On this episode of What the Floor we had the opportunity to interview Jason Surratt, President of Tarkett Home. We discuss who Tarkett Home is, why we are doing business with them and all the other tough questions you would have wanted us to ask.
Our Walk the Plank segment focused on AC ratings and how much we love them!
Links
Tarkett Home website
Carpet Captain’s explanation of AC Ratings
North American Laminate Flooring Association website
What the Floor is a T&A Supply Company Inc original production. You can find out more about us at tasupply.com or tasflooring.com. This show is produced by Jose Morales with help from Toni Collier and Jessica Riser. Tell us what you think of the show at wtfpodcast@tasupply.com or #whatthefloorpodcast on social media to let us know what you think.
On this episode of What the Floor we had the opportunity to interview Jason Surratt, President of Tarkett Home. We discuss who Tarkett Home is, why we are doing business with them and all the other tough questions you would have wanted us to ask.
Our Walk the Plank segment focused on AC ratings and how much we love them!
Links
Tarkett Home website
Carpet Captain’s explanation of AC Ratings
North American Laminate Flooring Association website
What the Floor is a T&A Supply Company Inc original production. You can find out more about us at tasupply.com or tasflooring.com. This show is produced by Jose Morales with help from Toni Collier and Jessica Riser. Tell us what you think of the show at wtfpodcast@tasupply.com or #whatthefloorpodcast on social media to let us know what you think.
This is What the Floor from T&A Supply Company Inc, a podcast for the flooring industry. I'm Holiday Van Erem.
Michael Goria:And I'm Michael Goria. We'll be exploring the hot topics of the flooring industry with a little humor and a new set of eyes
Holiday Van Erem:How's it going, Michael?
Michael Goria:It's going well, Holiday. How are you?
Holiday Van Erem:I'm excited about today.
Michael Goria:Yeah, we got a guest.
Holiday Van Erem:Yes, we do. We have a brand new partner to T&A Supply, Tarkett Home. And we have Mr. Jason Surrett with us. How are you doing, Jason?
Jason Surrett:Doing well. Thanks for having me, Holiday.
Michael Goria:We're excited to have you. You're our first guest.
Jason Surrett:It's an honor.
Michael Goria:Careful
Jason Surrett:Might be the last.
Holiday Van Erem:We're honored that you'd let us have you on.
Jason Surrett:For sure.
Holiday Van Erem:So I'd like to have you introduce yourself. Why don't you tell us your role with Tarkett? And kind of how long you've been with them and where you're where you come from?
Jason Surrett:Sure. Yeah. So like you mentioned, my name is Jason Surrett, President over Tarkett Home, which is Tarkett's residential division. Been with the company for about eight months now. But longtime industry vet, going on close to 20 years now started off out of school on the manufacturing side, inside textiles and carpet with Honeywell and Shaw moved over into product development later on in my career with Mohawk for several years, and then moved more into the product management side, starting with Phoenix flooring, and then stayed with them. After the Mannington acquisition for a couple more years before this great opportunity came knocking on my door.
Holiday Van Erem:Wonderful, you're an industry vet, bouncing around all over the place, like most do.
Michael Goria:For sure. Can you go into a little bit of kind of who is Tarkett and then why you've kind of been rebranding recently, I believe to Tarkett home.
Jason Surrett:Yes, it's a little surprising at the retail level, how many individuals for we're just kind of unknowledgeable of just how big Tarkett is. So you know, Tarkett as a corporate entity, we're actually the third largest flooring manufacturer in the world, over 12,000 employees sell in over 100 countries. And pretty much every single product category really have a strong position, particularly on the sports side with with turf and sporting fields. And then, domestically, for the most part, I think a lot of retailers hear Tarkett and they think commercial. And so that was really kind of what drove us to coming out with the Tarkett Home brand was softening the images and sticking a little bit more brand presence around, hey, we also have this great residential lineup. So we saw launched the Tarkett Home name back in the fall with the website release, and then really unveiled that brand at surfaces this year.
Michael Goria:That's great. So what should make customers want to do or certainly purchase, you know, Tarkett products, what kind of separates you from some of your competition?
Jason Surrett:I think, you know, we were really going to be going forward product focused. And we've done a really good job of some innovative opportunities across different product categories throughout the years. Be it on the actual product side or the warranties and merchandising around those products and makes it easier to sell. Our ProGen products, one of the only products out there in the field that actually carries a true three seasons room warranty. And then in the sheet side, we've really got a completely different style vinyl sheet than what's out there with this textile back product that just has unparalleled rip tear resistance and actually has a whole moisture resistance mitigation series or factors on the TruTex line.
Holiday Van Erem:That's awesome. So I just want to touch real quick on kind of why T&A Supply partnered with Tarkett and why Tarkett wants to partner with T&A Supply, I think we have a lot of a lot of things in common. Tarkett being an extremely old company that's been around the industry for a very long time over 100 years. And you guys have facilities all over the United States and in other parts of the world. Can you touch briefly on where are some of the manufacturing facilities?
Jason Surrett:Yeah, so specific to T&A most of that, or a lot of that is actually coming domestically or within North America. So the vinyl sheets made right outside of Montreal in Farnum, Canada, little province in Quebec, then they're probably closer, if not over 100 years starting on the linoleum side before moving over into vinyl sheet. And then our residential wall base Johnsonite products that you carry from the commercial side all come out of Ohio, the Chagrin Falls, middle filed, kind of all the suburbs of the Cleveland area. And then in Alabama, we have domestic LVT production. So really kind of smattered across product categories, and multiple areas of the US. And then of course, we've got carpet, right here in the carpet capital of the world, northwest Georgia.
Holiday Van Erem:Yeah, so a lot of different product offerings, which is one of the reasons I think that T&A Supply felt really comfortable partnering with Tarkett. Obviously, you've been a name in the flooring industry for a long time. So we felt comfortable working with you guys just by reputation alone. But having the opportunity to partner with a new manufacturing partner that has lots of different flooring options, sheet vinyl was obviously something that we really need a different new partner for. And you guys have a fantastic product. And we'll talk a little bit more about exactly what the sheet vinyl program entails having some access to some new carpet options was really exciting for us, and then the luxury vinyl options to the ProGen and NuGen products. So I think we felt really comfortable saying yes to Tarkett and you know, looking for a new partner. And we've obviously worked with your commercial side for a long time and different facets and parts of our business. So it just felt like a really great fit. And I I think Tarkett felt that same way. Would you agree?
Jason Surrett:Oh 100%, the reputation of T&A in the Pacific Northwest, we were looking for new new opportunity new partner in the in that region. And so we were already doing some business with the Johnsonite brand on the commercial side, it just felt like a natural fit. And so far, we've been really pleased with the partnership.
Holiday Van Erem:So let's start with sheet vinyl and go a little bit deeper into what Tarkett has to offer. And then what T&A Supply is stocking and what our local programs are going to be. And so why don't you explain to us? What does the sheet vinyl program cover? What kind of options do we have? When it comes to what's in the displays. And then we kind of hit upon some of the products, that T&A is stocking that maybe aren't in the displays.
Jason Surrett:Yeah, so the display is kind of set up with four major categories kind of your good, better, best of your typical vinyl sheet, I'd say our design team really is second to none. So you really got some on trend brand new design aesthetics, and in different stones, abstracts and wood visuals. And then one thing that I think the display part really sets us apart compared to our competition is that textile back product that I mentioned earlier. So TruTex, rather than being your standard overall fiber product has this, almost like a needle punch type of material. That's this textile back and that allows customer they can certainly glue it down. But if it's loose laid and allows any type of moisture that was coming up, particularly if you're in an area that that's prone for moisture problems, it allows that water to come in into that textile back and actually dissipate and go out across the loose laid product over towards the baseboards and then evaporate. So it's really unique solution that for mold, mildew issues. And it's something that again, it's kind of second to none out there on the market right now.
Holiday Van Erem:Yeah, that product is really interesting to me. Is there any other product in the market that has that textile backing on it?
Jason Surrett:The only one that I know is still our products. So we sent we sell such great response from that and that's a kind of a more higher end luxury product that another one that that you'll be stocking that's more geared towards multifamily what we found after the we were really going after that mold and mildew issue is that that product just has superior tear strength. So we created a slightly thinner product that's still got great overall wear performance. But it comes in at a more affordable cost point cost standpoint so that we can have a good kind of top of the line multifamily product and that that collection is called TritonTuff, but as far as the rest of the industry. I'm aware of anybody else has a product like ours.
Holiday Van Erem:Yeah. Yeah, that's really, I just I really like the fact that everything's glass back, it makes that story really easy. Everything's display can be installed with the same adhesive with the same seam sealers, there's not a different story for different collections. But then you've got some of these cool upgrade options and the display with you know, they have their own little story behind them. But I love that everything's really consistent. And you're you're walking through the whole display, and it's just upgrade upgrade upgrade.
Michael Goria:Yeah, it was some great innovation. I mean, that's, you know, we're looking for that we're constantly looking at how do we differentiate ourselves from our competition, you know, and products like that are just excellent for our market.
Jason Surrett:It makes it makes it so easy as a sales rep to go in there show the retailer and the retailer to show the consumer, you can roll up one of those two products and literally tell them, like try to tear it I mean, to tear strength is unparallel so that they know they're getting a quality product that's going to perform well.
Holiday Van Erem:Here, I think we had, we had the samples, I went out of the Market Expo about a month ago, and we had somebody who was trying to tear it apart, came pretty close. But there was a lot of strength there, really ripping on it. So it definitely stands up to that test.
Jason Surrett:Go back to the old school days, if they rip that we've got to get the thick telephone book and see if they can do that.
Michael Goria:Yeah, absolutely. We'll put them on the road as a sideshow, yeah.
Holiday Van Erem:So we've got a lot of different products that we're stocking for T&A's sheet vinyl in stock program, I think we're at like, 45 skus that we've chosen across several different construction options. So we've got a couple of the TruTex items. We've got Custom Pro and Starters. So those are and correct me if I'm missing anything, they're kind of your builder grade lower end products, but still glass back and 12 foot rolls. So it's still really great product overall. We've got a handful of those, and then it works its way up from there. So we've got some Fresh Start items, lots of Easy Living, which feel like can you kind of give us the specs quickly on Easy Living? It's kind of the best of everything right in the middle, isn't it?
Jason Surrett:Yeah, that's like right in that better category. So you got a little bit better wear layer, it's got a little bit of more air kind of blown in. So you got a thicker cushion, good, great under comfort, feel as far as walkability on it. So it's just that like, from from your bottom end up to the higher end with kind of the Cadillac of the series with a Lifetime, just right there good, good, affordable price point with with kind of the best of both worlds from a performance standpoint.
Holiday Van Erem:Yeah, you've got a lot of really great designs in that display to tell your design team that they're doing a fantastic job. Is there any products in our stocking program that you think are just like the best visuals out there? Is there any specific ones that our, our customers and listeners should take a look closer look at?
Jason Surrett:Yeah, we just updated this. This last market, there's a couple of newer products inside the TruTex series. It's got a really great hex, Carrera marble, and then this kind of black slate, black marble look to it. So really unique. And then I believe they all are stocking inside of the Easy Living. There's a couple of encaustic tiles that are just really nice, fresh on, on trend product lines.
Michael Goria:Jason, do you get involved with the design team? As you guys are coming up with new products? What's your involvement with that?
Jason Surrett:Yeah, so that's kind of been my background for the last 10 years. So while I certainly got a very, like I said, I feel like my design team, particularly on the sheet side, second to none in the industry, so I don't want to get in their way and micromanage. But at the end of the day, I love products. So those are the type of meetings when we started looking at what's new and fresh, you gonna get ready to come out. That's when I get excited.
Holiday Van Erem:Yeah, that's great. Not to get too far ahead. When do you guys usually know what you're going to have coming out next? Are you now that you know the Surfaces market is over? Are you starting now working on stuff for next year? It's gonna be a little while before you guys start to really know what you're working on.
Jason Surrett:Yeah, so we really are in the process, since I came on board of building out a pretty robust product map so that were more two, three years down the road with obviously a lot of wiggle room as design trends change or innovation and technology changes when you start getting three plus years out. But it's kind of right after surfaces. We've got to add do maybe what we want to launch and then we're just kind of seeing There are there any trends from competitors or trends and type of solutions that are being asked for from the marketplace. Basically, just a few weeks after Surfaces, we're starting to get the ball rolling of what's going to be the next Surfaces.
Holiday Van Erem:That's exciting. I love the you know, as soon as you get that one big event done Surfaces, you're right off into the next one. And you're you just hit the ground running and you're going, going going?
Michael Goria:No, that's so true. I mean, it just, it takes time, right, getting these new things from conception to the market. And so you have to start early in my former life, I did product development as well. And it just, it's amazing how long it takes to really refine a product to where you can take it to market.
Jason Surrett:Yeah, by the time you add in, you know, one key thing that we do and we're going to be doing it, you know, is getting out in front of your customers getting out with you early on in the design process, and getting that voice of customer feedback from the multiple regions, to understand really what you know, there's a lot of things, you can look up design trends, and you think this is going to be the next greatest thing, but then getting it out in front of the customer, and getting that true feedback. That's how you know that you're going to have a successful launch.
Michael Goria:I got a quick question about, have you engaged the millennial generation, or Gen Z is that, uh, oh, those generations you're looking at and looking to feed product into.
Jason Surrett:Certainly, that's one where they're young. And it's interesting, we've been talking about sheet, that's one that they're young enough that they don't quite understand what the linoleum is. So there's not, we've seen kind of that generation start gravitating a little bit easier of wanting to adopt and bring in a sheet vinyl product because of the price point. Because they don't have that stigma of their grandmothers linoleum or something. But it's interesting, even from a merchandising standpoint, there have been a few color lines in the past that I've done of the way that their brains process things have grown up in the age of computers and not even though I'm kind of borderline of Gen X versus that is that rather than most people and particularly Baby Boomers, Gen Xs, you know, you read left to right top to bottom, millennials, Gen Z is a center out approach. So we've gone from media, you always have kind of have lightest, and then cascade to the darkest, where we went like neutral in the middle and then like zoomed out from that. So they like focus in and then blow out. And so it was interesting to do a couple of tests markets that traditional way. Couple other markets where we felt that our sales were coming out of millennials to see, do we see an improvement there? So it's definitely something that that population has grown, and now they're getting into an area of, you know, they're going to have income, disposable income to put towards home purchases, and we need to make sure we've got the products and solutions for them.
Holiday Van Erem:Yeah, that's a great question. I, I know, we've had conversations with customers, as we've been trying to explain to them that we're bringing on Tarkett Home. And here's what we're looking at what we're stocking, the customers will, I'm talking to them out sheet vinyl. And you know, the first thing that they say, Oh, we don't show we don't sell any sheet vinyl anymore. Hold on. Let me go through my spiel first. And then at the end, let's talk about whether you really sell sheet vinyl or not. And why if you're not, you should still be trying to because there is a whole nother generation of people out there who really don't know anything about linoleum and old school sheet vinyl. To them. It's just another flooring type. But that salesperson at the retail level, they have their own personal opinions about it. And you know, sometimes that gets in the way of them selling a product.
Michael Goria:Yeah, when we were doing our roadshows back in January and February, we would you know, walk them through the room and you know, of course LVs were popular and laminate and wood but I think one of the best responses we got was you've got sheet vinyl, you know, we they were excited that we were back in the sheet vinyl game after about a week off. You know, and when that we had Tarkett, it was a it was a big plus to a lot of our customers they've come to rely on us to have a really good sheet vinyl line be able to do local cuts. And that's a big help.
Holiday Van Erem:Yeah. And they were excited to hear that we were partnering with Tarkett. Yeah, and that was a you know, it's always a little worrisome to tell them you're changing partnerships and what you're doing next and to have most people say, Oh, Tarkett I've sold it before I know the products I'm familiar with it. I tell I'm great reputation. I'm I mean just let us know what you're stocking. It was really great to hear that feedback right off the bat and made you feel like you made the right decision. Sure. Pretty good here. Let's talk about some of the other products So, we are looking at a carpet program with you, can you tell us a little bit about what you guys have coming soon for a distributor carpet program?
Jason Surrett:Yeah, we're. So this one's kind of exciting. We're looking at a more smaller concise line so that you can start there. And I think that's going to be the, the key critical point of success for this is that most of the skus will be right there, on location, so that you can get it same day 24 hours. And it's kind of going to have a gamut of a good, better best. And both textures and patterns. So have some unique tone on tone, visuals, and what said it several different weight constructions, but really kind of trying to focus on on good bread and butter every single day use both in patterns and textures. So your standard kind of little cut on cut grids, diamond trellises, things of that nature, little tone on tone street a. And then again, those tone tonal cut palette, or we've created this whole new fiber, overall cross section within torque cat for this program. So it's just got a really good, soft but bulky hand. So one of those you really want to seek your feet into when you get into those cut costs.
Holiday Van Erem:He has said all sorts of things that don't make any sense to me.
Michael Goria:He went straight soft surface.
Holiday Van Erem:No, it's fine. It's fine. I've just don't, I don't have a lot of experience with carpet. So I'm actually really excited for us to have a new carpet program and to learn it from the ground up and really understand it really well. But I didn't notice a thing that carpet people do. And you did this in particular Jason when you came to see us in person not too long ago, but they get their samples out, and they start to rub them and scratch them and like flick all of the little pieces off. And it's just cracks me up. Because nobody else has to do that with their samples, maybe dust them off a little bit. But you know, there's just a lot of rubbing that happens when it comes to looking at carpet samples
Jason Surrett:That's something we saw during the pandemic, it was very easy on the hard surface to get product feedback and still do a survey monkey or do these zoom calls and look through but there's just something about the depth and texture in carpet. We did the same thing. And they were the ones that we thought were just going to be clear number one winners graded out the very worst. And the ones that we felt were going to be duds graded out first. And I'm like, I just don't trust this. So right during the little dip where COVID cases came down and 2020 towards the fall we took them out and a completely in burst and went right back to where we were thinking would be the best ones and and just kind of validated. Okay? While technology's great and can cut down on travel. And you know, try to keep everything moving during the pandemic. When it comes to carpet. There's nothing like digging your hands into it.
Michael Goria:There's so much to be said about that with carpet, but also just life and business in general. I mean, yeah, you can do a lot over zoom. But there's something about being in front of the customer touch and feeling the things that you're purchasing I, I often wonder that with internet sales of, you know, hard and soft surfaces, it's just so hard to select off of, you know, a six inch piece or just something that you see online, I can buy a pair of jeans and return them if I don't like it. But you know, to buy a whole floors is another thing. So
Holiday Van Erem:So let's that kind of segues into a couple other questions I had about your website. So tarketthome.com You guys have a lot of information, can you give me a couple of highlights of things that our customers can utilize on the website to help sell product?
Jason Surrett:Certainly, yeah. So we just unveiled that that website in the fall with the new brand. And I think one of the key critical things for the customer is the visualizer there on the website. So we've got pre stocked room scenes, kind of by different room types, kitchens, baths, living rooms, what have you, but also, you can upload your own room and mask out the product that you have there. So you put our actual product onto the floor and then work through different layouts of that in in that your own room. The other thing, I think is just there's a lot of how tos of best practices for cleaning best practices if you're if you're going the DIY route, and really kind of try to help you walk through understanding how to best take care of your floor, which is sometimes gets kind of buried underneath but the way that the website has those front and center within the blog Blog area I think really helps If the consumer feel comfortable with what they're getting out maintain that product.
Holiday Van Erem:Yeah, that's great. I thought there was a lot of a lot of information, all the spec sheets and data sheets that you need. I, I liked the fact that I could easily email it to myself, instead of just downloading it, I could email it or send it to somebody else if I wanted to to. So I thought that was great. And all the photos and the room visualizer seemed like it was a really easy tool to use to.
Michael Goria:Yeah, I agree.
Holiday Van Erem:So a couple other questions. We didn't really talk about this yet. But this is something that I've been trying to tell customers about is the Asthma and Allergy certification. Can you tell us more about what it is and why it's so important to turkette?
Jason Surrett:Yes, so in our sheet category, we actually have certified products that by the Asthma and Allergy board, that these products are our healthy products from an asthma and allergy standpoint certified that they're, they're pretty much guaranteed to help improve the overall room space. And when you have either asthma or allergies, that it's not creating airborne pathogens. So there, there's it's a very rigorous test. That includes understanding overall, any type of off gassing VOCs of a product, but also how it how it interacts with the overall airspace and helps to mitigate creating any of those airborne particles from actually matriculating up in the air and potentially, in your lungs. So very, like it's a very, very rigorous test. And it's something that we're excited to be able to offer kind of the only product that truly is asthma and allergy certified.
Michael Goria:Yeah, that's great. I had a quick question that kind of plays into that. Where does Tarkett's passion for sustainability come from? You guys have a real great sustainability message? You guys are doing a lot, kind of in that vein, where does that come from? from Tarkeyt?
Jason Surrett:I mean, I think it comes from the Deconnick family. I think it's just been built into the heritage of Tarkett. But that is something that you're certainly correct. corporately, we are passionate about sustainability. And sometimes well, at least for the North American market, that, you know, it's not always top and center, from what the consumer wants. on the residential side, we know that that's the best thing for, for the environment and for, for, you know, our community. So that's something that we're going to drive and strive to get better at it across all of our product categories. So, you know, to pull out any type of Red List or any type of potential harmful chemical, and we want to be as transparent and have as little ingredients as possible within our products, while still delivering a quality product that performs across different attributes. So it's, it's an exciting type of kind of mantra to have for a company enjoy trying to look at unique ways of solving solutions, without using those type of chemicals, or, you know, what we can do to help conserve and create a product that has more recycled content and be more of a more of a sustainable footprint within our overall product portfolio.
Holiday Van Erem:That's great. I love when companies have kind of an underlying mission or something that they feel very passionately about. And just hearing how it turns out. That's part of just who they are, in general. How does it feel to work for Tarkett versus some of the other companies that you've worked for in the past? Is it does the company have a different culture that you're that you were really excited about joining? Is there other things that are just different about Tarkett?
Jason Surrett:Yeah, I mean, they're, they're all been great companies. Certainly not going to pour them out any of them. But I think each of them has their own little unique culture. And a lot of times I think that's really top down driven for Tarkett, you know, we're core our corporate headquarters is right there right outside of Paris. So being a European company, little bit different thought process of the way things are going around. So obviously sustainability is a much bigger priority even on the residential side in Europe. So that that kind of is another reason how that kind of drives that sustainability message. I've been really surprised was not that the other companies didn't have things like this, but really at the forefront and continuously focused week after week of trying to, you know, share across every single group. What's going on corporately, and then really, particularly in this last week, as I forget if it's actual day, or week, but I've been pushing like diversity and inclusion. So, you know, they're really trying to create a culture where, you know, it's almost more, even though we're a really, really large entity, it's more family asked, and that, you know, we're passionate about our product, we're passionate about the people that we work with, as well.
Holiday Van Erem:That's really nice to hear, I love. I love those types of businesses. And probably one of the reasons that I continue to work for T&A Supply, that same family oriented feeling and you know, just making sure that everybody's aware of what's going on. And you know, we're all working on things together. So it's nice to know that we're working with a company that has that same culture. Speaking of partnerships, Tarkett Home specifically has been adding a lot of distributors over the last several months. And I'm curious what the what the goal is behind that, obviously, you know, more people pushing your products. But do you guys have a specific target for number of distributors you want to work with? Are you how was the expansion? And are you continuing to do that past adding T&A Supply to that group?
Jason Surrett:Yeah, I think if you look at it, obviously, we've made a lot of headlines, we've spent a lot of press releases of new distributors, what kind of gets lost in translation is the number of distributors that were pulling the product from during that. So we've really looked to enhance the overall distributor that we're with. So looking for really strong distribution partners that are, you know, wanting to take that Tarkett Home product portfolio, and you know, it really be a mainstay brand for them that they're pushing. So I think we're at the right mix of distributors. Now, I would say probably in the history of our residential platform, we've never have had better national distribution than what we have right now. So we're extremely excited for them along, obviously, with with y'all, as well, of just how well the new distributors will be brought on how quickly they've kind of adopted those products and are pushing them out on the street. So we've seen a lot of success over the last nine to 12 months.
Holiday Van Erem:That's great.
Michael Goria:Absolutely, it has to be exciting. I mean, just to be adding who you're adding, you know, had some great names in the distribution realm. So that's huge for the Tarkett business.
Jason Surrett:Yeah, it's like I said, it's kind of going a different model than where we were at previously. So obviously, it comes with its own unique opportunities. But we're seeing the fruits of that labor and hopefully helps us really take off and grow to the next steps. As we look at how these partnerships evolve over the next couple of years.
Michael Goria:Yeah, anything that we should be looking forward to for late 2022 Going into 2023 that you want to talk about. And you don't have to if you don't want to give it away, I wanted to give you the opportunity to
Jason Surrett:Oh, no want to quite give it away, you know, probably the seal of death. If I say hey, this is what we're coming out with. There'll be some type of snafu. Throughout the product development. We've got new, innovative, exciting things pretty much across every single product category. So you know, hopefully, they all come to fruition right when we expect them to but that's another thing of, you know, not putting all your eggs in one basket. So we've got several different projects kind of lined up within each of the product categories so that we'll be ready. Come come this upcoming market season with with new exciting design visuals, it's new, exciting innovation across the different product categories.
Holiday Van Erem:exciting, exciting things to look forward to Yes. Now we've changed our distributor rep here just recently to David Lowe. And I know you guys were looking at hiring some other folks to help represent her cat in this area. Where are you at with that? Do you are you still looking for people to help us out? I'm wondering if our customers will be seeing new faces from Tarkett and with our sales reps soon.
Jason Surrett:Yeah, it's, uh, you know, it's still a very challenging labor market. So we haven't quite nailed down that person yet. But but we're looking to add someone kind of how we set it up. because we have a regional business manager David Lowe, you mentioned that really kind of helps at the corporate level, and you'll certainly get out with the DSM or DSR, but we really like to put a sales rep in that area that can help with Pk's help right up right along. And we've seen a lot of success by having more of our own employees inside that distributor market just kind of helps keep keep the overall Tarkett and the you know, the different product features and everything fresh at the top of mind for for your guys. And you know, kind of helps push maybe some things that when you do the overall corporate training and PK maybe something got lost in translation or forgotten when the throwing so much stuff at them so, and that unique one on one time and seeing how they would sell our product to a customer, I think really helps your guys. So they certainly can see at least one person, if not two people that will probably be added underneath David, to help support your overall territory.
Holiday Van Erem:That's great. We love little extra help out in the field. That's always appreciated. Well, I think that's all the question.
Michael Goria:I got more.
Holiday Van Erem:You've got one more.
Michael Goria:Ive got one more, are you right, I'm gonna put you on the spot. So I hope that's okay. So I just as I was coming up with some questions I just wanted to throw out give us one of the weirdest, funniest or oddest things about the flooring industry?
Jason Surrett:That's a good question. Well, I mean, I think you just kind of you can look at my career history, where else what other type of industry can you you know, walk across the street when I left Mannington was literally going to a point in delta. And at that traffic line, I would turn right. And so the following Monday, turning left to go up to my new office with Tarkett Home, and I was like, Man, I hope I don't turn right into the parking lot. So it's weird, just how everything congested obviously the galley, the whole history and tradition of carpets, kind of how floorings got here, but it's kind of unique to this industry to you know, everybody knows everybody and everybody's kind of been with everybody at some point in time in their career.
Michael Goria:Now, that's great. That's absolutely true.
Holiday Van Erem:Yeah, make sure you don't burn any bridges.
Michael Goria:Yeah, well, hey, Jason, we can't thank you enough for your time. This was a really great thing to do. And we appreciate you giving us as much time as you did. Yeah,
Jason Surrett:we appreciate it. Happy to be your very first guest. wear that badge of honor on the Bret The Hitman Hart shirt.
Michael Goria:Well, this if this podcast this podcast lasts like we hope it will we'll have you back for maybe like our 100th episode.
Holiday Van Erem:That's awesome. Yes. Thank you, Jason. We really appreciate you having having you on. We appreciate working with Tarkett. Appreciate you working with us. And thank you so much.
Jason Surrett:We appreciate your business and hope to continue to do lots more.
Michael Goria:Good evening. You too. Bye. Now it's time for Walk the Plank. The segment where we debate some ridiculous pet peeve that only flooring industry professionals will understand but can't decide on.
Holiday Van Erem:So today's topic for Walk the Plank, AC ratings
Michael Goria:AC ratings. Yes.
Holiday Van Erem:I love AC ratings.
Michael Goria:Do you?
Holiday Van Erem:Yeah.
Michael Goria:Why?
Holiday Van Erem:Well, I feel like they're underutilized. And I'm always a fan of the underdog. And there's a clear definition. There's a ranking of them. There's testing, it fits into a specific he puts the product into a specific category and gives it a definition. Whereas some of our other some of the other things we rate products with are pretty open ended. They're not very specific. It's not mainly related to a test for luxury vinyl, it's all about the mill wear layer thickness, which is completely ridiculous trying to use that. So for me AC ratings are like a concrete thing that you can utilize to tell you how this product is going to perform.
Michael Goria:No, I think you made a really good point. One thing I learned as I researched him because I kind of thought it was more an abrasion test. But other research it is much more than that. It's several test to make sure that this floor meets that standard.
Holiday Van Erem:Yeah, I didn't realize that either. So AC stands for abrasion class. But the test is five or six different tests that have to do with other things. staining impact resistance exposure to moisture, which I didn't realize at all that they were doing some kind of moisture testing, exposure to heat and burns. And then the stuff that we think of the sandpaper. Yeah, the chair caster, that kind of stuff. I didn't realize that they're taking five or six different tests, and then ranking them and figuring out, you know, where, where it falls,
Michael Goria:classifying it in where it falls. So AC ratings are what one to five, right in the United States, we rate them one to five. I've never seen an AC one or two in the market.
Holiday Van Erem:No, and I'm sure that there are, but for whatever reason, AC one is not a bad rating. It means that it's perfectly usable in a home. Yeah. And it should just be used where you're going to have the least amount of foot traffic,
Michael Goria:right. So I read a one classification of it was, you know, foot traffic, moderate foot traffic, so ideal for bedrooms, bathrooms or closets? Well, that's a lot of the home. Yes, exactly.
Holiday Van Erem:So why AC one's really not that bad of a rating. And it's AC zero is where like, if it doesn't pass the test, then you shouldn't be buying that product. But I think you only see it advertised if it's a three or above, which isn't a three isn't necessary. For most areas of the home, you probably want to three and your kitchen, your living room entryways, that kind of thing. But a product with an AC one or two is perfectly fine for most likely your upstairs and all your bedrooms and your bathrooms.
Michael Goria:Yeah, it's interesting. He knows we've launched some new products and their AC five customers get so excited about that. But most of the time, these are going to be used in residential settings.
Holiday Van Erem:Yeah, but if the price comparison, though, right, for a product that's rated at an AC five versus a product that cost the same and it's only an AC three, because like you said, you don't really see any that are listed as AC two or one. So you don't really know if you're getting the same abrasion class, or the same pricing for a better abrasion class. And why wouldn't you?
Michael Goria:Yeah, and one thing I didn't have time to research and I would be curious if we would get an honest answer is, is there a significant price difference going to an AC one, or AC two, you know, versus we often talk about the mill rating, as you talked about earlier, mil thickness and you know, a lot of our a lot of our manufacturers say it's it's a very little difference going from a 12 mil product to a 20 mil product, even though customers think a 20 mil is so much better. Yeah. So is there really cost savings? Or is that why everybody goes with an AC three or above?
Holiday Van Erem:Yeah, so the thing that bothers me about AC ratings is that it's only utilized on laminate flooring. Yeah, but I feel like it could be utilized on so many other products, and it would give you a way to compare them to each other. Right now you're trying to sell a laminate against the luxury vinyl, and you don't have any apples to apples comparison for that you have a lifetime warranty or when you could try to compare them warranty wise, but the warranties really are, it's really hard to compare something there.
Michael Goria:Yeah, I did want see a graph that showed like an AC three is equal to a 12 mil and an AC five is equal to a 20 mil. But I would love to see hardwood incorporated into this where you could have a rating system like this, maybe you use the AC system where you have hardwood, laminate and LV all under the same, you know, rating system so we can really compare like you said apples to apples. And understand, hey, this is hardwood. So you're gonna get an AC three, the laminate that you're looking at, could be an AC five. Boy, that'd be awesome.
Holiday Van Erem:Yeah, I think we need to find somebody to take that on and champion that and take AC ratings all the way. I unless I'm not understanding the tests. And there's some reason why the actual tests are being performed could not be performed on a luxury vinyl or hardwood. There is no reason why you couldn't use that testing for those types of products.
Michael Goria:We're going on a mill tour here in a couple of weeks, we could ask the factories, why they can't use AC ratings. What tests are different? I mean, maybe get back to the listeners.
Holiday Van Erem:Yeah, I think that'd be a great idea. So let's make sure we don't forget. Okay. Let's, let's bring this up at our mill tours, we're going to a couple different types of factories so we can bring it up at all of them and figure out why they're not utilizing it.
Michael Goria:Yeah, I think it'd be great. I was interested as I read different stuff. So the AC rating was developed by the European producers of laminate flooring, it's called the EP LP you know as a way to determine durability and recommended usage. So yeah, it's a fantastic rating system. I think it's as good or better than any that are out there in the flooring industry. I'd like to see it used more. Yeah. Did you want to go through the kind of what the ratings are then and where they're suggesting using these products,
Holiday Van Erem:yeah, sure, I think that'd be really helpful. So my, my assumption is that I'm not going to throw any particular company under the bus. But I think probably quite a few products that are sold at big box stores, the low price range options. And obviously laminate because that's what they're doing this testing on are probably AC one or two. Sure. And those are perfectly suitable for residential installations.
Michael Goria:Yeah. And again, the chart that I have here is yeah, one and two, both suitable for moderate to general foot traffic and used in those spaces. You know, there's even say an AC to could be used in kitchens.
Holiday Van Erem:Yeah, well, yeah. So anything, I feel like, AC wanted to have such a bad rap. Nobody wants to talk about it. Nobody wants to mention it, if it's just an AC one, AC two, but that's perfectly reasonable for most people's homes. Yeah, so
Michael Goria:maybe it's more of a marketing story. Everybody's just pushed it to an AC three. And or again. Like we said earlier, AC three is just to manufacture it to an AC three, you know, it's just as easy doesn't cost any more money. And with the new improved locking systems, obviously, that helps with water. Obviously, technology and finish and you know, the whole production line has improved. I think laminate is one of the most improved categories in the last 10-15 years.
Holiday Van Erem:Oh, for sure, people I laminate has such a bad name that companies don't even want to call things laminate anymore. For whatever reason, I I've never understood that because I never had a bad impression of laminate as an outsider. And then coming into this industry, it was still popular when I started working in the flooring industry. But it seems like within the last five or six years, it's really, as soon as the waterproof products came out. That's when all of a sudden people felt like they can't sell laminate anymore, which is so ridiculous, but has made the laminate industry, increase their technology and change what they're doing and be more innovative. So I think that it's actually been great for the category. I just hope that people can embrace it more. It's a really great product.
Michael Goria:It is I think it's one of the most durable products we have if you have a home you know that has a busy lifestyle, you have kids, you have dogs and different pets. Laminate is one of the best products for certainly for your dollar that you could purchase.
Holiday Van Erem:We've got a handful of laminates that are AC four and five. So I mean, those are on your chart that you're looking at where does it start? commercial rating? Yeah,
Michael Goria:commercial starts at AC four. So you have kind of like commercial at AC for suitable for you know, moderate traffic and commercial spaces, obviously offices, hotel rooms, cafes, and then of course, AC five being you know, your most durable wear layer. And that's for heavy foot traffic, public buildings, department stores warehouses, I think the one thing you have to be careful about with laminate is it's always a locking system. So heavy rolling loads, wheelchairs, things like that don't do well, because of the locking mechanism. So it could hold up to the traffic. But you've got to be careful about what's been used over the floor.
Holiday Van Erem:Yeah, so I'm just thinking if I've got for my own personal home and like my kids on the soccer team, so I've got like 25 Kids always coming into my house after soccer practice. Having an AC for product for slightly. commercial traffic through my entryway is probably reasonable.
Michael Goria:You'd be just fine.
Holiday Van Erem:Probably could deal with a lot less.
Michael Goria:Well, I think we've decided we love AC ratings. Yes,
Holiday Van Erem:I think it's a no brainer. And we love them so much that we're gonna get everybody else in the industry to start utilizing them for everything deal. Absolutely. Okay. It's set in stone. You've heard it here now. What the Floor is a T&A Supply Company Inc original production. You can find out more about us at tasupply.com or TAsflooring.com.
Michael Goria:This show is produced by Jose Morales with help from Toni Collier and Jessica Riser. Hosted by Holiday Van Erem and Michael Goria. Tell us what you think of the show by emailing us at WTF podcast at tasupply.com or on social media at hashtag what floor podcast
Holiday Van Erem:WTF