We Are PoWEr Podcast
The We Are PoWEr podcast spotlights voices and perspectives that need to be heard. Our weekly podcast, with listeners in over 60 countries, delivers PoWErful conversations that inspire, challenge, and empower... from personal life stories to business insights and leadership lessons.
We share diverse experiences, bold discussions, and real solutions. Whether you're looking for career advice, topical themes, or stories of resilience and success - this is where voices spark change.
We Are PoWEr Podcast
"If It’s Difficult, It’s Worth Doing" - Nazir Afzal OBE
The brilliant Nazir Afzal OBE joins the We Are PoWEr Podcast – bringing honesty, courage, and a lifetime of fighting for justice and inclusion. Chancellor of the University of Manchester, Chair of the Lowry, and tireless advocate for equity, Nazir refuses to let diversity become a tick-box exercise – instead, he challenges leaders to make allyship active, authentic, and accountable.
From calling out institutional misogyny to championing gender equality, Nazir shares why the retreat from diversity initiatives is not only harmful but deeply damaging to employees who are told, in effect, "we don’t believe in you anymore." He reminds us that while men are often part of the problem, they are also essential to the solution – and must step up, not out, when the work feels difficult.
In a conversation rich with challenge and hope, Nazir and Simone explore what real leadership looks like when values are tested, why measuring social impact matters, and how storytelling and community are vital tools for lasting change. For Nazir, the bottom line is clear: courage in leadership isn’t about following trends, but about standing firm when it matters most.
00:00 Welcome to the We Are Power Podcast
00:46 Introduction to Nazir Afzal OBE
02:06 Achievements and Roles
05:01 Advocacy and Leadership
08:23 Challenges and Pushbacks
12:29 The Importance of Inclusion
16:21 Celebrating Achievements
18:23 The Role of Male Leaders in Gender Equality
18:53 The Power of Advocacy and Support
20:06 Challenges Faced by Women in Male-Dominated Fields
21:37 Institutional Misogyny and Safety Measures
24:12 The Importance of Genuine Leadership Engagement
27:44 Measuring Social Impact and Value
29:44 Encouraging Community and Storytelling
32:18 Final Thoughts and Call to Action
Find out more about We Are PoWEr here. 💫
Hello, hello and welcome to the we Are Power podcast. If this is your first time here, the we Are Power podcast is the podcast for you, your career and your life. We release an episode every single Monday with listeners in over 60 countries worldwide, where you'll hear personal life stories, top-notch industry advice and key leadership insight from amazing role models. As we Are Power is the umbrella brand to Northern Power Women Awards, which celebrates hundreds of female role models and advocates every year. This is where you can hear stories from all of our awards alumni and stay up to date with everything. Mpw Awards and we Are Power. Hello and welcome to a very special edition of the we Are Power podcast. I'm delighted today to be joined by superstar Nazir Afzal-Obe, patron of the Northern Power Awards advocacy list and advocacy community, which we set up last year. Multi-winner of MPW Awards actually 2018. Commended to that, rob Mukherjee. He pipped your crown, that lad.
Speaker 2:Somebody else has to win sometimes, I know I know.
Speaker 1:And then 2022, you won the inaugural Disruptor for Good. Award as well which I remember you trekked up from the Midlands for to attend that evening.
Speaker 2:I think you were saying you have to come. You have to come. Why does she want me so desperately to be there? No, I know.
Speaker 1:But thank you. Thank you for so many things. Thank you for being here today and joining us on this special edition, but thank you for all your support, unwavering support from year one, even when it was a ridiculous idea. What are we doing?
Speaker 2:It was never ridiculous, simone, but you know, we thought we were making massive progress across the sector, across the country, if not across the world, and saddest thing is that we're going backwards over the last year or two. I think we're going to have to talk about that.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I think that's where you know you have an amazing story and you've achieved, and you're so accomplished You're the Chancellor of the University of Manchester. I've got a few sort of questions just before we get in.
Speaker 2:If you had to go back as a student.
Speaker 1:What would you study?
Speaker 2:Well, I studied law and actually, going back, I'd probably study law again, simply because um, I just use that as a tool. Law gives you critical thinking. It makes, gives you advocacy skills. So actually they were really useful for all the other things I've done in my life. Um, had I, had I done what my family wanted me to do was to become a doctor, I'm not entirely sure that I'd have achieved so much.
Speaker 1:And you have multi-roles. I think people call them portfolio now, don't?
Speaker 2:they. Absolutely, that's one word for it. I mean, I'm just really, really privileged. I wake up in the morning and every hour of every day is like, for example, right now is full of things that I want to be doing. I go to bed and I do the same thing tomorrow.
Speaker 2:So you mentioned Chancellor of the University of Manchester, which is a phenomenal role. I mean Manchester's 29 in the world, it's 26 Nobel Prizes, 48,000 students, and you know I have the privilege of graduating everybody and meeting all these people who are much cleverer than I am. And then I'm chair of the Lowry, which is, you know, I know we're in Liverpool right now, but the Lowry is the national theater of the north and you know it's a phenomenal institution, um, which is growing from strength to strength. I'm chair of the church of england's national safeguarding panel. You know, this little muslim boy from birmingham is chair of the church of england's national safeguarding panel. And before that I was chair of the catholic churches. Um, in fact, I founded the catholic churches agency. I'm a board member of the Creative Industry Standards Authority, which again was created by me and the rest of my board members. I'm just delighted to be doing stuff in all different areas of society and hopefully trying to make a difference.
Speaker 1:And what binds all those roles? Is there a common thread or is there a common purpose that you take into all of them?
Speaker 2:Yeah, all of them are about ensuring people are safe and people can flourish, and that's it. It's as simple as that. So, yeah, safeguarding speaks for itself. But some of the other roles are not just about safeguarding, about ensuring that people can flourish in the workplace, can look, you know, their potential can be maximized. When I do those graduations for Emily Simone, in front of me there are hundreds and hundreds of students who are graduating and thousands of parents and family members and the rest of it, and they are the future. And I have, in the few minutes I have with them, the ability to motivate them, inspire them and they motivate, inspire me. And every time, you know, know I've dealt with the worst that humanity does to each other. And there I'm in a room working with the people who are delivering the best. It's a real honor, a real privilege. So that's it. It's that, it's the fact that we can somehow motivate, inspire the next generation, but also ensure that the current generation is kept safe and what you snuck into the conversation there.
Speaker 1:This is the the we Are Power podcast, but formed out of the organization that was Northern Power Women and Northern Power Awards. How northern are you? Because you're a Brummie lad.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I was born. I always say I was born in Birmingham. I then spent 20 odd years in London, so I was nurtured in London, but I was made in Manchester and I was made here in the northwest of England. So you know, I came here in 2011. When I arrived, I knew nobody in the north of England absolutely nobody.
Speaker 2:And now you know, people ask me for selfies and stuff. It's absolutely phenomenal. Yeah, I'm running the chance of running the chance of the largest university in the north, largest theatre in the north. Yeah, I'm just in a really, really good place. But that's because everybody here has made me feel so welcome. And the opportunities that exist I've been lucky to take them, but they all exist for everybody else too.
Speaker 1:And I think, to have and create opportunity, we have to create great environments, inclusive cultures, openness, and at this year's Northern Power Women Awards, you stood um, you gave time, like you always do, for us, and you stood on that stage and you spoke in advance of announcing the 2025 advocacy list and you had out some quite stark facts out there, didn't you? But that was in the feedback that we did, uh, post. It was. That was one of the standout moments of the evening, because not just because of the harshness and the severity of how you talk, but actually that's what motivated people into action.
Speaker 2:I always say that allyship is a verb, not a noun. So, people, there are lots of organizations that say you know, I'm an ally. What's that mean? Unless you've done something? Not a noun. So there are lots of organizations that say you know, I'm an ally, what's that mean? Unless you've done something? It means nothing. And so, absolutely, we've got to be able to demonstrate what allyship really stands for, and that is about taking action. And so I'm glad you reminded me of what I said at the we Are Power Awards last year. I did something similar recently with, of all places, the British Cardiology Association 2,000 cardiologists, 19% of them were women, and the women had told me beforehand that there's no plan for making that 30% or 40%. And so whilst I thought I was going to be saying things you know sort of nice things about heart surgeons, actually I went in there and told them off and the president said immediately afterwards all right, next year's conference is all going to have to be about how we ensure gender equality. So the only way you get people sometimes to change their approach is by being blunt. And you're absolutely right, it has to be evidence-based. So when I said at the MP you know your awards last year.
Speaker 2:You know, one in four women suffer domestic abuse. One in five women are sexually assaulted. Two women every week are killed by their partners or ex-partners. Ten women every week take their own lives because of the abuse they're suffering. More than 3.1 million British adults were sexually abused as children. That's one in 20. So any room you go into in this country of more than 20 people, just think about what you have in front of you. That is the pandemic that will outlive the one that we went through, and the evidence says, unfortunately, that this is not getting any better. If anything, it's getting worse. At the same time, all the efforts that you're making to try and restore equity or bring equity and inclusion, there's pushback on that, and so hang on a minute.
Speaker 2:We're supposed to be fixing things and yet we're going backwards. I don't understand any of that. So the evidence speaks for itself the stories you know. Know I'm really honored, privileged um. Where I can, I've sat with the victims of horrible crimes. I've sat with the families of people who've lost their loved ones in terrible circumstances, and you can't leave a room like that not changed.
Speaker 2:I remember when I did the review of london fire brigade, which is, you know, a cultural review, three or four years ago. I remember one day I was sat with um you know these people who are not previously had never said anything about what was going on. There were nine women, one after another, very some of them in very senior roles within the fire service, and they were in tears, telling me about their experiences within the workplace. And at the end of that day I kid you not not only had all the tissues that we'd bought run out, because they'd cried themselves silly, really, given how much they were talking about. At the end of that day I, given what I've been through, I had to ring my therapist to get some counselling because of just the stories I was hearing from them. And that's what we're dealing with. Most people suffer in silence. As they say, they don't talk about what it is they're experiencing, but when they get the opportunity to talk about it, it is extraordinary how many people are suffering, and that's why what you do is so important.
Speaker 1:But there is a pushback. We are as a small micro organisation. It's not about us, but you know it'd be remiss of us not to talk about this, because there are so many conversations that we are having in the margins at the moment and wide or in open, and it's oh, we can't do that, we're not doing that, we can't do anything to do with that, we can't play there, we can't put our money there, and it's hard sometimes to understand what's the difference between dropping it and using it as an opportunity to go in a different direction or being fearful of what's happening on the other side of the pond. Is this all about what's happening in America?
Speaker 2:Well, I mean yeah, absolutely. What's happening in America has given people pause for thought. Yeah, absolutely. But what you've described there for me is a failure of leadership. It's a lack of courage.
Speaker 2:I was always brought up to think you must do the right thing. These people don't want to do the right thing and they're using excuses, simone, if they're telling you, as you've indicated, that they don't want to carry on with the relationship with. We Are Power, for whatever reason, or blaming what's happening in the States, they don't have to follow, they have to lead. And the other thing to be said is that, whatever happens in the United States, they have four-year government, so, who knows, in three years' time there'll be a different government. Are they going to go back and pivot back? What message do they send to their own staff? This is what I keep getting.
Speaker 2:The whole point of what you do is about generating safety within the staff, about ensuring that people within organizations are able to advance uh, equity, inclusion, all the things that you. You know the message you're sending to them by saying we don't want to, we don't want to relate with. We are power organizations like what you like you is we don't believe, we don't believe in you anymore. We don't like you, we don't trust you. This is our own staff. Uh, you don't believe in you anymore. We don't like you, we don't trust you. This is our own stuff, you don't need to move on. And what will happen and I bet you this will happen, I don't know if it's happening already is they'll start losing the stuff. The people who are there because they thought their organization believed in them, that gave them the opportunity to progress, to develop, develop, will start thinking I need to go somewhere else.
Speaker 1:This is a toxic environment Is that what they want, and nobody wants it. We all want the best people within our organizations, don't we? We all want that, but not every organization is ignoring it, isn't it? I think we talked, was it, walt Disney?
Speaker 2:No, Warner Brothers.
Speaker 1:Warner Brothers, sorry.
Speaker 2:One of my hats is creative industry standards authority and so I'm engaging with the BBC, itv, all these organizations and Warner Brothers. I sat down with Warner Brothers and I said are you feeling the pressure? They said we're feeling the pressure. So what we did was we got the D and the E and we're doing the I, so we don't have diversity and inclusion. Diversity and equality is inclusion, so we're just going to focus on the inclusion. There you go Like magic. They're still doing everything they were doing and putting the accelerator down actually, and doing more of it rather than pushing back. If they can do it and they're a multi-billion pound company why are these other companies saying to you somehow this is going to damage their brand in America? That's nonsense.
Speaker 1:And that's what always strikes me. Surely it's just being a bit mischievous creative.
Speaker 2:Creative is the word.
Speaker 1:Disruptive, for good, you know. Or just choosing a different language, Because actually every decade or so, or probably less than that, twice a decade acronyms change, don't they? 100%? You know how many acronyms have we had about inclusion, equity, equality, diversity, so surely I'm all for pause for thought. I'm all for that because there's no doing that one thing all the time. It's not always the right thing. There's always a good opportunity to change and revisit and review, absolutely. But, not to chuck things out.
Speaker 2:Most people don't even understand what they're talking about. I was going past a sign when I was in London recently and it was, you know, one of those signs on a floor where it might be slippery, and the sign was be careful, this flooring might be slippery when it's wet, and somebody scrubbed it all out and written down DEI is dead. Since when is health and safety DEI you? Dei is dead. Since when is health and safety DEI you know? All right, carry on, Slip on. The bloody thing this is. What we're up against is people don't even understand what they're dealing with, and the important point is that there's a business case for being inclusive. There's a business case. You are ensuring that your staff develop, that your staff progress, that your staff stay with you. That's what you're doing. You're ensuring that they're safe. You're ensuring that they can be phenomenal citizens. So if you don't do any of this, what are you saying to them?
Speaker 1:And I think that's the thing we have seen some leaders, haven't we? We've talked about an example there, but we have seen some leaders in isolation, but there doesn't seem to be as many as you would have hoped.
Speaker 2:No, no, I mean, I'm glad you're doing the advocacy list. It's phenomenal that you're doing that. Maybe you need to do a leader's list. You know top of my head stuff where these people who are really making a difference at the most senior levels of an organization, who are pushing back against the pushback, we need to recognize and celebrate them. This who are pushing back against the pushback, we need to recognize and celebrate them. This is quite a lonely thing being a leader.
Speaker 2:Very often, all you get is negativity and what you do with the awards is recognizing the value that people add. We need to recognize the people who are pushing back against the pushback because they need to be valued for what they're doing and that will hopefully encourage other people to think that way. But also, we're not going to do it on this um podcast, but we need to call out those who are being the weak, uh, who are um lacking courage, who are, for whatever reason, um deciding that they will not commit to this and are somehow revoking their membership or their support for what you're doing because, quite frankly, unless you call it out, they think they've got away with it and, of course, their staff may not ever hear about it, so their staff may not ever hear that they've got no relationship with. We Are Power anymore and you're being sensitive and you don't want to publicly say these things. However, there's a message to staff which is you know, if they don't value us, what hope is there of them valuing you?
Speaker 1:And I think it's interesting because we, as I say, we were born out of Northern Power Women, northern Power Women Awards. We have the we Are Power umbrella so that it can, because we know a lot of organisations we work with are from the North and from represented in, so we create that wider community because it's a place for. So, whether it's um, we're giving, we're enabling opportunities, whether we're shining a light, we we always want to focus on what we can do. So there's always a positive spin in what we do and I think there's a there's a part, I think, sometimes in educating. Sometimes people see the awards as just one night and a fancy dinner and a beautiful trophy and all that kind of things, which of course it is, but it's so much more than that. It's the wraparound Everyone who comes to the awards. We have a fantastic mentoring program that sits with it. So not quite everyone's a winner, but there is an element of you know, more so than any other award.
Speaker 2:I can think of Most awards I go to. We say to the nominees well, you're a winner too, and they'll go. No, you didn't really mean that, did you? But with we Are Power. Yes, whenever I go to your dinners I'm really lucky that I get the chance to do so the nominees feel as proud of being a nominated person as the winners do, and that's a trick Well done.
Speaker 1:And do you know? The secret is WhatsApp groups. You know, sometimes it's building those sub-communities and I think that's what we've done over the years, because when we set up the advocacy, the first advocacy list, last year, in some ways it was a frustration, because right from day one, we've always been all genders. That's always been really important. This has never been sort of a single agenda. This is this is not a woman's problem to solve, right. This is. This is a let's get everyone in round the table at the sofa. Everyone can do something, everyone has the power to do something for good. That's, that's 100, and I think. And even from that first year when I opened and said, oh, it's all genders, the, the awards were open to all genders and I got some kickback.
Speaker 1:Why are men involved? But this is the whole point, isn't it? You need, because of you have to look at statistics to know the majority of leaders are male. So we're not going to go and finger point and go do this, do this, just. This is all part of being part of the change, but it's that you talk. You actually talk. Sorry, nizia. You talk about. Power is both a burden and responsibility. It's something that. But how can leaders use that power for good, because we sit at work with our advocates and we'll come back.
Speaker 2:Yeah, absolutely, we'll come to that. You know, I get real energy from other people, so the fact that you've got really passionate advocates who demonstrated that they are going to be advocates I come away feeling happier, filled, more energized by just being in their company. I get so much out of that. But at the same time, you know what can I say? I said to you a moment ago that women are suffering, and they have been historically and they continue to do so, and variably.
Speaker 2:There's a man who is the problem, not all men. Let's make it very, very clear. The vast majority of us are not abusers or sexist or whatever, but misogyny is rampant in society. We know that for a fact. So men are also the answer to women's empowerment. And the fact that you have an advocacy list and you've demonstrated that there are men here who are prepared to stand up and say I'm going to fight for women's equity, not because I've got daughters.
Speaker 2:I always got really pissed off when Richard Sunak used to say, when he was prime minister, I'm doing this for my daughters. No, you're doing it for everybody's daughters. You know, literally, don't make it about your own daughters. It's because it's the right thing to do and that's why we do what we do, and you know, men and boys, unfortunately, we're suffering too, you know, not getting away from it. Men are more likely to take their own lives With everything that's going on in the world right now.
Speaker 2:Men undoubtedly feel in some way respected, neglected. However, that's not because of women. That's because of other men. Undoubtedly, you mentioned, I think, seven out of the top 100 FTSE companies has a woman CEO. Here we are in 2025, seven out of 100, you know. Yet we're meant to be and 51% of the population is women. So we're some, some way, and yet that seems to be too far. So, absolutely, men and boys have to confront the issues that we're facing and the challenges that we have, but also what we do and the fact that we, in some way, shape or form, are ensuring that women can't achieve their potential, and that's why it's important to engage with all genders and not just for women to work with real power.
Speaker 1:And there's no one sticking plaster. There's no one, because it would just be a sticking plaster. But I think often, and I think from a leadership perspective, people sometimes think it's too difficult. So we think that's in some ways some of the pushback. At the moment We'll just get rid of that because it's easy, because you know it's not going to hurt our. We don't want it to hurt our bottom line. There's almost a blinkered approach to that, absolutely.
Speaker 2:I mean, I go back to that report on London Fire. You can go on, it's online. One of the things I found with the misogyny it was the first organization that's ever been found to be institutionally misogynist, and the reason why I said that was the experience of women I mentioned earlier on, but also that women were telling me that some male firefighters, when they were doing home visits, would, when the women in the house had turned their backs, go through their underwear drawer. I thought what?
Speaker 1:what what?
Speaker 2:what In 2023, whatever that was. And so women did not have confidence that they felt safe when approached by a male firefighter. So one of my recommendations was body-worn camera that every firefighter should have body-worn camera, because that provides reassurance to anybody they engage with, but also to the person wearing the body-worn camera. And the Mayor of London put X millions behind it and they now have body-worn camera. Do you remember when Sarah Everard was murdered by I won't even name the guy, but the former police officer?
Speaker 2:Immediately afterwards, the ridiculous reaction of the Metropolitan Police was to tell women if you're not happy with the officer in front of you, flag down a taxi or a bus. That's what we've got to. We're telling women if you can't trust a police officer or a firefighter or somebody in a position of power responsibility, flag down a bus or a taxi. Well, we're in a bad place, aren't we? Now, in order to fix that, we can't keep. Is that a definition of insanity?
Speaker 2:If you do the same thing, you get the same response. What you do is different, what we are power does is different, and that's what people should be engaging with, organizations and businesses should be engaging with, because that's ultimately how they ensure not only that the women working for them and the women they engage with are safe, but the men feel safe, that the men feel that they can ensure that women progress within their organization. It is a win-win for everybody. And yet, for some reason, organizations well well, we know what reason the organizations are sort of stepping away from it and thinking it's too hard or too difficult. You know, if it wasn't difficult then I wouldn't do it. You know, I've been asked lots of times to do something I've done before and I never do something twice because it's been done. So similarly, all of us, you know, we all need to be thinking if it's difficult, it's worth doing.
Speaker 1:So how do we? Because if not us, who right?
Speaker 2:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And if not us, our listeners, our watchers? There's actions to be. It's deeds, not words.
Speaker 2:Actions, exactly Actions. I mean, I don't believe in. You know, I've sat recently with I wouldn't even say who it was very famous person and all the way this person was talking as if and everybody in the audience was thinking you don't believe a word of what you're saying. You know it's like, you know, you know the script, but you don't believe a word of what you're saying. You know it's like, uh, um, you know you, you, you know the script, but you don't know the story. You know, and too often, unfortunately, people in in leadership positions know the script but they don't know the story.
Speaker 2:And very, very often their idea of engagement with their staff, for example, is the regular staff meeting. Or, by the way, we have a Teams meeting once a month, etc. Etc. And somehow that's me engaging. No, it's not. You know, as human beings, we have empathy, we have sensitivity, the things that make us what we are, and that's what we need to be using more of. And it shouldn't be because of your daughters, it shouldn't be because there's some penalty for doing so. It's because it's the right thing to do and the more and more of us that speak up about this subject as I said, not for today, but we need to start calling them out, those people who are not on the journey with us.
Speaker 2:But at the same time, those who are on the journey with us need to be valued and respected, and we need more of them to put their hands up and say I'm going to carry on regardless and, as I said, the business case is there. It's not about no longer, not enough. We know the ethical case, we know the moral case, we know the legal case. The business case is there for doing the work that you're doing, and so we've got to keep repeating that mantra, simone, the more we do it, eventually you'll get through, but there will be some people that you'll never get through to, and those are the ones that we need to work with 100%.
Speaker 1:I think sometimes there's no point preaching to the converted because they're actually you having two of your religious affiliations.
Speaker 2:Exactly this is what we do, and this is the world we've become now is that we live in our echo chambers and so when you're on social media, the only people that you engage with are the people who follow you and you think somehow your whole world view is based on people who think like you. Actually, break that, go and talk to somebody that you, somebody that isn't from your echo chamber.
Speaker 1:Well, when we've had our advocacy dinners and not disclosing the conversations we have, but one of the big things that came out of them is the listening, isn't it? And being curious, don't just assume you think you know or be too afraid to be the advocate or to speak up. It's actually, again, it's the same thing If it doesn't feel right. I always think it's a bit of the nana test, would you say in front of your nana. You know, would you, would you have that behavior there? Absolutely not.
Speaker 1:I think I'm always very proud that we we will come from a we've never been a rinse and repeat organization. You may see that the awards 10th year next year. It's a big year, right, and so one of the things I think sometimes you have to take when there's a situation like this but sometimes it feels quite beaten down uh, the wonderful becky taylor I see at the moment is has put a shout out. She's doing a great event for tech women, women in tech, and she's like I've got, I'm nearly full, but I can't find the sponsors and the partners, and it's I, I'm barely going to break even. So she's just gone bold and put a GoFundMe page out and I'm just like 100%, but I think it's, and it's the same as it. You can't be. We could go over here and keep waiting, keep waiting, build a field and it will come, or we can try different things, we do different things, and I think one of the things that we are doing in the moment you talked about the measurability and what get measured gets done.
Speaker 1:I've always thought, well, how do we measure the impact? Because people see the awards, one dinner, shiny dresses, all that, not shiny, I don't know, maybe, um, but you see that it's not just about that, it's about everything that sits around it. So at that we did it. Uh, at the back end of covid. So the lockdown period, we did a whole bit of connectivity between your fine university, actually 13 universities across the North, because there was a bit of there was a lack of connectivity, wasn't there? Because we're all sent home, and I was really upset, actually, that you've got all these great leaders out there who want to have that give back and you know the good ones, not just the ones for show.
Speaker 1:And then you've got the students who are suddenly living at home, maybe where they weren't expecting to study and develop and all that kind of thing, and we wanted to put that thread, that pipeline, be three. So we innovated In that time. That was a really tricky time for the world. We did what we could do.
Speaker 2:And what was the social impact. So what we could do and what was it?
Speaker 1:What was the social impact? So what we did is we originally measured it. It was, and I was like what is that? What is this?
Speaker 1:social value thing that people are measuring and we used this thing called TOMS I can't even get there was acronyms for acronyms but we got some help from a professional services organisation who helped ratify it. For us, three quarters of a million and what we've done by just joining the dots and creating conversations and I'm like we've done this for years, we're good at it, we're northern, we're good at chatting, we care about people, we do things with purpose and people want to pass on that skills and knowledge that now we're now in excess of, probably just short of three million in what we've created, but I think we're more. So we're using, using this opportunity now let's measure again. Let's look now, because the awards were never kept factored into that. These were these mentoring sessions.
Speaker 2:Okay, so it's a tiny bit of what you do.
Speaker 1:Yeah. So I'm excited about that because actually if that's what gets noticed and that's in our hands to do, then let's measure it. And then sometimes we don't all shout about the great stuff that we do. Let's shout about it. Let's get all of our advocates or everyone who's been involved in the well, 10 years and beyond of what we've done creating and building this community, Because this is communities of sub-communities and let's share that impact and stories and let's not have a humble brag about it.
Speaker 2:Let's brag about that. I mean, there's a human touch as well, because 10 years ago, there would have been somebody who was just leaving school, started working with you or went to a mentoring session who are now senior leaders in whatever organisation. That's impact too. So tell us actually. There's our shout out right, capture them.
Speaker 1:Tell us what you've done, tell us where you've done, tell us where you've been, tell us what you know. Sometimes I've got a podcast, a couple of podcasts tomorrow, and two of the people that I'm interviewing separately met at an mpw event, but went to school together but never knew each other so it's.
Speaker 1:Sometimes it's that what, what does? Yeah, I think jasmine in the office calls it the invisible thread that you don't know is there till it's ready to be activated. I probably made that up now, but I'm gonna take it anyway, but it's. But tell us I think let's leave this podcast with the positivity that everyone could be part of this tell us what. Let's measure. Let's measure, because sometimes that one thing, that one opportunity that you got when I see the linkedin posts about I did this and I was involved in that session I've now got a promotion, yay, yes, I find about this stuff anecdotally, let please don't be shy to the evidence we want.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we are very humble people, generally human beings. Uh, we need some people for one day, we want you to stop being humble. Tell us how we are power mpw the word before has changed you and what you've done since and who you've engaged with and who else you intend to engage with.
Speaker 1:Let's capture those stories we just started a campaign. Who knew I love coming to these without a plan?
Speaker 2:let's capture these stories. You know, at the end of the day it's about storytelling and you know 100. It's about impact. For every pound that people have given you over the years, you've generated multi, multi pounds. You know that's what the value statement will show. So we need to demonstrate the more money that you give we are power, the more that society will get back it feels like a bob geldof moment, but without the money, please, that can come to ring those ring those. What did he say? Pick up the phone.
Speaker 1:Nobody picks up my phone anymore but we still do that, is it? We still do that, don't we? Oh, we still do that.
Speaker 2:Don't we or WhatsApp me? Don't WhatsApp me, by the way, by all means. You know, show us how we Are. Power has impacted on your lives and the people around you. Also, talk about what you're going to be doing next. Let's capture that, too, and recognize that we are generally, as a society, really good people. You know, know, there are lots of bad people, but there's lots of good people, and we want to hear more of what good people are doing 100%.
Speaker 1:Nazir Afzal OBE. Don't know why we bother with notes, do we? We don't need those, um. Thank you so much. Thank you for always having our back. Thank you for helping us lead and drive the charge on this and never giving up no, you give me more than I give you.
Speaker 1:So thank you so much thank you, thank you so much for watching. Keep those stories coming in. It doesn't matter where you think it's something so small, because the sum of all those small parts add to something else will motivate someone else, will make someone else say, oh my god, I can, I can do that and I can make the change, and that's how we stem the flow of what is currently happening.
Speaker 1:Thank you so much for joining the we Are Power podcast. Thank you so much for joining us and we'll see you next time. Subscribe on YouTube, apple, amazon Music, spotify or wherever you get your podcasts, leave us a review or follow us on socials. We are power underscore net on insta, tiktok and twitter, or we are power on linkedin, facebook and we are underscore power on youtube.
