Madcat Podcast
This podcast captures the history of Pararescuemen (PJ) and Combat Rescue Officers (CRO). "That Others May Live" is the motto PJs and CROs live by, but we are also known for our obsession with late nights, small wooden idols and tattoos on our rear-ends. Join us for stories of new and old.
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Madcat Podcast
Christopher Tellsworth
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Join us in our mentorship series as we sit down with Retired Chief Tellsworth to explore his most memorable missions, including his experience with the Jessica Lynch rescue operation, and crucial lessons learned throughout his Pararescue career. We dive into the key characteristics of effective leadership and he shares the necessary traits of a strong team.
Military Career Journey and Transitions
Andrew Luceromadcap podcast . We're back . Got myself , andrew lucero and nick adagio here with uh chief tellsworth a retired chief tellsworth . Um , it's definitely an honor . Thank you for taking the time to to sit down with us and talk a little bit about your career yeah , I appreciate you guys , uh , even asking me to be here , so thanks , yeah if you like , please , uh just like introduce yourself and give your background and uh just like your career progression from start to finish . Sure , okay ?
Chris Tellsworthback in uh , high school I wasn't , uh , the stellar student . Basically I made grades to play sports and I didn't really have a mentor or anything like that . Back then my parents were divorced and it was just hanging on and growing up in a military family . I was like , well , I'm just going to join the military and all my buddies were joining the Marines and Navy and things like that . So a buddy of mine went down to the Air Force recruiters or actually , let me back up a second . My mom said , well , if you join the military , please just join the Air Force . They have a lot better lifestyle , way of life . And so , and so I went to air force recruiter and as a young kid one of my favorite movies was Rambo and play Rambo and war in the streets . So when I went into the recruiter and I said , hey , what's the special ? I said special forces of the air force .
Chris TellsworthBack then this , this recruiter , he pointed up on the wall and he said , hey , it's a , it's that . And it was . It was that old Shirley gray dot poster and it was pararescue and combat controllers . He said it's that . I go , okay , that's what I want to do . And he laughed and he goes , okay , come back to me in like two years years and uh , um , we'll see . But here's what you need to do . Go take your asvab and all this good stuff . And I did that and I scored like 100 on the mechanical piece of it and I uh , so he goes . Okay , you're gonna go , you're gonna be an aerospace engineer and I'm like , oh , that sounds pretty badass . I'm gonna be working on like the space shuttle or something , had no clue what I was doing and uh , they always put our best titles on those , yeah yeah , they do so .
Chris TellsworthBut . But he told me , hey , he goes . Hey , like on the fifth day of basic training on saturday , some dude's gonna walk in and go , hey , who wants to be a pj or combat controller ? And uh , raise your hand and then just go from there and here's what you're going to do . You're going to take this test . And I go , well , what's the test ? And he handed me a slip of paper and it was a 500 meter swim , mile and a half run , 15 push-ups or 15 pull-ups , 50 push-ups , 50 pull-ups or not 50 pull-ups , I'm sorry , 50 push-ups , 50 sit-ups . I'm like , oh , all right , I'm going to train to that . So I had six months and I trained to that and then early January I shipped off to basic training .
Chris TellsworthJust like he said , this hulking of a man came walking in . His name was , at the time , tech Sergeant Mike Baltz , and if you guys have ever seen pictures of the guy , he was just a freaking beast and that's the poster child of Pararescue . Back then he was on the three-page pamphlet that we all got and I'm like , oh my gosh , what am I getting myself into ? This dude's a beast , I'm a freaking little scrawny dude . What year was this ? This was 19 , this was uh . This was january of 94 when , when I first met my first pj , mike maltz , and uh , so I raised my hand . I went and took the pass test on the fourth day , our fifth , sixth day of basic training , and I think of like 60 dudes there that day , maybe eight of us passed . One of those guys happened to be Paul Schultz , good buddy of mine . He went on to be a PJ also , but that , and that is the one and only time I think I ever beat him on a run , uh , that mile and a half run . It's pretty quick back then , but um , so anyways , I know I'm dragging this out , but uh , what happened was I went through basic training and I , uh was now selected to go try and be a pararescue man . So I jumped on a bus after basic training . They drove me literally three blocks , stopped the bus , I jumped . I'm like where am I ? They're like you're here . Two casual cones come running up , they grabbed my two bags . They turn around . They run right into beeline , into the , the dorms there , or whatever they were called back in the day . So I ran with those guys and then that was the start of my Paris U journey .
Chris TellsworthBack then it was called the OLH it was on Lackland and OLH for operating location hotel . That's where I met some of my best buddies Now Colonel Romspert back then he was Senior Airman Rom Spurtz Chris Keene on the team . Paul Schultz was on our team , todd Canoppo there were a few other guys but out of the now about 50 dudes started our selection course at the OL , seven of us graduated to go on through the pipeline , went through the pipeline . Finally we graduated Pararrescue school in December of 1995 . In December of 95 , we shipped off to our duty stations , myself and a few of those guys Paul Schultz , rahm Spurt , there was a bunch of others , todd Knoppel no , actually he went up to Portland . We went to our first duty assignment .
Chris TellsworthMy first duty assignment was Patrick Air Force Base in the 41st Rescue Squadron . It was active duty back then and I believe it was 98 or 99 , we started hearing words Patrick Air Force Base active duty team was going to shut down and we were going to move up to Moody Air Force Base and so that happened in like 98 or 99 . I don't really recall the exact year , but I got up to Moody and didn't really like the swamp as much and so by this time I think I was . I was a senior airman , element leader getting ready , going through team leader upgrade . I was like this is not where I want to be . So I said , hey , I'm going to put in a package for the 2-4 . I talked with Mike Maltz about it , so I got the paperwork , I submitted a package and they gave me a tryout date . And when I did that , some of my other buddies were also getting ready to do the same thing . So I had really good friends Chad Evans , rob Gregg , mike Atkins , glenn Weir . We all put in packages to try out for the 2-4 . We went up , did a selection , initial selection . We got selected to come out and try out for the 2-4 . But you PCS'd up to the 2-4 . And now I'm at the 2-4 . 2-4 , I was there for the invasion of Afghanistan , invasion of Iraq .
Chris TellsworthFast forward a little bit . My now wife we were starting to want to have kids and Op Sempo was very high at the 2-4 , to say the least . So I decided to let my enlistment run out , talked with the dudes up in Alaska , went up there , interviewed with those guys , got selected by those guys and picked up a full-time active duty position at the Alaska team . While my enlistment was running out , I got called up into the commander's office and the directors of operations office at the two four . At the time it was Kurt Buller and he said hey T , what's your intentions ? And I go . My intentions are to go be a mountain man in Alaska . And he goes yeah , we figured something was up when you didn't sign your reenlistment paperwork . You want to go up here ? So yep , that's what I'm gonna do .
Chris TellsworthWas in Alaska for a couple of years , loved it , did a lot of cool , unique things my time up there . But what I quickly found out was the winters are dark and long and I truly didn't want to be in the cold that much I like it , I loved it , but I didn't want to be in it that much . So I started talking with the dudes down here in Tucson , chief Sanchez to be exact , and I wanted to make you know . Alaska is a great team , they do a lot of great things , but I wasn't making a lot of impacts up there . They do a lot of great things , but I wasn't making a lot of impacts up there , partially because I was a tech sergeant , master sergeant but they're an established organization and there wasn't a lot for me to bring to the table other than personal experience . So I talked to Sanch down here at Tucson . He said , hey , come down here and be my training superintendent . Compound that with the Longwinners , dark Knights , long Day , longwinters Knights Decided hey , we want to move Now . We have two kids . Let's move back down to the States . It's a lot easier to see the grandparents and the extended family . So we moved down to Tucson .
Chris TellsworthI joined the 306 as an active duty dude at the 306 . I finished down my career here at the 306 . As I moved up through the different positions within the 306 , from training NCYC , stan Valley , ncyc operations superintendent , and then ultimately became the chief and finished down my time here and retired down here at Tucson , stayed here in Tucson and I did a nice , a very good transition job . Stayed on base , transitioned over to Red Flag Rescue , setting up the stuff for rescue teams coming over to do Red Flag Rescue training . And then at one point I moved over to where I am now , which is at the . I'm at F3 EA as a program manager , still impacting the mission and still on helping out the , the , the guys and part of our tribe and our culture and our team and trying to make lasting impacts
Impact, Leadership, and Lessons Learned
Chris Tellsworthon that .
Andrew LuceroSo well , I mean one thing that I want to throw out . There is like you're still making an impact on the , on the , on the guys right now in the in the career field . But looking at your whole career , where would you say you felt the most fulfilled and the most like you were ?
Chris Tellsworthyou're providing the most impact I can't , I wouldn't , I wouldn't say there's uh , one single place , there's probably a couple and then a couple , a few different positions . The two , four was great , it was awesome , made a lot of impact . But you know , your impact is it's small , it's it's it's unique and it's niche because you don't , you don't branch out as much to the career field . That's what's cool about the air force special operations . The Air Force Special Operations , we can go up to a tier one organization , do our business and do it well and love it , and you can still go out to other teams , rescue or ST teams , be impactful to the community still , whereas , like when guys go to Delta Force or SEAL , team Six in the Navy and the Army , they pretty much write out their entire careers out there and they don't go to back to their original teams . So you know we don't get stovepiped and that's what's neat about the Air Force .
Chris TellsworthAnyways , back to your original question . You said where do I feel like I was most impactful question ? You said , uh , where I feel like I was most impactful ? Probably it was probably at the . Uh , I mean , I loved being at the , the 2-4 , and I think I brought a lot of stuff there and and pushed the rope forward , and , and did the mission , and did what I was supposed to do , but impact , impact as far as big picture , big picture impactful it was probably being a part of the 306 um .
Chris TellsworthI was in positions that you would never have been in . Up there I was , you know , I was uh in charge of training , I was in charge of standard . I was able to really help develop what we did for uh selections here at the 306 and um and then part of a lot of high-performing teams high-performing teams at 2-4 , but also here at the 3-6 . And that was because of the type of mentality of the guys who were before me Chief Sanchez , rob Greggs and other guys on these teams and the passion that we brought of actually selecting every single unit member , not just the operators , but also the people that support you and are around you .
Chris TellsworthYou bring in the right quality of people . It just makes you and everybody around you a better . Better people , better at their job , want to be there , want to do the mission . When you have guys above you that really care and allow you the autonomy to do what it is that you think's right and steer you in the right directions . I think that's a . I know that's a good thing because that's a . Those are leadership qualities that you want to have and then leadership qualities you would want in the folks above you .
Andrew LuceroYou know to believe in you and let you do what you think is right and then , if you know if you're getting steered off track , help you back I definitely think that , as far as like creating and I definitely wanted to get into this , maybe on the back half of the interview , but since we're already on the topic like what creates a , an effective team , and you kind of touch on it already like being able to actually select every single individual , and I think there's a couple of reasons why that's so impactful for one , instead of like an active duty , when you just get thrown to a squadron and you just fall into a position , when you're actually interviewing for a position that you want and you have to , you know , answer certain questions or go up against a board and there's people that you're competing against and you actually win that position .
Andrew LuceroYou have a sense of like ownership , you know control over your life and you kind of want to prove yourself . You know , because you sold yourself so well , now you have to actually prove it . I think that's a major situation where you create , you know , a for sure for sure .
Chris TellsworthActions , hopefully , speak louder than words . Right , if you sold yourself , you better not be lying , you better be . Air Force got it right when they wrote the core values right Service for self , integrity , integrity first , service for self and excellence in all . We do so . If you're lying on your resume and in your interview , well , it's going to show in your actions . But let's back up . You applied to this , somebody applied to some position that they want . Well , that means for some reason they want to be there , hopefully for the right reasons In this career field and this mission set . You know it's a noble mission . Nine times out of 10 guys aren't just there for a paycheck . They're there because they actually want to do the mish , whatever the mission may be that day , but you know you want to be there .
Andrew LuceroSo as far as performance goes and creating a good team , yeah , you got to have people that want to be .
Chris TellsworthOh yeah , yeah , you want you , you want people that want to be there . And then you got people that know what they're doing and can actually action the words that they're . They're backing up the words that they're saying , you know , and that's , that's part of creating a professional and creating yourself as a professional . It's like , hey man , I said I can freaking , shoot , move and communicate . Well , what am I doing when nobody's around , meaning ? What am I doing at night , when I'm at home or when I'm just sitting around in the team ? And why aren't I out there working on a rope system ? Or why am I not going to the range and you know , practicing my draws and and just getting better at it ?
Andrew LuceroOne thing , just backing up a little bit , because I definitely want to make an opportunity to have this be an opportunity for you to mentor and foster and teach younger PJs that are still looking for you know the mission and and to you know , do the rescues ? Do you have any notable ? Obviously you have the jessica lynch , but more specifically , any missions , operational missions , um , where I mean you could have made a mistake , or just like a situation where you just had a major lesson learned and something that you want to , you know , pass on to the next generation of PJs .
Chris TellsworthGood question . Well , we always we do . We do your gear checks before you go on missions . So there was this mission that I was up in Alaska and it was pretty it was . We ended up not need to execute or employ , but we launched , we were kitted up and ready to do it and actually I got two I could two I want to talk about . So one of them was somebody got stuck out in the mud flats and if you don't know what the mud flats ? So Alaska has this huge tide shift and when the inlet , the tide goes out , there's miles and miles of mud and , for whatever reason , knuckleheads will walk out there and if you guys know you just walk into mud , your foot can get stuck . Well , people do get stuck .
Chris TellsworthAnd we launched on this mission I think it was me and this guy , wolf , steve Wolf . He's actually a doc up in Phoenix right now , no longer a PGA , but an awesome human and dude doc up in Phoenix right now , no longer a PJ , but an awesome human and dude . We were in the back of the 60 . We had all our gear . We really didn't know what was going on until we got the info and we're putting on our dry suits in the back of a 60 so we can low and slow into this or hoist down into this mud flats and in case the salt water comes in .
Chris TellsworthAnd I remember I'm putting on my dry suit glove and it tears and I just didn't and it was because it was all dry , rotted and it tears and I just didn't and it was because it was all dry , rotted . If you guys know those crappy-ass dry suit gloves and it's like wintertime up there and I'm kind of a little bit freaking out because I know how cold that water is and really it's know your gear . Make sure you're checking your gear beforehand because that stuff's gonna save your life and it's gonna save somebody else's life . You know you don't want to go and hang off the end of a rope and it's frayed . That's why you always do those little inspections , you know right what ended up ?
Andrew Lucerowhat ended up happening with uh , this specific ?
Chris Tellsworthoh man , I can't even . I think maybe the other helicopter may have got the dude . I don't really even recall what the end state was , I just remember you're like oh my , it was going down , yeah , and we , we launched and we were just in regular camis .
Chris TellsworthBut we're now we're in the back of a 60 standing up putting on our dry suits and we're , you know , you're putting all your uh harnesses on and everything and you got several bags in the back because you didn't launch without , like , cold weather gear , your tents , your survival gear , all that junk . So those guys in alaska , they're probably gonna laugh at me right now , listen to this , but they know , they know the deal man had . I had to get in the water , man , I might have been ineffective just because my hands would have been so frozen , right , um , know your gear know your gear .
Chris TellsworthYeah , is that another ?
Andrew Luceroquestion yeah , yeah , know your gear .
Chris TellsworthYeah , you say yeah , that's one question , yeah yeah , know your gear , be confident in yourself , be confident in your skill set . So it was a mission my element didn't actually employ because our other guys got down there sooner , which was a good thing . But , um , so I'm at
Alaska Gym to Rescue Mission
Chris Tellsworththe . I'm at the section up there in alaska and I'm working out . I'm the only dude in the gym . This is when we're at the section up there in Alaska and I'm working out . I'm the only dude in the gym . This is when we're at the old armory building on Spenard and I'm the only dude in the gym .
Chris TellsworthIt's like 7 in the morning . The alert crews had already blown out and launched , but I had no idea . And I walk into the back bay after working out . It's about 9 o'clock and I'm getting cleaned up working out . It's about nine o'clock and I'm gonna get cleaned up and I see these two crows combat rescue officers just chucking gear into the back of a truck . And I go where is there ? What are you guys doing ? And they're like , hey , we're , uh , we're getting ready to go launch on this mission . And I look at him , I go where's your pj ? They go we're the only .
Andrew LuceroWe're the only no , they're mission creeping they go . We're the only . Yeah , they go . We're the only , we're the only . No , they're mission creeping , they go .
Chris TellsworthWe're the only , yeah , they go . We're the only dudes here in the building . I'm here , I'm going , what's the mish ? And they told me and it was this huge , huge freighter had listed at 45 degrees way down off the aleutian islands . So we'd already launched the c-130s and the 60s and the c-130s were tail dragging these 60s down there . They were going to take like over 12 hours to get down there . And what they briefed me and what these two crows told me was we're going to launch , we're getting ready to go over talk to this the o6 , the , the wing commander , and and we're going to launch on the slicks and beat those guys down there in case there's people in the water .
Chris TellsworthWell , me , being a tandem dude knowing how to pack a tandem bundle of zodiacs , had some of the ttps and this is way before it was ever like mainstream . I'm like well , we have no rams packages because they're already launched . Hey guys , here's what we can do . You all right , we're gonna go stand in front of the 06 . You better be ready to brief them in five minutes . Let's go , all right . So I chucked all my bags in the back of the freaking um , the six pack , to go load on to the 130 at this time .
Andrew LuceroWhat was your rank ?
Chris Tellsworthum , it's either tech or master . Yeah , I don't recall exactly .
Andrew LuceroI had a lot of experience by that point and was that you definitely had like a lot of experience . But you know I was pretty experienced .
Chris TellsworthYou know I already left the two , four right um , but so I had all my gear , had everything in the back of the zodiac , everything in the back of the um , the trucks and the trailer , and we go over and we briefed those six and I told them exactly what I could do and why I would do it . I would build a freaking tandem Zodiac bundle in the back of the C-130 . If we got down there on scene and there was people in the water and they needed immediate rescue because lives were on the line , I'm ready to do this . And here's , and went through it , x , y and Z , nuts to bolts . The full bird was like Roger , that you guys got launch authority . If you get down there and that's what's where you are with the situation , you know , prosecute the mission . We got down there , luckily . So we get down there and we're in the back of the C one 30 and we fly . We pass the sixties and the one thirties .
Chris TellsworthI don't remember the exact timeline , it was hours , but luckily the boat was listed . But everybody on the ship there was like 26 crew members , uh , and they were on the side of the , the um , what do you call it ? Wherever the captain cruise the ship from . There's dudes with injuries but nobody was in the water need immediate life threat . So you know the sixties being drugged down there . They were going to be down there , these guys were going to survive . Um , there was no need to do that . It would have been a scary mission , but I was ready to do it and I was pretty confident in my skills and I at least portrayed myself to the 06 that I was confident in my skills and he had confidence in me .
Andrew LuceroWas this like a non-standard like method ? It was at the time it was at the time .
Chris TellsworthThey've definitely .
Andrew LuceroWere you kind of winging it almost or like a ?
Chris Tellsworthlittle bit . But I'd be . I I had the um , I was already tandem master , knew how to build bundles like nobody's business , all that kind of stuff . But uh , I've done what I had done water tandems and things like that . But this was definitely going to be new . I hadn't jumped a boat yet , it was already being done , but I hadn't done it .
Chris TellsworthKnow , I was ready to do it and um , you know we had , we had mitigating measures in there with flotations and all kinds of things . But uh , you know , I remember those guys got down there on scene and then they freaking hoisted down and were hoisting out those bodies and getting them back to safety . But yeah , I think the point of that whole long winded story right there was , uh , you know with confidence , with confidence yeah .
Chris TellsworthBut be ready to back it up and you know , and if you don't , you know other people's lives could be on the line . And or , if you do , but you screwed up , really you're the . You better be the man and stand up and take it on the chin and pay the consequences . You know , right , yeah .
Nick AdagioNow the first one when you were , when you were saying it . It's truly an example of risk to force . I think people blow by that in a risk analysis in mission planning . But water , cold water . You can't save a survivor if you're going to get downed yourself , so that's great . And then the second one is advocacy I think a crow's job for the most part tactically . You can't do the mission if you're not advocating for the guys and a lot of people don't know the capabilities of PJs until they get briefed it , especially at the higher levels of the approval authorities , like wing commanders are like I didn't even know you could jump a vote and it's like , yeah , I can do it , we got it covered , like got it in having credibility as your , as an organization , as long as you don't have like a tarnished image with that 06 approving it . He's going to always give you that approval If you're saying something confidently and you know in yourself that you can do it .
Chris TellsworthYeah , I agree , if you are continually proving yourself to the boss , he's going to continue his confidence in you will is going to continually grow and increase . And just have that confidence in you and your team's ability to do what needs to be done . You know we're not doing , we're not out here doing crazy shit that we've , uh , haven't trained to . We're doing stuff that we've trained to and it's adapting to the situation . Nothing's standardized Like , for instance , man , I was at the 2-4 when I'm on alert up at the Navy , day in and day out . We ran CQB drills all day long . Or we're at the range or we're doing IADs , but no house no , two houses are the same when you get downrange . But it's a template . It's how you train and how hard you train and how you apply yourself and what you're doing in the off hours reviewing , studying and then going back and doing it the next day that you take that template and you can overlay it into mud huts in Afghanistan , in cities in Iraq or wherever we're going . You know what I mean . It's a template and that's what , like time sensitive targeting is . That's what rescue is High angle , you go out in the in the bay , out in the back bay , on the team room , and you set up three to one in the back bay . Do it with the doors closed , the lights off , whatever , but it's a template . Now I can set that three to one up on a ship . I can set that three to one up on the mountains . I can set that three to one , five to one , whatever anywhere in an urban environment . So it's like I said earlier , man , it's like being a professional is training when nobody's looking , but also continuing training with your team on your core competencies , on your core skills .
Chris TellsworthWhat makes something advanced ? These guys always want , oh , we want to advance this , we want to go advance that . I'll tell you what makes something advanced . Let's go do CQB in the day . Okay , let's advance it . Now we're going to do it at night . We're going to do it on NVGs . We're going to do it with maybe some smoke in the house . There's nothing wazoo about it . It's doing medicine . Make sure you are a freaking badass at your TCCC . Your march pause and everything . Your basics . Make sure you're a badass at your basics . Advancing it really is changing the environment . The environment , whether there's a threat , so you got to stay ducked undercover while somebody's shooting back for you , or it's on nvgs or it's smoky , like I said . You know a house might be on fire and burning and you're ducking below freaking smoke and you're dragging people out of the building by their hair so that they're not dying .
Andrew LuceroThe thing is that you can't start there .
Chris TellsworthYou cannot start there . You have to master the basics , man , be the best at freaking your medicine , be the best at the basics of jumping , the basics of shooting . Like I said , how do we make shooting more advanced ? Okay , we speed it up and we turn out the lights . That's really , that's advanced shooting , man , you know .
Nick AdagioYeah , yeah , I actually there has to be intention and I think you and AR probably did this a lot at the 306 when you were both leading the squadron . But just a note from my past there was an intention even with the design of our building . We knew that , like budget was going to be an issue , but you don't need a budget to have good CQB training . So as you walk down the hallway , there were three team rooms One was left fed , one was center fed and one was right fed and like all right , well , we can't go tactically train in italy . Do it here . Take all the desks out , put all the desks in . You guys can just master the fundamentals before we can start working with your guns off base I think a lot of guys want to jump right into like live fire , cqb .
Andrew LuceroBut when I was like attached to the criff for a month , they did a whole like shooting block and the first week was just on the range , stagnant , you're not moving . Week two is like you're moving . Week three was that night and then week four was in that shoot house but using sim rounds , and it wasn't until like literally a month and a half of like straight shooting for weeks and weeks to where they , like you know , went to live fire . And we're actually doing it that's .
Chris TellsworthThat's mastering the basics .
Andrew LuceroRight , exactly , mastering the basics so one question I had , and like something that I think that a lot of younger pjs are are um , feeling right now is almost like a lack of , I don't know if I want to call it fulfillment , or you know . They were sold this idea of what paraesco is going to be and like I'm going to , you know , go out and save lives and risk my life and , you know , do the mish , and's quite the quite the lull right now . I don't know if you may maybe experienced this in the nineties , like not much going on , and then you , you were like there , you know , during the invasion . So do you have any advice for you ?
Chris TellsworthAnd that's funny . That's funny you bring that up Cause I just read something by a buddy of mine that he just posted on one of our community threads . But let me back up . So in the nineties when I came in right , there was no , no real conflict going on . That , at least , that I was a part of . I mean , I was doing deployments to Saudi and Kuwait .
Chris TellsworthIt was all about preparing , but we were doing the space shuttle mission , the TAL sites , and that was awesome , loved it , loved it , man . I had fun . We had great teams , those great dudes around . We're going out and we're training constantly and we were doing realistic training at home station and off station and we were making the best . We're making fucking chicken soup out of chicken shit .
Lessons From High Profile Military Mission
Chris TellsworthWhen , when you were a a small element of pjs under the thumb of helicopter squadron commanders back in the day , you know , or c-130 squadron commanders , you know , and they didn't really want to give us the funding and things like that , so fast forward , you know , I'm up at the two , four and and stuff really kicks off . Well , that's what happens , man . Shit breaks loose . What did I have to ? Fall back on my basics , my basic fucking training shooting , moving , communicating , medicine , technical rescue , technical extrication , things like that .
Andrew LuceroI think the key there is you guys were still staying busy and feeling like relevant right , Because you were doing , was it ? You said that like it was like the NASA thing , NASA mission , yeah .
Chris TellsworthYeah , and that was cool , but you know it was a high likelihood that nothing was going to happen . It did a couple of times right , but you know what , nowadays that we have these crows that are , you know , advocates and senior leaders we've all kind of come out of that last 20 plus years of the Iraq and Afghanistan conflict and it's kind of shifting , pivoting to a different . We have to shift and pivot what we're focused on . But you still have to master the basics and you've got to have these leaders who were there . They're on their way out to retire , so they know . So they need to be the most , best advocates for the young dudes to either get in the fight with different types of augmentation , rotations or whatever . It is home side , you know .
Chris TellsworthSo , yeah , like I said , my buddy Clint Beck he just posted in a reply to another dude on that thread and Clint was 100% right . Man , what does our motto say ? It says I will be prepared at all times . That's a professional , because I promise you guys , man , young guys , old guys , shit's going to break loose somewhere coming up Next five years . Something's going to happen . Man , this world's too unstable , too crazy right now agreed .
Andrew LuceroSo the jessica lynch mission , obviously that's probably the most high viz mission . I imagine that you've , you've done . You want to talk through that a little bit ?
Nick Adagiowe don't have to , but it was high viz was low viz yeah , I guess I guess the the intent behind it is like you were in the limelight , especially not only in the community , but you were in national news , right , like . What did you learn from that ? Like , I'm sure you didn't want that publicity , but you were still don't .
Chris TellsworthYou know , it's not you know . You know I've only talked about this mission maybe three times now publicly I'll talk . I've talked about it with dudes on the side and stuff like that here and there , and then the dudes I know well and I wasn't the only guy on that freaking mission and I'm going to go into that here in a second . No kind of like what I said earlier . It's all about repetition and being ready , because you never know when something's going to happen and you need to prosecute mission .
Chris TellsworthThat mission was a time sensitive target . We already had a time sensitive target mission plan how we mission plan out that . Um , and we'd already been leading up to it . We , everybody , we already knew she were this , these people were been captured , and so everybody Intel , national organization , national agency organizations were looking for these people and there was covert ways of when they actually found her and then they brought the information to us . It really ultimately boiled down to was we already had mission execution templates for anything like that . So we had a ground assault force , we had a helo assault force and then you had all your supporting entities and all we did was we overlaid that template , we took the current actionable intelligence and we input it on those templates . And then we went and did and I mean it went pretty well , you know . I mean there were some hiccups along the way on the GAF . I wasn't on the GAF , I was on the Hilo assault force , but did it get dynamic at all ?
Chris TellsworthOn target . It wasn't Our part , wasn't dynamic . There were ground assaults going on all around us . As I was flying in , I flew in on a little bird . I was on second little bird . First little bird set down , went up . As soon as they sit down , the breacher team jumped off . Those guys jumped off . I was on second little bird . I jumped off with the other guys . They went up , set the breach breach went off . The other helo was coming in . Maybe they'd already been in , I can't recall . But immediately we just flowed into the facility and we started clearing that facility . As we were flying in over the city of Tallil , I think it was , there were diversionary efforts and I was run by the Marines and the rangers , which was a part of the mission and they were . They were getting after it . I remember seeing lasers and freaking kinetic stuff going on as we're flying over , because you know we're in little birds , we weren't very high over the city because before I mean , that hospital was occupied by the military it was .
Chris TellsworthIt was , uh , I think that day we got intel that there was like approximately 30 Fedayeen in there and then , once we cleared the first couple floors of the hospital and had ex-filled our person , we turned it over to the rangers and they continued to clear the entire facility . We went down in the basement and we we did a sensitive site exploitation of the floors that we had cleared , the rooms and the basement , and the basement was a huge room . I don't remember how I recall how big it was , but it was like huge military planning sand tables down there . Now , not that saddam's regime and whoever uh followed any kind of geneva conventions , but you know that that does go against the law of armed conflict . Like you're not supposed to use hospitals as military planning areas or you don't hole up in those places , you know . But uh , that was what was going on there .
Chris TellsworthBut when we got on target , there was nothing kinetic inside the hospital , but as I was in the room , there was a whole . There was target . There was nothing kinetic inside the hospital , but as I was in the room , there was a whole . There was still a lot of kinetic stuff going on right outside and I just remember specifically , a lot of automatic gunfire going on and a lot of . We were doing this . We were still continually , even while we had her , we had every door in the hospital was , uh , was locked , so the breachers had a shotgun , breach every freaking door and , uh , she was pretty , pretty freaked out at the , uh , the , the sound of gunfire , especially the automatic gunfire going on out right side outside her window there and uh .
Andrew LuceroSo you know , I just talked to her , comfort her , said some things as far as stuff , yeah , as far as injuries go , was it just from the , the vehicle crash or the , because she was in a humvee and then there was like an rpg that hit her and the vehicle flipped ?
Chris Tellsworthyeah , everything that she sustained , sustained from that incident right there . Uh , you know I'm not gonna . I don't want to get into the HIPAA part of it and talk about everything . I'll talk about some stuff . The injuries that I assessed on her were in line with what you would sustain from being in the back of a Humvee when it was wrecked or crashed or whatever you know , um pelvises and tim fib , stuff like that .
Chris TellsworthUm , there's some other stuff that was you know and I didn't get all the debrief , but there's speculation by people out there you know ui's here oh man , they're gonna rape a woman and this and that the medical .
Chris TellsworthShe was brought to a medical hospital . She was given medical care . Now , it might not be the best medical care like what we would give in the States , but she was probably given the best medical care that they could give her right there at the time . During a war , when freaking bombs and shit are going off in Iraq and you know the trauma-sized state that she was in . She may have thought , hey , maybe somebody may be touching me inappropriately or something like that . But I can say that there was appropriate medical interventions done on her .
Andrew LuceroBecause there was like a Pentagon report that she had been like stabbed and like there's gunshot wounds or something like that . Oh man , I don't recall any of that yeah . I think that stuff was like redacted at some point .
Chris TellsworthBut let's see whatever , what else . Um , I will tell you this about her , though , man she at the time did . Now I don't know if she believed that the , the hospital staff , were her captors or not . Her captors were coming in there daily and that's why there was very sensitive type reporting going on and how we got our intelligence . But when I was sitting there talking to her and the gunfire was going off and we're getting ready to get her extractor , she was very compassionate towards her handlers , like her medical handlers . She didn't want us to hurt them , she didn't want us to kill them or anything like that , and you know we didn't intend on killing her medical providers there , so , but she was very passionate about those folks .
Chris TellsworthSo , whether that's that syndrome where you fall in love with your captor , or not , I don't know , I don't know if there was enough time or not , but you know she was in a very traumatized , very traumatized state and we did everything we could do to make her feel like we're there to freaking , take her home . I mean , you know I bent down . She was freaking out , crying , grabbing my hand or grab her hand , that's what kind of . When I handed her that little american flag patch , that was like not scripted or anything like that , and I so she could see hey , we're americans . I said to her hey , we are americans and we're here to take you home and then , this boyfriend boogied her out of there , you know yeah you obviously didn't want the limelight .
Nick AdagioYou didn't want that photo op . I don't know who took the photo , but like I'll tell you about that too .
Chris TellsworthWho took the photo ? But , like , I'll tell you about that too , that was , that was that was , that was not that was so any one of our EOD techs on the team . He's the one who carries the , the little video cameras , and back then they weren't these little lipstick cans , they were little camcorders about you know , six , seven , eight inches and as big as a bigger than a Coke can , and we use those for sensitive site exploitation , because that's how we filmed a lot of what was going on after we were on target , because you don't typically pull out a camera on target . Well , he just happened to whip out the freaking video camera on target and they pulled some stills from the footage of that , and that's how that happened .
Nick AdagioYou really let into it . It's like you didn't want the limelight but you had to deal with it , and that into it . It's like you didn't want the limelight but you had to deal with it and you came home and what did you do to , I guess , protect yourself from that ? I'm sure there's people trying to get interviews out of you and stuff like that .
Chris TellsworthNo , no , not really . You know , still at this time the public didn't know who did what . I mean they may have heard like SEAL team , this or whatever . They didn't know . You know who names of anybody or what exact organizations internally like within our community ? You know , folks knew and I would talk a little bit with some folks , but it was still . I mean probably , it's probably to this day is still classified and all that stuff .
Andrew LuceroBut you know as far as , like , notable missions and missions that kind of reflect on you know what the pararescue mission is , would you say that was probably one of the highlights , or are there other missions out there that ? Highlights of pararescue highlights for you as far as your career , oh yeah sure , man , that was a cool mission , really cool .
Chris TellsworthI mean it was cool because of the , the totality and enormity of effort that went into that mission .
Chris TellsworthLike I said earlier , man , it's not just one dude just because I was happened to be the dude bedside closest to the target .
Chris TellsworthThere was so many , there was hundreds of supporting entities involved in that and assaulters . We had a big time assault force go in on that and what that does is that speaks volumes to the missions that we are involved in , meaning the type of mission , the nobility of the missions that we like to be involved in , and then the amount of effort that the United States will put forth to get our own and our friends and allies . Millions and millions of dollars of assets were dedicated to doing
Leadership and Teamwork in Special Forces
Chris Tellsworththat . People's lives were put on the line to actually get her . You know , from the freaking , from the intel sources that were doing daily intel gathering on her , they were putting their lives on the line , risking their lives , and then every single freaking operator that went in to grab her , you know , had no idea what we were going into , just kind of dumped them in . You know , and that's what we do is we bring our own home and I don't know if that answered your question ?
Chris TellsworthNo , for sure , but yeah , I think .
Andrew LuceroUm , as far as flow of the interview , I think that would probably be a good time to take a pause , if anyone needs to take a piss or anything yeah , and then we could transition yeah , man .
Chris TellsworthOh yeah , I didn't tell you I was like . So cz was on my green team . We're at two , four together negron rod , all knee , chief , all knee . You know all those guys dave jackson , charlie mike , charlie mccarney , dean , hunger it's or are we going yet ? Yeah I probably can get this , I mean flow , this kind of recording .
Chris TellsworthIt's like , the kind of guys you surround yourself with is the kind of guys everybody feeds off each other . And then if you , if you I mean if you're freaking a pigeon you're gonna surround yourself with pigeons . If you want to be a freaking eagle or whatever you know , you're gonna be around eagles , you know ? Um , and all those guys that I just mentioned in earlier squadron group commanders . There's generals that were on my green team . Ray was the freaking SEAC . Charlie , mike , combat controller chief . Dean combat controller chief All these dudes , dean , he was on the mission also . He was a recce combat controller looking for bad dudes . Anyways .
Andrew LuceroWhat do you think , what are some traits or characteristics that all those guys share ?
Chris TellsworthSelflessness , drive , tenacity , drive to be a freaking professional right , like I said always , training , but also humbleness , man , not so fucking above yourself that you think you're better than other people . I never flaunt that mission . I really it's . It was super cool , it was fun , all that kind of cool stuff . But you know what ? Here's what I still , to this day , I preach and why I do what I do .
Chris TellsworthStill , it's like it's not what we fucking did in the past . It's what we are either training now to do in the future or how we're training and what we're training our dudes to do in the future as a PJ , as a team member . In my eyes right now , a team member is the most important dude in the operator team because that's the dude who's going to get the closest to the X . Everybody else but the crow , the team leader . We are supporting elements to that team member because we're sitting at the CCP now and we're pushing our dudes in a little bit closer . So we better be supporting that dude .
Chris TellsworthAnd then the security around us outside , then the freaking helicopters up above us or whatever we got above air superiority , whatever we got up there supporting , it's that outward supporting on in to that finite little tiny point . When you say tip of the spear , that is truly what you need . Tip of the spear Now . Your tip of your spear could be a hundred freaking dudes being awesome and badass at their thing , but that moment in time , when you're on the X and you're the one grabbing a patient , everybody is supporting you .
Andrew LuceroIntel , the c-130 pilot , everybody , the crow on target , the freaking team leader on target . One thing that I want to touch on that is that it's definitely important to have the right guys , like you said , that all have those characteristics . But when you kind of started getting into the leadership role and you became a chief , were there things that you were doing to try to foster that kind of sure ? Yeah , environment .
Chris TellsworthYeah , man Number one . Hey , it helps when you have freaking awesome leadership above you . You know , had great commanders , um , anthony , Alexander McCall , and then on back , you know . But , uh , but some of the good things , some of the best things , I believe .
Chris TellsworthRight , I don't know what CZ's philosophy on leadership is and his silver bullets are . I don't have them all memorized , ray , sorry about that . But lead by example . Don't ask your freaking dudes or dudettes , the people in your squadrons or on your teams , to do stuff that you're either A not willing to do or B can't do because your ass got out of shape . You better stay in shape for a couple of reasons . If you're not in shape and you get on target and you can't prosecute the mission , well then you're worthless and kind of back . What we talked about earlier is you became a hindrance , right .
Chris TellsworthAnother thing that I like to say and I don't remember who coined it the first time I heard it , but I use it all the time . It might have been at one of those leadership schools that we go to . As you freaking climb the ladder of rank and you're climbing up , you should be reaching a hand down and pulling your buddies up with you . You're never going to do it as an individual . It is the team that does it . That freaking mission , the lynch mission , it wasn't one guy , it was a freaking team effort . And man , any mission I've ever been on , there was no one guy doing anything . I haven't done any loan operator missions all by myself where nobody was supporting anything . No , stuff is always supported , so there's always a team . It don't matter your wife's part of your team , your kids are part of your team . They give you that moral and that reason to come back and that's , that's big , you know .
Andrew LuceroI feel like you've probably seen a lot of leadership styles , like through your career . Oh yeah , is there any , any style that you kind of respond best to ? Or you see , that is the most effective ?
Chris Tellsworthyou know we throw these terms servant leader , it's a lame term , but it's true . It's true . Servant leader , how would you describe that ? It's somebody . So buddy , my chief atkins , mike atkins , who's up there at the two four with me also again , and you want to surround yourself with these freaking awesome people . That's why we did what we did here at the 306 to freaking try to select the best people who possibly could , cause you want to be around most people and just meters getting after it , and if they can't stay , for if they're not going to stay forward , they're going to fall behind . If they aren't meant to be there , they aren't meant to be there .
Chris TellsworthBut I think Mike might have said it . Ak said it . He said , like , when you answer the phone as a chief , it should be so-and-so . How can I help you ? Like , what can I do for you ? That's fucking leading man . That's like , hey , what can I do to make you better so you can go out there and make whatever ? Your job is the best that can be . You're the freaking vehicle mechanic . Well , man , I want the best vehicle mechanic and I want him to want to be here . Empower him . I want to be a part of the freaking team . I want to be a part of the mission , whoever it is my supply guy . Those guys are awesome . I'm not going to be able to do the mission without the supply guy doing his mission and ordering the awesome stuff that he does , and I love those dudes and girls .
Andrew LuceroColonel Cabrera . He uh , he literally said the same thing .
Chris TellsworthDid he Servant leader ? Yeah , yeah , I mean , it's true , it's true Right later . Yeah , yeah , I mean , it's true , it's true right , but there's , there's traits that go into that and those kind of go fall back on what I said , I think , being humble , uh , don't ask people to do stuff that you're not willing to do yourself and can't do . If you can't do it , how are you going to ask somebody else to go do that ? Or if you're not willing to do it , how about that ? I should say , somebody might be bigger , faster and stronger and they can lift , uh , 500 pounds overhead and you just can't physically do that . Okay , I get that , I understand that , but that's not what I'm getting at . That's not my point .
Andrew LuceroBut you kind of chuckled when I asked about , like you seeing different kinds of leadership styles . What are some styles that you respond poorly to ?
Chris TellsworthToxic leadership is poor , and toxic leadership is when , like for instance , folks are out for themselves . They don't care about the folks around them . You know , they're self-centered . They just don't utilize quality traits that we look for in people , and so you know .
Chris TellsworthI think we do a decent job in the Air Force . We have professional leadership development courses and that's a start , but that's not the end . All Just because you went to senior NCO Academy doesn't make you a freaking qualified to be a chief or a senior or anything like that . It just means , okay , I've checked the box . Now I know what is good and bad qualities in a person to be a good leader , and it's upon me to be a professional and practice and do that .
Chris TellsworthEverybody falters , man , everybody . Some days nobody's on their freaking A-game . Some days you're just pissed off , your dehydrate and somebody says something that sets you off . Okay , man , I snapped at you . But how do you come back from that ? Not the person , but as a leader , you freaking humble yourself and you go . Maybe you go apologize to them publicly so that people know hey , I'm not , I'm not above myself and I know when I screwed up and I'm willing to make myself better . Maybe , hey , you know what ? Hey , I'm not always the best at doing that when it comes to my home life , but I hope , hopefully , I can get better too .
Chris TellsworthI'm still trying to get better at things . You know I think about things a lot , but yeah , always working towards it . Always working towards it . Yeah , it's the goal . Nobody's perfect , nobody's perfect man , but you know , what I think that's a good leadership quality is when they recognize hey , where , where , where am I at faults or I'm not ? I'm not too big to say , hey , faults or I'm not . I'm not too big to say hey , what do you , what do you think ? You know , give me some feedback . Feedback's a two-way street . It's not .
Nick AdagioIt's not a downward push you know , yeah , we're at kind of a turning point in our community where it's like we need to foster innovation and prepare for the unknown , and I think when you're talking about fundamentals at the beginning of our conversation , it's at the end of the day , when you're talking about fundamentals at the beginning of our conversation , it's at the end of the day we're trying to save good guys and kill bad guys , so we just need to find the ends of the means . At this point .
Transitioning From Active Duty to Reserves
Nick AdagioSome of the some of the questions I had , though , to kind of divert from that topic .
Nick AdagioYou're involved in active duty , you're involved in higher levels there , and then there's a . There's a distinct change from your active duty service to involved in higher levels , uh , there , and then there's a . There's a distinct change from your active duty service to being the guard and the reserve , and it's not like we're . We're more professional . I think it's a different kind of of hat we wear in the guard and reserve , not only because we have long tenured individuals at our squadrons , but also because our mission sets are a little bit different , specifically the guard guys . So did you notice any change culturally in those organizations , as you did maybe at the beginning of your career at Moody and Patrick as you like . I know the two fours different , but as you came into Alaska and DM .
Chris TellsworthWell , that's a good question . So the guy is the same , right , the pj since this is a pj podcast or crow he's the same . The dude is the same . He's passionate , he cares about the mission and that's why guys are passionate on the teams and they yell like we shouldn't be doing this , we should be doing that . So the guys are passionate on the teams and they yell . They're like we shouldn't be doing this or we should be doing that . So the guys are really the same . But you talk about culture and things like that , but you also touched on it .
Chris TellsworthIt's the thing that differentiates the guard and reserve from the active duty component is really its experience level is what I think it boils down to . You're able to better select the guys at the units levels . Guys and gals support folks and operators at the unit levels and then you're also able to retain that experience level for longer periods of time . It's all this cyclic thing . Well , we were able to select good dudes . So now I got good leaders . Guys want to be there .
Chris TellsworthThose good leaders , well , why were they selected ? It's because they were good operators . Now they know they're good SMEs . They're going to go find good work for you , the younger dudes to get after and still do and advocate for you . Not a knock on active duty , it's that they are hamstrung by a few things they PCS and you do lose a lot of that continuity and stuff that that guy has built . And a lot of times it just kind of goes with him to another unit and he has to start over at that new unit and then whoever slid into his position may have to start over and just rebuild because of all the turnover rate at active duty teams .
Chris TellsworthYou know yeah , culture you're able to build , you're able to build um personalities on teams for longer periods of time at units like the guard and reserve , because of that low turnover rate , you know . And so those personalities people view as culture , and I guess you could say that because it all kind of drives , everything drives each other , everything drives each other and , uh , you know , hey , one at one time maybe this unit was big in tactics and the culture there now has become , hey , we're the shooting team and we're the , or this is the jumping team , and and the culture is , is , uh , that nature . And then I think you know where I'm going with that yeah , yeah , no , I got you .
Nick AdagioI was just saying , like continuity by retaining talent is is definitely an advantage of the reserves 100% .
Chris TellsworthYeah , even six years ago , seven years ago on active duty , we talked they had this , they talked about this when we go to those freaking senior leader working groups and we talked about oh , we got this bathtub and you got all these freaking three levels down here and then your five levels got smaller and then your seven levels got even smaller and on so up .
Chris TellsworthBut it hasn't . It hasn't really shifted , because I'm seeing an increase in throughput and productivity at the pj schoolhouse and in turn at the 68th rqs , at the ftu and then going out to the active duty units and whereas at many of the Guard and Reserve teams it's kind of a flip of that you have a lot of freaking seasoned team leaders and operators and even your support staffs and you only have a few three levels or maybe new five levels and so it's not as much of a burden to train those dudes up as it is on the active duty side of the house and that's why they're stretched thin on the active duty side of the house all across the board , at the ftus , at the freaking squadrons , you know , and you're having to shift talent out of positions when they could still be seasoning and it kind of sucks , but it is also necessary and I get it , but it sucks .
Nick AdagioYeah . So another question that I had that I'm I'm interested in kind of the way you you transitioned out of the military . You obviously work in a role that is very close to our community . Still , did you ever think to do something other than work with pararescuemen ? Like , was there anything else on the table when you were making that decision to come back to f3a and be close to the community ?
Chris Tellsworthno , it was an easy , it was . Well , the opportunity was presented to me to work for f3a . I was getting ready to retire , the red flag rescue opportunity came open and I just jumped on that and that was actually an awesome opportunity and it was an easy transition for me to transition from being an active PJ to basically setting up training for PJs . That was super easy , super rewarding and it was still very close to my unit of retirement , like literally two miles
Air Force Career Transition and Networking
Chris Tellsworthaway . And then , you know , I'd been talking with f3a , uh , for I don't know , just off and on getting hit up to do um opportunities and train guys , but I kept saying no , no , no , I don't have time , I've got this other job I'm doing .
Chris TellsworthBut then , when this opportunity at f3a popped open , uh , there was some uncertainty in the contracting world with what was going on with red flag rescue , and so I talked to my boss and he goes man , if I was you I'd jump on it and and that's kind of how , how it started to shape out and then I jumped on it and it is , it was , but it wasn't like a step down , a lateral move or anything . It was really . It was a continual progression in my professional development to take on the role that I have now .
Nick AdagioYeah , so for the guys that are going to get out in the near future , maybe even after retirement years to come , did you have any calculus ? Like , obviously you mentioned that you wanted a rewarding job , but what else did you have maybe in your mind that you wanted to do after the Air Force that was going to give ?
Chris Tellsworthyou the same ? No , no . So you know , throughout , throughout my career mostly you know GWAT and whatever else we called it up until 2020 , when I retired , there was always those opportunities , whether it's contracting overseas , doing the you know , operator type contracting or these other jobs . I was always networked to where I knew there was something was going to line up . That's a , that's a key . That's a key feature or function is , while you're in , build your network , um , and when you interact with folks you never know , always treat it like it's an interview . So you know you don't want to just go there and bad mouth this and bad mouth that . I'm gonna treat it like it's an interview because you never know .
Chris TellsworthAnd when I was retiring here's the funny thing is , when I was retiring chad senior he's a crow and he goes hey t , I heard you . He just called me out of the blue , but we've been friends for years and he goes hey t . Uh , I heard you're retiring , is there anything we can do to to keep you in ? And I said , yeah , I kind of want to go to germany . I want to , I want to work in this pr cell over in germany with uh ar specifically . And uh , they just couldn't make that happen . They couldn't get an e9 billet into one of those slots ea all day long . But but they couldn't get an E9 because they were like , well , everybody wants an E9 .
Chris TellsworthSo he goes how about you just throw a dart at the map and tell me where it lands ? And I go yeah , my dart just landed in Germany . He goes well , I could get you to DC or Colorado . I go , what's in Colorado ? And it was like some sort of space command . And I and I said , what would I ? I know in my mind , I go what do you mean space command ? I go when I'd be working . I'm , you know , I'm looking out of the side , I'm side eye and I'm like space command , would I be working with pjs , knowing full well I wouldn't be ?
Nick Adagioand he said no , and I'm like no , dude , sorry bro , I'm gonna stay .
Chris TellsworthI'm gonna stay tight to my community . You , you know , I don't want to have to deal with I already can deal with the shenanigans of PJs and everybody else in our squadron . I don't want to have to deal with the shenanigans of everybody else in the Air Force because this was like a group chief type , billet or something like that . I'm like nah , not for me today . My family is ready for me to retire . I've been deployed years , freaking gone from my family , counting tdy's and deployments and all that kind of stuff . It's time to give them , give them more time at home .
Chris TellsworthSo uh , so no , to answer your question , it was uh , sorry it was to uh , uh , I never thought I was gonna stray too far away because I know the opportunities there . Hey , and that's a good segue for something for me . On those threads that we have different communities , I'm continually pushing out job opportunities to dudes in our tribe and I see other guys doing it , I don't know , don't get a whole lot of hits on it . Thousand dudes , somebody needs a job out there . So there's job opportunities , there will be , there are going to be , and you build your network .
Chris TellsworthThat guy who said throw the dart , he goes , hey , t , I built this network . He actually was an aide to camp to a general up in DC somewhere , something like three stars , something like that . And he goes hey , I built this freaking network . My network is worthless if I don't use it to help my friends and other people . That's so true and I've just never actually conceptualized it like that and that's why I use my network to try to help everybody I can . You know whether it's hey , connect me with this guy or what do you know , or whatever . And we're trying to just capitalize on that for the benefit of other dudes and do debts what ?
Andrew Lucerowhat was it about this community that led you to ? I just not want to , you know , believe oh man , I well .
Chris TellsworthI did it for 26 years plus . Now it's like I love it . It was awesome , it was fun , I had great time , I loved doing the mish had fun , I think guys kind of unique
Military Career Transitions and Personal Growth
Chris Tellsworthexperience .
Andrew LuceroYou know jug a lot idea of going and doing like the pa route or the doctor route or you know anything else like civilian side and um , I don't I mean nick's done it and he could attest to it did like medical sales where it was , you know , like strictly civilian and this is a lot of high ops tempo but also high caliber dudes here and I get it , man , like dudes are gonna want to freaking .
Chris TellsworthWhen you get idle and nothing's going on down range or whatever , where you don't have a mission set going , you're gonna get kind of bored or complacent or and that's when dudes get in trouble . But uh , so there's high caliber dudes . They're going to want to go and do something more with their , uh , their personal um situation and I encourage that man . Dave glass man , that dude's a doctor . Now there's other dudes , there are docs and pjs , and these are high performing , freaking meat eaters out there that that want to do something . Hey , man , if , if , if it's not happening for you right now , then go make it happen for you somewhere . You know I told that to guys . I go , hey , take your your own personal career in your hands and make it happen . If you don't like something , then change your situation . You know I can think of a couple of guys I specifically told that to and that would do that and those were the guys that got the most support . You know , when people don't respond , then it's kind of like well , ok .
Nick AdagioYeah , you definitely reached out to me when I in a time of need . I was dealing with some issues but things fell in line . I was back to the active side and I appreciate that personally for you reaching out and offering me some opportunities with F3A . For sure , when I did a med sales gig it wasn't what I wanted because I wasn't working with the again like high caliber people was working for like a big business and I became pretty cynical because I know the military is a business , but it's not . There's like brotherhood . The med sales , which wasn't his brotherhood , it's something that I really missed and when I was when I will transition again it's I'm never going to be far away from the community again , like that . It's just wasn't my thing .
Chris TellsworthI was like the anomaly you know yeah , no , I hear you and I hear , I've heard that from other guys they like go out there , they retire or whatever , and they go out there and then they're like it just wasn't for me . I didn't like those people or that's a big thing , for like guys in our communities is transitioning . That's why I didn't want to stray too far , because when I do have to deal with folks , that when I'm decompressing and I'm hanging out , maybe at a party or whatever , and there's people that aren't of our community but they're just maybe attached somehow , somehow they're associated with whatever it is we're going . I don't have anything in common with those guys or gals and I don't connect with them , and that's I think that's why you surround yourself with the folks that you connect with , and if you don't connect with it and you don't want to be there , you don't feel like you're part of that mission and you're not contributing , or or you don't feel like it's worthwhile , then it's not and it's , it's just going to eat at you and you're going to want to move on . Well , you might as well move on sooner rather than later .
Chris TellsworthLook , there's guys like CZ man . That guy I don't know how he did it and I don't know how he did that many years , but he ultimately was the voice of the entire military and that's awesome and that's pretty freaking rad . And there's guys who are command chiefs and there's guys who are group chiefs . That's freaking commendable and I love it . But uh , that just wasn't for me and that's why I didn't decide to go that route . I wanted to just stay , stay closer home .
Chris TellsworthMaybe you could say that's selfish or whatever , but uh , my personal desires and comforts at some point kind of come into play . You know a little bit , not not when it comes to the mission . When I'm out there doing the mission , man , you better freaking run and shoot and freaking carry and haul until your lungs bleed . You know why ? Because whoever you're going after , that's their freaking worst day of their life . And I'll tell you what it's not really about that dude and saving that dude . Really it Really . It's about that dude's mom , that dude's sister , that dude's wife , his kids or her husband or whatever , whoever that person is . Those people are the ones that will be even more thankful than the dude who you picked up on the mish .
Chris TellsworthYou know what I mean and that gives me the chills to think about
Commitment to Excellence in Training
Chris Tellsworththat . Because I think about that because I think about it from a perspective of the reason I'm still engaged in doing what I'm doing with the 68th and f3ea and the guys and hopefully training the guys still to be the best that they can be and in part in any kind of knowledge I can drop on guys is because my two kids , both one's getting ready to go into college and one's in college , both want to commission into the air force and either a my son wants to maybe be a pj crow or stow and then my daughter or or pilot and my daughter wants to be a pilot in the air force . I'm like , well , one day they may be on on the freaking end of that rope that you guys are dangling down there for them and I want the best dang product out there possible who's a professional and can do and does the basics well , you know , yeah .
Andrew LuceroAnd that's that's . That's a selfish personal standpoint , but man .
Chris Tellsworthbut I extend that to everything , though . I don't ever want our guys looking like turd bags in front of the eyes of other sister services or anything like that . We need to hold our own , and the way you do that is by being professional and being the freaking best at your product of mastering the basics .
Nick AdagioI don't have another question , dude , I'm fired up .
Chris TellsworthI'm fired up . Every time I go to a P PJ graduation I'm like , and someone , one of the bros , somebody gets up there and guest speaks , I'm ready to freaking , do it again . When I'm seeing guys out there in the mouth site dragging bodies , I'm like , oh man , I want to do this , I love it , I want to shoot move and communicate . Is that it ? Yeah , yeah , I think that was . It well , thanks for hanging out dude .
Nick AdagioThank you so much did you work out today . I did all right , that's right .