Why the Founder Bottleneck Is Blocking Your Agency’s Next Level

Growth can look strong on paper while everything underneath feels heavier than it should. You’re making decisions, approving work, clarifying expectations, answering questions, again. The numbers are up, but the agency still runs through you. That’s the Founder Bottleneck.

In this episode, I sit down for the second time with Marilyn Jenkins, digital growth strategist and founder of MJ Media Group LLC and Law Marketing Zone. Marilyn has spent decades helping service businesses scale with clarity, most recently through her new book, The 2026 Local SEO Playbook for Law Firms, and her national TV show, The Marketing Zone.

What makes this conversation different is where we focus. We don’t start with tools, AI, or tactics. We start with clarity: how founders unintentionally become the bottleneck through poor communication, over-control, and trying to stay indispensable. Marilyn breaks down why education scales trust, why mystique slows momentum, and why no system, automation, or AI will fix a leadership constraint.

If your agency is busy but not scalable, this episode will give you practical insight into delegation, team development, client communication, and how removing the Founder Bottleneck unlocks your agency’s next level—without burning out your people or yourself.

Books Mentioned

• The 2026 Local SEO Playbook for Law Firms by Marilyn Jenkins
• Buy Back Your Time by Dan Martell

If you want to connect with Marilyn or explore her work, the best place is LinkedIn. If you’re interested in contributing to her TV show, visit appearance.mjmediagroup.co.

Join Dr. William Attaway on the Catalytic Leadership podcast as he shares transformative insights to help high-performance entrepreneurs and agency owners achieve Clear-Minded Focus, Calm Control, and Confidence.

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Chapters

• 0:00 Welcome And Guest Background
• 2:10 From Early Tech To Law Firm Growth
• 4:10 Why Launch A TV Show
• 6:30 DIY Education And When To Outsource
• 8:45 Demystifying AI Search For Local SEO
• 12:00 Who The 2026 Playbook Is For
• 14:20 Local Signals Beyond Reviews
• 16:30 Results, Revenue, And Clear Communication
• 19:20 Seasonality, Ads, And Client Expectations
• 22:10 Leading A Players And Hiring For Values
• 26:00 Multi‑Layer Wins And Team Alignment

Transcript

Dr. William Attaway: 0:00

It is an honor today to have for the second time on the podcast Marilyn Jenkins. Marilyn's a digital growth strategist with a career spanning back to the early 90s. As the founder of MJ Media Group LLC and Law Marketing Zone, she specializes in all aspects of digital marketing, including paid advertising, SEO, Google Business Profile Optimization, bilingual call center intake services, and database reactivation to drive business success. With a proven track record of helping law firms achieve remarkable growth, Ms. Jenkins has crafted strategic marketing plans that have led many of her clients to exceed multiple seven-figure revenues, with some realizing returns on investment as high as 14x. Her top 3% podcast, Leadership in Law, features weekly interviews with prominent attorneys and legal service providers. Her cable TV show, The Marketing Zone, is on Now Media, TV networks, and available on local cable channels, Roku, iOS, Sirius XM, and more. Her newest book just came out, 2026 Local SEO Playbook for Law Firms. Outrank, Outshine, and Outperform in the age of AI search. And that's what we're going to be talking about today. Marilyn, I'm so glad you're here. Thanks for being on the show.

Marilyn Jenkins: 1:22

Absolutely. I'm excited to be back here.

Intro: 1:28

Welcome to Catalytic Leadership, the podcast designed to help leaders intentionally grow and thrive. Here is your host, author, and leadership and executive coach, Dr. William Attaway.

Dr. William Attaway: 2:02

But before we jump into that, for those listeners who are perhaps new to the show and don't know you from season three, I'd love for you to share a little bit of your story with our listeners, particularly around your journey and your development as a leader. How did all this get started?

Marilyn Jenkins: 2:18

Well, like it's kind of classic from being a little kid and taking charge and, you know, have growing up on a farm that maybe they had a my grandmother's farm had a tree that other kids didn't have, so I would take the the fruit to the school and sell it. I mean, it was just the classic entrepreneur early on, right? But uh no, I I was always never really wanted to be the employee. I wanted to be more in charge and control of my destiny. And so that's, you know, and studying computers was really something that that was important to me. And it was back in the gosh, early 90s, where, you know, it was typing term papers for college students because not everybody had computers to, you know, people, I need a website. Okay. And we were programming websites. And then the next thing was I need traffic to it. This was before people even had an idea of what was why they were doing these things. So it's been a long term, you know, and then hiring people to help me do the things that you've contracted to do. And then it's just grown into referrals and growth and you know, and then specializing in law firms. And, you know, I've worked in a lot of different niches, all local businesses, which is important to get traffic uh to be known online. And so it's just grown from there and being able to have, you know, a player team members that help me do a great job to deliver a great product for our clients.

Dr. William Attaway: 3:34

I love it. You know, you have become such an expert in the field. I mean, this book that you just released is not your first book, second book, or even third book. You know, you continue to add value through the writing that you do, and now through a completely new venture, which is the TV show. Why TV?

Marilyn Jenkins: 3:53

Well, I had the opportunity to guest on some shows, and it was a lot about local marketing. And then the network started looking at what we were doing with the podcast and the educational webinars and the books, and they're like, wait a minute, maybe we've got a host in hiding here. And so it just came to fruition. They're like, hey, let's do a show called The Marketing Zone, and we'll talk about growing local, you know, growing your business if you're a local company. And so we get to cover all aspects of marketing, whether it's you know, video marketing or local marketing, your Google business profile, and just talk about those things. We've even had an opportunity to chat with someone who talks about local financing local businesses, how to manage your finances to make sure that you stay on track and you grow and quality of life. So, I mean, we cover all aspects of running local businesses, and it's uh it's exciting to get to talk about that in a more detailed manner because you know, I I do a lot when it comes to education. You know, yes, these services I provide, but I want if you aren't to the position to outsource your marketing, I want you to have all the knowledge that you need to do it yourself.

Dr. William Attaway: 4:55

That's one of the things I love about you. You're not trying to hold back the information and say, well, if you really want to get into this, you're gonna have to hire me. You are so generous in sharing that education, sharing what you've learned so that people have a choice. They can either try to implement this stuff themselves, or if they want a shortcut, they can hire an expert, and that's you.

Marilyn Jenkins: 5:15

Well, I think we've all been in a place in different times in our business where maybe we had more time than money, or then we get to a point we have more money than time. So there's a position, and that's why, you know, the book is so important. And just you can walk through everything here. There's six new chapters on AI search and how that plays in the search engines and your local marketing. But, you know, it's just your position in your business. Where are you in your business life and are you ready to outsource?

Dr. William Attaway: 5:41

So talk about that for just a second, the AI search, because this is something that perhaps a lot of listeners are familiar with, but I'm sure many are not. Why is that important? It feels like a complete shift in the search paradigm.

Marilyn Jenkins: 5:54

It does and it doesn't. I mean, if you really look at the background, the real technical aspect of it, whether it's ChatGPT or Gemini or any of those, they're still getting their data from search that's coming from Google in essence and what you put out on the web. So it's not a huge master mystery that some people like to make you think it is. It is important that you give the search engines what they need to be able to answer these questions. Because just like when you're a consumer and you're out, you might go to um uh Siri or uh Hey Google or any of those and say, or even just type it into Google, what's the best Italian restaurant near me? Well, if you are that Italian restaurant and you've written that out and you've created an article about that or maybe done a cornerstone piece about what you provide, those AI engines are going to index that because Google indexes it. And so I think a big part of the AI is let's back up a little bit and that's just start talking to the search engines like people would ask questions instead of being technical about your question, right? When it comes to law firms, you're not asking, you know, they don't necessarily need to put out an article that's a very succinct technical something. Maybe it starts with a question that your average client, potential client might ask and go in that direction.

Dr. William Attaway: 7:09

I love that. And I think that's something that that, like you say, it is it is perhaps painted in a different light by some people who are trying to, you know, be the wizard behind the curtain. And say, oh, well, you can't really understand this, but you know, I'll take care of it for you.

Marilyn Jenkins: 7:24

Exactly. I mean, you've got the AI AEO and AI SEO agencies. And you know, Chat GPT is not, it doesn't have the spiders to go out and spy and and check all the websites. They are taking content from search engines that already do it well. So I think the answer really is knowing how to put content out that can cross platforms.

Dr. William Attaway: 7:47

This new version of your book, the 2026 Guide, you've talked about that. It includes AI, includes the six new chapters. Tell me about the the target for this book. Who should read this book?

Marilyn Jenkins: 7:58

It's written towards law firms because that's where my brand is, right? But this is for any local business that wants to be the local standout in their area. Right? I don't care if you're a baker, a plumber, the car dealership, the Italian restaurant, everything in this book you you can translate to what you need. It talks about if you do charitable work, exchange website links on that website. Your chamber of commerce, how many of you local businesses are members of your chamber? Do you have it set up in their directory, their membership with a link back to your website? All of those local links are give you more authority locally. So if you have more of those than your competition, Google's gonna choose you first. So being in that map pack is has a lot more, a lot more local signals, if you will, make the one, two, and three more than just the number of reviews. Because how many times have you done a search and maybe the biggest review is number three?

unknown: 8:54

Right?

Dr. William Attaway: 8:55

That's a good word.

Marilyn Jenkins: 8:56

There's a lot of factors that go into the ranking in the mat pack, and you and this book covers all of the things in the book can make can increase your ranking in the mat pack, which will increase your cat your customers and your revenue.

Dr. William Attaway: 9:09

Well, that's really the bottom line. I mean, that's so many marketing agencies are trying to talk about, hey, you know, we can do this and we can do this and we can do this. But the bottom line is really, hey, how do I get more leads and how do I close more sales? Because I want to add to my revenue bottom line number. And that's what you focus on. And I think one of the things that customers and clients love about you is that you speak in a way that is very direct. You speak in a way that is clear and that is targeted toward their goals, not using a bunch of lingo that they may or may not understand.

Marilyn Jenkins: 9:41

And I think that's silly to throw out a lot of those, you know, jargon things that that makes you feel makes you look like you're you know more. As a service provider, clients are only going to pay me if they understand and they get a benefit for what I do. So trying to be, you know, a step above them doesn't help. I am a growth partner for my businesses. We have to work towards your goals. And then if I can teach you why we're doing what we're doing, I don't have to explain every little nuance, but you need to understand what you're paying for. You know, I can't tell you the number of clients that I've talked to that when they switched over to me, they were shocked that we do phone calls and email catch-ups every week. I have one client that hadn't spoken to a person from their agency in six months. Six months? Yeah. An actual person, not a voicemail, but spoken to an actual person. I can't imagine having a service provider I didn't speak to for six months. And I continued working with them. You know, just uh, you know, things change in this industry and they change in marketing and they change in your business. Six months without talking to a service provider is ridiculous.

Dr. William Attaway: 10:44

Yes, it is. You know, I it's so interesting to me how we have swung back as I look across the landscape. We have swung back to the importance of the personal, of simple hospitality. I mean, uh all of us use automation, all of us value automation because it's such a time saver and an efficiency boost. But there is no automation substitute for that phone call, for simple hospitality and for that connection that you make. I love that you do that.

Marilyn Jenkins: 11:14

Yes, absolutely. And um, you know, I've cultivated my team that what we are is we are A players, we are customer service first and foremost, and we deliver a great service for great clients. And we they'll only understand that if we communicate. I don't want a client sitting on the sidelines wondering what's going on. You know, if uh this time of year, obviously we're recording this in December, this time of year, typically the number of leads will either reduce because of so much more noise in the market if you're running paid ads. And if your clients don't know that, they wonder what's wrong. So you can't always say throw more money at it when this is the budget. So let's be realistic and understand this time of year we can do a few more things, right? Get a little bit more, you know, it's not all the Black Friday sales and the Christmas sales. You're you're like, say your local plumber and you've got the same thing going on, and this is your service, whether it's Christmas or not. But if your client understands this is a slow season, then it's there's a lot going on about giving them a peace of mind that we are communicative. We want you to understand what's going on, and there's nothing we can do about it except throw money at more money at it, and that's not necessarily feasible.

Dr. William Attaway: 12:21

That's a good word. And and again, it goes back to the education piece, you know, where you're helping your clients understand not just, you know, what you're doing, but why you're doing it and why it matters and connecting that to their why about why they started the business in the first place.

Marilyn Jenkins: 12:38

Well, true. I mean, if they come in with unrealistic expectations, just from a a point of not understanding something, well, it's my job to make sure they understand this is why this works this way and this is what we expect from that. But if we did it your way, this is why it wouldn't work. You know, and it's a conversation. It's not a it's not a, you know, me standing on a on a platform and saying this has got to be this way. And I'm fabulous because of it. You know, it's like these are just the way, these are the restraints we work in, and this is how we know works. It takes a little bit longer to do it this way, but this works out really well in the long term and you'll beat your competition.

Dr. William Attaway: 13:13

It's good. You know, with with decades of experience in this field, I'm curious. Have you always valued the things we're talking about now? This this connection, this education, has that always been a part of your journey, or is that something that you've picked up along the way?

Marilyn Jenkins: 13:29

I think I've always enjoyed doing the teaching part of it. I did public speaking years ago and you know, in early technology. And I just think it's important for everybody to understand and and you learn what you want. Uh, you know, I knew a guy one time that said, uh take eat the fish and leave the bones.

Dr. William Attaway: 13:44

You know who is that guy?

Marilyn Jenkins: 13:48

Yeah, let me think. Let me think. But yeah, I mean it's uh I think it's I like to be able to be that um education part. I want you to understand what we're doing if you care to. You know, I've had clients that basically go, these are the things we need, just make it happen. Okay, fine. You know, but I think the the teaching part is something I w I've always enjoyed and uh just making sure that we can have a conversation about what's going on instead of a lecture.

Dr. William Attaway: 14:14

You have a you have a team of people that work with you.

Marilyn Jenkins: 14:17

Yes.

Dr. William Attaway: 14:17

And you are constantly trying to pour into them, develop them so that they can serve your clients at a higher and higher level over time. You know, leading a team is a different skill than marketing. You know, I mean, marketing, digital marketing, that's a skill all on its own. And we've talked about a number of things that you do there and are very good at for your clients. But leading a team is different. What did it look like for you as you were hiring people and beginning that process of developing a team mindset instead of doing everything yourself like you did at the very beginning?

Marilyn Jenkins: 14:52

I think in the very beginning, I think it was very frustrating because I wanted to hire someone who would come in and just have my mindset and would want to take part of this and just run with it, you know, and just take it over. And I found that, um, and I'm sure a lot of people run into this, I had to run through a few people that were not A players that wanted to be micromanaged, you know, or they wanted to, you give them a list of things to do and they'd do 90% of it and go end of day. Great, happy days. And that's not what I'm looking for. I'm looking for someone who's striving that uh to do better and to have more, and they want to shoot for the stars. And I find that um it took some patience. It also took me going back and reflecting what did I miss? How did I jump the gun? Right. I I had expectations that were unrealistic about who I brought in because I thought I didn't have to micromanage. I don't want to micromanage. And it just comes down to setting up the right expectations on the interview process and also in setting it up of what type of person I want. So the right people apply for the jobs. And so right now I'm surrounded by just an absolute amazing team. You know, we do everything from our bilingual intake service to our videographers, our graphic design people, my account managers, all I mean, just people that want to be more and they understand and and having that, I think you can you can hire values and personality and then you teach skill. You know, that's good. And that's kind of the difference is is changing the way I ask the questions and what I expected when people came in, and you pick up on that. You know, and they they want more, they want to be customer service, they want to make sure that we're delivering and delivering and we're communicating. And that's the biggest thing that we have. And I I think that's one of the biggest advantages my team has. We're not a large team, it's not 50 people, you know, and we are a remote team, and but it's everybody has the same goal. Success for the clients, because every win you get for your clients is literally a level of six wins. You know, clients, their teams, their customers, us, our team. It's just it just goes on. And so if you help a client win and we're all on the same page, it's a win all around.

Dr. William Attaway: 17:02

I love that mindset of seeing this as not just a one-dimensional win.

Marilyn Jenkins: 17:07

Yeah.

Dr. William Attaway: 17:08

But looking at at all the different layers that go into what success actually is. Obviously for the client, obviously for what they're doing, their goals, but for you as well, for your team, for what y'all are accomplishing. And I think that's something that I hope are I hope our listeners are are making note of that, because it's so easy to just focus on one dimension of a win. Just one dimension of what success is. And I think what you're describing here is is powerful. And I don't hear a lot of people talking about this. That's why I wanted to call that out.

Marilyn Jenkins: 17:39

Yeah, it is it is interesting because when you think you get a win for your yourself, you you close the sale. Well, the next thing is is when you get a client, a client, not only have you helped, I mean, you just got to count through all the levels and pieces of people that won from that one piece of business you got your client. Right. And they're happy and they're gonna keep working with you.

Dr. William Attaway: 17:57

That's true. You know, this time of year, a lot of us tend to to spend some time reflecting and evaluating. As you have entered into the year-end season here, are there any habits or rituals or things that you do at year end that help you to kind of tie a bow on what has been for the year behind us?

Marilyn Jenkins: 18:16

I think um this year especially is evaluating, you know, what worked and what didn't, also re-evaluating what's going forward. Doing I'm actually planning a better planning calendar for the webinars that I do each month. And, you know, looking at what's changed, going into the new book, okay, what do I want to teach and webinars? And so pre-planning those so that I'm actually teaching more each month on a more regular basis. I don't necessarily choose like the Thursday, Thursday of each month, but I do a webinar virtually every month. And so this year, that's what another thing is gonna be. In addition to the TV show, focusing more on obviously more aspects of local marketing, but the webinars are gonna be more thought out and covering more aspects and things, you know, like you know, IP ownership and and your Google business profile, things that you can actually take and just I think be more intentional about the teaching I'm doing this coming year.

Dr. William Attaway: 19:11

That's really good. And that leads into my next question, which is like as you're thinking forward, you know, looking ahead to 2026, I mean, you know, you provide insane value for the clients who work with you. You know, and your clients are, I mean, your your business is only growing at this point. What are what are some of the goals that you've got for 2026?

Marilyn Jenkins: 19:34

We've I'm looking at one or two more hires that's gonna help uh build out the team so we can provide some additional services. But yeah, I would love to see by mid year that we double the agency. And I think we are poised to do that. You know, we've got some new things happening. And again, you know, with the with the new book, the webinars, I think just getting out there, the podcast is now. I think we just recorded the 136th episode. So So, you know, we're in season three, moving into season four, so that's exciting. So I think just I don't know, to me it's just providing more and more comes in my way.

Dr. William Attaway: 20:08

Aaron Powell And I think the TV show is a big piece of that.

Marilyn Jenkins: 20:11

I hope so. I think so.

Dr. William Attaway: 20:14

That seems to be a a a media market where there's not a ton of people who are presenting and sharing information and knowledge. People love video. I mean, YouTube, right? I mean, that's that's the the one I would point to. I mean, everybody's watching YouTube. I see my kids all the time on YouTube, my family on YouTube. I mean, everybody's on YouTube. Great. What you're doing is presenting this in such a way now where people are going to be more prone to grab onto a short or a reel or whatever it is that's on YouTube and whatnot these days. But you're able to push this in such a way that it's where people are. And I wonder if that's not going to be a major growth factor for you in 2020, what you're doing with the TV show.

Marilyn Jenkins: 20:53

And that's why I really enjoy the idea of doing it. Um it's not only on cable TV running live uh every Friday at 2 p.m. uh central time, it immediately goes into syndication. Uh now Media TV has an iOS app. They're on Roku, it's a video on demand. It all the podcast stuff goes out on Castos and it goes on YouTube. So it's everywhere. It's even on all the podcast places, including Sirius XM, iHeartRadio. You know, I mean, the places it's on is crazy. I mean, to me, I mean, I hadn't expected that. I'm very excited to do that. And then one of the things that we do for our people that come on the show, the contributors, we provide them, so you get we record it in four 12-minute segments. And so every guest gets the entire full show in the four segments. And then my team, my video team, provides at least 16 video shorts for them to use to promote. So I mean, when it comes to brand building and and authority in your local area or in your your industry, it's a great way of putting out there that you've been as seen on TV, as they say. And um really you've got some great content to continue to use and you have unlimited use of the content.

Dr. William Attaway: 22:04

That's a that's a gift.

Marilyn Jenkins: 22:05

So that's what turned me on to it when I first had the opportunity. So I'm excited to have a show that we can give the same to our contributors.

Dr. William Attaway: 22:12

I love that. So somebody's listening and they're interested in being a contributor. Like, are you looking for guests who can add value to your audience?

Marilyn Jenkins: 22:21

Absolutely. And uh you can go to appearance.mj media group.co. And there you can see all about the TV show. It's called The Marketing Zone with Marilyn Jenkins. And uh yeah, I'm excited to uh it is a paid placement, but there's a lot of benefits of being on the show, and again, all the content you get from it is incredible.

Dr. William Attaway: 22:42

That's phenomenal. We'll have that link in the show notes. That's outstanding. You know, the the TV show, the podcast, the top 3% show in the world right now. I mean, the books that continue to come, that continue to add value to people. You know, Marilyn, you are you are becoming ubiquitous like everywhere. I wherever I'm looking, there's Marilyn Jenkins. You know, is that intentional? Is that a goal of yours to continue to spread and add more and more value to people?

Marilyn Jenkins: 23:11

It is. It is. I mean, there's so many people in the market that, again, like we said, they they want to know enough to be able to outsource it. So I've talked to people who they're like, okay, I I kind of think I understand what you do and I might need you. And but I just don't, you know, a confused mind always says no. So the more that you can teach them, the more that you can put out there and explain to them, then they're like, oh, now I get it, and I have no idea how to do that, or I don't want to do that. Now I have, you know, I believe it's the no, like, and trust factor. It's what I talk my clients into. Get it out there, what your voice is, what you teach, and what you can do to help people. And that's what my goal is, to make sure that people can look at my content, see me wherever I am, and see the types of services that we can do to help you grow.

Dr. William Attaway: 23:55

I love that statement. A confused mind always says no.

Marilyn Jenkins: 23:58

Yeah.

Dr. William Attaway: 23:59

I love that. And I think that that's so important to understand when you're thinking strategically about the messaging that you want to put into the world and the content that you're putting out. This is again something that I think you really do well. You are clear. There is no confusion. You know, your goal is to eliminate the confusion and to bring clarity because clarity is kindness. And I think that's what I think you do that well.

Marilyn Jenkins: 24:24

So be the one who does it or get someone to do it for you. It makes all the difference in the world. And that's just why I think, you know, the more that you can teach, yeah, you can learn anything you want online. Do you have the time as a business owner to learn everything that, say, your bookkeeper does? If so, why do you have a bookkeeper?

Dr. William Attaway: 24:41

So good. You know, I've had a sticky note on my left monitor for years. It says, is this the absolute best use of my time right now? And I need to see that question. I need to see it every day because so often it's not. What I'm doing, somebody else can do. I should be delegating this or hiring somebody who can do it way better than I can. As you say, this is why I have an accountant, because I don't want to learn the tax code, right? Do I have the capability of learning the tax code? Probably if I spent enough time at it. Yeah, but did you want to do the best use of my time? Right. That's the other half, right? Do I want to? Is that the best use of my time? Right? Is that a revenue generating activity? Or is this something that it's like with attorneys.

Marilyn Jenkins: 25:19

You know, when I needed a divorce 30 years ago, did I do it myself? No. You know, I hired an expert to do it. It gets done a lot quicker. The results come faster. And hire somebody that loves doing what you don't want to do or you don't have time to do. That's the whole point of remember you know that book, Buy Back Your Time?

Dr. William Attaway: 25:36

Yes. Great book.

Marilyn Jenkins: 25:38

Incredible book, you know, and I went through, after getting that book, I went through probably three weeks of making a list of the things I do every day. And how many things shouldn't should I not be doing? What do I not enjoy? That's the other thing, is put it into categories. And you hire someone who enjoys that. I have an amazing A player that takes care of most of the admin stuff, so I don't have to do it anymore. But I don't miss anything either, because that's something that she makes sure of.

Dr. William Attaway: 26:04

That's so good. Marilyn, I'll give you the last word. You have you have added so much value today, and I'm so grateful for that with your generosity and sharing. But I give you the last word. What is one thing you would love for people to walk away from this episode?

Marilyn Jenkins: 26:17

I would think that teaching what you do is more powerful than just preaching what you do. You know, don't be on a stage telling people all the things you do and and then have them come to you as a mystery. You know, make sure people understand what it is you do for them and why that's a benefit.

Dr. William Attaway: 26:37

That's good. Don't be the wizard.

Marilyn Jenkins: 26:39

Don't be the wizard. Exactly.

unknown: 26:41

That's good.

Dr. William Attaway: 26:42

Marilyn, I'm I'm so grateful. I know people are gonna want to get connected to you. We're already gonna share the link for people who are interested in being on your TV show. What's the best way for them to connect with you as far as everything else that you're doing?

Marilyn Jenkins: 26:54

I would say LinkedIn was probably the best place to to reach out to me. And it's just Marilyn Jenkins and um, you know, black leather jacket, you'll see it. I'm there's a few of us, but only one that's Law Marketing Zone and MJ Media Group. So LinkedIn would be the other. And of course, the link to the TV show is great.

Dr. William Attaway: 27:10

Excellent. We'll have those in the show notes.

Marilyn Jenkins: 27:13

Thank you so much. It's been a pleasure.

Dr. William Attaway: 27:15

Thank you. I've always enjoyed our conversations and I'm so grateful for you being on the show again. Thank you.

Marilyn Jenkins: 27:21

Thank you so much for having me.