Grace and Wellness: Hope, Healing, and Holy Grit with Cindy O’Rourke

In this raw, hope-filled episode, Cindy O’Rourke shares a powerful testimony of healing after devastating betrayal, spiritual warfare, and rebuilding discernment through faith. We talk about how God can redeem trauma into purpose—leading Cindy to adopt children with complex needs and launch Grace and Wellness, a med spa and wellness center in Burnsville, Minnesota with a mission to fund rescue and aftercare for trafficked children. Cindy shares how holistic wellness modalities can support the body, brain, and nervous system, and what it looks like to lead a Kingdom business with grit, faith, integrity, and obedience as miracles unfold through steady faithfulness.

Cindy's contact info:

Phone number - 612-494-6636

Grace and Wellness website - www.graceandwellness.co

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Transcript

Welcome And Mission Of Hope

SPEAKER_01 0:16

Welcome to the Hope Unlock Podcast. I'm your host, Kristen Kurtz, and I'm also the founder of New Wings Coaching. I help and empower wild-hearted and adventurous women of faith feeling caged and stuck, unlock their true purpose and potential, break free from limitations, and thrive with confidence, courage, and hope. If you're curious to learn more about coaching with me, head to NewWinkscoaching.net and be sure to explore the show notes for ways to connect with me further. Get ready to dive in as we uncover empowering keys and insights in this episode. So tune in and let's unlock hope together. Welcome to the Hope Unlocked Podcast. I'm Kristen Kurtz, your host. I pray this episode is like a holy Ivy of hope for your soul. Please help me welcome Cindy O'Rourke to the show. I'm so excited to have her here today. Um, she is actually a recent local connection, and I just love what she is doing. But before we get into the doing, I would love for you to share a little bit of, I know this is not proper English, um, but who who do you be? Who is Cindy?

SPEAKER_02 1:18

You know, I want to please God first. And so over time in my walk with the Lord, I've had a lot of hardship. I've walked um a hard path sometimes in my life, but in the end, I've always realized that God is big and he's over everything and he's for me, not against me. And when I press in with him, um, he does big things. When you when you surrender your whole life, which I remember there was a time in my life where it's like, have you really surrendered your whole life, or do you hold back and it's part of your life as long as everything is going well? And there was a time where it was surrendering my whole life. And I have to admit, I'm surprised at the hardship that came with that, but I'm also surprised at the molding that has happened with me and my walk with the Lord now and the wisdom that I carry now because of that.

SPEAKER_01 2:12

Yeah. Well, would you be open to just even sharing a little bit about that walk that you walked through? Because I do, it's interesting because that word surrender has been coming up a lot this week. And maybe somebody who's, you know, tuning in, they're they're like, oh, that sounds not sure if I want to surrender. Like, what did that look like for you? And and how did you come out of it?

When Good Ideas Aren’t From God

SPEAKER_02 2:33

Yeah. So for me, it was wanting to help children and it was reaching out in ways that I would just um bring someone my home to help. And in that walk, I learned that not every thought you have that seems good is from God. Sometimes we're tempted with good things to go on a path that actually could lead to destruction. So I actually went on a path that just seems so good, where it was my dad's neighbor who had a girl that needed help. And then the county asked if we would bring her into our home. Because everything fell into my lap to make that happen. I assumed it was from God. I'm like, how could it not be? Right. But what transpired over the next two and a half years was very, very difficult. Three of my kids were very abused. Um, the girl was possessed. Um, she was raised in a satanic cult. Um, and it got really serious and um really serious ramifications. And in my walk, that girl was removed from my home, but in my walk with God after that, um, not knowing everything that happened to especially one of my children that was abused the worst, um, for time, because until they feel safe, sometimes those things don't come out.

SPEAKER_03 3:55

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 3:55

And it was a really dark time for me. And I remember wondering how God could allow something like that. How could he allow such pain, such horrific things to happen in my family when I was trying to walk with him? And one of the things I learned was number one, I did not test the spirits like the word of God says, uh, where I was going with a really big decision. I did not ask God to show me 100% that it was from him. So I had that peace that surpassed all understanding.

SPEAKER_00 4:25

Yeah.

Abuse, Grief, And Choosing Forgiveness

SPEAKER_02 4:26

And but yet after everything, God did walk with me. He did lift me up. I got very depressed during that time because to know that your children have been abused, and then for horrific, horrific things to come forward, what happened in the night that I was not aware of was very difficult. But yet I remember a therapist telling me, um, you need to forgive yourself and you need to forgive God. And in a situation like this, actually, that can be very difficult because you're in this grief stage that is so severe and so difficult. It's really hard to do that. But she said it'll destroy you if you don't do it immediately. And it was such good advice because that means I chose to forgive myself that it happened, not that I was the cause of it in any way.

SPEAKER_00 5:23

Right.

SPEAKER_02 5:24

And forgive God that it happened. Um, and what happened was to make that choice immediately stopped my spiral. And the spiral was gonna, I think it was gonna be really disastrous for me and how I was doing. And I'm not saying it wasn't a battle every single day, every single day, all day long. Sometimes I would battle against the enemy who wanted to get such a strong foothold in my life and make me unproductive for God. Um, but I fought it. I remember I play Christian music constantly in my warfare, and I just I had a war on my hand for my children and for myself. Yeah, and then also um going forward, it was interesting because my husband and I were like, we might not ever really reach out and help children again because it was such a hard situation, but yet we did, and then we did again, and then we did again because God kept calling us to, but unlike the first time, there was a lot more prayer, there was a lot more discernment if this is truly from God.

SPEAKER_01 6:34

Wow, yeah, and and to be like, I I just want to really highlight to your story, even that you reached out for help. Um initially, was that a challenge? Or did you just kind of step into it knowing, like, I can't do this on my own. I need somebody on my side.

SPEAKER_02 6:53

It had a lot to do with bringing my kids in with someone and then taking part of the time for myself. That is really how that happened. Um, and just really wise Christian people in my life helping me understand um to just keep pressing in with God, not to turn away from him.

SPEAKER_01 7:11

Yes. And like if you even go back, like have you always had, you know, a heart to to come alongside and help children, like even as you were growing up, would you say? I I'm just always curious, kind of going back when we're children. Like, do we have like did you always have this heart of compassion for others?

SPEAKER_02 7:28

I did. I did. Yep, I did. And you know, we talked about we don't know where this podcast is gonna go. You don't know, you know, God's gonna lead what we share. I could go, I mean, I would like to go deeper in what happened with that because we're about setting people free and giving them hope, right? Yes, and this has nothing to do with my business, but it does lead up to where I am today.

SPEAKER_00 7:51

Exactly.

Suicidal Valley And Spiritual Warfare

SPEAKER_02 7:52

So, and just to be very humble about something. There was a time where my daughter was very violent as she was working through her trauma and I was starting to feel very hopeless, and I did get suicidal. So the devil did get his hand on me for a time, and I want to share it if I could help somebody else. It's often if you hear of someone being suicidal or that did kill themselves, often people on the outside of that will think, how could they do that? Or how could they think that way? Because they have children in the house, they have a spouse, or they have people that how could they, that's very selfish, or you know, how could they leave them or not take care of them? And something that um a lot of people don't realize is when you go into this dark pit and you are very low in it, and it is spiritual, very much spiritual, where you did start listening to the thoughts from the enemy that I can't make it. How could this have happened under my roof? This must be my fault, whatever. I don't remember all the details, I just remember getting to a point where I'm like, and this is what I want to share because so many people don't realize this. When you get to the point of almost suicide, you're at a place sometimes where you can't, the pain is so huge, you cannot, you don't think you can survive. You think your only answer is to commit suicide because you can't survive, you can't breathe, you can't survive another day with the pain and the heaviness. Like you can't live, you can't talk, you can't function. And I got to a point where I said goodbye to the kids I were dropping off at home and said, tell dad I love them. And no one knew what I really meant by that, except I did not return home. And the plan was that I was going to commit suicide. I could not live with the pain of what happened to my children. But again, people that haven't experienced this level of falling down that pit, it's hard to understand how I could ever think that way, how I could ever be that quote unquote selfish. So I came up with the plan. I'm not gonna share it, but it was going to happen. My husband, I found out later, was driving all over trying to find me. And um, when I was about to do it, God just like it was a yelling in my brain from him. No, you will not do this. I will lift you up. And I remember I was just sobbing and sobbing. And he goes, No, this is never my will. Never my will. You're going to stop now. And I remember I stood up, I got in my car, I drove to a parking lot somewhere, and I was sobbing so uncontrollably. I didn't know how I could still like function or live. I mean, it I wasn't the the pain wasn't lifted. And um, my husband found me. So that is a miracle, right? My husband found me in this parking lot.

SPEAKER_00 11:18

Yeah.

Renewed Calling To Help Children

Adoptions, Special Needs, And Provision

SPEAKER_02 11:20

Um, he said, I will follow your only choice is to go home, or I'm calling 911, I will follow you home. I got home, he took my keys, he was very sad. I shared with him how low I was and and what my thoughts were. And he was very, very sad. And he said, Well, you know, I have your keys, you can't go anywhere. And I said to him, and I'll never forget this, I said in tears, I said this to him. If I commit suicide, you have to realize this is not your fault. Like if someone really is going to do this, I don't think anyone can stop them. But he we prayed together and he said, I want you to make a promise to me. And God, right now, no matter what you're thinking, you will not do it. And I, on my knees sobbing, that's what I did. No matter how I'm feeling, no matter how I feel like I can't breathe, yes, I am going to not do it. I'm going, got this is not God's will. No matter what, I will not do it. So we did not have me um go to the hospital. It was decided that no matter what my thinking was, I was gonna fight. Wow, and in the next probably week, the attack on me spiritually was so strong, I had to fight like every 15 seconds I was awake. Every 15 seconds I had to say, in the name of Jesus, Satan, get away from me. I will not listen to these words. You cannot make me do this, I will not do this. God is my strength, he's over me, and I'm gonna get through this. And I had to do it. And what was so interesting is how God did not lift that from me. I had to fight it with him and walk with him. And then the next day, maybe it was every 30 minutes, and then the next day, maybe it was every hour. It probably took about 18 months that it was gone, where Satan gave up. Like, I'm not even gonna attempt this girl. She doesn't even, she won't even entertain the idea of being depressed or being suicidal, or that she didn't do things right, or that she's not good enough, or it's her fault. Like, I wouldn't even entertain those thoughts as I got stronger and as Satan gave up. So I pushed and I pushed and I pushed back and I kept reading the word of God and learning who God is in my life, and I was delivered, but it was wow, horrendous. I remember the fighting and the fighting and the fighting, and I remember my husband not knowing if he should give me my car keys back and just that walk with the Lord. But what happened when I came through this, when I came out of this, like it says in the word of God, he takes his right hand, he lifts you up and he stands you up stronger than you were before. That is what happened to me. I was never the same when I came through this. I was wiser in my discernment and what God would ask me to do. Because when you give your life a hundred percent like that, just know Satan is right there too. No, no, no. We don't want her to walk like this. Think of what impact she's gonna have. We need to tempt her, and the temptation can look really good. It can. And so I was delivered, and then we did go on to help children in the future because I knew from God that is what I was supposed to do with helping out with um Together for Good, bringing children in my home, dealing with situations actually that were very severe with Together for Good, saying only one out of 100 children don't go back home when you're volunteering your time with them for a short time, maybe like a week or a month or a few days. And I had six children in my home, and all six children ended up not going back and living at home. And that's not one out of a hundred, and all six that I took care of did not end up going back home. They did for a time, but it ended up they were eventually removed with my help of being involved in their lives. And so the director was like, Wow, God must just have you in this place for this time. And I remember being in an ambulance with one of them that was um doing very serious self-harming and thinking, Oh, do I rescue this child completely? Like I, because I had kids at home too, and then I was taking care of the other kids that were siblings, and oh, am I supposed to do this? And God said, right now, right now, in this instant, is the time I have for you to be doing what you're doing. Don't worry about the future, don't worry about what you can and cannot do. But right now is your appointed time with this child to help them, and then all the stress left. Just I might not rescue this child completely, but right now is what I'm supposed to be doing. And then just even going forward to um, I adopted three of those six kids. Um, they all have severe emotional disturbance, two of them were trafficked.

SPEAKER_00 16:34

Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_02 16:35

Um, I got them when they were two, three, and six years old. Two, three, and six, and six years old.

SPEAKER_01 16:43

I had two and three.

SPEAKER_02 16:45

Yes. And I have them almost um this spring, it'll be nine years. And have we walked a hard path sometimes? Oh my gosh, yes. With attachment difficulties, things that are so hard. Have I pushed through to help them get better? Yes, I have. My youngest has a rare genetic brain disorder. Um, she will probably need help unless they find a cure, um, or God miraculously heals her for the rest of her life. And I'm older, I'm 60. And so I'm 60? I am. I will wait a second. Yes, I am. Wow. Okay. Yeah, I'm 60. And I won't be there for her, most likely her whole life. And so part of opening this business was to have funding for her for her life so that she doesn't have to be under state care, but I can have someone in charge after I'm gone that her care is really good. I took care of aging parents and still am. And I've seen some of the things that can happen under state care. Some can be wonderful and some can be very abusive. And I don't want my daughter abused again. So I have also been very involved with health, working out in my home, just helping friends and family with many modalities. So it was just very encouraged to open something. And then God said, Go.

SPEAKER_01 18:10

Go. Those two letters. Yes. And and when was the go?

Launching Grace And Wellness

SPEAKER_02 18:16

The go was last spring. So this just happened. I got introduced to the Neuroglide, and it was so remarkable, and it helps a lot with PTSD. And I thought, we have to help other people too. And, you know, heard that that's not out in many places for people to pay a more minimum price to use it. It's in some medical facilities that's much more expensive with doctors. And then it just grew from there. Well, if I'm going to do wellness, there's not much money in that. How could I afford to rent somewhere? And then became the spa side, and that the spa side could support the wellness side because to be honest, it's very interesting how people will come in, and a lot of times I'm like, I will just treat you for free. Or I understand that's hard for you, you know. Yeah, we'll give you an extra time for free. Or I try to keep my prices lower, or I do consultations, which I really should be charging because I'm giving all this advice and I'm doing them a lot of times for free. But the whole, my whole mission is to please God and to set the captives free and to help people. And so if I can do that here, even though it might not appear that way with the Spa and a Wellness Center, that is my main mission. And so we do um, you know, the plan is to give 10% of our profits to the rescue and aftercare of trafficked children. There's a plan of who we work with, there's a plan of how that's going to work in the future. Um, and I just I know, for example, medical spas, they can bring in millions and think of what we could do to help children if that ends up happening.

SPEAKER_01 19:57

So beautiful. Tell us, tell us the name. of your I call it a business tree because it really is.

SPEAKER_02 20:04

Yeah, it's called Grace and Wellness. We're located in Burnsville. Yep.

unknown 20:09

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 20:10

Burnsville, Minnesota.

SPEAKER_01 20:11

We're we're right in the the heart of the middle of the country, right? Up in the north. Yes. Um so how did you like when you when you got this go, you know, a lot of times I remember I had a go back in 2021. And often, you know, with your spouse and family and maybe people around you, like, did you have support to go?

Discernment, Location, And Peace

SPEAKER_02 21:13

Um limited. I think my family thinks I well I they thought I was absolutely crazy because I have nine children. A fifth one was getting married at the time. And I have a lot of grandchildren. And so when you look at it that way, like I have a busy life and I'm very involved with my family and I homeschool three of them. And so it seemed a little crazy and I started in my home and then my husband thought this will never work with our family dynamics. You need to rent a place and then I'm like well I was going to work out of my home until financially I felt like I could afford to rent somewhere and my husband just felt very strongly I was supposed to rent somewhere and so when we looked at one place God said this is where you're going to be and I thought there's no way like how would that ever work?

SPEAKER_00 22:05

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 22:05

And it was so and then I did the praying and testing and it was just yeah it was very clear where I was supposed to be I love that.

SPEAKER_01 22:16

So you only went and saw one place.

What Is Neuroglide And Who It Helps

SPEAKER_02 22:18

Yeah well I had a little temper tantrum though at one point because when you when you rent um commercial usually there's negotiating and usually that price comes down and with them that was not going to happen. And I thought fine I'm going to go somewhere else I was mad. And I went and looked well I looked a lot online and then I went to look at a few more places and it was it was almost humorous. God was like what are you doing? Like what why are you wasting your time? And I was like oh my gosh fine it was kind of like that like it was just a no peace walking in those places peace that brought me to tears when I came in here.

SPEAKER_01 22:56

Yes yes well I haven't I have I haven't had tears going in your building but I definitely can feel like his hand is over it and there's peace like like dripping like oil over the whole building. Yes. Like everywhere. I I want to kind of go back a second um I don't want to skip over this part about the neuroglide.

Access, Cost, And How To Try It

SPEAKER_02 23:18

Could you maybe explain a little bit what that is um it maybe sounds like oil like some kind of oil like a glide right um tell us actually what that is and how like who who would this help and like what would this like ultimately do to like help people yeah so neuroglide is a mat that you lay on it feels like a light massage it's air chambers that actually um fit around your body and for your body type it um sets to your body as you start using it it helps with lovatic drainage it helps with inflammation and pain it really helps with the back but it does help with the inflammation in the immune system through the whole body it can help reset your immune system it um and one of the most exciting things to me is the PTSD area. So it puts you in rest and digest what which puts you in a state of relaxation and can really bring down these people with their brain where they're not used to being in that state at all. And what I have found I've used it on a lot of people that have had trauma often don't like it the first time because their body will resist that level of relaxation. They'll kind of tighten up go, I just don't know if I like that it happened to all three of my children. And then the next time they use it some of these people that didn't like it the first time absolutely fall in love with it the second time because then their body the brain body connection the brain will tell the body it's safe. It's okay to relax with this when I tried it for the first time for a shorter time than you're supposed to do I was like and I'm more of a high strung person. So within five minutes I was like what is this? What is happening? And then when I did it for the full time once which is 30 minutes I was so relaxed the next day I could function fine but I wasn't used to living out of that state of relaxation and calmness and it lasted three days seriously three days and it helped so much with PTSD that the the veterans the hospitals and the nursing homes and all those places it's going all over the country they're putting it on a lower setting to help people come out of their PTSD. Wow and how did like how did you hear about this? I heard about it from Jen Longley and she brought it over to have me try it in my home and then we talked about children. Jen and I very much want to help children and we think this is remarkable for helping children. Remarkable and everyone can try it for free the first time because we want people to experience understand it and see what it is. Not many people are going to call me unless they get referred by somebody hey I want to try the Neuroglide because it's not well known a lot of people have no idea what that is.

SPEAKER_01 26:21

Yeah I I mean I'm I'm big into like I like to say supernatural holistic health and I I had never heard about I heard it from you. So I'm I'm sure like so if somebody isn't local here to where we live um is there like a database or a website that could kind of lead people to find a location maybe in their state or country do you think?

Contact Info And Website

SPEAKER_02 26:43

Yeah I think the best would be to call our office so we can point you to the right direction which would be Jen Longly because there is a company that is working through the country and so yes I'm sure there would be connections it can be purchased so people can purchase them in their home the price does change here and there I believe it's at 4,000 right now to purchase one but people can purchase them also for themselves in their home.

SPEAKER_01 27:10

Okay. Well that's very generous of you to have people contact you and just cut kind of as we're doing that right now and talking about contact what would be the best way for somebody to contact you and I'll I'll be sure to put this in the show notes as well but if somebody's listening in they're like I can't listen any longer for now but they want to contact you what's your contact info?

SPEAKER_02 27:30

It is 612 494 6636 and that is the business phone and they will forward those messages to me and I would call them back.

SPEAKER_01 27:41

Perfect.

SPEAKER_02 27:42

And then would you just kind of rattle off your website as well in case somebody wants to pull up your check things out that is grace and spelling out and a n d wellness dot C O, not C O M, which trips a lot of people up but C O. I love it.

Early Wins And A Christmas Crisis

SPEAKER_01 27:59

Yes. Well like I said I'll be sure to put that in the show notes. Um but you know part of I think part of why I I really wanted to have you on here I I tend to have like amazing I like to say wildhearted business owners um minute people in ministry um maybe you know like me having a podcast I'm kind of an unlikely podcaster you know what I mean yes I've had people kind of look at me like you have a podcast I'm like yep yep go God right it's all on the go um it's all on your yes I would love for you to just share so you've been doing this you're coming up on it's it hasn't even been a year right correct and I walk in your building and I'm like wow it feels like she's been established for decades.

Boundaries, Authority, And Calling

SPEAKER_02 28:46

What would be and and maybe you can't obviously you maybe won't be able to share any names but um I love hearing testimonials from you know the work that we get to do and the work that the Lord calls us to like what would you say would be like one of the most amazing testimonials that you've seen come through your yes and come through your office through your business one was um I was throwing a business Christmas party here and so we had all staff on hand for that someone called um was like I need therapy right now and I am a certified trauma informed counselor and I said well you know what are you looking for? What do you need? And then I didn't think I could meet his needs honestly because he had already been to this building but it had been next door and I thought you know most likely you probably want to see who you saw before and he was stating that he had things he wanted to get off his shoulders for the first time in his entire life and he was not doing well and right now is the time and I still pushed him out well we could get you on the schedule next week I'm you know I'm doing a Christmas party and he's like right now I said yes 24 women right now I'm doing a Christmas party and he goes but I just I really am enjoying our conversation I really think I'm supposed to talk to you and then he's like what if I came over for 30 minutes could you carve out 30 minutes from you know your work with the Christmas party and I felt very led to say yes and so sure enough I met with him and it was beautiful. It ended up being beautiful I was able to point him to God and prayer and pray for him and just help him through that time. And it was just it was just interesting how if I was just in the flesh right I would say absolutely not and I'm not saying that my employees didn't look at me like you're gonna do what well I mean from from what I know about you is that kind of how how it work how it rolls though. Yes yes exactly and have you written a book yet no but I have been asked to so I think that's very interesting just what I told in the beginning of my story there's a lot more to that story there's a lot more to um kind of what happened in society with just people that worked against me um to get help and for the different people involved and so just that alone people have said you know you should write something what's interesting the the child that left my home was abused in a way by somebody that was um was high up somewhere and actually there's already a book written about that person I found out in a fictional way. Yes so kind of just very it's just very interesting how God works um and just the path that he has us on. Sometimes I want to go take down you know spiritually huge things and my husband has to go you're going to get yourself killed and not if God's walking with me and then I have to take 10 steps back and remember if God doesn't call me into that realm, into that area and I do it on my own, I'm in trouble. If I go into something because God says you are going to do this then he's doing it in front of me behind me over me. Then it's his victory and it is going to happen.

Marriage, Time Cost, And Support

SPEAKER_01 32:22

Yes I love that you touched on that because I feel like you know just even in the times that we're in there's so many I have a heart of justice. So I tend to like want to go in and you know flip tables and yeah it's like it's like well the Lord at one point I I had bought a book called Territorial Spirits. Okay. And I thought I'm just gonna help you know flip things here like in this area and um that was probably four years ago and the Lord's like no this is not yours. Yeah this is not yours you you you have you're very you know zealous and you have it hard to see things you know turn for good but you're gonna do that in a different way. So um I love how your husband just kind of came alongside you and was like okay honey yes I'm almost seeing him like yes honey yep so as as he's seen you like walk this out um how how has it been for you guys just even in your marriage with you know the this new business and has he been able to experience even some of these modalities if you're open to sharing I'm always curious because here's the deal like in my coaching I've found um especially for those of us who tend to take these crazy faith steps and maybe we're married to somebody who isn't maybe on board as much or maybe has kind of a more hesitation towards those kinds of things there can be a lot of challenges and um yet ultimately my heart is I want to follow the Lord first and foremost. Of course I'm not gonna go like do something way crazy that my husband's just like what in the world are you doing? He might say that at first but I'm just kind of curious how that's kind of worked for you because I I might have some listeners here today that, you know, they're being led to do something and you know maybe their spouse isn't fully on board but then you know you know what I'm saying like how has that panned out for you I think he was fully on board and is fully on board.

Hiring, Setbacks, And Prayerful Leadership

SPEAKER_02 34:33

I think that he heard from God like I heard on heard from God to like go and rent there, things like that. Like why are we questioning it if we got that affirmation and we know for sure it's from God. I think that the challenge for my husband has been I've been working way more hours than I anticipated and just like helping manage the home and be there and he misses me also not just the kids and just getting that balance in the future we're not making money yet. And so it's not like there's this blessing happening for our family that we're doing really great and there's like benefits from it. No, it's just really hard right like I'm gone all the time we're just trying to break even at this point. And for him it's like when am I going to see you again and I even have some funny videos where he's like I had cottage cheese for dinner and just like these funny things that happen where because he's really he's a really witty funny guy. And so I have vlog for Grace and vlog for grace is like starting a business when you have no idea what you're doing. And so there are funny videos of him on there. I was doing a talk once even in my living room I was doing a video to try to get models and he just kept snickering in the kitchen and I'm like oh my gosh Cindy do not look at him and then finally I'm like why are you laughing? And then he had all these funny comments like well I was just wondering when you were going to stop talking and isn't it more simple if you said it this way and I'm like are you serious right now? Like you have no idea what I'm even talking about. Yes. But anyways he has and he has done some things here Violet for the brain he has a past stroke he has done things for pain like terahertz energy we've all done the neuroglide and um something very interesting too is oh you know owning a med spa they they kind of expect the owners to have done a lot of anti-aging look very beautiful and to be very honest it's not me I had done nothing and I'm exploring things now which is really fun because then I can put before and after pictures like this is what I'm doing. This is what I'm trying. Yeah and for my husband too you know he's had a facial he's had um microneedling you know a lot of times it's because I need a model though like you can do this guys come in all and we have we have a lot of men that come into our spa I think a lot of it has to do with our building and what it looks like. It doesn't look like your typical feminine spa it really looks like a home and so it's very welcoming to men and women and um so yeah but he he's very supportive he just misses me.

SPEAKER_01 37:13

Yeah well I and I think like any business owner it's there is a challenge to you know have that and I I think balance is kind of I know people talk about being balanced but I I don't know I feel like balance is kind of it's it's kind of fleeting yeah it's juggling right I feel like it's juggling so you know just even in your time has the Lord shown you like different ways to um juggle like rather than juggling 10 balls you're able to juggle like three and have somebody come in and help hold the other seven balls while you're doing the three like what does that look like for you?

Financial Pressures And Faith For Provision

SPEAKER_02 37:52

Yeah I have a lot of really good employees that are being built up in the business really well and then I can give them more and more responsibilities. Eventually I'll have an operational manager and they'll do all those things that um I do daily but until um there's quite a profit for that you know at this time that's not happening. Also um there has been a lot of hardship with doing this business with um I really felt I had a really good um group of employees. I pray really hard before I hire someone um but I have had someone stealing from me and had to let them go. I have had someone else taking advantage of me had to let them go and now I have um someone that was managing most of it um that it was a really hard situation and they left and it's very interesting because it's kind of a why God question then but God if you led me to hire them why why does it have to be like this why does it have to be hard like this and then God puts on my heart don't you understand you're actually the only person praying for them right now. Wow because you entered that relationship with them you're the only person that's praying for them right now. Wow wow so even though uh I might look at it as what the Bible calls that enemy situation pray for your enemies type thing God's showing me there's a there's a huge reason why they were in your life and in your business for a time.

SPEAKER_01 39:24

Yeah and I I mean the first word of your business is Grace yes and and grace can be a challenge at times especially when you're walking through challenging things with people um people are people are challenging at times aren't they yes yep I'm sure I'm challenging at times yeah we could probably interview on that could be a whole nother we could do a whole podcast on how challenging we are um you know I I think like you know since you are new in business I've and I feel like I'd asked you a question when we were just chatting you know briefly at a meeting but have you had like a business specifically before never zero expensive that's that's what that was that I wanted you to touch on because I remembered you saying like I've never had a business and if you literally you guys if you walk into her building you just I just thought she's had businesses like for her whole life. So I know yeah tell us more about this journey of like I mean have you had like business people come alongside to give you advice or are you like what does this look like for you?

SPEAKER_02 40:35

So it's kind of comical actually So that has to do with the um my sons and my son-in-laws being like, we have to stop her. Like this is not gonna go well. And you're gonna lead your husband into financial ruin. That's what they all thought. Like she does not know what she's doing. That's what they were saying. No, well, kind of in a roundabout way. But the thing was, is like they would have talks with me or talks with my husband. And it was like, but God's telling me to do this. Like, this is what I'm supposed to do. Say that again.

SPEAKER_01 41:08

Just say it again because this is so crucial for people.

SPEAKER_02 41:12

God is telling me to do this. So this is what I'm supposed to be doing. My daughter just asked me just a few days ago. I said, sometimes I wonder why I'm doing this, like outside of God, what my reasons are, right? And she's like, Well, you must have wanted to become a business owner, mom. I said, actually, no. Never been in my thought processes. No, never. That was never a thing. And so, just so interesting how God worked through it. And I remember my oldest son, who does own his own business, going, You just have no idea how much work this is. It's going to be so much more work than you realize. And he is 100% correct. It doesn't mean I wasn't supposed to do it though.

SPEAKER_00 41:58

Right.

A Strategic Hire And New Offerings

SPEAKER_02 41:59

And he did come alongside me. And my other son, Shane, so Shane and Ryan, they came alongside me. Shane helped me brand my whole business, website, name, all the paperwork, everything. My other son, cinematographer, owns his own business, helped me with all the ins and outs. You need to get a good lawyer, you need to get a good accountant, like all the beginning steps. So, yes, they did come alongside me. They did help me in all those beginning steps. Yes, very much so.

SPEAKER_01 42:26

Well, and it's it's almost it's like legacy, right? It's it's a I always like to say like our yes has generational implications. And maybe, you know, it's so fresh, like it's like a fresh business baby that um it's not even really walking yet. It's it's like a an infant, it's in the infant stages, but yet you've got all these, you know, I like to call them kind of like a a midwife in essence to come alongside of you to help you first of all birth it, but then also to just help you build it up, which is incredible, right? Yes. Because we can't very much so. We literally can't do things on our own. I mean, yes, we can. I mean, I'm not saying we can't, but um that's there's a reason for the body, right? That the people who maybe have more expertise in one area. Um I'm asking I'm being glad to ask you this question. So what does Cindy need in her business slash ministry? And and if somebody's listening who's local or even, you know, even from another country that um, I don't know, maybe they have something that you know you're looking for or could help out in some way. Um, what what would that be for you?

Testimonials And Remembering The Why

SPEAKER_02 43:34

You know, it's very interesting. And of course, the first thing that comes to my mind is serve, you know, people coming in and um financing part, the business, the building was just sold. I just found out um about five days ago, and the owner um came up with a lot more money that I owe for CAM. Cam is your operational expenses, which they can up it, they can also charge you at the end of the year of if they went over. And and I just am gonna be honest on this podcast, it's thousands, and I'm supposed to pay it at the end of the month, which isn't even that's not even possible for me. And I actually thought maybe this isn't legal and found out it is, and so there's not much I can do about it except say I can't pay that right now. Um, but it's very interesting, and then people are like, oh, Satan's just really, you know, trying to attack you and just really get you down. Yes, I think that is a part of it, but I just also wonder when I'm praying and I'm like, okay, God, I I know you don't want me to shut down over this issue. What are you going to do then? Because I'm doing everything I can. And it is interesting, just in the last few days, there's been some networking that is going to help me. There has been, you know, like a dance teacher that knows marketing. What? Yeah, I did marketing for two and a half years. I'm like, what? Can I pay you to help me get a few more things going? Yes, I'm meeting with her this afternoon. We have some things in our business that are different, that are unlike other places. We also have our prices reasonable. And so it makes it more, it's just we're able to help more people, right? And then it's getting the word out. But I think, you know, what does Cindy need? Well, my gosh, a miracle of appointments and a miracle of people um wanting to be a part of this is basically what I'll say. I know God's in it. Um, but places do close down, and people do remind me of that. Um, I went on a payment plan for our Easy Gel machine, and she was like, Well, I I'm hesitant to put you on a payment plan. You haven't been in business, you know, maybe that long. And, you know, places close down. And it was so interesting because I thought, close down? Well, that's not gonna happen for me. God's doing this.

SPEAKER_01 45:52

And that's that's what you're hanging on to, right? Like you just exactly because here's the deal like I I I when I hear you, and I'm like, oh heck no, you're not closing down.

SPEAKER_00 46:03

Right.

SPEAKER_01 46:03

Like, no, and there's so many, like I left corporate and you know, I'm fully business, you know, my own business now. And there's been so many moments of like a roller coaster where it's like in the natural, it looks like destruction, but I'm like, God's doing something. This is like I feel like I have a like a degree in faith, a four-year degree in faith. And now I'm getting my doctorate. So I just want to like speak in to you that no, you are not quitting, you're not closing your doors, you're keeping those doors open. He's gonna bring a probably an 11th hour miracle of some sort. I just don't know what it is, but it's coming. Right, right.

A Mold And Brain Injury Recovery Story

SPEAKER_02 46:41

It was interesting because one person that was managing that left did our tattoo removal and our laser hair removal, and now she's just all of a sudden not here. And I need to fill that spot. And God just brought someone to me that is, I'm like, are you human? Like it was such a miracle. She's someone that's older than I am. Okay, that owned a med spa at a resort in Colorado, has tons and tons of experience with the esthetician side, with the lasers, with the body contouring. She has just five years left. She wants to work. Um, she works at a high-end place in a dyna. They might, you know, make changes where she would have to look for somewhere else, but she's always been looking around. Is there someone else somewhere else I would like to work before I'm done? And she fell in love with Grace and Wellness. I've had a couple long, long meetings with her, and she's really big into entrepreneurship, which is you come into the business and you help them build. And in my meetings, that's exactly what she's doing. Like we have so many ideas of what to put out there today. Actually, I'm having a meeting with marketing and how we're going to market some of these things that we have just sitting here that people don't know about. For example, we have pelvic floor restore. And maybe you think, well, that's not a big deal, but it is a big deal for people that have had lots of babies or they're getting older. We have that. We have that where you do it six times and it could make a huge difference in your life. That was an example she said, you need to get that out there. You need to let people know. Um, and she's gonna be helping me kind of re-establish things. And then when she walked out, she was like, You're gonna be building so much faster than you thought. I know you are. And I thought, thank you for speaking that to me. And how encouraging to hear that from somebody. Um, it's just it's amazing.

SPEAKER_01 48:33

Wow. You know, as you're even saying that, I was just like seeing, you know, Nehemiah, he built the wall in like 52 days, and he on each little station he had different people that you know were taking care of their own things. And I'm just kind of seeing you have a you have a lot of modalities that bring, you know, like he he repaired the wall, but you are coming in repairing with wellness, which is flipping the script with wall to well. And you know, I I just I truly believe in what you're doing. Um, as far as people that you need, um, maybe even to hire. Or are there specific people if they're listening in, they're local, they're like, oh my gosh, like what who's she looking for? And of course, we're recording this uh January 22nd of 2026. So you might hear this in two years because she's still gonna be open. And you can probably go to her website and contact her, and she might still have spots open. But are there specific spots that you're looking to fill like right now?

Final Encouragement And Prayer

SPEAKER_02 49:38

I'm actually not. I think that what I just hired, I'm good for now, but it doesn't mean we won't in the future because we will be getting busier and I won't be able to just have one person work receptionist in wellness. So that will definitely we'll be building and we will be hiring in the future, but right now I'm fine. And one thing I want to mention when we talk about God and like him showing himself, there are times that I get down and I'm like, this looks incredibly discouraging. And I'm kind of a mama to a lot of the workers that work for me and the fact that like I think they watch me, like, oh, how's she doing? You know, like is she is she okay? Like, is is God working? Because they'll like look to me how I'm doing about everything. And when I did my open, we had a grand opening party, which was other people's ideas, not mine, because I thought, oh, what that seems like a lot of work. And we did it a little bit after we opened, and it was a lot of work. And I remember walking through the hallway, and two families stopped me, and their words were almost identical. Cindy, you've changed my life. My life has changed, and it had to do with pain, had to do with um one was a teenage um son that was gonna have surgery, and another one was um an older man that had very serious um side eye pain for years, and he's like, You changed my life. And I remember walking away going, it's so interesting that um both the scenarios were kind of the same, big changes. Um, they didn't have to do that many services, but it was just it just spoke to me like, yeah, it's you're helping people. Yeah. Because sometimes I feel like I'm so busy, right? Like in the running, the managing the running. How am I helping people? You know, that kind of a thing.

SPEAKER_01 51:30

For sure. And just really, you know, like for any business owner, too, to just really hang on to the why, like why you're doing what you're doing. Yes, it's so important because we are gonna have business, it's really challenging. It's not the faint apart. It is literally like you have to have the gift of faith to be a business owner. Yes, truly, wouldn't you say?

SPEAKER_02 51:51

I would. And there was a time I was down last week, I think it was, probably this whole situation with the building, and God just said, like, he asked me, like, what is your main, what is your main goal in all this? And I I was like, to please you. And he's like, You're gonna be fine if you remember that. Amen.

SPEAKER_00 52:16

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 52:17

So that was just really it was a really big deal to like have that time with God and hear that from him and be like, you're right. Like, I I'm not gonna go the wrong way if my if I stay on the path of pleasing you.

SPEAKER_01 52:31

Yes, amen. And it it's reminding, you know, like Proverbs 3, 5 through 6, like we can make our plans, but the Lord determines our steps. And sometimes the steps, I always think of like Indiana Jones, right? Where he literally had to take the step, and then the the little stone appeared over that chasm. And I feel like that's what business can feel like sometimes. And um, but you know, just really I I believe just even for you or for anybody who's listening today, that you know, to be able to really capture the miracles that are happening along the way and and to really look to those rather than the circumstances that are trying to speak and lie to you about. Um to get you to lock the doors up, to go back to what you're doing, to because it's just it's alive from the pit of hell. Unless the Lord calls you to stop doing something, right? You have to keep going. Like that's my favorite two words is keep going. What what would you say is like the biggest miracle that you've even seen in the middle of um, you know, maybe what would look like challenging circumstances, even the last month, maybe. Let's capture a miracle.

Closing Blessing And Romans 15:13

SPEAKER_02 53:44

Let's capture a miracle. Um Well, I just like to talk about a person. So I have workers in my home too, um, with the kids I adopted. And a miracle story is a girl that was really sick from mold illness. And her looking side, and I kept telling her she had to, you know, remove herself from that situation. She was very um, she looked like she was not gonna make it actually. And at one point she looked at me and she said, You I don't think I'm going to survive or something like that. Like she was dying type thing. And I said, You're not leaving my home, you're gonna stay here. Because I it's like she couldn't think straight. And she ended up living with me for months, and then soon after she started living with me, got in a horrible car accident. Oh no, had a brain injury, was not able to work for a long time. Um, and I just brought her in, Grace and Wellness, and we did a lot of treatments on her, and uh there was another place too, a chiropractor at another place too that also did some OT work with her. It wasn't just us, yeah, but we helped her tremendously. And not only did she heal from mold illness, she healed her brain. And when I see her now, she works just one night a week for me now. When I see her, she looks so healthy, she smiles so big, and we just reminisce about it a lot because it's like yeah, she sees pictures of herself, how she was, and then the car accident, and she's just like, I feel so good all the time now, and it's a miracle, it is a miracle, yeah. You know, it wasn't just us, it wasn't just the other place that helped her, it was God too, yeah, and bringing her to safety and bringing her to healing. And that is a miracle to see her where she is now and how well she's doing. It's just so beautiful.

SPEAKER_01 55:42

Yes. Well, thank you for the work that you're doing and continuing on, giving your guests. Um, I fully support you in all you're doing. Thank you. I would love for you to share. Um, I we'll have to have you on maybe, I don't know, a little bit down the road. I feel like part two of like where you are in business.

SPEAKER_02 56:03

Yes, yes. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_01 56:05

There's so much goodness that's coming your way. Um, as we close today, I would love for you to just share. Um, I I personally do this for the one. I know it's reaching more than one, but I do this for the one. If you could just get in mind somebody who's listening in today, um, do you have any just words of wisdom or knowledge that you'd want to share over them? And then would you pray over our podcast today? Over the list.

SPEAKER_02 56:27

I will. So I feel led to just say, going off of my first story, if you feel like because what's happening in your life, you really question whether God's really there, He is. He created us, He created the world. And even though hardship is allowed, He is there. The blessings come from pressing in, surrendering, and turning to Him. We can't promise we're not gonna have pain. We can't even promise Christians are not gonna have abuse. I mean, the Bible's full of hardship for those that are following him. But I just want to encourage people to press in, to hear his voice, to read the word of God, and to know that he's got you. He knows you, he knows you more than anyone can on earth, and to just really not lose your faith and to just keep going because blessings will come, things will get better, but it really takes a lot of pressing in and fighting against the enemy, doing that warfare over yourself and for others. And then I will now open a prayer and Father God, I just pray for everybody listening that you touch them through this, but that you work in their lives and show them that you're there, that you're present, that you're big, that you're everything. You are everything, and that the peace that surpasses all understanding happens when we follow and surrender you, not ourselves. And there's so many times, right, for all of us that we are trying in our cognitive, physical brain, how are we going to do this? What should we do? But God's got you. He wants to give you wisdom on what to do next. That's the part of the proverbs that's promised. It says it's what always will happen when you ask. It's always a yes. When you ask for wisdom from the Lord, the answer is yes 100% of the time. God doesn't always answer yes for everything that we ask of him, but that is one that will always be us. And you can push through and do that. And we just pray blessings over all of you. We pray healing and deliverance for all of you. We pray that anyone that needs to get in touch with someone for help and support, that you will get to the exact right person for you to help you. And just remember, God's got you. He can replace your mother, your father, your children, your friends that you feel maybe that don't have you or you've had betrayal. He can replace that mom and dad that you don't have. You can ask him to hold you and you can feel it that he's holding you. And I just pray this in Jesus' name. Amen.

SPEAKER_01 59:04

Amen. Thank you, Cindy. And thank you for being such a brave voice who's setting so many free. Um, like I said, I can't wait to see the more that he's bringing to you. And I'm going to close with the anchoring verse over Hope and Locked. It's may the God of hope fill you with all joy and peace in believing, so that by the power of the Holy Spirit you may abound in hope. And that's Romans 15, 13. So thank you again, Cindy. Thank you. Bye, listeners. Bye.