The Future of Catholic Inc? (Full LOCALS Version)

What holds a Catholic ecosystem together: buildings, budgets, or the people who make donors care? We open with Steubenville’s possible merger and the weight of Scott Hahn’s legacy to ask a bigger question about succession, prestige, and what happens when a personality-built engine has to become a real institution. If grads don’t stay and leadership pipelines are thin, devotional culture becomes event-driven instead of rooted—and that has consequences for parish life, lay apostolates, and local identity.

From there we turn to the surging energy of the new right among younger Catholics. Love it or loathe it, the movement thrives because it blends theory and praxis: get staff jobs, avoid paper trails, shape policy. Older voices keep swatting at rhetoric while ignoring operations. That’s a missed chance to mentor. We argue for a different approach: hold firm lines on charity and truth while showing younger men where prudence begins, how power should be used lawfully, and why strategy beats outrage.

The most consequential split on the horizon won’t be between liturgical camps; it will be about loyalty, policy, and power. How do we assess foreign influence without collective blame? How do we reject predatory finance while building family-first economics? Catholic social teaching demands a common-good economy: sane housing, fair wages, and laws that protect the conditions for virtue. Fifty-year mortgages and 26% credit cards aren’t prudence; they’re a slow cage. We also talk about disciplined protest inside the Church—kneeling reverently and suffering silently when necessary—as a way to defend piety without courting schism.

Along the way, we share fresh evangelization stories: a lapsed Catholic returning to confession and burning occult baggage, a Protestant discovering the beauty of the Latin Mass, and why beauty plus clarity still changes lives. If you care about where Catholic life is headed—on campus, in parishes, and in politics—this conversation brings heat, hope, and a path forward.

If this resonates, subscribe, share with a friend, and leave a review so more listeners can find the show. Your feedback helps us shape the next conversation.

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Chapters

• 0:00 Cold Open: Jokes And Housekeeping
• 4:10 Steubenville’s Future And Scott Hahn’s Legacy
• 12:45 Donor Prestige, Succession, And Catholic Inc
• 19:30 Demographics, Community Bleed, And Local Reality
• 26:30 The New Right, Gr**pers, And DC Staffers
• 35:20 Generational Memory: Holocaust, Taboo, And Debate
• 44:30 Theory To Praxis: Why The Youth Are Mobilizing
• 53:10 The Coming Catholic Split: “Kosher” Vs Catholic
• 1:02:00 Policy, Power, And Foreign Influence Questions
• 1:11:30 Mentorship, Rhetoric, And Guardrails For Youth
• 1:20:40 Economics, Debt, And Catholic Social Teaching
• 1:30:00 Family, Roots, And The “Just Move” Reply
• 1:38:40 Cooperation Across Factions Or Burn Bridges
• 1:47:30 Evangelization Wins: Confession And Beauty

Transcript

SPEAKER_07: 0:11

If I died today, tomorrow you would come on here and use my death to promote a voting Babylon.

SPEAKER_06: 0:17

Yeah. So Rob passes on Tuesday. There's no show Tuesday or Thursday. So the third show, the following Tuesday, the hunt begins for your replacement. And I'll do auditions. This is a bad idea. Yeah, dude. Even if that gave me an 800-pound squat, man, I don't know, man. Uh Joshua Charles. What on earth is he talking about?

SPEAKER_07: 0:40

Send out invites to all the current you know podcasters, inviting them on. Make sure not to send one to Trent.

SPEAKER_09: 0:48

Sorry, Rob. I want that co-host spot.

SPEAKER_06: 0:51

So Wagner won the spot. Wait, wait, was this planned? No. Wait, this one this was not planned. Rob forgot to take the intro video down from the last episode, but we did discuss if Rob goes, who's I'm gonna find his replacement overnight. And Rob's gone, guys. I hate to break it to you, but Rob and I. It's me and Wagner. Wagner won the spot, he got the golden ticket. That's it. Um the Broy problem avoiding Babylon. The uh the okay, so uh Rob is feeling a little under the weather. Um, I wanted to talk about a couple of things tonight, and I figured Wagner was probably the perfect perfect person to bring on for do you hear an echo in this in this room? Because I moved some things around in my in my studio and sounds echoey over here, but um, so okay, so I had a a bunch of stuff I wanted to get into tonight. One was uh Stupenville is is talking about merging their diocese uh with Cleveland, I think. And uh I had some comments on on uh Scott Hahn that Thursday didn't really he wasn't crazy about. Uh so I figured we'd talk about that a little. Then Rod Dreer wrote an article about his trip to DC and talking about the Groipers, uh, and how 40% of the zoomers that work in DC are all secret Nick Plenthos.

SPEAKER_09: 2:20

I need to be I need to be so careful with uh what what I say about that, but you know, Dre or I I was reading that earlier and I was like he he really has no idea. Like he's he's just like in he's just in his own world uh right there, and it he makes no sense when he's commenting on the groupers and you know their placement and in like political positions. He's just he's just got no idea. It's it's so crazy.

SPEAKER_06: 2:47

The other thing is I think that Catholic Inc. has no idea how much groupers has infiltrated their realm. Um, there's there's a lot of this going on right now. So look, I have this theory that um all the older guys I see like freaking out about Fuentes, and I'm not just talking about like anybody that dislikes them, I'm talking about the guys who are like publicly like saying stuff about the dangers of Fuentes and all that stuff. These are the same guys who all believe in evolution, they all flip out if you question the moon landing, and they all end this. I know you're you're getting a little darker right now. I didn't know that's it's it's evolution, the moon landing. Um, and what's the other one, man? Um man, what was the other one? It was evolution, the moon landing. There's like me, there's this oh, and aliens. They all believe that there's possibility of aliens out there. Like it's something about like the the the propaganda they all received that they all hold to those narratives, like they're all just they get upset when you question their their their their narrative. So we'll get we're going to get into that. Um, and uh I have a bunch of other things that I want to talk about too, but we'll see where time leads us. So why don't we start off with the Stubenville story? Yeah. Um, so Steubenville basically is um considering merging their diocese with um let me just see. I want to make sure I have the story right. Uh sorry guys, when Rob's not here, things uh I'm gonna pull up what I wrote and then and then uh share what Thursday said. So let's see what we got here. Uh let's see. Oh man, this new this new chat for um dude.

SPEAKER_09: 4:45

That could have been that could have been so bad, you know, you showing your your your DMs.

SPEAKER_06: 4:51

I pulled it down just in case, but like the way the new chat is working, I really don't like it. Uh I'm gonna stop screen share there and then restart it. Dude, I don't like the way the new chat is set up. All right, let's go with this. Okay, this should work. Let's see. Okay, at the stage. Okay, so uh the Saint Paul. All right, so I wrote, I got news for you guys. So I was talking about the Steubenville diocese. Now, if they merge, and I said, I got news for you guys. Once Scott Hahn retires or passes on, there is no Steubenville. Say the St. Paul Center will also close down. There is no clear successor to the Han legacy, nobody has his charisma or ability to captivate. So now I was a subscriber to the Emmaus Road thing he had, and I I subscribed to it because I wanted to hear his talks, and then I figured I'd cruise around that site to try to find somebody else that I might enjoy their talk. There isn't really a single person on there that I found like, oh, I can't wait to see what else they put out. And a couple of people were like, Oh, what about John Bergsmo? What about and I'm like, Bergsmo is just as old as Scott Hahn, and he's going to be retiring or stepping down around the same time. So Thursday said the same the same poll center is great, but it's not the center of Steubenville. And there are lots of other things that can survive Scott. The College of St. Joseph, the worker, First Fridays on the fourth, uh, the community life, creator conference, Mark Nelson, Franciscan University, regardless of its problems, is going to hold growth. Uh, if you don't live here, you don't know what we need or what we are doing. Now, here's the thing: um, I don't live there. Thursday would definitely have a better perspective on this with me. My point is that Scott Hahn himself, people may not be going in droves to Steubenville because of Scott Hahn, but Scott Hahn brings a certain level of prestige to Steubenville. He drives donors there, he attracts other professors that they want to come and teach there because they know Scott Hahn is there. Now, you already had Frad leave. Once Scott leaves, I just think they're going to have a bit of a problem over there, especially once this diocese gets merged with Cleveland. I don't see how they maintain their unique Catholic identity. It's not really the epicenter of Catholicism in the States. Like, right, it's for the past 25 years, it's kind of had that reputation of being the epicenter of like of Catholicism because you had everything going on at Franciscan, and they were very closely related to the Catholic Inc. crowd. So all the guys at Stubinville would run through Frad show, they'd have good associations with Trent and Catholic answers, and they kind of like fed off of each other. And I I think they're going to be in trouble when Scott steps down.

SPEAKER_09: 7:33

Um, yeah, I don't know. I could see from at least my knowledge of like kind of some of the dealings of Emma, St. Paul's Center, you know, the kind of everything going on with Franciscan. I could see the argument for like, you know, St. Paul Center, Emmaus, they're gonna have to, you know, somehow uh change. They're gonna get smaller, they're gonna, you know, there's gonna be some issues uh there somehow. But you know, with with Franciscan University, I I just don't foresee um a sort of rapid collapse, especially because like there's this weird demographic shift of people from the coast going into um actually the Midwest, and I guess Ohio would be considered the Midwest here. Um, and it's it just doesn't really make sense to me that there would it collapse back into being like a crack den. Because that that's basically what Steubenville was before uh was kind of like well, it's still it's it's like 50 Catholic, 50 crackhead. Um a little bit of a little bit overlap.

SPEAKER_06: 8:33

It's basically crackheads, prostitutes, and catholicism. It's like that's that's the mix going on there. It's it's interesting though, because there'll be like a really beautiful house. Like we went there and we rented an Airbnb and it was gorgeous. And next door you see somebody shooting up, and you're like, Oh, that's interesting, you know. But the the the thing is that so if you read the Stubenville are the uh the the article from the pillar, I think it was, they're bleeding Catholics at three times the rate as the general population, really. So, yeah, so instead of like drawing more Catholics in to make it more Catholic, they're bleeding Catholics at triple the rate of the general population. So it seems like these kids that go to college there, very few of them are making their life there. They're they're going, they're getting their degree, they're figuring out what they're gonna do, and then they either go back home or they get a job somewhere else. But it's not like they're forming a community that people want to want to stay. They do have some pretty cool um like devotional things going on. Like that first Friday festival is awesome. If you've never been to it, it really is pretty cool. But um, I don't know. I I don't I just think, especially with the St. Paul Center and the Emmaus Road thing, Scott Hahn has dumped all this money, all this donor money into this project. And it just seems like he hasn't figured out a successor to that project. And I don't know. I I I because I talked to Joshua Charles about this too. I'm like, eternal Christendom right now, like you're the face of it. It's kind of like life site was John Henry Weston. Because we're in such personality-driven times, yeah, it's kind of difficult for a thing like that that has Scott Hanna's the face of it to continue on after he's gone, unless there's a clear, like charismatic figure that's right up in the ranks behind him that he's been forming that can take over things and bring the money in the same way he does.

SPEAKER_09: 10:24

Yeah, I mean, I think that this happens with a lot of organizations. Um, in the Protestant world at least. Uh, I've seen this. You know, it happens in uh multiple different uh institutions, unless there's like this weird thing, it's kind of funny. Um uh R.C. Sproul, I don't know if you ever heard of him. Uh yeah, I've read his books. Yeah, Ligonier Ministries, but they literally kept uh releasing books for like five years after he died. Like it was literally for like years after he died, they would keep releasing books of basically just like transcripts and like you know, recalled out stuff that he had already said and written for like years after he died, because that's really the only way that you can keep things like that going.

SPEAKER_06: 11:08

Um, well, we're watching it with TP USA, right? TP USA right now, you're watching the face of the organization past, and they're in kind of turmoil right now in mayhem.

SPEAKER_09: 11:20

Yeah, I mean that this is this is actually I was talking, funnily enough, uh, with the the groping of Catholic Inc., I didn't know I was gonna be a part of this since like uh until like an hour ago, uh, basically. But um the with the groping of Catholic Inc. I was just talking to somebody earlier, and basically my my sort of idea behind it is that when it comes to Nick and the America First movement, the the Gruiper movement, like they're kind of here to stay. Like they're everywhere, they're here to stay. Um, it's it's like a force that kind of just you know, it's you're either going you have to make a decision. Like if you're going to want to be like a political actor, you're gonna want to be involved in these things, you're gonna have to make a decision whether you like it or not. And this is something that was kind of, you know, it was uh taught to us from a very young age with working with the GOP, despite uh all of their you know supposed flaws, um, actual flaws of the GOP. Um, but we were taught that you kind of have to work with less ideal uh groups or groups that you may have disagreements with uh with things. So you kind of just have to make a choice. Like, are you going to work with like Joel Barry, uh the the Babylon B? Are you gonna be working with uh you know Ben Shapiro? Uh are you are you gonna be working with like this sort of side of things, uh, which would basically be like a sort of liberal republicanism, or are you gonna work with you know this other um you know up and coming movement? But the one thing, and this this is the reason why it was uh brought to my mind, but the the one thing where this could actually uh change is the very real possibility that somebody just you know uh eliminates Nick. You know, I I don't know what words I have to say to not get uh this video taken down on YouTube. But if somebody were to eliminate Nick, like that's a very real possibility, uh, you know, in this climate. That's one of the I think like the weaknesses of the Groiper movement is it's definitely um centered around Nick. Like if Nick goes, like the whole thing is kind of done. I think that basically everybody can kind of uh agree to that. So it's it's a very um it's a very fragile uh thing, especially you know, with this knowledge out that probably a lot of people have thought about.

SPEAKER_06: 13:36

Okay, so um it's been a little contentious on our show because I keep talking about this topic. Like I see the divide right now in the church as being on the some of the things that Nick has been raising, right? Like, I don't think we're facing a divide on liturgy, I think we're facing a divide on where you kind of land on this issue. And and my perspective is that it's because we're heading towards something where this issue is going to be front and center. Um, and I think Matt going over to Daily Wire plays a big part of that. I think you're gonna start seeing two camps form, and it's not going to be trads and novus ordo, it's going to be kosher Catholicism, which Stephen Cox coined that term. And Catholicism. Because I see I see it especially, I see it as a trad issue because I see it all stemming from the council, and I see it all stemming from Nostratate and our approach towards other religions, and especially uh towards the Jews, and with that document with no stratate. So it's like I'm I I see this issue as the main dividing line, and I think that it's because there's going to be a version of Catholicism that softens people to accepting the Antichrist. And that's just kind of how I see it.

SPEAKER_09: 14:56

I don't I don't know.

SPEAKER_06: 14:57

I don't and you don't have an apocalyptic view of it, but that's fine.

SPEAKER_09: 15:01

Yeah, I I mean for for at least for me, I actually think the divide is is really unfortunate because I'm somebody who's more on the the right side of things. Like I've said in the past that you know I wouldn't consider myself you know a grouper, um, despite you know how much I am uh accused of it. Um and but I do I do say positive things often about groupers and about Nick himself. I I do think it's actually unfortunate that this is something that is you know a dividing line in the church, uh, because I'm totally fine with actually like you know, believe it or not, I'm actually totally fine with working uh with people, working with people uh, you know, in terms of you know, apologetics, uh theology, uh, etc., with people that I actually disagree very strongly with uh on this issue, and we'll kind of hash out our disagreements. I really don't understand why. Uh it's it's very confusing to me. Uh, maybe you could explain it to me, um, Anthony, but it's really confusing to me why this issue in particular, you know, we're having a differing opinion on matters of policy uh when it comes to the way in which United States politics works, the way in which governance works. We have very different views of this. I think as a sort of pragmatic move, that, you know, it's I think it's basically inevitable that there is uh this sort of large portion of uh groupers in politics. And I think it's um you know necessary to not just have this complete, you know, hostility and never work with them and things like that. I think that's completely unhelpful. Um, and then there's other people who think this is the worst thing since um, you know, the thing that happened in the 1940s.

SPEAKER_06: 16:42

Okay, okay, but we have to get we have to get into that a bit because uh like you're saying you're willing to discuss things with people on the other side, but they're not willing to discuss things with you. Yeah, yeah, that's that's kind of how it goes, right? So you're willing to have the conversation, but I don't think any of them want to have the conversation because I think they know they're on a losing side of this issue. And when you start getting when you when you start getting into some of the things that Nick is actually raising. So, okay, so the way I see it is the people that are like losing their minds over this, all their their all of their fear is we are heading towards another event like World War II. Like that's their fear. It's like I this has happened before, and as soon as people start getting upset with with with with this group of people, the next thing you know, they're bussing them in into internment camps. Yeah, and it's like I don't know. I'm I am like we are like that is not happening.

SPEAKER_09: 17:37

Like I'm saying if I thought that was happening, like obviously I would not be doing I would not have the same opinion if I like legitimately thought that that was happening. But I think that's just insane. I think you have to be a crazy person to um listen to Nick kind of understand what grouperism is, and then say, Oh, they're gonna it. This is literally okay, and I was just thinking about this earlier when I was reading uh Rod's article, but this is literally the like 2016, uh well, the 2025 version of the 2016 mean tweets thing. It's like Nick says, you know, edgy jokes, he's he's like you one could say, okay, he's he's rude to this person, you know, he attacked this person when he shouldn't have, you know, whatever. He takes this position, I don't like. But that is completely different than I think he's gonna go out and his influence is gonna result in the death of millions. Like that, that is those are two very completely different things. I honestly think that when it comes to the liberal, normy, uh libertarian-esque republicanism, I think that's dangerous. I think that's very dangerous to me, my children, my future. Um, I think it's dangerous to my nation. I think it's dangerous to continuation of my culture, my church. I I think it's very dangerous. So I like I don't know why they have to make a moral judgment of me of who I'm uh who I'm very willing to work with versus not work with, um, and you know, stuff like that. It doesn't make any sense to me.

SPEAKER_06: 18:56

Okay, so I I kind of want to get into something now. I want to play a clip from Gavin Ashington. Um I will not be commenting on this clip. I want to play a clip from Gavin Ashing. You can comment on this clip. I will happen, Mr. Under the Weather.

SPEAKER_07: 19:10

The medicine took effect.

SPEAKER_06: 19:13

Oh, all right. Um, I want to play a clip from Gavin. Um, and I want to get into because this is this is I want to get into the generational divide on this issue, and this is uh this is kind of where I see this this all stemming from.

SPEAKER_03: 19:31

Um okay, so it was the sight of the Holocaust that first made me inclined to believe in God. For when I discovered what human beings have done to each other, I really could not believe that human beings were capable of what the Germans did to the Jews. Six million. And this is a moment when I have to say how much I totally despise the Holocaust deniers who are sick, sick, sick to their soul, who have been invaded by a perverting evil that has darkened their minds in an attempt to somehow dilute the horror of what evil did through human beings to one another. And if there is anything we can do today, it is to resist the anti-Semitism and the Holocaust deniers who have become vehicles of evil and call them out for it. It's not their fault. I have to I have to interject.

SPEAKER_06: 20:55

Um I like Gavin, but um this virtue signaling standing up like I have to speak about those who deny this event. And it's like the most people don't deny the event. We just don't care. We just don't care anymore. Like it's like we're just tired of talking about it, you know? And the the older generation, it was I think they're too close to the event, and uh it was such a main staple of uh of their education, of the propaganda they were fed, especially back when there was only three channels to get your news information on, and Hollywood was just pumping movie after movie out on this topic.

SPEAKER_07: 21:47

I mean, he he literally said his faith depended on the Holocaust.

SPEAKER_06: 21:51

Yeah, there's there's a there's this tendency to think denial of the Holocaust is uh it's like they will treat people who deny certain elements of that event with with more contempt than they will people who deny the crucifixion and resurrection. Like it's a bizarre, it's a bizarre thing to me when I see people acting like this is the like for someone to question anything from that time is a level of evil worse than the worst heresy on the planet. And I just like it it upsets me when I hear things like that, especially because there are many people who make that accusation who have very messy personal moral lives, so it's like they're they're judging somebody for not for maybe being a little bit younger and saying, okay, like this story isn't that that much of a myth-bearing load for me, and I'm willing to look at it kind of like past events, you know, like okay, it's well, what about the Hall of the Moor? What about what about you know, they're they're getting unknit for saying things like oh Hitler was based or something like that, but nobody would question if you said Julius Caesar was based. Julius Caesar murdered a million Gauls, and it's like if you were like, Oh, I like the aesthetic of Julius Caesar, huh?

SPEAKER_09: 23:12

Have you met French people? Kind of cooked there. Yeah, honestly, um, I'm I'm blue pilled uh on those historical questions that you brought up. So before anybody gets too excited about that, um I'm blue pilled, uh whatever. But yeah, it is really odd to me that uh when it comes to people asking, like there, there's this instance of all of these gropers coming into these political communities, they're going in and being staffers, and you know, because this is actually something that I think a lot of people do not give Nick credit for. And I wish that Catholics, especially when we're talking about church politics, that we would be smarter about this. Nick has always been very smart in mixing together theory and praxis, where he will describe, you know, what he what his political take is about this, what he thinks the plan should be for this and that, you know, doing everything a normal political talk show would do. But then alongside of this, alongside of giving his hot take about current events, something that Nick really excels in is he will actually go and explain what he thinks practically ought to be done. Like, how do we actually reverse this? And he will hammer it into people's heads again and again and again and again of like, okay, well, this is the issue. This is what I think the solution will be. Here's what you can do about it, and here's what I'm doing about it, here's what you know, you can actually concretely, you know, affect change. And I think that for a lot of the older people, they don't really recognize this. Like they they do not understand. Like Rod's article, I was reading it, and he was acting as if they were just gonna have a cakewalk, you know, we're just gonna look at all of the staffers' Twitters and find out whether they're groipers. That's ridiculous. These guys are smart, they're well educated. Um, they've heard about this for a very long time of how actually practically to do this, not get caught, not get exposed. Like these are these are people who are working as you know, like political operatives. They're not gonna get caught. Like they're they're not like the uh the the YR uh group chat leak. Like those guys weren't groifers. Uh they were those those guys were just like random, kind of edgy, uh, you know, young Republicans, um, which you know they shouldn't have been exposed and uh you know had their lives ruined. But you know, these are not like those guys. Like you're you're just not gonna be able to find all of this dirt on 30 to 40 percent of the staffers uh in Washington. Like that's just not gonna happen. So I think the reality is like, okay, what what is their end? And I think that Rod was just completely ridiculous here, too. Where he said, Oh, they're just nihilists, they just want to burn the system down. Like, no, that's stupid. Like, sure. Nick will give that rhetoric, but Nick Nick's solutions in what's the one. Here was my point the other day.

SPEAKER_06: 26:46

I said everything. I said, if these older guys keep throwing the the the accusations they are around instead of actually addressing Nick's Nick's actual arguments, they are going to lose an opportunity to to mentor these younger guys. And and I think that's that the hardest thing for the older guys is like, man, these these kids are just they won't listen to anything. And I do think the younger generation needs mentors. Like, I really do think they need mentors. I think even Nick needs an older guy who actually sees things the way he does. But and and what I've seen, even when you won't look at the portnoy situation this week, kids are pennies of portnoy, said F the Jews, and and and and the kid gets in trouble, like watching Nick come out and actually say, Listen, this is not the way to go forward. You cannot do this. So people are getting on him, though, like, like, oh, look, you started something that can't be put in the box, and now you're surprised by it. It's like, no, actually, what Nick is doing is toning down some of the crazier things he said in the past, coming about it, coming at it from a more mature perspective, and saying, listen, we're actually gaining a little momentum here. We want to see actual change here. Like, we do want to get AIPAC registered as a foreign lobby. We do want to question whether they should the APAC should have this much influence over both political parties. We want to make sure that our foreign policy is not shaped by another nation. These are things that we can actually do that we can address and get worked on. Um, so I but I do think that the the issue is if they're not talking about the actual substance of the arguments, they're gonna lose any opportunity. So, Rob put this this post in the in the um the article or the post. No, no, the post. So I don't know if Dreyer or Dreh how do you pronounce his listing? Is it Dreyer? Dreyer, Rod Dreyer, Rod Dreyer wants to be a respectable in the eyes of Washington elite. He wants to prove he's not just some some boy from Louisiana. So he remains caught between sympathy for the dispossessed and loyalty to the system that dispossessed them. There's something tragic in him. You can feel this yearning, his yearning to be a shepherd to young men. But the world he knew is gone. The young right doesn't need another anxious essay, it needs leadership, courage, and vision rooted in reality. Dreyer claims the new right wants to tear everything down, which shows he doesn't quite get it. They want something to stand on. They have inherited a country stripped of meaning. Their rebellion is not wanton destruction, but the desperate search for foundation. They have they obeyed the rules, studied, worked, deferred pleasure, and were rewarded with debt and contempt. They reject the system because they see rightly that it cannot be reformed. They have shed the Whig delusion that history moves toward progress, they know civilizations decay, and that when rot sets in too deep, replacement is the only cure. In this sense, they're closer to the founders than Dreyer could ever ever be. In the end, his error is that all of conc and is that all all of all con ink and an inability to learn from their mistakes, a failure to recognize that the new right didn't cause the collapse, they inherited it. Until the goal, until the old guard admits this, every sermon about moral hygiene will be ignored because it's the same tired song of a beautiful of the beautiful loser. Like, that is actually a perfect encapsulation of what I was trying to get at. It's like They think it's like these kids are just looking at the situation, like, oh, we're screwed. Let's tear the whole thing down. That's not it. There's it's almost the system is beyond reform and it implicit in liberalism is its own destruction. And we're seeing that democracy really is just a power game. So Nick is talking about things like look, if we take power, you don't want to take the libertarian approach. You actually want to use the power you get to bring things back towards a Christian order. Like if we're not conserving Christian morality, what the hell are we doing all this for?

SPEAKER_09: 30:38

Yeah, I think that um uh a point that was brought up there, and uh somebody somebody had asked me, like I there they basically they uh messaged me and they were they were like, Look, I don't get the Gruper thing. Like, why are all these guys like what why do they follow Nick? You know, why do they join these groups of you know, these group chats and no whatever else? Like what why do they do that? Like, what is the sort of like fundamental reason? And I think that for a lot of them, like there's a certain hopelessness that they have. Uh, you know, they look at the state of the nation, they look at, you know, a lot of the losses in the last, especially in the last 20 to 25 years uh that we've had, and they're kind of picking up on you know an analogy with what Trump did. Like Trump was there, there's a bunch of hopeless people, and Trump gave them hope. And I would say it was false hope for Trump for sure. Um, people can judge uh for Nick uh for themselves, but for a lot of you know, the the younger generation, they they feel pretty hopeless, and Nick actually gives them hope that this is a way forward. You know, people could argue all day that they think that this is a false hope, they think that it's not actually going to deliver, uh, et cetera, et cetera. But that that's sort of the reason why that uh you know that they're feeling this way. I think that's what hope is there in like the Ben Shapiro message like move. No, like well, what what like yeah, has Ben Shapiro ever given a hopeless person hope? Unless you're from Israel, I guess.

SPEAKER_06: 32:05

It's it's uh it's and it's even more that like everybody's like obsessing on Nick, on Nick, on Nick. It's not even about like I'm listening to what Nick's saying. Like, I'm not I'm not a griper, I don't, I don't, I don't watch Nick regularly. I think I think that the things he's bringing up are super important, and I and I'm also watching it split the church right now. Like what with Matt going over to Daily Wire and then watching watching how his guest list is going to shape out, I'm a little concerned with that. I'm watching um they put David Wood is is one of his next guests, and I know they're trying to put uh Protestant Christians in who want to blame Islam for everything while overlooking any of the domestic issues that we are facing with this issue. Like this issue.

SPEAKER_09: 32:51

If you're the the way that I think if you're European, it makes actually a lot of sense for me to uh focus on the um the Islamic threat. But like as an American, you look at the sort of rates in which uh Muslims are you know affecting domestic policy. Maybe there's certain areas, especially like Minneapolis, um, areas in Texas, um, you know, certain bigger cities where like Islam is a big issue. But like for me, I I don't even think there's a mosque. Like, I don't even know where the nearest mosque would be, maybe an hour from me. Um, you know, where I'm moving, the nearest mosque is probably like four hours from me. Um, like Islam is not necessarily like the big threat for me. Um, so yeah, it it makes sense from like a European perspective, but from an American perspective, to fixate on like Islam is like the big issue that we need to be focusing on. That's very like um, you know, like 2001 George W. Bush. Yeah, George W. Bush in a way that I just don't I just can't comprehend that being like the big deal.

SPEAKER_07: 33:49

Yeah, listen. I mean in the solution to that is pretty easy to stop importing them. Yeah, I mean, yeah, just just abord.

SPEAKER_06: 33:56

I mean, it's a simple simple solution. People are saying like that, oh, they're just drumming up old tropes and conspiracy theories, but I don't think that I think that we're beyond that at this point. I think there's enough going on where you even just see the gatekeeping and how they're treating anyone who even questions anything, what they've done to Dave Smith, what they've done to Tucker Carlson. Like, forget Nick, just just people who have a libertarian perspective on this issue, how they're treating them. Like Nick, I I think is bringing identity into the picture a lot more than those guys. Those guys are just looking at it like, oh, we shouldn't be supporting a foreign nation. And I and and like that's like an acceptable approach to take. I'm looking at it from the the narrative that you discussed with with Gideon yesterday, where you guys went through and discussed the the the older brother and the younger brother in scripture and going through all those stories. And I'm seeing it as Christians are told ever since uh ever since uh the World War II that they need to uh um love uh people of all religions and not treat them with any kind of suspicion, but the people of other religions are still treating Christians with suspicion. So it's like, and you see it happening in real time right now, where if you even question anything, this knee-jerk reaction to, oh my goodness, we're on the cusp of another Holocaust, and it's happening not just from the people that we're talking about, but it's happening from Christians, Christians who were raised on that narrative are all jumping to this. We're on the verge of another Holocaust. It's not, no, we're not. No, we're not. It's just not. That's we're no, it's not, that's not going to happen. We're not, we're nowhere near um uh a pogrom happening, anything like that. We're at a point where we want to have a discussion on how Jewish power affects our politics and the way our country is run. And when we're telling you guys that we can't, our children can't afford, like, I live in New York, my son is not going to be able to afford to buy a house. Trump comes out and goes, hey, let's bury them in 50 years of usury instead of 30. 15-year car loans, a 15-year car loan and a 50-year mortgage, and it's like, you are going to make my son a slave. I'm sorry, but this is not a solution. And these are all ideas that help Jewish financiers and bankers and things like that. Like you're just amping the conspiracy theories up.

SPEAKER_09: 36:16

Well, I mean, even if we were to take the the sort of like JQ aspect out of it, like if I were to speak to um, you know, normal Catholics that kind of aren't even uh into that stuff and are kind of more so just like I have a sort of like Tucker Carlson-esque sort of view of, you know, I'm not a pure capitalist. You know, I believe that the government can, you know, intervene and uh actually work towards uh the common good. You know, I'm just a I'm a social conservative. I I believe that you know, a lot of these uh different aberrations which have arisen in the last you know 30, 40 years ought to be uh somehow eliminated, uh whether on the the state level or the national level. Like from people on that perspective, I do think that it's actually a losing game uh to return to the slop of you know the Ben Shapiro uh sort of crowd. Like I think that it's a couple, like, for example, Matt Frad, um, you know, even Trent. I I don't I don't think that Matt Frad, Trent, or uh maybe uh probably not Lila Rose. Lila Rose probably is um you know outside the pale. But like uh individuals like that, I have no I have no doubt that when it comes to a lot of matters of of policy or principle, that we probably have a general agreement, you know, when it comes to we we just want people to be able to afford things, you know. We want um a sort of social cohesion, we want um, you know, like the the moral um you know fabric to be retained, you know, things like this. But I do think it's a mistake to automatically assume that uh reflexively, like we can't in a pragmatic way uh sort of work with uh you know the new right, that we just have to keep working with the old right and grit our teeth when they're bringing literally only France prostitutes on to the GOP uh, you know, uh uh national convention stage uh to speak, or they're appointing homosexuals uh, you know, to run major departments in in the federal government, or they're downplaying abortion, they're downplaying um, you know, sodomy, they're they're downplaying all of these uh things. They are uh you know only working for the capitalist class and they're completely screwing people over. Like I don't I don't see, like I do not understand, and I don't think they'll ever be able to explain to me why uh I should have a uh a moral obligation to work with those people, you know, because you know Nick has said this thing or that thing or this thing, and he is sort of emblematic of the new right.

SPEAKER_06: 38:47

So, so like I talk okay, so I I talk to Kale on the phone a lot. Um, I just spoke with him um I think two days ago, him and I had a conversation. So like I understand his worries. Like, I I I don't I don't want to downplay that, like, because even with the Portnoy situation where like you do see kids don't understand the difference in internet culture in real life, right? Like, there's really no appropriate time to yell. Like, if that kid would have just said F Dave Portnoy, it would have been fine. But to just start lobbing F like it's just a stupid thing to say. You actually do make everyone look like you are the villain that they're accusing you of being. It's it's not it's not an appropriate way to handle it. I I want to just talk about these issues from both a theological perspective and I want to talk about them from a political perspective. A political perspective because I think that actually affects the future of our country, but a theological perspective because I think that the entire church right now, ever since the council, is kind of in a in a haze to this issue, and they and they don't understand the enmity between the the people of the old covenant and the people of the new covenant, and they all and they're they're constantly talking about uh even even the people I respect on this issue are always talking about the unification of of the brothers at the end of the story, and it's like, yes, that's fine, but that's not the point of the story we're at right now. We're at the point in the story where the older brother wants to kill the younger brother. Yeah, or the Esau is coming after us rather.

SPEAKER_08: 40:20

Yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 40:21

Where Cain is trying to kill us. We're at the point in the story where Joseph is getting sold into slavery, like that's just the point of the story we're at. We're not at the point where the brothers reconcile. And that will come. And the thing is, there's like there's a way that we have to see this from a Catholic perspective, where it can never arise to a pogrom and it can never arise to violence, and it can never arise to hate. No, but it does have to, but you do have to understand the story properly and where we are in the story. And the thing is, I I mean, I I can't help but but take take the things that Maudsley has said about even the influence at the council. And and if you see the way if you see the way they influence our politics, the idea that they haven't in they didn't influence the council in the same way when we know the CIA was trying to influence the council too, and you know that the CIA has, you know, that is that is a very uh it's a very Jewish project. Let's not just say it like that. Like that's just what it is. And they were trying to influence the church. Now it doesn't mean the church put heresy into the documents, it what it means is they lightened language, they and and the people that came out of that council came with a different approach to the point where now in the Vatican you're seeing Leo having sit-downs with 3,000 different denominations of religions and stuff. And it's a it the whole thing is based upon that narrative from World War II, where we have been convinced that us talking about this enmity between the people of the old covenant and the people of the new covenant, that and that built animosity, and that is the reason that what happened in Germany happened is because of Christian animosity. And and I think all of us have subconsciously accepted that narrative, and it's just not true.

SPEAKER_09: 42:10

Yeah, I mean, I I think that that narrative is uh absolutely absurd. Um and uh I get I guess that that's all that I'll say that the narrative about you know in Germany, uh there happened to be these Christians and enmity with other denominations. Uh, when when in reality it it almost seems like it was actually the complete opposite.

SPEAKER_06: 42:31

You you know what your problem is, you're still holding out hope you're getting invited to Trent's Trent's thing. Like you still think you might get the invite to Trent's thing.

SPEAKER_09: 42:40

I wasn't given any special message of like, hey Wagner, you're not allowed here. I'm sure if I bought a ticket, I could show up.

SPEAKER_06: 42:47

Oh, I know you could show up, but you want to be on the poster on the thumbnail. You're not gonna ever be on the poster, dude.

SPEAKER_09: 42:54

No, it's yeah, if anybody, you know, it's I saw people speculating about this, you know. If they want to if they want to what what's why I mean to ask a trend, I mean it's not uh you know, no okay, wait, wait, but I will ask you this.

SPEAKER_06: 43:09

I will ask you this. Do you think because you did go to uh the creator conference and you did meet a lot of people there and you made a lot of friends there? Like I did kind of expect an infiltration from Wagner into Catholic Inc. a little a little bit, and it's not happening.

SPEAKER_07: 43:26

Instead, they uh they uh what's her name? Katie Pregeen is uh speaker now.

SPEAKER_09: 43:34

Well, yeah, I mean I don't know. Kyle, Kyle, Kyle. I I like Kyle. Kyle is awesome. I love Kyle, yeah, he's he's great for sure. Um, but yeah, I mean I I didn't really expect uh that much, to be honest. Uh I'm just waiting and seeing, uh, you know, just just being me, always saying what I say.

SPEAKER_07: 43:56

No, um, they can't be how it's pronounced. I refuse to believe that.

SPEAKER_06: 44:01

Uh Taylor said, Americans should own up and say, We screwed over Gen Z, we were selfish, they didn't inherit what we had. Let's help them. Such a man with that humility would be elected president. Yeah, it's like look, you see the meme going around now about the programs that Germany put in place about families that kept the wife at home and had children, would get a 25% discount on their home. Like you would never see something like that from American politicians. And it's like, if we cared about our country enough, we actually would do that because you would want you wouldn't want to inflate your population with foreigners, you'd want your own population to, I mean, for your own demographics to grow. Like Taylor's been hammering this down a lot lately, just about the demographics in in in the West are just on an insane decline right now. So it it just seems like there's never any attempt in policy to help the younger generation. And there's the we're dealing with a recipe for disaster because when you have a young generation who is hopeless because they can't afford to buy a home, they also don't have prospects to get married. Because this tied in with all this is the feminism aspect and just how blackpilled all these young guys are on marriage because they don't see us like man. I because I've my son's been coming to work with me, and we have like a two-hour commute every day together where we talk. My son's 19 years old, and he's like, and he went and visited his friends up at college a week or two ago, and he's like, he's like, you just don't even know what's out there, dad. He's like, he just he's like because I he's he's like, I've never seen degeneracy like that in my life, like where the girls are just gross, like the girls that go to college are just gross.

SPEAKER_09: 45:43

Well, I mean, that's not a Gen Z thing. That's been like that for it has, yeah, yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_06: 45:49

Yeah, so you you add that into the mix. So these kids are are hopeless when it comes to marriage, they they have no hope to buy a home, they have no because even their jobs that they're that they're looking again, and they're going to college for four or six years, they're getting out, and they're still making nowhere near enough to provide for a family. There's no hope for a guy to provide for a family where his wife can stay home. It's just you you're you're dealing with a recipe for disaster.

SPEAKER_07: 46:14

And AI is said to just destroy the job market.

SPEAKER_09: 46:19

Well, I mean, I think what it just comes down to, and this is why sort of like my my main argument for why you could never like you you could never team up with somebody like a Ben Shapiro. You could never team up with any of these economic uh liberals in the in the classical sense. Because when it comes to their economics, their economics is completely ordered towards the prosperity of of the few. It's uh it's ordered towards um like the material gain, the growth of GDP of a nation. Like that's what their economics is based on. Uh whereas when it comes to Catholic social teaching, economics is ordered towards the common good, you know. And yeah, if you don't have a you know a politician or a political movement that is you know grounded on that, none of their economic decisions are going to make sense, and they're gonna you know throw us into a fundamental uh tyranny, whether it's the tyranny of debt slavery, it's the tyranny of the way in which the job market works, etc.

SPEAKER_06: 47:15

But how about how about our president comes out and instead of saying 50-year mortgages, say, hey, we're going to cap credit card interest at 12%. So these kids aren't getting credit cards with 26% interest rates.

SPEAKER_09: 47:26

Yeah, how about interest throw in throw in jail everybody who uh throw in jail whoever made up the fact that we could have credit cards with 26% interesting? No credit cards are like who who made these things up? It's it's just so absurd to me that like this is uh like it's such uh an abuse and like crime against against your fellow man. It's it's like it's worse than it's worse than murder, um, in a sense.

SPEAKER_06: 47:52

The thing is, okay, so like going forward, uh we're gonna let Christian go because he has to record another show, and then Rob and I are gonna do a locals uh episode. Um, and I got some good stuff I want to talk about on locals too. So this was supposed to be the local side of the show. It was, it was, but I had Wagner on and I figured it would be, you know, it would be I figured it would be a good a good topic for him being here. Um let me just see something. Uh yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I got I got some good stuff over there. So um look like going forward, I I want to get Kale on because I wanna I wanna talk to the older generation and I and I wanna I wanna keep the communication open. So it's like yeah, so do I Taylor, right? Right? So I yeah, we both have we Taylor and I both have Gen Z sons. Like my son is 19 years old and he's living in this right now. And I want like so it what was worse was the Ben Shapiro say move away thing, right? Like, oh, you can't afford it. You don't deserve to live, you don't deserve to live where you grew up, you just have to move away. It's like for people that for people like Ben, I don't know what his family situation is, but I can tell you this I have eight siblings, all eight of my siblings, except for one of my sisters, moved down to Florida. The rest of my siblings all live at home, like in in this town where I live, right? My my kids all have their cousins around them, they have their grandparents around them, they have my and on both sides of the family. Like my kids have 50 cousins, and they and like my nephew was over my house tonight. My niece slept over my house last weekend. There's something beautiful about your kids having their family around, as opposed to just moving them to the middle of nowhere because it's somewhere affordable, and now they have now you have no connection to anyone around you, you don't have family around. Like, this is this is untenable. It's it's evil what they're saying, like, oh, just move away. No, I don't want to move away. I want my children around my family. That was everybody wonders why I haven't left New York. It's because my parents are here, all my brothers and sisters are here, and all my nieces and nephews are here, and I don't want to leave them. Like that, we have a very tight family. We have I had family dinner at my mom's house last night. Like, it's not, you know, it's not something I'm willing to just willingly give up because I might save a few bucks. So, no, I I'm not okay with just move away if you can't afford to live there. Um, all right. So to to to wrap up, um what do you think uh happens with the next generation of Catholics being that because I'm seeing the divide. Look, I I see guys like Taylor, I see guys like us, I see guys like you, I see us all willing to have this conversation about this topic, and then I see the grouping of guys unwilling to even speak to us because we talk about this topic, and I see the factions forming, and I kind of saw them a year out. I like a year or two out, I saw them starting to form. Where yeah, we've been talking about this for a while, for a while, yeah.

SPEAKER_07: 50:50

When was that uh Phylos project thing? It was like April, right?

SPEAKER_06: 50:55

Yeah, and I think we seen it even way before that, where it was like like the look, look, there were guys who were willing to talk to me two years ago that contact is cut off now. Now, that could be because I'm bombastic and I've done shows on Lila Rose and I you know criticize Matt for joining Daily Wire, but it kind of happened before that, and it's like I they're they're forming a rank right now, and they don't want that. I feel like what Trent is even doing with his conference is putting together himself up front with all the influencers in the background and kind of showing like the this is my posse, like yeah, they're basically being told, like, you guys are on our side, and I better not catch you guys associating with those other guys. That's kind of what it feels like. I don't know if that's just feeling it's it's me putting conjecture on as you know, my own thoughts, but it kind of does feel like that's that's what's happening right now.

SPEAKER_09: 51:50

Well, I think there's there's two things. Um one, I think that I would definitely uh for for the future, I definitely encourage a lot of the politically interested Catholics who are you know genuinely right wing when it comes to social issues, when it comes to economic issues. Uh, I I would I would genuinely encourage them to recognize the practical nature of politics and what political prudence looks like and how you can work with people that you may um you know have disagreements with or you may you know find problematic, et cetera, et cetera. Things that we've uh always you know kind of practically done uh with our relationship to the old right, uh back before there was the new right. I would encourage them uh first and foremost with that. And second, I would encourage uh a lot of the people who just completely disagree with me and completely disagree with the rest of us to recognize that uh a lot of these differences when it comes to uh you know the political state of our nation, it it is not sufficient, it is not sufficient grounds for you to hinder the work of Catholic action just on this basis. Like if you have somebody who disagrees with you on this, uh, you know, on this issue, you you shouldn't just bomb, you know, the uh the effects of the church evangelizing, doing apologetics, you know, all of this. You shouldn't just bomb uh possible growth just through this disagreement. Um, you know, it's no, I actually our collaboration with these individuals isn't gonna cause another, you know, uh 1940s event in Germany. It's not it's not gonna cause a sort of cataclysmic uh fall. Um, so there's no reason to you know treat those with these persuasions as a leper. And I think that that uh definitely is in opposition with uh you know the plenty of examples from people of the past who have done similar things.

SPEAKER_06: 53:51

I I I really I watched I watched your show with Gideon yesterday. I thought it was an awesome episode, you you Hassan and Gideon. I thought that was a great episode. You guys just talking about this from a theological perspective, getting into you know the nuance of the topic. No, Gideon is obviously of Jewish descent, but he's talking about it from his perspective. Like, I like the conversations need to happen. I saw Brian Holdsworth and Father Casey on today.

SPEAKER_09: 54:13

Wait, he actually like not a groiper, like Gideon's not a groiper. Uh the groper is clear. Um, but like I'm still friends with Gideon. We still do work together.

SPEAKER_06: 54:24

We still they accuse Gideon of being a subverso, they accuse Kale Zeldon of being a subverso, and it's like Kale's like one of my best friends, dude. Like, I I legit love Kale, and I and I love that he lets me have my perspective on this, and he doesn't like write me off. Like, like I talk to him on the phone, he knows him and I disagree on this. Um, but he he has some concerns that I think are overblown, and I think a lot of it has to do with narrative control, and I think stories are such a huge part of this, man. Like, like the way we see the world is through stories, and when you're molded and shaped in your youth on certain stories, they're just it's like the idea that like you were lied to is a very it's it's easier to convince someone of a lie than it is to convince someone they were lied to, you know. It's it's one of those things. No, but Kale has some interesting perspectives on Peter Pan with it and you know things like that. But either way, um, before we go, I wanted to mention um I there's a young guy that called into Keith Nestor's show a couple months back, and he was a Protestant kid, he was interested in Catholicism. He's from New York, he's from Long Island. Keith set the kid up with me, gave me his contact, and the kid's been coming to Latin Mass with me. Um, and I saw him this week outside of Latin Mass, and he's like, you know, it's so funny. Like, I started checking your channel out, and then I realized like you have all these other Catholics that I really like watching, like Christian Wagner. And he's like, So he's like, he really likes you, he really likes me. And there's a uh statue of Padre Pio right outside, and he goes, Is that Padre Pio? I go, Yeah. He goes, My grandmother was like obsessed with him, so I started looking into him, and it turns out he's my fourth cousin. So this kid is Protestant, his name is Dominic. His father is a cradle Catholic, his father came to Latin Mass with me a couple weeks ago. His father wants to go to dinner with me and my family, um, you know, with all of us to just go and sit and talk. Um, but his his fourth cousin is Padre Pio, the kid's Protestant. I asked him what he thinks of Fuentes. He goes, Oh, I love him. So I think I think he'll get a kick out of this show. But uh the young guys, and also another thing, funny thing happened. I went to confession at a novus ordo parish the other day. And I go in and a young kid, like 17, 18, I'm I'm there with my entire family. Some young kid, his name's his name is Anthony, comes over and he's like, Are you Anthony? I'm like, Yeah, in front of my whole family. It's like I can't believe I'm here talking to you. This is so amazing. It's like I watch your show all the time. He's like, I watch you, I watch Wagner. I'm always hearing from young guys that they watch us and they watch you. So I think awesome. I every every time a young guy watches our show, they always tell me they also watch Wagner. So I think I think you and I uh like our show and your show has uh has a has has a very young audience, and I think we have an opportunity to speak to these guys and make sure anybody that is Catholic, if you are starting to question these stories, you have to understand your role as a Catholic is to never treat anyone with contempt. And I think that's a responsibility we have as Catholics to make sure that other Catholics know yes, you can discuss these things, yes, you can get into this topic, and yes, there is a real issue here, but the way we handle it has to be different from any other group because we're supposed to love our enemies to the point of martyrdom.

SPEAKER_09: 57:50

Yeah, yeah. I mean, obviously, you know, don't do anything harmful towards um, you know, other people unjustly. And, you know, especially like in the church and within the church, you know, don't um, you know, express a behavior that is uh schismatic. Because remember that schism is not merely separating yourself from the Pope, it's separating yourself from those who are in communion with the Pope as well. And that can easily uh you know lead to a mentality where those disagreeing on these uh you know issues of secular issues, issues of uh political governance, etc. Uh, one can easily you know uh isolate themselves from the rest of the church uh you know on this basis. And it leads it leads down some pretty dark roads. I've seen it happen before.

SPEAKER_06: 58:40

Okay, so um we will we're gonna wrap this one up. We're gonna let you go because you do have another interview you're gonna do. Rob and I are going to head over to locals. I uh I have some some interesting personal stories to talk about over there. Uh my wife and I had an argument this morning, and uh something miraculous happened. That's all I'll say. I'll tease you guys with that. Something miraculous. Close. Something something miraculous happened. And she took never mind, never mind. No, no, no. Nope. She sorry, right? Now we'll get it, we'll get into that. Um, yeah, and I got a bunch of other stuff. Something happened with uh with one of my uh with one of my sisters, with a girl that she knew going to confession for her first time, and like the girl had all this occult stuff, and the priest got her to bring it in. So we got some good stories for the other side. So we will see you guys on the other side, Christian. Thank you for uh semi-filling in for Rob. I knew once we got the conversation going, Rob would have FOMO and jump in, but yep, yep.

SPEAKER_09: 59:45

Uh, you're welcome, Rob, for curing your sick. Thank you. Um thank you. Yeah, I'll talk to all you guys later. All right, appreciate you, brother.

SPEAKER_06: 59:52

We'll see you later. God bless you. All right, Rob, take us out, bro.

SPEAKER_07: 59:55

Uh, but before we go, I mean, well, Christian, can we can drop Christian here? Uh, do we want to talk about our sponsor?

SPEAKER_06: 1:00:01

Yes, we'll talk about our sponsor and also guys hit like and uh share the show and subscribe. And if you're not locals members, that's really where we always have the best segments of the show. So join locals. But uh Recusen Sellers, if you guys have not yet, go to recusyncellers.com, use code based at checkout for 10% off. Uh there is very few companies that uh that are willing to support our show, and this company is phenomenal. They have first off, their wine is amazing. Like, aside from whatever they do for us, their wine is amazing. Rob drinks it regularly. My wife loves their wine.

SPEAKER_07: 1:00:37

Um, you make me sound like a wine.

SPEAKER_06: 1:00:39

Well, you are a bit of a wino, but okay, yeah. No, go over to Reckon's house. They also have fruit over there. Um, awesome, awesome family, awesome company. Uh, they ship to most states. There's a couple that they don't. They might be able to ship the fruit to the states that they can't ship the wine, though. So check that out. So, yeah.

SPEAKER_07: 1:00:58

So we're actually talking about the Requisite Catholics next week.

SPEAKER_06: 1:01:02

Oh, so next week we're doing a show on the um the reign of uh Queen Mary, right? Like we're gonna we're gonna talk about the Reckies and Catholics. That so when when Elizabeth dies and Mary comes into power, and that whole time period, we're gonna we're gonna be discussing the the the almost reversal of the Protestant Reformation in England. Like that that period where Mary Tudor comes back in, and we're gonna get into that a little bit. So I think we'll do uh an episode on that, and we'll we'll be discussing where the name Reckison comes from, how to pronounce it properly, how to pronounce it properly, and uh knows how many languages. Yeah, that's terrible. So, all right, so that'll be next Tuesday, guys. Um, if you're not locals members, please please support us on locals. That's the best way to help us.

SPEAKER_07: 1:01:54

Okay, and we're gonna go over to locals.

SPEAKER_05: 1:01:57

102 take three. Action, please.

SPEAKER_04: 1:02:03

A bottle of recusancella's petit verdeaux is one of the few things that can make me stand watching avoiding Babylon. Use code base, that is B-A-S-E-D at checkout.

SPEAKER_06: 1:02:29

Okay. I actually before we get into my personal stories, can we do this John Deloney clip? Did you watch it? No, I didn't watch it. This one, which one the one I put in the in the chat, dude, the chat. How annoying is X chat now? Uh it's it's bad, man. It's really annoying, and like you'll load a video in and it doesn't um like float over properly. And like if I don't load a video from from my iPad, uh, it doesn't go into the chat. It's really annoying.

SPEAKER_07: 1:03:06

Um the yeah, oh wait, no, okay. The uh the temptation in your husband's life, that one.

SPEAKER_06: 1:03:14

Yes, yeah, dude. This this clip is absolutely insane. So a little a little backstory before we even get into it. This woman has struggled with jealousy her whole life. She she married her high school sweetheart. They got that they were dating since they were 16, since she had braces. I'm listening to this, I'm like, oh, it's like me and my wife, they're dating since she had braces. Um, they uh so she gets married and she struggles with jealousy. And the husband runs a small electrician company, and he's got to hire someone for the job. And listen to how this goes. It's absolutely insane. And this woman says that she allowed this to because she she wanted to face her jealousy. Now, just listen that listen to how insane this is.

SPEAKER_07: 1:03:57

Majorian says, You hate watch this guy like he hates watching this.

SPEAKER_06: 1:04:00

Oh, dude, I can't help it. I first off, his advice is so bad, like it's so bad. He is he is so feminized at this point. Like, every woman will call in and give her scenario, and he's just on her side. I'm like, I want to hear the man's side. I don't believe a word out of this woman's mouth right now. Like, I never believe anything these women say, I think they're all liars.

SPEAKER_07: 1:04:24

You know, most people watch things that they like, right? He's a good hate watch man. I don't understand the I I get I don't know.

SPEAKER_06: 1:04:34

It's my first actual show. Yeah, it's the first show I've ever watched like this where I'm like yelling at my freaking iPad because he encourages women to divorce their husbands. Like he's awful, he's an awful man. Like, like he might be the devil incarnate.

SPEAKER_02: 1:04:56

Is there a particular person you've zeroed in on, or is this women universal?

SPEAKER_01: 1:05:01

Mostly universal. Um, so we so my husband's an electrician, so we have our own business, and we just hired, we're small, we're baby business still, but we just hired our first employee, and she's a trainee, and it's a woman, which for the trades is not super common. Um, and she's fantastic. I never I was a part of the hiring process. She was the best candidate, and I saw it as an opportunity for growth for me because I've never I I've always hated this in our entire relationship. So I'm like, you know what? I don't want to shortchange her business and I want to grow. She's great. I don't get any weird vibes from her, like I'm gonna, you know, she's not gonna hand that rock to the cradle me. At least I don't that's not the vibe I guess, you know. And so um, yeah, she's I mean, she's tall and she's beautiful and she has a great attitude, and she's being taught by him, which my husband is a teacher. It's like he loves he loves teaching. And so, like, she's out there with him day in, day out, hours on end, in the same truck, working side by side with him. And so right now, there hasn't really been a specific person before then.

SPEAKER_06: 1:06:10

It's just kind of a general sense, and now it's definitely amped up, and I'm just trying to work a beautiful woman, she's single, she's tall, she's gorgeous, and she's riding in the truck with him for nine hours a day. But like, I did this because I wanted to, I wanted to get rid of my my jealousy. Is this women are retarded? Retarded, like, this is the dumbest thing I've what honey. Look, he could be the holiest man on the planet. I'm sorry you do not put your husband in that situation. Like, it is just dude. There's no scenario where you're where you should be first off. If you want a business win the trades and you want to grow, don't hire a woman to do like there's no scenario where the woman was the best candidate for the job as an electrician on top of that. Like, this just stop it. Stop it. First off, that girl is literally just gonna be his side piece and never get anything done, or she's getting electrocuted on the job. Like, there's no in between, she's never gonna be a productive worker, he's just gonna be distracted all day.

SPEAKER_07: 1:07:15

She also, she's not gonna be you know, she's not gonna sell any electrical work because any man you know who needs electrical work done isn't gonna like trust her, and she's not gonna be able to convince any women to do it.

SPEAKER_06: 1:07:27

Yeah, like like if you're if you're if you need stuff done at your home and some hot chick comes to your house to do it, you want to be like, no, like that's not happening. No, it's like the it's like the couples that pick like the hot 20-year-old to to be like the nanny. Like, are you insane? Do you know how eastern Europe? Yeah, like though you know often the husband leaves the wife for the nanny. It's just a stupid scenario. First of all Ryan Turner, it's about time you joined our locals. Um, but it's just a recipe for absolute disaster. Like, you're putting what hat what'll happen is the husband will have an argument with the wife one day, and he'll go in and he'll be like just in a bad mood, and the hot girl's gonna ask him what's going on, and he's gonna vent to her about the things going on in his house, and already he's crossed a ridiculous line. Like, once you like out you're working with the person, you're in a truck with them all that. Why would you ever be that dumb? Like, there's I don't know. I don't I just um the this the naivety and the stupidity of women never ceases to amaze me. Uh she thinks they are yeah, I saw that one. Yeah, Ryan, I how the hell is this your first? You're just getting here now, you gotta be kidding me. Um, all right.

SPEAKER_07: 1:08:49

So listen, someone said uh in the chat that I don't understand hate watching because everything I watch is hate watching.

SPEAKER_06: 1:08:57

Yeah, like literally, Rob. Like, I don't get hate watching, I don't think you've ever like watched anything. I put uh I put a couple of notes in the in the chat the other day, and I was like, what the hell is this? I'm like, I'm just putting notes in the chat so I remember.

SPEAKER_07: 1:09:13

Um I didn't know if you were either stroking out or if you were messaging someone else.

SPEAKER_06: 1:09:20

Well, I told the kid Dominic at Mass thing because I thought that was just cool that like he's so not just that, the kid at Mass he comes to Mass and it's uh for the feast of like the installation of St. John Latter, the seat of St. John Lateran, right? Like Sunday was about Saint John Lateran, and the homily the priest gave was about the beauty. So, first off, the thing that attracts this kid to Catholicism is the beauty of Catholic churches, okay. Now, the entire homily is about the beauty of Catholic churches, but that the Catholic churches that you're going into, these cathedrals, they're they're beautiful like that because they have the tabernacle and Christ is in the tabernacle, but also that each one of us individually are temples of the Holy Spirit and they're supposed to be a reflection of it. Like it was just the perfect homily for a Protestant who loves the beauty of the church but is worried about the personal relationship with Jesus stuff. Like it just it was you could not have given a better homily for that. Yeah, then we get outside, and I was just talking to the kid about how cathedrals actually are the kingdom of heaven colonizing earth, right? And how when you go to mass, you're actually the peasant that gets to sit in the kingdom, and you're supposed to be meditating on heaven when you're in there.

SPEAKER_07: 1:10:36

I mean, that's that's one of the apostolic thrones right there in front of you, the cathedral.

SPEAKER_06: 1:10:41

And the and and he was just kind of like blown away by that, like he'd never heard anything like that. He was like, that is just so cool, you know. Um, and I forgot to freaking mention this on the main show, but like we are going full steam ahead with this pilgrimage. Um, we still haven't chosen where we're going to go. It's either going to be Fatima, uh, an ending in Lourdes, and then like a few stops in Spain on the way, or we're going to do Italy. And because I want my kids to see Italy really bad. But there's a way to do Italy and Greece where you could do this footsteps of Peter and Paul, where you land in Rome, see Rome, and then you go into Greece and you go to Corinth and stuff like that. So there's like a few different options we can take. We're gonna try and pick the cheapest, one of the cheaper ones, but where you still get a bang for your buck. I think Spain's got a lot more Catholic history than Greece. Probably, probably. So we'll maybe we'll check Spain out. Um, but either way, we're gonna get options and we'll and we'll we'll ask everybody. So my sister Chrissy um tells me she she's in this group, and it's not like a religious group of any kind, it's just like a group where like it's like a young adults group or something, and um, there's this girl who's uh a cradle Catholic, but she's like bisexual, and she's uh living with a boyfriend right now, and there was something about my sister that just made her like talk to her.

SPEAKER_07: 1:12:07

You're gonna post all those processions from Spain and not go to Spain. What the hell?

SPEAKER_06: 1:12:12

You know what? We should go during Holy Week, man. Spain during Holy Week. But I like who's gonna be able to go.

SPEAKER_07: 1:12:21

I need to get a photo of you in a capote.

SPEAKER_06: 1:12:24

That would be awesome. That would be awesome. But like I think of them, think of the think of the thumbnails I can make with that. Could but what um could people pull that off though during Holy Week? I don't know. I don't know if I could do that. Like you have family obligations and stuff. It's a that's a hard one. Um, we'll see, but no, that's the other thing. It's too packed, like it's just too packed. I'm telling you guys that the time to go is December or January. Like when we went to Italy in December, when I tell you the it was empty, like we went to every single place and there was no tourists there. And that's that's the appeal of it.

SPEAKER_07: 1:13:03

I'm okay with going anywhere in December because anywhere we go is gonna be warmer than where warmer than it was.

SPEAKER_06: 1:13:08

We could go to Alaska in December and it would be warmer than where I live. It was 60 degrees every day. It was like 57. You could wear a light sweatshirt, it was the ideal weather, like you could not pick better weather. It was um empty. When I tell you empty, people are at home, they're not going to on they're not going to Italy during during that time of year, they're just not. And we went to every single holy site and had the place to ourselves. We went to monasteries by ourselves, we went and saw Eucharistic miracles. We were the only pilgrimage in the place. We everywhere we went, we were the only ones there. And it's like, I don't know if I'll ever go on a pilgrimage any other time because of that. I want to go when nobody's there. Changes the whole trip. So so this girl um says to my sister, she's like, Can I go to church with you? And my sister says, Well, I'm going to adoration tomorrow. So my sister's like racking wrapped with guilt right now. And she's like, I don't know how to handle this because this girl's living with her boyfriend. She um, you know, she's saying she's bisexual. And my sister's like, I can't take her to mass and just let her receive communion, you know? Yeah. So she's like really like worried about it. And she goes, Listen, I'm going to adoration tomorrow. Why don't you come to that with me? Um, so the girl says, okay. And while they're on the way there, my sister goes, Listen, I'm going to go to confession during adoration. So if I disappear, I didn't abandon you, but I'm just going to pop in and I'm going to go to confession. And the girl goes, I haven't been to confession since I'm a kid. She goes, I maybe I'll go. So my sister was like, Okay, that's good. You know, like the girl's going to go to confession. The girl ends up going into confession, telling the priest she hasn't been there since she's young. And the priest goes through an examination of conscience with her and ends up getting out of the girl that she's got crystals at home, that she's got a Ouija board at home, that she's got all this occult stuff at home, and tells her, I want you to bring all of this stuff back into me, and we are going to handle this. And the girl goes home, gets all of her occult crap that she has at her house. They go back and they go to mass the next day, and the priest like decommissioned all of it and like helped her through all of it. And it's like it was just such a cool story because, like, it's those weird moments where you're talking to somebody that you you're not even trying to evangelize, but they see something in you and they ask you a question. And next thing you know, this person's in confession for the first time in 15 years, and they're handing in all of their diabolical crap at their house.

SPEAKER_07: 1:15:49

You know, my wife is kind of going through a similar situation right now. One of her old friends from when she was growing up, um just reached out to her, and this friend uh was for a while trans, you know, a woman who thought they were a man and had, you know, changed their name and and everything. Um just recently reached out to her, and I guess now they are this this woman considers herself non-binary now and is married, we think, to a man. Um, but uh just asked my wife, you know, what is uh because she, you know, the they got to talking, and now she knows that my wife converted to Catholicism. They were both raised Baptist together. So she asked my wife what you know the Catholic Church thought about the LGBT issue and stuff like that. And so my wife is wondering, you know, how to respond. Yeah, because you don't want to, you don't wanna right, because you know, this could be a chance to bring an old friend out of terrible, terrible sin into the church.

SPEAKER_06: 1:16:56

So how do you how you handle that is very it's very delicate how you handle that. So this girl, this girl that my sister was even talking to, like, she's like, Well, you know, like, but like I'm bisexual and that's like part of my identity. And it wound up leading to a whole conversation about identity and not letting like your what who you're attracted to be part of your identity. Anyway, the like the girl wants to go to mass with my sister again, and she's you know, it's uh just interesting how all these things are happening around. Like, I have this Protestant kid coming to mass, my sister's taking this cradle Catholic who's identifying as bisexual back to mass. Like, things are still still happening where where God is still calling people to his church. It it's it's it was just a cool story. Um, plus that kid, do you see you've been watching that guy? Uh that guy that detransitioned that he went to his first Latin mass the other day.

SPEAKER_07: 1:17:50

I just watched that one video.

SPEAKER_06: 1:17:51

Yeah, that one video I watched, Jason sent it to us, but it's like this guy's like trying to relearn what it means to be a man, and he pops into a Latin mass for his first time. He's like, I didn't understand anything, but I want to go back, you know. It's like it's like you see how things like that. And then uh Fed Calderon, Protestant guy, watches our that's what Fed C meant.

SPEAKER_07: 1:18:13

I had no idea what that meant in the notes.

SPEAKER_06: 1:18:15

Fed Fed Calderon sent me a message. I'm like, I know Fed B, that's Bobby. We'll wait till you hear this message. Okay. Uh keep Fed in your prayers, guys. So um, first off, he uh he Wednesday he reached out and he said, Hey man, how's it going? So I went back to listen to the interview with Josh Charles that he did with Alan Femester. So, like I've been getting him to listen to some like deeper stuff. So he went back and listened to the Joshua Charles Alan Femister interview.

SPEAKER_07: 1:18:48

I saw a few people on Twitter recommend that to him, so that's good.

SPEAKER_06: 1:18:51

And he said he texted me Sunday. He said, Hey bro, today's my second time at the Latin Mass. Came back with my son, happy Sunday. I said, I've been praying for you, brother. He said, Thank you, met a couple of great guys today and had a great chat. So this is this is a Protestant guy who loves our show because he just likes he just likes us, you know, and just listening to our conversations got him checking out the Latin Mass, man. It's like just just cool things are still happening. He's in the chat, by the way. Oh, is he Fed?

SPEAKER_07: 1:19:22

Oh yeah, he said, Hey, that's me.

SPEAKER_06: 1:19:27

And then the other thing is um somebody's been posting on TikTok that uh there they're there. I told this story on locals before.

SPEAKER_07: 1:19:39

But um is it the quadruplegic one?

SPEAKER_06: 1:19:42

Yeah, I told this story on locals. So if you're new to locals, you've never heard it before, but like Molly's heard it and some of the OGs have heard it. Uh this this the guy was a quadriplegic, and he had a traumatic brain injury, the guy that that this girl is posting of, and she said, uh uh what did she actually say? All that trouble just to end up with a man who loves my first husband. Like she she's her new husband feeds the first husband.

SPEAKER_07: 1:20:08

And talk about the worst woman in the whole world.

SPEAKER_06: 1:20:12

Right. No, because that man doesn't even know what's going on. I'm gonna tell you about the worst woman in the history of the world right now. Oh well, you would oh I mean I've heard the story, but yes, yes, I'm going to tell you this the story of the worst woman on the planet. So I I said, I actually know a couple that the husband became up. All right, so this is they are in their early 20s.

SPEAKER_07: 1:20:35

Just don't read the tweet, just tell us the story.

SPEAKER_06: 1:20:37

Yeah, they go on their honeymoon, they go on an excursion, and he dives off the back of the boat in three feet of water, breaks his neck, and he is paralyzed from the neck down. On the honeymoon. On the honeymoon. I mean, look, heartbreaking for him, heartbreaking for the wife.

SPEAKER_07: 1:20:59

I mean, yeah, yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:21:01

Like this is you think you're about to start your life, and your husband breaks his neck on your honeymoon. The guy is incapable of feeding himself. Yeah. I think he has movement in like one finger. He's got an electric wheelchair. Bad. So, like two years in, he is in the darkest place of his life. And he rolls his wheelchair into the swimming pool when no one's home. And somebody comes home and sees him and revives him. They should have let that poor man drown. No, not really. I know not. I know. No, I know you're right. Yes, that was a terrible thing for me to say. I don't part of me thinks God would understand. No, no, his eternal soul is way more valuable. Yes, I know. I'm sorry, I was a dumb thing to say. She is now. This guy has all his cognitive ability. They talk through it, and he is in a place where he is just so depressed because I mean, dude, he cannot be a husband and a father. They have a I think they had a kid. Yeah, they had a kid. Before getting married? Before they were getting married. They had like a toddler or something. And this guy can't be a father, he can't be a husband. And she freaking divorces him and remarries, and the new guy is in the home and helps take care of him, and he has to watch some other man go up to bed with his wife every night. I'm sorry, let me drown. I'm sorry. That's more than wrong. That is literal hell on earth. That is hell on earth. Like literal hell on earth. I cannot think of a worse fate.

SPEAKER_07: 1:23:13

Yeah, but on the Yeah. But think of how sanctifying it could be for him. While his wife damns herself to hell.

SPEAKER_06: 1:23:26

Oh gosh. Well, why while his wife marches to hell and he can't do anything about it. Other than he condoned it, suffer well. Like, dude, she was in her 20s and she's literally caring for him. He can't be with her in bed, and this girl in her 20s.

SPEAKER_07: 1:23:45

See the this is when society in the past would have stepped in and basically prevented something like that from happening through the threat of shaming and ostracization. You know what I mean? Like, yeah, no, you do that to them, you do that to to your husband, to to that man, and your persona non grata for all of us for the rest of your life, bitch.

SPEAKER_06: 1:24:08

Dude, I just cannot I cannot fathom a worse fate. Yeah, I don't I don't know if there's anything I didn't say honor killings. I mean, I would I I would I I don't know. I would I mean you can't even kill the girl, like you can't even kill the woman. How you gonna bite her? I don't get it. You can't you can't I'm gonna gnaw you to death, woman. Yeah, like there's no way you're doing anything about it. You just have to sit and watch some other man live your life. And how about the new husband? Like, how the hell do you do that as a man? Oh, I'm gonna come in and sleep with your wife.

SPEAKER_07: 1:24:50

If your power chair has a lithium-ion battery, you could uh try to overload it and take out everyone with you.

SPEAKER_06: 1:24:58

Oh man, Anthony paralyzing Robin installing Wagner.

SPEAKER_08: 1:25:02

Scott, what I'm saying.

SPEAKER_07: 1:25:10

Yeah, you know, the fact that last week we talked about what would what you would do if I died, and then today I said I can't make it, and you had a co-host in five minutes. It's like five minutes. I gotta get on that, I gotta get on that show.

SPEAKER_06: 1:25:22

Son of a look, the thing is, like, so the the the topic tonight, like, yes, we're obviously like the the thing is you don't want to just become the show that focuses on the Jews constantly. It's just we're in a weird cycle, like, and I and I tried to tell Rob, like it's similar to when we started doing the pagan world series, and we just kind of spent a few months doing the pagan world, and then that kind of lost its luster, and then we wound up going into evolution and creation, and we spent a few months doing evolution and creation, and then people were like, All right, I have another show on evolution. It's like you know, we had we had uh uh Pam on, and we had we had like we just we did months of it where we would do otherwise.

SPEAKER_07: 1:26:13

Is that all those other cycles, the rest of the commentariat wasn't involved in those other discussions?

SPEAKER_06: 1:26:21

So that's the issue right now is that I would love to drop this, except that it is front and center in our culture.

SPEAKER_07: 1:26:28

Every every time we try to get away from it, something else happens.

SPEAKER_06: 1:26:32

Like there's right back to it. It's not just us talking about it, it's literally every conservative podcaster talking about this. The the can the the Republican Party is in a civil war over this issue. You're watching Matt Frad join the Daily Wire. You watch so it's it's a topic that I cannot avoid. Roger going to the DC and talking, like it's it's one of those things where it's just kind of got to run its course. And you know, we're gonna sprinkle other shows in, like we're doing a show on Tuesday about about the English Reformation. We're gonna sprinkle other shows in, but every once in a while we're gonna have no choice just because it's it's this story is going to continue, and I think it's going to get more and more prevalent. And I want to make sure we're on the right side of this issue, and I want to make sure that we're one of the few Catholic shows that actually talk about it and give people a place to go where they can hear a solid conversation about it because like there's just no other Catholic shows talking about. I mean, when we had Taylor on, and he I was blown away when Taylor came on and started talking about like towards the end there's gonna be worldwide Jewry and all that. I was like, this is great, you know, just just trying to explain to people what we're dealing with. But I know I know you don't land on the same side, and I know Wagner clearly didn't. Wagner's on the on this being apocalyptic, like oh that that this is leading to something like not just gonna fizzle out. This is I don't think I don't think it's the end.

SPEAKER_07: 1:28:10

Yeah, you and I you and I have had this discussion a lot of times. Like, I think we're probably like to me, what I see is that we're we're at the turning of like probably the fifth age, you know.

SPEAKER_06: 1:28:20

If we're talking about it's amend of it's like the end of the American story somehow, though. The like what would what we know is America now in 20 years might look very different, like extremely different. With all these different political discussions that are happening, and the fact that our currency is completely debased and all these young kids can't buy houses, like this stuff is leading to something.

SPEAKER_07: 1:28:45

Yeah, but yeah, I just could be civil war. We have to be careful not to ascribe too much significance to America. America's been on the global stage for a hundred years, and it looks like it's a that's about to end. You know what I mean?

SPEAKER_06: 1:29:00

Like yeah, like we lose our we lose our prominence as the as the world empire.

SPEAKER_07: 1:29:06

Yeah, compared compared to so many other civilizations and nations, like it's a very short time period. I I think like I said, I think we're coming, we're we're we're coming to the end of even uh not the end.

SPEAKER_06: 1:29:25

Even what's his name? Um uh the the apostolic nuncio coming to America today and telling everybody you better get on board with the Francis reforms because that's what we're sticking with. Like, yeah, I'm like, this is there is no there is no reform coming in the church, there's no reform coming to our political system. This shit is coming to a head. Do you uh you want to bring up the Maudsley clip? Sure. The Maudsley clip was interesting. He was on Catholic unscripted. Um uh oh, Gideon messaged me. Oh, Gideon sent me a really nice message. Um and uh uh and so did Patrick Knave. I got the thing is like all those guys watch Wagner and I think it's important we keep talking to him because Yeah, I like Wagner. I I really like Wagner and also like dude, I saw some of the most despicable behavior by the Set of Vicantes I've ever seen in my life today. Um, and uh I'll just say like I never want to see Set of Vicante in our chat ever again, ever, ever again. If I ever see him, there will be physical violence. No, well, the thing is, like, I know we make a lot of inside jokes about like where my family's from, and like, you know, I'm in a I'm in New York and I'm in a construction company. I'm just telling these guys, if they cross a line with my family, they will be getting a visit. And I'm not being hyperbolic in any way whatsoever. If they cross a line with me, I will find out where you live, I will find out exactly who you are, and you will be getting a visit. And I promise you, it will be the stupidest mistake you ever made. And I don't care how unchristian that threat is, you all especially especially when you live in your parents' basement, like you're putting your parents at risk, then too. I'm just telling you, this will not end nicely for you. I do not play games with my family. Such a scummy degenerate. It just shows you what a man who pretends to be Catholic without the sacraments really is like, yeah, like that's all you're just showing me how disgusting your spiritual life is. It's not like Rob's wife is some kind of a public figure, it's not like Rachel Wilson posted a freaking picture of us at his child's baptism. Like, I would knock your fucking teeth down your throat if I saw you in person. And that's my friend's wife. The the the reprehensible behavior. I'm just telling you. So yeah, no, I'm not in communion with that. No, no, no, no, good. It just it just shows you like the level I don't know, man. That kid, that kid's living, he's wallowing in hell. That kid. I wasn't even gonna bring it up tonight, but whatever. Like, just just I don't know, man. I don't play games with my family, so you guys better better. It's one thing to like goof around on shit we said on the show. It's like, you know, I don't care about that. You guys are like they they did their stupid puppet show and they put my face on a jubilant. Like, I don't care about that, like it's goofy stuff.

unknown: 1:32:59

I don't care.

SPEAKER_06: 1:33:00

Do not bring people's families into something when their family isn't in the public realm. Like it a Catholic should be able to post a picture of his child's baptism without these little shits doing that, like it's disgusting.

SPEAKER_07: 1:33:16

Well, I mean it it really just comes from a place of jealousy because they know they'll never have their own children, they'll never have a wife that loved them, they have no hope for the future. I mean, they probably honestly do live in their parents' basement. It's it's just it's jealousy, is what it is.

SPEAKER_06: 1:33:34

Yeah, and I don't want to knock people that are in that situation that have charity, though. Like, there are plenty of guys who are in that situation who have charity and they're and they're Christians and they're Catholics and they have the sacraments.

SPEAKER_07: 1:33:44

It's the difference. They're those people are Catholic.

SPEAKER_06: 1:33:47

Yeah, like there, there's there's like I my heart goes out to a guy who's in that situation who has charity, and it's like I the the the thing that pisses me off about it is that like I have been nothing but kind to those guys, like I've never shit on them publicly, never, like ever. I've never I've never done anything to any of them. If anything, like tried to involve them in our show chat, tried to be cool with them. Like, I've never ever disrespected them. Like, I don't know. I reached out, even was willing to go on a show with them. Like, you are a moral degenerate.

SPEAKER_07: 1:34:25

Sometimes the charitable thing is to tear someone down so that they can make themselves better. Yeah, that's just the truth.

SPEAKER_06: 1:34:35

Like, I have like I that makes me question his entire moral life. Like, you don't know that there's a line where, like, uh like you you you don't comment on a on a man's white, like you I these kids do not know that there is a line there. This is like like even the mob knows better. You don't you leave the women and children out of it, like you'll you'll kill somebody, but you don't touch the wife and children, like there's a line.

SPEAKER_07: 1:35:02

So it's it's one reason why um why the mafia for the longest time didn't like to deal with drugs, right? It if it affects families, yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:35:14

And then when they did allow it, they put it in the black neighborhoods. Yeah, they're animals, those people. Who cares what they do?

SPEAKER_07: 1:35:21

Usually because of the CIA trying to fight communists over in Italy is what early stern is.

SPEAKER_06: 1:35:26

No, critical Catholics. Right, like they've never been punched in the face, and they don't think it will happen, they think they're safe in their internet world. You are a public figure, Sene Picante. Do not for a second think we can't find you. I promise you I can find you. I know plenty of people who know who you are. Like I it just makes me mad because I was nice to those guys. Like I get I I attributed goodwill to them. I was like, ah, you know, we disagree on some stuff. Like, that's why I I like um I like Kevin from um Catholic Family Podcast because he's he's he's a guy of goodwill. Like I can I can have straight up disagreements with him, but he can have a charitable discussion on it. And it's like okay, we disagree on this. I you know, like, but he's a normal guy. Oh man. Sorry. I don't know if you was not expecting that. I don't know if you wanted to talk about that tonight, but that's been like that's been boiling up in me all day. Like all day. When yeah, I don't even want to bring attention to it, but that's why whatever, man. I I just they just uh assholes.

SPEAKER_07: 1:36:56

What just sorry for the bad language human scum wearing Catholicism as a skin suit is what it is, is what they are.

SPEAKER_06: 1:37:04

Um okay, what else we got? Um I think that might be all the do you want to cover the Father Casey clip before we go? I thought we were gonna do the Catholic unscripted.

SPEAKER_07: 1:37:17

I have it ready.

SPEAKER_06: 1:37:18

Oh, okay, let's do that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, this is this is actually good. This is good.

SPEAKER_00: 1:37:25

All those people on social media who think Catholicism is nothing more than saying you follow the Pope, you submit to everything from the Pope. I mean poor, poor souls, poor souls. They're not evil, but but there have been decades when we haven't had the faith taught. So they've taken this Protestant caricature of what being a Catholic is. Um that's like saying you'll follow the son Hedrin, no matter what they decide.

SPEAKER_06: 1:37:53

So, okay, so the reason I wanted to play this is because the Charlotte thing. The freaking Charlotte thing. I I put up a post the other day just saying, like, like I am baffled by the cowardice in the Charlotte diocese. I'm baffled by all of the priests, I'm baffled by the laity. I don't I don't get it. I'm sorry, but if they rip my communion rails out, I promise you there's going to be something. Like, I would get together with every single person at that parish and be like, we are going to go and line up as if that communion rail is still there, and we will kneel on the hard concrete. And if they refuse to give us communion, then that is we will do a spiritual communion that day. And I will do that every single week until they and I'd have somebody video it and watch show the world them denying communion to the men kneeling for communion at the altar rail that no longer exists, like something needs to be done, right? And when I said that, I got a whole bunch of people telling me so much for apostolic succession. This is you like the things these people think like we're not taught, you're nothing, you're no better than a Protestant. I am not protesting the Catholic faith, I am not protesting a Catholic doctrine, I am protesting an unjust like law that this that this bishop is passing down, an unjust freaking what would you call that? Like uh not a law, discipline, and uh whatever it is, like what there would be some kind of organization by every single man at the parish, and we would get together and do something about it. It's like you guys just want to like do nothing.

SPEAKER_07: 1:39:34

Yeah, I mean, what what it comes down to is uh they're all infected by the whole I mean Church of Nice, you know, sort of high hyper obedience sort of thing. Like we're so disconnected from from our history, from our tradition, from ancestors, from what from what Catholic men really really were, right? I mean, the the more I the more I I read and learn about historical Catholic figures, it just we're a shell of what we were. We really are. I mean the church, the hierarchy, but but the lady too.

SPEAKER_06: 1:40:11

Yeah, they just but but I think it's because so many Protestant converts came in and they have this misunderstanding that like you. I mean, these men aren't Catholic. You're talking about a bishop who isn't Catholic, yeah, putting an unjust order on you, ripping communion, like you have to hate Catholicism to be disturbed by people kneeling for communion. It's like people kneeling to show reverence for the king of kings, that disturbs your soul.

SPEAKER_07: 1:40:44

But I I don't I don't think we can blame all the Protestant converts because for the most part our grandfathers rolled over.

SPEAKER_06: 1:40:52

Yeah, oh I'm not just blaming Protestant converts. I'm not I'm not no no no it was cradle Catholics who allowed this, don't get me wrong.

SPEAKER_07: 1:41:00

Just like what we talk about with the the the the changes in the liturgy. I think I think it was the two world wars that turned us into the church of nice, yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:41:09

You know, definitely I I and I don't know how we uh the the I'm talking about the defending the bishops in these actions, right? I I think that is a very and I'm not saying all Protestant converts, there's plenty like Ryan's a convert and he's like appalled by this stuff. It's not all Protestant converts. No, no, it's saying there's a there's like a certain type of Protestant convert that comes in who because they never had any kind of authority, like when they come in, they're just like no, we have to worship the Pope. So that so as Protestants, they accused Catholics of worshiping the Pope, and then when they became Catholic, they're like, No, we have to worship the Pope. It's like no, we don't worship the Pope. Like they they think the it's uh it's an unhealthy understanding of like how how how how church discipline works and how you know when you have an unfaithful father.

SPEAKER_07: 1:42:05

I think I think for converts the way I see it, it it's less that in my opinion, and more they just don't have that that Catholic sense that that cradles do. You know, when you when you're when you've when you're raised in a family that's been Catholic for a thousand years minimum, right? Like, I don't know, there's this sense that gets passed on of your relationship with the church and its relationship with you, and it's just very different than than a convert who who doesn't get that, who doesn't realize that. Like, but do you there's always tension between the hierarchy and the layout layout? Yeah, there's always this back and forth.

SPEAKER_06: 1:42:45

We're allowed to protest within the church to to affect change in the church. You're not saying go start your own church. We're saying no, we want to reform the thing we're in. That's like that's a quote. Let me I've got a good quote here. I saw the do well before you even bring that up. Do you think what I'm suggesting is wrong? Like, no, I think that's a peaceful way to demonstrate your hurt.

SPEAKER_07: 1:43:10

Like I'm at the I'm at the point we sit in the pews and lock the doors and dare them to tear tear them open. Like I really am.

SPEAKER_06: 1:43:19

Like, I'm I think I think what I'm suggesting is actually a proactive, positive way to go about it, though, where every when they rip that communion rail out, you go in and you kneel on the concrete and wait for I don't I think in most cases they're not ripping any communion rails out, they're just saying they can't be used.

SPEAKER_07: 1:43:37

You can still kneel for communion, but you had to come up in the procession in the line, in the line, yeah.

SPEAKER_06: 1:43:44

If there if there is a communion rail there, you guys go up and you kneel at that communion rail. If they deny you communion, let them deny you communion. Have somebody video it and just show the injustice, and just and suffer that, suffer that well. Don't make a big deal of it, don't cause any kind of scene at mass, especially. You go there and you suffer silently. It's a similar thing to Christ getting spit on before the Sanhedrin, and he says nothing. You go there, you kneel. If they refuse you communion, they refuse you communion. You leave peacefully, you don't cause a scene, you don't argue with anyone, nothing like that. I think that's the way to handle it.

SPEAKER_07: 1:44:25

Um, so Brian Holdsworth tweeted this quote from Pope uh Leo the Great. Let no one be ordained against the express wishes of the place, lest a city should either despise or hate a bishop whom they did not choose and fall away from religion because they have not been allowed to have whom they wished. Like we in our day and age, we don't we don't realize we have no historically cities.

SPEAKER_06: 1:44:53

They would choose one from their own ranks. Yeah, they would choose a priest from their own ranks, right? But yes, and the people would want him. Well, and they would try that's why you had holier bishops in the early church, because they they would be proven men that the people wanted to be their bishop.

SPEAKER_07: 1:45:06

Like Ambrose. Ambrose was uh, I don't know if I think he had just been baptized and in and Milan chose him as the bishop, and he had to be ordained and then consecrated as a bishop. And he he didn't want it, but they they kept they chose him like two or three times, I think.

SPEAKER_06: 1:45:23

And then Augustine was grief. Yeah, yeah, man. We got some wild times ahead, kids. Uh all right. We'll uh we'll close this one up. We'll be back Thursday. We will try not to discuss the Jews. We should, but I don't think we will, but look, it was just because of the Rodre article, and I thought I thought we would get more into the generational divide, but I don't know. Christian, I'm I I felt and I felt trepidation from Christian. Like Christian still wants to be in Catholic Inc. World.

SPEAKER_07: 1:45:59

I think he really I mean I'm kind of fired up on the issue if you want to hash rehash it with me here.

SPEAKER_06: 1:46:04

Well, I'll I'll tell you right now, I'm starting to mute people that uh that I've traditionally liked because I'm you well muting people is is fine because it it's not causing a stir with uh and and I think this thing will pass, so you're better off just muting them for a while, and then when this thing passes, you go back to talking with them, you know. Um, that's probably the healthiest way to handle it instead of fighting with people that you like, you know, because that that people don't handle text well when you're tweeting and stuff, and that's why like I never fight with people on Twitter, really. I try not to, like, maybe on a very rare occasion, but I try to just make jokes and be stupid and I don't like getting into arguments with people. Um, was it a great show tonight? I appreciate that, guys. Uh Catholic Inc. needs to go. Yeah, I I I just want to make sure we're on the right side of this topic, and I want to make sure people know they can come to us if they're looking for clarity on it. And I think this is a very serious issue, and it's gonna be brought up again. Just we'll try not to do it two shows in a row because it gets tiresome. It gets tiresome for us, yeah. Yeah, so uh no, I don't fight on X like troll. That's not fighting. Uh yeah, I never like lose my cool in anybody on Twitter. Like, I'm never angrily tweeting ever.

SPEAKER_07: 1:47:31

Not me. You have a hard time keeping it together.

SPEAKER_06: 1:47:35

Uh all right, let's wrap this one up, and we will see you guys on Thursday.

SPEAKER_07: 1:47:41

Oh, let me change the outro here real quick. I don't think people want to hear our AI singing again.

SPEAKER_06: 1:47:46

No, I don't want to hear it. Okay, here we go.