Have you ever felt a deep, unexplainable connection guiding you through life's most pivotal moments? Imagine if that very instinct could be the beacon during your journey to motherhood. Today, we sit with Kelli Moore, a mother whose experiences with IVF, birth, and postpartum challenges, illuminate the incredible intuition that comes with motherhood and the indomitable spirit required to advocate for one's health. Through Kelli's eyes, we witness the intensity of labor, the complications from past medical procedures, and her undying trust in her own body's messages—lessons that resonate with every listener.
The path to bringing new life into this world is often shrouded in silence, especially when it comes to the struggles of infertility and extended labor. Kelli sheds light on these seldom-discussed topics, sharing the raw emotional toll it took on her personal relationships and the support that pulled her through. As she speaks on the importance of therapies, holistic health practices, and the power of honest dialogue, her insights underscore the need for empathy and comprehensive care.
Postpartum isn't just about recovery; it's about transformation. Kelli's story doesn't shy away from the emotional and physical aftermath of a taxing birth, the questioning of increasing C-section rates, and the necessary advocacy for informed childbirth choices. In our heart-to-heart, we also recognize the significance of showing up for one another, especially in those vulnerable moments after bringing life into the world. From the vital need for maternity leave to strategies for maintaining mental health, we celebrate the resilience and personal growth that motherhood fosters, while underscoring the beauty of community and shared experiences. Join us for a powerful reminder of the strength we possess and the unwavering support we owe to each other.
Connect with Kelli on Instagram here!
We want to give a big shoutout to our sponsor Baby Tula for making this episode possible. Baby Tula crafts beautiful and incredibly comfy baby carriers, blankets, and accessories using quality materials. Their ergonomic and stylish baby carriers keep your little one snuggled close while giving you hands-free mobility. We're truly grateful for the support of sponsors like Baby Tula that allow us to create this podcast. Be sure to visit their site for all your babywearing needs! Babytula.com
To sign up for our newsletter visit our website and blog: www.goldenhourbirthpodcast.com
Follow Liz on Instagram here and Natalie here
Follow us on Facebook here.
Have you ever felt a deep, unexplainable connection guiding you through life's most pivotal moments? Imagine if that very instinct could be the beacon during your journey to motherhood. Today, we sit with Kelli Moore, a mother whose experiences with IVF, birth, and postpartum challenges, illuminate the incredible intuition that comes with motherhood and the indomitable spirit required to advocate for one's health. Through Kelli's eyes, we witness the intensity of labor, the complications from past medical procedures, and her undying trust in her own body's messages—lessons that resonate with every listener.
The path to bringing new life into this world is often shrouded in silence, especially when it comes to the struggles of infertility and extended labor. Kelli sheds light on these seldom-discussed topics, sharing the raw emotional toll it took on her personal relationships and the support that pulled her through. As she speaks on the importance of therapies, holistic health practices, and the power of honest dialogue, her insights underscore the need for empathy and comprehensive care.
Postpartum isn't just about recovery; it's about transformation. Kelli's story doesn't shy away from the emotional and physical aftermath of a taxing birth, the questioning of increasing C-section rates, and the necessary advocacy for informed childbirth choices. In our heart-to-heart, we also recognize the significance of showing up for one another, especially in those vulnerable moments after bringing life into the world. From the vital need for maternity leave to strategies for maintaining mental health, we celebrate the resilience and personal growth that motherhood fosters, while underscoring the beauty of community and shared experiences. Join us for a powerful reminder of the strength we possess and the unwavering support we owe to each other.
Connect with Kelli on Instagram here!
We want to give a big shoutout to our sponsor Baby Tula for making this episode possible. Baby Tula crafts beautiful and incredibly comfy baby carriers, blankets, and accessories using quality materials. Their ergonomic and stylish baby carriers keep your little one snuggled close while giving you hands-free mobility. We're truly grateful for the support of sponsors like Baby Tula that allow us to create this podcast. Be sure to visit their site for all your babywearing needs! Babytula.com
To sign up for our newsletter visit our website and blog: www.goldenhourbirthpodcast.com
Follow Liz on Instagram here and Natalie here
Follow us on Facebook here.
Have you ever felt like something wasn't quite right during your pregnancy, but felt dismissed by doctors and others when you voiced your concerns? In this episode we speak with Kelly, a mom who went through IVF and had a gut feeling that her daughter wanted to come early. Despite her intuition and shared feelings, she was brushed off by medical professionals and told that doesn't happen for first time moms. Kelly's story highlights the importance of listening to your instincts as a mother and being your own advocate, especially when dealing with a complex birth. You'll hear how Kelly's persistence ultimately led to discovering a surprising reason behind her prolonged and difficult labor, and how a seemingly unrelated medical procedure years earlier almost caused the catastrophic outcome. Join us as Kelly courageously shares the details of her harrowing birth experience to bring greater awareness to placental issues faced by many IVF moms. Her story is a powerful reminder to trust our intuition as mothers and keep asking questions when something doesn't feel right.
Speaker 2:Before we dive into today's heartfelt conversations, I'd like to announce this episode is made possible by Baby Tula, a company that believes in something we talk about a lot here that showcasing each mother's distinct and unique story has the power to inspire other mothers to do things in a way that feels right for them.
Speaker 1:If you didn't know, Baby Tula makes these beautiful baby carriers in nearly every color, design and fabric that you could think of Intricately hand woven fabrics, clean linen, neutrals or fun colorful patterns. If you were looking for something that makes you feel more like you after having a baby, there's Tula.
Speaker 2:I've had the pleasure of working with Tula Carrier and let me tell you their dedication to supporting mothers aligns perfectly with our mission here. They want mothers to feel empowered, comfortable and confident in their role. They have a program called the Fringe that selects families across the world who have beautiful stories to share about their parenting journey, from before their little ones were born, through the early stages of babyhood and how they grew as a family together. If you wanna be inspired by real families who are finding ways to create a new world for their children, visit their site, check out their beautiful carriers and sign up for their email.
Speaker 1:BabyTulacom, where self love doesn't end at parenthood, it just begins. Thanks for tuning in. Now let's dive in today's inspiring story, the Golden Hour Birth Podcast, a podcast about real birth stories and creating connections through our shared experiences Childbirth isn't just about the child.
Speaker 2:It's about the person who gave birth their lives, their wisdom and their empowerment.
Speaker 1:We're Liz and Natalie, the Golden Hour Birth Podcast, and we're here to laugh with you, cry with you and hold space for you. Welcome to the Golden Hour Birth Podcast. I am your co-host, liz.
Speaker 2:And I'm your co-host, natalie, and tonight we have Kelly on. Kelly is a mama of one living outside of Denver, Colorado, and owns Soulfire Productions, so thanks so much for coming on tonight, kelly.
Speaker 3:Thank you for having me. It's late. We should obviously be going off.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we're exhausted working moms.
Speaker 1:Yeah, exactly yes.
Speaker 2:So if you want, to go ahead and just tell listeners about you and your fam.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so we live just outside of Denver, colorado. My husband Connor and I, and my daughter named Robbie. She was born in January, so she's 10 months right now and yeah, we both kind of came from the podcast industry and met through each other's shows and lived. I was in LA when he was in San Diego when we met and then we moved to Colorado and yeah, we're here now and growing our family and have a couple dogs and live on a mountain and live in the good life.
Speaker 2:That's so good, love it. So when did you guys kind of start talking about kids, or what did that look like?
Speaker 3:Day one.
Speaker 2:We met Same.
Speaker 3:You know, it's a virtual love story. You guys.
Speaker 3:So we met over Instagram. I binged his podcast and connected on Instagram and then we talked for like six or eight weeks before we met in person. And I always tell everyone I fell in love with him before I ever met him and we just knew there was something different about this connection. And I'm 35, he's 36. And we were like 30 and 31 when this happened. So you know, we had done the thing. We've dated a lot of people, we had kind of gotten through and we were like OK, we're done screwing around, like are you the person or not?
Speaker 3:And so we were just very forthcoming from day one, and so when we met in person on our first date, we had this very cute picnic at the beach at sunset and you know, so romantic, and we were sitting on the beach and we just were just mouth diarrhea all over each other all the things, and it was like what do you want?
Speaker 3:What do you want? How do you feel about this, what are your values? And one of the things that we talked about was that he was born without vas deferens and so he couldn't get someone pregnant naturally, and so we had the fertility treatment conversation on date one.
Speaker 3:And although that was not ideal for a lot of reasons, for me it was just great because I knew, ok, this is what I'm getting into, I get to do a ton of research, look into what this looks like. I knew that I could get pregnant, so I knew that I was good on my end and I knew that that would help our chances as well going into IVF. And so I just started doing a ton of research from the very beginning. And then, when we moved from LA to Colorado, I knew that we had CCRM here, which is, you know oh, world-renowned fertility clinic that I really don't like, but their rates are super high. And so we started meeting with doctors immediately and just getting in the lay of the land, figuring out what that was going to look like and just prepping. So when we were ready, we'd kind of have everything squared away.
Speaker 2:So I didn't know that part. So I work in a fertility clinic and they do the Tessie or PESA surgery where they kind of go in surgically. So that's not an option with the vas deferens. I know the vas deferens make the sperm, but is there. There's no other way.
Speaker 3:No, as far as I know, that's the only way, because I thought initially that we would maybe be able to do IUI and just be less invasive. But according to CCRM, they can't get enough sperm to do IUI because of lack of vas deferens, I guess, or the way the sperm are and so you have to do IVF. It's really your only option.
Speaker 2:OK.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Wow, ok. So I have like to go do research now too. I'm like whoa.
Speaker 3:If you want to come back and tell me something different so that I can not do that for baby number two, I'm very here for it, but I'm pretty sure that's what we have to do.
Speaker 2:Yeah, no, I totally probably agree. I'm just like I didn't know about this, so I'm just interested now. And we can cut this out or whatever. I'm just like what? So my mind is spinning that way. So yeah, so once you did you guys just go through the one round of IVF and then got the great news. Yeah, we were super lucky.
Speaker 3:So we went through our retrieval. We got the sperm, we got the eggs. We were super lucky. We ended up with five embryos and so we did our first round in April of last year and got pregnant immediately, which was so great. So, yeah, it was like I said. I think for us it was better because I knew that I could get pregnant and it wasn't a female fertility issue, which obviously I hate that for anyone, and oftentimes it's the man. I mean you work in a fertility clinic. How many times is it the guy that comes in that's actually having some of the issues?
Speaker 3:So, I learned a lot in that experience, but for us it was pretty seamless and I was really grateful.
Speaker 2:That's good, that's awesome. So what was pregnancy like?
Speaker 3:Well, you know, not my favorite experience of all time.
Speaker 3:So I had the worst time doing IVF, like I was suicidal. I was super disconnected from my body. The hormonal swings for me were really, really intense. I'm just very sensitive. I haven't been on birth control since I was 27. I'm very connected to my body, I'm very holistic, and so I'm just really self-aware. And so I think that I just had a lot harder of a time. And so you have to stay on IVF medication until you're 10 weeks pregnant to make sure that your body holds pregnancy, and so it's the pregnancy hormones plus IVF hormones, and that was just so much for me. And so I mean there were days where I just felt like I was not a functioning part of society and was just sleeping and just having a really hard time.
Speaker 3:And then, once I got deeper in the second trimester and into the third, a lot of the hormones kind of leveled out, but I was uncomfortable and I just felt like my body struggled in a lot of ways.
Speaker 3:I was in pain, I had a lot of brown ligament pain. There was a lot of things going on. And then, once we got towards the end of pregnancy, I ended up being in labor for six weeks and we found out later what was going on, but during that time we really didn't know. And so I was going into the hospital and trying to find out if there was something wrong or if I was in preterm labor, and they just kept saying everything was good and I had planned an unmitigated home birth in a tub with a midwife and a doula, and we were going the whole thing, and so there was just a lot of back and forth and I would be in labor for four or five hours a day, having contractions every one and a half to two minutes, like okay, and then it would just stop and we were like what is going on? And that just kept going on and so we finally induced do you want me to go into that or do you want to ask me questions before?
Speaker 1:I next. I have one question During your pregnancy and going through that hard time, did you do anything to manage your mental state? Oh, I did everything.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah, I'm so lucky. I'm very resourced and I was resourced before I got pregnant and I did that on purpose for a lot of reasons, and I always tell everyone like I'm so glad that I had practitioners and support and I've been in therapy for a lot of my life and I know how to ask for help, because if I hadn't, I don't know how people do this alone. I don't know how people do this without help. Like I was so out of my mind, so disconnected. There were moments where I have a really amazing group of friends and there's five of us and you know we talk all the time on zoom and really connected. We know each other so well.
Speaker 3:And I remember I was in I'm in my office right now and I was in the couch to my left and I was in the fetal position on the phone with my friend, Like I don't want to be with Connor, I hate this. Like why am I even doing this? I don't even want to have a kid, I'm not even attracted to him. My hormones were so all over the place and they were telling me step by step this is why you love your husband, this is why you're having kids. And I was in therapy and I was getting acupuncture and I was doing, you know, prenatal massage, and my eating is incredible and you know I was very well nourished and taken care of and so, yeah, I'm really glad that I knew how to ask for help. And with all of that it was still so hard.
Speaker 2:Wow, yeah, I really don't know how people go through it alone either. I mean those hormones and the medication. It's, it's hard.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and it's like look, some of us have to do that and the rates of people having to do for any type of fertility treatment are increasing and I don't. Sometimes I feel bad, like maybe I shouldn't tell this story, because I feel like a lot of it is very negative. But I also didn't hear any honest experiences like this before I went through it, and so I feel like I got hit by a freaking truck when maybe, if I had heard a story like mine, that was hey, this is going to be hard. Make sure you're resourced, make sure you talk to your partner before, make sure you guys are in a really good place, make sure you know how to ask for help.
Speaker 3:I mean, I went to my fertility clinic, to my doctor, and said this was when we were doing the retrieval, and I said I think I was on Lupron, which basically sends you into menopause, and I was like, hey, this is making me feel suicidal, like I am unwell, this is not okay. And she was like, oh, I'm so sorry. Like you're too far into the treatment, we can't do anything for you. She didn't say hey, are you in therapy? Hey, have you gone to acupuncture? Hey, like, maybe let's have a conversation. This isn't okay. It was like, oh sorry. And I remember leaving there like what the fuck just happened? What? How do you know if I have help or support or not? And so I just started thinking about all the people that go in there who don't have that support, who don't have a partner like mine, who's amazing and connected and can you know, hold space for me when I'm losing my shit.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:And it really upset me and I feel like that's just sort of the the medical industry as a whole. And so I think that if we can have honest conversations like this and say, yeah, this is not going to be fun, like no one wants to go through IVF, it sucks, and here are different ways you can support yourself and be honest and know that you're not crazy, it's okay and this isn't forever, and hopefully you get a baby at the end. And you look at them and you're like I guess I'll do it again. You're so freaking cute.
Speaker 1:Let's do it again. Yep, yeah. I'm glad you mentioned all that, because we are both in Dula training and the program that we chose has a like very comprehensive fertility support, so you can either focus on fertility Dula, birth Dula or postpartum or all three so it was it's? Yeah, it's a really good program, yeah, so hopefully it will help some people. I know.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I've never been more aware it takes women like you who are good at holding space, who help women and partners feel safe and who are educated so that anything that's thrown your way, at your client's way, you guys are resourced. And I think that most people just don't feel safe and they don't feel like they have a place to go to say like, hey, I'm like losing it, am I okay? Yeah, and so I think the work that you're doing is really, really important.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 2:Thank you, I never knew about like a fertility Dula. And then seeing the program that I'm in and being like oh, wow, like there's fertility Dulas out there, like that is amazing, because I'm seeing it from both sides and I'm like there, you're right, like there needs to be more support while you're in it and I like my heart hurts for like the people who feel like they need to hide it, that like their infertility treatments or things like that. You know like there's like the shame around it, but I just like that sucks. You know that you, because people are asking you like when are you going to have a baby, and then you can't tell them. You know there's like just yeah, and then what if it doesn't work?
Speaker 3:Yeah, you go through all these rounds and you know there's just so much stigma and shame around if you can't have a baby, if you can't have a baby like naturally, without support of medicine, and I just feel like we have to do a better job of not shaming people and not making people feel like they failed, because I don't know about you guys, but I don't feel like I did something wrong to have to do IVF.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:And you know that's also part of the, the shame. I think my husband feels that I don't have to do IVF. I could get pregnant, truly, if it was with someone else. And so then he's caring and he's watching me suffer and he's like this is my fault and he didn't do anything. It's not like he cut his vast deference out of his own fricking body or, like you know, did drugs to a point where something happened and well, that was a dumb decision, like he was just born like that. And I think that we just need to have more honest conversations so that people realize there's nothing wrong with you, like you're not bad, you're not broken, you didn't do anything wrong. This is just a part of some of our journeys and it's harder for some than others.
Speaker 3:I have a friend who has been trying to get pregnant for a year and a half now. You were just at coffee the other day and she was like I know this sounds bad, but I swear to God, if this girl gets pregnant before me, I'm going to lose my shit. And she ended up getting pregnant before her and she got pregnant really easily and it was like an oopsie, you know. And so then, someone who's going through fertility treatments is like shit, like what did I do wrong to deserve this, you know? And so there's just this constant narrative within us that there's something wrong with us. And then we compare ourselves, because we all have comparisonitis, because we're stuck on Instagram 24 seven it feels like everyone's getting pregnant every seven seconds. And we're not. And there's something wrong. And you know, it's just you can't win. And so I think we just need to be supportive of ourselves, supportive of those around us, and know that everyone is on their own path and that's okay.
Speaker 2:Yep, I like that. Everyone's on their own path in their own journey. So kind of going back into being on and off in labor for six weeks. Did that start around like 34 weeks or?
Speaker 3:Yeah, it was like 34, between 34 and 35 weeks, I think, and I don't know what the law is for you guys, but in Colorado we have to be at 37 weeks to do a home birth, and so that's all I cared about. I was just like you know, I don't want to have a baby in a hospital. I got to get to 37 weeks and so we were. I was Thanksgiving and I was like in the kitchen making potatoes and I start feeling contractions Like okay, that's weird, that's not going to happen again. And then they just kept going and then it just went on from there. And it was weird because the midwife and the doula were both just like what is going on? And the doula had a lot of red flags and I feel like the midwife just kind of I am frustrated looking back at her lack of knowledge and like looking into what was going on because she just never had an answer for anything. I went through my entire pregnancy and I was like maybe ask somebody or I don't know, because everyone I've talked to since then, every midwife I've talked to is like oh yeah, I would have looked for this thing and I would have asked you these questions on this intake form. Like why didn't you have this conversation? I'm like I don't know. So I felt very alone and I felt kind of crazy.
Speaker 3:And at one point I remember it was the day we ended up inducing. It was New Year's Day and I did the castor oil induction at home and Connor and I got in the biggest fight that day. It was like I took the castor oil and then he decided to tell me I was losing my mind because he was losing his mind. He's like you've been in labor for six weeks. Like no one's in labor for six weeks. You're crazy. And he was like I feel like you're making this up, no one is in labor for six weeks and I'm on the floor screaming and crying. I'm losing my mind. I haven't slept in six weeks. I'm in labor all the time. I'm having a baby. I'm like what is going on?
Speaker 3:And it just like it got really hard and I just felt like I'm losing it. Like maybe I am making this up, maybe, maybe am I pregnant? Like are we sure? Like I started thinking about all the most irrational things because it was like it was crazy. Making it didn't make any sense. So yeah, it was pretty funny. I was like I'm not sure, I'm not sure. So yeah, it was. It was pretty funny.
Speaker 2:So, like while you were in labor, like you were having actual contractions, you were counting them.
Speaker 3:You were oh yeah, I was timing. I'm on the phone with the doula. I'm like, hold on, here comes another one. She's like packing her bag, talking me through it, and she's like, okay, call the midwife. And that happened like four times where it got like intense enough, where we were like calling the team and then we would just stop and it'd be like, never mind, guys, just kidding.
Speaker 2:And you would just like oh, my God.
Speaker 3:The whole team ended up coming because my water broke and I was like really in labor, and I was in the tub. I labored for I don't know six or seven hours in our living room and then they should just stopped again. And we were like, okay, and they the whole team was like you know what? This is different. This has gone on longer. It's been more intense. Your water broke. Maybe your body just needs a break and wants you to sleep and we'll pick it back up in the morning.
Speaker 3:So we all went to bed at like 3am and I continued to have like random contractions, but nothing intense, and then it's stalled out until Tuesday afternoon and the midwife is like you need to go to the hospital. Your water broke two days ago. I'm now concerned. And I was like, yeah, and I'm concerned because you don't seem to know what's going on and I don't really feel confident with you. Yeah, delivering my child. And so we ended up going to the hospital and they were like, yeah, you have no fluid left, you need to induce, like you need to come today. And so I came home and we packed up and I just brought my mind around the fact that this was not going to go the way I wanted and that there was a reason it was happening. And so we went into the hospital that night and luckily, denver health here is a midwife hospital, and so I got to have the most amazing experience. All the midwives were so fantastic. I never saw a doctor until after my daughter was born and all of the nurses like more than half of them were doulas. So they were just so on board with the home birth and what I wanted, and they turned off all the monitors and the sounds and we had our candles and our crystals and the music and they were like this is the best room ever and I'm like, and so that part of it I was super grateful for. But yeah, we went in that night, we induced that night. Nothing happened.
Speaker 3:I ended up going into really severe back labor. She was sunny side up and so I ended up having to get an epidural. I hadn't slept in like a week. I couldn't stand, my whole body was shaking. I was like I just like couldn't do anything and I was like in such severe pain and the midwife was just, you know, talking to my husband and I and she's like I'm really concerned for you Because you're just so you're so far beyond the pain threshold. I feel like this is going to be more traumatic for you if you don't do this. And I'm really grateful that she was there to support me in making that decision, because I was just so anti epidural, anti everything, and so I got the epidural and still nothing was happening.
Speaker 3:And we're just like what is going on. I've been four centimeters dilated for six weeks. I've been in labor for six weeks. My water broke two, three days ago and nothing happening. And they go in and they're like you're only half a centimeter dilated. And I said what You're lying? They were like no, we are not.
Speaker 3:And I looked at the doodle and I was like did our midwife not know how to do cervical checks? Like I was like what is happening? And so we're just all sitting there totally stumped, and I go through three midwives and they finally bring in this other midwife because you know they are doing shift changes every 12 hours and this woman comes in and she goes I'm going to check you". And so she's got her fingers inside of me, she's doing cervical check and she goes did you have a leap procedure? And I said yeah, like 10 years ago. And she goes you have a ton of scar tissue and it's keeping you from dilating. I'm going to swipe it with my finger and you are going to dilate immediately. I'm like, okay, so she does it immediately. Five centimeters I go.
Speaker 3:Kate, can you explain to me why I thought I was four centimeters and then you guys told me I was half a centimeter and now I'm five centimeters? She goes because there's two sides basically of your cervix that you can check. Your midwife was feeling the side that was open. The other side was closed though, and the other side couldn't open because the scar tissue was holding it closed. She's like so now all of it's open, like you're fully open, open for business.
Speaker 3:I'm like, okay, so they flip my daughter. I'm five centimeters dilated, everything's moving, and I go into labor a couple hours later. I push for an hour and a half. I'm able to push, I get on all fours. I'm moving. It's lovely, as lovely as it can be on an epidural. It hurts like hell. And also I was like okay, I can do this, give birth, and everything was great and she was perfect and my husband was able to catch her. It was a vaginal delivery, like all the things, and they were like this is why you were in labor for six weeks, because you had the scar tissue and she was basically stuck. She did want to come six weeks ago, she was ready and your body wouldn't let her.
Speaker 2:Oh, my God.
Speaker 3:Yeah.
Speaker 1:Isn't that nuts? Yeah, that's. And none of the other midwives like. So, like the fourth one, she just was able to feel the scar tissue yeah.
Speaker 3:She had had patients with that procedure before. She knew to look for the scar tissue. And she knew because she had heard like, oh, this girl's been in labor a lot. She was like I bet that she has this thing that's keeping her from fully dilating.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and the lead procedure is something it's for HPV.
Speaker 3:Okay, yeah, so it's actually very common. Yeah, the more research I've done, I was actually on a podcast I can't remember what it's called, but it's hosted by a midwife. A couple weeks ago and I was talking to her about it and she did like a ton of research. She actually went into a midwives group with like 6,000 midwives and shared my story and asked for other people to talk about it. This is rampant. You guys are. I'm 36. I don't know how old you are. You look kind of like my age. Our generation has gotten so many lead procedures because HPV is so common that there are so many women that are getting unnecessary C-sections because they're not fully dilating and no one knows to look for the scar tissue, so they're just literally giving people C-sections.
Speaker 2:Oh, my God.
Speaker 3:Yeah, it's insane.
Speaker 2:My mind is blown.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah. So first of all, don't get a lead procedure. If you have HPV, it usually clears on its own. No one needs this freaking procedure. And also, if you've had it, make sure your whole team knows, because it's a very easy fix.
Speaker 3:All you have to do is swipe the scar tissue, yeah, but if people don't know to look for it and oftentimes people don't even know to ask if you've had one because they don't it's like birth control. We didn't know the repercussions until now and we're like, oh God, it's the same thing. So make sure your whole team knows, make sure they understand what to do, so that you don't have that situation.
Speaker 2:Yeah, whoa, yeah. So your daughter was ready to come at 34 weeks.
Speaker 3:Sounds like it, or at least close. Yeah, like maybe I wasn't ready to give birth at that time, but my body was definitely warming up.
Speaker 2:Yeah, whoa, so then the scar tissue would stop the contractions as well, like stop labor yeah.
Speaker 1:Whoa.
Speaker 3:I remember the midwife said to me does it feel like you're hitting a wall? And I said that is literally what I've been telling everyone for the last six weeks. I said I am in labor, I'm having contractions, and then it always feels like I hit a wall. She's like that's what's happening. It's like your body's trying to open and then it just it stops because it's being held closed.
Speaker 1:Yeah, oh God, I can't.
Speaker 2:Oh.
Speaker 1:God, I can't believe how quickly you birthed her after that I know Six weeks and how.
Speaker 2:he were just like five.
Speaker 3:I know Within seconds, I'm not kidding. We were like, I was like am I in the twilight zone? What is happening?
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, that feels like it. So did your, you know, kind of like the baby kind of like starts getting and preparing to Like do you feel like Robbie was preparing and then like she would kind of hit the wall as well?
Speaker 3:I don't, yeah, I mean she was, she was fully grown and I mean if you saw pictures and I could send you one of my vagina of her coming out, she has a full head of hair. I know she's almost 23 inches, she's an advanced kid. I feel like she was like overcooked in there and was like I'm good, let me out.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3:I'm telling you know, this is the other thing and this is my bone to pick with people and pregnant women and mothers that don't listen to us. I told everyone she was trying to come early and every fucking person I talked to was like you're a first time mom, that doesn't happen. And I was like I am telling you my daughter I didn't know as a girl my kid wants to come out. They are ready, my body is ready. Like what is happening. They're like, no, that will never happen.
Speaker 3:So it was so validating for me to be in there and the midwife be like, yeah, she definitely wanted to come out, like everything was ready to go and your body just couldn't let it happen. And I just wish that people would listen, because my intuition was so fricking spot on and I didn't even know what was going on, but I knew that something was off and I just felt like no one was listening to me and they made me feel stupid. They made me feel disconnected from my body and my intuition and it was so frustrating and who cares, even if she wasn't going to come early. I just feel like there needs to be more validation for how women feel in their bodies and what they're feeling and feel like is being intuitively guided within them. I don't know, that was really hard for me to grapple with for a while.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I completely understand. I finally feel like I have that mother's intuition now and it took two kids because we were at a doula event the other night and with all midwives and our birthing center in St Louis and a woman comes in and she's like 20 weeks pregnant. She's like I really want to change to the birthing center. I just feel like something's giving me vibes like that my OB just might not be the right person for me and I'm like you already have your intuition. Stick with it and don't ever question it. I love that for you.
Speaker 3:So I get it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, it's real.
Speaker 3:Yeah. So I gave birth. The story's not over, guys. So I gave birth, she was great, everything seemed fine.
Speaker 3:And then they were trying to get me to birth the placenta and it wasn't coming out. And they were like you know, let's just give it a minute, it'll be fine. And I'm just sitting there like blissed out. I just had a baby and all of a sudden she's like well, you push again. And so I push a little bit. She's like nothing's happening.
Speaker 3:And then like one minute passes and then there was this ginormous gush and I was like, oh cool, the placenta came out. And I just hear her start yelling and I was losing so much fluid and blood like it was like gushing out of me and the placenta still wasn't coming out. So that's when they realized that I had placenta and it was basically adhered to my body, and so doctors just start running the room and I start fading and I'm just like I feel myself pulling back and I can't open my eyes and I start getting really thirsty and I just keep being like water and I didn't know what was going on and all of a sudden I can't really feel much because I had the epidural. This doctor comes in and my husband said she was like elbow deep inside of me yanking my placenta out. He was like it was shreds of you, just like coming out.
Speaker 3:He was like it was insane and the fluid just kept coming and so they start like they were calling her room number and emergency coming in. And they came in and they looked at my husband and they were like we might have to perform a hysterectomy. We need your OK for this to save her life. And he was like what he's like? They were like we need your OK and he's like OK and he brings Ro to me and I kissed her goodbye and they wheel me off immediately to surgery and they had to perform a DNC and put a balloon in and gauze and I had a three bag blood transfusion and I had a near death experience on the operating table.
Speaker 2:Oh, my God.
Speaker 3:It was freaking crazy, yeah. And then it was over in 20 minutes and I was in recovery and everything was done.
Speaker 1:Oh, my gosh. Do you remember that?
Speaker 3:I remember everything.
Speaker 3:Oh my gosh, yeah, I remember the near death experience for me was I felt myself like really leaving and I was like, oh, I can go now, ok, great. And I realized that I had a choice. I was like, I think I'm good, I think I'm like ready to go, and then all of a sudden, I remember we had just redone our will because I wanted to have it done before she was born. I was like, oh, it'll be fine, like Ro and Conor are taking care of I just redid the will, like it'll be good. And then I saw him and I saw her like vision of them and I was like, no, I want to be alive, I want to be alive, I want to be, and I just I have children right now.
Speaker 3:Saying it, I just kept repeating it in my head over and over and over again and then I felt myself like come back into my body and then they were wheeling me into recovery right after that. Oh, my gosh, wow, yeah, I'm not still like have a choice. Yeah, you like do I want to be here? And for me, I had a lot of issues with, you know, feeling suicidal when I was young, starting in seventh grade, and so life had always been really hard for me and I never felt like I really wanted to be here and it was so interesting in that moment. And, of course, like right after giving birth, I become a mother and that's when I get to choose, like, do you want to be here or not? And I was like, yeah, no, I got to be here.
Speaker 2:It was all for her.
Speaker 3:It was all for her, yeah so it was nuts.
Speaker 2:I didn't get this far in your story. Oh, on your podcast, whoa.
Speaker 3:Yeah, yeah. And the other thing is that I've learned in my research since this happened is that a lot of IVF moms have placental issues and placenta accretia. So the maternal mortality rates are pretty high Not like 75% of IVF moms, but high is in probably 5-10%. I don't know, yeah, but people are not talking about it. It's midwives and nurses that are basically word of mouth sharing this and their experiences are seeing like so many IVF moms have these placental issues. And Ro was just in the hospital in August. She had a cancerous tumor in her stomach the size of a grapefruit and had to have it removed and our oncologist said that it could be from IVF. Oh my, god.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so IVF is screwing with nature and so they're seeing a lot of abnormalities with placentas and in children, because there's just something off when you start messing with it. That causes these issues.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I know there's like three different kind of like levels of accretia, but I can't like think of the exact words, like was yours? Like level three?
Speaker 3:I don't know. Honestly, I didn't even know what placenta accretia was until like two months ago. All they said was like basically your placenta was stuck to your body and they thought they said this could have happened because the baby was like in the canal for so long and she basically like pushed it against your body, which maybe, but when I started doing research it just was like so common with IVF mom. So yeah, I don't know what degree it was. I mean, maybe the hospital knows, but I know that I'm very high risk. It's very likely to happen again. It could potentially be much worse the second time.
Speaker 3:So we're kind of in the stages of one do we want to have another kid? Because if it's that risky, I don't want to die, obviously. And two, if we do do it, what is our support system look like? So I would go back to the same hospital because they clearly know what they're doing and handled everything so amazingly and I feel very safe there. But I think I would basically say like you have to have transfusion ready, emergency ready, like if anything were to happen.
Speaker 3:The whole team is there and prepared, because it sounds like a lot of moms who do end up either, like I know a mom here she's the one that told me about placenta accretia and just all the different specialists. She was in a coma for 10 days. They were like yeah, she's not going to make it. And she ended up making it. Her daughter's 14 now. But it sounds like the moms who go into comas don't make it or have just like really severe, you know 10 bag transfusion, like crazy stuff. People just aren't prepared and so if you have a team that's prepared and they know to look for it, then you're obviously in a much better situation.
Speaker 3:So yeah where we are is just we're like in dialogue currently of what that looks like.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and oftentimes they don't know about the accretia until it's time and you only have like one to two minutes to save the mom you know, yeah.
Speaker 2:We just had a accretia mom on sharing her story but they found it really early and like the hospital that she goes to, like the doctor is like that's his specialty. It was kind of beautiful, but also really scary.
Speaker 1:Yeah, hers was really severe, it was in her bladder. Bladder I had grown into her bladder.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I don't know how all that works. Yeah, I'm going to listen to that episode. I'm really curious to hear her story, yeah.
Speaker 2:That one was wild. I have a question. So I know that you said like your water broke and then you like went to the hospital and like they said that you didn't really have any fluid, like was anyone worried about that part? Or like was it kind of okay?
Speaker 3:Yeah. So everything looked fine. Her heartbeat was fine, my heartbeat was fine. They didn't feel like we were at immediate risk for infection. They were like yeah, it's been 48 hours, like that's not ideal, you don't have fluid left, but she seems fine, or the baby seems totally fine and you're good. So they said you know, we're not in a rush, but you do need to come in today. And I was like okay, so that's good.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I feel like here they would have just been like C-section, yeah, by the way. So your hospital sounds more a little more on the holistic side.
Speaker 3:I've heard that quite a bit. They're like I can't believe you had a vaginal birth and I'm like really. And they're like, yeah, that is a C-section almost everywhere.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's how I was feeling. I'm like the no fluid, the being in labor for so long, the like, failure to progress, like is what you think that was going on. That's like everything was coming out of my mind was like a C-section, a C-section, but I mean, I'm so happy that you got your vaginal birth.
Speaker 3:Me too. Yeah Well, and that's the thing is.
Speaker 1:I didn't need a.
Speaker 3:C-section, yeah, and so I mean you guys know the rates of C-section are skyrocketing and I don't think that we're looking at enough of what's going on in women's bodies to say is this actually necessary? Yeah, you know, like emergency C-sections exist for a reason. I'm totally here for it. I'm not like anti-do them, I just think that, like I obviously didn't need one, many women, in my case, are going to have it. Many women with elite procedure and scar tissue are going to have it, and I just wish we were asking more questions and doing better intake so that we understood where people are. And then these conversations are so important, like who knows who's listening to this who might have a mom who they're going to give a C-section to, and she's like wait, she had elite procedure, check her scar tissue, and then it's totally avoidable.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 3:But it's not like Western medicine is not throwing millions of dollars to test and like to research on this stuff, so it relies on people like us having these conversations, which is why I feel open to just talking about this, though I might scare people. This is the only way we can share this information at this point.
Speaker 2:Yeah, which you've really brought like a lot of important conversations up in this podcast, and I'm really thankful for that because I feel like, like we know, that C-section rates are skyrocketing. If you watch the business of being born, they're done during the hours of 4pm and 10pm so doctors can get home to their families. They're not done on Christmas or 4th of July. We know and this is not trying to like you know C-sections are there for a reason, but there's other options, other ways too.
Speaker 1:So okay, you go to recovery After all this, your near-death experience. What happens after that?
Speaker 3:I mean, I was elated, I was like my baby is so cute, I'm alive. I hadn't processed. Obviously I was in shock. I was in shock for a few weeks and, like I said, my body's really sensitive, so the epidural like really took a toll on me. I didn't feel like I was here, like physically here, fully landed, or maybe that's because I had a near-death experience and so it took a while for, like, my soul to come back into my body. I don't know. But even the first night we came home, we stayed in the hospital for two nights after and then the first night we came home, I didn't even know, I didn't, I wasn't with my child.
Speaker 3:That night, connor took Ro and slept with her on the couch so that I could sleep, and I didn't know that until a couple months ago. He was like, yeah, that first night with Ro was so special for me. And I was like, oh, yeah, he's like, yeah, I wish just the two of us Excuse me. He's like you don't remember. And I said what are you talking about? I slept with Ro, we co-slept for four months. And he's like babe, yes, and the first night I took her and we slept on the couch because you needed to sleep because you hadn't slept in so long and you had just gone through something really horrible. So I wanted you to sleep. I didn't even know that. So I think I was, you know.
Speaker 3:Just I wasn't here and then I also I had nine stitches and the trauma from the placenta and things being shredded out. It was pretty brutal on my body and so, yeah, my recovery was pretty rough. Thank God, my husband's mom called my brother when I was going into surgery and was like, hey, you need to get here. She might not make it. And so my brother and his wife got on a plane that night and they were in the hospital at 730 am the next morning. I mean, I gave birth at 930 pm and they were in the hospital at 730 am the next day and then they stayed with us for a week. My husband's mom was there for a week. So we had a lot of support I barely had to get. I also had the most amazing doula and she did a ton of like postpartum cooking and checking us and we have all the best friends and family. So that was amazing and I'm so glad that I had support and we already had a ton of meals cooked and I tried to do first 40 days in a lot of ways just to be nourished and stay warm and all of that.
Speaker 3:But yeah, I was waddling and bleeding a lot and my husband was changing me and it was pretty bad and then I ended up getting really constipated. Here's another little nugget of information for you guys Lactation balls are not that great. They can cause horrific constipation. No, the oats and the yeast are known to make you extremely constipated, which I did not know, and they actually don't really help lactation. I talked to my lactation consultant about this. If you wanna follow her, she's Milkmasters on Instagram. She's the smartest woman I've ever met, anyways.
Speaker 3:So I was doing these lactation balls crazy. I ended up getting really constipated and I was so constipated one day I pushed so hard I think I already had the prolapse, but I made the prolapse so bad and then I ended up in the emergency room a couple days later. I was in so much pain I had what is it called when the stool is stuck Impact Impacted. Yeah, I had like impact. So basically, I had a bunch of poop stuck in my stomach. I couldn't poop, I was extremely constipated and I had a prolapse and so I was feeling tissue come out of my vagina and I was just in extreme pain, and so that made the healing so much worse, and I'm still dealing with the healing from the prolapse. But yeah, it was really brutal.
Speaker 3:So there's just like a lot of things compounding, literally and figuratively on top of each other and at the same time I got back into movement pretty quickly. I love working out. I worked out my whole pregnancy. I've been an athlete my whole life and so I was in the gym three or four weeks postpartum just like stretching and moving and that felt really good for me and just making sure my nutrition was good and I was in a really good place. Ro was actually sleeping really well I think co-sleeping went really well for us until she hit her four-month sleep regression and then she basically was up every one to two hours until two weeks ago. She slept 11 hours two nights ago.
Speaker 1:Praise. I was very scared.
Speaker 3:I thought something bad happened.
Speaker 1:Yeah, when you wake up in a panic, I'm still asleep.
Speaker 3:I'm like looking on the monitor, crazy person. But yeah, and so that after four months like four to seven months I had a really bad postpartum depression, really bad anxiety, really horrible, terrible thoughts, and yeah, that was a really scary time and it was really amazing. Again, my husband is so wonderful. He it was a couple of days where I was being a total psycho bitch and I was like screaming to him and just being really irrational and kind of out of control and it's just not how we are. And at first he was like the fuck, like why being like this? And kind of yelling back at me and it was the whole thing. And then he came to me one afternoon. He's like, hey, this feels a lot like IVF.
Speaker 3:And I was like does, and I realized like my hormones were just so out of whack and I was so tired that it was just crushing me.
Speaker 3:And so I immediately reached out to our birth coach, emily Stanwick, and I was like, hey, this is what's going on, I'm not okay. And so we talked through everything and she was super supportive and I just started sharing with other people what I was dealing with and it was super validating because so many moms obviously deal with that and it just really helped for me to realize that I wasn't crazy. And then I was going through, obviously, exhaustion and then a huge hormone swing and shift and all of that, and so I came out of that around seven, seven and a half months and I've been pretty stable since then. I do have a hard time. I had got my period back at around four or five months as well and I do notice that around my period I do feel those like intense hormone swings more than normal, but other than that I feel pretty stable and I'm sleeping more now. So that's been really helpful.
Speaker 2:That's good, and sleep will give you a good mind fuck for sure. And you didn't even sleep at all during your tail end of your pregnancy Exactly. I am so surprised, I don't know. Wow, I don't think I could have functioned or lived and look at you Thanks.
Speaker 1:He's back. We actually just interviewed a mom who she has a support group for moms in that four to six month period Because she said it's just, your hormones are just all over the place and that's the time where people stop checking in on you.
Speaker 3:Yeah, so, yeah, that's interesting that that all happened at that four month mark, totally yeah, and I think that's why it's so important to just be OK with asking for help. We have really good friends, their baby. He was born and he was blue and not moving and ended up in the NICU for 10 days and now he's on oxygen, he's home, he's doing great and he's not sleeping and it's just been a really really hard month for them. And I keep reaching out to her and I'm like ask for help, tell me if you want me to come over and hold the baby while you sleep. I will come over and clean while you hold the baby. Just ask for help.
Speaker 3:I said it will make you crazy and you are not crazy and you need to be OK Sending out your SOS signal to all your people and be like.
Speaker 3:You guys need to show the fuck up right now. This is not OK and I don't think that we're good enough at doing that of being like yo guys all hands on deck, I'm not well, like I'm not well. And it's not just around pregnancy, I think it's just women in general. We're not good at asking for help. We're not good at saying like this is not OK. I need you to physically be here, get on a plane, fly here, show up at my house and take care of me because I'm not OK. And I've just realized that is the most profound thing that you could do for someone is to show up for them and to basically barge into their house and be like, no, I'm here. And I wish that more people had that and felt that, because I think we'd all have a lot better time healing and feeling supported and feeling whole and not going down these paths that make us just feel wrong and bad and crazy.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah. I feel like our generation is definitely like getting better at asking for help and just talking about all these things. So it's going to be really interesting about Gen Z and Gen A, like hopefully they will be able to talk about their feelings better in general.
Speaker 2:Yeah, yeah, so scary. Yeah, I had a really hard time. I feel like a lot of people didn't really show up for me on Baby Number Two and I was just talking to Liz about this Like there were very minimal people who actually showed up for me on Baby Number Two. It's like the excitement just isn't there. The second round, and I wasn't OK and I felt like I was just screaming until some blank here sometimes. So, yep, I love your attitude about that. Keep doing that. Make sure you have that for Baby Number Two too, if you decide to go that way. But yeah, I feel like that's overlooked.
Speaker 3:Yeah, and isn't it crazy? Because, from what I hear, going from one to two is insane so you would think that more people would show up when there's more tiny humans to take care of.
Speaker 2:I know, I know I didn't feel that way. Yeah, I don't know. I feel like I have to kind of process this after we get off too, I don't know. But thank you so much for sharing a lot of that, do you like?
Speaker 3:how are you feeling now, 10 months postpartum, and yeah, I feel like I really started to feel like myself again around nine, nine and a half months so pretty recently and I run my own company. I have 13 people on my team, I have a lot of responsibility, I'm the breadwinner of our family and I think that I didn't take enough time off maternity leave. I basically went back to work after six weeks and I swear to God I will never do that again. I'm saying four months on the next one.
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 3:So I learned a lot, but I'm really feeling like myself. I feel like really good in my body. I'm still dealing with the prolapse. I just started this amazing new pelvic floor program. I've come a long way and I still feel the tissue and want to do a lot more strengthening before I get pregnant again, but I feel physically so strong and so clear and I feel like one of my superpowers now is regulating my nervous system and it feels really nice because I was never good at that and I feel like my daughter has been such a catalyst in me really owning how powerful I am and the abilities I have to navigate hard things and to make sure that I take care of myself, because that's a direct reflection of how I'm taking care of her and how I can show up for her.
Speaker 3:And I mean you guys know this, when you have kids it becomes your why for everything you do and there's so much more on the line, and so I feel like she's really called me forward in being the best version of myself and owning my power and being unafraid to go after things and dream big. And it feels really good and I know that I'm in my purpose as a mother and so it's really cool to be able to continue living my life and building this company and going after my dreams and doing things that really matter to me and really connecting deeply with my husband and continuing to grow our relationship, while also being really present for her and present in my body. Yeah, so things feel really really good now and that's really exciting.
Speaker 2:That's awesome. I can see the glow in your face, so.
Speaker 1:Sorry. What kind of things do you do for your mental health? You talked a little bit about regulating your nervous system. Tell me more.
Speaker 3:Yeah, I mean, I feel like meditation and breathwork has been really important for me, and also I just really try and pause a lot. I have been a very anxious person, very controlling and perfectionist, and so those tendencies, when you're really tired, come back, and they come back really strong. And so I think that one of the best things that I've learned to do is, when I feel like a reaction that feels really emotional or just kind of irrational, I try and pause and be like what's going on right now before I respond, and that's really helped me sort of notice like, okay, what do I need in this moment? Because that's a very irrational response to this thing, and so what do I actually need? And so then I'm able to check in with myself and realize, oh, I have not had a long time in three days. I need to go and take an hour for myself and go for a walk or workout or take a bath or call my girlfriends and just catch up. I need to do things for me, and so I think that's been really, really helpful.
Speaker 3:And then also asking for help and allowing my husband to be the parent and take care of her daughter and show up like he was so incredible, and he still does this from time to time when I need it. But in the beginning, one of the best pieces of advice we got was that he takes the baby in the morning for two hours while I get really good restful sleep, and that was huge for me. It was usually the best sleep that I was going to get and I was uninterrupted, and then I would come out and he would have breakfast ready for me and it was incredible. And so I think continuing to allow him to show up for me as much as possible in that way whether it was cleaning or cooking or going to the grocery store he knows that I need help and I can't do everything anymore because I have to worry about a little person who can't be carted around all the time.
Speaker 3:And even tomorrow I'm going to Pilates at 7 am, so he's going to have Ro for two hours in the morning. He's like I'm so happy that you get to go to Pilates and I didn't ask like, hey, can I go. I put it on the calendar and I was like so you're watching Ro for two hours and then the nanny will be here and then you can do what you need to do, and then also having help like having a nanny has really, really helped. She's here five days a week for six or seven hours a day. I try and get all my work done then so that I can be present with my daughter before and after, and then obviously I'm with her much of the night. Not as much anymore because she's learning to sleep, oh God, but I was up every hour with her for 10 months. So, yeah, I think that's been really helpful too.
Speaker 1:That's awesome, I love that.
Speaker 2:So where can our listeners find you?
Speaker 3:Yeah, I want Instagram at KellyTMore and our website is soulfireproductionscocom, but my DMs are open. So if anyone has questions or wants clarification on anything, I'm totally here to help and any resources that I can provide.
Speaker 2:Thank you so much for sharing your story. I'm happy that I heard more of it, because I guess I just didn't get to the pepper. There's so much more.
Speaker 3:Thank you, thank you guys, for having me. I really appreciate it.
Speaker 2:Thank you, we'll see you next episode.
Speaker 1:Thank you for joining us on this episode of the Golden Hour Birth Podcast. We hope you've enjoyed our discussion and found it insightful and beneficial. Remember, the Golden Hour Birth Podcast is made possible by the support of listeners like you. If you appreciate the content we bring you each week, consider leaving us a review on your favorite podcast platform or sharing the show with your friends and family. Your support helps us reach more people and continue creating valuable episodes. If you have any questions, suggestions or topics you'd like us to cover in future episodes, we'd love to hear from you. You can reach us on our website, www. Goldenhourbirthpodcast, or connect with us on social media. We value your feedback and want to make sure that we're delivering the content you want to hear. Before we sign off, we'd like to express our gratitude to our incredible guests who joined us today. We are honored that they trust us enough to be so open and vulnerable. We're grateful for their time and willingness to share their stories with us.
Speaker 1:If you're interested in taking the conversation further with us, join us on our Facebook group, the Golden Hour Birth Circle. We'll be back next week with another exciting episode, so be sure to tune in. Until then, stay golden and remember to take care of yourself. We'll catch you on the next episode of the Golden Hour Birth Podcast. Bye.