Creating a Classroom Environment where All Students Thrive with Johnny Tiersma

Do you ever wonder how you can create a positive classroom environment and still get everything done that needs to get done?

If so, you’re in good company. But trust me, it’s possible!

In this episode of Real Teacher Talk, I sat down with Mr. Johnny Tiersma, a fellow San Diego area teacher,  to talk about how to create a classroom environment where all students can thrive! We discuss what stops teachers from having fun, how to use humor to create a positive classroom environment, and why this type of environment is so important!

Johnny Tiersma has been involved in education for over 16 years, primarily as a classroom teacher in grades 6 to 8. He has also been a middle school interim principal, an instructional designer for higher education, and an adjunct professor of educational technology. Currently, he is teaching sixth grade in the Cardiff School District in San Diego. Johnny has a passion for students and has spent his career pursuing a classroom environment where students are able to flourish. His goal is to use his connection with students to help them feel safe, valuable, and ready to learn.

If you loved Johnny’s tips and want to support him by purchasing his book, make sure to head to his website for more!


Resources Mentioned:

If I Were the Teacher book

If I Were the Teacher on Amazon

Follow Johnny on Twitter

Grab your ticket for Refresh and Recharge


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Transcript

INTRO

Kristen Donegan  00:02

Hey, everyone, welcome back to real teacher talk. So excited that you're here. We have a special guest who's just down the road from me. We've got Mr. Johnny tear PSMA. He's a teacher here in San Diego. He's been involved in education over 16 years, as a teacher teaching the big kids, six through eight, I will not touch those ones. And then you've been a middle school interim principal Instructional Designer for higher ed and an adjunct professor of ed tech. So Johnny, thank you so much for being here.

Johnny Tiersma  00:33

Oh, I'm so glad to be here. Thank you.

Kristen Donegan  00:36

So will you tell us a bit about your teaching journey? So our teacher listeners can get a little bit more info about you?

Johnny Tiersma  00:45

Yeah, absolutely. Well, I started teaching swimming lessons from a pretty young age. And that was the kind of the ticket where I realized how much I enjoyed children and, and, and watching those light bulbs turn on when they finally get it. Yeah. And so that was it for me and I, I jumped into college and started, you know, became a teacher. And, you know, I always enjoyed working with kids. And so then I went right into middle school. I was standing in front of those 12 year olds when I was 22. And I remember saying to him, you know, when you're 65, or when I'm 65, you'll be 55. Like we're both old people, you know. But yeah, so I did Middle School for 11 years. And then we ended up moving from the Los Angeles area down to San Diego. And that's when I jumped into sixth grade self contained classrooms. So that's where I'm at now.

Kristen Donegan  01:39

Got it? And can you tell us what that means? Exactly. Self Contained in your world?

Johnny Tiersma  01:43

Yeah. So for us down. I'm over in the Cardiff School District, which is, as beautiful as it sounds, it's awesome. We teach all the subjects so I teach everything the students are able to leave for, you know, pe for a stem, like special. And they also get to leave for Spanish and the library. But otherwise, I'm responsible. The kids are with me all day. And it's, it's pretty wonderful.

Kristen Donegan  02:09

And are you guys back to school now?

Johnny Tiersma  02:11

We're three weeks in and, man. Let me tell you people this. This is a better year. I know there's some listeners out there that are thinking like, what is this job that I've started? Yeah, if you started three or four years ago, oh, man, hang on people. It gets better. Okay, this is, this has been a great year. I'm so thrilled. So anyway, it's been wonderful.

Kristen Donegan  02:34

I love that. That's what a lot of teachers have said that this year feels a lot more, you know, air quotes normal than it's been, I did not teach during the pandemic. So I only hear the stories from all of you. But I hope this year is a lot better than the last few. Right? Yeah, thank you. So you're really passionate about building a classroom community. And that's kind of why we brought you on today, because that's an area with so many teachers. I don't know if I want to say struggle with but it's not something we always focus on, because it's just like reading and writing math, right? So why are you so passionate about building classroom communities with your students?

Johnny Tiersma  03:13

I think it's, it's really just a win win. Probably a win-win, win-win win, honestly, because it's one of those things where when students do feel loved, and when they feel safe, they learn so much better, right? So the learning comes easier for them when they're in a place where they know that they can make some mistakes, and like, no one's gonna laugh at them, no one's gonna make fun of them. And so, for them, I think it's so much better. And they you know, they'll enjoy school more if they feel like this is a place where they belong, and where they're accepted. And, and I love that. I want kids to be able to stretch themselves and feel like they can like being able to take that leap and not worry about the consequences, because that's when the best learning happens, right. But you know, I also think, I know your listeners probably would appreciate this, we're always looking at how to do our job best and most efficiently. And I think it makes our job so much easier. When you have a healthy classroom environment, you have less discipline problems, you're dealing with less of that. You can try new things without having to worry that someone's going to come in like a wrecking ball and just destroy this fun idea you came up with. And I just think it's you know, everybody's on the same team. So for me the classroom environment and having kids feel like this is a place where they can take risks and learn and feel safe to be themselves and that's just the groundwork I think for a really solid classroom.

Kristen Donegan  04:44

Did you figure that out early on in your career or was there something that happened to make you really see how important classroom community is?

Johnny Tiersma  04:54

You know, I was at a middle school is Valley Christian up in up in Cerritos and wonderful other teachers that I learned from and mentors that I had there. And one thing that I noticed, and this might rub people the wrong way, but like, that was more important than the content. Like, as a middle school, we knew what these kids were dealing with, as just emotionally. And I feel like 16 years ago, we were a little bit ahead of the game with Canada SEL stuff is like, these kids need to feel like this is a place where they want to be and can be, and then the learning can take place. And so I'm really thankful for the mentors I had there and the principals and admin, it was a really wonderful place to form my teaching career. Oh,

Kristen Donegan  05:36

That's so lucky. Because I know a lot of teachers don't have that sort of experience. You mentioned classroom communities, so important, what are three ways teachers can easily build a classroom community?

Johnny Tiersma  05:49

I think you know, it's about those individual relationships first. So I put a lot of effort at the beginning of the year to kind of jumpstart those. And again, I think it pays off in dividends, where I have less work later. But for me, like getting to know your students, you gotta you got to get to know them as people as human beings. And once you start to hear their stories, and what they like to do and what they're curious about, like being actually interested in their lives, they'll do anything for you, they'll learn for you, they'll, it's wonderful. So the first one is to know your students. The second one, I would say, and this one seems a little strange, but I actually talk quite a bit about building a classroom community to them. You know, there's that old saying, and teaching where you tell the kids you're gonna teach them, and then you teach them, and then you tell them what you tell them, right. And I do that a little bit with the classroom community. And, and it may be to some people feels weird, but I'm gonna tell you why I'm treating you like this. And then I'm going to treat you like that. And then I'm going to remind you why I treated you like that. Because I want it on the forefront of their minds to like these things that I'm doing and that they're doing when they interact with each other are very intentional. So that's, that's number two, talk about it, like actually say the reason why you play those fun games as a, as a, you know, as a class on Fridays, or whatever you do. And then the last one is just to have fun with them. I think I know that I know that the teaching profession has been really difficult the last few years. But like, we have a really special job. We get to be with all these individual, wonderful people in a room for so many hours. And I just think you can't take yourself too seriously. You have to be able to laugh. And I like the saying that says Well, first off, I don't know the exact same thing but I take my job. I do take my job very seriously. But I don't. I do not take myself seriously at all.

Kristen Donegan  07:51

So what would fun look like? Or what would you say to the teacher who's like, I want to have fun, but I'm already so drained.

Johnny Tiersma  07:58

Yeah, I think I think that's a tough one. You know, we're probably a month in or so for a lot of teachers. Right. And I think that it's something like when you can find joy when you can choose joy and find it in the classroom and find the things that you think are fun, and build that classroom community. And then your kids have fun. I think it does fill you up. You know, I think that's the hard part. And I hate to say it like this, but I think sometimes not always, but sometimes I think you have to push through some of those times. And kind of go deep within. I mean, I was raised by pretty much an immigrant so like, you know, things were rough around the house growing up for sure. It was like, it was like figure it out, buddy, like you're cold put on a sweatshirt, like you'll be fine. And so that's still kind of in my thought process. It's like sometimes it is rough. And I think you got to have that positive self talk and say, I'm going to play this fun thing. And then when you see the joy from the kids, it really rubs off on you. That's what I think. I

Kristen Donegan  09:01

I love that. Now you mentioned having fun is humor a part of that in your classroom?

Johnny Tiersma  09:07

Oh, my goodness. I mean,

Kristen Donegan  09:09

I mean, it's a middle school. So I

Johnny Tiersma  09:11

I mean, yeah, I taught all those years in middle school and it was like we'd play pranks on each other teachers like I put a watch that beeped at 855 on my buddy's projector, my buddy Michael. It beat the entire year. He just thought something was wrong with his projector. Yeah, no idea. They would stop. He'd stopped teaching for a minute every day because he didn't know and he just didn't talk to the tech people because he was just He's wonderful. But you know the kids see you having that kind of fun right and teasing your fellow teacher friends. That's why it's so important to have a buddy you know, another friend of mine, Eric Sheltie. He always used to say this quote and it's really stuck with me. And I'm sure he stole it from some old proverb or something, but it was you don't laugh with your enemies. Right, you don't laugh with your enemies. And I say that to my kids every year, like, when you have a group of people laughing together about a shared experience or something funny that happened. I mean, that's one of my favorite things. So, I talked about coffee all the time. I love coffee, but I really love coffee. If you ask my students, they think I have a legit problem. Yeah. But that's fun. Like, it's fun for them to have that to talk about. And I have a phone . My district gave me a new phone, and they never took my old phone away. So I mounted it about nine feet up on the wall. And it's not plugged in or anything. But like, I pretend like that I'm the only one that can hear it ring, you know? And I answer it. And like, sometimes I'll take orders from subway or whatever. Like, just like silly things. Because you're, I think your brain really lights up in interesting ways. When you when you toss humor in,

Kristen Donegan  10:57

You know, well, I'm sure middle schools are tough, at least my middle school experience when I look back at it. So I'm sure that knowing that they're going to your class, they look forward to it. Because it is fun, and you care. And then they're learning, which is like the goal. Right?

Johnny Tiersma  11:14

Right. Right. And I tell them that too, sometimes, you know, it's like, hey, again, this is probably that over talking that I said, where I want to tell them why I do things. But I say hey, man, we have fun here. Like, let's be clear. But don't you dare walk out his classroom and tell your friend we don't learn because like, you know, we do play hard. And we also learn hard too. So I like naming classroom objects. I mean, a lot of teachers do this. So we got Randall, the air purifier during COVID. You know, and

Kristen Donegan  11:45

I've never actually, I've never done this No. Okay, let's hear some more.

Johnny Tiersma  11:50

Oh, I mean, you just you're just using your you're using your overhead document camera and it doesn't work. And you just talk like it's really sweet. Like it's a pet and you name it something, you know, like, some silly off the cuff name and the kids. The kids just love that. Yeah, weird. And that's, that's my favorite thing. You know, sixth, seventh, eighth grade, there's this wonderful blend between cool and weird. Kids aren't totally, they're not totally sure what to do with. Yeah,

Kristen Donegan  12:18

you know, that awkward stage.

Johnny Tiersma  12:21

I played, I played, you know, the ground is lava. I played that in my seventh grade science classroom for a whole day, once a year where because you know, they're only in there 45 minutes, and I wouldn't touch the ground. And I taught the whole lesson. And it was totally ridiculous. But I don't know, it was fun for me to you know, that's

Kristen Donegan  12:41

really well, that's what I've talked with a lot of teachers inside our program, easy organization tools is like when you dread going to work. And it feels like a chore and work sometimes is right. Sometimes I'd rather be just hanging out at the beach. But you want to enjoy what you're doing. And you don't want it like oh, here we have to go another day. You know, because life's short. You don't know what's promised tomorrow? So like, make the most of it?

Johnny Tiersma  13:07

Absolutely. I mean, I actually call it school, right? Like, I don't even call it work, because I just kind of want to keep myself in that frame of mind of like, like, I gotta go to school today. You know, and

Kristen Donegan  13:19

it's that you say you get two and a half. Yeah. Well,

Johnny Tiersma  13:24

I mean, it's one of those things like, Are there bad days for sure. But I think sometimes we can get so caught up in everything that we don't just stop and think like, wow, like, I'm interested in these children in my room. And I get to partner with parents, like I really see it as a partnership. And I get to partner with my parents. And like, that's so special. You know that? That? I mean, I have a mask on my wall. Still I have the mask I wore during COVID on my wall. And it's pinned up there. When I'm feeling a little bit like, this wasn't the best day I look at that mask and go. Like, at least I'm not wearing that. That's how bad it was. It was

Kristen Donegan  14:06

rough. Yeah. Well, you mentioned that you care a lot right about creating a classroom environment where all students can thrive. You've shared some of the ideas, but what are some other ways that you can do that with your students?

Johnny Tiersma  14:19

Yeah, it's it is connected to a lot of those those things I said before, but I think when I think about all students thriving, you know, a bunch of kids come into your room and the ones that you really gravitate to right away the bubbly ones, the fun ones, like they've been the kid's favorite, the teacher's favorite kid every year, you know. And so I do try to look for those kids that maybe they're the ones that get lost through the cracks a bit. And, I try to give them a little bit of extra attention right out of the gate. Right where it's like, oh my goodness, did you see what Dylan did like said that question Dylan brought up in our discussion was so add, like, that's such a good question. Let's look at that. And Dylan, who for the first time in his life shared a question is really just like, oh, feels valuable. And so I think that's one big thing I do is I look for those kids who need a little extra attention right out of the gate, because they are the ones that are so friendly and bubbly. And I have a classroom full of wonderful kids this year. But those ones are so easy, that I really try to find that one that's a little prickly, you know? And, and I'll pull him aside and talk to him, like, Hey, I saw in your group today, like, you didn't do that down, but you got it, you gotta figure this out, because no one's gonna want to work with you. And like, try to appreciate straight talk, right? Like, with sixth graders, you can do that and say, like, no one's gonna write your name down again, buddy. So like, figure it out, like, and so I try to look for those kids that are on the margins a bit and give them a little extra encouragement and prodding and, and attention at the beginning of the year. Because I want all those kids to feel safe and valuable. Whether or not like some people are just a little harder to get along with, you know, and, and that's who they are to like. And that's, I think that's okay. But I want them to still feel like it's their classroom, too.

Kristen Donegan  16:17

I love that. Now, we mentioned a bit with pandemic teaching. So many teachers still are like, I'm still recovering. I really want to thrive myself, and I really want my students to thrive. But what do you say to those teachers who like it just feels really hard to even make that happen right now?

Johnny Tiersma  16:36

Yeah, I totally understand. Because, I mean, I've taught 17 years. And last year was, like, my toughest year by far. And, and it was still a good year, like, I have kids coming back, you know, and visiting me and it's like, Oh, phew, I didn't screw him up. Like, right. So it's still good. But, like, I think you first step to acknowledge that, like, it makes sense. Last year was really hard. And the year before was really hard. And probably the year before

Kristen Donegan  17:05

That, like never before, teaching is hard. In general. Like it just

Johnny Tiersma  17:08

right. Like for me, I felt like I was teaching with one hand behind my back, because I lean so heavily on the relationships, like how are you supposed to build a relationship over zoom? You know, how are you supposed to build a relationship, when, like, I say, a little joke, and you can't smile at the kid, you know, like, it's just really difficult. And so I think you have to call it for what it was and say, like, if you're gonna teach for 30 years, these were your toughest years, you're gonna have like, just know that and, and know that, like, these that it's gonna get better it is getting better somebody that's, you know, already always into my school year. It's, it's, it's something that I would just say, like, if you love kids, hang in there. Like, if you love kids, please hang in there. Like they need us. Right? Like, if you love kids, hang in there. If you don't like kids, please leave like we're fine. Like, do you love children? I like you got to do what you got to do. But I'm saying if you like kids, hang in there a little while longer, because I think you'll see the light at the end of the tunnel.

Kristen Donegan  18:13

And it seems like so many teachers are saying right now it feels like they're, they see the light like they're almost through, right? What would you say is the best part of teaching?

Johnny Tiersma  18:27

I mean, I feel like you could probably answer that question by now. Yeah. The kids. It's the kids, right? Like, it's just, I don't know, humans are so fun. Like, we all have different preferences and, and things we like and, and I just, I just feel so thankful that I get to do what I do. And again, saying that, I think I think for me having so many years teaching before the whole last few years. Like I know what it's like and I know the joy that you can find teaching and the difference that you can make. And so for me, that pulled me through these years, but man just working with kids, when you see those when you see a light bulb moment when you see a kid who never understood how to do something in math, and now they get it and you got to be there. Yeah, you lucky lucky person that you got to be there and be a part of that, you know, the kid that hates school, and then their parents come to you at back to school night and you're there like, I don't know what you're doing. And you're just like, Thank you, you know, like I don't do it for that praise but a little bit of that encouragement from parents if you're lucky enough teachers listening to get some feedback from parents. It's so huge and yeah, you don't want a kid to cry at the end of the year. I mean, none of us like crying children but when there's a good year like this, middle school boys like See you later, man. Like ah,

Kristen Donegan  19:59

That's all. Some sort of that though, too, because there aren't a lot of males in our profession that you get to make a different type of connection with your students, maybe even specifically the boys.

Johnny Tiersma  20:11

Yeah. And I think, you know, I look at as, like, there's, we all have our different advantages and disadvantages, there's a lot of things I can't do. Because I'm a male, you know, and, and I'm, I'm okay with that, like, you know, I'm not the teacher that kids are run up and given hugs to, and that's fine. You know, like, but I do think you're right, when a kid comes into my classroom, and they're like, I've never had a guy teacher before. Like, that's an advantage for sure. But then, you know, for the kid that has a terrible relationship with their dad, I could be really good for them. But I could also be something that they have to overcome and be like, there's, there's a man that's talking in front, I don't yell like, it's just not who I am. I'm not better than anybody else. Like, it just doesn't come out that way. For me, I don't yell. So that I don't think they're hearing like a yelling guy up there. And they're like, that's what my dad, you know, is like, but I do think it is an advantage for some kids that and you know, some kids really read a neat need a male role model in their lives, whether whether they're a young man or young woman like that, you know, that's missing for some people.

Kristen Donegan  21:19

Totally. Well, what's really cool, not only are you an amazing teacher, and you're a dad, but you also are an author you just wrote, it's your first book, right?

Johnny Tiersma  21:32

Yeah, yeah, it's, it's, it's been so fun. I wrote a little picture book that I wanted to read aloud for teachers for kindergarten, kindergarten through fifth teachers. And so this book is called if I were the teacher. And it's about a boy that daydreams on the first day of school, what he would do if you were in charge, and his date. His daydreams are crazy and silly. And, you know, middle school, US middle school teachers have our own little sense of weird humor. But, you know, he imagines that it would be so great if he were the teacher, all the school supplies would be edible. And he could like, if you didn't want to do any more writing, you could just eat your pencil, you know, and it's made of chocolate. He's like, super pumped about when it rains, because they're just going to cancel class and go slide in the mud. Yeah, just like all this weird stuff. But what I like about it is that it's silly and fun. And then on the last page, he snaps out of his daydream, and he says, You know what, like, if she's my teacher, she smiles at teachers and smiles at him. And he smiles back at her. And he says, if she's my teacher, then I don't want to change a thing. All right, so it's got kind of that sweet part at the end. And yeah, it's, it's, it's fun. We've got some of the president of the California Teachers Association, solid praise. So that's cool. We got a teacher of the year that was like, loved it, used it with her class, a California Teacher of the Year. So I've been communicating with some different education influencers, which has been fun, you know. But yeah, it's great. It's on. It's on Amazon, it should be on Amazon now. And it's called if I were the teacher, and it's, it's pretty silly, you should check it out.

Kristen Donegan  23:19

I love that it's so relatable as I was reading it. I'm like, this is totally what some of my students would say. Like, you're like the teachers gonna assign homework and we're just gonna play video games at home. Like I could just see reading this to your students, and then just going crazy for it. Now I have to go on into a presentation. I have to go to my daughter's preschool class about what it's like to be a teacher. Would you say this would be appropriate to read to them?

Johnny Tiersma  23:44

You know, I think my son's preschool, they read it to the kids. I asked my son, he's, you know, just four. I said to the kids that it was funny, and he's just like, I don't know. You know, I think it's, I think the thing I tried really hard, like, I love humor. So for me, I wanted a kindergartener who just is starting their school experience to be like, Wait, that's funny, because you're not supposed to raise your foot, like the teacher gonna raise your hand or, like, Oh, my goodness, if my friend brought his cat to school, and I brought my bird, like, that's not a good idea. Yeah. But then there's a page in there on coffee, right? Where like, if I were the teacher, I would serve my students coffee up so that they could stay focused or something like that. And the kids' eyes are all bugged out. You know? My illustrations are beautiful. So my illustrator is named Ron vander pol. And he's an art teacher and an artist and he's done everything. He's done murals. He's actually local here in San Diego as well as a teacher. But this was like the one thing he hadn't done was publish a children's book, and I came to him and I said, Let's do this. And he's so good. It's so fun.

Kristen Donegan  25:00

I love it. Now what inspired you to write this story like why this story is opposed to a million others, maybe you could have came up with,

Johnny Tiersma  25:08

you know, when I get a little too much time on my hands, like summer, for example, or a holiday break, my brain just kind of starts going. And, I kind of always wanted to read children's books. I hate saying that, because like, that's what everybody says. But I also wanted to kind of stay in my lane, if that makes sense, you know, and I hope the listeners can tell like, I'm so passionate about building, building the wonder and trust and classroom community. And so when I thought of a book, I thought, like, I want it to be able to do those things for elementary school teachers, I want it to be funny, but I want it to be like, the teacher is able to say like, Hey, this is important, why you buy into what I have for us, because because we might even do some of those things. Like, that's what the crazy teacher will read this book and say, today, we're gonna raise our feet instead, you know? Yeah. So that was kind of the reason for it. I want to stay in my lane. I wanted as far as teaching and something that would help teachers and, and I just like humor so much that I wanted to be so goofy, and it's, my kids are eight, six and four. And like, they love it. I told him that we go to the public library here. I said to the librarian, hey, I wrote this book, Can I drop off a few copies in October? And she's like, Yeah, that'd be great. And my, for my six year old, was like, did she say she took your book? And I said, Yeah, she said, Dad, you're gonna be fake. And I'm not like that, I'm a regular teacher. And I hope this book sells wonderfully. But like, I'm not making much money on it. Like the point is like, I hope there's a teacher. And if you're listening to teachers, and you buy the book, I hope there's a teacher that I don't know, that teaches in Indiana. And they like in three years, they email me. And they're like, Hey, I've been using your book for three years. And I love it like that would just that would

Kristen Donegan  27:04

be cool. Nice. Yeah, I love it. Well, where and when can teachers get their hands on this?

Johnny Tiersma  27:11

So it should be published right around this October 1 date. So by the time this podcast comes out, I think we're right around there. Yeah. If they go to Amazon, it is called if I were the teacher, but also if they want to connect with me, you know, they could, they could go to our website, which is the same name. If I were the teacher.com. And there's going to be information there ways to contact me, I'm pretty, pretty active on Twitter, as well and a little bit on Instagram, but if they want to reach out through email, I mean, if there's a teacher that's like, I want to write a book, like, like, I've loved the process, I've learned love learning about the process, a teacher that's listening right now, if you want to write a children's book, and you got an idea, like, email me, I'll at least be the person that bothers you and says, like, or have you been writing lately? Have you been writing lately? I would love to hear from people. So yeah, Amazon if I were the teacher, and I'm hoping I mean, I'm hoping by the time these people see it, it's at least a number. I don't know, 1 million. No, just if you're if you go and look at it right now, and we broke 1000 Just know that I am dancing. Okay. Oh, that's

Kristen Donegan  28:22

awesome. No, I know, I only contributed to a chapter in a book. And I know how much goes into that. So doing this all on your own is so exciting. So we will leave links and everything for all of you guys below so that you can check out if I were the teacher. I'm gonna read it to my daughter's class, I'm gonna report back and let you know what they think of it. I think they'll crack up if my daughter thinks everything is funny these days. So we'll read it for bedtime tonight. How about that, test it out. And then we'll bring it into the class. And but I, I really appreciate you being here. And being a positive light and the education space and just inspiring teachers that yeah, things can be challenging. But it does get better. And just sharing wonderful ideas on how you can really create a safe learning environment for your students. Because at the end of the day, we all know that right? And like undergrad and credential programs and all that, but until you're actually in it, right and experiencing it, learning is not going to happen until your kids feel safe. And so I appreciate you sharing your ideas with us. And we will make sure to connect with you and reach back out when your book launches. So exciting.

Johnny Tiersma  29:32

This was so fun. Thanks for Yeah, being able to chat with me and I love being able to talk you know, talk shop a bit and I appreciate the podcast and what you're doing. And I think it's super cool that you know, as teachers, we do need to have lives outside of school. And that's one of the things I'm going to talk about when I hope to go around to different schools in the area. I'm going to talk about like, you can be a writer, kids, like you can be a writer but you can also be the best kid at soccer. Like, you can be that you can enjoy this other thing like dance, but also, you can write and I think as teachers, right, like, you know, it's okay if you're really throwing yourself into teaching but like you say, it's so important to have these other things outside of our work hours that can really fill us up to.

Kristen Donegan  30:18

Yep, like you said, fun, have fun in the classroom, but have fun outside of your life too, because that's where it really, really matters at the end of the day of teaching that we're gone, right? Yeah, absolutely. All right. Well, everyone else thank you so much for joining us this week. I really appreciate it. Make sure you take some time for yourself today. You deserve it, and we'll see you next week. Have a good one.

OUTRO