DEI Symposium Series - Creating Identity-Driven Career Readiness Programming

This episode is part of the DEI Symposium Series, developed from the DEI Symposium presented at the 2025 NCDA Global Career Development Conference in Atlanta, Georgia.

Dr. Cheryl Love (UC Riverside) hosts Mount Holyoke College career development leaders Dr. Jaime Grillo and Meaghan Murphy-Rennie on strategies for implementing identity-driven career readiness programming. They outline Mount Holyoke’s demographics and describe adding intentional identity components to three signature programs: a mentoring program where students choose matching by identity, industry, or skills; Sophomore Institute cohorts including LGBTQIA+ and BIPOC options plus identity/values sessions; and a required internship/research orientation with identity-based “community conversation” panels. They discuss campus and alumni impact, key challenges, and future plans.

Dr. Jaime Grillo currently serves as the associate vice president for career readiness at Mount Holyoke College. Dr. Grillo joined Mount Holyoke in June 2023 as the executive director of the Career Development Center, leading a team of 16 professionals on career readiness and strategic initiatives. Building on 17+ years experience in career development, and higher education administration. Dr. Grillo earned her Ed.D. in Instructional Leadership in Higher Education from St. John’s University. Her research focuses on student success and engagement, experiential learning, students’ confidence, and post-graduation outcomes.

Meaghan Murphy-Rennie serves as the Associate Director of External Relations & Career Specialist at Mount Holyoke College. She advises students and alums interested in Business, Finance & Consulting and/or Computer Science & Technology, and also works with alums on signature programming offered through the Career Development Center. These signature events include Sophomore Institute, the Career Connections Mentoring Program, and the Internships & Research Orientation, among others. She is also a member of the First Gen Network, which is a group of first generation staff and faculty members who work together to support the college's first generation and low income student population.

Dr. Cheryl Love is a Career Counselor and a College Specialist for the Arts, Humanities, School of Education and School of Public Policy in the Career Center at the University of California, Riverside. In this role she also serves as the Liaison to the African Student Programs, the Black Student Success Initiative, Basic Needs, UCR Transfer Work Group, and the Kessler Scholar Program.

Transcript

Career Practitioner Conversations Podcast

National Career Development Association

S5:E11

DEI Symposium Series: Creating Identity-Driven Career Readiness Programming

February 24, 2026

Hello and welcome to the podcast. I'm Melissa Venable, NCDA, director of Professional Development, and this episode continues our 2025 DEI symposium series with a conversation about innovative strategies for creating identity driven career readiness programming. I am here with Dr. Jaime Grillo and Meaghan Murphy-Rennie from the Career Development Center at Mount Holyoke College, and Dr. Cheryl Love from the Career Center at the University of California Riverside. Thank you all so much for being here. Thank you for, um, having us Dr. Venable and once again, it's always an honor and a privilege to be able to continue the good work of the NCDA Diversity Initiative and Cultural Inclusion Committee.

And  we are now in the second year of doing a DEI Symposium podcast series highlighting. The presenters from the, um, symposium, the DEI symposium that took place in Atlanta, um, this summer, and so  already been introduced. I'm Dr. Cheryl Love, I'm one of the career specialists at the University of California Riverside, and in addition to that, I am  a board member, co-founder of in Harton.

Unseen leaders. I serve as a vice president of that organization and we are providing resources and support to unseen leaders, not only in the US but globally. And so another thing that I do in my spare time and I'm very proud of and my pronouns are she, her, hers. And now I'm gonna turn it over to the amazing folks who.

Created this identity driven creator readiness program that we're going to hear a lot about. So, Dr. Jaime and Meaghan take it away in terms of introducing yourselves and the amazing work that you do at your college. Thank you, Dr. Love. My name is Meaghan Murphy-Rennie. I use she her pronouns, and I'm the Associate Director of External Relations and Career Specialists for students interested in business finance and consulting and or computer science and technology at Mount Holyoke College.

I also work with alums on signature programming offered through the Career Development Center, such as the Career Connections Mentoring Program, the internship and research orientation, and Sophomore Institute, all of which we'll be talking about today. I'm about to start my fourth year here at the college and previously worked with an international education, primarily in study abroad, but also worked with our international student population.

Thank you so much for having us today. My name is Jaime Grillo. I use she her pronouns, and I am the Associate Vice President for career readiness. I am in my third year here at Mount Holyoke College. Before arriving at Mount Holyoke, I was at Hofstra Law School. St. John's University in Queens, New York and Syracuse University.

I have my doctorate in institutional leadership and higher education from St. John's, and my research is focused on the value of experiential learning. Through the student's lens. I have worked in a variety of roles on college campuses, and I'm grateful for the important work that we are doing in career centers across the country and at Mount Holyoke College.

We have such wonderful momentum as it relates to career readiness and very much look forward to getting into some of that throughout this conversation. Wonderful, wonderful. You guys are social justice warriors, so I'm gonna give you your props for the work that you are doing in the amazing career readiness program that we're gonna learn some more about  in this conversation.

But before we get into the notes and bolts of that career readiness program, tell us a little bit about Mount Holyoke College and the demographics of the institution. Sure. So Mount Holyoke College is a small liberal arts institution and considered a gender diverse women's college. We are located in the Pioneer Valley of Western Massachusetts and within the Pioneer Valley there are four other institutions, and so we make up something called a five College Consortium.

The other colleges in the area are Amherst College, Smith College, Hampshire College, and UMass Amherst. I think it's an absolute gift to be in this area and have peers so close by ranging from other liberal arts colleges, both co-educational and non to a large public institution to network with and partner on a variety of events and programs.

At Mount Holyoke College, we have a really special makeup of our student demographic with just, with just under 2200 students. A high majority of our students identify as LGBTQIA plus one. Fifth of our students are international students, and just under 30% of our students are domestic students of color.

A point of distinction about the career development Center at Mount Holyoke is our positionality on campus. We report through the division of enrollment management, alongside of admissions and student financial services. This reporting structure, I think is important to mention. As it allows us a unique opportunity to truly bookend the student experience, meeting with them very early on as soon as they expressed an interest as prospects all the way through.

 Being able to work with them throughout their time here on campus and continuing to work with them beyond the gates, which is what we like to say here, um, as they become alums. I have been so fortunate throughout my role here to lead through an inclusive lens and have the support to do so. So throughout this conversation, Megan and I are going to talk more about some of the inclusive programming and how we use both identity and industry interests to guide a student through their experiential learning journeys and through their career exploration.

You know, I just love it.  Especially, it just warms my heart to hear the book ending, um, with the interactions you have with your scholars and  you know, the diversity within your  college, you know, it's just heartwarming to me because there's a lot of chaos going on because of things happening in DC I believe in naming it.

So that people can understand what they're dealing with. And so Yeah, act, go ahead, doctor. Yeah, I I think too, to that point, Dr. Love, having that opportunity to bookend also means creating relationships early. Yes. And creating those relationships early. Then it turns into trusting relationships, right? Yes.

'cause they're seeing a consistent message from, you know, before day one all the way through, and we continue to support them. And so we've found it very successful. Al Bite a  an uncommon reporting structure. I think it, it's very much  a strength for all of the programs we deliver and the work we do here.

Yeah, especially in times like these, being able to build those trusting relationships, I think it's, um, it's definitely   blessing, a blessing to be able to do so. And I know your scholars are blessed with the opportunities that you are providing with them. So  tell  us. 'cause you know those who will get a chance to listen to this conversation.

How did the idea come to fruition in terms of creating an identity driven career readiness program? How did this idea come to fruition? I'm happy to add to that or to kind of expand more. So the idea really started, um, in terms of incorporating identity into these signature events, um, as being a direct response to students' needs.

And it also fits with the Mount Holyoke College mission statement and the college's overall commitment and emphasis on identity and supporting students. And alums in that way. Um, we first started with the Career Connections mentoring program, um, back in the summer of 2024, and we launched in the fall of 2024.

And the way that this program is structured is we do pair each student with an alum for one semester  and the student drives the experience so they decide what they'd like to work on for that semester. And throughout the whole time of the program commitment, we've asked them to, to schedule a minimum of three individual sessions with their partner and then also attend two virtual group sessions.

One to kick off the program and then one to close the program. And so that continues that idea of the bookends right, of, of meeting them kind of at the beginning of the program. And then at the end of the program when we were researching mentoring programs in kind of that development. Piece we did see a lot of programs that focused on matching students with alums based on industry interest or matching students with alums around a specific identity such as first generation college students.

Um, and so we wanted to do something a bit different with our program to align more with the Matt Holyoke College mission. So we gave students the opportunity to choose how they'd like to be matched so they can self-select how they wanna be matched first, whether that's by industry. Identity or the skills that they would like to work on throughout the semester.

And if they happen to choose identity first, then they, they can choose up to 15 different identity groups from the list. Um, and then we do our best to match them by that. And so those 15 identity groups are based around ethnicity, but we also have some that are college specific, such as our Francis Perkins Scholars, which are the non-traditional age, student population, and then other identities such as having a visible or invisible disability.

Being an international student, a posse scholar, an athlete, a veteran, or first generation college student. Um, and what we found was that in our first year, 89 of the 113 students who participated or about 79%, um, did request to be matched first by identity, which we were really excited to see. Um, and that was something that has kind of carried through, um, that whole time of just those conversations that have been happening.

 And then following the success of the mentoring program, we kind of, we built that into other programs. So while identity has been always present in the career readiness programming, after the mentoring program, we became more intentional about how we incorporated it. Into two additional events. So the first of those would be Sophomore Institute.

Um, and so that event is a three day conference style event in January for sophomores centered around the themes of reflecting, preparing, and connecting around their career readiness. Journey and it's a mix of workshops, keynote speakers, alum panels, and virtual informational interviews, as well as the networking reception with alums too.

 And this past year we had 126 students who participated in 207 alums who volunteered their time, which was fantastic to see. Regarding the focus on identity, students were sorted into cohorts based on their preferences for industry or identity. And so we had 15 industry groups and two identity groups, which were centered around those identifying as part of the LGBTQIA plus or bipoc communities.

And so the students who were sorted into those identity cohorts were given an additional opportunity to connect with alums who shared those identities over lunch and have kind of an, an informal conversation around whatever topics they wanted to bring up. Uh, we also offered two sessions during Sophomore Institute related to identity and values.

Um, an alum keynote called Your Career and Your Identities and Values and your Professional Self led by a CDC staff member. And so these sessions were both highly rated by students in terms of the content that they got out of that session. And then the, what we found interesting was the Bipoc cohort actually ended up being the largest cohort, um, with students really wanting to join and be part of that community  which was really nice to see.

And then for our third event, um, which was the internship and research orientation program. So this is a virtual one day conference style event that's required for students at Mount Holyoke who are receiving funding for low paid or unpaid summer internship or research experiences, or if they would choose to do or prefer to do an independent project.

So the way that that event is structured, we offer a few sessions called Career Conversations that focus on remote work or making small talk. And then we do, we have 17 alum panels, um, each with three to four alums. On the panel. And so these included a panel called Secrets of Success, which had alums who've previously managed interns or entry level workers talking about, um, you know, how do you set, how do you manage expectations in the workplace?

And then we did offer 12 panels focused on industry insights. So, um, you know, collection of alums focused on business or collection of alums focused on  you know, museums, library science, et cetera. And then the remaining four panels of those 17. Are called community conversations, and that was something new that we added this year.

Um, and so each of those four panels had alums representing, um, different kind of identities in the workplace. So, um, they touched on disabilities, gender, race, and then of course the non-traditional age students in the workplace and shared their experiences with students who also  or who, who shared those identities.

Wow. I have to tell you that 'cause I am involved with, um, mentorship  programs on my campus, but also through, um, professional organizations and such. And I will tell you, I love the fact that you are, um, given the students,  the choice of how they want to be mentored. 'cause typically, you know, mentorship is tied into industry interest.

And I love the idea that you guys are implementing where it's about, um, students, one, being able to choose and then also the  identity piece. The other thing I have to say, you guys are doing something really great. 'cause alumni, and we'll get to challenges later, but you guys are doing, you guys have some kind of secret sauce 'cause you have some amazing numbers when it comes to alumni helping out  your scholars.

And I know that also makes a big difference too.  And so that leads me to the next question. How does this work impact the campus? Because, you know, you got alumni coming in at some really,  I said great numbers, participating and helping and students getting to be able to beyond industry, connecting with folk through, um, the identity lens.

And so just curious, how does this work impact the campus? Yeah. I have to say Dr. Love, I think,  career readiness is thread throughout the fabric of this campus, and we feel that every day. We often partner with  many of our campus partners, especially our alum association and our development teams.

They are. Eager and excited to bring alums back to campus to talk about career and what better way for students to truly understand how to leverage and enhance a liberal arts education than talking with an alum and hearing about their pathway. And so we truly lean into the interdisciplinary nature of our students and our alums are a true testament to that living and working.

In being contributing members to society and the communities that they live and are, um, so eager to come back. So we are very fortunate, but ultimately giving students an opportunity to choose between identity and industry. In some cases, we're able to provide them both.  We're showing our students that we see them, that we hear them, and that we're committing and committed, excuse me, to leading through an inclusive lens.

An important aspect of our work is to prepare students for their experiential journeys, while also supporting the exploratory nature of their college and student experience. So in any or many of the moments of time that we're in, students may feel identity is the more salient as it relates to their career preparedness, comfort, and confidence in their next steps.

So our goal here in the Career Development Center is to help students learn, to help them to develop, right? And also to help them engage with a variety of industries of interest. Graduate schools, you know, professional schools, fellowships, project-based work, and, and many other things. And because we have such a collaborative and comprehensive structure of career readiness on campus here.

We work really hard to engage our campus partners in ways that help us support that student success. So depending on the programming we're offering and the options always continuing to raise up identity and industry as an integral to career preparation. Our hope is to allow our students then to feel more comfortable, more confident, and more prepared as they navigate their next steps and think about how they're entering a multi-generational, and I'm multicultural workplace.

I think inclusive and innovative programming, it's a foundation of our work on campus and beyond. Like you said earlier, our alums are coming back, and so that's where we hit that beyond how we're engaged with our five college and three college partners and employers alike. And like I've said earlier, and after hearing Megan's details on a variety of ways in which we've been able to enact such programming, we're fortunate to have that comprehensive program here on campus and, and show that true commitment to the student's career readiness, love, lovet, Lovet.

 Students are, um, begin seen and heard. And you guys are doing, all that you are doing is from an inclusive lens. And again, can't tell you how wonderful that is, especially in the climate that we find ourselves in these days because of the things happening in DC. So you guys are doing a lot of programming, you know, three day conference, uh uh, you know.

 Conversations with alumni and, you know, this stuff doesn't just happen with the snap of a finger. I mean, there's some work, a lot of work behind it. So I want to, um. Honor that by saying, I know that you guys are doing a lot to make these amazing  experiences for your scholars happen. So what are some of the challenges you've experienced this past year?

Because I want to acknowledge that. So people are listening, they're saying, Hey, this is great, but don't wanna use a, a rose color lens. So what were some of the challenges you experienced this past year as you were doing this amazing program for your scholars? Yes. You, you cannot grow without challenges.

And we certainly had a few  that I'm happy to highlight. So for the Career Connections mentoring program, on the subject of alums, actually lemme back up a little bit. So just to acknowledge the fact that we do have a really robust alum pool to work with an an engaged alum pool, um, one of the, the major challenges that we had with the Career Connections mentoring program.

Was that we found, um, there was a shortage of alums with shared identities compared to the number of students who preferred to be matched by an identity.  And so the largest gaps that we experienced in the first year was really alums who represented the Asian, Asian American communities, BIPOC community, Latin A and then, um, international students are alums and those with disabilities.

Um, so we're. I think, we'll, we'll touch on this in the, in, in the future. Um, but just trying to think of creative ways to, to really kind of encourage that population to support students.  And once these, this current group of students graduate, so reminding them kind of, of the opportunities so we can kind of pay it forward.

And again, with that book ending idea, um, another challenge was really the registration process. Um, so if anyone out there uses People Grove, um, that's the system that we use for our mentoring program.  When we first built it  the way that it was built, it did not allow students to rank which identity was most salient for them, um, in the matching process.

So we would have students, um, some of whom would select maybe one or two identities. And I had a student who selected. Six that they would love to be matched by. Um, so without having that additional input, we did have to make some guesses during the matching process, especially when looking at the full alum pool, um, and trying to find the best match for stu the students based off of  you know, the alums that were available to match.

And so for future programs, um, we did actually find a workaround. So students will have the space to list their preferences of identities to be matched by if they choose to be matched first by identity in the future.  For Sophomore Institute, we initially did not have enough focus on identities, um, for the identity cohorts  with only the additional lunch offered to students in those cohorts.

So we're working to expand that for next year and figure out other ways to build in identity beyond just having that additional opportunity. We do also anticipate a shortage of alums and or student leaders  who match the identity groups as we continue to expand Sophomore Institute. Um, and so each of our cohorts is led by a student fellow, um, so someone who's a junior or senior, ideally someone who's gone through Sophomore Institute before.

Um, but the, the question remains is, do we recruit alums based on identity cohort needs or recruit alums who fit the curriculum needs and trying to find the balance between those. And then the third challenge for Sophomore Institute is there's really not enough space for all of the identity groups to be represented in a cohort space.

So again, finding the balance between the number of identity cohorts and the number of industry cohorts that we offer each year to make sure that we're meeting student interest.  And then for the internships and research orientation, one of the biggest challenges there was really ensuring student attendance at the community conversation panels that were centered around identity.

Um, students had been, uh, required to attend one industry insights panel and either the alum supervisors panel or one of the career conversations panel pieces, but they were not required to attend. One of the, the panels had been centered around identity  for a variety of reasons. Um. And so one of the, the challenges there is, is really encouraging students to attend.

Um, and because there's so many sessions to choose from, it really was hard for students to, to decide what to attend, especially if they weren't able to attend sessions outside of  like the requirements, if they didn't have the time to do that. 'cause it is a full day event. And then the other challenge there was really just ensuring a diverse representation on these identity based alums because it was the first year that we were doing this.

Um, the approach was really to, to contact alums who would fit an industry panel and then offer up the additional opportunities there. Um, you know, if you're interested, these are new panels  please let us know if you would like to join. And so it was really on a first come, first serve basis. So we didn't have as much,  like nuts. We didn't have as much opportunity to really ensure that there was diversity on those panels, which is something that we're going to be exploring more in the future. How to, how to best ensure that there is a proper diverse representation on each of those panels. All right.  So that gives people a sense of, hey, great idea, but it's, you know, you've gotta.

Think about some things. You gotta be  nimble and make  changes as you need to and how to incorporate more of it in the future. Which gets me to the, um, next question. What do you have planned for future programming? And then I'm gonna add this little piece 'cause you know, I gotta put a little extra.

And what would you say to anyone out there that's looking to do. More career. Career or add more identity driven  elements to their career readiness work at their campus. Hmm. All right. I, yes. We'll, we'll go through future programming first, and I definitely, I love that question. Can't wait to answer that one or to share my thoughts on it.

Um, for the mentoring program, we're currently in the second pilot phase, so we we're opting for a two year pilot. Um. Phase, um, or program really to, before we launch it officially, um, we've scaled up this year or this semester, so we now have 95 student and alum pairs, which is up from the 55 to 60 that we had  each semester last year.

After going through the pilot programs last year, we did decide to do some targeted e outreach this year. Um, two alums who represented the various identity groups to ensure we we could meet demand, and we did see an increase in alums applying through that outreach. We're also going to be piloting group mentoring this spring, which will be centered around the career development centers new eight.

Career communities. And so within that group mentoring pilot, we plan to have two to four alums in each industry group who represent a range of class years identities and career paths. And then put them with a group of eight to 10 students across class years for the semester. And the goal here is really to give students an alums a chance to learn from each other and make connections in this group setting based on both industry and identity.

And in the future, we'd love to offer both individual and group mentoring throughout the year. And still have some component of identity-based matching in the program. Whatever its iteration, final iteration may look like. For Sophomore Institute, we're expanding again. Um, so in 2024 we had about 50 students, four alums I mentioned.

In 2025, we had 126 students, over 200 alums. This year we just accepted 251 students  to participate in Sophomore Institute, 2026. And so with that we'll come an expansion of the alum pool that we work with as well, so we can do, um, you know, matching for informational interviews. We did also add a fourth day of events based on student demand, which might be unique.

 Students really wanted more, more content and so we've built that in for them. Um, and related to identity, we have added a third cohort for students to choose from, which will be first generation college students, and we've moved that alum keynote into a full alum panel, um, that will be based or called your career and your identity.

And it will give students a chance to hear from alums whose identities have shaped their career path. For internships and research orientation, we're aiming to increase diversity in those identity based panels, and we're going to be adding these panels as an option under the career conversation requirement.

And so by, by adding them under the, the umbrella of the requirement, we're hoping that this will encourage more students to attend. And,  and it will hopefully still keep the conversation more intimate and limited to those who share that identity and or in are interested in the topic because it's not a separate requirement to attend one of those.

It's lumped under kind of that collection. And then we're also exploring the idea of offering a session centered around intergroup dialogue as part of this event, which could focus on the transition from the Mount Holyoke College campus to working in a multi-generational and multicultural workplace off campus.

And so thinking back to your question about what would you say to anyone out there who's looking to add more identity driven elements, I think a lot of that from, from my perspective, is really, um, you know, where, where are you starting at, um, and what could you scale up? And so rather than creating something new, are there areas where you can just expand and test out and, and try to kind of build it out that way.

And I think one of the, the things about the programming that we did is while it's part of the program, it's not necessarily. The full focus of the program. And so there's an opportunity to kind of  to still engage with identity driven programming without it being shattered from the rooftops and still serving the populations that you need to serve that are interested in the identity based programming.

Love it. Love it.  Dr. Jaime, you wanna add anything  to that? And I'm gonna run with that. 'cause again, there's a mentorship program that I helped to oversee where I'm at and to add more elements of  identity driven. Correctness to it. I'm already, my mind is spinning. But Dr. Jaime, um, anything you wanna add to what Megan has shared as it relates to giving people that the idea of how they can  add some of the wonderful things you guys are doing?

Mm-hmm. Implementing some of these things, even a small thing to scale up and be more inclusive. Yeah.  And in true collaborative form, Dr. Love tap into us and we're happy to share our resources and how we really  thought through this process. You know, it's interesting because we talk about mentoring programs and, and many colleges have mentoring programs and.

Something that we're doing here and part of our thought process included, you know, how are we going to make this mentoring program distinctive? And we really took a good look at our student body. And that would be what I encourage as step one, is to really think about the student demographic and. You know, think about student organizations and hold a couple of focus groups with, you know, student government and some key campus organizations that are identity based and hear a little bit about what they might, um, be interested in.

And then, you know, like Megan said, test it on something small and if you have matching opportunities on campus, whether that's. You know, through employer panels and or  high table, high top table networking events or mentoring programs. Think about offering it as a offering and see where the chips fall right after that first go around.

And I, but I think digging into the student demographic and, you know, hearing from them has gone a really long way for us. Because they feel, like I said, heard and they also feel valued, but also recognizing one of the greatest challenges for career centers in my opinion, is how are we preparing students to enter this multi-generational workplace where they may, may be having, you know, talk around the coffee pot in the morning or the water cooler with somebody generations.

Ahead of them. Right. With Right. Perhaps even different understandings and beliefs and so exposing students to this, which is why we think giving an opportunity to choose identity as more salient, because sometimes that's stressing a student more than industry and skills. Mm-hmm. And allowing them to develop comfort around entering the workplace as.

X, Y, Z identity and giving them that comfort will then allow them to fall into place and enact the skills that they have developed through their coursework, et cetera.  And what has actually prepared them to do the job well? For sure. Some great tips, ladies to encourage and inspire others to do  some amazing things in their space like you guys have done at, um, Mount Holyoke.

College now. I could talk to you guys all day. We don't have all day though. Um, so I'm going, I'm gonna need, we'll wrap it up. And so final question for You'all  as we conclude our conversation today, what is your favorite thing about this work, about this identity driven career readiness work? What's your favorite thing?

Yeah, so for me, I really enjoy watching the connections happen live. Um, so like during Sophomore Institute, watching students' faces light up when they see people that look like them, and, and then they can have the same conversation about identities, but also about. The industry and having those shared connections.

Um, I also really appreciate the connections that have been made through the mentoring program and one of my favorite moments so far  came from one of our spring mentees, so she's from an East Asian country. She's interested in the environment in doing legal work, and was participating in the program while studying abroad in Geneva, Switzerland.

And we were able to match her with an alum who was also from an East Asian country and who had also studied abroad in Geneva. And the student shared with me how much they really valued that partnership because of the shared live experiences and their shared interests in the environment. And because of that mentor experience, they have now found opportunities in legal consulting, in environmental spaces and in restoration ecological field workshops  from the conversations that they had.

And so that still puts a smile on my face when I think about that student and, you know, thinking again, write bookends. I'm really excited for them. They're graduating this year. I'm excited for them to come back in a couple of years and just, you know, share that information and be a resource for students either in the mentoring program or through one of the other events that we run on campus.

Wow. Amazing. Dr. Jaime. Gosh, this is a tough question because I truly love it. All this work fills my cup, like it fills all of our cups, right? I just feel lucky. I feel energized by this work, by my fantastic team here in the career development center, my colleagues across campus, but I would say. A consistent throughout my career has been watching students explore, watching students grow and watching them develop right on their, during their time on campus through their coursework and how they so carefully and intentionally now navigate their potential career interests and next steps all the way through watching them cross the stage and celebrating them at commencement.

I love attending commencement year over year. Another real reward for me is I think when we turn to our alums who are once in the same shoes, exploring their career interests as students to engage with our current student body. In a meaningful way, pathway conversations are essential, which we all know it's so essential to current students, and so hearing from our alums about how they got from point A to point B and all of their experiences in between, it's so valuable and something that really cannot be matched.

I think Megan and I both feel very lucky to be where we are and have such incredible support across campus and we just look forward to, um, continuing to build upon this momentum. Well, I have truly learned  so much from beginning in conversation with y'all today, and I know those who will listen to the podcast will learn a lot and.

Be inspired. And so I know in the meeting notes from this podcast, there'll be your contact information. 'cause you already mentioned  you are more than happy to collaborate with folks to help them do  this good work where they're at, like you guys are doing at Mount Holy Op College. And so thank you all for being in conversation with me.

Continue to do the amazing work that you guys are doing, and I look forward to being in conversation with you again real soon. Take care. Thank you so much.