Wondering why God isn't finished with Israel? Tune in as we engage Rabbi Jeff Grillo in a riveting discussion about Israel's future. Rabbi Grillo passionately rebuts anti-Semitic and replacement theology sentiments, highlighting the unity of Jews and Gentiles in Messiah and challenging misconceptions about Israel's role in God's grand plan.
We then turn the spotlight on the curious symbolism of the Menorah, a potent symbol woven into the tapestry of scriptures. Rabbi Grillo, our erudite guide, walks us through its profound depiction of the 12 tribes of Israel and its intricate connections to biblical passages. We also delve into the fascinating realm of Hebrew wordplay, unearthing revelatory insights into Yeshua's identity through Hebrew verb forms and alphabetic references.
The episode then takes a dramatic turn as we grapple with the realities of end times and salvation. This draws from the book of Revelation and explores the context of the rapture, the restoration of Israel, and the second coming of Jesus. We also stress the necessity of confessing one's sins and wholly embracing Jesus as your Lord and Savior. All this, wrapped up with Rabbi Grillo's powerful reminder of God's unwavering love for us all. Don't miss this enlightening conversation - it's not just another podcast episode; it's a journey into a fresh perspective on these crucial theological subjects.
*If you are searching for a clinical counselor and you live in Alabama, Virginia, or North Carolina, Dr. Jonathan Behler would be happy to see you as a client! He does all counseling virtually through a secure portal. He will also work with you on payments - don't let finances keep you from getting counseling!
If you live out of the US or not in Alabama, Virginia, or North Carolina, Dr. Jonathan Behler is an ordained minister and trained in pastoral counseling. If you are seeking pastoral counseling, please reach out as well!
Welcome to Grace and the Shadows. This is Dr Marla Bealer and Dr J Dr Jonathan Bealer. Alright, we are thanking FaceSolubed Pakistan. Yes, we are. So you're one of our new listeners and we're so excited to have you listening. So thanks for sharing.
Speaker 2:
Thanks for downloading. We appreciate it. You can check us out at Graceandtheshadowsorg. You can text or call 251-2444-645, or you can email us at Dr Jonathan at Graceandtheshadowsorg. There's also a link in our show notes. If you'd like to become a monthly supporter, alright. Last time, last podcast, we had Rabbi Jeff Grillo here and he is back with us again. Thank you so much for joining us again, we appreciate it.
Speaker 3:
Yeah, and Rabbi Grillo has a bachelor's degree in pastoral ministries. He's attended Southeastern University, graduated from the Christian Bible College and Seminary, and he's presently a Rabbi assembly's a God, a messianic, and a national Jewish fellowship of assembly of God.
Speaker 2:
And he's written a couple of books. Check them out.
Speaker 3:
What was the excuse? Yes, excuse, assassin. What was the other book that you?
Speaker 4:
wrote. It's called Power and Perseverance.
Speaker 3:
I love it. Power and Perseverance.
Speaker 2:
And we've read the excuse assassin really good, so everybody wants to try it out. Finally, recommend it.
Speaker 3:
Yes.
Speaker 4:
Alright, if you're only going to get one that would be the one.
Speaker 2:
Okay, gotcha Alright, so check that one out.
Speaker 3:
Welcome again and appreciate you here. Pastor Rabbi has a wealth of information and a wealth of study on what's called eschatology in times and future of Israel, and all that, and it's just. He's a follower of Jesus and you know he's a Jewish believer. Yes, and we praise God for him. So, rabbi, is God finished with Israel?
Speaker 4:
If he is, we're all finished, because if he can break his covenant, break his promises to one, then none of us are safe. So the answer is absolutely not. He has not done with Israel. His promises are forever, and unless you are one of these people that want to debate what the meaning of the word forever, is or is is I mean.
Speaker 4:
There's no way around it. His promises are forever And all through the brick on the show the renewed covenant. Because that's what it is. It's not a new covenant, it's a renewed covenant. That's the meaning of the word in the Hebrew. It's all through it. It just takes a little time and a little understanding to see it all the way through. It is one book. It's, yes, 66 quote unquote books and you know 40 authors or whatever, and it's over a huge number of years, but it is one book, one love letter from God to us.
Speaker 2:
Absolutely.
Speaker 3:
So what's the reason? you think? Because you know I see, now more than ever, a lot of pastors just not preaching or teaching or believing there's a future for Israel or a pre-trib rapture in the pre-millennial reign of Christ. Do you have any speculation on that or is that something we have any idea what that is for or the reason for that?
Speaker 4:
Well, yeah, and it really comes down to, you know, i hate to be so blunt, but it's a anti-Semitism, it's part of the poison of replacement theology, which is where the thinking comes that the church now replaced Israel because Israel, you know, national Israel rejected the Messiah. So therefore, god's done with you and now it's us. And it really is that simple, and I think part of that is a pride thing, because it's, you know, on the Jewish side. There's those who are Jewish that think that, okay, well, we're chosen, we're special, we're better than when, really, god chose the weakest and the fewest because they had a heart And it wasn't given to them to keep, it was given to them to disseminate to the nations, to all of the nations, and even in this is getting off on a tangent, but all of the and the Levitical sacrifices.
Speaker 4:
You know the 70 bowls and a lot of the. You'll see 70 over and over and that's that's in Gimaltria, kind of points to the nations. So every time the Jews were sacrificing these 70 bowls, they were making sacrifice for the rest of us, right? And then on the other side, you got the you know non-Jews that say, well, you know you were the Jesus killers and you rejected it. Now. Now we're the chosen ones, we're better, and it's just an us versus them thing, which is just nonsense, because Rabbi Shul, the Apostle Paul, said that we are there now.
Speaker 4:
Therefore, neither Jew nor Gentile in Messiah, we are one new man. You know that. People ask me well, are you Jewish? And I'm saying, well, you know my dad's side's Italian, my mom's side's Portuguese, a little bit of Sephardic Jew, circumstantial evidence and some DNA. But you know who knows. And the bottom line is, whether I am or whether I'm not is irrelevant, because if I am, well, i'm Ichad, i'm one with the Gentiles that are grafted in. If I'm not, i'm adopted, i'm grafted into the mind. That's what that means. I'm adopted into the family of Abraham, isaac and Jacob through the blood of Messiah. So it really is kind of a root point.
Speaker 3:
And but see, you know, you said that so eloquently and so passionately and I agree with you And to me it's not a debate, right, but right, but it is, and it's vehemently. There's people that eat believers in the Lord, that are vehemently against it.
Speaker 4:
Yeah, And here's the problem. Here's the problem to those in here, if any of them listen to this podcast, and and and for those who listen to it, if you know people like this, please share this with them. If you're if, as a quote, unquote Christian, you refuse to see yourself as a spiritual Jew, you have a problem, because the Bible, the New Testament, the renew, whatever you want to call it, is clear that Jesus Yeshua is the king of the Jews. So if I say I am not a Jew, i am now saying he is not my king And I don't know about you, but I want to be my king. He's the Jewish Messiah. Well then, save me.
Speaker 2:
Call me a Jew, call me whatever you want to call me.
Speaker 4:
I'm adopted into that family. Take me in, thank you.
Speaker 3:
You just Charles are grafted in.
Speaker 3:
Absolutely, and we're not. You know, when you look at Revelation four, after the rapture, after well, i think it's the rapture I just give you. You know, john, come up here After you know chapter five, you know the church is no more. I mean, you just see Israel, the nation of Israel, through the tribulation period. That's true, and you know. And the biggest thing, at one time I heard a pastor teaching on he did not believe that. You know replacement type theology that Israel's not in, there's no real future for Israel, and you know where he was preaching that In Israel.
Speaker 2:
Wow.
Speaker 3:
That's crazy.
Speaker 4:
Praise man, praise man.
Speaker 3:
Yeah, Or Godship There's season.
Speaker 4:
I'm trying to be kind.
Speaker 3:
Or there's no sign of Go ahead, you go ahead.
Speaker 4:
So it is the thing, the book of Revelation. We got to ask ourselves a question What is it a revelation of, and to whom? Is it a revelation of really scary things at the end of days? Well, absolutely, that is in there, But that's not the point of the book. It's a revelation, chapter one with God. With God, the first things are foundational. So chapter one it opens up with a revealing of the Jewish Messiah's identity to the Jewish people. It's not Jesus being revealed to John, it's Yeshua being revealed to Yachanan. That was his Hebrew name, and everything about this book is Jewish. Now we got to look at it through that lens because of course, it's translated into English. If you don't read Hebrew, and then they want to put the Greek in there, you know Alpha and Omega, but that's I'll show you, and sometimes my brain goes faster than my mouth can keep up.
Speaker 3:
What verse? Let me stop you because you're Are there some verses that you could share offhand?
Speaker 4:
Well, I can quote them. I don't necessarily know the number, but it's out of chapter one. For example, when John says and depending on the English translation, he says and behold, i saw one in the midst of the seven lampstands, of the seven candle stage. Right, what he's talking about in the Hebrew is I saw one in the midst of the menorah. Okay, and by the way, this all goes back to Isaiah, chapter 4610, i believe it is where God says in, again paraphrasing I'm blind, i can't read it to you.
Speaker 3:
But behold, Oh, i got you. I just figured that out. I just told you to do that. That's awesome, it's okay.
Speaker 4:
He's going with it, he's going with it, it's okay, the Holy Spirit will do what He's going to do. I'm not long for the ride, like the rest of us, right? So he says I am the Lord, your God, beside me. There is none other declaring the ends in the beginning and things of ancient times that have not yet been. Keep that in mind And before we get to this, revealing, okay, we got to go to Exodus, chapter 25, where Moses is getting the instructions for making the menorah and the mishkan and the tabernacle. And he says and the one English translation. I am not a fan of the King James Version, but this is the only English translation that actually gets this right. He doesn't say to make it out of one solid piece of gold. He says make him out of one solid piece of gold. So it's a clue in the Hebrews. So it's a lampstand. It's a picture of an almond tree. It's a picture of a tree, right, it's got seven branches. It's one solid piece. But the center is made up of 12 sections. That's the 12 tribes. Messianics look at it also as the 12 disciples. Each of the additional six branches are made up of nine sections each. I'm no mathematician, but nine times six is 54. And if you add in the center section of 12, you've got 66.
Speaker 4:
John said in the beginning was the word, and the word was with God, and the word was God and the word became flesh. Solomon says that the Torah, that the Torah is a tree of life to those who grab hold of it. Scripture has to interpret Scripture. So this menorah, it's a picture of the Messiah, it's a picture of the tree of life in the garden, it's a picture of an almond tree, it's a picture of all of these things. So keep that in mind. So now we're going to reveal the ends of the beginning.
Speaker 4:
We go to Revelation, chapter one. I saw one in the midst of the seven lampstands. That's the shumash in Hebrew, which is the servant branch. It's the one that always had to remain lit, it could never go out, and it gave its light to the other six branches. Yeshua then says and I might have the order of it, but he says I am the one who is, who was and who is to come. This is a direct reference to a Jewish particular. To everyone else This wouldn't necessarily mean anything right, except to the Jews. They would know exactly exactly what he's talking about. He's pointing to the tetragrammaton, the Yutei Vavhe, because Yodhe Vavhe, the Jewish, scribes the rabbis. they understand that. This is a. What do you call it? Not an acronym?
Speaker 3:
Not an acronym, not a parable, not a parable, analogy metaphor.
Speaker 4:
When you get two words and you combine them, i cannot, can't, it's a contraction, contraction, contraction.
Speaker 4:
So that's what it is. So, in other words, the word for stone in Hebrew is ebon. It's a contraction of Abba and Ben, so that's another thing altogether. So this is I may say it incorrectly that's the three forms of the Hebrew verb for to be. It's who is and what is and is to come. So when he says I am the one who is and wasn't is to come, he's basically saying I am Yehovah and that was we believe. We won't know it until we get there, but based on the fact that it's those three forms of the verb to be, that that is the most logical pronunciation of the unutterable name. But Yeshua told the Lord I have made your name known, so we're intended to know it. Don't ever abuse it, but we're intended to know it right. So he's saying I am Yehovah. And then get this when he says I am the Alpha and the Omega, okay, he wouldn't have said that, because that's great. He was a Jew speaking to Jews. So he would have said I am the alas and the ta'v. That's the first and last letter of the Hebrew alphabet. Rabbi, jeff, come on, you're killing me, you're, you're, you're, you know you're splitting hairs. No, this is meaningful And this is why, all throughout the Torah there's a two letter word that appears all throughout.
Speaker 4:
It's spelled alif ta'v. It's pronounced et. There's a problem? It's not a word. Oh, you ask the scribes, you ask the rabbis. Well, what does this mean? We don't know. It's a placeholder. Well, why don't you take it out? Well, no, because because they know what the word says. Anyone who removes from my word will be removed from the book of life. So they leave it in Now and from the beginning.
Speaker 4:
Bersheet, genesis, chapter one, verse one. In English it's 10 words. In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth, but in the Hebrew it's seven words. It's a word picture of the menorah And it's better sheet, the barai. Elohim et shemaim ha'aretz. Right in the middle is the et. I saw one in the middle of the seven right.
Speaker 4:
So now, knowing that John just received this vision of the Messiah who claims he is God, saying I am the olive tab. Now you go back and you read that better sheet in the beginning. But created something from nothing. It's that that's the only place that that word is used. Elohim points to the triune nature of God, the et shemaim. Shemaim is the heavens, haaretz is the land of the earth. Now you can read it this way in the beginning, the olive tab God created the heavens and earth. Yeshua is revealing to the Jewish people I'm not just a rabbi, i wasn't just a Pharisee, i wasn't just a prophet. I am God, almighty and flesh. Amen, that's awesome. New Covenant supports it. And John, when Thomas falls before the risen Messiah, which is an active worship My Lord and my God.
Speaker 4:
My Lord and my God.
Speaker 3:
You know what the Jehovah's Witnesses say, don't you? They say oh no, no, he just said. He said my Lord, my God, and they wouldn't have done that as Jews, would they?
Speaker 4:
Yeah, no, no, absolutely not. That's silly, that's silly Anyway. So, but the whole context is, chapter one is the revealing of the identity of the Messiah, and chapters two and three is the seven churches, the church ages, and, by the way, the only church that escapes wrath is the church of Philadelphia. So there is one church age that will escape the wrath. And then, as you correctly identified, chapter four is basically, excuse me, a picture of their rapture. And behold, a door opened in heaven, a voice like a trumpet saying come up here And instantly I was in heaven. And then chapter five we see all about what's happening in heaven, the worship, yes, the church.
Speaker 4:
And then, from chapter six to the end, the church isn't mentioned. It's nothing. But now God is turning his attention to the completion of the salvation of Israel, because Paul says all of Israel shall be saved, and we know it to be the case. That doesn't mean that every center is going to bow, but we know and we say never again when it comes to the Holocaust. But the reality is I hate it.
Speaker 3:
It's going to happen again. It's going to be worse.
Speaker 4:
It's going to be worse, we're told in Zechariah, chapters 12 to 14, that two thirds of Israel will be destroyed. Two out of three Jews will be killed, so the remnant of one third that endure, that make it out, will look upon him, whom they pierced and mourned. This is happening during the feast of Sukkot, and then all of Israel will be saved, because they'll see it.
Speaker 3:
And I have people out there that are searching, And you know, I think you got into some great things. and powerful, because this shows that scripture is true. Yes, Jesus is first coming. We know that only a prophecy is being fulfilled, as one in 10 to the 17th power, But he fulfilled over 300. And that's just. I don't even know what that is. But what you just said is, if he came the first time, he's coming again And everything he said is coming true. And the nation of Israel was prophesied in the Old Testament. I mean Joel 3, 1 through 2. For behold, in those days, at that time, I will restore the fortunes of Judah and Jerusalem. I will gather all the nations and bring them down to the valley of Jehoshaphat. I will enter into judgment with them there on behalf of my people and my heritage, Israel, And he will. he will because they have scattered them among the nations. So this what fulfilled? I mean the Jewish people coming back to the land. May 14th 1948, right.
Speaker 2:
Yes, cool, very nice, i tell you. you know, there are so many people that are afraid to talk about end times and afraid to talk about the Jews in the end times, because they're afraid that they're going to offend somebody or they think it's a fairy tale, or how. how do you talk to those type of people?
Speaker 4:
Well, you know listen if you're not offending somebody with the gospel you're in trouble, right?
Speaker 2:
Well, you're not doing it, right, you're not sharing it.
Speaker 4:
Because, listen, here's what it all comes down to, And this isn't well. we necessarily may have intended to go, but it's the Lord, I'm telling you. we all need to hear it Me included Right.
Speaker 4:
And one of the scariest verses in the Bible to me as a young man was Matthew, chapter 7, and it says, and many in that day will say to me Lord, lord, didn't we do signs and wonders in your name? Didn't we heal the sick? Didn't we cast out devils? And you surely responded what, right, apart from me, you work as of iniquity, you work as a lawlessness. I never knew you. So there's a couple of things going on here. Number one again, only scripture can interpret scripture. Luke, chapter 9, great commission, we're told to go teach, baptize and disciple. That's all about propagating the gospel, sharing the besora, the good news, with everybody. Right, but what were these people doing? They're doing all the stuff that we see the nonsense on Christian television to be seen or met Is it that right?
Speaker 4:
Yes.
Speaker 3:
Charlotants.
Speaker 4:
Because, look, i can't do signs and wonders in private, i can't, you know, healing the sick, that's pretty public. Casting on demons, come on, that's as public as you can get.
Speaker 3:
Right. What did he not say, though? What did he not say? He didn't say they were repenting and believing in Jesus. Right, they thought it was a work salvation.
Speaker 4:
But wait, what did he say? You workers of iniquity? iniquity is deliberate sin. What is sin? It's a transgression or a breaking or a failure to keep one. It's a law, a law, yeah. So here's the thing. This is the million dollar, this is the. If people get this, then our work here is done. It's it's. We are salvation, and I am a messianic grab. I am. I am absolutely not into legalism. There is nothing I have ever done, nothing I could ever do, that would ever earn my salvation. Salvation is a free gift, not a works. So nobody can boast That's right And and it no. But here's the thing, now what? It's justified by his blood, but we're saved unto good works. James says Yes, one of the good works, the mitzvah are the instructions of God, it's the Torah, it's the 613 commands. He doesn't expect that you can actually do it perfectly.
Speaker 4:
Right Yeah, but he expects you to learn it, he expects you to, you know to, to walk in it. Everything says to walk. You know, walk with the Lord, do not turn to the left, don't not turn to the right. Why? Because it's a narrow road. You will fall off. You have to get on the path and stay on the path. How do we get on the path? The blood of Messiah, then what? We walk out? our sanctification. We're being set apart, we're being made different, we're being separated from the world. How are we being separated? Because I'm the weird guy that wears a tzitzit, you know, on a telet, or on a katan under my clothes, or, or, you know, i keep, keep the Sabbath, oh, i don't know, on the Sabbath. You know why? Because because they said now is the first day of the week and they met. Well, they met every day.
Speaker 3:
True, the Sabbath, every day is rest and Jesus.
Speaker 4:
The Sabbath. Well, no, no, no, but, but. But the point is the early church in the book of Acts. They met in house every day.
Speaker 3:
That's what they did. They did.
Speaker 4:
So so the fact that you know it starts out it was the first day, it doesn't mean that God changed, Because remember Leviticus 23,. It's the most ignored chapter in all of the Bible by Christians. Why? Because they're those Jewish feasts. But when you read it, it says this is God speaking, these are my feast days, and it talks about Passover, unleavened bread, first fruits, pentecost or Shavuot. It talks about feast, atropics, atonement and secote, but the very first one that's mentioned, six days shall you work, and on the seventh day is a solemn day of rest, a holy convocation, a mo'edine, just like all of the rest of them. God expects us. It says these are my statutes for ever.
Speaker 4:
So I'm the crazy guy, i'm one of those that believes his word is his word And we walk in it and we keep it, and the Holy Spirit enables us, because I was not all that good at it when I first started. I stumbled a lot, i fumbled around, i did things that like, wow, wow, what was I thinking there?
Speaker 2:
That's not right.
Speaker 4:
But we grow And listen. everybody knows a baby that is not growing is a baby that is likely dying.
Speaker 2:
Yeah.
Speaker 4:
That's true Thank you.
Speaker 3:
Yeah, go ahead, you go ahead.
Speaker 4:
I was gonna say we're saved, We're babies in the faith. We've got to grow. How do we grow? Paul said I left you, you were on milk. You should be on the deep things of other than that of the Lord, And that comes from the studying and the keeping of the midst of the command. And again, it's not that at any point you show what Jesus turns to any of us. All right, Good job, You got it from here. No, Every single day his blood saves us. But at the end of the day, when we draw our last breath, whether it's because of the sounding of the shofar and the trumpet sounds, whatever you want to call it and we're wrapped it up out of here, or we draw our last breath for any one of a million reasons, On that day we're going to stand before him. And question number one he's going to look is did this person accept the Messiah Right And did he keep my commands? Again, not that he did it perfectly, but Deuteronomy 8-2, was it in your heart to keep my command?
Speaker 3:
It's a result of salvation. Yeah, Exactly.
Speaker 4:
It's an outgrowth, because you can't study his word and not see how much he loves us And that makes you want to love him. It just can't help it And that love leads to service and the service leads to guarding it. We don't ever want to break it.
Speaker 3:
Our nature changes and therefore our actions change Absolutely As a result of change life through grace, through faith True.
Speaker 4:
Hold, man is passed away and behold all things become new, absolutely.
Speaker 2:
Amen.
Speaker 3:
Isaiah 11-12, read that more real quick.
Speaker 2:
He will raise a signal for the nations and will assemble the banished of Israel and gather the dispersed of Judah from the four corners of the earth.
Speaker 3:
Yeah, i don't know what people do with that. Yeah, to me that's pretty blunt about the end times and what to expect.
Speaker 4:
Right, you know, and the, i think it's the last. Sometimes, you know from memory, i get my trumpets and my bowls mixed up, but I believe it's like the seventh trumpet, or you know. If I'm wrong, you give me, but we see, and it's for the end. And then the command is given to the angels to go and thrust the sickle into the earth, for the grapes are ready, and to go and harvest. Oh, that's the rapture. No, because those wrath, those are thrown into the trodden out in the press. Right, that's judgment. Yeah, well, what about when he says the angel to go and gather his elect from the four corners?
Speaker 4:
See, now this is something different, because what's happening is we've got the 144,000, the 12,000 from each of the 12 tribes of Jews, where, in Israel, these are the virgins. Now, these virgins, physically speaking, they've never known a woman. You know what That may very well be, but I think, in the greater context, what it's talking to is they have not prostituted themselves in idolatry, they've kept themselves pure. That we read in Scripture that they are sent out to those around the world to say, hey, come back. So they're sent out Because an angel we think of as being with wings and a halo up in heaven. But that simply means messenger, right, right. So these 12, excuse me, these 144,000 are now malachim. They're messengers that go out to gather the people back to Jerusalem, back to Israel. Why? Because national salvation is coming Right, it's all about you, all about you.
Speaker 3:
So the God's not finished, guys, and if you're out there, you don't want to be left behind, because it's not going to be fun, is it No?
Speaker 2:
Absolutely not, and we definitely want those that are listening. If you do not have Jesus as your personal Lord and Savior, there's no magic words. You just have to admit that you are a sinner. You just have to believe in your heart that he is Lord, accept him as your Savior And you'll be with us one day in heaven And you can say hey, i listened to that podcast and I got saved and we're going to go woohoo And we'll do the dance of joy and it'll be amazing.
Speaker 3:
But also don't forget that God can take your mass turn to a message for his glory, for your good. And remember God loves you very much.
Speaker 2:
Absolutely. Thank you so much for being with us. We are definitely going to have to have you back. Yes, yes.