Tips for Choosing a Worthwhile Charity

In this episode, Yasmine Vaughan and Dr. Laura Horvath discuss how donors can make better decisions when investing their money in charitable giving. How to recognize red flags and warning signs, versus indicators that a nonprofit organization is trustworthy and worthwhile.
Special Guest Gillian Wagner, Global Impact.

Of further interest on the topic of this episode is a Ted Talk and studies on charitable giving referenced during the discussion. You can find links to these things for more information below.  

Transcript

Optimistic Voices Podcast

Season 1, Episode 2 July 12, 2022

Tips on How to Pick a Worthwhile Charity 

Transcript

00:00:07 The Voice of Optimism

Welcome to optimistic voices, a podcast of helping children worldwide.

We help children worldwide by strengthening and empowering families and communities.

This podcast is for people interested in deep conversations with thought leaders in the fields of Child welfare, global health and international missions.

00:00:34 Yasmine Vaughan

Welcome to the HW optimistic Voices Growth this podcast.

We're your hosts Yasmine Vaughn.

00:00:40 Laura Horvath

And Laura Horvath.

00:00:42 Yasmine Vaughan

In this episode we will talk about what you should consider when choosing a charity or nonprofit to donate to.  

In the United States alone, there are 1,8,000,000 tax-exempt organizations and this includes everything from churches and cultural centers to food banks and disaster relief organizations.

With all of these options, it can be overwhelming to decide where to give.

So, in this episode we want to help our listeners learn how to find a charity to donate to that matches with your values, learn how to tell if an organization is actually making an impact in the world, and learn how to tell the difference between organizations that you should and should not donate to.

On with us today is Gillian Wagner from Global Impact. It’s an organization that works to inspire greater giving for global causes.

Welcome, Gillian.

00:01:30 Gillian Wagner

Thanks for having me.

00:01:31 Yasmine Vaughan

Well, I want to share with you guys a little bit about what inspired us to do this episode.

This came out of an interaction that I had probably a couple of months ago.

The power was out in my building and so I was working from a coffee shop and a young man walked into the coffee shop. He was dressed in a Polo and slacks. You know, relatively business casual dressed, clean cut haircut.

You know, very nice-looking fella.

And he was selling paintings to people in the Coffee shop. So he was going around from table to table and People were either waving him away or giving him a few dollars in exchange for actually what I thought were some pretty hideous paintings, but he came over to my table and said, you know, “hi, I'm - shared his name.” And then said that he was raising money to support Christian missionaries in China, so he asked if I would be willing to donate and I said no, I don't want to give this time, but is it possible for me to get your Website information so that I could give online and he said yes.

He gave me the information and I did a Google search of his organization and found out that it was associated with a cult outside of South Korea.

As I was sitting there, I was thinking to myself, Oh my goodness, like these poor people in this restaurant think that they're giving to Christian missionaries and have just donated money to a cult.

00:02:55 Yasmine Vaughan

What would they think if they knew that that's what happened to them?

00:02:58 Yasmine Vaughan

So flash forward a week later I was telling this story to my friends over dinner and a friend of mine said, you know it would have never occurred to me to ask for his website information.

00:03:09 Yasmine Vaughan

It would have never occurred to me to try to look into this organization to see if they were reputable, or if my money was going to the right place.

00:03:15 Yasmine Vaughan

And I realized that being in the nonprofit sector in this environment, we do a lot of research on our side to determine what organizations we want to work with and partner with and therefore we have a lot of information that people don't have, we want to share that with others. 

Alongside that I was doing a little bit of research on charitable giving in the United States and according to the Black Bot Institute, 18 million individuals donated to charity in 2021 and the average amount donated was over $800. People are generally, very generous. The Indiana University School of Philanthropy publishes a report every year called Giving USA and their 2021 report showed that $471 billion was donated to US charities in 2020 and, adjusting for inflation, the total amount given 2 charities has increased 3.8%. 

So, despite the pandemic, people who donate to charity have continued to increase in their generosity. However, the number of people who donate to charities has declined over the last 20 years.

And part of this is due to things like economic hardship and, you know, income restrictions and inflation and things like that, but empathy and compassion and interpersonal trust also play a really big role in why people decide to donate money instead of spending or saving it.

00:04:39 Yasmine Vaughan

Trust in philanthropic organizations has been declining, and particularly for those who are under the age of 30, it has really been declining.

People who are very generous don't tend to do their research and people who are not very generous don't give because they don't feel that they can trust organizations.

00:04:58 Laura Horvath

Yaz and I have been actually having this conversation for some time because, you know, as a small charity that does work really hard to be financially accountable and transparent, and so that donors can trust where their money is going.

Organizations that aren't as transparent and honest about that really give us a bad name and make it hard for us.

Doing, can you tell us a little bit about what global impact does and how the work of global impact can help donors be smarter about where they give their charitable and up donations?

00:05:29 Gillian Wagner

Absolutely! Thanks so much Yasmin and Laura for having me on today's global impacts mission is all 

We work to grow global philanthropy and build partnerships and resources to help the world most vulnerable people.

We are what's called a workplace giving Federation charity.

So we represent an alliance with nearly 100 leading international charities that includes helping children worldwide.

And these organizations work across all of the causes that you care about like clean water, global health, education and more.

00:06:02 Laura Horvath

That's so cool.

So if I understand correctly, if I want to like, maybe make a donation to a cause I care about and have that come right out of maybe my paycheck at work, then as long as it's an organization that global impact has looked into that I can be sure that the money that's being pulled out of my paycheck and donated toward the cause I selected is legitimate and the money is going where it's supposed to be going and all of that is that how that works.

00:06:27 Gillian Wagner

Workplace giving is great.

It's also called employee giving sometimes and it's a way for employees to make charitable contributions at work, typically through like you were saying, payroll deduction. It's all about confidence, convenience, and collective impact when we talk about workplace.

So you've got that confidence that the charities that are available to you through your employer that you can donate to.

You are vetted as legitimate non-profit organizations and I think we're going to talk in a little bit about what that means and how to keep an eye out for that, and it's super convenient because you get to make your choice of who you want to support and how much you want to support it and then all you have to do is donate through your employer's online giving portal.

00:07:05

And then once that payroll production begins, you're giving consistently throughout the year, and it's easy to make small regular contributions and watch those add up really quickly.

00:07:14 Gillian Wagner

And then I always like to add as a bonus and we can talk more about how to leverage this later, but many companies offer matching gift opportunities to really maximize the impact of your Gift.

00:07:23 Laura Horvath

I think as we get further into this conversation, we want to help our listeners to understand some important terms that get used.

00:07:32 Laura Horvath

And when we talk about donations and charitable giving, so can you kind of walk us through some important.

00:07:39 Laura Horvath

Items that we need to know what they are.

00:07:41 Laura Horvath

And understand what they do.

00:07:43 Laura Horvath

So Gillian, when people are thinking about making donations on a regular basis or even one time donations to maybe a nonprofit that's associated with the causes they care about.

00:07:54 Laura Horvath

What are some things?

00:07:55 Laura Horvath

What are some things they need to know about when they're starting to do that research?

00:08:00 Gillian Wagner

Yeah, it's really important that you do your homework and understand you know where are you giving your money to and why are.

00:08:05 Gillian Wagner

You giving it to them.

00:08:06 Gillian Wagner

And there are a couple of tools that you can leverage.

00:08:08 Gillian Wagner

To help make sure that you feel confident in your choice.

00:08:10 Gillian Wagner

So the first is that registered nonprofit organization status I mentioned, so you're going to be looking for 501C3 status. That is a tax code status that denotes that an organization is a registered nonprofit that is recognized as tax exempt by the IRS because they are exclusively for a charitable purpose, another great tool you're going to want to look for is something called a Nine-Ninety form completed annually by a 501C3 organization to maintain a report on their Tax exempt status.

Plus those are publicly available and they include information on leadership of an organization and their assets, expenses, things like that.

00:08:48 Gillian Wagner

So those are two really great places to get started to ensure that the organization that you're supporting is legitimate and reputable with their finances, and they have that accountability and transparency.

00:08:58 Laura Horvath

That's really helpful information to share Gillian. I'm so glad that you did. A lot of our listeners know that HCW helping children worldwide. It is a 501C 3 and we do go through a process annually where an outside independent auditor comes in.

00:09:12 Laura Horvath

Every year they spend three years, 3 three years (laugh) It feels like three years - they spend 3 days combing through our financial documents and making sure that everything is up to standard. And then the report that they release at the end is a 990.

(Addendum from HCW – it’s called the Annual Report of Audited Financial Statements, a second audit team uses the same verified information to generate the 990 Tax Return – both are on our website.)

00:09:27 Laura Horvath

And we think this thing is so important that we publish our 990 every year on our website so donors can just go right to our website. They can look at our financials year by year and understand where every single dollar.

00:09:40 Laura Horvath

Is going and it's I think that's really important for people to know because I think if you are donating money through a nonprofit, even a 501C3.

00:09:50 Laura Horvath

If they don't make their 990's just easily available to you, I think that should be a.

00:09:55 Laura Horvath

Little bit of a yellow flag.

00:09:56 Gillian Wagner

And Laura, I love that helping children worldwide has that information readily available on your website.

00:10:01 Gillian Wagner

It makes it so easy for.

00:10:03 Gillian Wagner

Donors to go and do their homework and double.

00:10:04 Gillian Wagner

Back if you're looking for other places to review nonprofit organizations, I have two recommendations, Charity Navigator and GuideStar are good options, so they Charity Navigator rates charities based on financial health and accountability and transparency and then GuideStar lets you view nonprofit data like nine 90s leadership information.

00:10:24 Gillian Wagner

Program work.

00:10:25 Gillian Wagner

And more, but it's always a really good sign when an organization puts that information forward, right?

00:10:31 Gillian Wagner

Available on their website and easy to find.

00:10:34 Gillian Wagner

It helps you.

00:10:34 Gillian Wagner

Know that they really stand behind what they do and where they put their money.

00:10:38 Yasmine Vaughan

I will add in that I think.

00:10:39 Yasmine Vaughan

It's GuideStar has recently changed their name to candid, so if you're if you've never heard of this organization.

00:10:45 Yasmine Vaughan

Before and you're looking for it.

00:10:46 Yasmine Vaughan

And you're like where the heck is that?

00:10:48 Yasmine Vaughan

It's it's changes.

00:10:49 Yasmine Vaughan

It's coming under an umbrella organization called Candid, which does a lot of work with nonprofits and nonprofit organizations.

00:10:56 Yasmine Vaughan

You do have to have an account.

00:10:58 Yasmine Vaughan

With godstar to view some of the more granular documents.

00:11:01 Yasmine Vaughan

But if you're just trying to find out if the organization that you're thinking

00:11:04 Yasmine Vaughan

About donating to is.

00:11:06 Laura Horvath

Even real.

00:11:07 Yasmine Vaughan

And even has any sort of financial accountability.

00:11:10 Yasmine Vaughan

Then a quick search typing in the name of the organization, and then GuideStar usually will pull up some information to guide you on that.

00:11:18 Laura Horvath

Helping children worldwide has both a candid rating and a Charity Navigator rating, and we curate that every single year we provide updated information to it, and we have the very very highest ratings.

00:11:30 Laura Horvath

That you can get on those accrediting sites and we work really hard to keep those ratings.

00:11:35 Laura Horvath

And it's not easy to do and so I think it is.

00:11:38 Laura Horvath

Those are two great options for donors to to check that I would.

00:11:43

I would.

00:11:43 Laura Horvath

Sort of recommend that people, when you're when you're looking at an organization website and they have on there that they have a Charity Navigator rating.

00:11:52 Laura Horvath

Lots of times people will just see oh they have a Charity Navigator rating and they'll move on and I would encourage people to click on the link or to go separately to Charity Navigator or to candid.

00:12:03 Laura Horvath

And and actually check that out.

00:12:05 Laura Horvath

It's really easy to put that on your website and have that information actually not exist.

00:12:11 Laura Horvath

For example, we know of 1 organization.

00:12:14 Laura Horvath

That has on their website that they have a Charity Navigator rating, but if you follow that link their rating is actually a bronze, which is not the highest rating.

00:12:24 Laura Horvath

I think Platinum is the highest rating you can get.

00:12:26 Laura Horvath

Their information has not been updated in more than 10 years.

00:12:29 Laura Horvath

It's also incomplete, but if I'm just looking at the website and I see the word Charity Navigator on the website.

00:12:35 Laura Horvath

I think this is a legitimate organization.

00:12:37 Laura Horvath

You have to follow the link.

00:12:39 Laura Horvath

You have to look at their financials.

00:12:40 Laura Horvath

You have to dig a little bit deeper.

00:12:42 Laura Horvath

Another organization that's out there specifically for Christian nonprofits.

00:12:47 Laura Horvath

That's another accrediting body is called the ECF A.

00:12:51 Laura Horvath

This stands for the Evangelical Council for Financial Accountability, and they do exactly the same thing.

00:12:57 Laura Horvath

They accredit nonprofits based on financial accountability, transparency.

00:13:03 Laura Horvath

Which is are they being transparent about where your money is going and what it's doing fund raising?

00:13:08 Laura Horvath

How much revenue do they bring in and board governance?

00:13:11 Laura Horvath

I think I think Charity Navigator also looks at board governance and that's an important thing too.

00:13:16 Laura Horvath

You want to understand how an organization is being governed, governed and that that is being done in a legitimate and transparent.

00:13:24 Yasmine Vaughan

Yeah, so we just shared a lot of information and threw out a lot of terms for those of.

00:13:29 Yasmine Vaughan

You who are unfamiliar, you're probably.

00:13:31 Yasmine Vaughan

Swimming in them at this point.

00:13:33 Yasmine Vaughan

So a quick recap is when you're looking for.

00:13:36 Yasmine Vaughan

An organization to donate to.

00:13:37 Yasmine Vaughan

First check and see if they are an actual.

00:13:41 Yasmine Vaughan

IRS registered nonprofit organization. They have that 501C3 tax code status. Next step is usually on.

00:13:50 Yasmine Vaughan

Their website.

00:13:51 Yasmine Vaughan

There'll be a section usually under their about section that sends financials and so look and see if they have their latest 990 forms or if there's something on their website that says 990.

00:14:02 Yasmine Vaughan

Coming soon so that you can see.

00:14:04 Yasmine Vaughan

Where their money is going and that they.

00:14:06 Yasmine Vaughan

Have done the the work to.

00:14:07 Yasmine Vaughan

Be registered for tax.

00:14:08 Yasmine Vaughan

Since you can also check Charity Navigator GuideStar or the FCA, if it's a Christian organization.

00:14:15 Yasmine Vaughan

To see how.

00:14:15 Yasmine Vaughan

These organizations rate not only their financial transparency, but there.

00:14:21 Yasmine Vaughan

From there, the balance between their administrative spending and their actual program spending is most of your money going to be going to an organization that is spending a lot on overhead costs or going directly to the cause that you're hoping to support.

00:14:37 Yasmine Vaughan

And there's some.

00:14:38 Yasmine Vaughan

Some tensions with that as well, which we'll talk about a little bit.

00:14:42 Yasmine Vaughan

But so that that encompasses a lot of the financial things that you can look into to make sure that what you're donating to is a good cause.

00:14:51 Yasmine Vaughan

But what are the steps Jillian that you would say you should take when you're trying to even find a place you might want to donate to?

00:14:59 Gillian Wagner

The most important first step is to find what you're passionate about, right?

00:15:02 Gillian Wagner

I think a lot of us have kind of an innate pull towards A cause or set of causes that really speak to us, but for some of us it might take a little bit of reflecting to figure out where you want to start.

00:15:12 Gillian Wagner

Or maybe you have too many things that you care about, and so it's about narrowing it down.

00:15:16 Gillian Wagner

I always recommend people start with examining what are my core values.

00:15:20 Gillian Wagner

What are my beliefs and what are my priorities?

00:15:22 Gillian Wagner

When you start.

00:15:23 Gillian Wagner

To think those through, you'll see patterns come.

00:15:27 Gillian Wagner

You know, when I was younger my mom, I was trying to figure out what I wanted to do with my career and.

00:15:31 Gillian Wagner

My mom recommended pay.

00:15:33 Gillian Wagner

Attention to the things that you're drawn to.

00:15:35 Gillian Wagner

Look at the news.

00:15:36 Gillian Wagner

Verticals that you find yourself reading over and over again.

00:15:39 Gillian Wagner

What are the stories that really pull at your heartstrings?

00:15:42 Gillian Wagner

I have a friend who likes to say what makes you cry, what makes you?

00:15:45 Gillian Wagner

Tear up thinking about those things and reflecting on how they fit into your values and and your beliefs and how you live your.

00:15:52 Gillian Wagner

Life will help you kind of identify that first place and then from there picking and choosing OK, what am I going to prioritize?

00:16:00 Gillian Wagner

What's going to be my primary goal for my giving plan this year?

00:16:04 Gillian Wagner

My next recommendation is to dive in and do your research so with the tools that we've been talking about today, thinking about finding an organization that addresses the causes that you've identified as as your priority area.

00:16:16 Gillian Wagner

I have a couple recommendations here, so first is to look for affiliations and groups based on your identified causes that link lots of organizations together as a good.

00:16:25 Gillian Wagner

Place to start doing your research.

00:16:27 Gillian Wagner

So for example, in workplace giving programs federations like global impacts and others, we often typically organize our membership around.

00:16:36 Laura Horvath

Type of cause so a.

00:16:38 Gillian Wagner

Global impact.

00:16:39 Gillian Wagner

All of our charities are focused on addressing the most critical global causes, so anyone interested in international giving can go check out global impact, which is why helping children worldwide is in our charity alliance.

00:16:50 Gillian Wagner

There are other ways to search by cause type Givewell and Charity Navigator have resources broken down by cause.

00:16:57 Gillian Wagner

Local news outlets are also a good go to.

00:17:00 Gillian Wagner

Obviously they're great for finding local organizations, but I also see local news organizations highlighting giving options during natural, national and international crises, natural disasters, and other kinds of emergencies, and then finally, when you're ready to take all the tools that we've shared with you today going and doing a Google search.

00:17:18 Gillian Wagner

Can absolutely be a great way of finding organizations, just as long as you're putting on your critical thinking hat and doing your homework here.

00:17:27 Yasmine Vaughan

Yeah, thank you Jillian and uh.

00:17:29 Yasmine Vaughan

I think we talked a little bit.

00:17:31 Yasmine Vaughan

About this, but

00:17:32 Yasmine Vaughan

Uhm, it's it's it.

00:17:34 Yasmine Vaughan

Seems sort of overwhelming like, oh, I just wanted to find somewhere to give, you know, 20 bucks around Christmas time.

00:17:39 Yasmine Vaughan

This is a lot of work to put into it, but people put a lot of work in determining where they put their retirement funds, where they put other investments, and when you are giving money to a charity, you're still investing in.

00:17:52 Yasmine Vaughan

Something you're investing in an organization.

00:17:54 Yasmine Vaughan

You're investing in A cause.

00:17:56 Yasmine Vaughan

So really doing that homework to determine where you want to give can be so important and really does not have to take that long.

00:18:03 Gillian Wagner

Absolutely giving is an investment.

00:18:05 Gillian Wagner

I love that you said it like that and it it it warrants our due diligence and our research and it also helps you feel more committed to the organizations and the causes that you support.

00:18:17 Gillian Wagner

My last piece of advice on this is if you're interested in supporting an organization, but you want to confirm that they were the right investment.

00:18:23 Gillian Wagner

For you sign up for their newsletter.

00:18:26 Gillian Wagner

Follow them on social media.

00:18:27 Gillian Wagner

Read their reports.

00:18:28 Gillian Wagner

It's a great way to observe their work.

00:18:30 Gillian Wagner

Learn more about the programs that you're supporting, and.

00:18:33 Gillian Wagner

Make sure that this is where.

00:18:34 Gillian Wagner

This is where you want your investment to go.

00:18:36 Laura Horvath

I love that and I love that that what that does is it engages people not just in giving a donation to a worthy organization.

00:18:44 Laura Horvath

You know they've done the research and they vetted them and they know that the money is going.

00:18:49 Laura Horvath

Where it it?

00:18:50 Laura Horvath

They're being told that it's going, but if you're following that organization also on social media, if you're reading their newsletter, if you're just.

00:18:56 Laura Horvath

Kind of tracking along with them.

00:18:58 Laura Horvath

Then you're not just writing a check or make.

00:19:00 Laura Horvath

Being a PayPal donation or what have you, you're actually, you know, becoming more engaged in understanding the work that they do and and being able to measure their impact and see the the impact that your moment that your money is having.

00:19:14 Laura Horvath

And I think that's an important part of charitable giving.

00:19:17 Laura Horvath

Most organizations aren't just looking to try to get money out of you.

00:19:20 Laura Horvath

They actually want you to care about their cause.

00:19:23 Laura Horvath

And understand the impact that your money is having through their work.

00:19:28 Laura Horvath

So I think that's really good advice.

00:19:30 Laura Horvath

How do we measure impact?

00:19:32 Yasmine Vaughan

Yeah, that's a.

00:19:33 Yasmine Vaughan

Great point as well as it's trying to figure out if your if your organization really is going to.

00:19:37 Yasmine Vaughan

Make the impact.

00:19:38 Yasmine Vaughan

That you're hoping that it's going to make.

00:19:40 Yasmine Vaughan

You know you've found a.

00:19:41 Yasmine Vaughan

'cause that you're very interested in.

00:19:42 Yasmine Vaughan

And and it really moves your heart.

00:19:44 Yasmine Vaughan

But you're wondering, you know?

00:19:45 Yasmine Vaughan

Is this is my money really going to accomplish what I'm hoping it will accomplish?

00:19:49 Yasmine Vaughan

Somebody things are really difficult to measure, especially when it comes to.

00:19:55 Yasmine Vaughan

A lot of nonprofits or.

00:19:56 Yasmine Vaughan

Moving towards this movement of being sustainable, we're not just giving a man a fish.

00:20:02 Yasmine Vaughan

We're teaching Amanda Fish and things like that can be really difficult to measure because they they take a while and the.

00:20:09 Yasmine Vaughan

The long term impact.

00:20:10 Yasmine Vaughan

Can can be difficult to see.

00:20:12 Yasmine Vaughan

And that's another reason why I like taking a look at an organization newsletter.

00:20:16 Yasmine Vaughan

Keeping up with them over time can really help.

00:20:19 Yasmine Vaughan

Another way to see like their impact is to see what organizations that they are affiliated with.

00:20:25 Yasmine Vaughan

So we talked about like financial organizations like GuideStar and Charity Navigator, but affiliations with other organizations.

00:20:35 Yasmine Vaughan

That are sort of groups, so or like coalitions.

00:20:39 Yasmine Vaughan

So at helping children worldwide, we're a member of the Christian Alliance for Orphans, which is a humongous network of organizations that worked with orphaned and vulnerable children, were also a member of the Christian connections to International Health, which is another large organization of.

00:20:54 Yasmine Vaughan

Groups and individuals who are committed to providing health.

00:20:57 Yasmine Vaughan

Care and global health from a Christian.

00:20:59 Yasmine Vaughan

Perspective and most.

00:21:00 Yasmine Vaughan

Of these organizations require pretty stringent applications.

00:21:05 Yasmine Vaughan

You have to update.

00:21:06 Yasmine Vaughan

Your to pay.

00:21:06 Yasmine Vaughan

Dues and with that you get you know lots of benefits in terms of networking and advocacy and resources and things.

00:21:14 Yasmine Vaughan

But seeing that an organization is not just working on.

00:21:16 Yasmine Vaughan

Its own but.

00:21:17 Yasmine Vaughan

Has an entire network of other organizations that are supporting them is a really good way to see if if your money is going to.

00:21:24 Yasmine Vaughan

Make really good impact.

00:21:26 Laura Horvath

Yeah, I think that's really important.

00:21:28 Laura Horvath

Yeah, it's because organizations like the ones you've listed, Christian Alliance for orphans and the.

00:21:33 Laura Horvath

Christian connections for international health.

00:21:35 Laura Horvath

These are organizations that are not going to partner with organizations that aren't operating at the very, you know, kind of highest level of transparency and financial accountability because they're not going to attach their name to an organization like that, and so you know, there are some great little small organizations out there, but if they're.

00:21:53 Laura Horvath

Also kind of plugged into these larger, globally recognized organizations.

00:21:58 Laura Horvath

Then you know that they've been fully vetted, and I think that's really important.

00:22:02 Laura Horvath

I think you still have to be really careful about things in terms of.

00:22:07 Laura Horvath

You know it's easy to get a donation for a one off if you you know.

00:22:14 Laura Horvath

Say, for example, want to donate to building a well or something like that.

00:22:18 Laura Horvath

There's that's a great thing to donate to, but it's a one off and one thing you might want to consider is looking for programs that are built.

00:22:26 Laura Horvath

To be sustainable.

00:22:28 Laura Horvath

It's not just feed people for a day.

00:22:30 Laura Horvath

But build the capacity of local people to to stand on their own to.

00:22:35 Laura Horvath

Have the dignity and independence of being able to care for themselves and finding ways to empower them to do that.

00:22:40 Laura Horvath

And as yet, yes has said that's a harder thing to track unless you're developing a relationship with the charitable organization that you're choosing to support, and so it's just something to think about.

00:22:51 Laura Horvath

If contributing your charitable dollars.

00:22:54 Laura Horvath

If you want to do that in a long term and meaningful way, then you need to think about programs that are trying to be self sustainable and build independence in people and not create dependence.

00:23:05 Laura Horvath

One thing I want to talk about is this issue.

00:23:08 Laura Horvath

I think as you brought it up earlier in the conversation where you talk about where you want to look at the balance.

00:23:14 Laura Horvath

Of administrative costs and program costs.

00:23:18 Laura Horvath

So how much of your donor dollar is being spent on what we call over?

00:23:24 Laura Horvath

Ahead and how much is going directly to recipients, and I think that donors have this sense that 100% of their money should.

00:23:32 Laura Horvath

Go to the.

00:23:33 Laura Horvath

People in need.

00:23:35 Laura Horvath

Jillian or yes, do either one of you want to kind of comment on why that might not be the best way to approach it?

00:23:42 Gillian Wagner

Yeah, absolutely, that's a big question to ask and I I suppose maybe the first question you want to ask yourself.

00:23:47 Gillian Wagner

Is where do.

00:23:48 Gillian Wagner

I want my money going and.

00:23:50 Gillian Wagner

And what do they need to do to make that change happen?

00:23:54 Gillian Wagner

And I think helping children.

00:23:56 Gillian Wagner

Worldwide is a great example of this, because when you think about your child reintegration.

00:24:00 Gillian Wagner

You have people.

00:24:01 Gillian Wagner

Who are doing case management?

00:24:03 Gillian Wagner

You have people who are providing counseling and training and helping children integrate into families and and build happy, thriving family units.

00:24:11 Gillian Wagner

Who do you need to make that happen?

00:24:13 Gillian Wagner

You need the best of the best.

00:24:16 Gillian Wagner

You need skilled, trained staff who.

00:24:19 Gillian Wagner

Know how to work with.

00:24:20 Gillian Wagner

Children who know how to work with families and have the tools they need.

00:24:23 Gillian Wagner

To do that?

00:24:23 Gillian Wagner

Well and program staff personnel staff, that's an.

00:24:27 Gillian Wagner

Administrative cost and so.

00:24:29 Gillian Wagner

It's it's always difficult to draw out what is program cost and what is administrative cost, and sometimes the the reporting that we have on on an administrative cost versus program cost is it's tricky to define because you want to invest in staff capacity and staff training and you want.

00:24:50 Gillian Wagner

To have the best people available to be doing this great work and investing in this change and so administrative costs are not always just about.

00:25:01 Gillian Wagner

Fund raising, or, you know, travel and things like that.

00:25:05 Gillian Wagner

It's it's paying for great people who you need.

00:25:09 Gillian Wagner

To do this great work.

00:25:11 Yasmine Vaughan

That's an excellent point, Gillian.

00:25:13 Yasmine Vaughan

There's a really wonderful Ted talk called the way we think about charity is dead wrong, and for any of you listening who work in the nonprofit sector, I'm going to tell you now to.

00:25:22 Yasmine Vaughan

Not watch it.

00:25:23 Yasmine Vaughan

Because it will just make you angry.

00:25:25 Yasmine Vaughan

The premise of the episode is about how nonprofits and for profit.

00:25:32 Yasmine Vaughan

For age.

00:25:33 Yasmine Vaughan

And are treated differently if a for profit organization spends a lot of money on advertising and fund raising and and things like and paying their staff really well, then people don't really blink an eye at it.

00:25:47 Yasmine Vaughan

They think, oh.

00:25:48 Yasmine Vaughan

You know it's it's great.

00:25:49 Yasmine Vaughan

That Coca Cola puts out these ads.

00:25:51 Yasmine Vaughan

It's fine that.

00:25:52 Yasmine Vaughan

They do that because then they make.

00:25:53 Yasmine Vaughan

More money as a result of these things, but non profits are not expected to operate under the same rule.

00:25:59 Yasmine Vaughan

Rules they're expected to have, you know, low paying staff because they are, you know, these people are are doing it out of the goodness of their hearts.

00:26:07 Yasmine Vaughan

They're expected to.

00:26:08 Yasmine Vaughan

Have to spend very little money on fund raising and other things because the money is supposed to.

00:26:12 Yasmine Vaughan

Go to the.

00:26:14 Yasmine Vaughan

Programs and to the people that are being helped in the communities that they're serving, but.

00:26:19

If you you.

00:26:20 Yasmine Vaughan

Gotta spend money to make money in certain ways.

00:26:23 Yasmine Vaughan

Measuring an organization just on its administrative costs versus its program costs isn't going to give you a complete picture of the work.

00:26:31 Yasmine Vaughan

That they're doing.

00:26:32 Yasmine Vaughan

And of course, as Laura was saying, the tension of an organization that spends 100% a 100% of your donation goes to.

00:26:40 Yasmine Vaughan

Programs means that they aren't able to recruit the staff that they need to run these organizations.

00:26:46 Yasmine Vaughan

The ads dealing.

00:26:46 Yasmine Vaughan

With saying the highly trained and educated staff that know how to do the work.

00:26:51 Yasmine Vaughan

Really well and have the time.

00:26:53 Yasmine Vaughan

To do the work really well people.

00:26:55 Yasmine Vaughan

I mean, even people who work for nonprofits need to make money to put food on.

00:26:59 Yasmine Vaughan

Their tables and.

00:27:00 Yasmine Vaughan

You're you're still assisting.

00:27:01 Yasmine Vaughan

You're giving somebody an opportunity to work and to.

00:27:05 Yasmine Vaughan

To to give.

00:27:06 Gillian Wagner

And I think the key here is transparency, right?

00:27:08 Gillian Wagner

Because if an organization is transparent about where their money goes, it's just that they're trustworthy and it shows that they really stand behind the kinds of financial decisions that they're making.

00:27:18 Gillian Wagner

And so again, if you have any questions about, well, you know why is your administrative costs, you know, broken down like this and you know you can go to the organization.

00:27:27 Gillian Wagner

Website and find that information and use the tools online.

00:27:30 Gillian Wagner

Global you to you to make sure that you feel comfortable with this decision and that.

00:27:34 Gillian Wagner

You you support the kinds of investments that they make.

00:27:37 Gillian Wagner

The transparency, I think is is.

00:27:39 Gillian Wagner

Really, the key around this?

00:27:40 Gillian Wagner

Pretty nuanced and pretty complex topic that we could probably do an entire other.

00:27:44 Gillian Wagner

Podcast episode about.

00:27:46 Laura Horvath

And maybe we will I.

00:27:48 Laura Horvath

Think I think this is really important. I I know that when I look at organizations and I see on their website, you know or they're promoting this idea that 100% of their you know of the donations go directly to programs.

00:28:00 Laura Horvath

That's a bit of a red flag for me, because in the back of my mind I'm thinking you know often in non profit.

00:28:06 Laura Horvath

Work, what you get are people who are smart.

00:28:09 Laura Horvath

And well meaning.

00:28:10 Laura Horvath

But aren't necessarily skilled in the work that they're engaged in doing, and it's important because you know, and your especially with the work like that.

00:28:19 Laura Horvath

Helping children worldwide does.

00:28:21 Laura Horvath

That's work with people.

00:28:22 Laura Horvath

I think we have an ethical and moral responsibility to make sure that those that are actually doing the work.

00:28:27 Laura Horvath

The skills they need to do it and and they are compensated.

00:28:31 Laura Horvath

You know, in a commensurate way, in the marketplace for doing that skilled work, because it's really important.

00:28:39 Laura Horvath

So I think that's that's a really important thing to just keep an eye out for.

00:28:42 Laura Horvath

And one other thing that occurred to me when we were talking about administrative budgets and and, you know, money that HKW has in our budget for, say fundraising because is.

00:28:51 Laura Horvath

Yes, points out it.

00:28:52 Laura Horvath

It costs money to make money and we do that in nonprofit because we're trying to raise money to support programs to help people.

00:28:59 Laura Horvath

So that's an important part of what we do.

00:29:01 Laura Horvath

HW has a travel budget, a lot of the travel that we do is international travel and it's it's not cheap.

00:29:08 Laura Horvath

But that's about visiting our programs and ensuring financial and programmatic transparency and being able to report back to donors that yes, the money that you're sending is continuing to do the work that we say that it that it is, and all that's just really important.

00:29:22 Laura Horvath

Part of ensuring that donors are getting that the best bang for their buck.

00:29:28 Laura Horvath

The way they would in.

00:29:29 Laura Horvath

Any investment that they're trying to make?

00:29:31 Yasmine Vaughan

And what it really comes?

00:29:32 Yasmine Vaughan

Down to is even if administrative.

00:29:34 Yasmine Vaughan

Costs are very high and program costs.

00:29:36 Yasmine Vaughan

Are a little bit.

00:29:37 Yasmine Vaughan

Lower it's not about.

00:29:40

The piece of the.

00:29:41 Yasmine Vaughan

Pie that it takes up, but how big the?

00:29:42 Yasmine Vaughan

Pie is and.

00:29:44 Yasmine Vaughan

The Ted talk.

00:29:45 Yasmine Vaughan

That I referenced does a really excellent.

00:29:46 Yasmine Vaughan

Job of illustrating this, but I'll I'll.

00:29:48 Yasmine Vaughan

Try to summarize here.

00:29:50 Yasmine Vaughan

You know if an organization spends $5000 and make $5000, then you know they're sort of just netting zero there.

00:30:00 Yasmine Vaughan

But if an organization spends $10,000 and they're able to make $100,000.

00:30:07 Yasmine Vaughan

Then you're talking about.

00:30:08 Yasmine Vaughan

A bigger piece of the pie in terms.

00:30:10 Yasmine Vaughan

Of what they're able to do with their programs.

00:30:12 Yasmine Vaughan

So yes, they may have higher administrative.

00:30:14 Yasmine Vaughan

Costs, but what they're able to?

00:30:16 Yasmine Vaughan

Do as a result.

00:30:18 Yasmine Vaughan

Of those high administrative costs is so much greater.

00:30:21 Laura Horvath

Yeah, I think that's a really important thing and it sort of does add a little bit to the amount of research a donor needs to do to dig down and understand.

00:30:30 Laura Horvath

That, but it's important and I keep I.

00:30:33 Laura Horvath

I want to keep using this this term of investments that you know how you're investing your charity dollar because I think people should take that as seriously as they take any other financial investment that they're making.

00:30:44 Laura Horvath

And we will.

00:30:45 Laura Horvath

I know Yaz kind of teased that those of us in the nonprofit world shouldn't watch that.

00:30:50 Laura Horvath

Ted talk, but we will put a link in the comments or so that you can access to it.

00:30:55 Laura Horvath

Get access to it because it's a great Ted talk that everybody I think should pay attention to.

00:31:00 Gillian Wagner

Because giving is an investment, I want to plug a few other notes that I have on building.

00:31:05 Gillian Wagner

What I kind of like to think about as your giving strategy.

00:31:08 Gillian Wagner

So one piece that I always recommend to folks is give regularly would why I love workplace giving and employee giving is because when you give it work you're giving over the course of an entire year and that's on average.

00:31:20 Gillian Wagner

Most employers have 26 pay periods.

00:31:23 Gillian Wagner

That's 26 contributions over the course of.

00:31:25 Gillian Wagner

An entire year.

00:31:27 Gillian Wagner

And those contributions are unrestricted and in the nonprofit world.

00:31:31 Gillian Wagner

That means that money can go wherever an organization needs to put that money the most.

00:31:35 Gillian Wagner

Giving that kind of consistency is a huge financial benefit for the organizations that you want to support.

00:31:42 Gillian Wagner

You also want to think about.

00:31:43 Gillian Wagner

If you're not going to give your round, or if you want to add in one off giving into your your plan, keep an eye out for maximum impact opportunities like matching gifts. So whether your company's workplace program offers a matching incentive for workplace.

00:31:59 Gillian Wagner

Nations, or if there's another corporate giving initiative.

00:32:01 Gillian Wagner

That's going on.

00:32:03 Gillian Wagner

Really, try to leverage that.

00:32:04 Gillian Wagner

Giving Tuesday is a great example here.

00:32:07 Gillian Wagner

Many organizations partner with companies to maximize the impact on that first Tuesday after Thanksgiving, and I personally think of it as free money for the organizations that you're supporting.

00:32:17 Gillian Wagner

So kind of leveraging those opportunities.

00:32:19 Gillian Wagner

As they arise, I also have a note about emergencies.

00:32:22 Gillian Wagner

We can't predict what kinds of emergencies will happen and when they will happen, but we know that they will.

00:32:29 Gillian Wagner

Happen, they are inevitable.

00:32:31 Gillian Wagner

And a great way to get ahead of an emergency is to support organizations that are deeply rooted in work to build resilient communities.

00:32:42 Gillian Wagner

So you can't.

00:32:44 Gillian Wagner

You can't always plan for when and where, but you know that they will happen, and so you know that you're doing good work when you are investing in.

00:32:51 Gillian Wagner

Organizations that are building local capacity investing in strengthening.

00:32:56 Gillian Wagner

Communities and when organizations have the right funding and the right staff and the local know how they're the best responders when an emergency does happen.

00:33:04 Gillian Wagner

And so you know, if you're someone who really is is drawn towards emergency giving, I do still think giving year round is a really great way to support that kind of disaster relief.

00:33:16 Gillian Wagner

An emergency work.

00:33:19 Laura Horvath

I think that's such a great point, and I know as a nonprofit we really appreciated what we call dedicated donors that give you know, kind of an incremental basis throughout the year.

00:33:28 Laura Horvath

I mean there are periods in our fund raising cycle where we get major donations.

00:33:34 Laura Horvath

End of year tends to be big donation time.

00:33:37 Laura Horvath

'cause people.

00:33:37 Laura Horvath

We'll do a.

00:33:38 Laura Horvath

A large end of year donations and we're always grateful for that too.

00:33:42 Laura Horvath

But when you do kind of a average, you know through the pay.

00:33:45 Laura Horvath

We check on a regular basis, then we know that money is coming and we know we can count on that money and that's really important in nonprofit work.

00:33:53 Laura Horvath

On the emergency issue, I love this too because I can give you an example.

00:33:58 Laura Horvath

So donors of powers who've been long term donors, regular donors of hours for years, years and years.

00:34:05 Laura Horvath

Reached out to us when the war broke out in Ukraine and now they know that it HKW doesn't currently do any work in that area of the world.

00:34:13 Laura Horvath

We don't have program staff on the ground there.

00:34:17 Laura Horvath

We don't work with families and children in that area and we and just we just haven't.

00:34:21 Laura Horvath

That's just not where we're located.

00:34:22 Laura Horvath

But donors have always reached out and said, hey, you know, we feel really called to make some kind of emergency donation to to children and families in crisis in that area of the world.

00:34:32 Laura Horvath

And we were able to say, because we're networked with these organizations, we were able to say, well.

00:34:37 Laura Horvath

You know, we we know of this organization that we're partnered with, and this organization and they've been working in that area of the world for years, and we know that they're there and they're ready to respond.

00:34:48 Laura Horvath

And so if you want to make a donation to them, we highly recommend them.

00:34:52 Laura Horvath

And so we have had several donors that have been able to do that, and we're happy to do that because in the end that just helps people, which is what we're after, and we don't feel like that pulls donor dollars away from us.

00:35:03 Laura Horvath

We feel like that what that does for our donors is demonstrate to them that we have a mission and a kind of higher purpose to helping families.

00:35:12 Laura Horvath

And and I, I hope makes us attractive as a charitable partner.

00:35:17 Gillian Wagner

Again, it gets back to this idea of leveraging sort of those professional connections and those networks, and looking for that partnership building.

00:35:25 Gillian Wagner

And we do a lot of that at global impact as well, making recommendations based on the organizations that we know are deeply rooted in these communities and deeply rooted in this kind of work and can respond.

00:35:37 Gillian Wagner

To the best of their ability in some of the toughest circumstances, so yeah.

00:35:42 Gillian Wagner

All all giving is is important and critical and it lifts up everyone in the sector absolutely.

00:35:49 Yasmine Vaughan

Yeah, yeah, absolutely.

00:35:52 Yasmine Vaughan

The this conversation reminded me, of course, as you were saying, there are always going to be emergencies in which people need immediate help and need immediate relief work.

00:36:02 Yasmine Vaughan

Immediate humanitarian intervention to prevent issues, but we talked earlier about sustainability and organizations that are doing sustainable work.

00:36:12 Yasmine Vaughan

So I wonder, Laura, if you would.

00:36:14 Yasmine Vaughan

Speak a little bit more to.

00:36:16 Yasmine Vaughan

Uhm organization.

00:36:18 Yasmine Vaughan

The difference between like relief, rehabilitation and development work within this sphere.

00:36:24 Laura Horvath

Yeah, so this gets a little bit into International Development and I won't take us too far off track as far as that goes, but I think you know when a crisis happens, there's often a relief response and that is entirely appropriate.

00:36:37 Laura Horvath

You know war breaks out.

00:36:39 Laura Horvath

There's a massive mudslide.

00:36:40 Laura Horvath

There's a pandemic or an earthquake.

00:36:43 Laura Horvath

A tsunami.

00:36:44 Laura Horvath

Something along those lines there is a relief response that needs to happen.

00:36:47 Laura Horvath

People need to be sort of taken care of in the moment and provide it with the the care that they need in the moment.

00:36:54 Laura Horvath

But then you have to start thinking more strategically in long term, relief is about tactical response.

00:36:59 Laura Horvath

It's about what do people need in a given moment of time.

00:37:02 Laura Horvath

But development thinks longer term and so after the crisis is over, we know there's going to be emergency.

00:37:08 Laura Horvath

Emergencies are inevitable, but they end.

00:37:12 Laura Horvath

And then what happens next?

00:37:13 Laura Horvath

Now the person is displaced from their home or they're displaced from their family.

00:37:18 Laura Horvath

You know, oftentimes we work with children that are separated from parental care.

00:37:22 Laura Horvath

How do we rehabilitate?

00:37:24 Laura Horvath

That situation, how do we bring the pieces back together again?

00:37:28 Laura Horvath

And so there are organizations like helping children worldwide that do that kind of work.

00:37:32 Laura Horvath

And then there's the.

00:37:32 Laura Horvath

Long term development piece which is also work that HW is engaged in.

00:37:37 Laura Horvath

And that is how.

00:37:38 Laura Horvath

Do we now that we've you know?

00:37:40 Laura Horvath

Sort of rescued the people out of crisis and we have rehabilitated or put the pieces back together.

00:37:46 Yasmine Vaughan

How do we build the?

00:37:47 Laura Horvath

Capacity and strengthen those people and communities so that when the crisis happens again, or when a crisis happens again, they're better able to sustain.

00:38:00 Laura Horvath

Themselves and need less help and so I think it's important when you think about charitable giving too.

00:38:06 Laura Horvath

To think about what part of that process are you trying to support?

00:38:11 Laura Horvath

And personally my my sense is that when a Ukraine, even the Ukraine Russia war breaks out, I probably want to make an emergency one time donation as a charitable donor.

00:38:26 Laura Horvath

But then I might.

00:38:26 Laura Horvath

I want to look at organizations that in that area that are going to.

00:38:30 Laura Horvath

Be doing the.

00:38:31 Laura Horvath

Next pieces and I might want to think about more long term sustained.

00:38:36 Laura Horvath

Giving that will help those organizations on the ground put the pieces back together, rebuild the communities and strengthen them so that people are better able to elicit with withstand a crisis when it happens, and I know that's a lot for people to think about, but again, we're talking about investing your charitable dollar and understanding.

00:38:56 Laura Horvath

What that money is doing and what you want it to do, and it's important.

00:39:00 Laura Horvath

When you're making those decisions that you have all the information that you possibly can.

00:39:04 Gillian Wagner

Laura, what I'm hearing from.

00:39:05 Gillian Wagner

You is that giving is about your head and your heart and marrying the two and thinking about.

00:39:12 Yasmine Vaughan

What's the right?

00:39:13 Gillian Wagner

Balance and so giving with your heart following your passion, the things that you care about and also you know.

00:39:20 Gillian Wagner

Using data and information to make informed strategic investments, and I think these things work really nicely together.

00:39:28 Gillian Wagner

They they don't counteract they.

00:39:30 Gillian Wagner

They build on each other.

00:39:32 Laura Horvath

Jillian, I love the way you said that I love that you said that this is about both your head and your heart because I think what happens a lot with people who are making charitable donations is they give with their heart.

00:39:42 Laura Horvath

And they're not pulling their head into it, and I think honestly, doing both of those things understanding I get definitely give.

00:39:52 Laura Horvath

Out of passion and compassion and the thing that's that's tugging your heart strains definitely follow that instinct that I think personally I think God putting that on your heart for a reason you should definitely follow that instead.

00:40:04 Laura Horvath

But I don't think that you're meant to do that kind of unconsciously.

00:40:08 Laura Horvath

I think it's important to understand where that's going and how the impact that's going to have, and frankly, that's going to be more rewarding if you make a donation and you track that organization and you understand how that money is being spent and how people are being empowered.

00:40:24 Laura Horvath

But then that I think is a more rewarding donation for you because you understand the impact of every dollar that you're donating and you deserve to know that.

00:40:34 Yasmine Vaughan

Yeah I totally agree.

00:40:35 Yasmine Vaughan

Working at this organization.

00:40:37 Yasmine Vaughan

Has shown me that people are.

00:40:39 Yasmine Vaughan

So incredibly generous, we can tell a.

00:40:41 Yasmine Vaughan

Story we can share.

00:40:44 Yasmine Vaughan

An information about a family or about a community being helped, or about someone being treated at the hospital and people are so generous to.

00:40:53 Yasmine Vaughan

Give based on on their experience and from hearing from us that trust is is.

00:40:58 Yasmine Vaughan

It's easy to build, but then trust is also really easy to have destroyed and we have seen organizations that have even like big name donors give to them and then end up being under FBI investigation for poor practices.

00:41:14 Yasmine Vaughan

Both financially and programmatic.

00:41:16 Yasmine Vaughan

Really, it can be overwhelming to think.

00:41:19 Yasmine Vaughan

Oh gosh, if I'm going to give money, I have to do all of this work to find out if I'm giving to the right place.

00:41:24 Yasmine Vaughan

But having those trusted people like Laura with saying donors approaching us and saying, do you know an organization in Ukraine that we can donate to?

00:41:32 Yasmine Vaughan

So building those relationships and and meeting people whose expertise?

00:41:36 Speaker 2

And and.

00:41:37 Yasmine Vaughan

At trust, you feel that you can give and I I again want to circle back to the the idea of development organizations that are working.

00:41:48 Yasmine Vaughan

Like we said before, to teach Amanda Fish not give Amanda Fish are such a a way to make an impact long term.

00:41:55 Yasmine Vaughan

I wonder as we were talking about.

00:41:57 Yasmine Vaughan

The idea of.

00:41:58 Yasmine Vaughan

Of giving with your heart and and also with your head, if we want to talk a little bit.

00:42:03 Yasmine Vaughan

About ethical storytelling and the the way that organizations present information regarding people that they serve that can.

00:42:12 Yasmine Vaughan

B as a as a nonprofit organization, we know how powerful people stories are and we love being able to share the good work that our donors are able to do.

00:42:23 Yasmine Vaughan

But we're also really mindful of how how sharing those stories.

00:42:27 Yasmine Vaughan

Can be potentially very negative.

00:42:30 Yasmine Vaughan

I recently listened to a webinar where.

00:42:33 Yasmine Vaughan

A young man was talking about visiting a slum in Kenya and he found this man in this slum who had passed out.

00:42:40 The Voice of Optimism

He was.

00:42:41 Yasmine Vaughan

Drunk and he had basically passed out in his own.

00:42:44 Yasmine Vaughan

Filth and the young man took.

00:42:46 Yasmine Vaughan

A photo of this.

00:42:48 Yasmine Vaughan

This guy passed out drunk on the in this slum and looking back on it, what he said was in that moment.

00:42:55 Yasmine Vaughan

I could have given to him but instead I took there's this aspect when it comes to.

00:43:01 Yasmine Vaughan

Storytelling, and when it comes to to how organizations present those who are in need of affirming the dignity of people.

00:43:09 Yasmine Vaughan

And I know.

00:43:10 Yasmine Vaughan

We could definitely do.

00:43:11 Yasmine Vaughan

We probably will do a whole other episode on ethical storytelling and that sort of thing, but.

00:43:17 Yasmine Vaughan

There's so much path there can be just as much passion in being positive as there isn't being negative, but helping join the worldwide.

00:43:24 Yasmine Vaughan

We try not to tell stories of look at this poor, emaciated child that you could help but look at this grandmother who's so happy because her child has a chance at life.

00:43:36 Yasmine Vaughan

Look at their smiling.

00:43:37 Yasmine Vaughan

They says look.

00:43:37 Yasmine Vaughan

What you have been able to do?

00:43:39 Laura Horvath

Yeah, I think we will.

00:43:41 Laura Horvath

Do an episode on ethical storytelling, 'cause I think it's super important, but I I'm glad that you raised it here because I think this is maybe one.

00:43:50 Laura Horvath

Easy way that donors can vet an organization in terms of whether or not they want to give their charitable.

00:43:56 Laura Horvath

Dollars because look.

00:43:58 Yasmine Vaughan

All of us.

00:43:58 Laura Horvath

Nonprofits out here are trying to raise money, and one of the ways that we raised money is to tell the stories of real people that are being served in the field, and it's super easy to take a picture of the.

00:44:10 Laura Horvath

You know, starving kid in the.

00:44:12 Laura Horvath

You know hole in the mud or whatever with his torn T shirt looking emaciated and say you know, don't you want to feed him?

00:44:19 Laura Horvath

We actually in the in our sector called that poverty **** and that seems like a really easy way to bring money in, but for me that's always a red flag because it's it.

00:44:29 Laura Horvath

It pictures people in very undignified ways.

00:44:32 Laura Horvath

It highlights their need instead of their their strengths and their capacity and their dignity and and what we find better is telling the story of the impact that you've had.

00:44:46 Laura Horvath

Like Jazz is saying, you know, here's this grandmother who's been reunited with this child who had been living on the streets and.

00:44:52 Laura Horvath

And how happy the two of them are together.

00:44:54 Laura Horvath

And here's this woman who was a petty trader.

00:44:57 Laura Horvath

You know basically just selling things in the marketplace, just to put enough, you know food on the table for the next.

00:45:02 Laura Horvath

Neil, who went through our microfinance training program and now runs a tailoring shop where she employs six other people.

00:45:10 Laura Horvath

That's the story we want to tell is the story that's saying your donor dollars are creating this this outcome?

00:45:16 Laura Horvath

This impact that's changed people's lives in a positive way, and it honors the dignity of these people.

00:45:21 Laura Horvath

Who are just?

00:45:23 Laura Horvath

You know they're struggling at a moment in time.

00:45:26 Laura Horvath

But they.

00:45:26 Laura Horvath

Have the capacity and.

00:45:28 Laura Horvath

We want to tell their story in a in.

00:45:29 Laura Horvath

A in a more positive way.

00:45:31 Gillian Wagner

I'm going to be the first one to listen to the Ethical storytelling podcast because I think this is such an important and fascinating conversation, and so for the listeners who are needing something to tide them over until.

00:45:44 Gillian Wagner

That podcast comes out.

00:45:46 Gillian Wagner

I think you can take what we've talked about today and start to apply that in the way that you approach which.

00:45:51 Gillian Wagner

Organizations you support and give to, and really again you know in this framework of of doing the best.

00:45:58 Gillian Wagner

Taking your head in your heart and combining the two and making a plan for what you're going to do for giving for this upcoming year and making sure.

00:46:06 Gillian Wagner

That you are.

00:46:07 Gillian Wagner

Supporting the causes that you care about.

00:46:09 Gillian Wagner

The organizations that you trust.

00:46:11 Gillian Wagner

And taking a look at this frame of what is their impact?

00:46:15 Gillian Wagner

What is the work that they're doing and how do I feel about?

00:46:18 Gillian Wagner

Supporting this work.

00:46:20 Gillian Wagner

And then we can.

00:46:21 Gillian Wagner

We can pick this up, find the ethical storytelling another day because there's just so much to talk about.

00:46:27 Gillian Wagner

It's been a real real pleasure.

00:46:28 The Voice of Optimism

Speaking with both of you about all of these things.

00:46:31 Yasmine Vaughan

Yes, thank you so much Jillian.

00:46:32 Yasmine Vaughan

I'm going to conclude with.

00:46:34 Yasmine Vaughan

A quote I just heard from Pastor Rick Warren, which says you can't care unless you are aware.

00:46:41 Yasmine Vaughan

If you don't know what.

00:46:43 Yasmine Vaughan

Organizations are out there.

00:46:45 Yasmine Vaughan

What communities?

00:46:46 Yasmine Vaughan

Are being served what people are being empowered and brought out of poverty and.

00:46:50

Illness and.

00:46:51 Yasmine Vaughan

All of the other horrible things.

00:46:53 Yasmine Vaughan

That haunt this.

00:46:54 Yasmine Vaughan

World, then you can't make it.

00:46:56 Yasmine Vaughan

In fact, and we we hope that people will grow in their generosity, not just in those who currently give but those who have maybe never given before, and are maybe interested after listening to those podcasts.

00:47:08 Yasmine Vaughan

Look for organizations that are taking action and are being successful in the action that they take and consider partnering with them.

00:47:15 Yasmine Vaughan

Thank you so much.

00:47:17 Gillian Wagner

Thanks so much for having me on both views.

00:47:18 Gillian Wagner

This is a great.

00:47:19 Gillian Wagner

Conversation today if you want.

00:47:20 Gillian Wagner

To learn more about global impact and figure out how you can support helping children worldwide at work, go to charity.org/give.

00:47:29 Gillian Wagner

That's where you can find all sorts of resources about how to give it work and and how to.

00:47:33 Gillian Wagner

Support great organizations like.

00:47:35 Gillian Wagner

Love you thanks so much everyone.

00:47:37 Laura Horvath

Thank you Jillian.

00:47:38 Yasmine Vaughan

Thank you bye bye.

00:47:41 The Voice of Optimism

Thanks for listening. If you enjoyed this episode, please subscribe share it with others post about it on social media or leave a rating and review to catch all the latest romance you can find us at helping children worldwide up on Instagram, LinkedIn, Twitter and Facebook. #optimistic voices.