{"version":"1.0.0","segments":[{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":39.845,"endTime":40.925,"body":"Welcome,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":39.845,"endTime":40.925,"body":"welcome, welcome."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":41.555,"endTime":43.685,"body":"It's Therapy Natters time."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":43.955,"endTime":47.525,"body":"The podcast series, where"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":43.955,"endTime":47.525,"body":"two psychotherapists turn"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":47.53,"endTime":50.045,"body":"on their mics and try"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":47.53,"endTime":50.045,"body":"to answer your questions"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":50.045,"endTime":53.765,"body":"about all things therapy,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":50.045,"endTime":53.765,"body":"whether you ask them or not."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":54.215,"endTime":55.294,"body":"I'm Richard Nicholls."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":55.325,"endTime":59.105000000000004,"body":"And as usual I'm joined by"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":55.325,"endTime":59.105000000000004,"body":"my co-host Fiona Biddle."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":59.165,"endTime":60.215,"body":"How you doing Fiona?"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":60.973,"endTime":63.673,"body":"Oh, I'm, I'm doing"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":60.973,"endTime":63.673,"body":"fine a bit hot here,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":63.673,"endTime":64.963,"body":"but it's interesting."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":64.963,"endTime":67.063,"body":"You said whether if you've"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":64.963,"endTime":67.063,"body":"asked or not, we, we did"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":67.063,"endTime":69.289,"body":"say right at the beginning,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":67.063,"endTime":69.289,"body":"we, might have to make"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":69.289,"endTime":71.239,"body":"up some questions, but we"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":69.289,"endTime":71.239,"body":"haven't actually had to do"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":71.244,"endTime":75.919,"body":"so have we they've all been"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":71.244,"endTime":75.919,"body":"completely genuine so far."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":76.825,"endTime":78.535,"body":"Yeah, we"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":76.825,"endTime":78.535,"body":"probably don't need to."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":78.565,"endTime":80.97999999999999,"body":"I mean if we've got a topic"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":78.565,"endTime":80.97999999999999,"body":"that we want to talk about,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":81.37,"endTime":82.39,"body":"we'll just talk about it."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":82.47999999999999,"endTime":83.28999999999999,"body":"It's fine."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":83.56,"endTime":86.08,"body":"But actually that every time"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":83.56,"endTime":86.08,"body":"that happens, if maybe we"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":86.08,"endTime":88.27000000000001,"body":"haven't had a question about"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":86.08,"endTime":88.27000000000001,"body":"it, all I've done is I've"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":88.33,"endTime":91.6,"body":"put it to my listeners on my"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":88.33,"endTime":91.6,"body":"Patreon podcast and said, Hey,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":91.89,"endTime":94.03,"body":"me and Fiona on Friday, we're"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":91.89,"endTime":94.03,"body":"gonna record an episode about"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":95.41,"endTime":97.81,"body":"existentialism or what"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":95.41,"endTime":97.81,"body":"was the other one defense"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":97.81,"endTime":98.74000000000001,"body":"mechanisms I think."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":99.28,"endTime":101.74000000000001,"body":"And if you've got any"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":99.28,"endTime":101.74000000000001,"body":"questions, let me know."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":101.74000000000001,"endTime":105.38300000000001,"body":"And we did  if there's"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":101.74000000000001,"endTime":105.38300000000001,"body":"something on our mind, we"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":105.38300000000001,"endTime":108.083,"body":"could just turn the mic on"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":105.38300000000001,"endTime":108.083,"body":"and just start talking anyway."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":108.083,"endTime":108.35300000000001,"body":"It'll be"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":108.66300000000001,"endTime":108.953,"body":"fine."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":109.36000000000001,"endTime":109.99000000000001,"body":"Absolutely."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":109.99000000000001,"endTime":111.88,"body":"I mean, there have been"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":109.99000000000001,"endTime":111.88,"body":"those couple of times when"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":111.88,"endTime":114.63999999999999,"body":"we've sort of thought that"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":111.88,"endTime":114.63999999999999,"body":"the episode led into the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":114.63999999999999,"endTime":118.12,"body":"next one, so we've set it up"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":114.63999999999999,"endTime":118.12,"body":"in advance and yeah, we've"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":118.12,"endTime":119.62,"body":"had the, had the input,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":120.10300000000001,"endTime":120.28299999999999,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":120.852,"endTime":121.793,"body":"Thank you listeners."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":122.11699999999999,"endTime":122.63999999999999,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":122.69,"endTime":124.686,"body":"I was quite pleased when"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":122.69,"endTime":124.686,"body":"I saw this question  come"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":124.686,"endTime":126.74799999999999,"body":"in and I know some of our"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":124.686,"endTime":126.74799999999999,"body":"questions that we've had."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":126.864,"endTime":128.214,"body":"A lot of them have"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":126.864,"endTime":128.214,"body":"been quite similar."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":128.495,"endTime":132.938,"body":"But this one really did"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":128.495,"endTime":132.938,"body":"sum up a lot of what"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":133.088,"endTime":134.768,"body":"clients bring into therapy."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":135.215,"endTime":136.295,"body":", shall I read it out?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":136.565,"endTime":137.315,"body":"Shall I read it out?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":137.48,"endTime":140.27,"body":"It was from Carla,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":137.48,"endTime":140.27,"body":"from Richmond."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":140.51,"endTime":143.93,"body":"And she says, Dear Richard and"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":140.51,"endTime":143.93,"body":"Fiona, I wonder if you could"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":143.93,"endTime":146.99,"body":"offer some advice on how to"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":143.93,"endTime":146.99,"body":"grapple with some very deep"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":146.99,"endTime":149.03,"body":"rooted beliefs about self."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":149.48,"endTime":152.0,"body":"I'm, a 36 year old"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":149.48,"endTime":152.0,"body":"woman currently single"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":152.0,"endTime":153.38,"body":"and very insecure."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":154.1,"endTime":156.74,"body":"I've seen many C B T"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":154.1,"endTime":156.74,"body":"therapists over the years."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":156.96,"endTime":159.48,"body":"But only when my depression"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":156.96,"endTime":159.48,"body":"has been particularly bad."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":159.72,"endTime":162.12,"body":"I can't say that CBT has"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":159.72,"endTime":162.12,"body":"helped me very much though,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":162.20999999999998,"endTime":164.67,"body":"as each time the therapist"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":162.20999999999998,"endTime":164.67,"body":"and I seem to go round in"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":164.67,"endTime":167.1,"body":"circles and go over the"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":164.67,"endTime":167.1,"body":"same things each time."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":167.253,"endTime":172.32299999999998,"body":"The crux of it being that I"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":167.253,"endTime":172.32299999999998,"body":"feel broken and unlovable."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":172.531,"endTime":174.571,"body":"It doesn't matter how"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":172.531,"endTime":174.571,"body":"many times my therapist"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":174.571,"endTime":177.43099999999998,"body":"has reminded me that my"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":174.571,"endTime":177.43099999999998,"body":"feelings are not reality and"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":177.43099999999998,"endTime":179.951,"body":"encouraged me to look for"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":177.43099999999998,"endTime":179.951,"body":"evidence that I am lovable."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":180.221,"endTime":182.261,"body":"It doesn't change"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":180.221,"endTime":182.261,"body":"the way I feel."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":182.62099999999998,"endTime":185.351,"body":"I still expect to be"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":182.62099999999998,"endTime":185.351,"body":"rejected by people."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":185.351,"endTime":188.021,"body":"I still put everyone"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":185.351,"endTime":188.021,"body":"else's needs before my own."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":188.231,"endTime":190.631,"body":"And I continue to hate myself."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":190.93099999999998,"endTime":193.15099999999998,"body":"If you have some wisdom"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":190.93099999999998,"endTime":193.15099999999998,"body":"and insight to offer, I"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":193.15099999999998,"endTime":194.081,"body":"would love to hear it."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":194.261,"endTime":196.041,"body":"Thanks for everything, Carla."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":196.93099999999998,"endTime":198.001,"body":"Oh, Carla."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":198.516,"endTime":200.52599999999998,"body":"I'm so sorry, you feel"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":198.516,"endTime":200.52599999999998,"body":"the way that you feel."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":200.736,"endTime":203.946,"body":"And all these times you've"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":200.736,"endTime":203.946,"body":"gone to therapy and people"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":203.946,"endTime":206.733,"body":"have tried to convince you"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":203.946,"endTime":206.733,"body":"that your beliefs are wrong"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":206.87,"endTime":210.626,"body":"and they're right  in that"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":206.87,"endTime":210.626,"body":"your beliefs are wrong."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":210.626,"endTime":213.83599999999998,"body":"And I think there's a part"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":210.626,"endTime":213.83599999999998,"body":"of you that knows that."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":213.83599999999998,"endTime":217.52599999999998,"body":"But like you say, deep,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":213.83599999999998,"endTime":217.52599999999998,"body":"deep down, you just don't"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":217.58599999999998,"endTime":220.646,"body":"believe it if somebody"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":217.58599999999998,"endTime":220.646,"body":"says, but you do deserve"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":220.646,"endTime":222.146,"body":"love, you are lovable."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":222.536,"endTime":223.826,"body":"It's it's really sad."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":223.826,"endTime":224.066,"body":"Isn't it?"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":224.46599999999998,"endTime":227.236,"body":"I suspect that there's"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":224.46599999999998,"endTime":227.236,"body":"probably layer upon layer"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":227.80599999999998,"endTime":229.546,"body":"of a, I know I am lovable."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":229.546,"endTime":230.266,"body":"No, I know."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":230.326,"endTime":232.126,"body":"No, I know that"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":230.326,"endTime":232.126,"body":"I'm not lovable."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":232.126,"endTime":232.96599999999998,"body":"I am."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":232.96599999999998,"endTime":233.74599999999998,"body":"No, I'm not."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":234.49599999999998,"endTime":237.52599999999998,"body":"It feels like there's"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":234.49599999999998,"endTime":237.52599999999998,"body":"probably layers and something"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":237.52599999999998,"endTime":240.436,"body":"just struck me then, when"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":237.52599999999998,"endTime":240.436,"body":"you read it out, Richard,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":240.55599999999998,"endTime":243.299,"body":"that hadn't, hit me when"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":240.55599999999998,"endTime":243.299,"body":"I first read it, which"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":243.299,"endTime":245.959,"body":"was the bit of I'm broken."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":246.042,"endTime":248.862,"body":". I feel broken and unlovable."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":249.68699999999998,"endTime":254.581,"body":"is it the breakage that's"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":249.68699999999998,"endTime":254.581,"body":"caused the unlovable-ness?"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":254.682,"endTime":257.562,"body":"I'm just finding that really"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":254.682,"endTime":257.562,"body":"a, an interesting one."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":257.772,"endTime":261.16200000000003,"body":"If Carla was sitting here"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":257.772,"endTime":261.16200000000003,"body":"in the room with me, I'd"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":261.16200000000003,"endTime":263.97700000000003,"body":"be saying right let's"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":261.16200000000003,"endTime":263.97700000000003,"body":"pull that one apart."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":264.03700000000003,"endTime":266.347,"body":"What's first chicken"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":264.03700000000003,"endTime":266.347,"body":"and egg and so on."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":267.23900000000003,"endTime":269.159,"body":"What we wouldn't be"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":267.23900000000003,"endTime":269.159,"body":"doing in those situations,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":269.159,"endTime":270.329,"body":"I think is C B T."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":271.03000000000003,"endTime":272.0,"body":"Yeah, absolutely."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":272.0,"endTime":275.06,"body":"We would not be doing, I mean,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":272.0,"endTime":275.06,"body":"there can be little bits of"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":275.5,"endTime":279.6,"body":"CBT that come in all over the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":275.5,"endTime":279.6,"body":"place, but fundamentally CBT"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":279.65000000000003,"endTime":282.651,"body":"is about now and the future."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":282.915,"endTime":285.585,"body":"Whereas what Carla is saying."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":285.683,"endTime":288.353,"body":"Is about the past and"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":285.683,"endTime":288.353,"body":"about how she's set"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":288.353,"endTime":290.43,"body":"up her belief systems."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":290.43,"endTime":293.829,"body":"Now that broken unlovable,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":290.43,"endTime":293.829,"body":"suggests that there's some"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":293.829,"endTime":298.609,"body":"sort of process that's  gone"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":293.829,"endTime":298.609,"body":"on that could be accessible."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":298.628,"endTime":301.478,"body":"this has got to be"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":298.628,"endTime":301.478,"body":"a, a look at what has"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":301.538,"endTime":303.354,"body":"caused these feelings."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":303.604,"endTime":306.87399999999997,"body":"I start from a belief system."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":307.384,"endTime":308.224,"body":"It's very simple."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":308.224,"endTime":311.839,"body":"I don't do complex  in"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":308.224,"endTime":311.839,"body":"anything really in life."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":312.049,"endTime":312.964,"body":"I do simple."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":313.461,"endTime":316.908,"body":"The  simple belief system"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":313.461,"endTime":316.908,"body":"is that everybody is"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":316.968,"endTime":320.778,"body":"born pure  and okay."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":320.861,"endTime":325.538,"body":"And it's what happens that"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":320.861,"endTime":325.538,"body":"leads to the development"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":325.538,"endTime":326.738,"body":"of belief system."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":326.738,"endTime":330.308,"body":"So I would say"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":326.738,"endTime":330.308,"body":"nobody is unlovable."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":330.429,"endTime":332.529,"body":"But there can be things"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":330.429,"endTime":332.529,"body":"that have caused them"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":332.61899999999997,"endTime":333.879,"body":"to feel unlovable."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":333.879,"endTime":336.566,"body":"And of course, some people"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":333.879,"endTime":336.566,"body":"do adopt behaviors that make"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":336.566,"endTime":339.84999999999997,"body":"them unlovable you know,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":336.566,"endTime":339.84999999999997,"body":"you can be a mass murderer."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":339.84999999999997,"endTime":342.777,"body":"And so you're probably"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":339.84999999999997,"endTime":342.777,"body":"not that lovable, but I"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":342.782,"endTime":343.79699999999997,"body":"don't think that's Carla."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":343.891,"endTime":346.021,"body":"I mean, could be, but we,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":346.072,"endTime":347.182,"body":"It's unlikely, isn't"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":347.182,"endTime":347.472,"body":"it?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":348.122,"endTime":348.242,"body":"Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":348.372,"endTime":350.311,"body":"I don't think that's"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":348.372,"endTime":350.311,"body":"going to be the case,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":350.724,"endTime":351.504,"body":"but the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":351.594,"endTime":353.916,"body":"essence is lovable."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":354.05899999999997,"endTime":356.549,"body":"Yeah, it's really"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":354.05899999999997,"endTime":356.549,"body":"hard to tease out what is"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":356.549,"endTime":358.109,"body":"nature and what is nurture."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":358.319,"endTime":361.293,"body":"We know that two twins"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":358.319,"endTime":361.293,"body":"separated at birth,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":361.323,"endTime":363.573,"body":"identical twins as close"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":361.323,"endTime":363.573,"body":"you can get to a clone."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":363.997,"endTime":365.837,"body":"There are gonna be"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":363.997,"endTime":365.837,"body":"similarities and there"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":365.837,"endTime":366.977,"body":"are gonna be differences."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":367.027,"endTime":369.752,"body":"But the thing is it's"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":367.027,"endTime":369.752,"body":"really complicated."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":369.752,"endTime":373.17199999999997,"body":"You could be born and"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":369.752,"endTime":373.17199999999997,"body":"you've got a headache."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":373.562,"endTime":375.842,"body":"You've got ear ache,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":373.562,"endTime":375.842,"body":"you've got belly ache."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":375.902,"endTime":380.402,"body":"You've got a slight more"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":375.902,"endTime":380.402,"body":"intolerance to lactose."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":380.402,"endTime":383.222,"body":"There's just something"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":380.402,"endTime":383.222,"body":"that makes you slightly"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":383.342,"endTime":385.412,"body":"grumpy, for example."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":385.622,"endTime":388.11199999999997,"body":"And that makes you whinge"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":385.622,"endTime":388.11199999999997,"body":"a bit more, which makes"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":388.322,"endTime":390.392,"body":"parents roll their eyes"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":388.322,"endTime":390.392,"body":"a little bit more or go,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":390.392,"endTime":391.352,"body":"oh, for goodness sake."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":391.652,"endTime":392.852,"body":"Just a bit more often."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":393.167,"endTime":397.247,"body":"Just those tiny little tweaks"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":393.167,"endTime":397.247,"body":"can send people down a, a path"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":397.367,"endTime":400.967,"body":"that turns into eventually"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":397.367,"endTime":400.967,"body":"a feeling about the way"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":400.967,"endTime":402.167,"body":"they fit in, in the world."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":402.407,"endTime":404.447,"body":"And actually their parents"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":402.407,"endTime":404.447,"body":"could have been, or caregivers"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":404.447,"endTime":407.48699999999997,"body":"could have been fine, quite"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":404.447,"endTime":407.48699999999997,"body":"nurturing and quite, quite"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":407.48699999999997,"endTime":409.497,"body":"loving, but eventually."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":409.776,"endTime":413.736,"body":"Given enough evidence that,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":409.776,"endTime":413.736,"body":"eh, you might be, you might"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":413.736,"endTime":416.878,"body":"be loved, but there's still"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":413.736,"endTime":416.878,"body":"something wrong with you."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":417.08799999999997,"endTime":419.518,"body":"You're still an"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":417.08799999999997,"endTime":419.518,"body":"annoyance for example."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":420.10699999999997,"endTime":423.557,"body":"and that can be exaggerated"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":420.10699999999997,"endTime":423.557,"body":"as the, as every friendship"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":423.557,"endTime":426.04699999999997,"body":"relationship interaction"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":423.557,"endTime":426.04699999999997,"body":"you have with the outside"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":426.052,"endTime":428.35699999999997,"body":"will continues until"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":426.052,"endTime":428.35699999999997,"body":"you're 36 years old."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":428.657,"endTime":430.757,"body":"And all you've got in"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":428.657,"endTime":430.757,"body":"your memory banks is just"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":431.177,"endTime":435.238,"body":"evidence that you've been"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":431.177,"endTime":435.238,"body":"rejected, disliked, forgotten."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":436.108,"endTime":437.668,"body":"Inferior for example."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":437.668,"endTime":441.868,"body":"And it's it, it is, it"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":437.668,"endTime":441.868,"body":"does need, I think therapy."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":442.018,"endTime":445.558,"body":"It, we can do our own"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":442.018,"endTime":445.558,"body":"therapy to a degree, but"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":445.563,"endTime":448.318,"body":"there's a lot of reading"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":445.563,"endTime":448.318,"body":"and thinking and journaling"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":448.318,"endTime":449.278,"body":"that needs to be done."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":449.368,"endTime":451.558,"body":"It is easier with a therapist,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":449.368,"endTime":451.558,"body":"of course, just to sit"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":451.563,"endTime":452.578,"body":"in a room and go, right."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":452.807,"endTime":454.217,"body":"Let me tell you about myself."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":454.377,"endTime":455.877,"body":"That is gonna take a"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":454.377,"endTime":455.877,"body":"little bit more than"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":455.877,"endTime":459.927,"body":"just let's fill in a form"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":455.877,"endTime":459.927,"body":"and do a CBT exercise"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":459.927,"endTime":460.79699999999997,"body":"about thought stopping."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":460.85699999999997,"endTime":461.517,"body":"Don't get me wrong."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":461.697,"endTime":464.637,"body":"Like you saying, there are"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":461.697,"endTime":464.637,"body":"some elements of CBT really,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":464.642,"endTime":467.997,"body":"really useful for in the"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":464.642,"endTime":467.997,"body":"moment dealing with, with"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":467.997,"endTime":469.85699999999997,"body":"stuff to go, oh, is this real?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":469.85699999999997,"endTime":471.157,"body":"Or is this  just"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":469.85699999999997,"endTime":471.157,"body":"my imagination."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":471.162,"endTime":474.307,"body":"Let's see if I can challenge"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":471.162,"endTime":474.307,"body":"this, but it does get to"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":474.307,"endTime":475.057,"body":"a point where it becomes"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":475.057,"endTime":475.777,"body":"really hard."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":475.805,"endTime":476.839,"body":"this is beyond that."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":476.844,"endTime":477.169,"body":"Isn't it."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":478.114,"endTime":479.344,"body":"It was just something"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":478.114,"endTime":479.344,"body":"that struck me."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":479.344,"endTime":481.354,"body":"Then when you said about"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":479.344,"endTime":481.354,"body":"nature versus nurture"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":481.954,"endTime":484.90999999999997,"body":"the word nurture,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":481.954,"endTime":484.90999999999997,"body":"suggests something good."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":485.967,"endTime":486.627,"body":"does doesn't it?"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":486.8,"endTime":487.82,"body":"You're nurtured."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":488.086,"endTime":491.63599999999997,"body":"if you've got a plant that you"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":488.086,"endTime":491.63599999999997,"body":"just leave to its own devices,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":492.015,"endTime":495.378,"body":"and I've got a sunflower in"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":492.015,"endTime":495.378,"body":"my garden at the moment I'm"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":495.378,"endTime":497.368,"body":"not a very good plant mother."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":497.904,"endTime":501.904,"body":"If it was down to me that"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":497.904,"endTime":501.904,"body":"sunflower would just die"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":502.144,"endTime":503.104,"body":"it never comes into my"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":503.104,"endTime":503.43399999999997,"body":"head."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":503.816,"endTime":504.476,"body":"sounds"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":503.816,"endTime":504.476,"body":"like, you need a"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":504.476,"endTime":505.226,"body":"cactus."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":505.341,"endTime":506.301,"body":"I can do cacti."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":506.64,"endTime":509.61,"body":"Especially the ones that"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":506.64,"endTime":509.61,"body":"look real, but aren't like"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":509.67,"endTime":512.6700000000001,"body":"my mother, when she had"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":509.67,"endTime":512.6700000000001,"body":"dementia, she bought loads"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":512.6700000000001,"endTime":516.3000000000001,"body":"of cacti from all sorts of"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":512.6700000000001,"endTime":516.3000000000001,"body":"different places and had"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":516.3000000000001,"endTime":517.53,"body":"them all over the house."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":518.28,"endTime":520.1700000000001,"body":"And it wasn't until"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":518.28,"endTime":520.1700000000001,"body":"after she died that we"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":520.1700000000001,"endTime":521.37,"body":"realized they weren't real,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":521.625,"endTime":522.495,"body":"Wow."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":522.503,"endTime":522.923,"body":"good."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":522.9830000000001,"endTime":524.423,"body":"And we didn't pay"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":522.9830000000001,"endTime":524.423,"body":"any attention."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":524.428,"endTime":526.523,"body":"We were just, oh, she's"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":524.428,"endTime":526.523,"body":"just bought another cactus,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":526.557,"endTime":529.167,"body":"but she would water them,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":526.557,"endTime":529.167,"body":"but they weren't real."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":529.249,"endTime":529.399,"body":"her."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":530.442,"endTime":531.702,"body":"But she was"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":530.442,"endTime":531.702,"body":"happy doing it."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":531.812,"endTime":532.392,"body":"It was fine."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":532.392,"endTime":532.962,"body":"It doesn't matter."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":533.022,"endTime":535.2420000000001,"body":"You can water a fake cactus."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":535.452,"endTime":538.662,"body":"I don't know what that says"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":535.452,"endTime":538.662,"body":"about life, but anyway, my"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":538.662,"endTime":541.822,"body":"sunflower would not live"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":538.662,"endTime":541.822,"body":"without other people doing it,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":541.94,"endTime":543.83,"body":"but this is nurture."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":544.2570000000001,"endTime":544.797,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":545.277,"endTime":547.437,"body":"One of the origins"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":545.277,"endTime":547.437,"body":"of humanistic"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":547.442,"endTime":549.263,"body":"therapy, Carl Rogers."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":550.033,"endTime":554.023,"body":"Isn't that how he, unless he's"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":550.033,"endTime":554.023,"body":"just made up a story about"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":554.023,"endTime":555.163,"body":"the potatoes in the cellar."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":556.1030000000001,"endTime":558.528,"body":"That had not seen light,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":556.1030000000001,"endTime":558.528,"body":"they'd been forgotten."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":558.528,"endTime":559.488,"body":"They'd been ignored."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":559.488,"endTime":560.6880000000001,"body":"They hadn't been nurtured."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":561.018,"endTime":562.998,"body":"And yet they were"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":561.018,"endTime":562.998,"body":"trying to sprout."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":563.349,"endTime":565.726,"body":"And planted that seed in"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":563.349,"endTime":565.726,"body":"his mind that says even if"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":565.731,"endTime":570.556,"body":"something has been neglected,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":565.731,"endTime":570.556,"body":"it still wants to live."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":570.586,"endTime":572.176,"body":"It still wants to thrive."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":572.6360000000001,"endTime":576.2360000000001,"body":"And he saw humans in that"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":572.6360000000001,"endTime":576.2360000000001,"body":"process that says, doesn't"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":576.2360000000001,"endTime":578.1560000000001,"body":"matter how neglected"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":576.2360000000001,"endTime":578.1560000000001,"body":"and forgotten you are."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":578.3660000000001,"endTime":582.086,"body":"You still have a will to"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":578.3660000000001,"endTime":582.086,"body":"live and try and let's build"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":582.086,"endTime":582.6260000000001,"body":"upon that."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":583.2660000000001,"endTime":583.7660000000001,"body":"And I love"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":583.8190000000001,"endTime":585.109,"body":"then"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":583.8190000000001,"endTime":585.109,"body":"watered the seed in"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":585.109,"endTime":585.649,"body":"his head."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":585.841,"endTime":586.201,"body":"Yep."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":586.3240000000001,"endTime":587.8240000000001,"body":"That changed therapy."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":588.0340000000001,"endTime":588.7840000000001,"body":"It really did."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":588.7840000000001,"endTime":591.764,"body":"It went from being that"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":588.7840000000001,"endTime":591.764,"body":"sort of very authoritative"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":592.004,"endTime":593.024,"body":"I'm the expert."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":593.354,"endTime":596.654,"body":"I'm here to, just to boss"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":593.354,"endTime":596.654,"body":"and lord over you for an"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":596.6590000000001,"endTime":602.264,"body":"hour and you go away with"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":596.6590000000001,"endTime":602.264,"body":"some, with something I'm sure"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":602.264,"endTime":603.1940000000001,"body":"Freud did more than that."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":604.724,"endTime":607.8770000000001,"body":"But it changed forever"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":604.724,"endTime":607.8770000000001,"body":"Once Carl Rogers put that"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":607.8770000000001,"endTime":611.864,"body":"idea out there that says,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":607.8770000000001,"endTime":611.864,"body":"no, just be kind, do that"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":611.864,"endTime":613.724,"body":"first and see what builds."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":613.904,"endTime":616.364,"body":"Listen to them,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":613.904,"endTime":616.364,"body":"be there for them."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":617.024,"endTime":618.344,"body":"Reparent them."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":619.0340000000001,"endTime":620.4440000000001,"body":"And I think sometimes"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":619.0340000000001,"endTime":620.4440000000001,"body":"we do do that as"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":620.4440000000001,"endTime":620.864,"body":"therapists."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":620.957,"endTime":622.7270000000001,"body":"Do you know, that was"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":620.957,"endTime":622.7270000000001,"body":"one of the things that I was"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":622.7270000000001,"endTime":626.3670000000001,"body":"thinking, before we started"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":622.7270000000001,"endTime":626.3670000000001,"body":"talking the reparent, as"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":626.3670000000001,"endTime":629.1700000000001,"body":"in, I was thinking that it"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":626.3670000000001,"endTime":629.1700000000001,"body":"it could be really good for"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":629.1700000000001,"endTime":634.2470000000001,"body":"Carla to find a therapist"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":629.1700000000001,"endTime":634.2470000000001,"body":"who will go back and almost"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":634.2470000000001,"endTime":637.2370000000001,"body":"sort of well reparent"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":634.2470000000001,"endTime":637.2370000000001,"body":"but recreate some of the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":637.2810000000001,"endTime":641.8820000000001,"body":"childhood processes now, I"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":637.2810000000001,"endTime":641.8820000000001,"body":"think it was in episode three."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":642.4340000000001,"endTime":649.052,"body":"Where we discussed Eric"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":642.4340000000001,"endTime":649.052,"body":"Ericsson's first stage in his"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":649.0920000000001,"endTime":653.075,"body":"psychosocial stages, which was"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":649.0920000000001,"endTime":653.075,"body":"about trust versus mistrust."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":653.106,"endTime":656.9590000000001,"body":"This one could fit with the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":653.106,"endTime":656.9590000000001,"body":"second of Eric Erickson's"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":657.009,"endTime":658.899,"body":"psychosocial stages."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":658.9590000000001,"endTime":663.369,"body":"Which is autonomy"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":658.9590000000001,"endTime":663.369,"body":"versus shame and doubt."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":663.8190000000001,"endTime":670.4490000000001,"body":"So this stage is,  from about"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":663.8190000000001,"endTime":670.4490000000001,"body":"18 months to three years,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":671.119,"endTime":676.9630000000001,"body":"where Erickson's idea was"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":671.119,"endTime":676.9630000000001,"body":"that the child was focusing"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":676.9830000000001,"endTime":680.4430000000001,"body":"on developing a sense"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":676.9830000000001,"endTime":680.4430000000001,"body":"of personal control over"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":680.803,"endTime":685.163,"body":"physical skills and gaining"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":680.803,"endTime":685.163,"body":"a sense of independence."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":685.485,"endTime":689.8050000000001,"body":"And success in this stage"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":685.485,"endTime":689.8050000000001,"body":"leads to the virtue of will."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":690.315,"endTime":692.8950000000001,"body":"So if children in this"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":690.315,"endTime":692.8950000000001,"body":"stage are encouraged"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":692.8950000000001,"endTime":696.195,"body":"and supported in their"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":692.8950000000001,"endTime":696.195,"body":"increased independence,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":696.2,"endTime":699.5250000000001,"body":"they become more confident"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":696.2,"endTime":699.5250000000001,"body":"and secure in their ability"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":699.5300000000001,"endTime":700.9350000000001,"body":"to survive in the world."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":701.091,"endTime":704.481,"body":"If children are criticized"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":701.091,"endTime":704.481,"body":"overly controlled or not"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":704.481,"endTime":706.851,"body":"given the opportunity to"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":704.481,"endTime":706.851,"body":"assert themselves, they"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":706.851,"endTime":709.701,"body":"begin to feel inadequate in"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":706.851,"endTime":709.701,"body":"their ability to survive."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":710.211,"endTime":714.2610000000001,"body":"And may then become overly"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":710.211,"endTime":714.2610000000001,"body":"dependent on others, lack"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":714.2610000000001,"endTime":717.8910000000001,"body":"self-esteem and feel a"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":714.2610000000001,"endTime":717.8910000000001,"body":"sense of shame or doubt"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":718.461,"endTime":719.6310000000001,"body":"in their abilities."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":720.081,"endTime":723.0780000000001,"body":"So what 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is"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":739.8620000000001,"endTime":741.302,"body":"probably what we said about"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":741.302,"endTime":744.272,"body":"the first one, because you"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":741.302,"endTime":744.272,"body":"can't remember nought to 18"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":744.272,"endTime":747.517,"body":"months She might be able to"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":744.272,"endTime":747.517,"body":"get a feel though of, well,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":747.711,"endTime":753.471,"body":"she sort of feel in inside"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":747.711,"endTime":753.471,"body":"that she wasn't encouraged"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":753.471,"endTime":756.6510000000001,"body":"that she was criticized and"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":753.471,"endTime":756.6510000000001,"body":"she would that, that potty,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":756.6560000000001,"endTime":761.0310000000001,"body":"training's a key part 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unless."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":781.398,"endTime":783.3180000000001,"body":"Unless we behave in"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":781.398,"endTime":783.3180000000001,"body":"a particular way."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":784.038,"endTime":788.3280000000001,"body":"And to have that so young,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":784.038,"endTime":788.3280000000001,"body":"which, which happens, I mean,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":788.3330000000001,"endTime":790.758,"body":"which is one of the reasons"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":788.3330000000001,"endTime":790.758,"body":"why Freud came up with the,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":790.758,"endTime":791.748,"body":"the idea that there was that"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":792.239,"endTime":795.899,"body":"fixation period, we start off"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":792.239,"endTime":795.899,"body":"being fixated with 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think?"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":808.657,"endTime":811.407,"body":"It does"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":808.657,"endTime":811.407,"body":"seem to, to fit."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":811.657,"endTime":815.3870000000001,"body":"Any parents will know"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":811.657,"endTime":815.3870000000001,"body":"that children do go"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":815.3870000000001,"endTime":818.0870000000001,"body":"through a phase where"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":815.3870000000001,"endTime":818.0870000000001,"body":"everything's about the mouth."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":818.0870000000001,"endTime":821.403,"body":"And then there is the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":818.0870000000001,"endTime":821.403,"body":"potty training part, which"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":822.133,"endTime":824.3050000000001,"body":"can be easy or difficult."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":824.725,"endTime":830.033,"body":"I had one of each  with my"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":824.725,"endTime":830.033,"body":"two, but I tried not to put"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":830.153,"endTime":833.517,"body":"any pressure on think they"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":830.153,"endTime":833.517,"body":"probably don't want me to"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":833.517,"endTime":835.2570000000001,"body":"go into any more detail than"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":835.504,"endTime":835.9540000000001,"body":"Agreed."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":835.9540000000001,"endTime":836.974,"body":"I'm sure cause they do listen."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":839.224,"endTime":839.854,"body":"hello there."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":840.177,"endTime":840.7470000000001,"body":"hello."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":841.363,"endTime":842.923,"body":"But no, we won't go"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":841.363,"endTime":842.923,"body":"into any more detail."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":843.0500000000001,"endTime":846.504,"body":"but, and then of course"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":843.0500000000001,"endTime":846.504,"body":"the next stage is the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":846.6840000000001,"endTime":848.124,"body":"genital stage, which,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":848.167,"endTime":852.9490000000001,"body":"Again, parents will know"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":848.167,"endTime":852.9490000000001,"body":"that children become aware of"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":853.1590000000001,"endTime":854.984,"body":"that part of their anatomy."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":854.984,"endTime":857.4150000000001,"body":"And the sensations"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":854.984,"endTime":857.4150000000001,"body":"that that can bring."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":857.811,"endTime":862.749,"body":"But  it's a mix of the,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":857.811,"endTime":862.749,"body":"the parents' approach and"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":862.749,"endTime":864.999,"body":"any other care caregivers,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":862.749,"endTime":864.999,"body":"cuz there could be things"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":864.999,"endTime":866.0790000000001,"body":"going on at nurseries."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":866.0790000000001,"endTime":869.0830000000001,"body":"And what have you, So"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":866.0790000000001,"endTime":869.0830000000001,"body":"the caregiver's approach"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":869.113,"endTime":873.523,"body":"and each individual"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":869.113,"endTime":873.523,"body":"child's response to it."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":873.793,"endTime":877.993,"body":"And I do think it's important"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":873.793,"endTime":877.993,"body":"to say that this doesn't"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":877.998,"endTime":880.363,"body":"mean in any way that"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":877.998,"endTime":880.363,"body":"we're saying that Carla's"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":880.363,"endTime":881.893,"body":"parents did anything wrong."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":882.4100000000001,"endTime":883.0100000000001,"body":"exactly."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":883.19,"endTime":883.5200000000001,"body":"Yeah,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":884.743,"endTime":888.7030000000001,"body":"They will have done"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":884.743,"endTime":888.7030000000001,"body":"the best that they could with"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":888.7030000000001,"endTime":890.413,"body":"what they knew at the time."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":891.0730000000001,"endTime":894.0580000000001,"body":"And it could be that it's just"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":891.0730000000001,"endTime":894.0580000000001,"body":"a mix that didn't quite work."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":894.84,"endTime":897.57,"body":"And that I'm sure"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":894.84,"endTime":897.57,"body":"my parents are doing the"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":897.57,"endTime":899.5200000000001,"body":"best they can, they love me."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":900.12,"endTime":902.37,"body":"We don't have that capacity"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":900.12,"endTime":902.37,"body":"to understand that when"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":902.37,"endTime":903.1500000000001,"body":"we're 18 months old."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":903.6030000000001,"endTime":905.043,"body":"We've only got the extremes."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":905.653,"endTime":908.503,"body":"This sort of dichotomy"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":905.653,"endTime":908.503,"body":"with no gray area."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":908.533,"endTime":910.033,"body":"They either love"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":908.533,"endTime":910.033,"body":"me or they hate me."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":910.9330000000001,"endTime":912.403,"body":"I'm either lovable or I'm not."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":912.7330000000001,"endTime":916.2130000000001,"body":"And if we become fixated on"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":912.7330000000001,"endTime":916.2130000000001,"body":"the I'm not, for some reason"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":916.653,"endTime":919.293,"body":", and we don't have that"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":916.653,"endTime":919.293,"body":"adult perspective that says."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":919.7620000000001,"endTime":922.485,"body":"Oh, my parents had three"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":919.7620000000001,"endTime":922.485,"body":"other children to look after"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":922.485,"endTime":923.625,"body":"they were very, very busy."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":923.625,"endTime":925.0350000000001,"body":"They had full-time jobs."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":926.0450000000001,"endTime":929.6450000000001,"body":"it makes a lot of sense that"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":926.0450000000001,"endTime":929.6450000000001,"body":"I was, left offend for myself"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":929.6450000000001,"endTime":932.4050000000001,"body":"at times, for example, this"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":929.6450000000001,"endTime":932.4050000000001,"body":"isn't just Carla, this is"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":932.4050000000001,"endTime":934.745,"body":"for anybody going through"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":932.4050000000001,"endTime":934.745,"body":"similar sort of approaches."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":934.955,"endTime":937.1450000000001,"body":"We don't have that language."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":937.1450000000001,"endTime":940.1450000000001,"body":"That vernacular when we"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":937.1450000000001,"endTime":940.1450000000001,"body":"are three, four, even five,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":940.1750000000001,"endTime":943.955,"body":"probably even 10, maybe at"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":940.1750000000001,"endTime":943.955,"body":"10, but certainly at seven I'm"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":943.955,"endTime":945.005,"body":"sure we probably don't."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":945.095,"endTime":945.9350000000001,"body":"It's just,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":945.9480000000001,"endTime":947.378,"body":"some people"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":945.9480000000001,"endTime":947.378,"body":"never get it."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":947.7230000000001,"endTime":948.173,"body":"True."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":948.3480000000001,"endTime":950.628,"body":"I know you wanted to"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":948.3480000000001,"endTime":950.628,"body":"talk about schema theory."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":951.565,"endTime":952.105,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":952.1650000000001,"endTime":954.955,"body":"And I, so I think that ties"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":952.1650000000001,"endTime":954.955,"body":"in quite, quite well with"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":954.955,"endTime":959.3610000000001,"body":"that because we don't have"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":954.955,"endTime":959.3610000000001,"body":"the schema for My parents"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":959.3610000000001,"endTime":960.681,"body":"are doing the best they can."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":960.921,"endTime":962.3610000000001,"body":"They love me dearly."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":962.6610000000001,"endTime":963.7710000000001,"body":"We don't have that."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":964.311,"endTime":966.4110000000001,"body":"We're gonna have the extremes."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":966.485,"endTime":970.128,"body":"And schema therapy or sort"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":966.485,"endTime":970.128,"body":"of sort of schema theory."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":970.128,"endTime":973.6880000000001,"body":"Schemas are  core beliefs"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":970.128,"endTime":973.6880000000001,"body":"about the way we see"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":973.6880000000001,"endTime":975.788,"body":"ourselves and the world."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":976.1410000000001,"endTime":978.24,"body":"It's an offshoot of cognitive"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":976.1410000000001,"endTime":978.24,"body":"therapy came about in the"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":978.24,"endTime":983.6700000000001,"body":"1980s to try and help people"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":978.24,"endTime":983.6700000000001,"body":"who weren't finding as much"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":983.7,"endTime":986.3100000000001,"body":"success with CBT as they'd"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":983.7,"endTime":986.3100000000001,"body":"like, which is exactly"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":986.3100000000001,"endTime":987.9000000000001,"body":"what Carla was saying in"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":986.3100000000001,"endTime":987.9000000000001,"body":"the message wasn't it?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":987.9000000000001,"endTime":990.96,"body":"That she just wasn't"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":987.9000000000001,"endTime":990.96,"body":"getting anywhere with just"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":990.96,"endTime":995.3000000000001,"body":"going around in circles"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":990.96,"endTime":995.3000000000001,"body":"and, like we say, CBTS"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":995.3050000000001,"endTime":996.69,"body":"is, it's got its place."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":996.75,"endTime":1001.22,"body":"For those that haven't heard"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":996.75,"endTime":1001.22,"body":"someone say this enough, C"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1001.225,"endTime":1005.5830000000001,"body":"B T is about   noticing how"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1001.225,"endTime":1005.5830000000001,"body":"your thoughts influence your"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1005.5880000000001,"endTime":1008.8230000000001,"body":"emotions, how your emotions"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1005.5880000000001,"endTime":1008.8230000000001,"body":"influence your behavior,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1008.9730000000001,"endTime":1011.373,"body":"and then how your behavior"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1008.9730000000001,"endTime":1011.373,"body":"influences your thoughts."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1011.373,"endTime":1015.303,"body":"The idea, being that in"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1011.373,"endTime":1015.303,"body":"taking some control over those"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1015.303,"endTime":1019.9330000000001,"body":"things, the thinking, the"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1015.303,"endTime":1019.9330000000001,"body":"feeling, the behaving you can"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1020.4730000000001,"endTime":1022.633,"body":"have a positive effect"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1020.4730000000001,"endTime":1022.633,"body":"on the whole system."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1022.9630000000001,"endTime":1027.073,"body":"But what Young found this"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1022.9630000000001,"endTime":1027.073,"body":"is Jeffrey Young, the, the"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1027.073,"endTime":1028.99,"body":"doctor that came up with"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1027.073,"endTime":1028.99,"body":"all of this, not Carl Jung,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1029.263,"endTime":1031.903,"body":"but Jeffrey Young, what he"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1029.263,"endTime":1031.903,"body":"found was that some people"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1032.013,"endTime":1036.513,"body":"had such deep beliefs that"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1032.013,"endTime":1036.513,"body":"it was almost impossible to"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1036.513,"endTime":1037.683,"body":"challenge their thoughts."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1037.683,"endTime":1041.973,"body":"It was like trying to tell an"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1037.683,"endTime":1041.973,"body":"underweight anorexia patient"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1041.973,"endTime":1044.5529999999999,"body":"that they're dangerously slim"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1041.973,"endTime":1044.5529999999999,"body":"and that they are allowed"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1044.5529999999999,"endTime":1047.883,"body":"to have a milkshake without"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1044.5529999999999,"endTime":1047.883,"body":"feeling guilty and fat."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1048.423,"endTime":1049.713,"body":"In a similar way"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1049.833,"endTime":1051.783,"body":"he found that some of"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1049.833,"endTime":1051.783,"body":"his patients had certain"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1051.783,"endTime":1055.683,"body":"beliefs that were so"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1051.783,"endTime":1055.683,"body":"pervasive that they needed"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1055.953,"endTime":1057.0929999999998,"body":"more investigations."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1057.0929999999998,"endTime":1062.163,"body":"So, schema therapy is more"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1057.0929999999998,"endTime":1062.163,"body":"psychodynamic than CBT would"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1062.163,"endTime":1065.8229999999999,"body":"be psycho psychodynamic"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1062.163,"endTime":1065.8229999999999,"body":"meaning the way that we see"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1065.828,"endTime":1069.033,"body":"ourselves in the present"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1065.828,"endTime":1069.033,"body":"is because of the way that"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1069.033,"endTime":1071.5529999999999,"body":"we were shown how to see"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1069.033,"endTime":1071.5529999999999,"body":"ourselves in the past,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1071.5529999999999,"endTime":1074.223,"body":"usually by those caregivers."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1074.733,"endTime":1077.523,"body":"But what, what is"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1074.733,"endTime":1077.523,"body":"called maladaptive"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1077.8129999999999,"endTime":1078.993,"body":"schemas can come about."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1080.5529999999999,"endTime":1082.773,"body":"Well, because of that, and"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1080.5529999999999,"endTime":1082.773,"body":"later in life as well, but"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1082.773,"endTime":1085.8029999999999,"body":"it's more common that they"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1082.773,"endTime":1085.8029999999999,"body":"come around because someone's"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1085.808,"endTime":1090.8129999999999,"body":"had problems growing up"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1085.808,"endTime":1090.8129999999999,"body":"because the basics of most"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1090.8129999999999,"endTime":1094.523,"body":"theories, not just schema"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1090.8129999999999,"endTime":1094.523,"body":"theory is that every child"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1095.133,"endTime":1098.523,"body":"has basic needs for safety,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1099.273,"endTime":1102.713,"body":"love attention,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1099.273,"endTime":1102.713,"body":"acceptance, playfulness."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1103.37,"endTime":1104.99,"body":"And Jeffrey Young wanted"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1103.37,"endTime":1104.99,"body":"to make sure we also"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1104.99,"endTime":1107.8999999999999,"body":"recognized the importance"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1104.99,"endTime":1107.8999999999999,"body":"of autonomy and adequate"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1107.8999999999999,"endTime":1111.11,"body":"boundaries, limit setting,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1107.8999999999999,"endTime":1111.11,"body":"in order to get a healthy"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1111.11,"endTime":1112.9099999999999,"body":"personality development going."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1113.03,"endTime":1116.1499999999999,"body":"And if those things weren't"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1113.03,"endTime":1116.1499999999999,"body":"present in our childhood"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1116.1499999999999,"endTime":1120.26,"body":"than our schemas, the way"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1116.1499999999999,"endTime":1120.26,"body":"we see ourselves, they"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1120.26,"endTime":1122.12,"body":"could become maladaptive."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1122.57,"endTime":1124.34,"body":"And like we say, not"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1122.57,"endTime":1124.34,"body":"just because of neglect,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1124.34,"endTime":1128.36,"body":"but temperament as well,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1124.34,"endTime":1128.36,"body":"inborn personality traits"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1128.36,"endTime":1131.3,"body":"that exaggerate the little"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1128.36,"endTime":1131.3,"body":"rejections that we all get"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1131.6299999999999,"endTime":1135.32,"body":"through in, in life until they"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1131.6299999999999,"endTime":1135.32,"body":"become so deeply ingrained"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1135.71,"endTime":1139.9099999999999,"body":"and unconscious that they"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1135.71,"endTime":1139.9099999999999,"body":"go lower, deeper than those"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1139.925,"endTime":1144.485,"body":"simple core beliefs, they"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1139.925,"endTime":1144.485,"body":"become schemas like a phrase"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1144.7549999999999,"endTime":1146.975,"body":"that might be, I am unlovable."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1147.125,"endTime":1151.205,"body":"People are untrustworthy,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1147.125,"endTime":1151.205,"body":"I'm broken, I'm defective."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1151.205,"endTime":1153.725,"body":"There's a defective"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1151.205,"endTime":1153.725,"body":"schema in schema theory,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1153.725,"endTime":1154.5349999999999,"body":"that sort of thing."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1155.075,"endTime":1157.125,"body":"And the, the problem"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1155.075,"endTime":1157.125,"body":"is because our brain"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1157.895,"endTime":1159.2849999999999,"body":"likes familiarity."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1160.0249999999999,"endTime":1163.235,"body":"It seeks out the information"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1160.0249999999999,"endTime":1163.235,"body":"in our world that matches"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1163.5049999999999,"endTime":1167.225,"body":"these schemas proving itself"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1163.5049999999999,"endTime":1167.225,"body":"right, all the time and"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1167.225,"endTime":1170.675,"body":"filtering out anything that"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1167.225,"endTime":1170.675,"body":"contradicts it, even drawing"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1170.675,"endTime":1174.575,"body":"people towards the situations"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1170.675,"endTime":1174.575,"body":"that prove it right."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1174.8149999999998,"endTime":1178.145,"body":"Like repetition"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1174.8149999999998,"endTime":1178.145,"body":"compulsion, and it's."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1178.7749999999999,"endTime":1182.675,"body":"It, it really does need"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1178.7749999999999,"endTime":1182.675,"body":"not just a scratching"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1182.675,"endTime":1185.735,"body":"of the surface, but"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1182.675,"endTime":1185.735,"body":"a good dig through it"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1185.735,"endTime":1187.235,"body":"with a massive spade."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1187.475,"endTime":1188.645,"body":"It really does."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1188.705,"endTime":1189.995,"body":"It really, really does."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1190.0549999999998,"endTime":1190.685,"body":"So I like it."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1190.685,"endTime":1193.125,"body":"I, I think, I think these,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1190.685,"endTime":1193.125,"body":"these theories are great."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1193.1879999999999,"endTime":1196.248,"body":"There's another"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1193.1879999999999,"endTime":1196.248,"body":"theory, from TA transactional"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1196.248,"endTime":1198.4379999999999,"body":"analysis that I think we"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1196.248,"endTime":1198.4379999999999,"body":"talked about last time,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1198.4379999999999,"endTime":1200.9879999999998,"body":"we've mentioned before,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1198.4379999999999,"endTime":1200.9879999999998,"body":"as well, previous to that."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1201.2269999999999,"endTime":1205.667,"body":"but it's a particular schema"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1201.2269999999999,"endTime":1205.667,"body":"or set of schemas that the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1205.667,"endTime":1210.2269999999999,"body":"idea is that anybody puts"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1205.667,"endTime":1210.2269999999999,"body":"themselves into one of four"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1210.2269999999999,"endTime":1214.317,"body":"life positions, and there's a"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1210.2269999999999,"endTime":1214.317,"body":"book by Thomas Harris, not the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1214.317,"endTime":1216.327,"body":"same one who wrote Hannibal"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1216.692,"endTime":1217.8319999999999,"body":"Silence of The lambs."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1218.656,"endTime":1219.326,"body":"Not that, guy."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1219.645,"endTime":1221.667,"body":"And it's called I'm"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1219.645,"endTime":1221.667,"body":"okay, you're okay."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1222.607,"endTime":1226.927,"body":"Because it's sort of, it's"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1222.607,"endTime":1226.927,"body":"the idea that we all have"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1226.927,"endTime":1228.637,"body":"a basic position of either."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1229.2369999999999,"endTime":1229.7169999999999,"body":"I'm okay."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1229.7169999999999,"endTime":1230.647,"body":"You are okay."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1230.857,"endTime":1231.5169999999998,"body":"I'm okay."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1231.522,"endTime":1232.777,"body":"You are not okay."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1233.407,"endTime":1234.447,"body":"I'm not okay."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1234.7469999999998,"endTime":1235.447,"body":"You are okay."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1235.927,"endTime":1237.307,"body":"Or I'm not okay."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1237.397,"endTime":1238.417,"body":"You are not okay."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1238.587,"endTime":1241.677,"body":"So basic Cartesian"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1238.587,"endTime":1241.677,"body":"logic positions."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1242.301,"endTime":1245.8609999999999,"body":"I think from what she"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1242.301,"endTime":1245.8609999999999,"body":"said, Carla  is in"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1246.071,"endTime":1247.991,"body":"the, I'm not okay."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1248.201,"endTime":1250.451,"body":"You are okay position."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1251.231,"endTime":1254.291,"body":"Which is a one down position"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1251.231,"endTime":1254.291,"body":"that everybody else is"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1254.291,"endTime":1256.031,"body":"alright and I'm not."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1256.163,"endTime":1259.223,"body":"I raise this because"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1256.163,"endTime":1259.223,"body":"having a little think"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1259.223,"endTime":1263.003,"body":"about it for yourself,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1259.223,"endTime":1263.003,"body":"anybody who's listening"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1263.531,"endTime":1264.521,"body":"can be quite insightful."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1264.821,"endTime":1266.771,"body":"You just get, oh, right."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1266.771,"endTime":1267.1309999999999,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1267.1309999999999,"endTime":1269.6209999999999,"body":"I view the world in that way."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1270.001,"endTime":1274.021,"body":"So anybody who is in the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1270.001,"endTime":1274.021,"body":"I'm okay, you are not okay."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1274.021,"endTime":1277.501,"body":"Position is going to be"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1274.021,"endTime":1277.501,"body":"insulted by what I'm about"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1277.501,"endTime":1280.171,"body":"to say, because that's"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1277.501,"endTime":1280.171,"body":"the sort of narcissistic,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1280.531,"endTime":1285.301,"body":"egotistic position of I'm"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1280.531,"endTime":1285.301,"body":"better than everybody else."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1286.261,"endTime":1289.1209999999999,"body":"Now it depends on the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1286.261,"endTime":1289.1209999999999,"body":"circumstances a few weeks"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1289.1209999999999,"endTime":1289.991,"body":"ago, we talked about"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1290.591,"endTime":1291.234,"body":"persona."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1291.3609999999999,"endTime":1293.1309999999999,"body":"And the positive"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1291.3609999999999,"endTime":1293.1309999999999,"body":"use of a persona."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1293.405,"endTime":1298.624,"body":"If you are going into an"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1293.405,"endTime":1298.624,"body":"audition for a play and you"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1299.194,"endTime":1301.903,"body":"presumably want to get the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1299.194,"endTime":1301.903,"body":"role then going in with the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1301.963,"endTime":1305.789,"body":"I'm okay, you are not okay"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1301.963,"endTime":1305.789,"body":"persona can be quite useful,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1306.119,"endTime":1307.6789999999999,"body":"but living your life with it."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1307.799,"endTime":1308.1589999999999,"body":"Mm."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1308.1889999999999,"endTime":1310.9589999999998,"body":"If you've got that going on,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1308.1889999999999,"endTime":1310.9589999999998,"body":"might be something to look at."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1311.5839999999998,"endTime":1313.654,"body":"The I'm not okay."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1313.654,"endTime":1316.414,"body":"You are not okay is the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1313.654,"endTime":1316.414,"body":"depressive position,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1316.414,"endTime":1319.204,"body":"which is everything's,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1316.414,"endTime":1319.204,"body":"everything's hopeless,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1319.234,"endTime":1320.194,"body":"everything's rubbish."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1320.261,"endTime":1321.7559999999999,"body":"That's a horrible"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1320.261,"endTime":1321.7559999999999,"body":"place to be in."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1322.086,"endTime":1325.571,"body":"And a lot of the media"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1322.086,"endTime":1325.571,"body":"deliberately or not try"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1325.571,"endTime":1326.8609999999999,"body":"to put us in that place."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1326.8909999999998,"endTime":1328.091,"body":"Certainly the British media,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1329.501,"endTime":1329.531,"body":"a"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1329.531,"endTime":1329.741,"body":"lot"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1329.793,"endTime":1332.193,"body":"Well, I think"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1329.793,"endTime":1332.193,"body":"capitalism really"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1332.193,"endTime":1333.513,"body":"plays a part in this."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1334.2749999999999,"endTime":1337.5449999999998,"body":"we live in, we live in"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1334.2749999999999,"endTime":1337.5449999999998,"body":"a world, mostly where"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1337.635,"endTime":1339.7849999999999,"body":"it's funded through"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1337.635,"endTime":1339.7849999999999,"body":"the things that we buy."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1340.875,"endTime":1343.575,"body":"and the taxes that are on it,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1340.875,"endTime":1343.575,"body":"then go into the government"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1343.575,"endTime":1344.7749999999999,"body":"and that pays for everything."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1344.78,"endTime":1347.175,"body":"And we all live happily ever"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1344.78,"endTime":1347.175,"body":"after, but in order to get"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1347.175,"endTime":1349.922,"body":"us to buy things, they've"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1347.175,"endTime":1349.922,"body":"gotta make us want it."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1350.042,"endTime":1351.3319999999999,"body":"They've gotta make us need it."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1351.452,"endTime":1353.5819999999999,"body":"And one of the ways to do"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1351.452,"endTime":1353.5819999999999,"body":"that, I think is to make"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1353.5819999999999,"endTime":1356.822,"body":"it so that we are not"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1353.5819999999999,"endTime":1356.822,"body":"okay if we don't have it."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1357.422,"endTime":1361.5919999999999,"body":"And that's not a good place"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1357.422,"endTime":1361.5919999999999,"body":"to try and keep people, but"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1361.8319999999999,"endTime":1365.3719999999998,"body":"that's, that's where we've"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1361.8319999999999,"endTime":1365.3719999999998,"body":"got to over the last 50 years."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1365.3719999999998,"endTime":1366.902,"body":"Certainly the last"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1365.3719999999998,"endTime":1366.902,"body":"generation or so we"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1366.902,"endTime":1367.8919999999998,"body":"really have, and it is"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1368.072,"endTime":1369.752,"body":"it's definitely definitely"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1368.072,"endTime":1369.752,"body":"needs challenging."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1370.495,"endTime":1371.125,"body":"reminds me."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1371.125,"endTime":1373.225,"body":"I forgot to buy my new"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1371.125,"endTime":1373.225,"body":"milk pan this morning,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1373.225,"endTime":1374.455,"body":"cuz my old one burnt."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1374.935,"endTime":1377.095,"body":"Oh, I do need it."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1377.155,"endTime":1380.575,"body":"You see, I don't, I don't"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1377.155,"endTime":1380.575,"body":"need a new milk pan."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1381.0549999999998,"endTime":1384.908,"body":"But yeah, I mean, I don't go"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1381.0549999999998,"endTime":1384.908,"body":"into complexity with politics"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1384.908,"endTime":1389.258,"body":"either, but any political"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1384.908,"endTime":1389.258,"body":"system you can, you can fit"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1389.258,"endTime":1394.1779999999999,"body":"to, to these, these models,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1389.258,"endTime":1394.1779999999999,"body":"but that's , the everything"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1394.1779999999999,"endTime":1395.7379999999998,"body":"is a horrible place."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1395.918,"endTime":1396.398,"body":"And."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1397.523,"endTime":1401.513,"body":"Gosh, that must be an"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1397.523,"endTime":1401.513,"body":"unpleasant place to live."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1401.5939999999998,"endTime":1403.874,"body":"But of course, the fourth"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1401.5939999999998,"endTime":1403.874,"body":"one, which I started from"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1403.874,"endTime":1407.684,"body":"and I've ended up at is the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1403.874,"endTime":1407.684,"body":"I'm okay, you are okay place,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1407.858,"endTime":1409.868,"body":"which doesn't necessarily,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1407.858,"endTime":1409.868,"body":"I mean, it doesn't"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1409.868,"endTime":1412.148,"body":"mean everything's okay."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1412.9879999999998,"endTime":1416.6499999999999,"body":"It's not you know, life"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1412.9879999999998,"endTime":1416.6499999999999,"body":"is a bowl of cherries"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1416.6499999999999,"endTime":1420.4679999999998,"body":"and over the rainbow"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1416.6499999999999,"endTime":1420.4679999999998,"body":"and flowers and hearts."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1421.3529999999998,"endTime":1422.403,"body":"Lovely lovely stuff."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1423.273,"endTime":1426.062,"body":"It's not saying that it's"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1423.273,"endTime":1426.062,"body":"saying that basically."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1426.722,"endTime":1428.252,"body":"It's okay."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1429.1219999999998,"endTime":1435.152,"body":"I am okay being me and"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1429.1219999999998,"endTime":1435.152,"body":"you are okay being you."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1436.1419999999998,"endTime":1438.3619999999999,"body":"So it's a very"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1436.1419999999998,"endTime":1438.3619999999999,"body":"positive place to be."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1439.1119999999999,"endTime":1442.8619999999999,"body":"And along with the other"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1439.1119999999999,"endTime":1442.8619999999999,"body":"things we've talked about"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1442.867,"endTime":1446.472,"body":"today, I'd like to encourage"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1442.867,"endTime":1446.472,"body":"Carla to see if she could"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1446.472,"endTime":1451.652,"body":"get some, some help to get"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1446.472,"endTime":1451.652,"body":"her to the place where she"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1451.652,"endTime":1453.655,"body":"can see that she's okay."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1453.82,"endTime":1457.1499999999999,"body":"By going back by looking"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1453.82,"endTime":1457.1499999999999,"body":"at the, the, the things"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1457.1499999999999,"endTime":1459.9399999999998,"body":"that have happened, her"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1457.1499999999999,"endTime":1459.9399999999998,"body":"interpretations of the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1460.1499999999999,"endTime":1461.08,"body":"things that have happened"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1461.783,"endTime":1463.3429999999998,"body":"And get an"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1461.783,"endTime":1463.3429999999998,"body":"adult's perspective on it."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1463.8909999999998,"endTime":1464.971,"body":"and get an"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1463.8909999999998,"endTime":1464.971,"body":"adults' perspective."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1466.1109999999999,"endTime":1466.4109999999998,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1466.9879999999998,"endTime":1469.6879999999999,"body":"Then we can change"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1466.9879999999998,"endTime":1469.6879999999999,"body":"those, those deep core"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1469.6879999999999,"endTime":1471.278,"body":"beliefs gently, slowly."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1471.278,"endTime":1473.648,"body":"We can't just reinvent"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1471.278,"endTime":1473.648,"body":"ourselves overnight."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1473.648,"endTime":1474.638,"body":"That's a persona."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1475.358,"endTime":1479.558,"body":"And putting that on as long"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1475.358,"endTime":1479.558,"body":"as you've got, well, you"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1479.558,"endTime":1483.158,"body":"can put on a persona and"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1479.558,"endTime":1483.158,"body":"as if you are lovable, but"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1483.158,"endTime":1485.9479999999999,"body":"you've gotta do it with"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1483.158,"endTime":1485.9479999999999,"body":"the right mindset I think."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1486.278,"endTime":1488.138,"body":"If you do it with the"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1486.278,"endTime":1488.138,"body":"mindset of, I'm just"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1488.138,"endTime":1489.578,"body":"pretending I'm lovable, but I"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1489.578,"endTime":1490.748,"body":"know deep down, I'm not,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1491.2359999999999,"endTime":1492.2259999999999,"body":"And that's"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1491.2359999999999,"endTime":1492.2259999999999,"body":"not gonna work."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1492.578,"endTime":1495.4879999999998,"body":"it's not gonna help,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1492.578,"endTime":1495.4879999999998,"body":"but if you practice anything"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1495.998,"endTime":1499.778,"body":"with a, with the background"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1495.998,"endTime":1499.778,"body":"knowledge that I'm just"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1499.778,"endTime":1502.838,"body":"practicing this, I'm"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1499.778,"endTime":1502.838,"body":"learning how to love myself."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1502.838,"endTime":1504.248,"body":"I'm learning to be lovable."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1505.328,"endTime":1506.378,"body":"Then that's the right to me."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1506.378,"endTime":1508.6879999999999,"body":"That seems like a, the"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1506.378,"endTime":1508.6879999999999,"body":"right sort of mindset."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1508.693,"endTime":1509.888,"body":"I'm learning to be lovable."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1509.888,"endTime":1514.118,"body":"So I'm practicing acting as"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1509.888,"endTime":1514.118,"body":"if someone as if I am lovable."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1515.018,"endTime":1516.1879999999999,"body":"And I know I don't"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1515.018,"endTime":1516.1879999999999,"body":"quite feel it"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1516.1879999999999,"endTime":1517.118,"body":"yet, but I'm getting there"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1517.388,"endTime":1517.838,"body":"that sort"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1517.8909999999998,"endTime":1520.6509999999998,"body":"And I bet"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1517.8909999999998,"endTime":1520.6509999999998,"body":"that I would bet."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1521.806,"endTime":1524.4759999999999,"body":"I don't bet very often,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1521.806,"endTime":1524.4759999999999,"body":"but I would bet that if"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1524.4759999999999,"endTime":1529.126,"body":"Carla was to act as if she"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1524.4759999999999,"endTime":1529.126,"body":"was lovable, she would be"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1529.126,"endTime":1531.676,"body":"doing nothing different"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1529.126,"endTime":1531.676,"body":"from what she's doing now."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1532.158,"endTime":1535.158,"body":"Well, who"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1532.158,"endTime":1535.158,"body":"knows what people do."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1535.158,"endTime":1537.032,"body":"It might be things would"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1535.158,"endTime":1537.032,"body":"be exactly the same, but"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1537.032,"endTime":1541.172,"body":"there might be the added"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1537.032,"endTime":1541.172,"body":"saying no to somebody else"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1541.172,"endTime":1542.432,"body":"and saying yes to herself"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1543.26,"endTime":1544.2,"body":"Yes, that's"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1544.202,"endTime":1544.682,"body":"with things."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1544.942,"endTime":1547.1019999999999,"body":"Yeah, cuz she did"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1544.942,"endTime":1547.1019999999999,"body":"say about putting other"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1547.1019999999999,"endTime":1548.452,"body":"people first all the time."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1548.452,"endTime":1550.393,"body":"Yes, yes, she did."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1550.873,"endTime":1551.473,"body":"Yes."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1551.743,"endTime":1554.143,"body":"And that's exactly what"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1551.743,"endTime":1554.143,"body":"people with that defective"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1554.143,"endTime":1559.0929999999998,"body":"schema do in order to try"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1554.143,"endTime":1559.0929999999998,"body":"and compensate for it."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1559.374,"endTime":1559.974,"body":"Love me."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1559.974,"endTime":1560.994,"body":"Love, please love me."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1560.994,"endTime":1561.474,"body":"Please love me."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1561.474,"endTime":1562.104,"body":"Please love me."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1562.404,"endTime":1563.874,"body":"I've got to do"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1562.404,"endTime":1563.874,"body":"everything for you."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1564.384,"endTime":1567.684,"body":"And then all it does is"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1564.384,"endTime":1567.684,"body":"just reinforce this belief"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1567.684,"endTime":1570.8339999999998,"body":"that I'm no good, and"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1567.684,"endTime":1570.8339999999998,"body":"that's not what we want."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1570.8339999999998,"endTime":1572.024,"body":"We wanna be able to say."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1572.484,"endTime":1575.124,"body":"No, this is, this is"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1572.484,"endTime":1575.124,"body":"what I want to do."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1575.124,"endTime":1578.0639999999999,"body":"I'm not gonna babysit"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1575.124,"endTime":1578.0639999999999,"body":"again while you go out"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1578.754,"endTime":1581.7839999999999,"body":"sister , for example."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1581.874,"endTime":1583.674,"body":"And I remember having that"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1581.874,"endTime":1583.674,"body":"experience, not with my"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1583.674,"endTime":1586.7759999999998,"body":"sister, but with being taken"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1583.674,"endTime":1586.7759999999998,"body":"advantage of when I was, when"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1586.781,"endTime":1590.4959999999999,"body":"I was very young, I was like"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1586.781,"endTime":1590.4959999999999,"body":"19,  18 something like that."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1590.4959999999999,"endTime":1592.7759999999998,"body":"And the friend said,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1590.4959999999999,"endTime":1592.7759999999998,"body":"cuz they'd had a baby."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1592.956,"endTime":1594.456,"body":"Well, could you look after"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1592.956,"endTime":1594.456,"body":"the, could, could you look"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1594.456,"endTime":1596.898,"body":"after her while I uh, well,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1594.456,"endTime":1596.898,"body":"no, actually got a phone call."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1596.9279999999999,"endTime":1598.008,"body":"What are you"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1596.9279999999999,"endTime":1598.008,"body":"doing on Saturday?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1598.528,"endTime":1600.258,"body":"Oh Saturday, I'm"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1598.528,"endTime":1600.258,"body":"not doing anything."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1600.318,"endTime":1600.6779999999999,"body":"Oh, that's good."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1600.6779999999999,"endTime":1601.4579999999999,"body":"Could you babysit?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1602.508,"endTime":1608.4779999999998,"body":"I was like, damn no,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1602.508,"endTime":1608.4779999999998,"body":"but I said, yes  because"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1608.4779999999998,"endTime":1609.528,"body":"I wanted to be loved."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1609.858,"endTime":1610.9679999999998,"body":"I wanted to be liked."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1611.058,"endTime":1613.825,"body":"And I wanted to be"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1611.058,"endTime":1613.825,"body":"part of that unit where"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1613.825,"endTime":1615.7749999999999,"body":"everybody seemed to like"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1613.825,"endTime":1615.7749999999999,"body":"each other and be happy."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1615.7749999999999,"endTime":1616.3149999999998,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1616.32,"endTime":1618.115,"body":"And I was at one o'clock"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1616.32,"endTime":1618.115,"body":"in the morning when they"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1618.115,"endTime":1619.3149999999998,"body":"all came back, I thought."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1620.35,"endTime":1622.25,"body":"and somebody said, look,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1620.35,"endTime":1622.25,"body":"she's taking the mick mate."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1622.6599999999999,"endTime":1624.07,"body":"Yeah, she isn't, she"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1622.6599999999999,"endTime":1624.07,"body":"she's never gonna"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1624.07,"endTime":1624.6499999999999,"body":"sleep with me is she."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1624.73,"endTime":1629.4099999999999,"body":"No, okay."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1629.74,"endTime":1630.34,"body":"I'll get my coat."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1630.34,"endTime":1635.71,"body":"it's what we do, but we"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1630.34,"endTime":1635.71,"body":"have to challenge it when"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1635.71,"endTime":1637.06,"body":"we have those experiences."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1637.4689999999998,"endTime":1643.589,"body":"But the other side of"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1637.4689999999998,"endTime":1643.589,"body":"that is I I've seen too many"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1643.589,"endTime":1649.049,"body":"examples of people who say"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1643.589,"endTime":1649.049,"body":"no, because their schema is"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1649.1689999999999,"endTime":1651.539,"body":"that they feel they're going"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1649.1689999999999,"endTime":1651.539,"body":"to be taken advantage of."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1652.249,"endTime":1655.829,"body":"Whereas if they've got"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1652.249,"endTime":1655.829,"body":"nothing else to do on a"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1655.829,"endTime":1659.069,"body":"Saturday evening and a"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1655.829,"endTime":1659.069,"body":"friend needs a babysitter."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1660.119,"endTime":1661.829,"body":"Well, that's okay."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1661.829,"endTime":1663.899,"body":"It doesn't mean you're"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1661.829,"endTime":1663.899,"body":"being manipulated."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1663.899,"endTime":1666.989,"body":"If you don't take it as"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1663.899,"endTime":1666.989,"body":"such, you're choosing"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1666.989,"endTime":1670.6789999999999,"body":"to do something that's"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1666.989,"endTime":1670.6789999999999,"body":"nice for people and"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1670.6789999999999,"endTime":1671.9089999999999,"body":"that's okay as well."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1672.359,"endTime":1674.849,"body":"I suppose it's all about"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1672.359,"endTime":1674.849,"body":"being clear in your own"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1674.849,"endTime":1676.799,"body":"mind as to what you're doing"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1674.849,"endTime":1676.799,"body":"and why you're doing it."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1677.1979999999999,"endTime":1677.835,"body":"Yeah, it is."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1678.0449999999998,"endTime":1681.655,"body":"And as long as we've got"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1678.0449999999998,"endTime":1681.655,"body":"those more positive schemas"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1681.675,"endTime":1686.175,"body":"to use that word again,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1681.675,"endTime":1686.175,"body":"that say, I am lovable."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1686.7269999999999,"endTime":1688.97,"body":"We're gonna be able to"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1686.7269999999999,"endTime":1688.97,"body":"handle those experiences"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1689.0,"endTime":1691.1599999999999,"body":"and, and filter it for that."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1691.6399999999999,"endTime":1693.8,"body":"If somebody's asking us"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1691.6399999999999,"endTime":1693.8,"body":"to do something and we"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1693.8,"endTime":1697.27,"body":"feel lovable, then why"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1693.8,"endTime":1697.27,"body":"not do it for example."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1698.23,"endTime":1699.4299999999998,"body":"Because that's what,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1698.23,"endTime":1699.4299999999998,"body":"that's how we are"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1699.435,"endTime":1700.87,"body":"filtering our world."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1701.148,"endTime":1701.368,"body":"Mm,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1702.07,"endTime":1702.49,"body":"We just"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1702.528,"endTime":1703.668,"body":"it's about"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1702.528,"endTime":1703.668,"body":"the filtering."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1703.668,"endTime":1703.9379999999999,"body":"Isn't"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1703.9379999999999,"endTime":1704.118,"body":"it."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1704.6499999999999,"endTime":1704.95,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1705.52,"endTime":1706.51,"body":"It really, really is."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1707.56,"endTime":1708.04,"body":"Well Carla."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1708.04,"endTime":1711.85,"body":"I hope we came close to"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1708.04,"endTime":1711.85,"body":"scratching the surface"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1711.85,"endTime":1715.51,"body":"of what to do and what to"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1711.85,"endTime":1715.51,"body":"explore and how to explore it."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1716.2,"endTime":1719.336,"body":"I genuinely do think"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1716.2,"endTime":1719.336,"body":"that it's best done with"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1719.341,"endTime":1722.0059999999999,"body":"a psychotherapist or"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1719.341,"endTime":1722.0059999999999,"body":"a counselor, but there"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1722.011,"endTime":1722.816,"body":"are things we can do."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1723.426,"endTime":1726.366,"body":"On our own, but it, it does"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1723.426,"endTime":1726.366,"body":"mean a lot of thinking, a"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1726.366,"endTime":1729.83,"body":"lot of journaling and maybe"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1726.366,"endTime":1729.83,"body":"a little bit of research,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1729.83,"endTime":1733.37,"body":"maybe a lot of reading about"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1729.83,"endTime":1733.37,"body":"these theories and listening"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1733.37,"endTime":1734.6599999999999,"body":"to other people's stories."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1734.99,"endTime":1738.4099999999999,"body":"And believe me, there are"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1734.99,"endTime":1738.4099999999999,"body":"plenty out there whether it's"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1738.415,"endTime":1742.7,"body":"podcasts like ours or it's"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1738.415,"endTime":1742.7,"body":"books from authors that have"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1742.7,"endTime":1744.95,"body":"had similar experiences and"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1742.7,"endTime":1744.95,"body":"how they got through it all,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1745.25,"endTime":1746.33,"body":"it's all really, really good."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1746.33,"endTime":1752.1399999999999,"body":"Explore it all and challenge"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1746.33,"endTime":1752.1399999999999,"body":"that you have and recognize"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1752.1399999999999,"endTime":1753.52,"body":"is this because of my reality."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1754.435,"endTime":1758.365,"body":"Or is this, is this because"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1754.435,"endTime":1758.365,"body":"of me filtering for something?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1758.7549999999999,"endTime":1762.115,"body":"Chances are you're"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1758.7549999999999,"endTime":1762.115,"body":"filtering and do we just"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1762.115,"endTime":1763.645,"body":"need to be aware of it."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1763.705,"endTime":1764.665,"body":"That's how it starts."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1764.665,"endTime":1767.0049999999999,"body":"with that awareness comes"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1764.665,"endTime":1767.0049999999999,"body":"some understanding and some"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1767.0049999999999,"endTime":1769.7649999999999,"body":"acceptance of ourselves that,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1767.0049999999999,"endTime":1769.7649999999999,"body":"oh, I see why I do that."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1769.7949999999998,"endTime":1770.0049999999999,"body":"Okay."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1770.0049999999999,"endTime":1770.7849999999999,"body":"That makes sense."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1770.875,"endTime":1774.235,"body":"And then you can forgive"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1770.875,"endTime":1774.235,"body":"yourself for screaming"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1774.2849999999999,"endTime":1777.896,"body":"at somebody and sort of"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1774.2849999999999,"endTime":1777.896,"body":"exaggerating everything."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1777.9009999999998,"endTime":1779.8509999999999,"body":"When all they did is just"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1777.9009999999998,"endTime":1779.8509999999999,"body":"took a bit of time to"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1779.8509999999999,"endTime":1781.081,"body":"reply to a text message."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1781.261,"endTime":1781.8609999999999,"body":"For example."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1781.8609999999999,"endTime":1783.1209999999999,"body":"It doesn't mean"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1781.8609999999999,"endTime":1783.1209999999999,"body":"you're not lovable."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1783.481,"endTime":1785.341,"body":"Just means they"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1783.481,"endTime":1785.341,"body":"were slow Croy."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1785.591,"endTime":1787.981,"body":"I tend, I spend ages"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1785.591,"endTime":1787.981,"body":"to reply, reply to text"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1787.981,"endTime":1788.8809999999999,"body":"messages sometimes."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1788.8809999999999,"endTime":1790.7259999999999,"body":"Cuz I get so distracted"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1788.8809999999999,"endTime":1790.7259999999999,"body":"with other stuff."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1791.166,"endTime":1794.251,"body":"Today, I wanted to"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1791.166,"endTime":1794.251,"body":"research scheme of therapy."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1794.751,"endTime":1796.801,"body":"I went onto YouTube just to"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1794.751,"endTime":1796.801,"body":"have a look at a refresher"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1796.806,"endTime":1799.831,"body":"of some of the names ended"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1796.806,"endTime":1799.831,"body":"up looking at MacBook pro"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1799.831,"endTime":1802.531,"body":"reviews because that's what"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1799.831,"endTime":1802.531,"body":"popped up then closed the"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1802.531,"endTime":1803.551,"body":"window down and went right."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1803.551,"endTime":1803.941,"body":"Where was I?"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1804.421,"endTime":1804.571,"body":"Oh,"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1804.609,"endTime":1807.609,"body":"because because the"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1804.609,"endTime":1807.609,"body":"capitalist society says"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1807.739,"endTime":1808.779,"body":"you need a MacBook pro"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1809.341,"endTime":1811.1109999999999,"body":"Yeah, and I,"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1809.341,"endTime":1811.1109999999999,"body":"and I don't, I just"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1811.1109999999999,"endTime":1813.811,"body":"wanted to, oh, damn it."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1814.201,"endTime":1815.1309999999999,"body":"Capitalism."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1816.6309999999999,"endTime":1818.721,"body":"Oh, any hoo!"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1821.251,"endTime":1822.541,"body":"Let's love you"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1821.251,"endTime":1822.541,"body":"and leave you all."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1822.541,"endTime":1823.6209999999999,"body":"Cuz time is ticking on."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1824.356,"endTime":1825.376,"body":"Have a super week."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1825.586,"endTime":1828.2259999999999,"body":"And if you have any further"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1825.586,"endTime":1828.2259999999999,"body":"questions about this or"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1828.2859999999998,"endTime":1831.2859999999998,"body":"anything else at all, the"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1828.2859999999998,"endTime":1831.2859999999998,"body":"link is in the show notes"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1831.2859999999998,"endTime":1833.176,"body":"to a little form where you"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1831.2859999999998,"endTime":1833.176,"body":"fill in that sends us an"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1833.176,"endTime":1835.966,"body":"email and we get to read all"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1833.176,"endTime":1835.966,"body":"your thoughts and insights."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1835.9959999999999,"endTime":1838.8809999999999,"body":"So please do that and we'll"},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1835.9959999999999,"endTime":1838.8809999999999,"body":"speak to you next time."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1839.001,"endTime":1839.241,"body":"See"},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1839.354,"endTime":1839.5639999999999,"body":"Yeah."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1839.654,"endTime":1840.944,"body":"thank you Thank you, Carla."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1840.944,"endTime":1842.0539999999999,"body":"And thank you everybody."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1842.114,"endTime":1842.744,"body":"Talk to you soon."},{"speaker":"Richard","startTime":1843.441,"endTime":1843.6209999999999,"body":"Bye."},{"speaker":"Fiona","startTime":1844.634,"endTime":1844.8139999999999,"body":"Bye."}]}