTime":77.956,"body":"yeah."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":78.031,"endTime":78.511,"body":"I'm, I'm"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":78.76599999999999,"endTime":79.336,"body":"it all the way now."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":79.336,"endTime":79.606,"body":"Isn't it."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":79.696,"endTime":81.826,"body":"I'm looking after"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":79.696,"endTime":81.826,"body":"Jack's dog at the moment."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":81.826,"endTime":83.146,"body":"So I'm, I'm happy."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":83.23599999999999,"endTime":84.286,"body":"He's nice."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":84.52600000000001,"endTime":84.706,"body":"Got"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":84.886,"endTime":86.566,"body":"you Got yourself,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":84.886,"endTime":86.566,"body":"a dog for the week."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":87.136,"endTime":87.436,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":87.706,"endTime":88.336,"body":"The whole week."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":89.02600000000001,"endTime":90.166,"body":"Five nights, I think."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":91.006,"endTime":91.756,"body":"Oh, nice."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":92.416,"endTime":93.46600000000001,"body":"And you can be trusted."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":94.44999999999999,"endTime":95.88999999999999,"body":"You said"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":94.44999999999999,"endTime":95.88999999999999,"body":"that as a statement."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":95.91999999999999,"endTime":97.57,"body":"You didn't put a"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":95.91999999999999,"endTime":97.57,"body":"question mark on the end."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":99.63999999999999,"endTime":100.93,"body":"so yes, I can."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":101.02000000000001,"endTime":102.31,"body":"I can be trusted."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":103.0,"endTime":104.11000000000001,"body":"I've never"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":103.0,"endTime":104.11000000000001,"body":"known you have a dog."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":104.22999999999999,"endTime":104.97999999999999,"body":"I've never had a dog."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":104.97999999999999,"endTime":107.25999999999999,"body":"They've never looked to a dog"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":104.97999999999999,"endTime":107.25999999999999,"body":"after a dog overnight before."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":107.77000000000001,"endTime":108.78999999999999,"body":"But we're doing alright."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":109.57,"endTime":110.65,"body":"I can be trusted."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":111.78999999999999,"endTime":113.41,"body":"I think we're doing okay."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":113.41,"endTime":114.00999999999999,"body":"Aren't we darling."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":114.1,"endTime":114.69999999999999,"body":"Where's she gone?"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":114.75999999999999,"endTime":116.74000000000001,"body":"I dunno where she's"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":114.75999999999999,"endTime":116.74000000000001,"body":"gone, but we're"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":116.77000000000001,"endTime":118.6,"body":"I'm wondering"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":116.77000000000001,"endTime":118.6,"body":"though, I'm wondering"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":118.6,"endTime":119.44,"body":"if this is denial."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":120.1,"endTime":123.37,"body":"He says shoe horning in the"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":120.1,"endTime":123.37,"body":"topic for today's episode."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":124.56,"endTime":127.17099999999999,"body":"And that is actually"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":124.56,"endTime":127.17099999999999,"body":"a point because when we"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":127.17599999999999,"endTime":129.6,"body":"get into this, we'll find,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":127.17599999999999,"endTime":129.6,"body":"there are lots of overlaps"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":129.605,"endTime":132.63,"body":"between these here things"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":129.605,"endTime":132.63,"body":"called defense mechanisms."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":132.837,"endTime":134.898,"body":"Yes last"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":132.837,"endTime":134.898,"body":"week, we said we were"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":134.898,"endTime":135.648,"body":"gonna do an episode."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":135.768,"endTime":139.368,"body":"In fact, from day one, I think"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":135.768,"endTime":139.368,"body":"a few months ago we said, oh,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":139.368,"endTime":141.708,"body":"we're doing an episode about"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":139.368,"endTime":141.708,"body":"defense mechanisms one day."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":141.919,"endTime":146.599,"body":"So I asked my patrons on"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":141.919,"endTime":146.599,"body":"patreon.com, my supporters"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":146.599,"endTime":149.272,"body":"of  my projects And said,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":146.599,"endTime":149.272,"body":"we're gonna do an episode"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":149.272,"endTime":150.322,"body":"about defense mechanisms."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":150.322,"endTime":151.422,"body":"Do you have any questions?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":151.612,"endTime":156.982,"body":"And they did hooray so"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":151.612,"endTime":156.982,"body":"we do have some comments"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":156.982,"endTime":159.267,"body":"and questions, from"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":156.982,"endTime":159.267,"body":"existing listeners who"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":159.267,"endTime":160.317,"body":"are interested in, in"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":160.322,"endTime":162.507,"body":"defense mechanisms and"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":160.322,"endTime":162.507,"body":"what makes us tick on"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":162.507,"endTime":163.917,"body":"why we do what we do."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":163.977,"endTime":166.617,"body":"Say what we say and think"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":163.977,"endTime":166.617,"body":"the way that we think."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":166.971,"endTime":169.011,"body":"Do you wanna introduce"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":166.971,"endTime":169.011,"body":"these people?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":169.011,"endTime":169.281,"body":"These"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":169.691,"endTime":169.971,"body":"questions?"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":170.42,"endTime":173.672,"body":"I think it might"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":170.42,"endTime":173.672,"body":"be an idea to introduce"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":173.672,"endTime":177.78199999999998,"body":"a little bit of theory"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":173.672,"endTime":177.78199999999998,"body":"first and then come to the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":177.787,"endTime":179.762,"body":"questions as they fit in."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":179.917,"endTime":182.432,"body":"Fiona, what"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":179.917,"endTime":182.432,"body":"is a defense mechanism?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":182.432,"endTime":184.352,"body":"What do we mean by defending?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":184.50199999999998,"endTime":186.932,"body":"What are we defending in"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":184.50199999999998,"endTime":186.932,"body":"this defense mechanism?"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":187.90699999999998,"endTime":188.477,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":188.73399999999998,"endTime":191.787,"body":"Before I try to answer"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":188.73399999999998,"endTime":191.787,"body":"that question, I think it"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":191.787,"endTime":194.427,"body":"is important to say that"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":191.787,"endTime":194.427,"body":"it's blooming complicated"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":194.607,"endTime":198.837,"body":"because lots of people have"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":194.607,"endTime":198.837,"body":"got their own theories about"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":198.84199999999998,"endTime":201.637,"body":"it,  and we literally could"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":198.84199999999998,"endTime":201.637,"body":"be here for hours and hours"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":201.637,"endTime":204.617,"body":"and hours going through"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":201.637,"endTime":204.617,"body":"all the different types."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":204.90699999999998,"endTime":205.317,"body":"So,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":205.595,"endTime":208.20499999999998,"body":"we need to keep it"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":205.595,"endTime":208.20499999999998,"body":"fairly simple and"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":208.20499999999998,"endTime":211.11499999999998,"body":"straightforward whilst"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":208.20499999999998,"endTime":211.11499999999998,"body":"recognizing the complexity."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":212.015,"endTime":215.255,"body":"But I would say that the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":212.015,"endTime":215.255,"body":"defense mechanism is a way"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":215.255,"endTime":220.385,"body":"to protect ourselves from"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":215.255,"endTime":220.385,"body":"pain, anguish, stress,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":220.715,"endTime":223.45499999999998,"body":"anxiety, in everyday life."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":224.355,"endTime":228.945,"body":"And whilst the term defense"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":224.355,"endTime":228.945,"body":"mechanism is often used"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":228.975,"endTime":230.385,"body":"in a sort of negative way."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":231.025,"endTime":231.975,"body":"As a bad thing."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":233.08499999999998,"endTime":234.525,"body":"it's really, really important."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":234.525,"endTime":237.285,"body":"We use them, some of"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":234.525,"endTime":237.285,"body":"them, some of the time"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":237.58499999999998,"endTime":241.784,"body":"in some ways, because we"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":237.58499999999998,"endTime":241.784,"body":"couldn't live in the world"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":241.784,"endTime":244.48399999999998,"body":"as it is now, maybe ever."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":244.48399999999998,"endTime":245.114,"body":"I don't know."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":245.474,"endTime":248.998,"body":"There's too much going on to"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":245.474,"endTime":248.998,"body":"be able to take everything"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":250.333,"endTime":253.423,"body":"in take everything on"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":250.333,"endTime":253.423,"body":"to process everything."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":254.143,"endTime":259.507,"body":"So we have to use defense"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":254.143,"endTime":259.507,"body":"mechanisms, generally, and"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":259.567,"endTime":261.03700000000003,"body":"sometimes specifically."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":261.427,"endTime":264.427,"body":"So please listeners"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":261.427,"endTime":264.427,"body":"don't think that these"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":264.427,"endTime":268.357,"body":"are things to get rid of"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":264.427,"endTime":268.357,"body":"they're things to work with"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":268.717,"endTime":270.637,"body":"productively and positively."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":271.091,"endTime":275.531,"body":"I think understanding"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":271.091,"endTime":275.531,"body":"defense mechanisms is a way"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":275.621,"endTime":280.331,"body":"of helping us to understand"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":275.621,"endTime":280.331,"body":"each other, and in that"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":280.331,"endTime":283.181,"body":"understanding can lead to"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":280.331,"endTime":283.181,"body":"an acceptance of each other"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":283.181,"endTime":288.521,"body":"and ourselves, and that can"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":283.181,"endTime":288.521,"body":"lead to a happier system,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":288.551,"endTime":290.831,"body":"whether it's a family system,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":288.551,"endTime":290.831,"body":"whether it's a community"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":290.836,"endTime":294.881,"body":"system, whether it's just our"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":290.836,"endTime":294.881,"body":"own internal system, it  can"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":294.881,"endTime":296.111,"body":"help put our mind at rest."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":296.116,"endTime":298.85699999999997,"body":"If we know that the way"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":296.116,"endTime":298.85699999999997,"body":"that we act has a, has"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":298.85699999999997,"endTime":300.23699999999997,"body":"a reason has a purpose."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":300.822,"endTime":303.972,"body":"."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":300.822,"endTime":303.972,"body":"Fiona: Well, even that phrase,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":303.972,"endTime":307.48199999999997,"body":"almost sort of saying let's"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":303.972,"endTime":307.48199999999997,"body":"activate defense mechanisms."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":307.48199999999997,"endTime":307.782,"body":"Isn't it."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":307.787,"endTime":311.592,"body":"And I noticed earlier, just"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":307.787,"endTime":311.592,"body":"as I was thinking before"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":311.592,"endTime":313.476,"body":"we .came on to do this."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":313.866,"endTime":316.956,"body":"I heard somebody on the"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":313.866,"endTime":316.956,"body":"TV said, you need to take"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":316.956,"endTime":318.486,"body":"your mind off things."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":319.236,"endTime":322.116,"body":"And I thought, oh, isn't"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":319.236,"endTime":322.116,"body":"that a lovely phrase?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":322.116,"endTime":324.57599999999996,"body":"It's just one of those"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":322.116,"endTime":324.57599999999996,"body":"wonderful phrases that we have"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":324.581,"endTime":328.44599999999997,"body":"in the English language that"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":324.581,"endTime":328.44599999999997,"body":"everybody knows what it means."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":329.07599999999996,"endTime":330.306,"body":"And everybody can accept."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":331.026,"endTime":331.476,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":331.626,"endTime":336.626,"body":"I need to take my mind off"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":331.626,"endTime":336.626,"body":"things, but that's a defense."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":336.806,"endTime":342.236,"body":"It's a, it's a back off,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":336.806,"endTime":342.236,"body":"defend, move way from."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":342.94599999999997,"endTime":344.866,"body":"I was gonna"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":342.94599999999997,"endTime":344.866,"body":"say is acceptance a"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":344.866,"endTime":345.94599999999997,"body":"defense mechanism."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":346.216,"endTime":349.392,"body":"No, it's not, but denial"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":346.216,"endTime":349.392,"body":"would be, and we can use"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":349.392,"endTime":352.532,"body":"denial as a way of accepting"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":352.532,"endTime":352.652,"body":"things"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":352.652,"endTime":352.712,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":352.75,"endTime":355.303,"body":"I think it's,  the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":352.75,"endTime":355.303,"body":"baseline, for all defense"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":355.308,"endTime":356.503,"body":"mechanisms, denial."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":356.652,"endTime":360.806,"body":"And it can be very positive"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":356.652,"endTime":360.806,"body":"if talking about how"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":360.806,"endTime":362.426,"body":"overwhelming life can be."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":363.686,"endTime":368.80899999999997,"body":"If in the current world, we"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":363.686,"endTime":368.80899999999997,"body":"were to allow everything in."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":368.899,"endTime":374.449,"body":"So we allow ourselves to get"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":368.899,"endTime":374.449,"body":"a complete and full picture"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":375.319,"endTime":377.899,"body":"right now, right now, a"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":375.319,"endTime":377.899,"body":"complete and full picture"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":378.319,"endTime":384.253,"body":"of climate change of the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":378.319,"endTime":384.253,"body":"war in Ukraine of, rising"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":384.253,"endTime":387.58299999999997,"body":"prices of, pending strikes."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":388.218,"endTime":390.618,"body":"Of existential anxiety,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":390.82099999999997,"endTime":391.781,"body":"this is"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":390.82099999999997,"endTime":391.781,"body":"freaking me out"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":391.901,"endTime":392.231,"body":"yeah."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":392.291,"endTime":392.471,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":392.501,"endTime":392.771,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":392.771,"endTime":393.281,"body":"So right."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":393.311,"endTime":393.911,"body":"That's enough."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":394.001,"endTime":394.871,"body":"So stop now."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":396.101,"endTime":398.381,"body":"we need to get back into"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":396.101,"endTime":398.381,"body":"our denial because you"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":398.70799999999997,"endTime":400.258,"body":"can't,  hold it all."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":401.308,"endTime":403.048,"body":"So we are naturally."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":403.433,"endTime":406.13599999999997,"body":"using denial, to live"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":406.83299999999997,"endTime":409.02299999999997,"body":"How often do we"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":406.83299999999997,"endTime":409.02299999999997,"body":"talk about the idea of, of,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":409.028,"endTime":411.603,"body":"mental health being based"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":409.028,"endTime":411.603,"body":"around living in the moment?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":411.846,"endTime":415.056,"body":"That's a form of denial"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":411.846,"endTime":415.056,"body":"to a degree that's okay."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":415.086,"endTime":417.63599999999997,"body":"We're expected to,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":415.086,"endTime":417.63599999999997,"body":"it's a good thing."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":417.756,"endTime":419.616,"body":"Yeah, it is,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":417.756,"endTime":419.616,"body":"it is a good thing."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":419.82599999999996,"endTime":420.906,"body":"Um, except when it isn't."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":420.906,"endTime":425.086,"body":"So, when I was looking up"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":420.906,"endTime":425.086,"body":"the theory as I promised last"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":425.086,"endTime":430.089,"body":"week, I would, one example"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":425.086,"endTime":430.089,"body":"that I found was when somebody"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":430.089,"endTime":436.009,"body":"finds, let's say a lump"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":430.089,"endTime":436.009,"body":"or, a change in some bodily"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":436.519,"endTime":441.979,"body":"function and , and that as"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":436.519,"endTime":441.979,"body":"we're sitting here, we know,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":442.099,"endTime":444.379,"body":"well, if you find something"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":442.099,"endTime":444.379,"body":"like that, you go to the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":444.379,"endTime":446.289,"body":"doctor to get it checked out."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":447.539,"endTime":449.05899999999997,"body":"But people"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":449.779,"endTime":453.964,"body":"will very often use"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":449.779,"endTime":453.964,"body":"denial on that and say,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":454.354,"endTime":455.734,"body":"oh no, no, no, no, no, no."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":455.794,"endTime":456.754,"body":"I'm just imagining it."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":456.814,"endTime":459.154,"body":"And just completely"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":456.814,"endTime":459.154,"body":"block it outta their mind"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":459.694,"endTime":463.541,"body":"because of the fear of"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":459.694,"endTime":463.541,"body":"the potential outcome."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":463.931,"endTime":466.901,"body":"So that's the time when"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":463.931,"endTime":466.901,"body":"denial not a good thing."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":467.577,"endTime":469.437,"body":"So it's important"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":467.577,"endTime":469.437,"body":"to differentiate."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":470.697,"endTime":473.787,"body":"And to recognize when you"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":470.697,"endTime":473.787,"body":"are using denial positively"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":475.017,"endTime":475.287,"body":"when you're"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":475.377,"endTime":475.887,"body":"not."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":476.397,"endTime":478.707,"body":"Yeah, because that"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":476.397,"endTime":478.707,"body":"denial isn't about"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":478.712,"endTime":479.697,"body":"isn't being positive."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":479.697,"endTime":481.137,"body":"It isn't being optimistic."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":481.167,"endTime":484.527,"body":"Being optimistic would be,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":481.167,"endTime":484.527,"body":"oh, looks like there's a lump."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":484.827,"endTime":486.057,"body":"I better get that checked out."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":486.23699999999997,"endTime":488.697,"body":"It's probably nothing,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":486.23699999999997,"endTime":488.697,"body":"but I'll get it confirmed."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":488.907,"endTime":491.847,"body":"That's optimism and"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":488.907,"endTime":491.847,"body":"that's, that's a"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":491.847,"endTime":493.317,"body":"nice, healthy attitude"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":493.347,"endTime":493.677,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":494.337,"endTime":494.997,"body":"to go."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":495.462,"endTime":496.992,"body":"Oh, this hasn't changed."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":496.992,"endTime":498.102,"body":"that's been like"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":496.992,"endTime":498.102,"body":"that for years."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":498.102,"endTime":498.642,"body":"It's normal."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":498.642,"endTime":499.722,"body":"I was probably born"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":498.642,"endTime":499.722,"body":"with that anyway."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":500.442,"endTime":501.522,"body":"That's denial."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":501.61199999999997,"endTime":504.67199999999997,"body":"And then if it starts to"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":501.61199999999997,"endTime":504.67199999999997,"body":"grow to go, no, I'm sure"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":504.677,"endTime":505.602,"body":"it's always been that big."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":505.842,"endTime":507.762,"body":"I'm sure that lump on my leg"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":505.842,"endTime":507.762,"body":"has always been that big."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":508.752,"endTime":509.802,"body":"Again, that's denial."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":509.802,"endTime":511.212,"body":"That's not optimism."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":511.212,"endTime":512.847,"body":"That's not positive thinking."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":513.1370000000001,"endTime":517.2090000000001,"body":"But then let's say,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":513.1370000000001,"endTime":517.2090000000001,"body":"that you've gone and got"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":517.419,"endTime":520.389,"body":"the checked and you're"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":517.419,"endTime":520.389,"body":"waiting for the results."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":521.019,"endTime":523.3290000000001,"body":"Then use denial"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":521.019,"endTime":523.3290000000001,"body":"whilst you're waiting."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":523.907,"endTime":526.067,"body":"Because that goes back"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":523.907,"endTime":526.067,"body":"to an episode that we"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":526.067,"endTime":528.767,"body":"did, uh, a while ago on"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":526.067,"endTime":528.767,"body":"worthless worries, cuz"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":529.337,"endTime":530.327,"body":"not gonna do you any good."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":530.7470000000001,"endTime":534.1610000000001,"body":"So switch on your denial"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":530.7470000000001,"endTime":534.1610000000001,"body":"at that point until"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":534.166,"endTime":535.091,"body":"you get the result."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":535.091,"endTime":538.571,"body":"And then if it's bad news,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":535.091,"endTime":538.571,"body":"well then there's different"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":538.576,"endTime":540.227,"body":"things that can be done."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":540.5500000000001,"endTime":544.5640000000001,"body":"so it's being careful as to"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":540.5500000000001,"endTime":544.5640000000001,"body":"how you use these things."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":545.224,"endTime":546.4540000000001,"body":"So should we do another one?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":547.4240000000001,"endTime":547.9440000000001,"body":"Indeed."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":548.264,"endTime":549.7040000000001,"body":"Let's go"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":548.264,"endTime":549.7040000000001,"body":"for repression."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":549.7040000000001,"endTime":550.1740000000001,"body":"Shall we?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":550.764,"endTime":551.5490000000001,"body":"It's a common one."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":554.264,"endTime":557.024,"body":"The thing with"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":554.264,"endTime":557.024,"body":"repression, which basically"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":557.024,"endTime":563.077,"body":"means to not really remember"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":557.024,"endTime":563.077,"body":"that something happened, in"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":563.1370000000001,"endTime":565.37,"body":"some, psychological theories."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":565.577,"endTime":568.8470000000001,"body":"I mean, Freud believed"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":565.577,"endTime":568.8470000000001,"body":"that some things were too"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":568.8470000000001,"endTime":570.167,"body":"much for the mind to take."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":570.3770000000001,"endTime":574.8870000000001,"body":"And so they were squished down"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":570.3770000000001,"endTime":574.8870000000001,"body":"so that literally, there was"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":574.8870000000001,"endTime":579.1990000000001,"body":"no conscious awareness of the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":574.8870000000001,"endTime":579.1990000000001,"body":"incident or, emotion attached"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":579.1990000000001,"endTime":583.1220000000001,"body":"to said incident at all,  the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":579.1990000000001,"endTime":583.1220000000001,"body":"jury's still out on that one."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":583.5120000000001,"endTime":588.647,"body":"Really as to whether that"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":583.5120000000001,"endTime":588.647,"body":"actually does happen."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":588.647,"endTime":592.738,"body":"maybe it's more suppression,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":588.647,"endTime":592.738,"body":"actively squishing something"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":592.738,"endTime":594.778,"body":"down that, you know,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":592.738,"endTime":594.778,"body":"you've squished it down."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":595.3480000000001,"endTime":599.0980000000001,"body":"So one example that's often"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":595.3480000000001,"endTime":599.0980000000001,"body":"used is about, let's say"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":599.0980000000001,"endTime":603.298,"body":"somebody who, uh, been, in"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":599.0980000000001,"endTime":603.298,"body":"the military in a war and."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":603.725,"endTime":607.325,"body":"They say, oh, well, I"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":603.725,"endTime":607.325,"body":"know that were terrible"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":607.325,"endTime":608.975,"body":"things happening, but I"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":607.325,"endTime":608.975,"body":"really don't remember them."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":609.388,"endTime":613.168,"body":"Is that repression as"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":609.388,"endTime":613.168,"body":"in they actually don't"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":613.618,"endTime":617.0680000000001,"body":"or is it suppression"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":613.618,"endTime":617.0680000000001,"body":"where it's Squished down."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":617.619,"endTime":618.7890000000001,"body":"Often"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":617.619,"endTime":618.7890000000001,"body":"it's suppression."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":618.9390000000001,"endTime":619.599,"body":"I think."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":620.619,"endTime":621.879,"body":"When it's described to me."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":622.5690000000001,"endTime":623.9490000000001,"body":"Can be repression."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":624.606,"endTime":630.2890000000001,"body":"There're times I think when"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":624.606,"endTime":630.2890000000001,"body":"repression can prevent PTSD."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":631.4090000000001,"endTime":634.349,"body":"And it stops the brain from"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":631.4090000000001,"endTime":634.349,"body":"latching onto traumatic"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":634.349,"endTime":638.099,"body":"memories and making a,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":634.349,"endTime":638.099,"body":"a somatic, uh, feeling"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":638.099,"endTime":641.1890000000001,"body":"within their body, which"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":638.099,"endTime":641.1890000000001,"body":"then turns into potentially"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":641.339,"endTime":643.6790000000001,"body":"a somatization, which is"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":641.339,"endTime":643.6790000000001,"body":"another defense mechanism."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":643.769,"endTime":645.8090000000001,"body":"You know, actually feel"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":643.769,"endTime":645.8090000000001,"body":"this thing in my body."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":645.8090000000001,"endTime":646.589,"body":"My body's reacting."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":649.6640000000001,"endTime":652.364,"body":"Neurologists would, would"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":649.6640000000001,"endTime":652.364,"body":"look at the way the brain"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":652.6940000000001,"endTime":654.6740000000001,"body":"and memory is, is formed."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":654.6740000000001,"endTime":656.474,"body":"And look at the difference"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":654.6740000000001,"endTime":656.474,"body":"between short term memory"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":656.474,"endTime":659.254,"body":"and long term memory to"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":656.474,"endTime":659.254,"body":"move something, to move"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":659.254,"endTime":661.6840000000001,"body":"an experience, a memory"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":659.254,"endTime":661.6840000000001,"body":"from being short term"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":661.744,"endTime":665.0340000000001,"body":"into long term, that"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":661.744,"endTime":665.0340000000001,"body":"takes a couple of minutes."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":665.5440000000001,"endTime":668.3340000000001,"body":"And if something happens"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":665.5440000000001,"endTime":668.3340000000001,"body":"in an instant, that's"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":668.3340000000001,"endTime":669.354,"body":"really traumatic."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":670.5540000000001,"endTime":675.1740000000001,"body":"And then 45 seconds later it's"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":670.5540000000001,"endTime":675.1740000000001,"body":"the actual event is, is over"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":675.1740000000001,"endTime":679.014,"body":"with either because it didn't"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":675.1740000000001,"endTime":679.014,"body":"happen after all because the"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":679.014,"endTime":681.5340000000001,"body":"lorry jack knifed, but didn't"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":679.014,"endTime":681.5340000000001,"body":"hit you and you went past"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":681.5340000000001,"endTime":686.4540000000001,"body":"it or it's just happened and"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":681.5340000000001,"endTime":686.4540000000001,"body":"it's over and it was fast."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":687.774,"endTime":691.614,"body":"Irrespective of any physical"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":687.774,"endTime":691.614,"body":"trauma, the brain can push"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":691.614,"endTime":692.634,"body":"that memory away and go."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":692.6640000000001,"endTime":694.494,"body":"We don't need to put that"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":692.6640000000001,"endTime":694.494,"body":"into long-term memory."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":694.5540000000001,"endTime":696.384,"body":"And as far as the"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":694.5540000000001,"endTime":696.384,"body":"brain is concerned, it"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":696.389,"endTime":697.9440000000001,"body":"just did not happen."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":698.0340000000001,"endTime":700.224,"body":"It didn't happen cuz the"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":698.0340000000001,"endTime":700.224,"body":"memory has never been"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":700.224,"endTime":703.3000000000001,"body":"kept alive by, remembering"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":700.224,"endTime":703.3000000000001,"body":"it as every day goes by."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":704.11,"endTime":705.4000000000001,"body":"That sounds helpful."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":705.7940000000001,"endTime":708.894,"body":"What do you think about"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":705.7940000000001,"endTime":708.894,"body":"the theory that, the mind"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":709.017,"endTime":713.106,"body":"does still have the memory"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":709.017,"endTime":713.106,"body":"in a sense, but the conscious"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":713.106,"endTime":714.426,"body":"doesn't have access to it."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":714.426,"endTime":716.3760000000001,"body":"So it's still"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":714.426,"endTime":716.3760000000001,"body":"causing a problem."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":716.586,"endTime":720.666,"body":"I had a client once who came"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":716.586,"endTime":720.666,"body":"to me with fear of driving."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":721.9860000000001,"endTime":724.446,"body":"And I asked the obvious"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":721.9860000000001,"endTime":724.446,"body":"question, have you"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":724.5060000000001,"endTime":727.8960000000001,"body":"ever had any issues,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":724.5060000000001,"endTime":727.8960000000001,"body":"accidents, anything?"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":728.3760000000001,"endTime":730.1160000000001,"body":"And she said, oh, I"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":728.3760000000001,"endTime":730.1160000000001,"body":"had an accident once,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":730.1210000000001,"endTime":731.226,"body":"but it was fine."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":731.226,"endTime":731.976,"body":"Nobody was hurt."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":731.976,"endTime":732.726,"body":"It was no problem."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":733.056,"endTime":739.936,"body":"But in hypnosis, she went"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":733.056,"endTime":739.936,"body":"back to that accident and for"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":739.936,"endTime":744.556,"body":"a split second, she thought"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":739.936,"endTime":744.556,"body":"she had killed her boyfriend."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":745.7860000000001,"endTime":746.7460000000001,"body":"She was driving."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":747.556,"endTime":751.7860000000001,"body":"He was just absolutely"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":747.556,"endTime":751.7860000000001,"body":"stock still when the car"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":752.446,"endTime":758.176,"body":"stopped and her mind thought,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":752.446,"endTime":758.176,"body":"oh my God, he's dead."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":758.7460000000001,"endTime":762.1360000000001,"body":"And then he moved in"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":758.7460000000001,"endTime":762.1360000000001,"body":"that sort of timeframe."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":762.541,"endTime":763.591,"body":"Who knows."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":763.6510000000001,"endTime":764.4910000000001,"body":"Nobody knows."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":764.4960000000001,"endTime":765.1510000000001,"body":"She doesn't know."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":765.1510000000001,"endTime":769.441,"body":"And I certainly don't know"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":765.1510000000001,"endTime":769.441,"body":"how true how factual this"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":769.441,"endTime":776.6110000000001,"body":"story was, but this gave"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":769.441,"endTime":776.6110000000001,"body":"her the reason for her"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":776.7610000000001,"endTime":778.3810000000001,"body":"being afraid of driving."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":780.7660000000001,"endTime":782.596,"body":"Again, like"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":780.7660000000001,"endTime":782.596,"body":"you say, we don't know,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":782.686,"endTime":785.686,"body":"is that, is that just a"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":782.686,"endTime":785.686,"body":"metaphor that helps somebody"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":785.686,"endTime":787.7560000000001,"body":"heal and move on maybe,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":788.566,"endTime":790.426,"body":"see what I mean, when"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":788.566,"endTime":790.426,"body":"I said it was complicated,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":790.921,"endTime":791.581,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":791.9860000000001,"endTime":794.176,"body":"let's go onto"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":791.9860000000001,"endTime":794.176,"body":"another really complicated"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":794.176,"endTime":796.086,"body":"one projection."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":796.3820000000001,"endTime":797.8820000000001,"body":"I'm going to get a"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":796.3820000000001,"endTime":797.8820000000001,"body":"definition for this one."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":798.332,"endTime":804.452,"body":"I will read it out for you"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":798.332,"endTime":804.452,"body":"placing unacceptable impulses"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":804.9920000000001,"endTime":807.452,"body":"from yourself onto others."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":808.022,"endTime":812.192,"body":"So there's something within"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":808.022,"endTime":812.192,"body":"the self that you feel is not"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":812.2520000000001,"endTime":813.542,"body":"acceptable to hold it there."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":813.542,"endTime":816.272,"body":"So you put it out onto others."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":816.392,"endTime":818.946,"body":"It's quite a hard"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":816.392,"endTime":818.946,"body":"one to identify."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":818.9970000000001,"endTime":819.2420000000001,"body":"But."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":819.365,"endTime":821.735,"body":"A couple of examples"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":819.365,"endTime":821.735,"body":"we've got here."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":822.586,"endTime":823.576,"body":"The example."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":824.1160000000001,"endTime":827.806,"body":"Becky often accuses other"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":824.1160000000001,"endTime":827.806,"body":"women of talking too much and"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":827.806,"endTime":832.1560000000001,"body":"spreading rumours It is rather"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":827.806,"endTime":832.1560000000001,"body":"obvious to those who know her,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":832.1560000000001,"endTime":835.8760000000001,"body":"that she is revealing her own"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":832.1560000000001,"endTime":835.8760000000001,"body":"inclinations in that area."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":836.926,"endTime":842.8290000000001,"body":"And another example here"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":836.926,"endTime":842.8290000000001,"body":"is of a guy who often goes"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":842.8290000000001,"endTime":845.5590000000001,"body":"to nightclubs with his"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":842.8290000000001,"endTime":845.5590000000001,"body":"buddies and has affairs"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":845.769,"endTime":848.0690000000001,"body":"because he suspects his"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":845.769,"endTime":848.0690000000001,"body":"wife is having an affair."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":848.0690000000001,"endTime":851.648,"body":"too actually, I think just"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":848.0690000000001,"endTime":851.648,"body":"to simplify that one probably"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":851.7080000000001,"endTime":856.658,"body":"makes a bit more sense to"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":851.7080000000001,"endTime":856.658,"body":"say that somebody who is"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":856.658,"endTime":859.4780000000001,"body":"feeling that they are at"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":856.658,"endTime":859.4780000000001,"body":"risk of having an affair."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":861.008,"endTime":865.12,"body":"Is likely to say to their"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":861.008,"endTime":865.12,"body":"partner, I don't trust you."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":865.87,"endTime":868.12,"body":"I think that that's easier"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":865.87,"endTime":868.12,"body":"than that example of the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":868.12,"endTime":870.37,"body":"guy going to the nightclub"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":868.12,"endTime":870.37,"body":"and actually doing it."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":870.37,"endTime":873.8050000000001,"body":"I think it makes more sense"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":870.37,"endTime":873.8050000000001,"body":"to think of it as internally,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":874.5550000000001,"endTime":878.065,"body":"I feel these urges, so,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":874.5550000000001,"endTime":878.065,"body":"but I can't accept them."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":878.065,"endTime":879.505,"body":"So I'm gonna put"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":878.065,"endTime":879.505,"body":"them out on you."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":880.0450000000001,"endTime":881.4250000000001,"body":"You are the one"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":880.0450000000001,"endTime":881.4250000000001,"body":"who's doing that."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":882.325,"endTime":885.456,"body":"Yeah, we do hear"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":882.325,"endTime":885.456,"body":"those stories a lot in"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":885.456,"endTime":889.606,"body":"therapy as family members"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":885.456,"endTime":889.606,"body":"and friends will, treat."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":889.9860000000001,"endTime":891.8760000000001,"body":"Other people that way they'll"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":889.9860000000001,"endTime":891.8760000000001,"body":"treat our clients like that."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":891.8760000000001,"endTime":893.5260000000001,"body":"And the clients will"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":891.8760000000001,"endTime":893.5260000000001,"body":"come in and go, why"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":893.5260000000001,"endTime":894.576,"body":"was I treated this way?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":894.576,"endTime":895.5060000000001,"body":"Is this because of me?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":895.5060000000001,"endTime":896.586,"body":"Or is it because of them?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":897.0,"endTime":899.466,"body":"I go, ah that's why a little"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":897.0,"endTime":899.466,"body":"bit of psychoeducation can"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":899.466,"endTime":900.7560000000001,"body":"be quite useful for people."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":901.296,"endTime":903.456,"body":"If they can see why other"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":901.296,"endTime":903.456,"body":"people treat them the way"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":903.456,"endTime":905.826,"body":"that they treat them, they can"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":903.456,"endTime":905.826,"body":"see that the other person's"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":905.831,"endTime":909.2760000000001,"body":"just made a mistake, but it's"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":905.831,"endTime":909.2760000000001,"body":"a normal human thing to do."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":910.341,"endTime":914.1210000000001,"body":"When I notice"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":910.341,"endTime":914.1210000000001,"body":"a sort of puzzlement"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":914.691,"endTime":918.291,"body":"within a client about a"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":914.691,"endTime":918.291,"body":"relationship when they're"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":918.441,"endTime":920.841,"body":"doing that, I saw your face."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":920.841,"endTime":923.1510000000001,"body":"Then when you said you"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":920.841,"endTime":923.1510000000001,"body":"got little puzzled,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":923.181,"endTime":924.051,"body":"look on your face."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":924.5310000000001,"endTime":929.331,"body":"Why when you get that"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":924.5310000000001,"endTime":929.331,"body":"sort don't understand,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":930.051,"endTime":930.8910000000001,"body":"look for projection."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":932.166,"endTime":935.45,"body":"Because it's often there,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":932.166,"endTime":935.45,"body":"happens in all sorts of"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":935.45,"endTime":939.9820000000001,"body":"relationships, bosses, will,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":935.45,"endTime":939.9820000000001,"body":"project onto their, employees."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":940.505,"endTime":941.2650000000001,"body":"It's very interesting."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":941.84,"endTime":945.08,"body":"we are hearing a"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":941.84,"endTime":945.08,"body":"lot of pushback from a lot"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":945.08,"endTime":947.0,"body":"of political commentators"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":945.08,"endTime":947.0,"body":"and, and even members"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":947.0,"endTime":948.11,"body":"of parliament saying."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":949.94,"endTime":953.0300000000001,"body":"The the pandemic is to"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":949.94,"endTime":953.0300000000001,"body":"a degree anyway, over"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":953.2700000000001,"endTime":954.98,"body":"why is everybody still"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":953.2700000000001,"endTime":954.98,"body":"working from home?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":955.19,"endTime":956.9000000000001,"body":"Everybody needs to get"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":955.19,"endTime":956.9000000000001,"body":"back into the office."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":956.9000000000001,"endTime":958.19,"body":"Everybody needs"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":956.9000000000001,"endTime":958.19,"body":"to get working."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":959.615,"endTime":961.625,"body":"We are, they are working."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":962.075,"endTime":963.215,"body":"They're just working"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":962.075,"endTime":963.215,"body":"from home where there's"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":963.215,"endTime":964.4150000000001,"body":"a bit more flexibility."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":965.105,"endTime":967.475,"body":"And these characters are"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":965.105,"endTime":967.475,"body":"saying, no, no, no, no."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":967.475,"endTime":967.6850000000001,"body":"no."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":967.8950000000001,"endTime":969.875,"body":"I've, I've been out for"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":967.8950000000001,"endTime":969.875,"body":"a walk during the day."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":969.9050000000001,"endTime":972.2650000000001,"body":"I've seen people taking,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":969.9050000000001,"endTime":972.2650000000001,"body":"going out for a walk too."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":972.365,"endTime":973.985,"body":"There's a lot of people"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":972.365,"endTime":973.985,"body":"working from home when the"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":973.985,"endTime":975.005,"body":"sun shines isn't there."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":975.335,"endTime":976.835,"body":"They need to be getting"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":975.335,"endTime":976.835,"body":"in there working."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":977.375,"endTime":980.4050000000001,"body":"And by the sound of"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":977.375,"endTime":980.4050000000001,"body":"things, one, you."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":981.8000000000001,"endTime":982.7,"body":"You're doing the same thing."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":982.73,"endTime":984.5600000000001,"body":"If you're going for a walk"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":982.73,"endTime":984.5600000000001,"body":"in the sunshine too, you"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":984.5600000000001,"endTime":990.38,"body":"know, for a start, shut up"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":984.5600000000001,"endTime":990.38,"body":"for one or I'll give you"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":990.38,"endTime":994.0400000000001,"body":"a back slap and, and it's."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":994.13,"endTime":997.5200000000001,"body":"And it's potentially maybe"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":994.13,"endTime":997.5200000000001,"body":"projection that well, if"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":997.5250000000001,"endTime":999.9200000000001,"body":"I had the opportunity to"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":997.5250000000001,"endTime":999.9200000000001,"body":"do nothing, I would too."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1000.4200000000001,"endTime":1001.6500000000001,"body":"That's not what we do."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1001.98,"endTime":1004.47,"body":"And there has been a big"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1001.98,"endTime":1004.47,"body":"pushback lately because"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1004.47,"endTime":1007.95,"body":"there's a, there's a huge"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1004.47,"endTime":1007.95,"body":"campaign for a, a living wage"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1007.95,"endTime":1011.2800000000001,"body":"that says one of the ways to"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1007.95,"endTime":1011.2800000000001,"body":"help with the mental health"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1011.2800000000001,"endTime":1014.0400000000001,"body":"of the, of the country is"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1011.2800000000001,"endTime":1014.0400000000001,"body":"to get people outta poverty."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1014.4000000000001,"endTime":1016.35,"body":"And the only way to get"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1014.4000000000001,"endTime":1016.35,"body":"people outta poverty, if"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1016.355,"endTime":1019.5600000000001,"body":"food prices are, are, are"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1016.355,"endTime":1019.5600000000001,"body":"high, is to raise wages."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1019.7700000000001,"endTime":1021.4200000000001,"body":"And that has to come"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1019.7700000000001,"endTime":1021.4200000000001,"body":"from a little bit more"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1021.4200000000001,"endTime":1024.69,"body":"tax on those high, big,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1021.4200000000001,"endTime":1024.69,"body":"big billionaire earners."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1025.23,"endTime":1025.77,"body":"And."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1026.685,"endTime":1028.785,"body":"There's a lot of, uh,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1026.685,"endTime":1028.785,"body":"fairly wealthy people"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1028.785,"endTime":1032.445,"body":"saying, no, if you, if you"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1028.785,"endTime":1032.445,"body":"give people free money,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1032.625,"endTime":1034.875,"body":"then that's no incentive"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1032.625,"endTime":1034.875,"body":"for them to go to work."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1035.415,"endTime":1037.725,"body":"But that's not what the"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1035.415,"endTime":1037.725,"body":"studies have ever suggested."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1037.905,"endTime":1041.445,"body":"Studies have consistently said"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1037.905,"endTime":1041.445,"body":"that we want to be productive."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1041.865,"endTime":1045.645,"body":"That to feel unproductive,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1041.865,"endTime":1045.645,"body":"even if we've got, even if"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1045.645,"endTime":1046.265,"body":"we, we are quite wealthy."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1047.04,"endTime":1048.69,"body":"People can be made redundant"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1047.04,"endTime":1048.69,"body":"and they're still their"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1048.69,"endTime":1049.83,"body":"mental health still drops."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1049.86,"endTime":1051.57,"body":"They've got plenty of"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1049.86,"endTime":1051.57,"body":"money coming in, but"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1051.62,"endTime":1053.87,"body":"they're not contributing"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1051.62,"endTime":1053.87,"body":"to society and so on."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1053.87,"endTime":1056.48,"body":"So they, we, as a human,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1053.87,"endTime":1056.48,"body":"we want to do stuff"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1056.48,"endTime":1057.62,"body":"we want to contribute."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1057.6799999999998,"endTime":1061.82,"body":"But when somebody says  I"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1057.6799999999998,"endTime":1061.82,"body":"don't wanna see people"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1061.82,"endTime":1064.85,"body":"getting benefits because"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1061.82,"endTime":1064.85,"body":"they, they're not gonna,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1064.8799999999999,"endTime":1065.99,"body":"they're not gonna do anything."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1066.4399999999998,"endTime":1069.1399999999999,"body":"Often, that's projection where"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1066.4399999999998,"endTime":1069.1399999999999,"body":"people think that if I had the"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1069.1399999999999,"endTime":1072.11,"body":"opportunity to do nothing all"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1069.1399999999999,"endTime":1072.11,"body":"day, then that's what I'd do."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1073.06,"endTime":1073.28,"body":"And."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1073.5149999999999,"endTime":1075.705,"body":"I get it."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1075.7649999999999,"endTime":1078.165,"body":"We all wanna do nothing from"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1075.7649999999999,"endTime":1078.165,"body":"time to time, but believe"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1078.165,"endTime":1080.2649999999999,"body":"me, after a little while"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1078.165,"endTime":1080.2649999999999,"body":"of doing nothing, you're"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1080.2649999999999,"endTime":1083.5049999999999,"body":"desperate to go and do"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1080.2649999999999,"endTime":1083.5049999999999,"body":"something we all need to"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1083.5049999999999,"endTime":1084.495,"body":"learn about these things."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1084.495,"endTime":1084.915,"body":"I think"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1085.385,"endTime":1089.3149999999998,"body":"We talked about"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1085.385,"endTime":1089.3149999999998,"body":"shadow didn't we Yes."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1089.345,"endTime":1090.0049999999999,"body":"I thought did."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1090.365,"endTime":1090.7549999999999,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1091.5349999999999,"endTime":1094.406,"body":"What's happening there is"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1091.5349999999999,"endTime":1094.406,"body":"they're projecting a uh,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1094.406,"endTime":1097.616,"body":"an element of their shadow"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1094.406,"endTime":1097.616,"body":"out onto other people."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1097.826,"endTime":1101.0069999999998,"body":"And remember that the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1097.826,"endTime":1101.0069999999998,"body":"shadow has things that"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1101.012,"endTime":1103.376,"body":"you fear being, not"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1101.012,"endTime":1103.376,"body":"necessarily things you are."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1104.0059999999999,"endTime":1107.5159999999998,"body":"So it would be quite"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1104.0059999999999,"endTime":1107.5159999999998,"body":"likely that somebody"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1107.5159999999998,"endTime":1108.806,"body":"who's projecting out."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1109.796,"endTime":1112.706,"body":"They're doing nothing,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1109.796,"endTime":1112.706,"body":"actually wouldn't be"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1112.706,"endTime":1115.076,"body":"doing nothing, but they"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1112.706,"endTime":1115.076,"body":"just fear that they would"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1115.316,"endTime":1117.2659999999998,"body":"and that's unacceptable."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1117.326,"endTime":1119.456,"body":"Therefore they put"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1117.326,"endTime":1119.456,"body":"it out onto others."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1120.1609999999998,"endTime":1123.4009999999998,"body":"It's also worth iterating,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1120.1609999999998,"endTime":1123.4009999999998,"body":"cause I imagine that we"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1123.4009999999998,"endTime":1125.531,"body":"did say this, that not"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1123.4009999999998,"endTime":1125.531,"body":"everything in the shadow"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1125.6209999999999,"endTime":1128.231,"body":"is actually something you"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1125.6209999999999,"endTime":1128.231,"body":"would think would be bad."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1128.531,"endTime":1131.471,"body":"So quite often we can project"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1128.531,"endTime":1131.471,"body":"things that are actually"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1131.531,"endTime":1136.001,"body":"quite good onto other people"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1131.531,"endTime":1136.001,"body":"as well, which also leads to"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1136.0059999999999,"endTime":1138.341,"body":"that puzzlement and confusion."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1138.671,"endTime":1142.2649999999999,"body":"Why is this person saying"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1138.671,"endTime":1142.2649999999999,"body":"I'm like this when I'm not,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1142.325,"endTime":1144.425,"body":"but I wouldn't mind being"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1142.325,"endTime":1144.425,"body":"like that, but I'm not."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1144.425,"endTime":1145.5049999999999,"body":"Why are they saying I am."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1145.912,"endTime":1146.782,"body":"that's an"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1145.912,"endTime":1146.782,"body":"interesting one."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1148.792,"endTime":1150.8519999999999,"body":"Does this feed in with some"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1148.792,"endTime":1150.8519999999999,"body":"of the questions that we got?"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1150.992,"endTime":1152.7069999999999,"body":"Oh, good point."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1153.277,"endTime":1153.847,"body":"Does it"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1154.5169999999998,"endTime":1155.802,"body":"Cause we've"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1154.5169999999998,"endTime":1155.802,"body":"got  three questions."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1156.312,"endTime":1158.172,"body":"Um, let's make sure"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1156.312,"endTime":1158.172,"body":"that we're gonna answer"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1158.172,"endTime":1159.252,"body":"these as much as we can."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1160.032,"endTime":1161.3519999999999,"body":"Question from Anon."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1161.502,"endTime":1162.1319999999998,"body":"Anon says."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1163.8719999999998,"endTime":1166.482,"body":"How do you differentiate"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1163.8719999999998,"endTime":1166.482,"body":"between a change which would"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1166.482,"endTime":1169.992,"body":"improve your mental health"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1166.482,"endTime":1169.992,"body":"versus an avoidance behavior?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1170.742,"endTime":1172.8419999999999,"body":"When I'm struggling there are"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1170.742,"endTime":1172.8419999999999,"body":"certain things that I'll take"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1172.8419999999999,"endTime":1175.752,"body":"a break from such as reading"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1172.8419999999999,"endTime":1175.752,"body":"the news, engaging with social"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1175.752,"endTime":1178.782,"body":"media or online dating, but"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1175.752,"endTime":1178.782,"body":"at what point does it become"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1178.782,"endTime":1181.722,"body":"a less helpful instinct"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1178.782,"endTime":1181.722,"body":"to where I end up avoiding"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1181.7269999999999,"endTime":1183.732,"body":"anything that feels difficult?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1184.182,"endTime":1186.282,"body":"So that's using"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1184.182,"endTime":1186.282,"body":"the, the defense"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1186.282,"endTime":1187.6019999999999,"body":"mechanism of avoidance."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1188.6219999999998,"endTime":1191.682,"body":"But is there a balance is"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1188.6219999999998,"endTime":1191.682,"body":"what they're asking between"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1191.682,"endTime":1194.772,"body":"it being a useful defense"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1191.682,"endTime":1194.772,"body":"mechanism to protect their"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1194.772,"endTime":1198.192,"body":"salary or an unhelpful"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1194.772,"endTime":1198.192,"body":"defense mechanism that"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1198.492,"endTime":1202.1789999999999,"body":"prevents productivity or"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1198.492,"endTime":1202.1789999999999,"body":"prevents even personal"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1202.1789999999999,"endTime":1205.749,"body":"development and, and facing"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1202.1789999999999,"endTime":1205.749,"body":"challenges and difficulties."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1206.9189999999999,"endTime":1209.019,"body":"we even, how do we"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1206.9189999999999,"endTime":1209.019,"body":"find that balance"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1209.184,"endTime":1211.364,"body":"well, you've just"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1209.184,"endTime":1211.364,"body":"used the crucial word."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1211.869,"endTime":1212.319,"body":"Twice."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1212.319,"endTime":1212.9489999999998,"body":"Balance."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1213.399,"endTime":1215.019,"body":"And that's what it is."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1215.109,"endTime":1218.819,"body":"You can certainly, use"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1215.109,"endTime":1218.819,"body":"avoidance too much."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1219.2089999999998,"endTime":1223.279,"body":"And, certainly using it to"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1219.2089999999998,"endTime":1223.279,"body":"a degree in those cases."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1223.3339999999998,"endTime":1227.444,"body":"So engaging with social"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1223.3339999999998,"endTime":1227.444,"body":"media, not doing that is."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1227.513,"endTime":1228.413,"body":"perfectly reasonable."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1228.413,"endTime":1230.783,"body":"Avoiding the news sometimes"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1228.413,"endTime":1230.783,"body":"seems perfectly reasonable"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1230.783,"endTime":1233.46,"body":"if those are causing,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1230.783,"endTime":1233.46,"body":"stress or anxiety."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1233.638,"endTime":1238.498,"body":"But to, you know, bury"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1233.638,"endTime":1238.498,"body":"yourself away and never"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1238.7379999999998,"endTime":1241.258,"body":"see what's going on in the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1238.7379999999998,"endTime":1241.258,"body":"world, then that seems a"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1241.258,"endTime":1243.328,"body":"little bit out of balance."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1243.763,"endTime":1246.193,"body":"One of my"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1243.763,"endTime":1246.193,"body":"catchphrases is nothing's"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1246.193,"endTime":1248.3029999999999,"body":"a problem unless"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1246.193,"endTime":1248.3029999999999,"body":"it causes problems."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1248.953,"endTime":1250.153,"body":"say it every week?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1251.773,"endTime":1252.463,"body":"I think I"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1252.673,"endTime":1253.783,"body":"do yes."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1254.003,"endTime":1254.493,"body":"clients"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1255.283,"endTime":1256.3329999999999,"body":"most sessions."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1256.6029999999998,"endTime":1257.0529999999999,"body":"agree."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1257.058,"endTime":1258.973,"body":"It cannot really"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1257.058,"endTime":1258.973,"body":"be overstated."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1259.463,"endTime":1262.883,"body":"So I, I know people have"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1259.463,"endTime":1262.883,"body":"told me that I look at"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1262.883,"endTime":1266.783,"body":"the news headlines too"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1262.883,"endTime":1266.783,"body":"much and I said, well, I"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1266.873,"endTime":1267.743,"body":"don't have a problem with."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1268.838,"endTime":1269.618,"body":"then it's"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1268.838,"endTime":1269.618,"body":"not too much for"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1270.4279999999999,"endTime":1270.7279999999998,"body":"too much."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1270.7279999999998,"endTime":1271.1779999999999,"body":"for them."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1271.268,"endTime":1272.7079999999999,"body":"Yeah, exactly."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1273.098,"endTime":1275.4479999999999,"body":"And so same with social media."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1275.4479999999999,"endTime":1277.655,"body":"I mean, I don't really"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1275.4479999999999,"endTime":1277.655,"body":"like Twitter because I"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1277.655,"endTime":1279.375,"body":"find it terribly negative."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1280.235,"endTime":1280.325,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1280.385,"endTime":1280.5049999999999,"body":"Hmm."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1280.864,"endTime":1283.504,"body":"whereas Instagram"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1280.864,"endTime":1283.504,"body":"and Facebook, sometimes"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1283.504,"endTime":1284.3139999999999,"body":"you get nice things."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1284.3139999999999,"endTime":1288.5439999999999,"body":"You get little nice"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1284.3139999999999,"endTime":1288.5439999999999,"body":"videos of dogs and cats."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1289.789,"endTime":1290.149,"body":"Hmm."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1290.605,"endTime":1292.615,"body":"so yeah,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1290.605,"endTime":1292.615,"body":"it's about balance."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1292.885,"endTime":1294.2649999999999,"body":"These things are"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1292.885,"endTime":1294.2649999999999,"body":"about balance."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1294.2649999999999,"endTime":1297.7749999999999,"body":"So I think that really is"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1294.2649999999999,"endTime":1297.7749999999999,"body":"this, this the simple, maybe"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1297.7749999999999,"endTime":1301.5159999999998,"body":"a sort of get out answer"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1297.7749999999999,"endTime":1301.5159999999998,"body":"for Anon, I suppose to me,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1301.936,"endTime":1303.946,"body":"the most important thing"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1301.936,"endTime":1303.946,"body":"is  thinking about it."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1304.0839999999998,"endTime":1304.384,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1304.5939999999998,"endTime":1306.514,"body":"Then you can work it"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1304.5939999999998,"endTime":1306.514,"body":"out and go, yeah, this"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1306.514,"endTime":1307.5339999999999,"body":"is causing a problem."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1307.5939999999998,"endTime":1311.981,"body":"I am avoiding too much and"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1307.5939999999998,"endTime":1311.981,"body":"avoiding social situations"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1311.999,"endTime":1312.869,"body":"can make you lonely."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1313.5439999999999,"endTime":1315.734,"body":"But it could also protect"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1313.5439999999999,"endTime":1315.734,"body":"you from social anxiety"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1316.514,"endTime":1317.8039999999999,"body":"or other sorts of anxiety."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1317.954,"endTime":1319.874,"body":"If it's making you lonely,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1317.954,"endTime":1319.874,"body":"then it's a problem."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1320.504,"endTime":1324.164,"body":"If it's helping you to feel"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1320.504,"endTime":1324.164,"body":"comforted and you're more"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1324.164,"endTime":1327.8709999999999,"body":"introverted than sitting on"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1324.164,"endTime":1327.8709999999999,"body":"the sofa with, um, a film or,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1327.8709999999999,"endTime":1331.051,"body":"something creative drawing,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1327.8709999999999,"endTime":1331.051,"body":"coloring in, whatever,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1331.831,"endTime":1334.051,"body":"if that's doing you good,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1331.831,"endTime":1334.051,"body":"then it's not a problem."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1334.384,"endTime":1335.414,"body":"That's the way I look at it."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1335.414,"endTime":1335.8139999999999,"body":"Anyway."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1336.619,"endTime":1336.9189999999999,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1336.9189999999999,"endTime":1338.809,"body":"And that, that just reminded"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1336.9189999999999,"endTime":1338.809,"body":"me of something else."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1338.809,"endTime":1341.779,"body":"I was thinking earlier about"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1338.809,"endTime":1341.779,"body":"the fact that watching a film,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1342.319,"endTime":1346.4289999999999,"body":"reading a book, coloring in,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1342.319,"endTime":1346.4289999999999,"body":"doing embroidery, knitting,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1346.729,"endTime":1347.899,"body":"all sorts of things like that."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1347.899,"endTime":1350.9669999999999,"body":"They're sort of defense"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1347.899,"endTime":1350.9669999999999,"body":"mechanisms really?"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1350.9969999999998,"endTime":1355.197,"body":"Aren't they there a way of"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1350.9969999999998,"endTime":1355.197,"body":"just keeping yourself in a"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1355.197,"endTime":1358.245,"body":"little bit and stopping the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1355.197,"endTime":1358.245,"body":"outside world, affecting"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1358.245,"endTime":1362.595,"body":"you, which, I mean, where's,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1358.245,"endTime":1362.595,"body":"where's the balance on that?"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1362.625,"endTime":1366.0249999999999,"body":"I think the, again,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1362.625,"endTime":1366.0249999999999,"body":"it, it does apply"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1366.135,"endTime":1367.0049999999999,"body":"the word, doesn't it?"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1367.0049999999999,"endTime":1370.485,"body":"I think certainly sometimes"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1367.0049999999999,"endTime":1370.485,"body":"I go too far into the,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1370.8629999999998,"endTime":1373.683,"body":"sitting and embroidering all"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1370.8629999999998,"endTime":1373.683,"body":"weekend and watching Netflix."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1375.4679999999998,"endTime":1375.9479999999999,"body":"Oh, yeah."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1376.758,"endTime":1379.7279999999998,"body":"But again, not, I don't"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1376.758,"endTime":1379.7279999999998,"body":"think it's a problem,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1379.998,"endTime":1381.528,"body":"but other people might"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1379.998,"endTime":1381.528,"body":"say it was a problem."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1381.588,"endTime":1382.4279999999999,"body":"So there we go."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1383.2379999999998,"endTime":1384.338,"body":"So what was next?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1384.5439999999999,"endTime":1387.4479999999999,"body":"Uh, Cheryl from"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1384.5439999999999,"endTime":1387.4479999999999,"body":"London who asks, would"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1387.453,"endTime":1390.2079999999999,"body":"it be a defense mechanism"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1387.453,"endTime":1390.2079999999999,"body":"to feel the need, to make"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1390.2079999999999,"endTime":1392.248,"body":"light of serious problems?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1392.4879999999998,"endTime":1394.618,"body":"For some reason when faced"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1392.4879999999998,"endTime":1394.618,"body":"with difficulties like"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1394.618,"endTime":1397.378,"body":"redundancy and even when a"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1394.618,"endTime":1397.378,"body":"friend's boyfriend was hurt"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1397.378,"endTime":1398.578,"body":"in a motorbike accident."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1398.903,"endTime":1402.023,"body":"I almost felt like I was"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1398.903,"endTime":1402.023,"body":"in a comedy TV program"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1402.0829999999999,"endTime":1404.483,"body":"and needed to lighten"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1402.0829999999999,"endTime":1404.483,"body":"the mood with jokes."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1404.5729999999999,"endTime":1406.8529999999998,"body":"Why can't I just"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1404.5729999999999,"endTime":1406.8529999999998,"body":"accept reality?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1407.033,"endTime":1408.383,"body":"Is this denial?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1408.473,"endTime":1409.3129999999999,"body":"Thanks."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1410.043,"endTime":1411.328,"body":"Short answer, or long answer."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1411.3329999999999,"endTime":1413.7279999999998,"body":"Uh, short answer no"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1411.3329999999999,"endTime":1413.7279999999998,"body":"that's not denial."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1414.328,"endTime":1417.058,"body":"Well, it I suppose, but the"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1414.328,"endTime":1417.058,"body":"long answer would be that"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1417.0629999999999,"endTime":1418.168,"body":"you're just using humor."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1419.098,"endTime":1420.6879999999999,"body":"just been just using humor."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1421.4879999999998,"endTime":1423.048,"body":"It's very well known."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1423.378,"endTime":1428.028,"body":"I think that, uh, humor is"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1423.378,"endTime":1428.028,"body":"a very useful, strategy."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1428.9379999999999,"endTime":1431.9679999999998,"body":"Maybe it's more of a"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1428.9379999999999,"endTime":1431.9679999999998,"body":"coping mechanism than"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1431.973,"endTime":1433.858,"body":"a defense mechanism."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1434.569,"endTime":1438.599,"body":"Vailant called it"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1434.569,"endTime":1438.599,"body":"a, a mature defence mechanism"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1438.792,"endTime":1441.097,"body":"was trying to avoid"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1438.792,"endTime":1441.097,"body":"Valent, cuz it's getting"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1441.097,"endTime":1444.067,"body":"so complicated, the mature"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1441.097,"endTime":1444.067,"body":"immature, et cetera, etcetera."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1444.067,"endTime":1446.966,"body":"But yeah, I mean  If you"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1444.067,"endTime":1446.966,"body":"think about, um, the,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1446.966,"endTime":1451.466,"body":"the black humor that,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1446.966,"endTime":1451.466,"body":"um, people in let's say"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1451.646,"endTime":1454.346,"body":"difficult occupations use."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1454.346,"endTime":1458.701,"body":"So,  you mentioned about"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1454.346,"endTime":1458.701,"body":"a fire officer earlier"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1458.701,"endTime":1461.521,"body":"when we were talking, that"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1458.701,"endTime":1461.521,"body":"could be paramedics, uh,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1461.521,"endTime":1465.6309999999999,"body":"surgeons, military, the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1461.521,"endTime":1465.6309999999999,"body":"police, they, they use,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1465.811,"endTime":1466.771,"body":"they use black humor."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1467.9289999999999,"endTime":1472.779,"body":"and it's, it is a way of"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1467.9289999999999,"endTime":1472.779,"body":"coping and I suppose it's,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1472.869,"endTime":1476.9189999999999,"body":"as long as everybody's"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1472.869,"endTime":1476.9189999999999,"body":"on the same page with"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1476.9189999999999,"endTime":1478.418,"body":"it, then it's okay."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1478.868,"endTime":1482.7669999999998,"body":"It's only when somebody's"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1478.868,"endTime":1482.7669999999998,"body":"not, or they're using some"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1482.7669999999998,"endTime":1487.692,"body":"particular type of humor that"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1482.7669999999998,"endTime":1487.692,"body":"somebody in the system, finds"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1487.692,"endTime":1491.802,"body":"objectionable, then it can"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1487.692,"endTime":1491.802,"body":"be a problem, but natural."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1492.5069999999998,"endTime":1493.287,"body":"It's natural."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1493.3819999999998,"endTime":1496.4969999999998,"body":"it is, and"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1493.3819999999998,"endTime":1496.4969999999998,"body":"it's been helpful."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1496.4969999999998,"endTime":1500.317,"body":"Dark as humor can be in"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1496.4969999999998,"endTime":1500.317,"body":"traumatic experiences."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1501.9869999999999,"endTime":1505.797,"body":"and It can seem disrespectful,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1501.9869999999999,"endTime":1505.797,"body":"and I understand why people"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1505.797,"endTime":1507.277,"body":"would frown about it."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1508.137,"endTime":1510.417,"body":"But when you can see that"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1508.137,"endTime":1510.417,"body":"it's a defense mechanism"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1510.417,"endTime":1513.7169999999999,"body":"and it's there to protect"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1510.417,"endTime":1513.7169999999999,"body":"us from trauma, we need"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1513.7169999999999,"endTime":1514.947,"body":"to let people do it."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1515.427,"endTime":1517.587,"body":"There's been a lot of"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1515.427,"endTime":1517.587,"body":"cutbacks in the fire service"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1517.797,"endTime":1518.9969999999998,"body":"over the last few years."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1519.297,"endTime":1524.74,"body":"And one of the things that"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1519.297,"endTime":1524.74,"body":"was taken out was, and maybe"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1524.74,"endTime":1526.1799999999998,"body":"there were other reasons"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1524.74,"endTime":1526.1799999999998,"body":"why it was taken out, but"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1526.1799999999998,"endTime":1528.1599999999999,"body":"they're always used to be"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1526.1799999999998,"endTime":1528.1599999999999,"body":"in fire stations, a little"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1528.1599999999999,"endTime":1529.57,"body":"bar, there'd be a bar area."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1530.05,"endTime":1532.84,"body":"And that's where after"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1530.05,"endTime":1532.84,"body":"work, the firefighters"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1533.8149999999998,"endTime":1536.335,"body":"would would, would go and"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1533.8149999999998,"endTime":1536.335,"body":"they'd have a drink and they"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1536.335,"endTime":1539.485,"body":"would talk about the things"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1536.335,"endTime":1539.485,"body":"that, that experienced."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1539.485,"endTime":1544.975,"body":"And they'd talk about trigger"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1539.485,"endTime":1544.975,"body":"warning for severe trauma in"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1545.0649999999998,"endTime":1548.905,"body":"accidents, road accidents,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1545.0649999999998,"endTime":1548.905,"body":"skip if you have to, but"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1548.905,"endTime":1551.935,"body":"they would talk about the"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1548.905,"endTime":1551.935,"body":"bodies that they'd seen"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1552.2949999999998,"endTime":1555.715,"body":"and even the children that"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1552.2949999999998,"endTime":1555.715,"body":"they'd seen dead and they"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1555.715,"endTime":1559.575,"body":"would talk about it and they"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1555.715,"endTime":1559.575,"body":"would have to joke about it."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1561.6399999999999,"endTime":1566.08,"body":"And dark as that is it"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1561.6399999999999,"endTime":1566.08,"body":"helped them to process it."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1567.1,"endTime":1569.83,"body":"And then when those bars were"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1567.1,"endTime":1569.83,"body":"taken out for a couple of"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1569.83,"endTime":1572.32,"body":"different reasons, ethical"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1569.83,"endTime":1572.32,"body":"potentially, but certainly"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1572.32,"endTime":1575.53,"body":"financially and they, and"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1572.32,"endTime":1575.53,"body":"they couldn't take those,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1575.53,"endTime":1576.7,"body":"those stories to the pub."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1577.282,"endTime":1582.712,"body":"And they needed to do that in"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1577.282,"endTime":1582.712,"body":"order to not go home and cry."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1583.942,"endTime":1586.012,"body":"And it does seem, just"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1583.942,"endTime":1586.012,"body":"seem disrespectful,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1586.1119999999999,"endTime":1587.042,"body":"of course it does."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1587.552,"endTime":1590.1019999999999,"body":"But when you can see"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1587.552,"endTime":1590.1019999999999,"body":"the reasons behind it,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1591.152,"endTime":1593.702,"body":"I think it makes it"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1591.152,"endTime":1593.702,"body":"somewhat more acceptable."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1594.422,"endTime":1595.8919999999998,"body":"And I know that's dif"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1594.422,"endTime":1595.8919999999998,"body":"that might be difficult"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1595.8919999999998,"endTime":1596.552,"body":"for people to hear."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1597.6319999999998,"endTime":1600.062,"body":"It certainly"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1597.6319999999998,"endTime":1600.062,"body":"makes it understandable."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1600.062,"endTime":1603.6019999999999,"body":"And again, I iterate"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1600.062,"endTime":1603.6019999999999,"body":"the, the, if within"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1603.6019999999999,"endTime":1604.982,"body":"the system it's okay."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1605.6689999999999,"endTime":1609.1589999999999,"body":"I saw a joke actually"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1605.6689999999999,"endTime":1609.1589999999999,"body":"earlier today on Facebook."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1609.389,"endTime":1615.319,"body":"I can't remember what the joke"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1609.389,"endTime":1615.319,"body":"was, but somebody responded"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1615.319,"endTime":1617.569,"body":"saying that was sexist."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1618.829,"endTime":1620.479,"body":"And then somebody"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1618.829,"endTime":1620.479,"body":"came back and said,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1623.779,"endTime":1624.9489999999998,"body":"it was just funny."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1625.4289999999999,"endTime":1627.7089999999998,"body":"And it was a woman who"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1625.4289999999999,"endTime":1627.7089999999998,"body":"said it was sexist."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1627.714,"endTime":1631.129,"body":"She came back and she said,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1627.714,"endTime":1631.129,"body":"I didn't say it wasn't funny."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1631.456,"endTime":1633.9959999999999,"body":"Sexism and humor"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1631.456,"endTime":1633.9959999999999,"body":"are not distinct."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1634.2759999999998,"endTime":1635.7759999999998,"body":"It can be both."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1636.436,"endTime":1639.0159999999998,"body":"And then some guy and"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1636.436,"endTime":1639.0159999999998,"body":"I'm going by their names."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1639.721,"endTime":1643.471,"body":"Say, but some guy came"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1639.721,"endTime":1643.471,"body":"back and said it was funny"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1643.531,"endTime":1647.491,"body":"because, and then explained"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1643.531,"endTime":1647.491,"body":"the reasons to her."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1647.581,"endTime":1650.8809999999999,"body":"She was tagged to explain."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1652.1409999999998,"endTime":1655.964,"body":"And did actually, respond"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1652.1409999999998,"endTime":1655.964,"body":"and said, thank you"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1656.144,"endTime":1657.464,"body":"to whoever this was."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1657.704,"endTime":1660.941,"body":"I am sure that woman's"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1657.704,"endTime":1660.941,"body":"name was very glad that"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1660.941,"endTime":1662.711,"body":"you mansplained this to her"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1664.6309999999999,"endTime":1667.1509999999998,"body":"I thought the whole thing"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1664.6309999999999,"endTime":1667.1509999999998,"body":"was, was really funny."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1667.241,"endTime":1671.021,"body":"The fact that, that these"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1667.241,"endTime":1671.021,"body":"guys couldn't get the fact"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1671.021,"endTime":1675.971,"body":"that it could be sexist and"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1671.021,"endTime":1675.971,"body":"funny, but that's, that's"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1676.091,"endTime":1677.951,"body":"the thing about, about humor?"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1678.234,"endTime":1680.754,"body":"just sort of taking it"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1678.234,"endTime":1680.754,"body":"away from the extremes."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1681.5639999999999,"endTime":1684.024,"body":"Of the, uh, the, the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1681.5639999999999,"endTime":1684.024,"body":"firemen and so on."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1685.194,"endTime":1690.494,"body":"Most people, most people or"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1685.194,"endTime":1690.494,"body":"people I don't know, will"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1690.854,"endTime":1695.384,"body":"use humor as a defense when"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1690.854,"endTime":1695.384,"body":"they're feeling a little"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1695.384,"endTime":1699.704,"body":"bit threatened so they can"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1695.384,"endTime":1699.704,"body":"feel afraid, say laugh,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1700.311,"endTime":1703.011,"body":"probably most people who are"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1700.311,"endTime":1703.011,"body":"listening, as I say, that"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1703.041,"endTime":1706.341,"body":"will think of somebody that"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1703.041,"endTime":1706.341,"body":"they know who laughs a lot."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1707.4959999999999,"endTime":1710.2559999999999,"body":"And that it's, it's,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1707.4959999999999,"endTime":1710.2559999999999,"body":"it's there as their,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1711.1889999999999,"endTime":1713.7089999999998,"body":"their persona, as we were"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1711.1889999999999,"endTime":1713.7089999999998,"body":"talking about last week."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1713.739,"endTime":1717.456,"body":"It's version of them that"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1713.739,"endTime":1717.456,"body":"they show to the world as this"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1717.461,"endTime":1722.816,"body":"jolly person, to protect and"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1717.461,"endTime":1722.816,"body":", again, we go back to balance."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1722.816,"endTime":1724.2859999999998,"body":"That's absolutely fine."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1725.696,"endTime":1726.646,"body":"If it's fine."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1726.806,"endTime":1727.0159999999998,"body":"Is this a"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1731.186,"endTime":1731.666,"body":"problem?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1732.5059999999999,"endTime":1733.106,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1733.826,"endTime":1735.866,"body":"We've got a"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1733.826,"endTime":1735.866,"body":"few more little ones."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1736.136,"endTime":1742.106,"body":"And two that are quite similar"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1736.136,"endTime":1742.106,"body":"displacement and sublimation."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1743.126,"endTime":1747.5059999999999,"body":"So displacement might be"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1743.126,"endTime":1747.5059999999999,"body":"that you really want to"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1747.5059999999999,"endTime":1753.096,"body":"punch somebody who's just"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1747.5059999999999,"endTime":1753.096,"body":"hurt you let's say, uh,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1753.1109999999999,"endTime":1753.261,"body":"your,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1753.331,"endTime":1753.571,"body":"boss."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1754.4759999999999,"endTime":1758.856,"body":"your boss has insulted"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1754.4759999999999,"endTime":1758.856,"body":"you or somebody's really upset"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1758.856,"endTime":1760.5359999999998,"body":"you, you want to punch them."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1760.626,"endTime":1762.412,"body":"So, you punch"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1760.626,"endTime":1762.412,"body":"the wall instead."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1764.0919999999999,"endTime":1767.182,"body":"And it we've all done"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1764.0919999999999,"endTime":1767.182,"body":"elements of that."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1767.182,"endTime":1770.662,"body":"I don't think it"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1767.182,"endTime":1770.662,"body":"tends to be terribly"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1770.667,"endTime":1771.8919999999998,"body":"effective hitting walls."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1772.129,"endTime":1773.899,"body":"But we, we do that"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1772.129,"endTime":1773.899,"body":"sort of thing."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1774.079,"endTime":1775.999,"body":"Sublimation is slightly"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1774.079,"endTime":1775.999,"body":"different in that"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1775.999,"endTime":1777.1689999999999,"body":"it's more longer term."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1777.3919999999998,"endTime":1779.792,"body":"Where somebody who's got"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1777.3919999999998,"endTime":1779.792,"body":"aggressive tendencies might"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1779.792,"endTime":1781.202,"body":"take up boxing for example."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1781.952,"endTime":1785.5819999999999,"body":"And we see that in schemes"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1781.952,"endTime":1785.5819999999999,"body":"that they have for troubled"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1785.702,"endTime":1790.1899999999998,"body":"teenagers and so on, who, take"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1785.702,"endTime":1790.1899999999998,"body":"up martial arts and things."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1790.195,"endTime":1793.05,"body":"So it's, it's a good"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1790.195,"endTime":1793.05,"body":"defense mechanism."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1793.365,"endTime":1796.011,"body":"I can't actually  give you the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1793.365,"endTime":1796.011,"body":"source for where I got this,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1796.011,"endTime":1799.281,"body":"but this might be quite funny,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1796.011,"endTime":1799.281,"body":"but then I might be using"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1799.281,"endTime":1800.481,"body":"a defense mechanism here."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1801.8229999999999,"endTime":1802.963,"body":"This is for sublimation."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1803.623,"endTime":1806.743,"body":"Parents might be reassured to"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1803.623,"endTime":1806.743,"body":"know that children who pull"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1806.8629999999998,"endTime":1811.0929999999998,"body":"wings off flies and jab pins"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1806.8629999999998,"endTime":1811.0929999999998,"body":"in the cat may eventually"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1811.0929999999998,"endTime":1814.993,"body":"find their niche in the areas"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1811.0929999999998,"endTime":1814.993,"body":"of dentistry or surgery."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1820.051,"endTime":1822.691,"body":"was, this was from  a"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1820.051,"endTime":1822.691,"body":"psychology website."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1823.386,"endTime":1823.8909999999998,"body":"dunno about"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1823.951,"endTime":1825.8909999999998,"body":"was normalizing"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1823.951,"endTime":1825.8909999999998,"body":"sticking pins in cats?"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1825.981,"endTime":1829.771,"body":"It could be that you"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1825.981,"endTime":1829.771,"body":"sublimate into a career."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1830.702,"endTime":1833.6419999999998,"body":"Yes, somebody that"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1830.702,"endTime":1833.6419999999998,"body":"feels for whatever reason."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1834.062,"endTime":1836.312,"body":"Maybe growing up, they"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1834.062,"endTime":1836.312,"body":"didn't have much autonomy."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1836.312,"endTime":1838.922,"body":"They didn't have much control"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1836.312,"endTime":1838.922,"body":"over their, over their life."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1839.162,"endTime":1841.462,"body":"And they wanted desperately"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1839.162,"endTime":1841.462,"body":"to feel powerful."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1842.972,"endTime":1847.322,"body":"They might well, instead"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1842.972,"endTime":1847.322,"body":"of doing something that is"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1847.322,"endTime":1850.3819999999998,"body":"socially unacceptable, when"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1847.322,"endTime":1850.3819999999998,"body":"it comes to, um, showing"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1850.3819999999998,"endTime":1853.922,"body":"power, they might turn that"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1850.3819999999998,"endTime":1853.922,"body":"into a, into a different form."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1853.922,"endTime":1855.793,"body":"So  they might be attracted"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1853.922,"endTime":1855.793,"body":"into the police force"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1856.393,"endTime":1859.283,"body":"is it really any"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1856.393,"endTime":1859.283,"body":"different, to sublimate,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1859.3429999999998,"endTime":1862.6129999999998,"body":"into being a dentist, as to"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1859.3429999999998,"endTime":1862.6129999999998,"body":"sublimate into being a boxer"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1863.393,"endTime":1863.633,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1864.503,"endTime":1865.193,"body":"who knows?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1866.183,"endTime":1866.243,"body":"in"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1866.3029999999999,"endTime":1866.633,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1867.5629999999999,"endTime":1867.983,"body":"Uh,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1868.013,"endTime":1868.283,"body":"of authority."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1868.283,"endTime":1870.383,"body":"Might even, might even make"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1868.283,"endTime":1870.383,"body":"somebody become a therapist"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1870.923,"endTime":1875.3629999999998,"body":"I've known trainees and"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1870.923,"endTime":1875.3629999999998,"body":"students who you can see"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1875.3629999999998,"endTime":1879.383,"body":"that they've got that"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1875.3629999999998,"endTime":1879.383,"body":"power need and questions"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1879.383,"endTime":1881.0629999999999,"body":"are asked as to whether"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1879.383,"endTime":1881.0629999999999,"body":"they should qualify  yes."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1882.848,"endTime":1883.358,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1883.508,"endTime":1884.498,"body":"Uh, definitely."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1884.498,"endTime":1886.9879999999998,"body":"And the H word hypnosis."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1887.798,"endTime":1891.548,"body":"I've definitely, there are"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1887.798,"endTime":1891.548,"body":"some people who go into being"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1891.548,"endTime":1894.548,"body":"a hypnotherapist because they"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1891.548,"endTime":1894.548,"body":"perceive it's as being about"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1894.548,"endTime":1899.288,"body":"control when it is anything"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1894.548,"endTime":1899.288,"body":"but, but it's that perception."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1899.5729999999999,"endTime":1899.663,"body":"That"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1900.533,"endTime":1900.5929999999998,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1900.653,"endTime":1904.5529999999999,"body":"some people have,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1900.653,"endTime":1904.5529999999999,"body":"uh, two more, two more"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1904.5529999999999,"endTime":1907.013,"body":"quickly rationalization,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1908.473,"endTime":1911.1129999999998,"body":"Oh, does that"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1908.473,"endTime":1911.1129999999998,"body":"fit in with maybe what?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1911.173,"endTime":1913.493,"body":"Cause there wasn't a question"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1911.173,"endTime":1913.493,"body":"from Carl, from Bristol."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1913.783,"endTime":1915.0729999999999,"body":"oh, Carl from Bristol."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1916.693,"endTime":1917.383,"body":"Let me"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1916.693,"endTime":1917.383,"body":"read these out."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1917.383,"endTime":1919.3029999999999,"body":"See if that fits in question."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1919.393,"endTime":1921.373,"body":"I had a massive"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1919.393,"endTime":1921.373,"body":"argument with my family"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1921.373,"endTime":1922.753,"body":"recently over Brexit."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1923.383,"endTime":1926.8029999999999,"body":"My parents both voted to"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1923.383,"endTime":1926.8029999999999,"body":"remain as did I, but now that"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1926.8029999999999,"endTime":1929.773,"body":"we've left the EU in facing"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1926.8029999999999,"endTime":1929.773,"body":"the consequences, my Dad"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1929.773,"endTime":1931.123,"body":"has flipped the other way."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1931.543,"endTime":1933.674,"body":"It's like he's trying to"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1931.543,"endTime":1933.674,"body":"justify it as the right thing"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1933.764,"endTime":1936.854,"body":"to do to protect him from"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1933.764,"endTime":1936.854,"body":"feeling angry about it not"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1936.854,"endTime":1938.234,"body":"going his way originally."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1938.264,"endTime":1940.214,"body":"Is it normal for"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1938.264,"endTime":1940.214,"body":"us to do this?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1940.694,"endTime":1941.264,"body":"Hmm."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1941.569,"endTime":1943.369,"body":"In terms of the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1941.569,"endTime":1943.369,"body":"father, there could be"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1943.369,"endTime":1945.769,"body":"some rationalization"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1943.369,"endTime":1945.769,"body":"going on there, which is,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1945.859,"endTime":1946.7189999999998,"body":"but also"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1946.899,"endTime":1947.989,"body":"reaction formation"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1948.019,"endTime":1948.279,"body":"yeah."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1948.7189999999998,"endTime":1953.359,"body":"So rationalization justifying"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1948.7189999999998,"endTime":1953.359,"body":"failures with rational reasons"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1953.364,"endTime":1954.769,"body":"rather than the real reason."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1955.879,"endTime":1961.0829999999999,"body":"And reaction formation"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1955.879,"endTime":1961.0829999999999,"body":"is taking the opposite"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1961.0829999999999,"endTime":1963.5729999999999,"body":"belief because your"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1961.0829999999999,"endTime":1963.5729999999999,"body":"beliefs cause anxiety."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1964.4859999999999,"endTime":1971.55,"body":"So an example, , here of"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1964.4859999999999,"endTime":1971.55,"body":"rationalization, is somebody"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1971.55,"endTime":1974.796,"body":"who suffered heavy financial"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1971.55,"endTime":1974.796,"body":"losses, playing the stock"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1974.801,"endTime":1978.936,"body":"market had to trade her"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1974.801,"endTime":1978.936,"body":"big luxury car for an old"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1978.936,"endTime":1980.316,"body":"broken down small car."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1981.0059999999999,"endTime":1983.4959999999999,"body":"And she told her friends"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1981.0059999999999,"endTime":1983.4959999999999,"body":"that she brought the cheaper"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1983.4959999999999,"endTime":1986.706,"body":"car to do her part in the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1983.4959999999999,"endTime":1986.706,"body":"battle against air pollution."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1988.656,"endTime":1992.7659999999998,"body":"So that's rationalization,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1988.656,"endTime":1992.7659999999998,"body":"so that could fit for"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1992.7659999999998,"endTime":1997.056,"body":"Carl's father and then"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1992.7659999999998,"endTime":1997.056,"body":"reaction formation."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1997.686,"endTime":2000.426,"body":"An example of that is."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":2000.879,"endTime":2002.289,"body":"So it's taking the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":2000.879,"endTime":2002.289,"body":"opposite belief."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":2003.339,"endTime":2005.649,"body":"Somebody hates the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":2003.339,"endTime":2005.649,"body":"obnoxious marketing person"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":2005.649,"endTime":2008.889,"body":"at work and being around"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":2005.649,"endTime":2008.889,"body":"him makes her anxious."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":2009.069,"endTime":2012.639,"body":"So she is always extremely"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":2009.069,"endTime":2012.639,"body":"nice to him and agreeable."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":2013.749,"endTime":2018.499,"body":"So taking the opposite"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":2013.749,"endTime":2018.499,"body":"position because to stick"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":2018.499,"endTime":2020.399,"body":"with the He's horrible."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":2021.339,"endTime":2022.809,"body":"Is too uncomfortable."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":2023.0339999999999,"endTime":2025.734,"body":"So either of those"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":2023.0339999999999,"endTime":2025.734,"body":"could well be going"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":2025.734,"endTime":2027.174,"body":"on for, Carl's father."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2028.0739999999998,"endTime":2030.414,"body":"frustratingly"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2028.0739999999998,"endTime":2030.414,"body":"that could often work"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2030.414,"endTime":2031.434,"body":"the other way around."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2031.494,"endTime":2035.7839999999999,"body":"And although it's enormously"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2031.494,"endTime":2035.7839999999999,"body":"unacceptable, but nothing's"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2035.7839999999999,"endTime":2038.8139999999999,"body":"a problem, unless it causes"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2035.7839999999999,"endTime":2038.8139999999999,"body":"problems, people will often"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2038.819,"endTime":2042.296,"body":"say,  maybe when they're"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2038.819,"endTime":2042.296,"body":"kids, the reason that boy was"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2042.296,"endTime":2044.816,"body":"was, was rude to that girl"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2042.296,"endTime":2044.816,"body":"is deep down he likes her."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2046.856,"endTime":2050.396,"body":"Now I don't like that cuz"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2046.856,"endTime":2050.396,"body":"I, I think that does need to"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2050.396,"endTime":2051.656,"body":"be explored at a young age."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2051.716,"endTime":2055.196,"body":"If you like somebody, you"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2051.716,"endTime":2055.196,"body":"don't have to pretend you"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2055.201,"endTime":2057.776,"body":"don't by being rude to"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2055.201,"endTime":2057.776,"body":"them or cruel to them."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2058.886,"endTime":2062.156,"body":"Because then we've got this"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2058.886,"endTime":2062.156,"body":"schema in place that says,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2062.216,"endTime":2063.116,"body":"I know that people love me."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2063.116,"endTime":2065.786,"body":"If they hit me, that's"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2063.116,"endTime":2065.786,"body":"not good for society."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2066.0860000000002,"endTime":2068.636,"body":"Ah, I mean, I'll always"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2066.0860000000002,"endTime":2068.636,"body":"have a job, I suppose, as"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2068.636,"endTime":2070.766,"body":"a therapist, if that's the"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2068.636,"endTime":2070.766,"body":"world we've got, but I'd"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2070.766,"endTime":2073.736,"body":"rather not have to deal with"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2070.766,"endTime":2073.736,"body":"that sort of experience in"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2073.741,"endTime":2077.147,"body":"the consulting room, I'm"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2073.741,"endTime":2077.147,"body":"reminded of a story of a,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2077.147,"endTime":2080.987,"body":"of a, somebody, a nurse in"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2077.147,"endTime":2080.987,"body":"accident in emergency or after"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2080.987,"endTime":2083.1470000000004,"body":"a girl had gone in, because"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2080.987,"endTime":2083.1470000000004,"body":"she'd been pushed over in"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2083.1470000000004,"endTime":2084.347,"body":"the playground and got hurt."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2085.1870000000004,"endTime":2087.407,"body":"The nurse said, oh, it's"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2085.1870000000004,"endTime":2087.407,"body":"probably because he likes you."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2087.407,"endTime":2088.427,"body":"That's what boys do."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":2090.197,"endTime":2090.597,"body":"Yuck."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2091.382,"endTime":2094.712,"body":"And that stuck in"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2091.382,"endTime":2094.712,"body":"my head for decades, that I"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2094.712,"endTime":2096.002,"body":"was like, that's horrible."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2096.032,"endTime":2099.572,"body":"That girl being told that by"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2096.032,"endTime":2099.572,"body":"somebody in authority and oh,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2099.572,"endTime":2101.342,"body":"that's what adults believe."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2101.342,"endTime":2103.0820000000003,"body":"So that's what I'm supposed"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2101.342,"endTime":2103.0820000000003,"body":"to believe when I'm older"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2103.1420000000003,"endTime":2106.0220000000004,"body":"and you think, ah, 20 years"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2103.1420000000003,"endTime":2106.0220000000004,"body":"later, is that girl in abusive"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2106.0220000000004,"endTime":2110.762,"body":"relationships because of"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2106.0220000000004,"endTime":2110.762,"body":"that, aren't we complicated"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2110.7670000000003,"endTime":2111.8720000000003,"body":"as a species, Fiona."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":2112.1240000000003,"endTime":2114.3740000000003,"body":"I think we've"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":2112.1240000000003,"endTime":2114.3740000000003,"body":"only just touched the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":2114.3790000000004,"endTime":2117.014,"body":"surface of the complexity"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":2114.3790000000004,"endTime":2117.014,"body":"of this topic today."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2117.719,"endTime":2118.409,"body":"Indeed."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2118.4990000000003,"endTime":2119.309,"body":"Absolutely."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2119.309,"endTime":2123.318,"body":"And we really need to draw"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2119.309,"endTime":2123.318,"body":"the episode to a close"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":2123.453,"endTime":2126.0930000000003,"body":"Yes, I don't think"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":2123.453,"endTime":2126.0930000000003,"body":"you're going be able to edit"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":2126.0930000000003,"endTime":2127.463,"body":"this down to 30 minutes."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":2128.7490000000003,"endTime":2129.284,"body":"Good luck."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2130.2290000000003,"endTime":2131.6090000000004,"body":"I'll I'll do my best."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2131.6090000000004,"endTime":2133.739,"body":"We'll we'll see what I can"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2131.6090000000004,"endTime":2133.739,"body":"come up with in a week's time."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2134.444,"endTime":2136.034,"body":"This is a topic like many"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2136.034,"endTime":2138.074,"body":"things in personal"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2136.034,"endTime":2138.074,"body":"development, mental"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2138.074,"endTime":2139.214,"body":"health psychology."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2139.8140000000003,"endTime":2140.954,"body":"It's huge."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2140.954,"endTime":2143.2340000000004,"body":"And if you are interested"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2140.954,"endTime":2143.2340000000004,"body":"in finding out more,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2143.264,"endTime":2144.614,"body":"then please do."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2144.714,"endTime":2148.1040000000003,"body":"We live in the 21st century"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2144.714,"endTime":2148.1040000000003,"body":"full of resources around"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2148.1040000000003,"endTime":2151.914,"body":"the internet, full of"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2148.1040000000003,"endTime":2151.914,"body":"podcasts and YouTube videos"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2152.034,"endTime":2153.804,"body":"of people talking about"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2152.034,"endTime":2153.804,"body":"these sorts of things."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2153.8940000000002,"endTime":2155.304,"body":"Soak it up, learn it."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2155.664,"endTime":2156.654,"body":"You might end up becoming a"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2156.654,"endTime":2157.404,"body":"therapist who know."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2158.3940000000002,"endTime":2159.1440000000002,"body":"I wouldn't knock it."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2159.1440000000002,"endTime":2160.074,"body":"It's a good idea."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2160.164,"endTime":2161.4840000000004,"body":"I think it's a great job."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":2163.0190000000002,"endTime":2163.4190000000003,"body":"indeed."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2164.034,"endTime":2166.164,"body":"so shall we"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2164.034,"endTime":2166.164,"body":"love them and leave"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2166.164,"endTime":2167.214,"body":"them for another week?"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":2167.454,"endTime":2168.264,"body":"Let's do that."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":2168.5040000000004,"endTime":2169.7340000000004,"body":"We'll talk again soon."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2170.364,"endTime":2172.824,"body":"We certainly will"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2170.364,"endTime":2172.824,"body":"have a good week you beauties."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":2172.884,"endTime":2173.844,"body":"Take care all"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":2173.964,"endTime":2174.6240000000003,"body":"Bye."}]}