Catalytic Leadership

How Katie Brinkley Scaled with Less Content, Smarter Systems, and a Self-Led Team

• Dr. William Attaway • Season 3 • Episode 97

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What if everything you’ve been told about social media is wrong?

In this episode, I sit down with Katie Brinkley — a social media strategist, author of The Social Shift, and agency founder who scaled her business with a lean content model, smart systems, and a self-led team.

Katie built her agency without becoming a slave to the algorithm. She reveals the Four-Post Strategy that replaces content burnout with a sustainable, consistent visibility system — and she unpacks the leadership shifts that freed her to step out of the day-to-day.

If you’ve been stuck in execution mode, feeling like growth means more hustle, this episode will challenge your assumptions and offer a new way forward.

💡 What You'll Learn:

  • Why more content ≠ more growth
  • How Katie built a self-led team using one question: “What do you think?”
  • How to scale visibility through conversation, not just content
  • What it means to truly delegate authority — and why most leaders don’t
  • How your social media goal determines your entire strategy
  • The anti-hustle strategy that brought her best sales month — during burnout

Books Mentioned:

  • The Social Shift by Katie Brinkley

Connect with Katie Brinkley
To learn more about Katie’s strategies, systems, or team, visit https://katiebrinkley.com. There you’ll find her book, podcast, and links to connect across social platforms.

 

🌟 Check out our podcast sponsor, Competitive Edge Business Consulting, and book your free discovery call with them today at www.CompEdgeConsulting.com 🌟

Join Dr. William Attaway on the Catalytic Leadership podcast as he shares transformative insights to help high-performance entrepreneurs and agency owners achieve Clear-Minded Focus, Calm Control, and Confidence.

Connect with Dr. William Attaway:

Dr. William Attaway:

I'm so excited today to have Katie Brinkley on the podcast. Katie's the author of The Social Shift and she's redefining social media marketing with a less is more philosophy. With over two decades of experience, she innovates with a unique four-post strategy fostering growth with minimal posting. Minimal posting, her platform agnostic approach and journalism skills empower brands like AT&T and DirecTV to achieve their goals efficiently. She's also the host of the Rocky Mountain Marketing Podcast. Katie excels in storytelling, guiding clients from solopreneurs to corporates in capturing their ideal audience and driving tangible results. Katie, I'm so glad you're here. Thanks for being on the show.

Katie Brinkley:

Thank you so much for having me. I'm excited to be here.

Intro / Outro:

Welcome to Catalytic Leadership, the podcast designed to help leaders intentionally grow and thrive. Here is your host author and leadership and executive coach, dr William Attaway.

Dr. William Attaway:

I would love to start with you sharing a little bit of your story with our listeners, particularly around your journey and your development as a leader. How did you get started?

Katie Brinkley:

development as a leader. How did you get started? By accident? Nice, well, and I think that a lot of times some of the best entrepreneurs do stumble into entrepreneurship.

Katie Brinkley:

And for me, I was going to be a sports reporter. That's what I went to school for. I landed my dream job. I was a sports reporter right out of college. I loved it and then, you know, life has a way of kind of taking us where we need to go to give us the skills that we're going to need for our real job. So it's you know, here I am on a podcast, I have my own show.

Katie Brinkley:

Everything that I learned as a sports journalist, I think, helped me be a better leader. So I was, like I said, I was a sports journalist for the Broncos and the Rockies. I loved what I did, and then SiriusXM came out and everyone in the radio industry panicked. So I was one of them and I moved into marketing and loved what I did. I worked for the TV station for the Rockies, did a lot of ad buys, I did a lot of script writing, I handled the social media, and then we were bought by DirecTV and then we were bought by AT&T and then, before I knew it, I had been relocated to Atlanta and it's really hard to do live play-by-play for a sports team when you don't even live in the same city. So this is where I kind of took it as my all right.

Katie Brinkley:

Well, I think that it's time for me to leave. And I was sitting in my boss's office and she said to me she goes man, katie, you're just so good at social media and it'd be really cool to see you find a way to get back into radio. And so I was. I left her office. I was like, yeah, what if I, what if I did just do something with just social media? And that was almost a decade ago. And that was almost a decade ago I, with my laptop and a dream, started working from my couch and got my first client, and then I got my second client, and you know it's been a really fun journey. But now, you know, I have a team of 10 and love what I do, get to be on social media and think of different strategies, and I have my podcast and everything that I learned along the way I think was just kind of setting me up for what I do today.

Dr. William Attaway:

You know I love that. I believe there's no such thing as a wasted experience in our journey. You're right, Everything is a part and everything sets you up for the next chapter. You know, when I think about social media, I think about the conversations I have with so many entrepreneurs who they're really good at what they do. But the idea of social media and posting consistently and regularly, which we all know is the key they just let out that sigh, that groan, and they're like, yeah, I'll get to that eventually. Yeah, I know I need to do that. Yeah, I'll get to that. What advice do you have for people like that?

Katie Brinkley:

You're not alone. That's good. No, I mean, I have a social media agency, but I am a business owner first, like I'm not just an influencer. I'm not just an influencer, I'm not out there to get a whole bunch of brand deals. I mean, would it be awesome if I don't know Incas who? I wear all their shoes. It would be amazing if they said, katie, we want to pay you for wearing our shoes, since you wear them anyway. Yeah, but that's not going to help me pay my employees, that's right, but that's not going to help me pay my employees.

Katie Brinkley:

Like, that's not you know, and so I think that for me, with I just you don't need to post so much, you don't. You don't need to post so much, you don't need to, you know, be on every single social media platform. I'm not on TikTok, you know, and I'm rarely on Instagram, facebook and LinkedIn. Those are my jam, so that's where I spend my time. I have my community. I show up regularly, I create a variety of content there, but I don't create a ton. I post maybe three, four times a week there and it still works very, very well. So I think that one of the biggest things to keep in mind is nope, we're all adults here, you don't have to do anything. Don't let anyone tell you what you need to do.

Katie Brinkley:

The biggest thing is being consistent. So every Monday, I send out a LinkedIn newsletter to my LinkedIn audience. Every Monday, if I'm going to do only one post that week, it's going to be that LinkedIn newsletter because I've created the consistency and my audience knows, hey, katie's going to be that LinkedIn newsletter because I've created the consistency and my audience knows, hey, katie's going to give us some really valuable information to start our week. So create the consistency with your audience, no matter what social media platform it's on. And if you show up 82 times in one month, you know what you got to show up 82 times again the next month. Create something that you can remain consistent with.

Dr. William Attaway:

Hmm, that is incredibly helpful and encouraging Because, you know, I hear so many people and so many gurus in the space say you know, well, you've got to post. You know 10 times a day. You know you've got to post. You know, on eight different platforms, eight different channels.

Katie Brinkley:

You want to know a secret? Yeah, okay. So in a couple years ago, I was burnt out. Burnt out, I you know. You couldn't pay if Incas came to me and said, hey, we will pay you to post about our shoes. I couldn't do it. I was out of ideas. I didn't want to show up, I didn't want to create content for strangers on the internet. I was just burnt out and it was one of my best sales months ever. So how was I able to do that? Because I don't do paid ads.

Katie Brinkley:

Everything I do is organic and it's because I was showing up and still having conversations, and what I mean by that is commenting on the right people's posts. That's what the platforms want. Like, if you can't create a ton of content for them, showing up and just engaging, giving the algorithm 10 minutes of your time, that's going to help you tremendously, because you're commenting on the right people's posts. They're going to come back to your page and be like oh, this, this is what Katie does. I like this video. Oh, this is how I can get in touch with her. Oh, she has this course. Oh, she's got the book, whatever. So it's getting the right people into your sphere, and by doing good comments, not just setting it up through a bot or whatever, actually looking to see who you're commenting on. It is an absolute game changer.

Dr. William Attaway:

I've not heard that before. That's fascinating. So often people look at social media and they're like I don't even know how to measure this. You know, and the comments that you make. I mean I like that strategy. I'm just processing that, as you've said it, and thinking, wow, that sounds completely doable. But the metrics that you use to measure matter so much, and so I know there are so many so-called vanity metrics that are a part of social media. What metrics do you look at that are a part of social media? What metrics do you look at, Like, how does an entrepreneur or a business, how do they really measure? Yeah, this is working when it comes to their social media efforts? Or gosh, it's really not on the things that-.

Katie Brinkley:

And I think that it's going to be. This answer is going to be different for everyone, right? It depends on what your goal is from social media and whether because for some people it is more followers, for some people it's to get to sell books, for some people, maybe it's to get more high ticket clients Everyone's goal from social media and if you're not posting with a goal, take a step back and really think about what it is that you're doing with your time on social media, because posting just a post is a waste of your time and, honestly, it's a waste of your audience's time because they don't really care. Then there's like oh okay, here's another, you know another repurposed TikTok video, thanks you know, and so the last thing we need is more mediocre content.

Katie Brinkley:

How can we create content that's going to stop someone scrolling and be like Katie is talking directly to me yes, I haven't even voiced this problem out to the universe and here she is with the solution, that's. All that matters is I show up and I've answered that one person's question, because now that person is going to go one step further with me, depending on what my goal is from that post. So this is where the four-post strategy comes into play, and it's a lot of reverse engineering.

Dr. William Attaway:

So let's talk about that. The four-post strategy. What does that look like?

Katie Brinkley:

Yeah, so it's a lot of reverse engineering. So what is your goal? Let's do it for you. So what are your main social media platforms?

Dr. William Attaway:

LinkedIn first Okay, great Facebook, okay yeah, linkedin.

Katie Brinkley:

We'll talk about LinkedIn. So LinkedIn and Facebook, those are my two platforms too, so this will be fun. But if you think about it, linkedin and Facebook both have very different ways of posting online. Yes, you can post a picture, yes, you can post a video, but on LinkedIn you also have the newsletter feature, you have the carousel, so, like the swipable images I mean there's on Facebook, then you just have the single image with, like, the different colored back, or the single like sentence with a different colored background.

Katie Brinkley:

There's a lot of different ways to create content on these platforms. And keep in mind, if they didn't want you to create content these different ways, they wouldn't give you the option. So you have to be checking the box with the big guy you know, with Facebook, with LinkedIn, and be creating a variety of content. And also keep in mind too, like everyone consumes differently. I don't watch a ton of YouTube videos, but do I create YouTube content? Absolutely, because I know there's a lot of people out there that don't want to just listen to my podcast. They wanna watch it. And am I doing the same thing? Yeah, but I gotta tell you my YouTube channel I think I have one video that's just blown up and I was like, man, why of all the videos, why is that the one that's going crazy? And I mean it's still for the podcast. It didn't do that awesome, but it's just killing it over on YouTube. It's because of the different ways of people consuming content. So just keep in mind that there's a variety of ways for creating content. There's a variety of ways that people consume content.

Katie Brinkley:

All that being said, what is your goal? Let's just say you want more podcast downloads. Maybe you have an upcoming launch. Whatever it is, we'll go with the podcast downloads because we're on a podcast. So you want more people to listen to this episode. How are you going to get more people to listen to an episode? It's not by just saying new episode alert, or Katie Brinkley's on the pod this week, or showing a short clip of us talking on here. It's not going to work, because if people wanted to listen to the podcast, they'd open up Spotify or Apple or whatever and just click on the podcast. So how are you going to get the right people raising their hand saying whoa, whoa, whoa? There's somebody that owns a social media agency telling me I don't not to post on social media. Tell me more. Oh, there's an entire owns a social media agency telling me I don't not to post on social media. Tell me more. Oh, there's an entire episode. Of course I want to listen. So think about what your end goal is first, and how are you going to get those right people to raise their hands? So more podcast downloads.

Katie Brinkley:

The very first post is an awareness post. This post is designed to make the right people aware of the problem. You're also for awareness, going to post the way that the algorithm for LinkedIn and Facebook is promoting your content to strangers on the internet. So what I mean by this is what is so like. On Instagram reels, those get found by a bunch of people that don't follow you. On LinkedIn polls videos, those get found by a lot of people that don't follow you. On Facebook, it's the single sentence with the different color background those get pushed out into the strangers feeds right now.

Katie Brinkley:

So when I say awareness, I mean it both for making the right people aware of the problem and the way that the platform is pushing you out to make more awareness about you.

Katie Brinkley:

So for this, like if you were going to promote this episode on Facebook and on LinkedIn on LinkedIn, maybe you do a poll and it just says this is it?

Katie Brinkley:

How many hours a week do you spend on social media? You know one, more than five. Uh, zero, this is the only social media I'm doing all week, or you know something like that. And then on Facebook you say uh, uh, maybe like an unpopular opinion or a statistic, like 48 million pieces of content are posted to Instagram every day and you don't need to, and I don't think you need to post more than once a week. Maybe that's your, just your sentence, like, oh, like, well, who are you to say that? And it's just a strive conversation. Get the right people saying like, huh, that's interesting, or engaging, or liking and having an opinion on it. So you've made them aware. Both those posts you probably could have created in the amount of time that it took me to say the sentences. It's very, very fast, maybe 30 seconds each, right, and it's just making the right people problem aware and pushing you and your content out into the platform. Any questions on the awareness posts?

Dr. William Attaway:

No, no, that makes sense.

Katie Brinkley:

So the next post is going to be the elaboration post. This is where you elaborate on the problem that you just made people problem aware of. This is where it's really good to have a LinkedIn newsletter LinkedIn newsletters if you're not doing one listener, that is your homework. Start a LinkedIn newsletter. It is one of the best ways to get your best content seen on social media right now. Not only does it show up in the feed, but it also shows up in people's inboxes, so it is a no-brainer. Launch a LinkedIn newsletter. So anyway.

Katie Brinkley:

So the elaboration post can be a LinkedIn newsletter On Facebook. It could be just a long caption, but this is where you get to elaborate on the problem that you just made people aware of. So if you have a podcast, it makes it super easy. You could take the transcript from this and turn it into a blog about how there's a four post strategy that's actually going to help you post less and get more reach, more impressions and better engagement by posting less. And these are the four things that I sat down with Katie Brinkley and we talked about blah, blah, blah, blah blah. You can include a link to the podcast in your LinkedIn newsletter if you want or you don't have to, it's totally up to you. You're just giving people that enjoy reading their way of learning.

Dr. William Attaway:

I love that.

Katie Brinkley:

So we've gone through awareness, we've done elaboration. Also on Facebook you could do like a LinkedIn Live and just kind of talk to people about what you learned from posting less or how you overcame it. The next post is the elaboration post actually is going to be your most time consuming post for the week, actually is going to be your most time-consuming post for the week. But again, if you have a podcast thank you AI you can really crank out those newsletters and those articles a lot faster. But then the community post these are the ones that you should really have the most fun with.

Katie Brinkley:

This is what social media was intended for. What is your story? How have you overcome this problem? How have you helped a client overcome this problem? And maybe for you you could say, like how posting only three times a week on my LinkedIn boosted my podcast downloads by 500%, and you could just include a screenshot of you or a picture of you talking in your microphone. Just click hi, selfie, whatever. And in there you could say I thought I needed to post 42 times a week and it was my fault that I wasn't seeing the results from my podcast that everyone else said I should.

Intro / Outro:

I get great downloads.

Katie Brinkley:

I was doing this, I was optimizing SEO. I was putting, you know, a variety of thumbnails out. I was sharing it. I was doing everything. But when I actually took a step back and stopped talking about my show, everything changed and shared your story. And people are going to see that and they're going to resonate with you and be like man he's been where I've been. You know like he gets it too, like I'm frustrated. He tried this. If it worked for him, I could let what happens for me.

Katie Brinkley:

And then the last post is your action post asking people to leave social media, to go one step further with you. And, if you think about it, the right people have been seeing your content all week, the people that engaged in your very first post and had something to say about you know that crazy comment about you not showing up on social media so much you helps them along their journey and be like, oh, I can trust him. Look at all of this information he gave me for free. Look at all this value. Oh, and now he's.

Katie Brinkley:

Oh, I can trust him. Look at all of this information he gave me for free. Look at all this value. Oh, and now he's been where I've been where I'm at. I really trust this guy. Wait a second. You mean to tell me that he has an entire hour-long podcast teaching me how I can do what he did and have success? How do I listen to this podcast? Tell me. And they're ready to leave social media. They're ready to go one step further with you because you've taken them through this journey with them.

Dr. William Attaway:

So good. There's so much clarity in what you just described, katie. I love that. I love the flow of it, and I can only imagine the results that you have seen clients get with this. What are some stories from that that you have seen as clients have implemented this?

Katie Brinkley:

Yeah, it's been great. There's been clients that we've had that have had like 300 LinkedIn followers're. They're up to like 7,000. And I know that followers aren't everything, but because of this they landed a 10K sponsor for their podcast, you know, because now they have the social proof, that goes along like, oh, they've got more followers, they got more downloads, everything. And this client also was able to. He does a quarterly masterclass where people come in, pay a thousand dollars a person to come and learn from him. None of this would have been possible without him getting his message out there more and growing the show, getting the sponsors getting more followers and creating the content that people are like. Man, if he tells me all this for free, what is it like to give him $1,000 and spend a day with him learning everything?

Dr. William Attaway:

That's so good. Wow, it's interesting. You mentioned the LinkedIn newsletter and I'm with you. I think that's one of the least known tools on the LinkedIn platform.

Katie Brinkley:

I do mine once a week. I think you should do it at least once a month. But I have to say like they've even given more insights now for the LinkedIn newsletter. You can actually see how many people it was delivered to, so how many emails actually got sent, what the open rate was. So you're not just relying on the algorithm to be like oh, I think this, you know, katie's 7,000 followers will like this article, maybe, and if no one engages, oh okay, well, we're going to stop showing it. No, they're taking it and they're putting it in someone's inbox for you.

Dr. William Attaway:

So good, you know. It's so easy to be overwhelmed, you know, by all of this and I love your strategy because it's simple and it's clear and you know exactly what to do next. And I can only imagine that people who work with you just have a giant sigh of relief when they know hey, here's somebody who has the expertise and is bringing that to bear to help my business to grow.

Katie Brinkley:

It's. You know, I think that we no one, really no one became an entrepreneur to to be, to be on social media all the time. It's really become a necessary evil. But it's such a powerful tool, right, the connections that can happen, the conversations that can happen Like some of some of my closest friends I see only at Social Media Marketing World once a year, and but I it's great because, like I saw Jessica get married, you know, and see all of her pictures, Then, like I, it feels like a close friend that I'm, you know, connected to and you can have all that with social media. But we're getting lost in the ways of it turning. It's really turned into another Netflix, right, and I don't know, I don't know about you, I didn't start my business to be on social media all the time.

Dr. William Attaway:

No.

Katie Brinkley:

Yeah, and I, as you can tell, listener, I'm a pretty long winded person, like it's hard for me to get to the point. But this is the. This is the point. Like we're, we all have our ways of creating content and showing up and for me, podcasting is that way. And how can I still build community and show up and have and have those relationships and grow my business? Well, social media is the way, and I've never done any paid ads. I've grown my business, you know, to a team of 10. Now I think that it's all by being consistent and sharing how you can help and giving that value.

Dr. William Attaway:

And that I think is key. It's you're adding value, you know, and when people feel like they have someone who's adding value to them, they stick around and retention goes up. Tell us about your podcast.

Katie Brinkley:

Yeah, so Rocky Mountain Marketing is the name of my podcast. I show up twice a week. On Tuesdays, I do interviews with another digital marketing expert and we talk about YouTube, strategies, email, you know, LinkedIn, you name it. And then, on Thursdays, those are my solo episodes. They're about 10 minutes long and I talk about, you know, like right now I'm talking about how to fix your like if you get hacked on Facebook, like what happens if you get hacked. So it's kind of a how-to or the latest trending news in the world of social media.

Dr. William Attaway:

I love that. Very practical, very useful. So let me ask you this, Katie. So you have to lead at a higher level today than you did five years ago. You have a team of 10 who are looking at you. How do you stay on top of your game? How do you level up with the new leadership skills that your team and your clients and your business are going to need you to have three, four, five years from now?

Katie Brinkley:

Yeah, this has been. I found that I was the bottleneck in my business, in my business, and I had to start removing myself and empowering my employees to answer the question. Well, what do you think? That's been one of the best responses that I think has helped my team be willing to just answer the question instead of coming to me for the solution. Answer the question instead of coming to me for the solution.

Katie Brinkley:

Well, what do you think on this? You know, is this within scope? Instead of telling them like, no, it's out of scope, go ahead and say this Can I answer the question? Yes, absolutely, but by me just consistently saying like well, what do you think, you know, how is this within? Asking them the question, it's allowed them to hold up and think for themselves and be like, yeah, actually we can go ahead and do this or no, this isn't, and you know, kind of make their own decisions, and then come to me with, hey, I wanted to let you know that we are doing blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. You know, it's really empowered them and it was hard for me to to figure out what I needed to say and I'm like why aren't they just not answering these questions, or why am I having to step in again and I was creating such a bottleneck effect because I wasn't empowering them to step into their leadership position? I love that.

Dr. William Attaway:

So what helps? So what helped you? Learn that Like, how do you continue to grow?

Katie Brinkley:

Yeah.

Intro / Outro:

I learned it the hard way. It took me way too long. Yeah, it's a hard way.

Katie Brinkley:

It's, you know, a tenure education. I guess the hard way university.

Katie Brinkley:

But no it really was trust. I had to. One, I had to trust them and be like I trust you, go ahead, you got it. But two, enabling them to trust themselves that they knew all this.

Katie Brinkley:

And for one of my employees, she's been with me for about six years and she's in a leadership role now and there's still times where I have to say, well, what do you think you know? And tell her I'm like you've done literally every role in this company. You know the answer to this, what do you think you know? And kind of reestablishing the fact that I was like, okay, I've been here very long, I have done every single role. What do I think on this? Where would I go to find that? Where is that?

Katie Brinkley:

So, and just letting I think that again, like for me it was to kind of rip off the Band-Aid and not answer their questions, not be readily available, because I was afraid that things were just going to collapse. But then once I was like all right, I have to, just I have to do this. It was a little tough for you know, a couple of weeks, but now I can go ahead and I can take. I love cruising and I've been able to take a cruise and I don't have to worry about buying the internet package.

Katie Brinkley:

I know that the company will not burn down while I'm gone.

Dr. William Attaway:

Well, and I think that what you're describing there you know, delegating not just tasks and responsibility, but delegating authority is something that a lot of people struggle with. But when you do, when you make that turn and you learn to do that, it does give you freedom as the owner, it does give you freedom as the leader to be able to focus then on doing the things that only you can do. And that question that you use is exactly what I teach my clients. Don't answer their questions. Ask them what do you think, what would you do if I wasn't here?

Katie Brinkley:

Yeah.

Dr. William Attaway:

You're either going to get a good, solid answer and you can affirm that and say, absolutely, yeah, do that Perfect. Or occasionally, you'll get an answer that's really, really bad, and then you have to really work hard at controlling your face and say, hmm, okay, I can see how you got there. Let me tell you how we do it here. I see what you're saying, but let me tell you how we do it here. You coach them and then the next time they know that and it's a process of delegating that type of authority, so that you are not the center of the spotter web, where everything connects to you and where, when you're gone, everything falls apart. I love that you have found that freedom. I hope our listeners are taking notes, because they can have it too. You just have to do something different.

Katie Brinkley:

I think that that was one. Like you just said, that was one of the hardest parts. Like you just said, that was one of the hardest parts not getting the clients, not, you know, all of the other parts of being a business owner. I think that leadership was the one that took me the longest to really be willing to. You know, and I think that that was like with even my very first hire. I was like, well, I can't hire anyone. No one's going to be able to do my job as good as me. And it's finding those people that are willing to, well, that will do their job better than you. That's finding them and then empowering them when you find the really good ones, empowering them.

Dr. William Attaway:

So you are always learning.

Intro / Outro:

And.

Dr. William Attaway:

I know that because you're a leader who's leading a growing business and a growing team, so is there a book that has made a big difference in your journey that you would recommend to the other leaders who are listening?

Katie Brinkley:

Hire early. Hire before you think you're ready.

Dr. William Attaway:

Nice.

Katie Brinkley:

I think that that was one of my biggest holdups with growing my business. It took me too long to make that first hire growing my business. It took me too long to make that first hire and find the people in your sphere. Surround yourself with people in your sphere that are ahead of you. Does that make sense?

Dr. William Attaway:

Yeah, no, absolutely so.

Katie Brinkley:

I mean hiring a business coach. That was one of the game changers for my business. When I hired my first coach and I got to tell you it was $10,000 for six months and I lost so much sleep over it and I was like, what have I done? Why did I do this? What did I get talked into?

Katie Brinkley:

And if he would have told me, katie, you got to paint yourself blue every day for six months and this will help you grow your business, I would have done it, like everything he said to do, because I spent so much money. I'd never made an investment like that before. And so that's where I was Find it. Surround yourself with the people that are better than you hire. Hire coaches to help. And you know he was with me for, or I was with him for, six months. Then I moved on to another business coach and then I moved on. So I mean there's going to be a different coach for a different season of where you need growth and so um, those are two things that I think that 100% moved the needle for me.

Katie Brinkley:

Um, I still have a coach and a coach, and it was. Sometimes it's just nice having that like oh, this is what I'm struggling with and being able to bounce ideas off of somebody.

Dr. William Attaway:

A hundred percent. Having a thinking partner really helps you avoid the loneliness that is inherent in entrepreneurship. Sometimes Having a thinking partner, I love that.

Katie Brinkley:

Yeah.

Dr. William Attaway:

Last question I'll ask you If I could snap my fingers and solve one problem in your business right now. What would you want that problem to be?

Katie Brinkley:

For me, I think, for if you were to solve one problem in my business for me right now, we're going through, you know, we're scaling, we have a lot of new clients, we built out the systems and now we're ready, Like now we're ready for the influx of clients, and so I think that for me, one of the hardest parts is that for the past decade I've been the lead gen. People want to work with Katie Brinkley, and so I think it's been hard for me to do all of the sales calls and doing all of my system of people wanting to work with Next Step Social because of you know our framework, because of our philosophies, and not being expecting to see Katie on every single sales call. So I mean, like that's. I think that's where the bottleneck is happening now.

Dr. William Attaway:

Good, it's not uncommon either. You know, particularly with founders. You know as your team expands and grows, but everybody still wants to work with Katie, Everybody still. You know, particularly with founders. You know as your team expands and grows, but everybody still wants to work with Katie, everybody still. You know, you're the, you're the face, and I think that that is a turn. And if you make that, you become you start breathing rarefied air because so few people will, for two reasons One, it requires a whole lot more systematic way of thinking about business.

Dr. William Attaway:

But two, there's a little bit of an ego hit too, and you know, I think we have to, we have to own that, acknowledge it and say, wow, but I'm not driving all the business, I'm not, everybody's not talking to me, and you got to be okay with that. And, and I think that's why a lot of business owners won't make that turn, because there's that. There's that that ego hit, that dopamine hit of being the one who does have the answers, who does make the magic happen, you know. But I can see in you that you have a real heart and a desire to grow something bigger than just you, and I think you're going to make it, thank you, I hope so.

Katie Brinkley:

I've worked really hard it.

Dr. William Attaway:

Thank you, I hope so, I've worked really hard, no doubt, and I know that that hasn't stopped. You know you're not just resting on your laurels now. You know you built out the structures and the systems and you're ready for the next chapter, and I can't wait to see what that's going to be.

Katie Brinkley:

Well, thank you.

Dr. William Attaway:

I know our listeners are going to want to stay connected to you and continue to learn from you and more about what next steps up to and how they can get engaged with you. What's the best way for them to do that?

Katie Brinkley:

Yeah, so if you like this podcast, be sure to check out mine, rocky Mountain Marketing. Give that a listen and connect with me on social. If you go to katiebrinkleycom, you can connect with me there, buy the book, connect on whichever social your favorite social channel is. And yeah, I would love to continue the conversation.

Dr. William Attaway:

We'll have all those links in the show notes. Katie, thank you for your time and for your generosity in sharing so freely today from what you've learned so far and how you're helping so many other people.

Katie Brinkley:

Thank you so much for having me.

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Dr. William Attaway

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