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The Father's Business Podcast
The Father's Business Podcast
Summer Series: Safe in the Father's Heart-Wrestling with Trust
Trust. Such a simple word, yet one that carries profound complexity in our spiritual lives. When life delivers uncertainty, disappointment, or pain, trust becomes the battleground where faith either withers or flourishes.
We explore trust as "an active expectation of seeing God show up for you." Rather than listing religious duties, Jesus pointed to belief—or more accurately translated, trust—as the foundation of our relationship with God.
But we don't shy away from the hard truth: trusting is difficult. We compare broken trust to a shattered glass jar that takes time and care to reassemble. Our brains catalog painful experiences as protection mechanisms, making trust biologically challenging when similar situations arise. Add emotional wounds and spiritual warfare, and it's no wonder many of us struggle to surrender control, even to a trustworthy God.
What makes this conversation unique is our vulnerability about our own trust struggles. We talk honestly about the tension between knowing theological truths about God's character and reconciling those with painful life experiences. We acknowledge the difficult questions: How do we trust when prayers go unanswered? How do we rebuild faith after devastating loss? Listen now, and discover how even faith as small as a mustard seed can transform your relationship with a Father who is endlessly patient with your journey.
The Father's Business was founded by Sylvia Gunter to encourage people to a deeper relationship with God. I'm Elizabeth Gunter Powell.
Speaker 2:And I am Kimberly Roddy. Welcome to the Father's Business Podcast. We are so glad that you've joined us.
Speaker 1:Welcome back to the Father's Business Podcast. Everyone, kimberly and I are so excited that you're back with us this week as we continue our summer re-release of our Safe in the Father's Heart series. Today's episode centers on one word that packs a lot of complexity, and that is the word trust. And, if we're honest, trust sounds simple until we're asked to do it Right, kimberly, yeah, you and I don't have any issues with control or trusting other people, do we? No, not us. It can be hard to trust, especially when life feels uncertain or when we've been let down before, whether it's broken relationships, unanswered prayers or long seasons of waiting. Sometimes trust feels a little too risky.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and the hard part of that is that trust is also at the heart and the center of our relationship with God. It's not about pretending that everything is okay, it's not about blind optimism, but trust is about having this real living belief, hope, trust, faith in a God who is always at work, even when we can't see it, and that's hard.
Speaker 1:Yeah, it is very hard because that is like you said, even when we can't see it. And that's the hard part, kimberly, you and I joke about it. Neither one of us are very good passengers. When the other one is driving, it has nothing to do with. I mean, you may say it has something to do with my driving, but mine has nothing to do with your. I don't look at you and go, wow, she's an unsafe driver. It's just my hands aren't on the steering wheel and so therefore, I have trust issues because I don't know that we're stopping soon enough. Or did you see that over there? Were you distracted? And so all of us can think about areas of our life where it's hard to trust someone else, much less a God that you know. We know he's there, but we haven't really seen him.
Speaker 1:Jesus was asked in John 6, what must we do to do the work God requires? And I've always found his answer interesting. His answer was the work of God is this to believe in the one he has sent. And when you dig into the Greek word for believe, it means more than just an intellectual agreement that, yes, I believe Jesus was sent by God. It means to actively trust. Trust is the work not striving, not fixing, not figuring it all out, not having to fully understand it before you're willing to take a step forward, but trust in a Father who is also trustworthy.
Speaker 2:And that's why we want to reshare this episode in particular. As we're doing this series, we know from personal experiences that trust is hard. Like Elizabeth just said, it's not a one-time decision. We don't decide I'm going to trust someone, or I'm going to trust God, or I'm going to trust in this, and then we're done. It's a daily invitation. Sometimes it looks like big, brave steps and sometimes it's just saying God, I want to want to trust you.
Speaker 1:And I love that. God is okay with us saying that, that if we come with him with our honesty and say I want to want to trust you but I'm struggling, that he is able to meet us in that. Psalm 28, 7 says the Lord is my strength and my shield. My heart trust in him and he helps me. And that's what we're talking about today how trust is formed, how it gets broken and how God patiently helps us rebuild that trust in Him.
Speaker 2:You'll also hear in this episode about how our experiences, like our childhood wounds, our relational disappointments, those types of things, how those can shape, how easy or how hard it is to trust. Here's the good news God doesn't shame us for those things. He knows our story and he gently invites us to lay down our defenses and our fears and our shame and let Him prove that he is trustworthy again and again and again, even when it's hard.
Speaker 1:So if you've been wrestling with disappointment, with fear, or just trying to hold on to hope because you don't really see God showing up for you the way that you want him to, we pray that he will be able to speak to you through this episode and that it will be a reminder that you don't have to have perfect faith to be deeply loved. Even mustard seed size trust is enough for God, because he will meet you right where you are. So let's listen in on episode six of Safe in the Father's Heart. All about trust.
Speaker 2:Well, welcome back to our podcast, where we are walking through Safe in the Father's Heart. Today, we are looking at trust. It's a loaded word and so, elizabeth, I would love to hear you kind of unpack that word a little bit and tell us what is trust. Yeah, as we're writing this book.
Speaker 1:Trust can mean a lot of things to a lot of people, but we kind of centered in on John 6, 28 and 29, when the disciples asked Jesus what must we do to do the work of God? And in our English translation it says believe. But if you go to the Greek and really look down to what that word means, what it means is to trust in God, who is able to help you. So what we must do to be doing the work of God is not all the things that run through our mind. We've got to do good deeds, we've got to do all these things. What Jesus is saying is the work of God is to trust. That's a word that we kind of toss around in culture and different things, but trust is the basis of our faith. It's basically what people say here. They go again saying it one more time in their podcast. Is what we say at the core of what we are about the father's business. It is trusting and knowing who God is. And because you know who he is, you believe that he's able to do what he is able to do. So again, it's that whole idea of knowing who God is and then knowing who we are in him and so, because I know God is a good father, that makes me a beloved daughter, and so trust is very critical to our faith.
Speaker 1:I think we throw the words faith and believe around a whole lot more than we do the word trust, because I think a lot of times we think trust is an emotion and there is emotion involved in it. But trust is really a choice. It's I am going to choose to anchor myself on who God says that he is and that he is able to come through for me. One of my favorite verses and I mean honestly it's one of my favorite verses because it's the verse that mom prayed over me while I was in the womb for nine months is 2 Timothy 1, 2, which says over me while I was in the womb for nine months, is 2 Timothy 1.2, which says I know who I have believed in and I am persuaded that he is able to keep that that I have entrusted to Him against that day. And so that's the two parts of trust.
Speaker 1:It's I know who he is and I know that he is able and I trust that he is able, that he is going to be able to come through for me. So it is an active expectation of seeing God show up for you is really the basic way that I know how to describe what trust is. But it's not easy to trust, and so that's why another very familiar verse that we all probably can recite if I started, everyone else could finish. It is trust in the Lord with all of your heart and lead not on your own understanding, but acknowledge him in all of your ways, and he'll direct your path. And so we're commanded to trust. If you have a copy of the book, in the back there's an appendix where there's over 45 verses about trust and trusting God and what trust does for us, and that we're commanded to do so Because I think God understands that it's so easy for us to lean into our own story and our own understanding instead of trusting who he is.
Speaker 2:Can you repeat what you said about trust being active?
Speaker 1:Where the word active comes in. It's an active expectation of God showing up for me. Trust is not a one-time choice. I don't say, god, I trust you, and then it is an active, continuous, kind of that come and keep on coming that we hear in the abiding with Jesus. So it is an active expectation of seeing God show up for me and trusting that, whatever circumstances I find myself in, god is in them and he is active and he is working. And so sometimes for me, trust is a minute by minute thing. When life gets hard, trust gets hard, and so it's continually reminding myself who God is. And okay, not only is God all those things, because it's easy for me to believe that God is all those things for my friends, but God is, this is who God is for me, and that he is actively involved in the details of my life.
Speaker 2:What is the difference between trusting and believing?
Speaker 1:because they're obviously related looking through scriptures is that there are you kind of looking through the scriptures where Jesus says believe in this and trust in that Belief is just belief in a truth. I can believe that the world is round. I can believe that gravity is real. Trust is a deeper word where it is specifically about as far as in scripture. When it says trust as far as in scripture, when it says trust, it's talking about not only do I believe God is, but I have anchored myself, I have secured myself, I am assuring myself that God is for me, god is still working, god is still active. There's more of a relational piece to it than the word belief, cause I can believe in God, I can believe there is a God. A lot of people will say that, well, I believe there's a God, but do you have a relationship with him? That that's a deeper level thing, and trust comes over time. And trust comes as I allow myself to open myself up to another person or to God and let them prove to me that they are trustworthy.
Speaker 2:Which is where trust is hard work.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so. So, kimberly, let's talk a little bit about why is it hard to trust?
Speaker 2:I mean it's hard to trust because we get hurt, and I heard a illustration one time about if you have a glass jar full of marbles sitting on the table breaking trust is like when that glass jar gets knocked onto the floor and crashes into a bunch of pieces and it takes time to put it back together. You don't just pick it back up and set it on the table and you start trusting again. Trust has to be rebuilt right, which takes time, and time is the great healer. And so what does that look like with God? I don't know that. It looks a whole lot different than it looks with people.
Speaker 2:As far as just it being a process, I think that in theory, in our belief system, god has proven himself and we have facts and we have truths that have withstood the test of time historically, but maybe not always experientially. That's where it seems like it would be easy I'm using air quotes here that no one can see where it would be easy to trust in god. Right, but trusting god, that's kind of trusting in god versus trusting god, or slightly different nuances.
Speaker 1:Yeah, right.
Speaker 2:And so there's the part where we you use that word like an active expectation earlier a little bit. There's this we hope and we long for and we trust that God is going to do things. But then we have expectations. We trust that God's going to be something to fulfill, something to come through in some way, and yet he doesn't always do those things in our practical lives. And that doesn't mean that he's not true to his character, right, but there's a wrestling in that.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:There are things that happen that don't feel loving or good, but that doesn't mean that, in the bigger scheme of things, that they aren't or maybe they aren't good, but God is still good. And holding the tension between those things is really difficult, and I think it's you talk about this in the book it's a risk. It's a risk to trust, because in order to trust, we have to let go and allow the other person to prove themselves.
Speaker 1:Yeah, that's hard.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and so it's like I can look at scripture and if I hold, if I hold scripture to be true, then I then I believe that God is trustworthy, yeah.
Speaker 2:But then I look at stories in scripture where they didn't necessarily know they could trust God in the middle of it, and that's where we live we live in the middle of the story and so, first off, letting go is hard, and then giving the other person a chance is hard, and then, knowing that the other person's going to have to prove themselves, knowing that the other person's going to have to prove themselves Right, letting go, I think, looks like I think you kind of alluded to this earlier like leaning into who God is, leaning into faith, leaning into belief. What does Hebrew say? Faith is the evidence of things not seen, you know, you think about, like a trust fall.
Speaker 3:We do those exercises sometimes oh.
Speaker 2:I hate those things. Yeah, most of us with control issues do hate those things, right? Yes, that's the reason I was always in youth ministry where I could let other people I would lead the time for the students to do the trust fall.
Speaker 1:I didn't have to do it, of course. Of course I would facilitate them all day long. Other people need to do trust falls, just not me.
Speaker 2:Right, right, because there's an issue. In a trust fall, you stand there and you say, okay, I'm going to fall backwards and trust that you will catch me. Yeah, and that is a difficult, to say the least, thing to do, because it is a releasing, it is a letting go and, like you said, it has to be a choice. I know many people that you want to do a trust fall exercise. They're like no thanks, I'm tapping out.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I'm not going to do it. Yeah. And then God is kind of the same way with us. You know he doesn't impose himself upon us, but he invites us to trust. He invites us to anticipate that he's going to be good, regardless of what we see going on around us, and he invites us to believe the best about him and his nature towards us. But that's hard because I mean honestly, if trust was easy, no one would ever worry.
Speaker 1:My theology is solid. I know God is all powerful. I know he is faithful, I know he's a good father. Like I can rattle off 30 characteristics of who God is. But in the day to day moments when I'm not sure what's going to happen next, that's that's hard. Just to go to hold on to that, and I think that's where we have to continually preach to ourselves a lot of times and I know I of okay, are you going to let yourself get wound up in worry and fear? Or are you going to once again put this on God's shoulders and say you've got this and I just need to rest in you and be your beloved and watch what you're going to do? And easy said, hard to do, as we're talking about, because I am a president of the Control Freak Club, so I like to know the control freak club, so I like to know what's going to happen. I like to know when it's going to happen and how it's going to happen, and so it's very hard for us to let go.
Speaker 1:And as you said, kimberly, because we've been hurt before, and part of that we talked about this in the in the orphan heart podcast.
Speaker 1:Our brains do a very good thing for us because it helps protect us, but it's also to our detriment that our brain catalogs all the experiences that are the same and the same little neuron chain in our in our minds, and so it's very hard to trust when I am triggered or I am entering a situation and my brain is going. We've been here before and the last time this didn't turn out well. And so then you've got you know your own biology and your own emotions and you know discouragement from the enemy, like you've got layers of stuff trying to come against you, because the last thing the enemy wants is for us to trust that he's a good father and he's going to be there for us. He's been doing it since the garden when he tried to tell Adam and Eve God's holding out on you. He can't be trusted. It's a nice, good, clean word, trust, is it to say, but much, much, much more difficult to live.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I'm sitting here in front of a bookshelf and there's a book directly in front of me, two books one called when Is God when it Hurts and another called Disappointment With God, both by Philip Yancey. And there's been books written on this right, right, because it's a real issue and people ask the questions. There's been things written on it and so it's scary and I think I mean we have to get to a place too where we I don't know. For me it's like I want to just be committed to wrestling through these things, meaning I want to. I trust God enough that I want to wrestle with him when I don't trust him.
Speaker 1:Right, Like I want to.
Speaker 2:I want to lean into my faith. I mean, wrestling is not easy. There's a lot of people out there right now talking about deconstruction and it's a popular again air quote kind of thing. Here it's a. It's a thing again air quote kind of thing here it's a thing on social media in a lot of circles and I think that's just because of just the storyline in America that we've had going on of the Christian church and that kind of thing.
Speaker 2:But when you look out, throughout history people have deconstructed for centuries. The idea of deconstruction at its base level is a good thing, because we need to be deconstructing these ideas that have just been thrown at us and we need to own them and we need to reconstruct them according to God's word. We need to take apart God's word, we need to look at it, we need to investigate it, we need to have these conversations and go okay, trusting is hard, but I don't just give up trusting. I mean, let's be honest, in the relational world there are people who, where trust has been so broken, they're out. Tap, I'm out.
Speaker 3:Right, I'm out.
Speaker 2:And that's okay, Because there's a lot of different stories out there. I'm not judging that, I'm just saying that's a real thing. That happens when sometimes we've been hurt too hard. I'm out and I had friends in my life over the seasons where I have really doubted God and I have questioned his goodness and his character and who he is, because of deep hurt and deep loss and people have said don't lose your faith. Don't lose your faith For me. I want to be committed to reconstructing in those moments.
Speaker 3:I want to be committed to God.
Speaker 2:I want to wrestle this out with you because I do know I have seen. If I look at the holistic picture of my life, I have seen not just my life, my, not just my personal life, but my lived life of seeing other people's stories as well. I have seen the goodness of God in the land of the living right. And when trust is hard, I think we have to go back to I'm thinking of the movie with Bill Murray. We've got to take baby steps, you know. And there's just this okay, like Matthew 17, 20, if you have trust as small as a mustard seed, you can move mountains. So I had a friend in college one time trust me. Can you just say that you want to want this, that you want to want to trust God. Can I just get there Right? It's a small prayer, such as the one in the book that's written God. Thank you for sustaining my heartbeat through the night and waking me this morning.
Speaker 1:Yeah, if that's where you need to start, that's where you start.
Speaker 2:Yeah, because God's not seeking perfection. Sometimes we are, depending on how we're wired. It's all or nothing at times, but it's got to be smaller than that. It's just got to be a willing heart that's willing to take a chance and say I want to. I was using the word reconstruction because I think that could be a popular term out there right now just to use that and reframe that a little bit. But I think really what that saying is I just want to have a willing heart to to look at you and to look at who you really are and to try to trust you again, because I think we can also look at those relationships in our lives where trust has been broken and the relationship doesn't have to end.
Speaker 1:Right.
Speaker 2:And we say, okay, I want to trust you again. But there's moments where we're driving in the car or we're alone by ourselves and we have to relive the hurt, just internally even.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And and those are real, felt, genuine experiences and in my life when that happens, I have to go. Ok. If that that person has asked me for forgiveness, I have forgiven that person has asked me for forgiveness, I have forgiven that person. The trust has been broken, but we're going to pick the shattered vase up off the floor and we're going to try to put it back together and hopefully it's not too shattered that you can't put it back together and I think that God is big enough to be patient with us and he's the one who has done the see. This is the interesting part. Right, like trust is work, but he's also done work. Yeah, right, right.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and that's what I was just thinking. Kimberly is, yes, we have to be open, but God is the one who can reparent all of us.
Speaker 3:All of us have had wounds.
Speaker 1:None of us have ever. No one who's ever walked on this planet has ever had a perfect mom or dad.
Speaker 2:Right.
Speaker 1:We all have parenting wounds, and so we can allow God to supernaturally come in and allow him to heal and repair and, as you're saying, he can put that vase back together better than anyone can. You know me and some super glue we're not going to get very far, but God can restore that glass face to a point where you can't even see that it was ever broken. Our part is that mustard seed, part of being open and willing and saying I'm going to choose to think on the goodness of God, because we all have a choice, just like you were saying, when you're in the car and something comes up, either you can keep rehearsing that pain that's coming to your mind or you can choose to say no, that's been dealt with and let it go. So in our relationship with God, we have a choice to either keep rehearsing the pain of all the times that we've been wounded in our life or, as those come up, bring them to God and say God, I want to hand this to you and in exchange I want to rehearse the times that you have been there for me in the past, because the times you have shown up for me and get yourself a little list going of, and sometimes you just need to. That's a great part of rewiring your brain, both in a relationship with God and with others.
Speaker 1:I remember in marriage counseling they would talk about how, when you get in conflict, you know you're in a really bad place when you can't think of three things that you like about the person.
Speaker 1:And so sometimes, in the midst of being angry at someone, you should stop for a minute and go okay, yes, this is an issue over here, but what are three things I like about this person right now?
Speaker 1:And there's something that happens in the wiring of our brains and in our emotions when we take a time to stop and reflect on the goodness of a person instead of always focusing in on the negative. And so in my family growing up and even as I'm married now, we have kind of a routine where we don't do it every day. I wish we we don't do it every day. I wish we could remember to do it every day. But often we'll ask each other where did you see God today? Just as a way of pausing at the end of the day and knowing that God was in our day all over the place. I got home safely and wasn't hit by a car. That's God's protection. There's so many things that we take for granted, and so just really refocusing our hearts and reminding ourselves of the goodness of God will be a huge part in reparenting us.
Speaker 2:Sometimes it's been too hard to trust again. And that's where I say take some of those baby steps, look at all right, can I see God today? Can I see Jesus at work today? Sometimes Jesus is easier to see than God, but we talked to you about how Jesus points us to the father Right, so you don't have to get there right away. But sometimes it's easier to see Jesus because he was a human who lived on this earth and there's a history there that we can look at. Sometimes it's easier to see God, sometimes it's easier to see the Holy Spirit.
Speaker 2:Wherever you are in that journey. Can you say, like you just said, elizabeth, where did I see God today? And let that be a part of rebuilding the trust, reconstructing your faith, whatever phrase you want to use there, because God, your father, he asked you to trust that he loves you. He asked you to trust that he's with you in this very present moment. He rewards those who seek him. He continually gives the wisdom that we need. He hears and he answers our prayers. He will provide in the future. He is directing us and living his life through us. He is working all things together for your good, and that's the truth of who he is, whether our experiences or our feelings line up with that in the moment doesn't remove the truth of those things, and that's the tension and believing and having faith and trusting.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I, just from my own personal experience, want to share. He is so patient, so so very patient.
Speaker 1:I remember one time in particular, about 10 years ago, there was something very painful that I had been carrying in my own heart for a long time. And as I was spending time with God about it and praying through it, I just felt him say do you trust me enough to give this to to me? And I and I, I said honestly, I don't know. I you know, I don't, I don't know. And what I just sensed him saying to me at that moment is like would you give it to me for a day, let's just just for a day. Would you let me carry this today?
Speaker 1:And I remember I was like, okay, but if I don't think I laughed that I was so bold to talk to the God of the universe. I was like, okay, god, I'll even give it to you for the weekend, but if I don't think that this is right, then I can't give you more than 24, 48 hours. And I remember as I prayed and I truly released that to him and said I'm not going to hold on to this as a way to protect my own heart. Sometimes we hold on to pain because if I hold on to the pain, it almost becomes a shield where I'm not going to get hurt again if I hold on to this pain.
Speaker 1:And so I remember handing it over to him and I remember how much lighter I felt in my emotions, even the muscles in my shoulders and neck calmed down. But there was still this little part of me going are you going to take care of it? Really? And he's so gracious, he doesn't command, he doesn't say get your act together, he's just like okay, sure, let's make an agreement for 48, 48 hours, and after that time there's as you're you talked about Kimberly being in the car and things come up.
Speaker 1:There are times when that continues to bubble up and I kind of want to take it back and hold up my shield again to protect myself and I have to go. Okay, no, god, I'm going to continue to trust you and he's so gracious and he's so kind and he's so patient because you know God's got all the time in the world. He's outside of time. So, whatever pace you need to go in your own healing through all of this, he's all right with it. He's not patting his foot and looking at his watch and saying would you just hurry up. He is willing to stay with you for as long as it's needed.
Speaker 2:So, as we close out today, we have Richard, our friend and board member, who is going to be praying over us the blessing of trust and healing. So be blessed and encouraged with these words.
Speaker 3:Blessing of trust and healing. Father God has promised that he will never leave you or forsake you. He has not abandoned you. His perfect love casts out all fear. Rest in his love. Receive from your heavenly Father all the Father's blessing that you craved from your earthly Father. Be blessed with life-changing encounters with the father heart of God. Be blessed to receive his perfect healing that can make you whole. Allow him to bring healing, recovery and restoration of your broken trust. Your father's best healing work restores your heart and soul according to His design that he had for you before he laid the foundations of the world. As you drink in your Father's love, he will re-innocence you, restoring your childlike faith and trust.
Speaker 3:Respond this way, god. I choose to trust you today. I choose to believe your heart toward me is kind, good, loving, approachable and accepting. I choose to bind my will to your will. I bind my mind to the mind of Christ. I bind my emotions to the Holy Spirit for healing and alignment.
Speaker 3:Thank you for wanting to be my Father, not my taskmaster or my boss. You are indeed Master, sovereign, judge, king and so much more in your universe. How majestic is your name in all the earth. I am in awe of all you are, but you are first of all my Abba Papa. Thank you that you created me to be loved as your child and for me to love you. It's that simple. You like me and you like having me around. Thank you that the greatest blessing is nearness to you and you want me near you. Thank you for inviting me to draw near to you so that I may experience joy and peace in your presence. Thank you for your promise to hold me in your everlasting loving arms. I accept your invitation to come closer to your Father heart.
Speaker 1:I want to thank you for listening to the Father's Business Podcast. I want to thank you for listening to the Father's Business Podcast.
