Leaders in Supply Chain and Logistics

#68: Professor Richard Wilding of Cranfield School of Management

January 23, 2020 Radu Palamariu Season 1 Episode 68
Leaders in Supply Chain and Logistics
#68: Professor Richard Wilding of Cranfield School of Management
Chapters
Leaders in Supply Chain and Logistics
#68: Professor Richard Wilding of Cranfield School of Management
Jan 23, 2020 Season 1 Episode 68
Radu Palamariu

Richard Wilding is the Chair of Supply Chain Strategy at the Centre for Logistics and Supply Chain Management, Cranfield School of Management U.K. And Past Chairman of the Chartered Institute of Logistics & Transport UK.

Discover more details here.

Some of the highlights of the episode:

  • How Richard started his career in academia
  • How cybersecurity is keeping executives up at night
  • Nike’s vision of installing 1200 additive manufacturing machines
  • How the internet helps with the modern model of education
  • Skills needed in future for Chief Supply Chain Officers

Follow us on:
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Show Notes Transcript

Richard Wilding is the Chair of Supply Chain Strategy at the Centre for Logistics and Supply Chain Management, Cranfield School of Management U.K. And Past Chairman of the Chartered Institute of Logistics & Transport UK.

Discover more details here.

Some of the highlights of the episode:

  • How Richard started his career in academia
  • How cybersecurity is keeping executives up at night
  • Nike’s vision of installing 1200 additive manufacturing machines
  • How the internet helps with the modern model of education
  • Skills needed in future for Chief Supply Chain Officers

Follow us on:
Instagram: http://bit.ly/2Wba8v7
Twitter: http://bit.ly/2WeulzX
Linkedin: http://bit.ly/2w9YSQX
Facebook: http://bit.ly/2HtryLd

Radu Palamariu:   0:00
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Radu Palamariu:   0:23
Hello and welcome to the leaders in supply chain Forecast. I am your host, Rod Apollo Mario, managing director of Global. Our mission is to connect the supply chain ecosystem by bringing forward the most interesting leaders in the industry. And today I'm delighted to have with Professor Richard Wilding, who is the chair of supply change strategy at the Center for Logistic since my chain management can feel school of Management in the UK as well as past Chairman of the Charge Against Into the Logistics and Transports for the United Kingdom, Richard works with the European and international companies on logistics and supply chain projects in all sectors, including pharmaceutical, retail, multi hi tech, food and drinks, and professional service is a significant contribution to logistics and supply. Chain management has been recognized. Bye. He's being appointed this officer of the most Excellent order of British Empire by Queen Elizabeth, second year 2013. And he also wanted to 1019 the National Teaching Fellowship, which is the most prestigious individual award in higher education. I'm very happy and thrilled Thats region to the time. And let's welcome human and thank you for joining us.

Richard Wilding:   1:35
Yeah, no problem. It's an absolute pleasure to talk to you all today.

Radu Palamariu:   1:39
Super so I wanted to firstly, maybe give our audience a brief story line in terms of how you started in Supply Channel that the very beginning you were in raw materials that very oriented to your career. You're a materials engineer and then for years you transitioned into into a very It's a practical econ. Yes, maybe maybe just tell us a little bit about yourself. Yes,

Richard Wilding:   2:07
of course. So I mean, I started off my my first degree was in materials engineering with material science and technology on dhe. I started off my career actually working in manufacturing, engineering and production management. Andre used to make brick ex building brick, so I ended up managing a facility which used about 1.2 million building bricks a week on these were, you know, the red bricks that you see buildings made out off in England, a cz you moving forward? But believe it or not, we made 144 different types off, Uh, standard square brick. But then you could do all sorts of special things with them on, so I were there for a period of time. I then moved into the metals industry, which was actually the copper industry where I was working in that particular area for a while. Andi was one. I was on that journey, and I was beaming technology into copper smelters and coppers. Smelting facilities, you know, doing manufacturing systems engineering that I accidentally fell into academia. I think that's the best way to describe it. Because during those previous roles are particularly the brick industry, you're managing the whole supply chamber. To be quite frank, I didn't really realize it at the time. By accident, you fell into academia on die doing the Warrant manufacturing group, which is based in the university. Warrick. Andi, I was there for a number of years. Um, I have a break from there. I joined when there was 70 staff a lift When was 500 staff within within that particular group under the late Professor Kumar Bhattacharya, who is a very famous figure in the United Kingdom. I then decided, after doing my PhD eats in my spare time while working there on the Big Thing about Warrick Waas that we were very much engaged with engineering companies. So a lot of my time was actually spent, really, in a way, working with companies, working with managers in manufacturing environments and supply train as we know it. Today was really just in its infancy, So I was sort of working with those organizations many of, you know, automotive companies, aerospace companies on Saul and so forth within that area. I then decided it was time to escape academia, and I failed dismally and ended up at Cranfield University, sort of worked with a number of consultant sees and various people, and I was gonna go and work with them. Onda. The story goes that one of the professors here was a non exact director for one of those companies, and he says, No, you're not having him. He can come to Cranfield, but you can. He can work with you for a few a few days. So I've been a crumpled now for 21 years, Believe it or not, s o. What's great about Cranfield is is everything we do is what about knowledge into action. So all our students are post graduate students that people like yourself working an industry on. We do a lot of work with, you know, with organizations around the world. So since then Yep, you know, we're doing research, but also, what we're very much doing is trying to embed good supply chain practice within those organizations. And France feels kind enough to let me dio sort of private works from a lunatic director with a number of large organizations. Andi, as your introduction said, I was chairman off the chance that institute of logistics and transport for for a number of years, well, four years and I just had to step down. I've done the maximum number of terms you can do on the governance that we put in, said that you couldn't have people on the board and its chairman for too long because that's bad for a company you know of that type. So, for professional institutions, you need a little bit of a change. So I'm now immediate past Chairman. Of course, I still have some connections, but I'm unless eating the current team get on with things and keeping a low profile for a few months. Um, before I just sort of go back and perhaps do something else who

Radu Palamariu:   6:30
knows? You seem to have Ah, you seem to have a pattern and doing that. And it's not necessarily, you know, uncommon. Because if you're very passionate about something, it tends to happen. I'd love to ask you a little bit in terms of the work that you do for multinational Corporates, Um, you are purview to, And you said that you sit on a few boards and see a lot of these discussions are owned corporate supply chains in action. I wanted to ask you maybe, and start here with the question. What do you see as the main challenges that you they're being faced with in this world off. You know, I don't want to give you a manual east, actually, let me ask you, what do you see is the main. The main challenges that companies are faced with Constance a plaited into these world.

Richard Wilding:   7:18
Well, I think you know, if we're if we're sitting in the board room, the some of the things that we have to comply where they're actually quite challenging. So it depends on the companies that you were. So you know, for example, modern day slavery is a particularly important area that is, you know, I can be severely disruptive to an organization. If you find out that that's going on in in your by chain, of course, things like conflict, minerals, fiber security increasingly is something which is very much, you know, on the agenda within the board. And I think what's actually really important about this is is that from a supply chain perspective, if you think that competition is not between individual companies, it is between the supply chains that their part off we are a ll very much connected. And if we're looking at some of the foundational elements of supply chain 4.0, which we're starting to see, you know, taking place with it within the environment, that starts to create all sorts of challenges because this increasing connectivity is also presenting us with, you know, actually, great vulnerability and greater risk within the by chain environment. So if you think about you know, the foundations of spy chain for Went zero and industry 4.0 things like systems integration, big day, Tranel itics simulation, virtual ization, Internet of things, that cloud cybersecurity, which I've already mentioned autonomous systems or demented reality. An additive manufacturing. All these things are sort of joining together. Um ah, nde. You know, in the past, you know, you will talk to supply chain professionals and you say, Hey, you need to think about cyber security and they'll think it's not My job is the I T Department's job, right? It's no, is everybody's job on our be quite honest, It's very much the responsibility off a supply chain. Professionals by Chain Direct. It's a think and considers, you know, the whole cyber security issue. Why is that? Because if we're looking at some of the more recent attacks on Corporates, it's occurring through their supply chain partners. So in other words, you have a supply chain partner that is compromised because we're all connected. Then they're able to get into your systems on dhe compromise what you're doing as well. So you know, I look at the supply chain and I think you know OK, What you need to think about is, you know, we all need to be thinking around those particular things. I mean, that's just one example we also have. If you're looking at side of terrorism, another area is sorry, you know, just supply chain terrorism. That's another area which is increasing. So, you know, if you're looking at some of the latest stats on that, we're getting 3.7 instances a week now occurring where you know terrorist activities is happening, which is which is actually generating serious issues for supply chains. So we've got a whole raft of different things that we're having to deal with consumers demanding great traceability. But of course, you know that we've got the whole cost issue as well, which underlies everything. At the end of the day, we've got to make sure we can make some money and do that cost effectively. And I think in a way that's also being a big challenge because, you know, if you think about, for example, in retail the world of Omni Channel, where you know consumers wanting to buy things haven't delivered on line and everything else. If you don't understand the cost to serve in that particular area, you lose money very, very quickly. And we're finding many organizations, many traditional retailers who really adjust, you know, just losing everything because they're trying to play that game on. They're not playing it properly, so it depends on the sex you're in. But I have a lot of stuff which, from the boardroom agenda at the moment  which is part of the challenge of the, you know, the complexity of what we're having to deal with.

Radu Palamariu:   11:40
Mmm, I could not. I could not agree more and also the fact that you are purview to so many industries on. But that also paints a very complex and diverse picture because, you know, obviously there's differences. Differences between each of them. I was, I was reading Recently, the World Economic Forum presented some some effect, and also they had the 44 factories of the future. There's a list, Adam, if you saw that one where they basically ah highlighted their best manufacturing facilities in the world that are using the different elements of industry for prom, so to speak, you know, suit of between artificial intelligence and machine learning and, you know, digital Tweens and big data and everything that you have. You want to connect to that? But I'd love to go a little bit deeper because I think the woman that you mentioned this site security is, you know, probably just gonna get a warning going for it. I don't t with amounts of devices that I get in connected. The an interconnected is just gonna get more important. I wanted to get your perspective. How do you see this? Interesting? Because stealing

Richard Wilding:   12:53
a lot of

Radu Palamariu:   12:54
organizations, it's pretty broken in silence. Right.

Richard Wilding:   12:57
You have a P I T. Department detective part, but you have displaced

Radu Palamariu:   13:00
department. Can you give us some examples of organizations that you've seen that have done this really well? And they're this because it's not that. I mean, in my experience of this, in terms of our from where we come from a consulting angle Orioles, it's not that common that the size of security expected it sits within the supply chain pills. I'm just curious.

Richard Wilding:   13:22
Yeah, I think it's something that really needs across the across the whole of the organization. So if you're looking at? Yes, you need the i t. People. But at the same time, Um, it's rather like I came across this early and this fine, oh based approach when we were looking at a data standards and information standards to use across the supply chain. So you probably know GS one, which is one of the, you know, the key standard standards organizations. So, you know, when working with G s when we often talk about the language of business. So really, what they're basically saying is, if you've got, like, proof of delivery and so on and so forth, make sure that you have that in the same format. So advanced shipping notices make sure that all the spy chain parties used the same format. So what they do is they have a stand performer on you. Witness this mostly in the grocery supply chain because every bar code can be read. You know, around the world, you know, you have a standard, you know, barcode structure, which can then be read by, you know, scanners and so on and so forth. If you didn't have that, you'd have all sorts of problems. Now I remember actually a few years ago. Now we were doing a doing events saying, Hey, look, you know, this is really important to the supply train. Having a common language, common ways of working on. We need to actually mobilize organizations to think more carefully about this. So we sent that invitation to the supply chain directors on Dhe, the supply chain directors also ran, said, No, that's not a drop. That's a map information, you know, information, director's job. So then you think him invitations to the information directors on they turn around, say, Oh, no, no, that's no add drop. That's the supply chain director's job last. The problem with Silos is that there's some pig gaps in between. She has to start thinking process, and it's the same with cyber security. It's not one function that can actually do with this. This is a whole organizational culture that needs to be addressed. So you know, you're having to make everybody sort of think through what the implications are, but for the way that you, you know, you sharing data, how you're managing and protecting your systems and so on and so forth. And if you look at some of the you know, recent attacks. Meanwhile, which is well documented, it's probably worth sharing his target. The, you know, the U S retailer. They ended up being being hit a number of years ago. Now, on dhe effectively, that came from a refrigeration, um, heating, ventilation, air conditioning supplier. Okay. Who was who was attacked with a phishing emails. So then they were able to get onto that Suppliers systems from the supplier systems because of the connective ity to heating and ventilation systems in, you know, target, for example, they were able to then get into the target systems. They then sat there for a number of months on they, you know, basically just harvested 40 million. You know, payment cartridge and, um, credentials on 70 million records. Okay, Once they got all that, then they were able to start, um, you know, basically making money out. Of course, on dhe they recognized that was actually cost target 162 million. Um, so far, you know, I don't know if the final cost of actually being worked out, So this is substantial amounts of money. I mean, another example. Google Australia. They have once again they're building control systems were actually hacked by some activists on they got into a good Google systems there. So So, you know, you're sitting there is a supply chain person, but you've got to think about how we secure things. But if you think about the infrastructure of the supply chain directors in charge off, you know, might have some responsibility for you. Think about your warehouse management systems and so on and so forth. Somebody gets into that chisel, the data records. You're not gonna know what's going on for a very long time. And of course we've. We've recently had some just in the last few months. I mean, we're talking about we in January 2020. We've we've had Austria. Their government systems have bean targeted on. We've also got Travelex, which is the travel money organization, has also have a have a big attack on that as well. And that's out of action. And the problem is, they offer those service's into retailers and other organizations. So, you know, in the United Kingdom, you know you can get your money from Tesco, the big supermarkets and they used their systems, but it's branded as tests go, you know, travel money or whatever on actually behind all that. It's Travelex who are managing it. Nobody can move anything anywhere at the moment, and I haven't had an update on it recently. But you know that businesses is still I think that happened, um, on around Christmas time and this still from last I heard there. Still, things are not fully operational, so you know, this is severe on, but it's increasing, so we need to start thinking very differently about the amount of focus we put into this. That's one of the things which I think you should be keeping a what awake at nights by chain directors. Think what they do for help, you know, secure. Secure the business because you know the supply train if it's attacked. Competition is not between individual companies. It's between the supply trains. Their part off on. You could very easily lose your competitive position if you don't deal with these issues.

Radu Palamariu:   19:46
And if you we were to think from a very practical and pragmatic perspective. Let's see Professor Richard that you're the chief supplies an officer of a major retailer of manufacturing company, and you wanted to be sure that your supply chain has minimal risk or or even risk zero. What would be some of the first things that you would do and look at?

Richard Wilding:   20:06
Well, you're never gonna get into zero. But, I mean, one of the things that are looking at with one company is in the United Kingdom. We have something which is actually run by the by the governments and its cyber essentials. It's like a a a kite mark that you can have. And the interesting thing about five essentials is is that you know, they took my reassuring customers that you're working to secure your I t against cyber attack. Okay, you can attract new business with the promise you have cyber security measures in place. You have a clear picture of your organization. Cyber security levels on some government contracts, rich choir, cyber essentials. So this is a so your essentials is this initiative on? You can do it on a very much a voluntary basis, but you can also get audited, and you can get a match for it. So one of the things that you know I've been working with companies with is saying, Hang on a minute. If you're thinking about, you know, procurement and so on and so forth Is cyber essential something that you're actually asking off your suppliers, you know? Is this something that you can ask of your suppliers? So So that, you know, you can practically do something useful. I'm sure other countries have similar initiatives. But if not, just you know, if you look at Google Google something like, you know, UK cyber essentials, I'm sure you'll be able to find the details of these initiatives s O that just really starts to give people the processes and the opportunity to go through. Of course, the end of the day. You're never going to completely protect yourself, but it's just some a lot of it is good housekeeping. I mean, we're on my favorite little thoughts. I came across on Twitter is about passwords. Okay, so here's a great quote. Passwords are like underwear. Don't let people see it. Change it often on you should not share it with strangers. S So So Yeah. So you know, if you take a poor board, I've been sharing that within Cranfield, you know? So if you take on board some of the just some of the bits with the basics of, you know, having more complex passwords, changing one on on a regular basis, ensuring the everybody's aware of these things. You know, that becomes really important. And I think from a supply chain perspective, if you think well, when I'm working with companies on supply change strategy, I generally say this, um, you know, in simplistic terms, is four building box. There's thesis apply train process design, the supply chain infrastructure and equipment that you're using. There's the information systems, but also there's the organization, the people, and you know that side of things. And really, if you think about it, if you're gonna take out a supply chain, you can take out either the processes, the infrastructure, the information systems, all the people. So, you know, if you're thinking about, uh, sometimes it is easier to take out the people, right? So if you think about you in your office, it may be that you know, I'm going to face. Look, I find out what's the details about you? Because I've got all those details I'm unable to. Maybe hacking's one of your accounts because I've hacked into one of your accounts. I then they're able to maybe get into your business that, you know, the the businesses account on so on and so forth. So it's something that you know it can be. You might see your work, and the way you operate a home in terms of your writing systems is very different. But of course, that we're all everything's connected at the moment. So, you know, if you're disgracing lots of information on Facebook and so on and so forth, there is a better chance that maybe people might be able thio get the details of your work. You know, security is it were infrastructure. So, you know, you could target infrastructure so you could target particular bits of infrastructure which people are having to deal with in order to disrupt this supply chain. That could be, you know, could be vehicles. It could be warehouse management systems. It will be all sorts of things. Of course, it could be the information systems, but also you might want to disrupt the process Is so you know, these are some of the things that you have to think through. We have time protection in place on all those elements, so that you know, we understand the resilience of what's happening are happening.

Radu Palamariu:   24:45
Mmm. And on the topic of people Because, uh, um no, no. I guess if I'm to speak metaphorically, you've kind of transition from a sum from physically building bricks too, and more metaphorically building the fundamental bricks of knowledge right in the in the minds of the students in mind. Beauty. Workforce. What do you see, Professor? In this age, where we're talking a lot about you new ministry for point only talking a lot about digitization of reporting, machine learning. There's a bunch of technologies that are coming. They're coming fast. What do youse here? Skills needed for the future supply chain leaders and professionals to make them or to keep them relevant into this very fast changing

Richard Wilding:   25:32
world. Well, I mean, what else don't talk about is is that what we have is, you know, you have your technical intelligence. Okay, so this is the I Q of the supply chain now, traditionally, you know, the I q of the supply chain might be around, you know, had I manage inventory. How do I you know, warehouse design, you know, is a ll that that technical knowledge which often you know, it becomes Cranfield. We can give you an awful law off supply chain I Q. You know, you know that technical intelligence off the supply chain. The challenge is, is that that really, to some degree is just the qualifier. Now, you know that is very much just the qualifier. The winner is the e Q or the emotional intelligence that supply chain, which is the relational intelligence. It's how we manage relationships. So, you know, if you're looking at all the examples we've discussed so so far, you know, if you're looking at cyber, you organized to manage relationships across the broad supply chain and within your organization to really deal with this effectively. No, it's not just about, um, you know, sitting in your business and doing something very technologically. You know, advance. That's a part of it. But the relationship side of things is also very important to deal with now. Part of the challenge that we then got is if you're looking at supply chain 4.0 and all those elements the tech nickel intelligence, the qualifying technical intelligence elements is changing very rapidly. So, you know, if you go back And you think that, you know, a supply chain professional at one time. If he sort of understood, you know, inventory control algorithms and, you know, rooting, routing algorithms and a few things like that. He was here. She was very, absolutely fine. You know, they could they could do a very nice job with just that level of technical intelligence. But really, for the jobs in the future, you're gonna need a whole raft of a different sort of skills and things that are required. So this is very much part of the challenge. So if I'm doing supply chains strategy going back to my processes, infrastructure, information systems and then the people, if we're example, we say, Hey, you know, instead of having a warehouse that just has loads of racking with loads of automotive parts on it, we put in the warehouse a clever additive manufacturing three D printing machine. So we don't actually keep any physical parts. We just keep virtual plans off the parts on. We print them when we need them. Okay, That will have a big impact on the infrastructure side of things. You know, it might mean the warehouses smaller. It might mean that way Don't need as much racking it might. It couldn't have implications. Got sole source of different things. It also means we can change. The process is okay, so the processes that we usedto have for managing inventory of distributing victory may change. It will also have an impact on the information systems because the information systems, you know, that we were originally have will need to change to accommodate the fact that now they might be holding, you know, a virtual a design rather than a keeping track of a physical product. So, you know, things will change there because you're putting a sort of a small manufacturing facility into a warehouse. Also, think about the people you think about the people, the skill set to be ableto operate in that environment. The technical intelligence is gonna be completely different, too, if you don't have that bit of equipment as it were. Andi, this really is part of the challenge that we've got that you know, ants were increasingly putting in, you know, autonomous systems, robotics and so on and so forth within particular facilities, the skill set of people working in those facilities needs to change quite dramatically to accommodate. Uh huh. On. We're already starting to see some of the some of the challenges. I mean, you mentioned people talking about the best automated factories. You know, one thing which was announced by Nike just it was just over a year or so ago now was that they were wanting to really did it ties their whole supply chain and the current model. They spoke about walls. We have one million workers in  566 factories, 75 distribution centers on dhe, 30,000 retailers in their 190 countries. Andi. They have this vision off this future model of installing 1200 additive manufacturing machines. And they're saying this is great news because we can near shore. So reducing shipping expenses, import juices and overproduction risks. And they also say, What's great about it? Is there a 30% fewer steps in the process? And also in the report, there was a little thing which says we can also have 50% less labor within this environment. So what we have to think it is if you're the current models one million workers in 516th fat factories. Now they're saying we want 50% less labor. So what we've got then is is we've got a situation where half a 1,000,000 people effectively on that supply chain will be out of work. Now, that has significant social consequences. So if I look at what they do it, you know, doing the reassuring manufacturing know locally, great for the planet, you know? So in terms of the planet, the environment, that's good news. You know, we're not shipping all this stuff around the world. Let's see Young too less this less fat and everything else. Okay, Profitability. Well, you know, we'll see. But I'm sure they're doing it because it's gonna save them. A lot of money on day is gonna make them more profitable. So on, you know, the planet. It's good on profitability. It's good. But what about the people about the, you know, the social implications of this? You know, at the end of the day, if we've got 1/2 1,000,000 people who haven't got drops, um, how how is how are we gonna How are we gonna manage that? Is that gonna lead to civil unrest if it leads to civil unrest? in those nations. Is that gonna disrupt other supply chains that were part off? And I think that this now is something that, you know, supply chain professionals needs consider is not just the bell, you know, the profits as it were, were being encouraged to think about the planet. But also, we're gonna start thinking carefully about people because some of the decisions as we're in a in a transition at the moment between If you like two ways of working and we're moving into this new, you know, new industrial revolution as it were, you will always find, you know, if you look up past industrial revolutions, I'm past, you know, ages of industry. You go through a dip where you've got the old rubbing up against the new on. We're at that point now. So, you know, we've got to be quite careful in his thinking through our decisions. They're saying, how will these decisions also impact on society on DDE in terms of its impact on society is also gonna have an impact on this skills off the people that we need. So you know, people who have a skill set like me who knows I'm gonna be replaced by a hologram on a next, but, you know, an artificial intelligence engine potentially, you know, which will do everything, which I do. Well, I don't think we're quite there yet, but you think we need to actually think so How? My goings would just my job. So I'm still going to be competitive in the future. Yeah, you know, So it's this lifelong learning. So, you know, a teething on the importance of organizations like the chance of instituting logistics and transport is that we're very much involved in that lifelong learning. And that's very much what Crown feels all about as well. So we have our executive programs. We have our you know, this master's programs that people will do. But at the end of the day, what we're having to train people is that situation where you can come and you can get views, skills on retraining your current skills so that you're able to go, you know, to carry on in your work and think through You know what's actually going on. So I think that that is going to be, um, a pretty big challenge for everybody in the future.

Radu Palamariu:   34:22
I wanted to also pick on this topic, because the education system in itself is very much right for for disruption, I guess. And we have things like they called an old sea mocks message,

Richard Wilding:   34:40
plus online something courses. Yeah.

Radu Palamariu:   34:44
Yeah, exactly. So it

Richard Wilding:   34:46
moves. Yeah. So this is, you know, I mean, really what this is saying is we can you know, if you think about I guess, the very traditional model off of education. It's, you know, maybe 30 people in a room when you talk to them with, You know, the internet, where we're now able to do is to communicate to thousands. I mean, I've got on iTunes you. I've got an introduction who supply chain management a course there, which is being consistently, believe it or not. In the top 10 top 20 business was theirs on on iTunes. You, which is iTunes University on that has, you know, when we tried to track it, but that that's that's have well over 60,000 subscribers to that. You know, that's collections of podcast papers and so on and so forth. So it what I'm being able to do is to communicate globally to 60 60,000 people through doing this, and it's like this podcast we're doing now. I mean, if you think about the number of people who may listen in or download and so on and so forth, it probably far exceeds the number of people that I can speak to in a classroom at Granville. So things are changing in that way. But I think it depends on the types off the type of what you're trying to achieve in terms of your education. And that's really where things were important here. Cranfield, What we take is very much a blended to learn learning approach. More that means is, we will use that sort of Web based teaching off the mat might be for the more basic elements of what we're trying to get people to understand. You know, you can do that very well on some of the, you know, supply chain fundamentals, as it were. But actually, what's really important as well, particularly for supply chain leaders on executives, is you do need to get people together to share ideas. You know, I say that innovation is taking ideas, which in you to you and creating economic, social or environmental values. So you know on the challenge, then, is if innovation is all about taking those ideas which new to you and creating value is, how do you get those ideas and share those ideas? And sometimes the best way you can do that is get people here at Cranfield in the Lecture theatre and probably in the bar afterwards to, you know, talk through these of these ideas here. I don't I don't think sometimes, actually the half the learning in the bar afterwards and over dinner. Can it see what's going on in the lecture Theatre? Requirement is that's quite right, because what I will be doing is throwing ideas of people on. Do you have to be able to take them away and think about them and discuss them before you can think about how you're gonna take that knowledge and create action? You know, that's what about acknowledge and creating action on. We do what we do. A lot of that I mean, I am. I run up a one week cool say from Fuel Supply Chain Management program, which has been running for many years on dhe. We we get senior supply chain director's going on that after, say to them, I said, When was the last time you had a one week out of your business to basically think about supply chain on? In a way, it's like a supply chain retreat in automated. It's you're getting out of the business for one week and we take them through the end. When supplied came the key things that you haven't to think through during that and you see how it all connects. But actually, it's those discussions on what's going on around that, because it, if you want it, refreshes them, and it enables them take that knowledge and create actions. So is part of we have actual planning workshops every morning where I don't have them at the end of the day because, you see, at the end of the day, everybody's still thinking, Oh blimey, what do I do with this? They need to sleep on things they need to sort of get in the bar and discuss things. And then in the morning, they're able to sort of think with more clarity about right about that concept there. I need to try my business. This is how I'm going to do it so they're able to take that knowledge and then say This is the action I'm gonna be taking. We do that every day over those five days on at the end. They don't have a plan of action for their business so they can go out and trace and change. And that's what really excites May, because we're improving the ways my chains operate globally, you know, with where were helping your the those businesses in terms of, you know, the profitability off. Those businesses were helping them, you know, wrestle through the challenges in terms the planet when we do things differently there. But also, you know, what I do hope is that we give, you know, a bit of a social conscience because at the end of the day, it's also about managing those relationships on thinking about society in the long run. So we have to sort of get a trade off on all those areas.

Radu Palamariu:   39:51
Would tend to agree that indeed, the combination between them online and classroom based learning is is pretty much where we heading. And also a lot of things are readily available online. We have a lot, of course, is that our, um are available online. We had Professor USC Shefi from M. I. T. In one of the episodes on the podcast, and he's a very big advocate as well, in terms of this blend of learning and again against call it learning agility for students and people of all ages nowadays to be able to pick up information from from the online spectrum. So that's great to hear and moving towards the last question that I wanted to address to you, Professor, which is very much to maybe the younger audience of the younger professionals listening to this What would be your advice to somebody that would I want to become a chief supply jin officer. What should they be looking

Richard Wilding:   40:46
for? Some of the big things around this is just thinking. In terms off, you have to think process. So, you know, early in your career, try and get as a cz much off an overview of the organization as possible. Now, some companies are actually very good at doing this, you know, thinking through the types of skills on things that people need. But other organizations are a not so good. You don't want everybody to be a generalist I talk about the conflict on T shaped people like the letter T you've got across the top. You need that process view, but you also need a functional special ism. You don't want people to become total generalists because they're less useful. So I think the point is from a supply chain perspective, you still need to very much have you know that technical knowledge that some some special ism But you also need to understand the process that you're part off. So you still need to have a reasonable understanding of all those various other elements which are taking place on you also need to develop that emotional intelligence. You know, that relational intelligence, You know, if I'm on, you know, I have encouraged people to think through How can you get back and you don't have to do it in your job. You know, it might be that I have to look at the skills that people you tries in their in their workplace. But what are the skills that people owe utilize outside of the workplace, you know? Ah, nde You know some of those skills we can utilize, so I know, you know, hear it counsel. I've got colleagues who might be quite junior, but they're doing fantastic things. Say, working with the guides, you know, the girl guides or, you know, other people are working with, You know, they're local communities in certain project, so you're able to learn new skills. Another really important thing is is there is no doubt about it that you've got to develop the language off the board room. You know, if you're gonna be a chief supply chain officer, you've got to think through what's the language of the boardroom and the language of the board Room is no. A load of technical crazy supply chain language generates around shareholder value. So one of the things which I have you know well, with a number of companies is we talk about the language of trophic. Yeah, So how can you you know, people talk around here is an example and say, Oh, you know, we've got availability of 92% on dwindling again. It's a 95%. Well, what does that mean? You know, if you share that with people, it makes no sense. It'll they can't visualize what they're talking about, you know? So you get some crazy supply chain language which is going on which nobody understands. You know, I got quote once. Unfortunately, your S K you did not arrive within the lead time due to a problem in the safety stock calculation following our recent collaborative partnership moved to production postponement. You know what we talking about? Wait, what we have to do. Language of prophet says things like right, You know, you go to a company and say, Hey, I can I can improve availability from 92 to 95 cents. What does that mean? If the language of profit you turn around and you say how long? A minute of the moment. You're losing £100,000 in sales per year or whatever, I can help you reduce that loss to £50,000. All that might be doing is taking it from 92% to 95% but using language that people can relate to. So, you know, one of the things that becomes really true in this whole area is that you have to start using the right language within the business. You need to develop that language and back off from supply chain I think it was a good quote from the founder of Algae on, the founder of Alby said, The change your language and you change your faults, which I thought, Yeah, that's interesting, but I've adapted that If you change your language, you change your force. If you change your thoughts, you change the culture often. That's what we're trying to do with this flight games to train some sort of cultural change. So So, in a way, you know, if we're going back to the question which is around, what does a you know, a supply chief supply chain off, sir. Need they need that breaths of experience. They also need a bit of special ism in certain areas. But you've got to also, I would argue, be able to troll the right language. So you need to think about the language of the business, the language of the board room in order to make this work. So you know, that's what one of the the key things that you do need to think through is you're doing this.

Radu Palamariu:   46:00
Thank you very much, Professor, for joining us. It's been a great session and really appreciate all the sharing and stories that you had for us today. Thank you very much indeed. Thank you for listening. If you like what you heard, we should to go to www dot elka global dot com and treat the focus button for all the show. Notes of the interview also subscribed our mailing list to get our latest updates. First, if you're listening through a streaming platform like iTunes Spotify arts teacher, we would appreciate a kind view. Five Star works best to keep us going and our production team happy and, of course, share it with your friends. I most active on Lincoln, so do feel free to follow me. And if you have any suggestions on what what to do and hooting by next, don't hesitate to drop me a note. And if you're looking to hire top executives and supply chain or transform your business, of course, contact us as well to find out how we can help