Episode 22: Brian Gavin

B"H

Brian Gavin Diamonds’ CEO shmoozes with Matt & Felix about the importance of trust in the diamond industry.

But what happens when "Mazal and Brocho" is no longer enough to keep partners together?  Learn how Bitachon -- Trust -- can transform a bitter past into a more successful future.

Use promo code TRUST10 to claim your FREE Gate of Trust book, with your next online purchase at briangavindiamonds.com.

Transcript

Yossi Pels: 0:00

You're listening to the gate of trust podcast, join hosts, Matt Trusch and Felix feedbooks. Heart to Heart conversations with artists, entrepreneurs, scholars and laymen who were strengthening their trust in God, despite all odds, experienced outright miracles, trusting in God can literally save lives. And now get a trust podcast host, Matt and Felix,

Matt: 0:26

I met. And I'm Felix, and this is the gate of trust podcast. Hey, if you'd like to send a little down or up?

Felix: 0:33

Well, you know, I was having a little challenge yesterday, you know, I'm in the recruiting business. And I was recruiting a candidate who was sort of delaying and giving me a positive answer. And while I was waiting for the answer, I decided to reach them to help them and read some data of trust. Pick, the chapter ran with my picks chapter chapter is going to be the right chapter. It was chapter three, nice, and I started reading and I go, Oh, man, oh, man, I don't know if this is the right chapter or not. It says, Hashem will do for you. Whatever Hashem does, is the right thing. And if it's not the right thing, it's still the right thing. Because it's what Hashem wants for you. And I'm like, oh, no, he may not want me to have this deal. Oh, it's not the right chapter.

Matt: 1:21

You read up a little bit farther. Everything comes free for you. Yeah. And only good things are coming and maybe maybe blessed to be in the right time. Yes. So the good news is Felix that you and God you close the deal.

Felix: 1:34

We close the deal. Close the deal. Happy, happy people all around candidate client, me, my manager. Everyone's happy.

Matt: 1:41

Thank God. Wonderful. Today, we have a gem of a guest, Brian Gavin from Brian Gavin diamonds, who is an old friend of both of ours shouldn't call them old.

Brian Gavin: 1:53

operative word,

Matt: 1:56

a good friend of both of ours. And we're really, really looking forward to speaking with you today. Thank you for joining us, Brian. And I said to Felix for the call. I said I can't wait to schmooze with Brian Gavin on today's podcast.

Brian Gavin: 2:07

It's my honor to to join both you guys. And I must say I was looking forward to this when after I received your invite. And so I'm pretty excited. But as long as Felix says a good joke.

Felix: 2:21

I'm working on it working on it. And we're working on it.

Matt: 2:25

Ryan said Listen, I'm not joining the podcast. Felix has a good joke. So

Felix: 2:31

it's not a it's not a Jewish joke. But it's it's still a good joke. Brian near the diamond business. What do you call it? An imitation diamond that an Irishman uses to propose to his girlfriend.

Brian Gavin: 2:41

Now? You got me, buddy.

Felix: 2:44

It's a it's a shamrock.

Brian Gavin: 2:49

See, I like that one. That one. I like the extender.

Felix: 2:53

Brian, I have a question for you. Have you ever tried to make a Duck shaped diamond?

Brian Gavin: 2:58

Not really,

Felix: 3:00

I don't think it's gonna work out because I think if you make a Duck shaped diamond that might quack under the pressure. Now that sounds like I'm bringing I'm bringing the heat this week with the Joe.

Matt: 3:15

Ryan, we got your bio on paper. But I'm sure I can't tell as much color as if you give it to yourself. So Brian, tell us a little about yourself where you come from? How did you get that charming accent and good looks?

Brian Gavin: 3:27

Well, it's a long story, isn't it? I was born in Johannesburg, South Africa. 1957. That's telling my age. My grandfather, his brother in law, his sister and his wife left Amsterdam just before the Second World War. He was brought to South Africa in order to teach people how to cut and polish diamonds because he was a master diamond cutter. And they arrived in Cape Town. They, they I think the first factory that they worked in was in Weinberg in Cape Town, which is like a city next to Cape Town. Basically, my mother was born in and then they moved to Johannesburg. And they started their own business called majestic diamond cutting works, which I had for many, many years. My father met my mother of course. And he was an electrician and a very accomplished a double bass player. He was a well known jazz musician in South Africa. And of course, for those who don't know, my mother was also very well known artist. So I grew up in a very sort of creative, creative home. And so when my father married my mother, he went into the business. And that brings me to today. I went to University in South Africa to study law. I really wanted to make movies but my mother said it's not a nice job for a nice Jewish boy. I said What's wrong with Steven Spielberg? So So, so I set out in the path of law, which I absolutely hated. And at that time, everybody had to go to the South African Defence Force. And I was very much on the liberal side as a young young man. And I decided no, and I thought the best thing was for me to leave the country, which I did know move to England. And I studied Marketing Management in London. And then I eventually came back to South Africa for my brother's wedding. After that I became from, most people want to know, well, how did you become from

Matt: 5:39

Tommy, Brian, Gavin, how did you become from

Brian Gavin: 5:43

on the way to the hookah, they started a single thread as Negan. And for those who don't know, about the Raven, the Raven Negan is a very powerful Negan. And they say it's changed many, many, many lives. And I was one person before the HIPAA and it was another person after can explain it. Almost like an out of body experience, can explain it, I was one person next, and then I had a changed life. And my gates were open to the to acknowledge that God exists in the world. And that's that, then actually, I went beyond, because everybody said, they wouldn't defer my training any longer. And I graduated from Central London College, and they wouldn't defer my training anymore. And everybody said, Brian, you have to go to the army, I was going to be a deserter will never be able to come back in a way to do the things that you want to do. So I went to the army. And that was an experience in itself. And then of course, I met my wife, Donna, and we got married, she was from Rhodesia, actually Bulawayo already. And we decided that if we were going to have children that we didn't want to bring them up in South Africa. And we landed up in America, and Houston, where we've been here for the last 39 and a half years. And so ultimately, why Houston, her aunt, lets her father sister lived. Yeah. And she encouraged us to come, we arrived, and she left. So. So we very much had the bad community here. And that was our home. And it's been, as I said, last three, nine, half years. And we're happy. So we're gonna tell you,

Matt: 7:30

by let me ask you a question about the author of about the author, Evans niggun. I thought that maybe you heard it at your own wedding. And that was the transformative experience. We all know how we started off as half a soul. And then we become another full soul once we get married, but you're telling me that it was at your brother's wedding that you heard the alternatives, Nick, and that you were transformed to a new man

Brian Gavin: 7:49

who's totally, totally, totally. Wow. And, you know, I think that when one looks back, you know, we all live in a microcosm, most of us do, because we don't see further than our noses, when hopefully, we do see. But, you know, when you look back, and you see the pathway that is created, it's it's always very, very interesting. I mean, the way I met my wife, her history behind, I'm not gonna go into all those things, but, but it was amazing how these were designated from above, and how this all landed up. And of course, this is how the future is, I mean, this is where we are. And we made a life together. And we brought up four beautiful children, and then got to have nine wonderful grandchildren not counting. And yes, it's been a real interesting journey, with lots of doors opening and lots of doors close, with a lot of experience.

Felix: 8:53

So obviously, you know, leaving a country to start a new life, in a completely on a different continent. Like, talk to us about that trust, because, you know, all of the connections, all of the family that you had, then coming here, and then the family you knew left had to be challenging. So how did you how did you deal with that, like, you came here and then you were, you're in a crowd, you were with God, but you're not alone and your family back into the country? It's not it's not the same, not the same.

Brian Gavin: 9:24

It's not it's not the same. So I think my exposure to Yiddishkeit into the other day that gave me a lot of insight in not worrying about what's going to be that everything was predetermined for me anyway, it was a choice. Yes, there was freedom of choice to do what I had to do. But I, you know, if you look back, it was crazy. We had a six month old kid, we had got into America, on a work visa for myself to come here and start doing business. And it was yeah, in a way I think when you're younger, if remember, I was a lot younger, my, let's say mid 20s. And so I think that you know, when you're young, you frivolous. And I don't think we've we fear as much as women, maybe we get older, and we have a greater understanding of what we've passed through. Would I do it again? I don't know if it's. But yes, it was, there was I think there was a blind trust, I think we the need for us to move on. And to do what we wanted to do. There was enough power, we actually wrote into the Arabian river for a broker, which we never got, we had no response. And we asked various rabbis in South Africa, what we should do. And some of them said, you know, you got to look into yourself and decide what it is that you want. And we took that as being an answer to leave. Because this is what we felt would be the best thing for us and for our children. And we left. And as I said, you know, when I look back, and I think, where I had the guts, and the strength to do that, it's, it was quite amazing. I mean, even though we spoke the same language, or let's say, we spoke English, I never spoke the same language, because back then, it was bathroom and bathrooms, and half and half. So there were there were changes to come. But it you know, it was a journey. It was a it was a really sort of a very interesting journey. As I said, lots of doors opening and closing along the way. I hope that answers your question.

Felix: 11:44

Beautiful. Absolutely. Absolutely.

Matt: 11:46

Brian, your family comes from Master cutters. Maybe you can give us a muscle for how to diamonds and bitOK on a trust beat to one another. Is there anything we can learn from the diamond industry, the diamond business that can tell us about the talk on trust,

Brian Gavin: 12:01

I think that the generations have changed so much. But if we look at the original dealers of diamonds, the there was a great trust amongst each other. It was a handshake. If you came to me, and you wanted a diamond looked at it, it's a you offered me offered me on the diamond have accepted and you didn't pay me immediately, we of course would use the word masala Raka, which would seal that that would blessings and luck. And that, that that deal was done. And I think for many, many years, those values held very true. I'm not saying they don't hold true today. But it's a different. It's a different value system. I think the industry in itself, tries to police it and support it in its in its own way. But it's definitely not you know, we still we still use the word muzzle, I think it's just been shortened the muzzle, if you luck. So good luck. And, you know, I think that it means something different today versus when I saw my grandfather, same as Alan Brock, when they close the deal with somebody. And, you know, there's that one aspect of it. Then there's the other aspect, you take all diamond, what is the royal diamond, it's a rock, it could be covered in dirt and whatever. Then of course, they remove that. Just like as human beings, we have our diamonds inside of us, our souls or souls are like diamonds. And sometimes we have to remove that dirt and polish it. I think that you know, when you polish a diamond, you transform it into something that is bright and beautiful and sparkly, and things that to me that are very positive. And I think you know, we have that same trust or hopefully people will have the trust in their souls to be sparkling and shining and not covered with dirt.

Matt: 14:12

Now follow up with another question. And in the diamond industry, as you said it started with where it was just a handshake, Amazon braha. And things have come to develop to today's the diamond industry where you can even have synthetic diamonds. Right. So there have been ups and downs for sure. I understand in the diamond industry. So how have you as someone who this is this, this sort of you living in the center of this roller coaster of the diamond industry as it has been in the last, say decade or so? How have you been able to hold strong with your baton and your trust and how has it helped you weather the storm?

Brian Gavin: 14:49

You know it's interesting. When I did certain things in the diamond business when I started developing my patents and light performance. There was a conch Leave, which I never attended. But a lot of my associates and people that I knew, and I think this is the important thing. And I think this is was a blessing that I've been bestowed on me. And that is somebody mentioned, Brian, Gavin was visionary before his time. And what did that mean? Look, a lot of people know that that was probably one of the first people or first diamond dealers to go online and sell diamonds online. Every diamond dealer in the world said, You're mad, it'll never work. You can't sell diamonds. It's a touchy feely thing. That's which, that's what sort of catapulted me into developing perfectly cut diamonds that will perform with the utmost like performance, greatest sparkle. And that's where my research started. Because I wanted people to feel comfortable online. How else could they tell whether this diamond was better than that? Yes, they could see the reports by the grading labs. And they could see the color and I could see the clarity that those were Givens. But how do they know which really shines and sparkles. And this is an issue. I think, for a lot of people that there's so many people out there today that will buy diamonds, even even to steal today, under false pretenses, which is very sad, even look at public companies that, that that there are selling online, they're not really very ethical into certain extent and not telling the truth. They're not telling the truth. And I think that's, it said, it said, but I think that's where I sort of have held a very, very high standard for being online. I think we all know,

Matt: 16:51

what is the Brian Gavin proprietary way of cutting stones that brings out its maximum shine can explain it to us in a few words,

Brian Gavin: 16:59

diamonds are prisms that are reflected, most diamonds are cut, because they're very expensive to retain as much weight as possible. But there's no free lunch, if you're going to, in order to retain the weight, you're gonna have to increase the angles, make them what's commonly known as deep and steep, which will retain more weight. So the spread in relation to the weight will be much smaller. When light enters through the diamond through the top, the light is bent. And when it reaches the bottom of the die, it's going to it's going to exit instead of bouncing back around and exiting through the top. Not everything will exit to the bottom, but a lot of it will. But in some will return what we do is we maximize those angles. And we maximize all ancillary angles. Whereas you know, every house is built on a foundation, a diamonds, main pavilion and crown angles, all those foundations, they're not really as important as all the ancillary angles, and part of our patent is the maximization of those angles to to make sure that white light is returned to its maximum. There's no low intense light, which is leaking through the bottom. And that's what we specialize in. And that's what makes our diamonds shine like no other. And, you know, they say, what's the biggest compliment you have, and that you could have somebody to copy. So there are a lot of people who have reverse engineered what we've done. And so I feel great, it's okay, but they don't have all the secret sauce, most of it there because they can find on the patents. And we do that for round. It's the only important round brilliant in the world that has a patent for for maximizing like performance. We do it for cushion cuts. We do it for emerald cuts. And we have some other patented products, which not necessarily a downward migration, but we do for ovals. And we do a square cap called quadratics. And so there's a bunch there very few people that carry what we do, do what we do as a company in the beginning, if I can put it to you this way, before there was even such a thing as PayPal. I entered the internet when it was called ICQ chat, which some people will remember. But of course, I was a lot younger and many people won't know what it was. But that was the forerunner to communicating over the internet. I had a professor from University of Houston was a good friend of mine. He developed software for me managing my diamond inventory. And one day he came in, he walked into the office and we said, Brian, look at this. This is called the World Wide Web. We showed me a picture of a web from a spider. And I said so what what do you want from it? He said the amazing thing is that we could show somebody details about your diamond. And they could see it on the other end of the world. And you can transact business said, Okay, that sounds great. But then we became schizophrenic because we were in the wholesale business, you know who we're going to sell to. So we developed, he will, he developed a web page for me. And we sold our first diamond to a lawyer in Chicago. I don't I found some a family where there was the rights to general I don't know. And he said, How are we going to transact this? I said, You're gonna pay me and I'll send you the diamond. Is it? Okay, I'll tell you what, back in 1997 98. There was there was no form of of transaction online. And what happened was, he wrote this contract up, that he would pay me and it would send him back the barn. And I would send him the diamond and and all that, he got it, I got my money. And it was fantastic. And he said, you're welcome to use this contract for everybody else. And within I think few months pay pal was born online interactions happen, where I think when I look back, now, I see all these things that were appearing before me, were very, they were there were things that that I couldn't believe could really happen. But they were happening. I think, from that gave me a certain trust, knowing that I wasn't driving this train. Yes, I was a partner in this train, and I was doing what I had to do. But I wasn't driving the train. The The tracks were there for me. And I had to make sure that my engine was was was stoked, and that we could run. And I think, every aspect of that, which led to another gave me more trust in doing what we work with.

Matt: 22:01

Brian, I'm gonna ask you this question. Because it's actually a play on words, we've been talking about trust a lot. Yes. And for sure, the diamond industry is something which is so wrapped up in trust. I'm in I'm a fund manager, real estate fund manager. And everything that I do is based on trust. And I know in the diamond industry, everything you do is based on trust, I'm sure with Felix as well. So chapter two, of the gate of trust lists seven trustworthy qualities. And then we say that God has these trustworthy qualities times infinity. But I wonder if you to, in your interactions as a business person, think about these seven trustworthy qualities and how you need to exemplify them to the utmost that you can, in order to be a trustworthy diamond dealer. In your case. There are seven trustworthy qualities we say, compassion, attentiveness, strong, wise, close, responsible, and extremely generous. So do you think that these seven trustworthy qualities, not only are they there to help us understand why we need to trust in God, but why we ourselves as business people need to exemplify these traits. In being a trustworthy business person.

Brian Gavin: 23:05

Yes, we are made in the image of God. And our role is to play that role. By was play up that role. And we are given these qualities, we're given these things as guides, to what we do in business relationships, I always evaluate the person in front of me thinking, if you were in my shoes, would you be behaving in the same way? And if I if I just bring back a few of those, so this compassionate, is this person really compassionate? Is he listening to me? Or is He is not listening to me? He's telling me so you know, is he attentive, attentive? Is he going to hear what I have to say? Or is he being really strong and trying to build those me into a position? Does he answer wisely? Is he trying to form a relationship with me to be closer so that we have a better understanding? is he behaving in a responsible manner? And is it being fair in what he does? I'm not saying I use all of those qualities to look at somebody. But I should do use many of those qualities to look at somebody. And if one comes up negative, my radar goes up. And I have to be careful. And that's only through experience. And that's that's happened through experience. You know, it's like I say, youth is wasted on the young, right? If I knew today what I knew when I was younger, I think I would have averted many things. But that's not life. God allows us to travel this journey in order to learn these things and to improve. Unfortunately, I've been in situations in my life, where people have abused those, those scenarios and where they did take advantage. They weren't responsible. You know, you always want others to treat you in a way you would treat them. And if you don't see those things coming back to you as an individual, be careful, because you know that you're, you're there's a brick wall in front of you. And sometimes we don't see that brick wall, and we hit pretty hard. And that's when we have to get up. And we'd have to run again. And I've had two internet companies, one previous to this one. And the first one didn't end in a very good way. And I separated from it. And you talk about trust, or you talk about the world to do something, you know, are you doing the right thing? It was hard, because when you when you've put your, your premium time of your life into something, building something, and that is pulled from underneath your feet, in a matter of seconds, when you find that strength, and that gate of trust, does it open, where you can move on to the next phase of your life? Very difficult. When I left the previous scenario, my wife and I woke up one morning, and we said, what are we going to do now? You know, we've we've done this for Cisco seven years? And do is this what we still want to do? Brian,

Matt: 26:17

let me tell you a little bit about my story. And maybe to put it all in context. So you all know that about 10 years ago, I started a company called by Joe spirit of China. And we got about a million dollars from Jewish investors. And then we were so fortunate to meet with Yao Ming's investment team, and they put in about $3 million. I remember the day that we signed with them. I walked away from that meeting, saying, Oh, how lucky I am how fortunate I am. Now that we've got Yamahas investment team in this project, it's sure to be a success, even beyond my imagination. And the whole time, we're waiting for that piece of the puzzle, the turn, and everything to be great. Well, sometimes soon after, it was a disaster, you know, Chinese mafia coming after me and just trying to make the story sound as good as I can. But I was really afraid. And all of that great blessing that I thought was going to come from China come from the helming really became a nightmare. I can't tell you how afraid I was. And despite that, we kept on going with the business at a more limited pace, later on being courted by the largest bio company, or second largest biotech company in China. And I was so excited to ran after them to trip after trip running after them, only for them to turn around, copy all of my ideas. And then they went and did it themselves. So the pain and suffering of going through this. And I think somebody who appreciates Bataclan can understand that I was doing all the wrong things, first of all, putting my trust in something that was a person or a group. And finally running after the business thinking that I could achieve this that I could close that I can make it all happen, and all blew up in my face. So Bataclan. And I really can't explain exactly how but having learned the gate of trust, it really reframed my whole understanding about the things that I was doing wrong, and what I could be doing differently. And when I finally had peace with the fact that it's because I was putting my faith in others or I was putting my faith in myself, I trusted myself and started putting my trust in Hashem all of a sudden started getting calls from China from fund managers who want to invest money in by Joe again and again, again, cetera. So the point is, I was definitely walking around for maybe a decade with pain and suffering, and, and difficulties because I felt why did God do this to me? Why didn't it happen to me, but now really, everything I see was for the good. I'm completely calm and relaxed. And I see a very, very bright future for this business. So I think it's a very, very important piece to deal with difficulties in business to see them. And when you are able to implement the trust mindset. It really helps you move on in life with simpler and with success. So that's my story for you. I don't know if I've ever shared it with anybody, but it's sort of still a story in progress. But Brian, we we know that business is tough. And we all go through hard times. And this was a partner. These were the my partners, the Chinese partners who ended up scaring the living daylights out of me, because I was afraid of man, not not God. But ultimately, when I when I got past it, as I said, I can't even put my finger on exactly how the gate of trust did it. But it did it that now I have peace and trust. And this business is on its way to success again. So Brian,

Brian Gavin: 29:28

it's an interesting story. And I suppose in some way you expect me to sort of relate back to you about my experience and my my interesting experience that I had, how do you read people or how do you trust people? One always looks toward Who are you doing business with? Although the same kind of people as me, do they have the same upbringing as me? Do they have the same background as me and one would expect correct that if you fit in that category, that it would be better. But it's not always so in my experience not. So you have an experience of of being in business with people who are not really the same background as you, and have done have the same upbringing as you, even though you are a verse in the dialect of Chinese and you have the ability to communicate, you would expect, I suppose on one hand, that things will run easier, but evidently they didn't. So when you speak

Felix: 30:35

the same language, maybe you think we're spiritually and culturally, we're probably the same. If we're in business together, we're probably the same.

Brian Gavin: 30:45

But the answer is, and what I was trying to draw analogy, my experience was with people who come from the same was similar religious background. And in many respects, one would expect more from people like that, versus when somebody comes from a different set of values. And the funny thing is, I've been involved in different partnerships, legal partnerships, or just working partnerships. And I've always found that people that I work with totally similar backgrounds have been far more complex, and far more difficult, then working with people of different persuasions and backgrounds, maybe once forced to work hard, I'm not sure. I'm just summing that up. And so one's expectation of others, when you come from the same background, I think is far greater. And maybe that's not correct. I don't know if it's the correct way to look at it. Which sort of points back to Matt's statement, you have to put your trust in God, not in the people in front of you. But you have to at least try and read who the people are

Matt: 32:07

surprised? What was your business partnership? What went wrong? Why did you wake up one day, and you felt like the carpet was pulled out from under you? And why do you feel that this was something that has been so difficult to deal with till this very day?

Brian Gavin: 32:21

I will try and answer it met? It's a little bit complex, but I will try and answer it. I think when you're in a place of darkness, and I don't mean a darkness of depression, I'm just talking to a place of darkness where, where things seem to be more overwhelming. And your your trust is not an issue. But your trust isn't around the people around you, then I think you don't see the wood for the trees. And I think, in many respects, my trust was more in the people at that stage than I think it was with Hashem. The journey that I traveled was complex. And I think that in the diamond business, when you shake a hand and you say, Mazel Abraha, that's that contract. And for many generations, and many years, people have to acknowledge that contract. I was brought up like that. I saw my grandfather give me muscle broker to many, many people. And even when there were complexities, and let's say in those business relationships, a man's word was his word. I can't really say that for today. Today, I think, in general, in many business instances, it's how can I have an advantage over you? versus, you know, what if I can be in business with you, and I can help you, and you can help me and we can help the people around us? Great. And you know, businesses business, I understand that. It's not a it's not a fun game. Or it's not a game of fun. We're talking about money, and people greed always enters into that. So I think that I came from a different perspective. And I just saw a lot more goodness than I thought I actually saw. All its I put it the other way around. I didn't see enough goodness. But that's on one side. And then on the balance, I think it's a road that I have to travel. Because travel that road, I would never see what Hashem was trying to teach me. And even that, in many respects, and people have asked me Do I bear ill will No, ill will. Doesn't hurt. Sure it hurt. It hurt because of many things. When you have a relationship with people. Those things are can be very deep, and when somebody hurts whether it's direct or indirect, if you're a sensitive soul, it hurts bad. So I bear no ill will. But to come to terms of a full forgiveness, it's very difficult. I have to honestly say that very, very difficult for me.

Felix: 35:10

Is it easier to think about forgiveness, if you look at from a bita con perspective, if God has plans for us, and it's possible that individuals that we feel bear ill will for us, they're tested, they have a certain Avada in their life, and they have certain roadblocks that Hashem puts for them, and they have their own thing. But as it affects you, in the big picture, is it possible to I mean, this is a very, this would be a very high level of Bataclan. To say, sure, that I forgive because it's not even it even for oneself. When we Yun Kapoor, we asked forgiveness, like, we we have this free will, we're trying to do what God says, but we make mistakes, right? So is that is that? Is that a thought you've ever had? No, it is

Brian Gavin: 35:59

it is a thought. And that's why I have to stress deep down inside, it's not your work. But to bring it to a point. I'm saying it takes a lot. I'm sure. Matt can vouch for that in a certain way, in his own experiences, as he just led us into this conversation. It's a tough one for me, and I have to I have to climb that mountain. You know, it's very easy to sort of get on here and say, I'm a great guy, look at me, I'm, I can forgive everything and just move on. Not so easy. It's not so easy, because it does affect multiple, multiple things. But yes, if I can come to that full realization, then, of course, I understand I will be the better person. But that's the goal. I suppose one has to get over that and understand God is bigger. It's just 98%. There. Felix,

Matt: 36:49

Brian, before this business challenge, was there anything called Brian Gavin diamonds? Or was it called something else?

Unknown: 36:56

No, it wasn't Brian Gavin.

Matt: 36:59

Okay. So what I'm trying to say is that this happened? Yeah, it's unfortunate occurrence. Quote, unfortunately, cars happen. This has given birth to Brian Gavin diamonds, to your proprietary cutting technology, and all of the amazing things that you've done for the industry and you do for your clients every day.

Brian Gavin: 37:16

No, I that's something that I identify. I think we said that a while back that without the prehistory to Brian, Gavin, I would never be on this journey where I am at the moment. You know, it's a multifaceted thing. And that's why I say, Do I bear ill will? No, because I understand the lesson that I've been taught, as it all gone away. No.

Matt: 37:38

But do you think you and Brian, Gavin diamonds, and your whole diamond career is better off because of whatever happened 10 years ago?

Unknown: 37:45

It is I mean, I think I became a bigger person. And I gave the world a lot, a lot of things that the world wouldn't have seen. Let's put it that way. Has that uplifted the world? I would hope so. I hope that the way we conduct ourselves in business that we do uplift the world and the people around us. And that we have to thank God because God shows us shame shows us the way. But yes, I I'm just being honest in my feelings, because to say that I'm 100% pastoral. No, but I know I'll get there. In the end, I've got to 98%. So

Matt: 38:22

ultimately, we know everything that happens to us for good or for bad, whether it be from friends or from enemies, nothing can happen to us. Unless God decrees it happens. And if it didn't happen from here would happen from there. We also believe that everything that happens to us we trust, everything that happens to us is for our own good. And as time passes and wounds heal, we start to see that it was really all a divine path to bring us to the best us that we could ever be sure it's often a painful journey. You've been through it. I've been through it. I'm sure Felix has been through it. And so many of our listeners are going through it. Sure that the talk on is really that mindset really helps us heal the past and reframe it for the future. Definitely.

Felix: 39:01

I think Bataclan is the vaccine. It's not it's not a cure, but it's a vaccine, no,

Brian Gavin: 39:05

but when you can let your guard down and realize that the traffic lights on your journey, Hashem will turn them green, and he will turn them red. And you have to follow that, if I can put it into a into a simplistic point of view. And I think we do see the times when the lights are green. And we do see when the lights are red, to your

Felix: 39:31

point when we're evaluating is to see where maybe there's a yellow light. True. Caution.

Brian Gavin: 39:37

True. Definitely. Definitely. Well put. Very nice. I'll never forget when we just started writing down diamonds. We were in a bit of a hole. And I think this is for most business people. Sometimes you think how am I going to get how am I going to see tomorrow? How will I get out? Or how am I going to survive tomorrow? I'll never forget there was a chef who came to my door He said to me, Brian, I really need this amount of money. I looked at him and I said to him, You know what, I don't know how I can help you. And then I sort of closed my eyes for a minute. And I looked back. And I said, You know what, I cannot not help this person. So you know what I have to put my trust in God, that if I help him, God will help. And I think, you know, that's always the biggest yardstick for us as humans that we know if we give of ourselves to help to others, whether it's financially, emotionally, mentally, whatever way you want to look at that it comes back to us in double. I wrote him a check for a big amount. And I said to him, yeah, I just don't deposit it today. Just the positive on Monday. I said, and everything will be okay. And that's what happened. I don't know, sales poured in quickly, where they came from. And there was a, there was money to cover his check. And I felt good, I did something positive. And it was good to know that we helped somebody in a positive way. These are some of the lessons that I've learned out of being in business. And we see it in business so much easier than in, in everyday life. Because we're on the edge, we're always on the edge. And things change. If we look at the last couple of years, things have changed change dramatically. It's like like you mentioned synthetic lab grown diamonds, that a man has finally reached the ability to recreate gem quality diamonds grown in a lab. There are two different methods. One is CVD, which is carbon vapor deposition, and one is HPHT reaches high pressure, high temperature, two different ways. But the end result is the same diamond, exactly the same as a natural diamond that God put into the earth and grew there. And so there is a sense of trust. And for quite a while I decided no, this is not for me. I don't want to touch it. But you are in business, and customers demand. So do you deliver you don't deliver. And ultimately, I made a decision. No, I have to deliver. But I will do it better than anybody else. And I applied all our patented technologies for cutting and maximizing live performance in all the studies. And so yes, we have amazing lab grown diamonds that people who want to buy a less expensive stone and don't want a natural stone. They'll buy it. We keep them very separate. We make sure that they have identifiable features, we laser engrave the girdles with lab grown and that enables the customers to be assured that they're getting what's right. Then on the other hand, there are a lot of people who buy natural diamonds from us. And of course, my patents are applied to those. And of course our brand name is on it and the certificate number the document their grades is done. And that's there so they are distinguishable actually have a very interesting Tiktok for those who visit Tiktok we made a Tiktok How do you tell the difference between a natural background I'm not gonna tell you the story you have to go to tick tock and see it. But it's all related to what I said above. So go to Brock if you haven't done so tick tock and tell me if you enjoy this

Matt: 43:31

Are you dancing in the video just tell us now because everybody's gonna go if you tell me you're dancing,

Brian Gavin: 43:35

I have a dancing now that that's a separate one. I'm not the best dancer. But I describe what's the easiest way to tell the difference between a natural diamond LeBron because you can't see with your eyes because they both chemically diamond like both crystallized carbon and you have to tell the difference in a lab in order to tell the difference, but there's an answer. So it's not a dancing answer. Check it out.

Felix: 44:03

Well think about think about a dancing tic tock I think that's more of a suggestion for you got it all right now you could use like, computer generated so you can have a chat GPT facsimile like a like a lab grown animation of yourself. Almost Brian

Matt: 44:22

Gavin, do you have any promo codes for our listeners? I certainly will do we will announce it on the podcast. I'm looking forward to sharing that with our listeners so everybody can get a Brian Gavin diamond for their loved one.

Brian Gavin: 44:33

Come up with a good idea mag comm uses that promo code if they don't have a gate of trust book will pay for it. Wow.

Matt: 44:41

I want to throw up my entrance book just so I can get a new

Felix: 44:47

you don't have to buy diamond though. Matt.

Matt: 44:48

My wife gets a diamond.

Felix: 44:50

I get to your wife gets a diamond you got a new book. Sounds like a good deal. Everyone's happy.

Brian Gavin: 44:54

You know, you know there's three of us together. We have to uplift the world around Does so if that's what it will take to make that final uplift and let's do it.

Matt: 45:05

That's beautiful. Thank you. Okay.

Felix: 45:07

But don't tell my wife Matt. Good. Good for you, Matt.

Brian Gavin: 45:14

Right Felix will give you a good deal.

Yossi Pels: 45:17

Thank you for listening to the gate of trust podcast. If you enjoyed today's episode, please subscribe, leave a rating and share the podcast with the people you love. To access today's show notes asked Matt and Felix the question was suggest the gate of trust story to be featured on the show visit gate of trust.org forward slash podcast