The World According to Jen & Carolyn
The World According to Jen & Carolyn is a podcast where history, politics, psychology, and humor collide in unexpected yet brilliant ways. Hosted by Jen, a community servant with a sharp wit and a knack for digging up the historical receipts, and Carolyn, a licensed marriage and family therapist who expertly unpacks the psychological layers behind it all, our show offers listeners a smart, hilarious, and refreshingly real conversation between two friends with 25 years of stories and opinions to share.
Tiktok: @twatjc
YouTube
Instagram: @theworldaccordingtojen_carolyn
The World According to Jen & Carolyn
Trans Trailblazers: Achievements That Changed the World
Use Left/Right to seek, Home/End to jump to start or end. Hold shift to jump forward or backward.
In honor of pride month, Jen & Carolyn are amplifying the achievements of transgender people — individuals who have broken barriers, shattered stereotypes, and made history in ways that inspire us all. Jen & Carolyn recognize that transgender people have always been part of the human story — and today, we’re lifting up some of their most notable contributions across activism, science, arts, politics, and sports.
Trans Activists You Need to Know
Trans Women in Sports: Facts Over Fear | SF.gov.
Transgender Athletes In History
Factbox: Transgender politicians and government officials around the world | Reuters.
Six Queer and Trans Artists We Love — Brooklyn Arts Council.
Six Queer and Trans Artists We Love — Brooklyn Arts Council.
Transgender Artists Taking The Art World By Storm.
Programming Pride: 10 LGBTQI+ Pioneers of Computer Science | New Relic.
Pioneering trans and non-binary scientists.
Six Trans Programmers Who Shattered the Lavender Ceiling | Blog.
Trans Saints? Cross-Dressing Monks.
The Little Known History of Transgender Saints
Happy Friday! It's the world according to Jenny Carlis! Hey, Carolyn. Hey, Jen. I wonder we're trying to do so much right now and none of it is working out. We're not working. No. My husband is golfing. Our child has been at summer camp for almost two weeks. We pick him up on Saturday. So we've been trying to do as many things as possible within this two-week period, which means my husband. Yeah. A lot of drinking. I'm worried I would have a significant problem if I didn't have a child, but no. So my husband wasn't here to set up the tech. So here we are. We did it. Like the camera angles are going to be all fucked up, like I can tell by we're going to figure this out. I'm still getting like uh electromagnetic interference. I don't know where it's coming from. It's very strange. I'm pretty sure my house is haunted. That's not what we're here to talk to you about. Although there is some like uh spiritual stuff going on in this because we're gonna be talking to you about trans trailblazers and the achievements that changed the world. It's all gonna make sense in terms of the spiritual thing when we jump into those. Don't worry, we'll get there. We'll get there, we'll get there. Um, yeah, trans folks have done amazing things. And we are here to talk about that, especially in the face of all of the scrutiny coming from the right from elected officials. The Supreme Court today just ruled that, you know, you can limit gender-affirming care for minors. So we're gonna see more and more of that. Um, you know, Donald Trump Jr., that fucking idiot, uh, said that the what did he call it, the radical trans agenda is the biggest, uh, biggest terrorist threat, not only to the United States, but to the world. This, this in the wake of a shooting committed by, oh surprise, a weird ass InfoWars MAGA dude. Yeah, white boy.
SPEAKER_00Uh, straight white men?
SPEAKER_01For the most part, yes. Yeah, that's what I thought. Yeah, there haven't been many that have been perpetrated by people of color. There definitely haven't been many perpetrated by women. They are the new serial killers. Uh, who? Not women.
SPEAKER_00White people? White men. White men always have been. But the Ann Burgess was even studying uh active shooters and mass shooters as like the new behavioral model for a serial killer.
SPEAKER_01Well, it's interesting too because with a serial killer, their MO seems to be to try to get away with it for as long as possible so they can keep keep fulfilling whatever it is that murdering is doing for them. But with mass shootings, it's like oh, you're gonna get caught pretty much right away. Um, so it it's an interesting psychological dynamic. But again, we're not here to talk about that. Jesus fucking Christ. We want to honor our trans siblings, y'all. This is Pride Month. And Carolyn and I, you know, this is the second year we've done this where we are picking, you know, doing an episode specifically to honor our queer siblings. And we want to talk about the trans folks who have broken barriers, shattered stereotypes, made history in ways that inspire all of us. So we, of course, me and you, um, and all of our listeners recognize that trans people have always been part of the human story. And today we're lifting up some of their most notable contributions across activism and science and arts and politics and even spirituality and sports. And sports and sports. Okay. So, Carolyn, you threw this in here. I want you to kick us off because I actually didn't know about any of this because you know, my my religious education is fairly limited. So please tell us about trans saints.
SPEAKER_00Well, and I'm gonna do a TikTok about this too, because yeah, I have I have quite an extensive religious education, and um so much of it seems very, very sexual to me. Which probably is why they're gonna be able to do that. There's a lot of subtext, a lot of subject. Yeah, yeah. Um, so yes, trans saints. Now, technically, from the 5th to the ninth century, over 20 saints share similar stories. They were assigned female at birth, but live their adult lives as men. Okay. Joining monasteries or becoming religious hermits. Interesting. And their biological sex was usually discovered only after their death. So, again, scientifically, the way that we can have uh body modification, no, they weren't how we see the the way I would describe trans now. Yeah. Um, they were called sort of cross-dressers, but that's that's what you had. So you did what you did. And it was all women. It was all women.
SPEAKER_01So you have to wonder were they were they truly trans or were they just trying to intersex? Or beyond that, were they just living in a world where women had absolutely no power and they decided to live as a male. Well done, Jen.
SPEAKER_00A plus. So let's talk about Saint Marina or Marinos, the monk, fifth century assigned Maros assigned female at birth. Marina adopted the name Marinos and entered a monastery as a man in Lebanon. Awesome. He embraced the male identity throughout his life, even when falsely accused of fathering a child. He's like, I'll own it. I'll own it, yeah. Which he then adopted and raised. Cool. His feast days June 17th to 18th. See? I'm like, it would take a woman to actually step up and do that. That kind of shit. Yeah. That's hilarious. All right, Saint Eugenia, third century, disguised herself as a man named Eugenios and became an abbot near Alexandria. And when falsely accused of assault, she revealed her identity by opening her robe to show she was a female. Bad ass tits out, bitches. That's proving her innocence. And her feast day is December 24th, 25th. Take that, Jesus. Um Saint Anastasia, the Patrician? Yep. Okay. Um, a sixth century Byzantine court lady in waiting who adopted a male identity and a you as as a eunuch monk and lived in the Egyptian desert for 28 years. Um, her feast day is March 10th. Saint Ugh, I can't say that. Euphorzonine. Euphorine.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, that's good enough for me.
SPEAKER_00Fifth century. Um, left life as a woman to become a monk named Slash Smarogitus. That's the name she that's red. Euphacine is her dead name. Smaragus. Sorry, but means emerald, um, and went to an Egyptian monastery. And the abbot assigned him to a separate cell to avoid arousing the other monks. So, like that the abbot knew. Kept kept their guy, um Roland Betencourt. Um, check out his website. I think it's called the New Uh The New Ways Ministry, which sounds like it would be weird, but it's not. It's learning. It's not a cult. It's not a cult. So this dude, um Roland Betancourt, argues that these stories, again, like you said, represent early examples of what we might recognize as a transgender experience. Um, noting that medieval medical texts show understanding of gender dysphoria, but there's also scholarly debate about whether these were medicalized gender transitions as well as we understand them today, or if the female saints just adopted these male personas for what you said, kind of political reasons and practical reasons, like avoiding marriage and entering a monastery. Like, leave me alone. I don't want to get married totally controlled. Yeah. So I thought that was super cool. That is cool.
SPEAKER_01Take take that religious right. That's fascinating because the rest of the folks that we're gonna talk about, I think are a little more well-known. But those folks, I don't think a lot of folks have a lot of uh knowledge around that. So that's cool. So let's talk about some folks that are, you know, notably the most iconic figures in trans history, like Marsha B. Johnson, who was a black trans activist woman and self-identified drag queen. She was a central figure in the Stonewall Uprising of 1969, a pivotal moment in the LGBTQ plus rights movement. She co-founded Street Transvestite Action Revolutionaries or STAR to support unhoused queer and trans youth in New York. I think Dave Chappelle missed the memo when he was like, Oh, I like, I like the Stonewall gays, the ones that are out there like throwing bricks and shit. It's like, um, yeah, Marcia was known to be possibly, um, it could just be the stuff of legend, but a lot of people credit her as throwing the first brick at Stonewall. So you missed something. Uh my mom used to have a stonewall poster on her bedroom door. That's cool. When I was in high school. Well, I didn't want people to know my mom was gay. And so I was like, You can't, you can't come in my house. You can't come in my house. It was just it's different times. Man, it was the 90s. Yeah. And and even though like I had queer friends, like they wouldn't have cared. It would have been fine. So I have no idea.
SPEAKER_00It's it's hard growing up. You don't want to, you don't want to be different. No, you don't want to be different. Anyway, we'll start you're cool if you're different though.
SPEAKER_01Right? I think. Now I I own it. I just wish I wish things were different then. Yeah. They weren't. Um unfortunately, yeah, I I really feel for the the children of queer parents. Yep. Um, maybe here in San Francisco, things are more accepted. And that's great. It's a beautiful place. Like, you know, it's a very no. I mean, to an extent, but you go into our public schools, they're very inclusive. Like, you know, they're they celebrate different identities. It's a wonderful thing. I mean, maybe at home certain kids are told different things, but in the the classroom space, the public classroom space here in San Francisco, it's a pretty accepting space. So anyway, so uh Marcia's sidekick was a woman named Sylvia Rivera. She was a Latina trans activist. She dedicated her life to advocating for marginalized trans and gender non-conforming people long before trans rights were even recognized as part of the broader civil rights conversation. Yeah, I'm pretty sure they they were buddies. Yes. I don't think I made that up, right?
SPEAKER_00No, no, super buddies. And Sylvia Rivera is probably one of my favorite icons. Yeah. Um, because she was saying things uh in New York to the gay men. And they were booing her. Oh, that's a bummer. And it was that thing where it was like, fuck you all, like the trans and the lesbians, like we have your backs. Yeah. And it's just so interesting how you still see patriarchy in any movement.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00Right?
SPEAKER_01Yeah, no, it's true. And and how um, I'll never forget in in transparent, which I think some people find to be problematic, um, the whole like man on the land thing, like the turfy lesbians who wouldn't accept the main character I can't remember. Mara. Mara as a woman. Yeah. And pointed out, well, you have privilege, you made this decision. But how is how is that a decision any more than being gay is a decision? I know. You're born this way. This is how you identify. So I hate seeing the division within the community, but it's also not a community that I am directly a part of. I'm queer adjacent having two moms, but like I it's hard for me to weigh in because it's not my community. It's an interesting topic, though. Yeah, it is. It is pee next to me, shower next to me. I don't give a shit. Just don't talk to me. Don't I want to engage in conversation? The only person I don't want, we have a um in our building, our office building, we have a gender neutral bathroom. But it's always like cis dudes taking dumps. And every time I've gone in there, I've I've opened a stall, excuse me, and there's just been like a dump floating. I'm like, this is what happens when you have to share a bathroom with cis dudes. A trans woman would not do this shit, literally. So I'm like, I don't like using bathrooms with cis dudes.
SPEAKER_00They're nasty. I don't like poop pooping in public if I can avoid it. Yeah, I'm pooper.
SPEAKER_01I usually can't avoid it. Anyway, so Sylvia championed the rights of homeless trans youth, sex workers, and incarcerated individuals. Then there was Christine Jorgen Jorgensen. She was alive between 1926 and 1989. You know about her. She was the first American widely known to have undergone gender-affirming surgery in Denmark. Yeah, Denmark. Oh, yeah, that's right. I need to see that. This happened in 1952. So it sparked national conversation about gender identity. And then she became a spokesperson and entertainer using her fame to educate the public. Dope. There was somebody named Miss Major Griffin Gracie. This was circ in 1940. She's a veteran of I don't know why it's this for oh, I think that was I cut off like her birth date and her death date. So I think that's where I was going with this. So I, because I was like Stonewall, 1940. Does not compute. Uh Miss Miss Major was also a veteran of Stonewall, former director of the transgender variant intersex justice project, supporting trans women of color in and out of prison. Love it. Lifelong advocates for trans women, especially those impacted by incarceration, poverty, and police violence. Then there was somebody named Janet Mock, uh, is a modern black transgender woman activist who publicly came out in 2011, became a New York Times bestselling author, and was the first transgender woman of color to write and direct a television episode. Awesome. Do you know what episode it was? No. I don't either. We need to look that up. Yeah. So Janet Mock. Okay, breaking barriers in politics. Let's move on to politics. So fast forward to more recent milestones. It's all pretty recent. Right. In 2017, Danica Roam made history as the first openly trans person elected and seated in a U.S. state legislator representing Virginia's 13th district. She didn't just run as a trans woman. She ran as a dedicated journalist and public servant focused on traffic solutions and education. And she won over and over. She keeps winning. It's like, hey, don't pay attention to my identity. Pay attention to what I'm doing and what I, you know, what I want to do for my community. Yeah. Like that's all that should matter.
SPEAKER_00Really? It's all that ever matters. But can I just like, can we just pause for a moment? Oh, we can talk about stunning she is. Let me see. This is it's she wrote an episode. Janet Mock wrote Pose. Oh, uh Ryan Murphy's XFX show.
SPEAKER_01Okay, I still haven't seen that. Have you? Uh no. Is it based on the ballroom movement or is it like a modern interpretation? You know what? We'll have to watch it. Yeah. Let's do it. All right. Beautiful. She's gorgeous. Anyway. Then there's Sarah McBride. We all know and love Sarah. She's dealing with some real bullshit from assholes like Marjorie Taylor Green and that other cunt, Bo Bert. Marjorie, you wish. I'm gonna use the C word on you, Lauren. Bo Bert, you deserve nothing. And I'm not using it in the friendly British way either. Like the Irish shoes. You are a cunt in the truest sense of the word. See you next Tuesday. But we're not here to talk about her. So Sarah was the first openly transgender state senator in U.S. history. She was elected to Delaware State Senate in 2020, representing District 1. And now she's become the highest-ranking openly transgender elected official in the United States. Yay! And then internationally, we have somebody named Audrey Tang, who became Taiwan's digital minister in 2016 and is the youngest person to hold a ministerial post in Taiwan. Pretty cool. So there's quite a few people. Now I want to talk about somebody in particular. Like initially I was like, yay, Chris. And then I started reading more about, I'm gonna call, I'm gonna say him because he's de he detransitioned. So Chris Beck, he's a retired U.S. Navy SEAL, remarkable life journey, spans from elite military service to personal transformation, public advocacy. He served in the Army, or I'm sorry, the Navy from 1990 to 2011. 13 deployments, dude. Seven in combat, including teams like SEAL Team One and SEAL Team Six. Like the most badass of the most badass of the armed services, right? He's won a Bronze Star, a Purple Heart, two defense meredist service medals, tons. He's like highly, highly, highly decorated. Okay. And in 2011, he began living as a woman named Christine, started hormone therapy in 2013. Um, Kristen, I'm sorry, not Christine, co-authored the memoir Warrior Princess, a U.S. Navy SEAL's journey to coming out transgender with a psychologist Ann Speckhard, but then walked it all back. And in December 2022, he announced that he detransitioned, returned to living as Chris, and embraced Christianity, criticizing the gender transition process. And now he speaks out openly, particularly against young people, against 25 transitioning, citing personal regret. Now, this is really timely. And also, this is your personal regret, not backed up by statistics. Because Carolyn, it's my understanding that regret and detransitioning are super rare. And I really worry, especially with today's Supreme Court ruling, about the implication of Chris's stories being held up as a cautionary tale and used to make decisions regarding gender-affirming care abuse.
SPEAKER_00Yes. Like again, this is one person's story. And to me, I'm I'm happy that he had the choice to do that. You do not then get to uh first of all, I would I would psychologize that that you have so much internalized, you know, velvet rage about this that something clicked in you. And I who knows? I don't know. I don't know your story, but you have the right to choose. And yes, this is a huge problem in in a public conversation around trans care, especially for youth, and how individual stories of detransition or regret shape policy. Yeah. And honestly, as someone who works very closely with trans kids and their parents, it absolutely concerns me because I've I've had parents tell me about this as a reason that they try and pathologize their kids' face, yeah, which is I not neutral. And I'm really happy to see other therapists coming out and admitting that also we are not neutral. This is not neutral. Right. When we look at the data, so let's just talk about the research, right? So I'm not going to talk about feelings, right? It's not just viral posts or dramatic headlines. It tells a very different story. So a large study published in JAMA Journal of the American Medical Association Pediatrics in 2024 followed over 220 trans youth who'd received puberty blockers or hormones. And guess what? Only 4% of them reported any kind of regret. Now, again, that's one in a hundred. So we've got what four uh four percent of that, right? So it's that's statistically relevant, but 97% continued their care. Right. We don't look at the outliers. Yeah, we look at the the mean. Right. And so it's a huge indicator of how effective and affirming this kind of support can be. And when it comes to surgery, the numbers are even clearer. Yeah. A huge meta-analysis that looked at nearly 8,000 people who had gender-affirming surgeries found that only one percent expressed regret. Yeah. And that's actually lower than the regret rates for things like a hip replacement, weight loss surgery, tattoos, nose jobs. Yeah. Man, I regret dyeing my hair sometimes. Like it happened. Yeah. So here's something that often gets missed in all this. Detransitioning doesn't always mean someone regrets transitioning. In fact, a 2021 study found that most people who detransitioned did so because of social pressure, outside pressure, bingo, like family rejection, financial issues, or safety concerns. So do not, not because they no longer identify as trans. Right. Many of them actually still do. And some even say that starting gender affirming care helped them better understand themselves. So even if they paused or changed path, they didn't regret it. Right. And unfortunately, these stories, these rare stories of regret have been blowing way out of proportion. And one study found that in just one month, September 2024, there were over 41,000 online mentions of regret in the content of gender care.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. And forums where you can't verify if the person writing the regret story is even trans.
SPEAKER_00Yeah. I don't want to hear. And that's what we're talking about. Thanks. Yeah, exactly. It's a lot of noise. Right. And it's, and again, if that's happening in a space that as a parent, you can say, well, I'm not going to allow you to see this, or this is not okay. But what do you do when it's being used to pass laws that restrict or outright ban access to care, especially for young people? And as a therapist, I find this absolutely just bad, not baffling. It's troubling and it's sick and it's going to cause deaths and it's going to hurt people. And when we are making policy based off fear and cherry-picked anecdote instead of on solid evidence, we are hurting people. And we have a duty to protect what we and children deserve that protection. Every story matters. I'm not it, I'm, I agree with that, but every and every person deserves to be heard, but they have to be placed in the context of a broader data. Yeah. And that's where if a 12 year old is already hating themselves and then sees a story like that, or parents see that, yeah. So we know. So again, regret is rare, detransition is complex, gender affirming care is also very complex. For a good reason. Yeah. Because it's therapeutic. It's diagnostic, it's therapeutic, and it's it's treated as such. Yeah. Unlike the internet.
SPEAKER_01So Yeah, and I'm paraphrasing because I read it very quickly, but in uh Sonia Sotomayor's dissent, she was saying essentially like, we're letting our politics dictate medical decisions. Yes. And it's not everybody's politics, obviously, but we're letting the politics of the right that are inflammatory and discriminatory dictate how children are treated. When we know from statistics, real studies that children who are denied gender-affirming care often suffer from depression, are more likely to die by suicide. Like there are so many positives associated with gender-affirming care. But of course, that's irrelevant to the right because they don't care. That's not what it's about for them. Yeah. They want to control people's lives. They want to control people's bodies. Yep. And so this is more. Yeah. This is just more of the same bullshit. So, all right. So let's talk about arts and entertainment. Something fun. We all love Bern Cox. She's amazing. First openly transgender person nominated for a primetime Emmy. We all love Orange is the New Black. She played Sophia. She used her platform to educate, inspire, advocate for change. How about MJ Rodriguez? So in 2021, she made history as the first trans woman nominated and then winning a golden globe for a role in the groundbreaking series Pose. It's coming up again. Yeah. It's all coming together, full circle. We really need to watch Pose. Oh, yeah, it is. That's what exactly what it's about. It's centered on New York's drag ball culture in the 80s and 90s, largely led by black and brown trans people. It's basically Paris is burning on Titan. Yeah, totally. We got to watch that. So in literature, we have somebody named Jennifer Finney Boylan. She's an author and professor, has bought uh trans experiences into the mainstream with her memoir, She's Not There. It was the first best-selling book by a transgender author. So somebody named Wendy Carlos released Switched on Bach. Oh yeah, I this woman rocks. She released Switched on Bach in 1968, becoming the first trans musician to win a Grammy in 1970. She also composed notable films, film scores, including A Clockwork Orange, which is one of my favorite movies. She is such an amazing electronic musician. Or yeah, dude. The Shining. Kim Petris became the first trans singer to win a Grammy in 2023 for a song called Unholy. Haven't heard it, but I'm going to check it out. Somebody named Candy Darling. Oh, yeah, Candy Darling, one of Andy Warhol's most famous muses, starring in his films and becoming an enduring icon for artists and musicians. And the Whitney Biennial. I don't know.
SPEAKER_00The Winklevost. Winklevost twins. Messing up. It was this show called Sensate that came out on Netflix during the pandemic. Oh my God, grab your vibrator and watch that show. It's fucking hot.
SPEAKER_01You're the one that was telling me to watch it.
SPEAKER_00Away from my husband to go on a golf trip and then I'll check it out. There's a whole scene. There's a whole character, and then one of the actresses in the movie is a trans actress and she's gorgeous.
SPEAKER_01Let's put a crush on her. I'm gonna have to check this shit out. Yeah. There's not enough time in my life. There's so much good content out there. There is not enough time, y'all. Uh especially when you're a parent. So in science and sports, so we have Dr. Ben Barris, a neurobiologist at Stanford. Yay, Stanford transitioned in mid-career and continued his groundbreakbreaking work on brain development. Fierce advocate for equity in science and used his own experiences to highlight the biases trans scientists often face. Yep. In sports, Chris Mosier, I think that's how you say Chris's name, broke new ground as the first openly transgender athlete to make a U.S. national team in the duathlon and the first trans athlete to appear in ESPN. Oh, the body issue. And as much as I absolutely hate Caitlin Jenner, uh I was just about to say we we kind of didn't mention her, and it's for a very good reason. Yeah, she's a she's a Republican and she doesn't seem to advocate like she should for her community, as far as I'm concerned. Uh oh, did you hear about how she was gonna be the Grand Marshal for Pride in Israel? But with everything going on between Iran and and Israel, she ended up in some fucking bunker, like drinking wine and making videos. This is what doesn't make sense though.
SPEAKER_00Like, how do you go and do that given what your party says about you?
SPEAKER_01I know she voted for Donald Trump. It's like it's like a snail having salt fantasies. I don't get it.
SPEAKER_00I never understand that sentence. And I don't want anybody to be in power.
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Maybe miss. I think that's what it is, trying to maintain some sort of like hold. I don't know, some sort of influence. I I have no idea. And ordinarily, I ain't trying to laugh at nobody in a bunker while bombs are going off, but there's just something entertaining about Caitlin Jenner who's used to like extreme wealth and is a you know Republican twat, and she's like stuck in this fucking bunker. Yeah. You came out for pride, and the the queer god said, no girl, no, you are not worthy. Get your ass in the bunker and drink some wine, bitch. And then there was somebody named Laurel Hubbard, a New Zealand weightlifter, became the first openly trans woman to compete in the Olympics in 2021. Timothy Ledoux became the first openly non-binary athlete to compete in the Winter Olympics in Beijing in 2022, um, competing in Paris, in pairs figure skating. There's so many. So there's there's quite a few, and obviously, so much of the backlash around trans folks right now is around, ooh, protecting women's sports. It's like, first of all, bitch, you don't watch women's sports. You don't give two shits about women's sports. You just care about discriminating against trans folks. And let me tell you, the statistics do not support any sort of assertion that trans folks are like winning all the gold when they can when trans women compete against cis women. Yeah. They are not, they are not bringing home the gold, they are not usually ranking first.
SPEAKER_00So cut that shit out. Well, I think this is, and I've gotten into some conversations with my partner who's the probably one of the biggest sports fans I've ever met. Yeah. It's everything needs to evolve right now, right? In my mind, nothing is sacred. And this ideal of men's sports, women's sports, I think this is to me, this is like segregation. This is the last place that we're still seeing that. And it fucks everything up. Yeah.
SPEAKER_01I mean, we want people to be on somewhat equal footing. But let me tell you, I have a female trans friend. She's tinier than I am. And her partner is a trans man and says, like, oh, since she started taking hormones, she's become like, you know, weaker. Female hormones. That's what happens. Like you introduce all this estrogen and you start losing like muscle mass and your body starts to change. I'm not gonna pretend I know all the science behind it, but your body starts to change. And so I I don't know. I think everybody people are focused on height and weight. That's that's what you're focused on. Look at um, who's that that swimmer, Katie Ledicke or Katie Leducki? People talk shit about her and call her a man because she's super tall and has like a big armspan or whatever. And and people call that unfair. It's like you have a problem with women's bodies, period. Just like uh Serena. She has endured so much shit with people saying terrible things about her and calling her a man. She's very much a cis woman because she is athletic. Yeah, she is a friggin' athlete, yeah, she is like a goddess. Yeah, but people are gonna talk shit. So, what people really have a problem with is size and weight. So that would do height, size and weight classes. That's weight class. That's what I say. Yeah. Well, apparently everything's sacred, Jen. No, it's not. Sports are stupid. Yes. Unless it's women's sports. Woo! We're trying to get into women's sports, y'all. But um, I mean, there's there's so much discrimination and terrible things. I'm I'm thinking particularly of the NFL that happen in sports that make me like antagonistic towards sports. But I love using baseball and I typically love basketball. Well, we have sports is the last place that we can be political.
SPEAKER_00How so? Like the last place. Well, I feel like it's not, it's it's kind of how entertainment used to be. Oh, where you're not supposed to have a political opinion. Yes. Like I think it was in poor taste for the Giants and the Dodgers to play on Saturday in LA.
SPEAKER_01No, I think it was beautiful. Really? I think differently they brought somebody out who sang the national anthem in Spanish. Right now. They did, yeah. Um, I was I was talking to somebody else about this. Like, ordinarily, you know, we're we're like, beat LA, fuck LA. But right now, it's like, no, we're we're one California, man. Like we are united against all of this bullshit with ice, like we are getting hit particularly hard. Like, I thought sports, but sports does have this amazing ability to unify.
SPEAKER_00Yes. It can be, it can be used for good. Well, but that's to me, that's such a tremendous opportunity to have taken a stand.
SPEAKER_01And I think that was taking a stand, though. I think that was taking a stand by bringing out somebody to sing the national anthem in Spanish and really go hard on like LA is Latino. Like LA supports its, you know, Latino brothers and sisters who are currently being attacked by the Trump administration. So I felt like using that platform was cool. And I felt like both Giants and Dodgers fans, right now, we're like united.
SPEAKER_00I saw a lot of great memes on this.
SPEAKER_01Like bloods and crips come into the it's it's that volatile, it's that crucial. It's that like with California historically significant. Yeah, but like, goddammit Trump, I just broke Chinese food. Um, your best love Dodgers fans. Like this is what you pushed us to. So I kind of see the beauty in that. Anyway, so you know, Carolyn, how does let's let me ask you a question. Let me punt it to you. Sports, sports, how does community belonging, you know, like, for an example, LGBTQ plus spaces, chosen families, et cetera, buffer against systemic marginalization, especially what we're seeing right now?
SPEAKER_00What a love, what a lovely question. Beautiful question. This is the psychological framework we'll give you. So community belonging, again, human beings, we all need to belong. That is an inherent right that we have, unless you don't want to be belonging, but that's up to you. It's your choice. So offers critical support mechanisms that protect against the mental health impact of systemic marginalization. That's why in any community you see, they gather together, they eat, they sing, they dance, they praise, they gift, like all that stuff is so important. So, social support theory belonging to is a theory that says belonging to affirming spaces like LGBTQ communities or chosen families enhances access to emotional, informational, and instrumental support, and it acts as a buffer against stress, anxiety, depression. Individuals get moms and dads. Yeah, I love that. Grandmas and grandpas, children. This is a space where if you have been rejected by your fucked up family of birth, you can find that minority stress model. Trans individuals experience chronic stress due to stigma, prejudice, discrimination, and fear of dying. Yeah. Just because of who you are. And community belonging mitigates the effect of this minority stress, be together in groups, um, enhancing resilience to that shared identity and validation, and reducing internalized transphobia. When you see um avocado client who is feels really alone and talking to his mom about, hey, can can we get him into some programs where she can see that she's not the only kid going through this? Yeah. Um, that's huge. So providing safe disclosure spaces, which alleviate the psychological toll of conceal of concealing who you are and having to be so fucking hyper-vigilant all the time. Self-determination theory. I love this theory. Um, community inclusion fulfills three core philosophical psychological needs autonomy, competence, and relatedness, which are essential for mental health and motivation. Trans individuals, and I think really anyone in affirming communities are more likely to feel empowered, valuable, and capable. Value, valued and capable. We're all valuable. Um we've got some social framework. I'm going to run through this really, really quickly, but basically collective resistance and resource distribution that counters structural inequalities. So social capital theory. LGBTQ plus spaces and chosen families build bonding capital, which is strong ties within the group that enhances mutual support and bridging capital connections to other networks. They found uh Gottman Institute did a research study, which I helped co-author. Oh, nice. Um, on why, and this was about gay couples, but it I would assume the same concept could be used. When gay couples have a higher rate of success in couples therapy than straight couples. Oh, interesting. And the reason is because they're bonded, you know, you and Bill or me and Mario feel like we're, you know, ride or die, right? Like we're in it. Imagine being marginalized. Yeah. Your bride or die against the world. Your bride or die against the world. Yeah. So it tends to bond even thicker. Um, symbolic interreactionism. Comedian individuals reinterpret social labels and construct affirming identities, critical race and queer theory. This is what they don't want you to be learning. Of course not. Studying beauty-be spaces, create platforms for counter narratives and identity affirmation, um, especially for multiply marginalized trans individuals. So when you add on those subjugated feelings, like incarcerated, um, uh person of color, yeah, uh able bodies, right? Different things that foster collective agency and challenges the this made-up construct of binary um and cisnorm cisnormativity and white supremacy. So again, network theory, um affirming supportive infrastructures, basically, community buffers systemic marginalization, fulfills core psychological needs, fosters corrective uh collective resistance, and these spaces offer refuge, but they are actively challenging a system and saying we're here, we're a group, and groups have power. Yeah, strength and numbers. Exactly. So we need more of this, and that's what makes seeing cuts to NIH or cuts to mental health programs in our cities, in our states, in our federal government grants. Yeah. We're just gonna have to go into nonprofits and do more and volunteer, and this is a call to action like nothing ever before.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, and it's deliberate, right? Um, being able to prevent these studies from taking place in the first place that are completely and totally counter to the dominant right-wing narrative about who queer people are, like they have any right to try to summarize what a community that they don't belong to or respect is and is not. Um, you start with science. You always go for the smart people. Anytime you have uh, you know, an attempt to turn a democratic society into an authoritative one or into an authoritarian one, going after the educators, going after the scientists, that's one of the first things you do. Because you want to stop the spread of information that counters misinformation. Yes. So that's what we're experiencing right now.
SPEAKER_00Um, and it sucks. You have to question in my mind if you have to have studies to prove that human beings matter, I don't know if I want to be a part of that society you're creating. Right.
SPEAKER_01No, it sucks. Yeah, it does suck. So these are just a few of the many transgender people who have made history, not by asking for permission, but by showing up with brilliance, resilience, and purpose. Their achievements remind us that when trans people thrive, everyone benefits and visibility is powerful. But we must also fight for a world where trans lives are protected, uplifted, and celebrated, not just during this month, during Pride Month, but every single day. And what we're seeing right now is an attack on a group that represents less than, I think, 1% of the population. And they are being attacked like they're friggin' Al-Qaeda. It is insane. It makes absolutely no sense to most rational people. And it's cruel, which is what this government's cruel party is about. It's a witch hunt. They're trying to vilify these folks, they're trying to scapegoat them for everything that's wrong with a country and with the world. And it's ridiculous. There aren't enough of them to be responsible for anything deleterious or anything as bad as what's going on in this country. And that's the irony, right? It's the very party that is making these accusations that's actually making this country less safe, less prosperous, and less democratic. And we have to fight back against that narrative. So we pray, or we hope, we don't really pray, um, that maybe somebody who didn't necessarily feel positively toward the trans community or had some apprehension about the trans community, maybe you listen. Maybe you learn something. Oh no. But maybe we're just preaching to the choir and that's okay too. That's okay too. So we love our trans siblings. Uh, this one's for you. Happy Pride Month, everybody. Be sure to follow us on TikTok. We are TWAT T W A T J C. Uh Be a part of the TWAT army. Be a part of our our TWAT army. We guarantee you'll have a good time. All right, everybody. Thanks for listening.