ADHD, Hedonism & Dissociation: Katy Smith

I can't even guess the number of times I've told the story about the conversation with a newly diagnosed friend which led to my ADHD discovery. Well, THIS IS THAT FRIEND! I am so excited to share this VERY special in-person interview with the girl who kicked off this whole safari...

All aboard the late ADHD discovery roller coaster with the one and only Katy Smith. Katy is 'in fashion', and always fashionably late! :)  Sydney's finest was misdiagnosed with BPD in childhood, but as is often the case, she wasn't told about it until adulthood and the diagnosis didn't fit at all.

Suffering a lifetime of masking her ADHD symptoms and battling commonly co-occurring anxiety, depression and disordered eating. Alongside bashing her self esteem to smithereens, the wrecking ball of ADHD destroyed her personal relationships. An ex made her realise she had ADHD, and once diagnosed in 2018 she 'subtly' mentioned her newly discovered condition to the most ADHD person she knew; a person she met and raised hell in Thailand with seven years prior...me! This legend plays an enormous role in ADHDAF Podcast history.THANK YOU FOR EVERYTHING KATY!

And thank you to Sessionz Services for cleaning up this audio of two excitable fidgeting ADHDers in an echoey kitchen! 

Trigger Warning: mentions of triggering topics including: depression, anxiety, ED, body dysmorphia, alcohol abuse, mental health struggles,burnout, misdiagnosis, alcoholism, escapism, Covid, health trauma, hairloss and skinpicking. 
Also contains a lot of swearing and cackling.

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As mentioned in the episode:
- Alcohol and drug abuse support HERE
- ED support HERE
- ADHD Medication Directory for those struggling to access medication during the national medication shortage HERE

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Transcript

Part of the reason why I'm really excited to have Katy on the podcast is because when I tell the story where I say it was a conversation with a friend that led me to find out that I had ADHD, this is the friend! She is responsible for all of this. Yeah, that's my claim to fame. That's my only claim to fame. 

So blatantly obvious, the late discovery, diagnosis and treatment at 38 for severe combined type ADHD in 2022 not only improved, but genuinely saved my life, which I have since dedicated to fighting for change amidst the global ADHD crisis.  As the acronym suggests, I swear like a sailor and each episode will contain sensitive subject matter.

So please always read the description before. For diving in where you will also find a link to resources for support. These crucial conversations with experts by lived experience are shared to inform, validate, shame, eradicate, and unite the A DHD community. With a fair few laughs along the way, I've been able too much all my life.

But finally, I celebrate my too muchness and use my justice sensitivity to let the world know that A DHD presents differently in each individual self-diagnosis. Is valid and that A DHD is not a trend. A DHD is real. And I want all a adhd as of all genders to know you are not a alone.  The leopard is a symbol of Aberdeen, Scotland, where this podcast began.

It also symbolizes bravery, the reclaiming of power, and I'm a total hun. So leopard printers become the uniform of the A-D-H-D-A-F community uniting to support each other and push for change, which together. We are the Leopard Print Army. Hear us roar.  Hi, I'm Laura, and I am ADHD AF. 

So this is a rare in person interview with the girl who kicked off my ADHD season. I want to pre warn you that it contains mentions of excessive alcohol consumption and very risky behavior. And though we nostalgically laugh about these memories, this is in no way to glorify or encourage alcohol. All that is shared in this very special episode is done to raise ADHD awareness, to display how an identified ADHD can present, and to let others know.

If their memories sound similar to ours to help them drop the shame with the knowledge that this type of behavior is symptomatic for many ADHDers. So if what we share sounds familiar, you are not alone. If you struggle with alcohol, substance abuse, or addiction of any kind, there is free and immediate support out there.

There's a link in the episode note of useful contacts supplied by Mind Charity. We also discuss a very dangerous incident, again, to highlight the danger of the commonly shared ADHD trait of impulsivity. Without the knowledge of our shared neurodevelopmental condition, we didn't know that we needed to stop and assess the way that we do now.

We just acted on impulse and put ourselves in danger time and again.  At the end, we touch on the commonly co occurring struggle many ADHDers face. of Disordered Eating, and I've shared a link from Beat Eating Disorders in the show notes also. I have to say, there is a bit of rustling. Sessions Audio Services has worked miracles to clean up this audio, but it isn't studio quality.

Because it isn't recorded in a studio. It's two ADHD friends chatting in an echoey kitchen, cackling and fidgeting. The inability to sit still is something most ADHDers are all too familiar with. Because this is one of my very best friends in the whole wide world, the interview becomes incredibly relaxed, which means I swear a lot. 

And I say things I probably wouldn't or at least wouldn't phrase in the way I have here. If I were interviewing a new person rather than a chosen family member with whom I've experienced so much and we've seen each other in all sorts of states. But what happened in Thailand stays in Thailand. For the most part, anyway, now, although this is an interview, it is a conversation between two besties.

So obviously it flows making it slightly longer than the usual. So I won't be back at the end this time. So before we dive in, I just want to send my love to everyone who is struggling to access the medication right now. We are in a national medication shortage. This week, ADHD Father UK, our Jacob, shared a link to a fantastic medication directory, which can be used to find local pharmacies with medication in stock.

Jacob recommends preparing to reorder two weeks prior to running out. The link to that directory is also in the blurb of this very special episode. But now I leave you with a giggly, sweary and very special in person interview with my nearest and dearest, the one and only, Katie Smith. So we'll start with the quickfire questions.

Name? Katie Smith. Pronouns? She, her. Age? 36. Are you? Yeah, recently. Location?  Somewhere between Sydney and London. I haven't decided yet.  Currently in my kitchen. Living in Sydney heart in London. Yes, that's a good way of putting it. Yes. Occupation? Fashion person.  Marketing, branding, fashion. In the fashion field, yeah.

Fashion. Favourite animal? Has to be a cow. Dopamine dresser or calming neutrals? Depends where I am. Chartered nickname? Dickhead. 

Oh, actually I did have a nickname. It was Bambi because I was just so uncoordinated and constantly bruised knees, scabby elbows. So yeah, I got the nickname Bambi from a very young age. Relatable content. What city in the world do you most like? I think Bangkok. Yes. Yeah. Planning, love it or loathe it?

Depends where I am.  What, in your cycle? Um,  No, I think like I'm very planned when it comes to work because I have to be, but like personal life, I just go with the flow. I think that's more fun. ADHD diagnosis status.  Oh my God. It's, it's a, it's a tricky one. And I have, you know, the medical system to thank for that.

But I am, I was formally diagnosed in 2018 in Sydney and then diagnosed again in 2022 in the UK because my diagnosis in Australia didn't, didn't work. Doesn't count. Doesn't count. And then when I moved back to Australia, I have to get appraised again. So  yeah, two appraisals from two different doctors. I then now have to go through the process again and convince someone.

So that's. Oh my God.  So I wanna give some background. So where did we start?  ? I don't know what year it was. I think I do. It was, it was 2008, 11.  Yeah, it was 2011. Fuck. Okay. So 2011 I met Katie. I finished teaching diving one day, and I went to another dive school where my friends were working in Tau, and I came down to the beach where you were all sitting and you had.

It's literally a table full of a hundred, I'd say at least, large Changs just that you'd been drinking all day. And that was how we met. And then a few days later, it was the Kowtow Festival and our mutual friend, well now mutual friend, Tana, was visiting me and we were walking down the street and I decided it was a really good idea to make dresses out of bin sacks. 

They were chic to be fair.  They were like very tailored dresses. It is a wonder what you could do with a big sack. And I spotted Katie and I was like, Oh, hi, do you want to come to the, to the Kowtow Festival with us? And you're like, yeah. I was like, do you want to wear a big bag? You're like, yeah. So I just stood in the street and ripped off a bin bag, made you a dress.

It was very Rick Owens. Yeah. Like very, yeah, it was chic. We should find some pictures of that. I should be in fashion too. Yeah.  I scouted you, babe. I saw your vision.  And then we proceeded to be at this Kotel festival. I remember not having shoes on. I don't think we ever wore shoes. It was just mud. Yeah.

Carrying a bucket. That would have been spilling Red Bull and Yeah. Just unbelievable amount of alcohol. But then remember the storms came over and we were walking through the streets because we couldn't wear shoes because it was up to our hips of water and we just thought, let's wade through town, hip deep in water to find a pub.

Yeah. And the electrical wires were like dancing. And we just thought, yeah. It's worth it for a pint.  So that was, that was how we met.  As you pointed out in 2018, you got diagnosed with ADHD. And so part of the reason why I'm really excited to have Katie on the podcast is because when I tell the story where I say, it was a conversation with a friend that led me to find out that I had ADHD, this is the friend.

She is responsible for all of this. Yeah, that's my claim to fame.  So, what led you to suspect that you had ADHD? Um, I think it's very, you know, similar to a lot of people, especially women. Like I, I think as a child, I always felt very, very different, um, very, very creative at school, but couldn't really apply myself.

And despite, you know, the teacher saying good potential, like there was just no way I could focus. And it was just like a very isolating experience. Like I had a, I had a really good time at school because I got to socialize with friends, but. Yeah. At the same time, there was like, I've always felt like a bit of a failure.

And I remember my first job out of school, it was in an office, so it wasn't working at like a closed store or at a restaurant, but I remember just like looking around the room and all of these people were so like dedicated, so like they'd had their little notepads on and they'll like clear off all of the jobs.

And I was like,  I'm getting phone calls from my phone company asking me to pay my phone bill. Like, I just like, and I was like a turning point where I was like, I think I am, I think built differently because I just have never seen someone operate like that in a professional environment. And that was very scary.

And I think that kind of, yeah, was like a turning point for me, but it took like quite a long time. And unfortunately through relationships and like my emotional responses during like, you know, breakdowns of like with my partners. The last one was like a big turning point. I was like, why do I feel so emotional about this?

Where, you know, I'm really good at giving advice to other people, but not taking on my own. So yeah, it was after like a really, really bad breakup and burnout as well. Like I, I think, you know, as I was saying before, like being surrounded by like high performance in my workplace, that has led me to  work extra hard.

Like, you know, everyone would go home at five, I'd stay till nine doing the same task that I could have gotten done in the first hour of the day. So that led to burnout. And then obviously that spilled out in other parts of my life. And then, yeah, I got a diagnosis. And yes, or, uh, I actually have a very funny diagnosis story in that my doctor in Sydney referred me to just the closest clinic, which they, they kind of do.

And luckily for me, the wait list wasn't long at all. I think it was maybe two weeks I had to wait, which, you know, amazing, but I've rocked up to this clinic in the city and it was something, I forget the name, but it had like legal in it. And so I've gotten in there and I'm like sitting in the reception area and there's all of these like bike y, like.

Gangster looking guys sign in and then I sit down with the psychiatrist and he's like so you haven't committed a crime like This is for like criminal assessments before the courts I was like, this is a girl from fashion, how dare you?  But yeah, he was like I love this because I get to like assess someone who hasn't committed the worst kind of crimes But hang on, let's backtrack a minute Because I have two things to say.

So first of all, it's so funny, isn't it? Because it's that thing where you're looking from the outside looking in. Yeah. And every time I've told the story, which is many times of how I found out I had ADHD, I always say like, my most capable friend, my most successful friend, my most organized friend. Like, yes, you did fucking work all the time, but I didn't ever perceive that as like you having to do double or like whatever.

I just thought that you were just the most driven, successful person. Yeah. I'm very good at masking. Very, very good. I think that's my number one talent, but yeah, like consistently over overdoing myself and like I have a massive, massive fear of failure. And I think like when you're in a workplace. Like I'm, you know, I still do it now.

Like I'll put up a task for, you know, months at a time and then I do it. I'm like, that was so easy, but the time has passed and I'll still get absolutely slammed by my workplace. So that's something I had to learn with. But yeah, it's. It's like, I think, you know, I'm very good at presenting as being together, but behind closed doors, like I would get home and I had no social life for about five years cause I would just be so burnt out.

I get home and just like get into bed, not eat dinner, but yeah, since my diagnosis that's obviously changed. Well, that's good to hear, but how did you, so when you realize when you had your emotional responses and you realized you were struggling, could you put that to ADHD or was it a doctor that suggested that?

Yeah. Um, well, interestingly enough, a former boyfriend after we broke up sent me a very, very long article about you might have ADHD and it was like a really long form. This is before TikTok.  Here are the five signs. So you didn't read it. No, I wasn't trying  to do this. So like, it always been in my head, like when I was younger, I did and still do suffer from anxiety and depression.

And I just like, I think I got to a point and I saw my doctor, I was like, I just can't keep living like this. Like, is this, is this really it? Like, is this? How it's going to be for the rest of my life because this, I, despite, you know, having a great job, having great friends and living in a beautiful city, like I feel so shit all the time.

I feel like a failure. I have massive imposter syndrome. So, and I also went through like a bit of a health kick after like my sort of breakdown as it were. And I stopped, you know, I did the wellness journey, so I stopped drinking, stopped going out exercising and yeah, he kind of just gently put it to me.

I did actually say, like, I've always wondered if I. you know, suffer from like ADHD. And at the time there wasn't a great deal of information out about it. And so, yeah, he referred me. And then after my diagnosis, my mom was like, Oh, we always thought that you did, but you know, we were, we were advised that, you know, we knew kids who had it, but they were like, you know, naughty boys from church.

I'm like, well, My life would have been a lot different,  but it's still, it's still a great life. You don't know. You don't know. Not only did we not know, but we didn't know the impact of a lifetime not knowing what the knock on effect of that would be. But you know, you might not have ended up like shoeless in a bin bag.

I know, exactly. In Thailand with me. I've lived many different shades of life. Um, and, you know, And I do, like, as much as, you know, there was shame about it when I first got diagnosed, like I was so shocked. And even I did tell some people in my life and they were like, Oh, it's just like, don't worry about it.

I'm like, what do you mean? Don't worry. It's not like I'm going to like take some medication and get over it in like three weeks. Like this is going to impact me for the rest of my life. It's impacted me my whole life  and like, just reflecting, like I had a conversation with another friend of mine who was recently diagnosed and we're very similar personality types.

Um, yeah. And he just said something that, like, really, really hit home of, like, we were always, like, the jokers in our classroom. We were always kind of the, yeah, like, the joker, the centerpiece of the party, always doing the funny things, but in a way, like, people were laughing at us in a certain way.  We didn't know any better, that some sort of behaviour, you're like, it's a laugh, but it's like, you're putting up these, I guess, very funny characteristics, or like boisterous characteristics, because like inside, you're like, I don't know how else to act, like, it's like almost a way to soothe the stimulation of being out in public around different types of people.

And I mean, also dopamine seeking, so like seeking the fun, because I know that that was, It's such a big one for me anyway, was like,  God, is this it? Like you said, is this it? What's this all about? Okay. What are we doing here? Everyone else seems to be doing well. I'm really, I've been really fucking struggling and or bored at all fucking times.

So should we just do something fun then? Yeah. Like what else? You know, I also have this thing as well. Like if I was in a really boring, I shouldn't say boring, but like an environment which wasn't steepling for me, I would actually just start yawning and it was, I just felt so rude doing it. But I just now realize that like.

It was because I wasn't getting the rush of, you know, doing something that I actually enjoy, which is, you know, a common human experience.  But yeah, like that was one thing, having a physical reaction, just being like, I'm so bored. Like, my eyes go, yeah. And I just like, you know, daydream and like, I draw a lot during meetings.

I've had to stop doing that because, you know, it can come across as rude. You don't have to. I don't have to. But like, you know, it's very confusing for some people, I think, who aren't sort of aware that that's like my stimulation. Yeah, absolutely. Why do you think it was missed?  I think I was, you know, not an easy child to raise.

Um, no, no, no, no. And I think that came from growing up in a very male dominant environment in that, like I grew up on a street and we're all very close family friends and they were all mostly, mostly men around me or boys. And they all had their own stuff going on. And I think, you know, in the nineties and, you know, 2000s and even now, you know, many centuries before that, the little girl has to be the perfect little princess that has no issues.

But like during, like, I grew up in a Christian environment as well. And I now, I'm now atheist, but respect my, my upbringing and all religion. But I think, you know, if you're someone like us and you're sent to a place on a Sunday and you have to dress a certain way, learn about things that you Not really into and then conform like one thing.

I'm I cannot conform in any kind of way Like it's just something I really really I'm proud of it but like I get physically like and I have an emotional response if someone tells me to do something and I'm like See, I I can I can conform if I can understand the why if you can explain to me why it makes sense Then I can get I'm not saying everything.

Yeah, I can get behind things. Yeah, I'm not a rebel You Without cause, but I do need to know my first response would always be why? Because a lot of the time I'm just like, what for though? What's the fucking, why do I have, why? You know, I just really didn't want to be there like at all. And then as I got to high school, the hormones were mixing. 

I just became an absolute. Horror. And, you know, I feel, I feel bad for my parents by also now knowing what I do and like going on my own journey. I feel more sorry for myself and  like, you know, my family are lovely, but they're very, you know, it's like a very structured environment. And so when you're being pushed up against the wall every single day, every single minute of your life, you're going to lash out and lash out.

I did. So yeah, there was some really dark times during my teenage years.  A lot of failed counselling. I actually got diagnosed with borderline personality at one point, but like, I didn't have that. I didn't, I didn't have that at all. I had ADHD. Yeah. And again, like, going to a child psychologist who also didn't, this is another horrible thing, they actually didn't tell me that I had it.

I found out years later that I was diagnosed with it, but they didn't actually bother telling me that I had it. They thought for some reason, this, you know, really, really serious mental condition would be better, best kept from me,  but I didn't, like borderline personality is a very complex mental issue.

And like, I have some people in my life who do have that condition, but I did not resonate with, I looked through it when I was finally told and it's just not me. But then if I put ADHD next to it, I'm like, Oh yeah, like, how did you miss that? How did you miss that? I'm like, See, I think that I'm even more ridiculous than you though, because like, when we were in Thailand, like there were stories that need to stay there. 

And it was like, you know, we were all, there were three of us in our little group and we were wild together, but I feel like I was fucking howling at the moon at this point. And literally. Yeah. I mean, we definitely, I look back on that now and I'm like, just. How are we alive? How are we alive? Like, Not even just like, just situations I think we'd put ourselves into  were definitely reckless.

But, I mean So reckless. But I don't regret any of them actually. Oh no, no, no. God no. I wouldn't, I wouldn't, I wouldn't recommend it.  I wouldn't recommend it at all. Like, and if I had a child to say, I'm going to go  tubing in Laos, I'd be like, I'll rip up the passport.  Like there's just no way you're going.

But, um, yeah.  Was that answer the question? Yeah, I can't remember what it was. Um, so what has changed for you since your ADHD diagnosis?  Well, I got medicated, which was great. And. I think like an analogy that I use with my psychiatrist after I started on the medication was like, I was always a disassociate child.

Like I wasn't ever hyperactive. I was  in my head a lot. And I just like, when I started taking my medication, I just said like, it feels like I've been looking through a dirty like photo lens and now it's just been like twisted into focus. And I was like, holy shit, is this like how it's meant to feel like this is fucking amazing.

And, like, even people at work were like, wow,  we don't have to, like, make fake deadlines for you now because you're actually, like, doing the work on time. And I was like, I know. And I think, like, that just helped my self esteem so much. So that was, like, a huge thing. My self esteem was, like, wow. non existent for a really long time.

And then that, yeah, funny, because again, I would never have that. Oh my God. No, no self esteem Smith, like absolutely none. So that really, really helps. And my relationships changed as well. I think when you're a disassociate as well, like it's,  What's that thing? It's like out of sight, out of mind, but it's like a, it's a common absence of object absence.

Object impermanence. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. So I unfortunately would have that with relationships in my life, like even friends that I've had for a really long time. And yeah. If I hadn't seen them in a while, like they were just, I  had it with ex boyfriends. I remember like being out and being like, why is it when they're here, I absolutely love them.

Yeah. And then when they're gone, it's like they were never here and I couldn't care less. Yeah. And then I'd see them again and be like, Oh my God, I feel so guilty. I adore this person. Yeah. I'm exactly the same. I actually made like a song. Spreadsheet in Excel and I would have like the 10 people I care about most.

And I would like put dates next to the last time I contacted them because like, that was the only way that I could ensure that I was like pulling my end of the relationship. When I look back now, I'm like, that is so sad. Um, but also as well, like at the same time, you know, in the lead up to my diagnosis of being burnt out and being like absolutely heartbroken by situations.

I couldn't be a good friend. So it just was like this double down on like, I don't have the emotional capacity. Maybe that's just a badgered you into talking to me then. Yeah. God, leave me alone. You're always contacting me again. She's hearing that weird girl from Thailand. Fuck off. You know, you mentioned something really interesting.

So like disassociation. I remember I have this really clear memory of being about  I must've been like 14 and I was at my granddad's house in Trinidad and I remember we were stood trying to get into his door. Like my mum couldn't find the key or something. I remember standing there and I was like just playing with my hands or something.

I was looking down at my hands and I was like, Oh fuck, this is really happening.  Like I did, it's almost like I just wasn't there. Oh, I wasn't, I was, I was there, like I was going through the motions of life. It's. But the only way I could sort of cope with life was that I was kind of like just a few steps  Like inside myself and then I was like, oh no.

Yeah, I'm actually controlling this meat soup 

Horrible realization. That's, yeah, that you're too young for that. That's where your trauma came from. Realizing that you're a sentient being at a young age. 

Anyway, we digress. So self diagnosis is valid, but one of the main points of this podcast is to push for systemic change so that we can access life changing diagnosis and treatment. So with that in mind, if you could implement change to improve the diagnostic process, what would it be?  You can answer this twofold.

You can do Australia and the UK, having been through both, or whatever calls you to say. I mean, I, I feel like, you know, the last couple of years and your part to think this has been a lot more advocacy and awareness and definitely back in when I was diagnosed, there was a few online medical journals, but also, I think, like, speaking from, like, in the workplace as well, like, I feel, you know, we're always trained to see or identify if someone's, you know, feeling blue if they're anxious, like, what steps do we need to do to, like, you know, Um, ensure that person that they're in a safe space to like open up and there's like, you know, outside, um, resources, like corporate therapists and things like that.

But I feel like that doesn't actually like cover the root of the issue sometimes and ADHD being one of them. So I think like more awareness in the workplace. I think it's really funny because obviously.  You're, well it's not funny at all, but you're about to have to go through the process for a third time.

For me, I'm quite nervous because, well, it's good news. Good news is we've sold our  house, it's official today, and we're going out for dinner to celebrate and we're gonna have time. We're going for Thai food, who knows what will happen tonight. If only they had buckets of sangsom and redbok. But, the issue is, that kind of, everything I've set up here, like, I am afraid, I don't know what happens now.

As a person who has responded so well to medication, obviously it's like, boo hoo. There are people listening that are still on this. But like, It did change and save my life and the fact that I might not be able to access it where I'm going to have to go through the process again or something is quite scary.

I still don't have access to work. I don't know what happens there. I don't know what's going to happen with any of it. Change is like a massive thing for people like us, like as much as we like to move about, try different things. For me, like, Relocating overseas for the first time when I moved to London was by far the most traumatic thing I've ever been through.

Like if, you know, when you've gone without your support system and like, you know, your nest, it's, it is very, very hard. And I think just doubling down on the fact that I got to the UK and then I had like six months worth of medication I think I came with. And then I was like, I'll just, you know, sign up to get assessed here.

And then COVID happened. Yeah. And then like, however many people found out they had it during COVID. And then the waitlist, I mean, that's what happened as well. Right. So I think I got to halfway through COVID. I'm like, Oh, my medication's running out. I should probably like see. And I was like, How long did you say that this was for 

Oh, shit. So, I mean, yeah. Um, and I definitely went out without my medication for a really long time and then I had to see, yeah, someone else separately, um, and then tell them my life story and that, that were very, very lovely. And that was sort of private 'cause I couldn't like wait any longer. Yeah. And then, um, I just am so perplexed as to how expensive the medication is.

I just, I feel like I'm being punished for it. You know what I mean? I think that, I think the whole thing's fucked, isn't it? Really? Because that's one of those things where you can logically look at something. So I can say, okay, we didn't know about it. So there are all these people now, the system as it stands, it's going to take forever for the people that have found out that they've got it to get through.

And then the medication is in shortages because of this. And I get it. And I get it. And I get it. It's a knock on effect. But  yeah, but it's like, it shouldn't be this hard. So for example, And I'm not, I'm going to say I'm not ashamed to say it, I'm a little bit ashamed to say it, but I'm working on my own internalised ableism.

So Big is like in charge of my meds. He'll be like, Oh, it's time to reorder or change your HRT patch, because otherwise I'm going to fuck it up. Every time, you know, there has been a couple of times where I've had to be like, Oh my God, I've only got one tablet left and it's Friday, fuck. And then they've helped me out in an hour of need, but it's like, that's so ableist.

Why the fuck do I have to do that? Like, I understand that it's a controlled drug. I mean, I actually, I'm lying. I don't fucking understand that it's a controlled drug. However, it is. And I just think it's absolutely fucked that I have to keep remembering to order it. Yeah, it's, I kind of mean is one of my biggest struggles. 

Yeah. I mean,  surely we're at a time in our lives,  even just a fucking text message, but like it's a prescription for a subscription for your prescription.  A subscription, just like, how can you send me a fucking HelloFresh box every week? You can't send me my medication,  life saving stuff. Like I hate it.

But what also like really bothers me as well. Like. If you have such a big wait list and such a big, like, you know, this huge wave of people who are coming forward with like, I've suffered with anxiety, depression, addiction my whole life.  Relationships. You want to address that pretty quick, and I understand that there's, you know, a whole other thing behind this, but like, no, but the issue is that they shouldn't be because I feel like, you know, the pandemic taught us that you can change your fucking plan really quick.

Yeah. So like, yeah. Okay. It should take as many years of legislation and lobbying and whatever and whatever, but just like that you go, Oh no, actually all of these people are in dire medical need. Let's change the fucking plan right now. And it could, it could happen just like that. And that is what needs to happen, because all of these people on waiting lists  is lucky that they're alive.

And, you know, with the BBC saying it could take the best part of eight years, because there's 200, 000, then yeah, gosh, God help us all, because who knows how many of those people will still be here if it stays as it is. So actually.  It's really scary. It's really scary. And with there being no set way that things are diagnosed, you know, there's no reason why  we can't just make it simpler and make it quicker because say up here, it takes something like eight to 14 hours or something to diagnose where you don't have the staff, you don't have the time and all of these people's lives are in danger.

So what are you paying at? Yeah. Let's go. From a personal experience. Why do I have to go to? I mean, I. There's bureaucracy about it, and I fucking get it, like, I, I understand, but like, coming from the UK with like a full detailed analysis of my diagnosis, so they wrote like a, he wrote like a 30 page letter, which I was like, how did you remember all of these details?

Very impressive. But to give to my doctor here, so it would be like a straightforward thing.  No we can't do that, Mrs. Smear, you need to sign up, and I had to wait like quite a long time to see that person. And I just thought, hey, like, I can just come in and just be like, okay, here's my letter. Yeah. Do a quick overview and give me the drugs.

No.  It was like a full hour overview. I then had to do two more appointments post that to then be given the green light. Because that person's medical diagnosis wasn't credible. It's like, okay, I have asthma in Australia. Does it mean I have not have asthma in the UK?  And then I'm having it on the way back to Australia now.

I'm like, you would not do this for any other condition. Why are you doing it for this one? I, It's not gonna go away, I haven't cured myself, like, but yeah, I have to go through the whole process again, it's so, like, it's insane. It literally is, it literally is, it's inhumane, it's abased, it doesn't make sense.

I think, like, when they're questioning you as well, like, and I know it's, I recognise there's a whole diagnosis process, but it's just like, I don't need to, like, prove myself to you any longer, like, I've had this my whole life, this is my third diagnosis for the same disease, and I've had to spend thousands, thousands and thousands of dollars.

For the same answer for the same outcome, but it could be something that would they turn around and say, no, you're not eligible because we don't believe you have it like there is a small chance that could happen to me and that is very ableist.  It's just absolutely ridiculous. With ADHD presenting differently in each individual, what are your greatest struggles? 

I have very bad time blindness. Very, very bad time blindness. But do you overcompensate by being extra early? No, God no. Oh, fuck that. You do. Yeah, I do. It's crazy. It's crazy how, like, we are just opposite. And, like, I'll be like, okay, like, you know, everyone has different approaches, but, yeah, that's something I've really had to work on for a long time, because if I rock up late somewhere  to work, to a meeting, the self esteem goes, and I'm not in the room for at least six hours.

I'm just shaming myself, and, yeah, really talking shit about myself. Even when you knew, even post understanding what Time Blindness was, you still shame yourself. Oh, God, yeah. Like, it's like, why are you like this? But Nicole Nadler knows, right?  But over time, I've, you know, I've become more kindness and like kinder to myself.

I could, I could be doing a lot worse. I think being like not present in relationships as well, but you know, I think after moving to London and it was really like really great timing other than the COVID thing, but it was really good because I kind of got here. Had another mental breakdown and then had That's really great.

It's fucking great.  Yeah. Bon appétit.  And you know, I was without my support network. I, you know, had left a job that was very much part of my identity for a long time. I had no friends. I didn't know anyone in the city. But it really just taught me to like hitting rock bottom and like building the blocks from there.

And so that meant building better wellness routines in my life. Like for the longest time I did not engage in any kind physical exercise because I was like, that's lame. Um, which is so not true. Um,  but you know, prioritizing my wellness saying no, I was always a yes person to say no to people and then building better relationships.

Like I had a chance to, you know, bring this new Katie out into the world on my own terms. And you know, there's, there's, I have friendships and relationships now that, you know, accept me for who I am and not all of my past shortcomings. That, you know, I think a lot of relationships I did have in the past, that would hold a gun against my head and remind me of them all the time.

So, yeah, I think, well, yeah, the relationships. It's the, the time blindness and the other ones, which I forget would be, I don't know. I would have said impulsivity, but it's not 2011, so I don't know. You know, we, well, you know, we were young and, you know, no agenda, we had no jobs. You had a job for a bit.  I mean, I feel like we got in a ridiculous scrape once.

So we, You know when you live on a, any kind of tourist island, tourists come and they get mopeds and they moped about the place. Oh no. And it was always the case that you see it in Thailand. 'cause some of the roads aren't gray. And you've got, you see a group of lads on holiday in Thailand, at least one of them's gonna be bandaged up 'cause they've come off moped.

Oh yeah. Or they've got, or they've skipped through a fire. Oh yeah. Yeah. I mean, so it was something that I would never do because I know I'm uncoordinated and I know I can't do anything. I could get on the back of some people's bikes, but I would never ride on myself. I don't have that coordination anyway.

And then just on this one day, literally it was like the day before you were going to go. Yeah. But also, no, I was going to go away somewhere, but just.  Basically, Laura got on the back of my bike. I'm a confident bike rider. I will say this. I'm going to caveat this and people who,  some of my friends who might listen to this will say you are not a confident rider, but I don't need your validation.

And like, I'm not used to having people in the back of my bike, but instead of just going on the main roads, which are concrete roads, we decided to go down a 45 degree mountainside over big rocks. It was like, there was no grip. Oh my God. It was like gravel on a mountain. To get to a dumb beach. Yeah. That we didn't get to.

And how the fuck would we get back up, is the question actually. Don't like, ask questions later. But anyway, inevitably, we fell off. And it was the worst thing because I, did I go over your shoulders?  I can't remember, but when I think back to it, it was literal flip flops and shorts, no helmets, nothing. I got busted, we both got a busted knee.

Well, Katie stood up, and I'm not being rude, but your knee was like a vagina, and it was just open at the front, and you stood bar upright, and you alright? I'm alright, I'm fine, I'm fine. And your leg was just like, It's because I am a woman. I'm a cancer son. I put everyone before myself. But, I mean, that's not even, I don't even think that's the worst thing we've done.

Oh goodness. Another worst thing, we were in Laos, and we unfortunately witnessed a very horrible thing that happened, which someone fell off one of the rope swings, and, you know, when you I didn't even go on any of those, by the way. Um, no, we did. Oh, we did after that. Yeah, which is This was the dumbest thing.

So we've just witnessed something that was out of final fantasy. And so we decided to shake it off. Well, we did. Well, the point is, where else are you going to go? Well, we were there.  Literally home, but like we got, we drank another bucket. Like I think what would have been like an equivalent of a bottle of whiskey between the two of us or three of us.

And then we went to the next bar And then decided to, to soothe what our trauma, we decided to jump off a ledge of the same height into water that you can't see 10 centimetres through like muddy Russian river. And the thing is, I just done, I just done my dive instructor training where you have to do all of these health and safety things.

And we're literally looking at a tree. There's a fucking bit of. It's like wet paper stuck to this tree and somebody's drawing in pencil, jump here, don't jump here. Don't jump here, because you will fall on rocks and break your legs. Yeah. But we just decided to give it a go anyway. Yeah, we just did it. It wasn't Eat Pray Love.

And that was the same, oh, there was no Eat Pray Loving, there was no Eat Pray Loving. Eat Risk Drink. Janey, eat, drink whiskey. Well, we were,  yeah, it was, it was pirate times and then for no reason whatsoever, you got out a sharpie and drew mustaches on us and wrote Paddy on my chest. Wow. As in diving Paddy.

They were, they were,  I mean. They were the best of times. They were the best of times. They were most of the worrying time of your life. They were really horrendous and yeah, they were. You know what though, like that, that trip, I did on my own as well. Like I didn't know anyone. So I met you and Han, who are two of my best mates now, to be fair.

But like, you really gave me a lot of confidence. Cause like, I was Because I was that much of a dickhead that I'm just gooning about the place. Like, come on, let's be dickheads! I had to find someone on the extreme, not just someone who goes up to guys in bars and be like, Hey. Someone who's like, let's jump off this ledge into water.

We can't see it. I had to really go to the extreme to get myself out of my shell. And I found you  and look at us now.  Oh my God. That's so funny. So you're on meds now.  I'm actually off the meds now. at the moment. I mean, this is just another annoying thing about Invertical Modes of the System is that when I left London, I got my prescription from LVANCE and I was speaking to my lovely pharmacist and just said, I'm going to India for like two months and he's like, just buy your Benz there.

It's so cheap. And you just buy it over the counter. And I was like, hang on, what? And I just, yeah, I bought some when I was there and it was like next to nothing. But I was like, explain to me how this is like, it's like the crown fucking jewels for me to get medication. For your actual brain disorder. I can just go to a pharmacy in India and they're like, yeah, how many do you want?

That's going to cost you like 10 pounds. Yeah, it's fucked. The whole thing's fucked. And even like other like medication that I needed there was just next to nothing. And I was like, we really live in that world, don't we? Like it's,  it's confusing. It just feels like you're being taken advantage of your own, being taken advantage of a little bit.

And that's the thing being taken advantage of is, is right. And that's the thing that bothers me so much about the people on waiting lists. Like obviously I've said many times on this podcast.  ADHD. There are problems across the board. Like, yes, we should start identifying young and we should do this and we should do that.

But like my lane is very specifically this lane because it, it just, it literally, well, it does keep me up at night. I just feel like all of these people, like all of us.  We've been so wronged, we've been so failed, and it's like, you can't let these people down again. Like, that's fucking enough. This is enough of a plot twist.

Give us the help now. Yeah. For fuck's sake. We're fucking tired, man. Yeah. We're really tired. Well, you know, continue fighting and, you know, advocating for our sisters and brothers and everything in between to get their diagnosis, but it's fucking tiring. Like, I don't Well, none of us have got here scot free, really, have we?

So we've had enough. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I had to go on like the wait list in Australia was quite long. Um, even though it's private, I'm like, I just don't even know if I can be bothered.  I'm so grateful. That's how I feel. That's what I'm worried about going and moving anywhere else. I'm just like, well, maybe I'll just fucking work then.

And it doesn't come without me recognize how privileged and lucky I am to even be in a position where I can go to a doctor. Like I'm not saying that at all. And I'm very, very grateful, but it's just wake up, take your medication, having to explain yourself. Having to like, you know, live with a guilt for so long of, and like mourning your past self of how it could have been going to doctors, explain that you need this medication, pitching your illness to them to get the drugs.

It's like, Oh my God, just there has to be a better way. Do you know, it's funny because like you say you were very good at masking  and I feel like I haven't ever been particularly.  And so it's like. When you look at it, that's literally why it's called ADHD AF. It's like, are you fucking joking? It's like, how?

How could anybody not look at me and just literally see it written across my forehead? I think though, like, and I don't mean this as a read or a thing, but I think like knowing you for so long, it was like,  Laura hasn't bought her ticket for the boat, or Yeah. Oh, it's okay, Laura's rocked up to a night out with 1 percent on her phone.

Like, I think she's Laura's still out. I think, like, over time, like, it was ingrained as to what we could You know. Expect. Expect. You know.  I don't mean that in a bad way at all, but like, I think before, the years before you got diagnosed, I think you were just like, you were fed up a long time before, you know.

But then also, you know, getting upset and having emotional responses to things  like, you know, types of music, for example. Yeah. Special interests. Yeah. Special interests. Raving. Yeah. Only I can make raving nerdy, I tell you. I was just trying to think of something that Like, you, you sometimes cry at like the dumbest things.

Yes!  What were you crying at once? Or like, I know you always cry at like the Tesco Christmas ads or something. No! Anything! Not even the John Lewis ones, the Tesco ones. My grandad had it. Yeah. My grandad used to cry at everything. Yeah. He used to cry watching football. And you'd just be like, what are you crying for?

He's like  Well, somebody's lost. Yeah,  aww.  So, after receiving a late diagnosis, it is believed we experienced Elizabeth Kubler Ross grief cycle. But I feel those different stages are constantly shifting, so we'll call it the late diagnosis rollercoaster instead. So like, denial, bargaining. Acceptance. Yeah.

Anger. Depression. Anger. Acceptance. Like, where are you at? Or do you think it changes? I think like when I first got diagnosed,  what was the first one? Denial. Denial. I did not deny. I did not feel any denial at all. I still don't because I knew this my whole life  and you know, the, now it had a name, you know, like the curtains have raised and I'm like, okay, at least I have some clarity on who the fuck I am and how to move forward.

So there was never a denial stage. What I did very much struggle with was grieving and that was really, really hard, especially when I, you know, moved away and I was like by myself a lot and I was during lockdown of like reflecting on all those times that I failed my younger self and like failed that poor little girl who was just so confused at the time, but then trying to keep up appearances and.

And frightened and trying to be the best of the best and like, you know, failing at that as well. And I think that's really sad. I think that's, for me, that was the saddest part of like reflecting as my younger self and how different things could have been, even though, you know, I've done the full roundabout now and I'm at a point where I'm like, I've loved those experiences because they've shaped me to who I am despite them being, you know, very, very traumatic and hard at times.

That's the I think, yeah, and I've done a lot of inner child work on that as well, like soothing my inner child. And like, for a while I had this trick on, I had my own screensaver as like a picture of my The RuPaul thing! RuPaul says to do that. I still haven't done it. I still haven't done it. And like, it was a picture of me and a little girl, like every time I'm feeling down or angry at myself or pissed off at the world, I just look at her and I'm like You just have to do it for her, you know, and that sounds very, very lame and like, you know, very whimsical and Pinterest y, but like, that's really, really helped me because, you know.

Has it? Yeah. And cause I, I feel like as a child, you're not given the tools to make decisions or any coping mechanisms at all. Like you kind of have to navigate through life by yourself. And like, I, I didn't ever feel like I could really come to my family with, you know, My troubles because it was, you know, seen as maybe being a bit naughty or, yeah, you know, maybe you need God get in trouble or you, yeah.

So like, yeah, I, that was like a really hard time for me and I just, the anxiety on past decisions, like, you wake up after a big night out and you're like, Oh my God, like, did I do all those things? I say those things. We're not going to say anything about David James, that's ADHD after hours. It is. That's for the After Hours episode, but like, 

I  think I just decided to black it all out because there was a lot of things in my life that I'm like, Oh my God, like, I can't believe I, you know, they're all from like impulsive actions or, you know, maybe I was having a really bad day instead of like resting at home and like, you know, not being overstimulated.

I've gone out and done some dumb stuff. Or, you know, said some things that have come out the wrong way, or found something funny that I shouldn't have found funny, but we have a very unique sense of humor, so,  um. But, you know, I just decided like one day of just, you know, months and months of, you know, depression and isolation, I was like, you know what, like, I can't let this weigh me down any longer. 

And I had like a very, you know, spirit ceremony. Like I think everyone did in COVID. I bought some crystals. Yeah. Yeah. Some sage. And then just didn't cut a fringe like me. They didn't cut a fringe. We'll put a picture of Laura in the episode notes. You know what you said about, instead of kind of sitting in the discomfort, you go out and do something ridiculous.

And I think I relate so hard. I think there were just so many years there where I felt, yeah, so othered, so alien  and just, you know, so alone in a crowd, unless I was with my people. So like if I was in Thailand or if I was in Visa, that's okay. Yeah. Yeah. But everywhere else it wasn't. And so then it was just like this. 

The only word I can ever think to describe it is oblivion. Just fucking come on then! And then it's like this absolute frustration and it's almost like a joke. Like all of this stuff inside me or in my head. That I can feel anything, it's just like, what the fuck do I do with all of this? That's what it feels like.

So just like, right, let me out. And that, and that was it. And I, and I was out for years and years.  The other thing I was going to say is like, now, where are you at now? Are you at acceptance now? I'm at acceptance. And I think. That's what I was going to say before, like part of my  journey as well is that like, because I had been like masking this whole time and, you know, overextending myself, burning out, I actually didn't have any fucking hobbies.

Didn't have any hobbies? No, I don't have any hobbies. If someone said to me, what, what are you into? I'd be like,  um, hanging out with friends, listening to music, like, so like eating food, like the basic human fucking requirements.  And I'm like, it's not true. You're into dying things now. That's because I got hobbies.

So like over time, like, you know, and then I'm like, I'm going to just operate on my own terms now. And you know, you have to find a balance between, you know, what society expects of you. Yeah. Baseline. And then I was like, I'm just going to like completely turn this shit upside down and like find what I'm interested in.

And yeah, now I, I'm so busy all the time because I'm doing things that I love. Not because I've been roped into doing something like abseiling, which I fucking hate, but like, you know, just feeling the need to sort of be out there and fitting in. So, a lot of those hobbies I have now are like, one woman shows.

It's like, you know,  that's been a good, that's, you know, the, the morning old self, but then finding the new self. Yeah. I think it's like a duality. It's a yin and yang, right? And it's, I feel like I've come full circle and now I am a completely different person than I was. What? Six years ago. Like I just, I think,  no, you're like, that's not true, but  like how I see myself and how like, you know, how I talk to myself, how I treat myself.

And just like, I think this is the Katie that always wanted to. be this person, but through the wave and the very knotted forest of getting out of this, you know, condition. Like, I feel like I'm out the other side, you know?  Yeah, sorry, I'm not laughing at you. Just the way that we  It's just so funny that we just kind of bounce around.

We'd always be looking at each other, like doing something stupid. Like, let's go do this. I feel like lately I've had this kind of weird experience of, it's not like the same situations tripping me up again and again, and it is, you know, I've said it all the time from the start of any of this is you see the ways in which you fall down, you put systems in place to better support yourself, but really like, in terms of relationships and people in my life.

And that's okay because you know, you have to learn it until you've learned it. But the issue that I face is like the impact that my decisions have on a lot of other people's lives. That's brought me a lot of shame and a lot of sadness. So I feel like I'm in another, even though I'm completely at acceptance, I'm in this other bit.

I had a sad day the other day and I said to big, I was just like,  I'm just gonna cry for a bit. Don't mind me. Uh, I just, I'm having one of those days where I just don't want to be me anymore. Like, I've just, I've just had enough. Like, I, I feel really embarrassed and really stupid and really sorry and really guilty and just like loads of shame.

And it's, and it's not fair because I've really fucking tried. Like, God, nobody can say I haven't tried these last couple of years. I've tried my best every which way, and to then, two years later, be like, you're almost back at square one and what was the fucking point anyway? It's like, oh, it's always gonna be!

But you know, it is.  Well, you don't have a fringe now. No, I don't have a fringe. And no, and I'm very rarely hungover as opposed to every single day. There was like a time though, like I remember when I came and saw you in Ibiza one year,  and your girl was down in the fucking pits.  Do you remember that time when you had like the flat by yourself was before it was, and I just remember like, cause like I've known Laura for a really long time, the pink palace, the pink palace.

Yeah. I've seen, I've seen, I think I've seen you through a lot of your life stages and I  think when I saw you that time, as much as you were kind of, you know, floaty happy, like there was such a sadness in you that I was like, I didn't even know this person. Yeah. And I think. That was when you were starting to be like, I can't  go on anymore.

And all of the years I've known you, that was the first time I was like, Oh shit, like, she's not. I think that's the thing though, is I was thinking about this the other day. It's like, I'm the darkest, lightest person I've ever met. And it's so extreme. And so the one feeds the other, right? So I, I'm so excitable, you know, Pat.

Who will like this episode and kill me for us sitting here like this doing it. But you know, like he'll be like, I can hear when you get excited, like your voice goes higher, you talk quicker, you,  I could get, you know, but I get really, really down as well. And it's always been that way. And so I'm always. 

looking to the light and trying to fill my days with fun because the dark side is so dark sides. I think there was definitely a period of time there where everything,  the hangovers weren't worth it because I was so sad and so anxious. Yeah. And so then I was paying for it that way. Whereas, you know, I'm like, just like, should I go again?

Like, every day, just like, oh, it's nearly noon, you know, but at that point, it was like, oh, the walls are closing in. Yeah, that was a sad time. Yeah, it was. But I do think, again, that that was hormonal. I think that was the start of, like, the next hormonal change, like, perimenopausal. Kind of stuff was when it all started to go to it's up because the symptoms got worse And I bet it was never the same.

That's why space closed 16 space closed  and Bowie died and I'm sorry, but everything's been fucked up since  I remember when space closed,  Pepe, the owner, he had a lot of local women or friends or whatever people came to the club before it closed. And it was these like 60, 70 year old women just there.

And they were up in the tube on the premier attach, like they were dancing to music. I remember watching it. It's being like. No, but that was my literal life plan. Yeah. What the fuck am I gonna do now? My God. Start a podcast. What am I gonna do now? Start a podcast, babe. Yeah.  . Star of revolution. Anyway, enough of that.

What has undiagnosed A DHD cost you? You talked about self-esteem.  I think it's really just cost my sense of self for a really long time. Yeah. Like I didn't know who the fuck I was.  Like, for a really, really long time, and I've had to really like rebuild that, and Because you were mirroring others? Yeah. So I didn't really, I'm like, I don't even know who the fuck I am.

And like, you know, I had certain people in my life being like, you, you know, rightfully so, being like, you were just ten people in one. And I was like, you're right, I didn't admit to them at the time. But I was like, I don't know who I am, I don't know what my values are, I don't  Yeah. Maybe. I don't know. I think it's like cost me like who I felt like.

Yeah. Well, you just felt disconnected. Disconnected from myself. Cause I would say you're a really strong personality. I'm a curation of 10,  10 strong personalities. I think I'm a hundred percent. Who I want to be now and I'm very strong in my values and like the way I view the world now, you know, the way I want to navigate and that's taken like a lot of time and reflection.

And I think, you know, as much as COVID was like a really, really horrible time, it did actually allow me. Nearly kill you. Yeah. Yeah. I'm a horrible COVID survivor. You lost your hair. Lost my hair. That was. That was another way of like finding myself. Guess what? You're nearly dying on your own in a flat in London.

Nearly dying and losing all my hair as a result from the stress in which it caused me. So yeah, there's like a sense of self has definitely cost me a lot of money. Oh my God. Like impulse buying, not like just. blindness of how much money I'm spending. It's definitely cost me a lot of opportunities. Like, there's been times where I've been freelancing and I just haven't submitted the work because of self sabotaging, time management, in which the work has gone, submitted so late that they're like, we're not paying you for this.

So, which is so fair. But that was, you know, a while ago, and I've, you know, made the steps to be like, that was a byproduct of my ADHD, so that you can't be too hard on yourself there, Katie, um, but there's steps you can take to ensure it doesn't happen again, or try not to, but there are still days where I just, I relapse back to my former self, and I have like, really, really down days, and like, You know, maybe going to the office where it is like a high performing environment and again having to mask, like, those are the really shit times and like, I just want to like, sit in my bed, pull the blinds and just listen to white noise for 24 hours and not see anyone because yeah, you're always, I think it's, you know, this is a lifelong journey.

It's not going to be, you know, an everlasting meadow for the rest of our life. It's going to be, Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. There's going to be a crooked path, but there's going to be beautiful flowers along the way, a nice river. There's going to be nice moments, but, um, there's going to unfortunately be some times where you feel very isolated because as much as, you know, you and I sit next to each other, we have ADHD.

Um, the way we navigate it and the way we interpret and experience it is very, very different. And like for me, and I think very much you were very much isolators when things go to shit instead of leaning on others.  Head down. Head down. See you later. Yeah. I like what you said, you know, there'll be rocky terrain or whatever, because the point is, is that In being quite extreme, all the life experiences that we can have through the symptoms that we have, it means that we have absolutely fucking lived.

Yeah. Ideally.  What would you like the world to know about ADHD? It goes without saying, it's not a trend. Yeah. That's a part of me. Unfortunately, it doesn't go without saying, but yeah. But like, ADHD is a very, very serious condition. Imagine feeling that you have like no self esteem, that you can't get out of bed.

Or imagine having all the time in the fucking world to apply for your Irish passport, but you still haven't done it, and you're about to move fucking house! And they won't let me apply for it! Yeah, so there's like, there are so many things. But I think, yeah, it's not a trend. It is a very, very, um, serious, serious debilitating condition and a never ending depth of symptoms and behavioral patterns that go for it, that look different on everyone.

Yeah. Like you are late. I'm, I'm late. You are early for good example. Yeah. And I think, you know, like more education on what those look like, so it's not about, you know, having bad grades or being late.  So many other things and that, and those are very common symptoms and how they show up with a diagnosis.

But yeah, a whole rainbow of other stuff. This might be an overshare, but I used to pick my skin a lot. That was like a huge stimming thing. I managed to build up like masses of like scar tissue, like I had one here and one here and one here. And they got so bad that I had to get them cut out. But ever since I was young, I was just always.

Picking these parts of my face, it created like a, um, it's like a cyst, but it's like a massive, like, scar tissue, yeah. What would you like the listeners to know? It gets better, and I feel like the journey that you are currently on, and you know,  it's a fucking safari. Um, everything, part of this journey, if I could do it again, is to lead with kindness.

So like, with yourself, with, you know, others that are, you know, even the people trying to help you, like just, just lead with kindness because it's really easy to become resentful and spiteful for sure. But I think I mentioned earlier, like the best thing that I kind of got from this was a greater sense of self.

And I think that's the best gift that I gave to myself ever and something I'm really proud of and how it's like, gotten this far in life until I was. However old I was, 28 or something. And like forgiveness as well. Um, so like it is a journey, journey into oneself and also just take it slow. Like I think once I got my diagnosis, I was like, right, I'm gonna make all these changes, blah, blah, blah.

And it's just, it's not going to work like that. It's a process and one you have to be very, very kind to yourself on. And yeah, we're all just trying to do the best. Very wise words. People with ADHD may have lower levels of dopamine, the chemical that plays an important role in reward and motivation. So increasing dopamine levels may help with some of our symptoms.

What increases your dopamine levels? You know what? I can't believe I've, like, if you asked me this, well, six years ago, I'd be like, no, but I exercise. Yoga was the one that I was like, no way. I could never do yoga because you have to like, you know, concentrate and switch your mind off and meditate. And like.

Someone who is like constantly overthinking things, like that sounds like hell. Like I'm being forced to sit with my own thoughts for an hour and I have to pay for it. Like, no, thank you. But once I started doing it, I started off with like a really slow type of yoga and then has gradually built up to a more advanced one.

And like. My yoga teacher said, like, all of the moves that you do in yoga, like lunges and shaturangas and all that kind of stuff, like, it's actually preparing your mind for meditation. So it's not actually about the moves that you're doing so much. It's basically like to activate part of your body that is going to make you enter a meditation.

And like, Nothing has been more beneficial for me, like I walk in, unwind, do my stuff, and at the end I'm like, I didn't, I didn't think about anything for an hour. That's amazing. I did not think for a single thing. I was just thinking about how I'm, you know, positioning my chest,  and that in itself is a meditation.

Yeah, absolutely. That's the first time I've ever meditated, and it's been the most beneficial for me, and I never have regretted going to a yoga class. So that's how I kind of, you Get my dopamine. But another way I get dopamine is I just love eating. I love eating. I love eating. And I really struggled with eating for a really long time in my life.

And that was like another, you know, offshoot of this thing we call ADHD was like body dysmorphia and not treating my body right. And there was some, but they were strange times as well. Yeah. Like culturally. Yeah. Yeah. But I just, I didn't have control in any other part of my life, so let's portion control my meals and have a green tea for dinner.

But now I've like, yeah, got to a place and enriching my body with like, nutritious food that I know that I'm going to love and it's taking me time to prepare is something that I really love doing. And yeah. EK love. Yeah. I've taken to the person I hate. I really have. I really, really have, but I love it. 

Give me a crystal, get me an astrology reading. I'm all about that life now. And then get her to Ibiza. And get me to Ibiza. And then Ibiza. I'm going to tell you! That's me going to church, baby.  What song best describes your ADHD?  It's called Small Hours by John Martin. It's not, it's quite a long song, but it's very acoustic and a bit ambient, but it does sing in it.

It's just very beautiful lyrics. Um, and I think, yeah, it resonated. Right. Thank you very much. And thank you from all of the listeners who actually can stand my voice  for starting this safari for all of us, Katie Smith, because I mean, likely I would have found out about it when it started to come out in 19, in 1920. 

1920.  2020. Um, but I wouldn't have found out about it when I did. And, um, I think especially because it was you, it felt very different. Yeah. I remember like when I was telling you, you're like, well, if you've got it, then I've definitely fucking got it.  Yeah.  I'm just going to gently passively tell you that.

I think you have it. I think you have got raging ADHD. How still alive.  Nobody knows it. Hands bleeding,  talking a million miles an hour. Don't stop moving. I didn't live in the same country as you at the same time. I was like coming from across the world. I've got some, I've got some tea to tell you, babe.

It's going to turn your world upside fucking down when you find out this shit.