Are Your Thoughts Creating More Than You Realize? The Ancient Teachings Say Yes

What if the thoughts, judgments, and assumptions you repeat every day are quietly shaping your entire reality?

In this episode of Happy Hour for the Spiritually Curious, Dr. Sandra Marie sits down with author and teacher Kay Cordell-Whittaker for a fascinating conversation about ancient wisdom, consciousness, attention, and the energetic patterns that influence human behavior. 

Kay shares her experience apprenticing for 13 years within ancient Peruvian and Egyptian lineages focused on balance, awareness, healing, and what she describes as “the truth of who we are.” The discussion explores how ancient teachings connect to modern life, including parallels between today’s world and stories of Atlantis and other advanced civilizations that may have collapsed under corruption, greed, and spiritual immaturity. 

The heart of the conversation centers around Kay’s book, The Seven No-No’s: A Guide to Awakening and Freedom, which outlines seven patterns she believes disconnect people from clarity, self-awareness, and inner peace:

•  Blind beliefs 
•  Judgments 
•  Expectations 
•  Assumptions 
•  Jumping to conclusions 
•  Arrogance 
•  Negative perceptions 

Learn more about Kay’s work, books, and workshops HERE

About the Podcast

Happy Hour for the Spiritually Curious is part of the Wild Soul Gatherings ecosystem, exploring spirituality, consciousness, healing, and the deeper questions shaping human experience. Hosted by Dr. Sandra Marie.

Please subscribe and follow the show to stay updated on new releases. If this episode resonated, feel free to share it with someone who may enjoy or benefit.

Support Happy Hour for the Spiritually Curious

WildSoulsGathering.com

Embrace YOUR Wild Soul!
https://www.youtube.com/@wildsoulgathering
https://www.tiktok.com/@spirituallycurious
https://www.twitter.com/@soul_gatherings
https://www.instagram.com/wildsoulgatherings
https://www.facebook.com/groups/669456900799583

Transcript

speaker-0 (00:03.084)
Enjoy this Wild Soul gathering production. I'm Dr. Sander Marie. Pour yourself a really tall glass of spiritual curiosity and join me for the happy hour for the spiritually curious podcast. In the spirit of happy hour, cheers to some new insights, peace, revitalization, and perhaps an aha moment that may change your life. Hi, Dr. Sander Marie here. Today, I'm joined by Kay Cordell-Whittaker, an elder and teacher.

who spent 13 years apprenticing in an ancient lineage focused on balance, awareness, and what she calls the truth of who we are. In this conversation, we explore her work around the seven no-nos, how attention shapes your experience, and why something as simple as judgment or comparison may be quietly keeping us stuck. Kay, I'm glad to have you here today.

speaker-1 (00:55.904)
I'm very glad to be here. Thank you.

speaker-0 (00:58.402)
Kate, you spent 13 years apprenticing in a lineage most people have never heard of before. Before we get started into what you teach, what actually happened during that time and how did it influence the trajectory of your life?

speaker-1 (01:15.206)
180 degrees influence. Yeah, it's definitely a major, major influence on my life. I was pretty young. I was in my twenties. I was a single mom and I was just starting back to college and I met the Hedekas. They were, they're both considered shamans and they came to this country to

find some people that they could teach that would be able to translate what they're teaching into modern American language and metaphors and understanding. As I learned the ceremonies and the ideas, the concepts, they said the teachings are very, very, very old. Before the flood, pre 12,000 years ago, before the flood.

And the Hatticas are from Peru. They're Amazonians. The other person that I met was a woman who was the lineage carrier of the pre-flood Egyptian teachings. As I got into more of the studies, understanding them better and being able to do the healings, I learned how to do the energy healings and the psychic surgeries.

of both cultures, they're exactly the same. They have their own critical ways of saying things or describing how to do it, but they are exactly the same. And what the ancients on both sides of earth there, this is so old and there was before us, before 12,000 years ago, there was a world

culture, a very advanced, technically advanced culture. They could do all kinds of just absolutely extraordinary things, but they emotionally and morally and spiritually, they were like toddlers. It was like they never grew up. They got more corrupt and more corrupt and more corrupt and more violent.

speaker-1 (03:42.01)
and power over and wanting to just control everything, everybody, the whole planet, all that kind of stuff. Everything that we see going on today, we have followed the same steps, one after the other. We're repeating. But the ancients say, we have a chance of surviving. That culture just before us didn't. They never got out of their super childhood.

corrupted, greedy, violent way of living and thinking and feeling.

speaker-0 (04:18.773)
As you're talking, this takes me to the Atlantean times. Is that what you're talking about is the Atlantean times?

speaker-1 (04:26.188)
Yes, that's one of the cultures, but it's worldwide. It's a worldwide culture. When I've studied with different people, little bits and read and heard things from different cultures, I find the same kind of teachings, the same stuff coming out all over again in the Aztecs, the Hawaiians, in the Tibetans, in the Black Africans, in the Asians.

The Australians. Everybody.

speaker-0 (04:57.528)
Yeah, it does seem like a lot of this information as it's coming out, there's a lot of ahas on how it's all related. Yeah. Even with the advancements of Egypt that I think are a little bit more tangible sometimes than when you talk about Atlantean times or Lemuria. And it is sort of fascinating how there is an incredible parallel to exactly what's happening in our times now. And that many people feel like a lot of

folks who lived through those times have reincarnated onto the planet now specifically for what's happening so that we can actually meet it at a level of an evolvement versus another level of destruction. That being said, when people hear ancient lineage or shamanic training, it can feel really abstract. You lived it for 13 years and it's still a very active part of your life. What did that actually look like?

from a day-to-day perspective.

speaker-1 (05:59.534)
That's a very good question. Their way of thinking, their patterns of thinking, the structures of what they're thinking, how they think, all the details, their ideas of what is moral, what's ethical, what is self-sovereignty, what is control over, where do you draw the line between all those kinds of things? In our modern culture, it's gotten really

muddied up a little bit. We've gotten to where we just don't have a moral compass anymore. And that's because they're literally brainwashed. They've been programmed since the time they were born. And this has been happening for 10,000 years, maybe more. It was happening before 12,000 years ago to a certain part of the population, which grew and grew and got more powerful.

And then they blew everything up. They blew themselves up and they blew each other up. Not only that, they knew better. They just, they'd heard the stories. Their own stories is that there was a group of people before them that had a civilization that was technologically very advanced, but they were so immature and so spiritually and morally, ethically, psychologically crazy and immature.

that they did the same thing. They made fantastic things and thin things the culture could do and fly and go to the moon and all this stuff. But they just got deeper and deeper in the corruption.

speaker-0 (07:43.028)
Yeah. So you've written a number of books. You've written a number of books. So did you end up writing the book that they asked?

speaker-1 (07:51.662)
They asked me to write. Yes, I didn't think I could. I had just entered college, got a full scholarship, and it was, this is a really exciting time for me. I got a very low grade on English, and a really low grade on certain kinds of science and math. My other real love, my bigger love, was art. All kinds of art. I changed my major right away.

and was an art major all the way through getting an MFA.

speaker-0 (08:24.782)
So you were into that creative side of it. So let's talk about your latest book, The Seven No-No's, the Guide to Awakening and Freedom.

speaker-1 (08:33.847)
The latest book, The Seven Nonos, it's gotten a lot of first place awards.

speaker-0 (08:40.002)
Nice. So the book, it focuses on fundamentals and patterns that hold people back. Can you walk us through one of the no-nos in a real life situation someone might face today?

speaker-1 (08:54.414)
First of all, the name is the name that myself in the Hedicahs gave to these sayings, these instructions. It isn't part of some kind of teachings or a lineage or anything like that, but in their broken English, they would keep saying no, no, no, and no expectations or no jumping to conclusions or they'd go, no arrogance.

speaker-0 (09:23.35)
All big things.

speaker-1 (09:25.326)
those are some of them. The way it came out in their broken English, it sounded really funny to me. So I would make fun of it and they'd make fun of it. But I understood, I understood the depths of it. So when I started teaching my students, that was like 33 years ago or so, I was calling them the no-nos. So that's how it got its name.

These are really, really serious. These are all about the first...

speaker-0 (09:59.508)
Can you share one of them with us?

speaker-1 (10:01.742)
Oh, absolutely. Let me give you a real quick list of the seven that I picked out. The real no-no list would go on endlessly. You could always add something else to that list. But these are the ones that I seem to get corrected on repeatedly over and over and over and over in the very beginning. So the first one is no blind beliefs. And that means

speaker-0 (10:13.644)
of that.

speaker-1 (10:28.418)
Don't take on other people's ideas and blindly believe them. And it's something that we do from the day we're born. We've got a collection in our heads of blind beliefs that it's astounding. How many ideas that are somebody else's or how many lies, how much programming have we sucked in and we've taken on and we still let that run our lives?

It's still running our lives. number one, no blind beliefs. Number two, no judgments. Number three, no expectations. Number four, no assumptions. Number five, no jumping to conclusions, which is something I seem to have done an awful lot of back then, because that was one of their favorite ones to point out to me. Number six, no arrogance.

And number seven is no negative perceptions. A negative perception would be getting caught in just a negative swirling downhill pit where everything that you see or everything that comes your way, every possibility decision, a person, anything.

There's always something negative about it, something wrong, something's going to go wrong. They're not good. That's not good. That's always going to be bad. You shouldn't do that. They're just negative about it. Everything. So the blind beliefs are all these different no-nos. We have blind beliefs that go into each one of those categories and like I said, many, many more. So no judgments. That's another one that I seem to have.

collected an awful lot of no-no talk on. The Hedekas would say, we learn to judge everything. All day long, we're judging ourselves, we're judging things, we're judging people in our heads and outwardly and saying it out loud, saying it to others, saying it about others, writing it. Now we're texting it. We're texting these horrible.

speaker-1 (12:52.128)
Nasty judgments.

speaker-0 (12:53.71)
So how could this affect someone's life without even realizing it?

speaker-1 (12:57.772)
Because every time you judge, you're throwing a dark energy at them. It's like a bullet. It's dark energy and it goes right into them, sinks into them and it hurts. It's like it grows, it metastasizes. It has babies and spreads more and more and more of its nastiness, whatever that was, into people.

When we personally get judged, we tend to feel less than. If we're judging something else, that makes us feel better than. And they described it like a ladder or a pyramid. You're always trying to climb to the top, always trying to get better than, better than others. And in our culture, a lot of us are quite willing to rip

the person off of the run above us and toss them down and then quickly jump up into their place so that we could be better than. We have this hierarchy, this concept. Our whole culture is built on concepts of hierarchy, better than and less than, good and bad. Those are just some of those blind beliefs that we've had stuffed into our head.

and they rule the roost. They've learned how to let our mind, with all the blind beliefs, be the dictator, be the ruler to keep us controlled.

speaker-0 (14:25.794)
too.

speaker-0 (14:36.984)
Can you talk a little bit about attention shaping reality?

speaker-1 (14:41.162)
Yes, that is attention shaping reality. Exactly. Wherever our attention is, we are creating that inside ourselves and we're creating it in the world right around us. We're creating it out in the whole world with everybody else. We are the creators that we are. And this violence is corruption that the wars, they start inside us.

Little wars, weird wars about all kinds of strange things. When you stop to think about it, it's really strange that we fight over these concepts, we fight over these ideas, and yet we have world wars about it.

speaker-0 (15:29.09)
think that that might be hard for someone who's sitting at home and listening to the episode to think, hey, I'm not about these wars or, you know, I disagree with whichever side that you sit on to be sitting at home thinking, well, I created this war. What would you say to them?

speaker-1 (15:50.19)
They have to just stop and look at it, be willing to look at it. That we, each one of us, we have all kinds of little wars going on in our mind, in the babble, because our beliefs are not homogeneous and they're not headed in the right directions. They're all scattered. They're about all different kinds of things. They're very conflicting with each other. And we have wars.

with ourself inside each other. And we're doing it constantly on a subconscious level, on a barely conscious level, on this mental babble level. And we act out on it. Something surprises us, something makes us angry, and we're acting on automatic pilot. Some of those beliefs, they have a whole

program in there of how we're supposed to be, how we're supposed to act and react, and what is the right thing to, what kind of face expression should you have for this particular incident or meeting with this particular person, this kind of person, or what things should you be saying or not saying or doing. We have all these automated behaviors.

the kick in over and over and over. Look at the guy with the driving down the road who thinks other people are doing injustices to him by getting too close or cutting in on him or not letting him get in the line and he's cussing them out and giving them a finger and all that kind of stuff. Those are all dark darts, dark energy.

speaker-0 (17:45.75)
So how do we create change? How do we make a difference with that? How do we resolve that?

speaker-1 (17:51.214)
We have to realize, accept, be honest with ourselves. We have to honestly examine that we do that. Domona used to say, we judge things and people so much that even we're walking down the aisle in the grocery store for the toilet paper, it's on both sides, and it's a long aisle. We're judging the brands we don't buy as we pass by. We're condemning them.

It's as dumb and crazy and stupid as that. As irrational as that.

speaker-0 (18:29.742)
For the seven no-nos, they sound simple. I mean, they sound basic. Everything that you say is, you know, that it's logical, it makes sense. But what do you think people might tend to misunderstand about them?

speaker-1 (18:46.828)
On the surface, can appear very simplistic and people can dismiss that very easily. our blind beliefs are on guard against things like the no-nos and against things like seeing the love that's in the world. The ancients say that the whole universe is made out of love. The Egyptians have a goddess name.

and everything about the story of she is the blackness of the emptiness of the void and she's just wanting to birth something. She's wanting something. And so she's birthed this unconditional love, pure unconditional love. And she fills the whole universe with it and she doesn't stop making it. She just keeps filling it more and more and more. Then she has another birthing.

And that's the goddess Neith, N-E-I-T-H, usually. And she's the weaver. She's the one who takes the love. the love is the threads and the strings and everything that makes the weaving in her loom. And she weaves the whole universe together out of love. Everything is made out of love.

every realm, every dimension, our 3D world, all kinds of other places, everything that's on our world and everything that's in our physical universe. It's all made of this love that she keeps pouring out. She's still pouring it out and filling the universe with it and filling everything else.

That is the basic nature of who and what we are, what we really are. It's unconditional love. The only thing we know in our modern culture is conditional love.

speaker-0 (20:53.506)
Yes, I would agree. Everything is conditional. I don't believe that unconditional exists in this particular timeline, dimension, whatever you want to call it. But I want to expand on the love a little bit. Kay, you've compared our essence to a song. Can you share more about that? That just sounds so beautiful to me.

speaker-1 (21:14.008)
It's a very poetic description. The Hedekas are very poetic people. Their language is very poetic. Their metaphors are very poetic. And how they describe the who and what we really are, our totality, like with our spirit, our soul, our aliveness, the totality of who and what we really, truly are. That's what they call our song.

and each person has their own song and each thing that is made in the universe, everything that we have in the universe has a song. It's all alive. It's all thinking and feeling and loving and has deep emotions and caring and it's alive. It's all alive.

speaker-0 (22:05.548)
So that's the uniqueness, no? Yes?

speaker-1 (22:08.514)
That is the uniqueness. Each song is completely unique. An individual, unique piece of creator. Those are their words. Individual, unique piece of creator. Every atom out there and every star, every human, each one of us and each one of these unique pieces of creator

is a song. It is a whole entity, a living entity. And we are so full of this love. We know this love, this purity, this unconditional love. And then everything out there, like the trees and the wind and the waters, everything has this unconditional love. And all we have to do is

Scoot those blind beliefs, all the no-nos, just scoot them aside a little bit and you can start to see it and feel it. It's not a thinking thing. You can't think it and understand it. It has to be felt. It has to be felt, right?

speaker-0 (23:22.638)
So I feel like people are starting to remember that a little bit more. It's easing and seeping in that remembrance. Yeah. And it is the most incredible sensation or feeling. It's hard to put into words. That is just an overwhelming blissfulness in your chest when that level of love. But I do want to talk about some of your other work. You developed something called the Red Door.

speaker-1 (23:47.374)
Mm-hmm.

speaker-0 (23:51.575)
For someone hearing this for the first time, what is the red door in the simplest of terms?

speaker-1 (23:58.25)
The red door is a device that I came up with using the different geometries, especially for the geometries of sacred objects and altars, sacred spaces, altars. And what they do to the energy and how they make energy move and what kind of patterns and what do those patterns do? What frequencies are they? What's that like?

I came across this guy who was talking about a bowl that's similar to mine, only he was making his out of lead, which is not a healthy thing. You don't want to mess around with that. He was also talking about a very good friend he had at NASA. The guy from NASA told him about a shape, a geometrical shape that

could heal people. It could create a scalar wave and it could heal people. And you could put things in this shape like writing or have it be electrical and put it in digitally so it would broadcast these particular frequencies, energies, or the words, the words of energies. That scalar wave

is a wave that takes information and energy from one spot, transfers it to another spot instantaneously. Doesn't matter where it is, even if it's on another planet, doesn't matter where it is. And we are seeing this in quantum physics. They talk about this connectedness, this entanglement, and we can create that. And so I started experimenting. I got some

some kind of art paper to make constructions of models of things. And I started making models of different sizes of the shape. It's a cylinder, flat sides, cylinder, but it goes down straight and at 90 degrees hits the floor. The floor is flat and it has to be a certain size in order to make

speaker-1 (26:23.244)
the scalar wave. If it's too small or too big, as these waves of energy are crashing around, bouncing off the walls, they won't be able to make the scalar wave. When they do make the scalar wave, it's as though what you put into the center just disappears. And they could do that electronically. They do that in labs, but they're trying to send

things like voices and digital material. I was working with healing energies, the healing energies that I was taught by the Egyptian woman and the Atticus, and translate that into different words, different symbols, different numbers and frequencies, the numbers of those frequencies, put those in the bowl.

and you put that with your target, who you want it to send it to, and instantaneously it is there and in their body, radiating in their body.

speaker-0 (27:36.066)
That's really interesting. I I don't, I know some, but I certainly don't know a lot. So when you're talking with the symbols and I am just obsessed with geometric sacred geometry, I think of Reiki symbols and a lot of that energy work. there's so many different aspects or modalities that come with it. So I love that you've got your own unique creation there because there's a lot of projects out there.

Big love holes.

speaker-1 (28:06.894)
The Egyptian teacher was, she herself was studying with another woman who did radionics, which is an electronic device that creates the scalar wave that can transfer them, these frequencies, through subspace instantaneously anywhere. You just have to have what they call a witness for the person. You have to have a picture of them or, you know, a hair, hairs from them and that.

something that identifies where you want the information to go and what you want it to do. She had the lady come and teach us all one time and it fascinated me. I had no money. I mean, I had no money. But I really wanted to take the class and learn and I could not afford the machines myself.

But one of my best friend, she did have a lot of money. And so we would get together and we would use her machine and experiment with it. And that helped me think with geometry. That was another piece of the pie with all those geometries and the frequencies, how to make a skater wave and how to make it go to the target that you want. And I wanted to be able to

do healings on other people and myself and maybe your pets or your garden or all these other things that you can use it for to help. That was part of my inspiration. The motivation, I didn't have any money, I had to figure out how to make one myself. So I did, yeah.

speaker-0 (29:56.632)
There you go. That's perfect. The world is full of infinite possibilities. How do you or how would you suggest people stay grounded when exploring concepts that aren't easy to explain or that you can't measure?

speaker-1 (30:14.286)
Good question. You have to know yourself. And that's knowing your song, knowing the feeling of your song. That's the very first ceremony that they teach. They taught me, that's what they teach our children. Every chance they get at the beginning of every ceremony, everything, they do a song ceremony before they get into the rest of other ceremonies that they're planning to do.

This is learning how to feel who you are, what you are, what that really feels like. And what they told me, this is how they taught me in the very beginning, is that you remember something that was happy, something, you know, either happy, very beautiful, very exciting, falling in love feeling, or a baby, a little baby kitty,

a flower that is blooming where it shouldn't be, and then it just goes, you just get this rise of excitement and love and feeling the beauty of it. That feeling doesn't come from something outside. It's not really coming from the flower that instigated you to have that feeling rise up in you.

Or when you're in love, it's not that other guy, it's not the other person. That was an impetus, started it, but that feeling of happiness and beauty and love, that's your song. That is your song. That's who you really are. And when they do a song ceremony to find your song, you get it in a meditative state and you find some happiness, you find your song.

And you feel, you just feel, feel, you end up forgetting the details of what brought that on. And you're just feeling it and feeling it. And you realize that's the real you. You remember. You remember that before you were ever born and every time before you were ever born and when you were born here, there, whatever, that was you. It's this feeling. This is that feeling is you.

speaker-1 (32:41.794)
and you can bring it into your conscious awareness at any time. You can focus on it and feel it. And they explore themselves, their song, their memories, their many, many past life memories, and the universe, their connectedness to everybody, everything, everybody else's songs. You see, you feel, you perceive.

the connectedness, how intimate it is, how just intertwined it is. We're connected that way to everything. And when we have a song ceremony, we're deep in focusing on that feeling. And we could explore it. We could go in any direction we want, any history, any memory on this planet, on another planet, on a nebula somewhere.

Where stars are being born or...

speaker-0 (33:43.062)
For someone who is curious but skeptical, where would you suggest they begin without needing to believe anything upfront?

speaker-1 (33:51.064)
Well, any of the books, any of my books, the new one, the no-nos, it's out and available and it's easy to comprehend, it's easy to follow, and it's step by step by step. And we have my website, kasasi.com, world in balance.com. Both words will take you to the website. Everything is there, all these descriptions and.

All the different books are there that you could order. And all the books, even this brand new one that just came out, it's everywhere. It's on Amazon. It's on all the places that you go to buy books. There's a workbook that goes with it as well, if you wish. There's a workshop that is being developed. There's a lot of free information, like on YouTube. I have a YouTube channel. I do a lot of podcasts.

And lot of the stuff ends up there on that channel.

speaker-0 (34:50.786)
I'll make sure I include all of that in the show notes. Kay, as we're winding down, have one last question for you. What is the most important thing that we did not talk about today?

speaker-1 (35:01.55)
That's my question. Persistence and the need for it. We need to, even though we think, no, I didn't do that right, I failed or I can't do it. We try, try again, maybe try the ceremony again and the practice. One step at a time. Do it over and over and over and over. And that's the way I learned. The Hedekas didn't let me write anything or record anything.

I had to try to remember it here. The Egyptian lady did. And I would go to sleep listening to those recordings of her teaching over and over and over and over and over. You have to absorb. That most important thing is not to think it or memorize those words or the pages. It's to absorb and to feel.

That's what we have to do.

speaker-0 (36:02.648)
Very nice. Well, Kay, thank you for being here and sharing your experience and perspective. This was truly unique and different. I appreciate what you brought to the conversation. Happy Hour for the Spiritually Curious podcast is part of the Wild Soul Gatherings ecosystem. To learn more, go to wildsoulsgathering.com. For all our listeners out there, thank you so much for taking time out of your day to join us. Remember, stay curious. Until next time, thanks again, Kay.

speaker-1 (36:32.268)
Thank you, Sandra. It's been beautiful. It's been fun. Thank

speaker-0 (36:39.022)
Thank you for joining us for this episode of Wild Soul Gathering's Happy Hour for the Spiritually Curious. To learn more about our guests, please go to our website, WildSoulsGathering.com. We're very eager to hear from our listeners what you thought of the episode, topics you might like us to cover in the future, your thoughts on spirituality, questions you may have. Please feel free to send us an email at WildSoulsGathering.gmail.com.

This is your host, Dr. Sandra Marie, sending each of you peace and love. Until we meet again, embrace your wild soul.