Optimistic Voices
Vital voices in the fields of global health, global child welfare reform and family separation, and those intent on conducting ethical missions in low resource communities and developing nations. Join our hosts as they engage in conversations with diverse guests from across the globe, sharing optimistic views, experiences, and suggestions for better and best practices as they discuss these difficult topics.
Optimistic Voices
Rising Tides Catalyzing Change: Part 2. Beyond Orphanages: The Global Shift to Family-Based Care
The global movement to transition children from orphanages to families is gaining momentum, but significant challenges remain. In this thought-provoking episode, David Titus Moussa hosts a conversation with Stephen Usembe, a care leaver and founder of Kenya Society of Care Leavers, and Phil Aspergren, executive director of Casa Viva in Costa Rica, as they unpack key insights from the recent Rising Tide Conference.
Stephen shares his unique perspective as someone who grew up in institutional care, emphasizing the critical need for research and data to drive meaningful policy change. "When we know better, we have a responsibility to do better," he reminds us, highlighting how institutions isolate while families embrace. The experts discuss how poverty, misguided funding models, and entrenched attitudes continue to separate vulnerable children from families that could care for them with proper support.
Phil recounts a powerful story of transformation: when 26 adolescents in a well-run children's home were asked what they wanted most, every single one answered, "I want to live in a family." This led to a complete transition from institutional care to family placements for all 26 youth—proving that change is possible even in challenging circumstances. He challenges listeners who support orphanages not to withdraw funding, but instead to use their influence to ask important questions and encourage transition toward family-based solutions.
The conversation explores practical strategies for redire
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Travel on International Mission, meet local leadership and work alongside them. Exchange knowledge, learn from one another and be open to personal transformation. Step into a 25 year long story of change for children in some of the poorest regions on Earth.
https://www.helpingchildrenworldwide.org/mission-trips.html
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A bible study for groups and individuals, One Twenty-Seven: The Widow and the Orphan by Dr Andrea Siegel explores the themes of the first chapter of James, and in particular, 1:27. In James, we learn of our duty to the vulnerable in the historical context of the author. Order here or digital download
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Family Empowerment Advocates support the work of family empowerment experts at the Child Reintegration Centre, Sierra Leone. Your small monthly donation, prayers, attention & caring is essential. You advocate for their work to help families bring themselves out of poverty, changing the course of children's lives and lifting up communities. join
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Organize a Rooted in Reality mission experience for your service club, church group, worship team, young adult or adult study. No travel required. Step into the shoes of people in extreme poverty in Sierra Leone, West Africa, Helping Children Worldwide takes you into a world where families are facing impossible choices every day.
Contact support@helpingchildrenworldwide.org to discuss how.
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Helpingchildrenworldwide.org
Welcome to Optimistic Voices, a podcast of helping children worldwide. We help children worldwide by strengthening and empowering families and communities. This podcast is for people interested in deep conversations with thought leaders in the fields of child welfare, global health and international missions.
Speaker 2:Welcome to the Optimistic Voices podcast. I'm one of your regular hosts, dr Laura Horvath, but today I get to take a backseat and spend some time in the audience while my friend and colleague, david Titus Moussa guest hosts this episode. Welcome, david, it's great to have you here.
Speaker 4:Thanks very much for having me, Laura.
Speaker 2:I will take a minute to introduce David a little bit before handing the microphone over. David Moussa is the Senior Consultant for Reintegration at the Child Reintegration Center in Beau, Sierra Leone. But he's also a recognized thought leader in child welfare and specifically, in the transition of residential children's homes and orphanages to family-based care models across the continent of Africa.
Speaker 4:Thank you once more again, laura. This year's Rising Tide brought together top leaders from a number of different countries in the global north and the global south for a deep-dive conversation on how to continue to grow the impact of transition support services globally. With us today is Stephen Usembe, a professional social worker with skills, knowledge and experience working with children and young people without parental care and vulnerable families. Stephen is a care leaver himself, having grown in an orphanage in Kenya, and is a founder of Kenya Society of Care Leavers, now serving as the regional advocacy manager for open homes for children.
Speaker 4:Phil Aspergren is the executive director of Casa Viva. He and his wife, jill, co-founded the initiative in 2003 and continue to serve as directors. In 2005, they launched Casa Viva, costa Rica. Casa Viva seeks to expand the spectrum of alternatives for children who've been separated from their biological families through reunification, national adoption and short or long-term family-based foster care. Yes, at the Rising Tide, we know we had a lot of discussion points, but we have more to discuss. So, from you guys, what did you wish had been included in the discussions that we didn't get to, in the discussions that we didn't?
Speaker 5:get to. Yeah, thanks, thanks, david. The discussions, I mean we had, you know, two days to discuss. You know two decades of experiences and all that. So I feel like we did. I mean, within that short time we discussed a lot, but I feel like we touched briefly on research and this is a conversation that needs, you know, deeper exploration In many countries.
Speaker 5:You know the lack of robust, you know, research continues to hinder, you know, the efforts to drive this meaningful change. So, without solid data influencing policy and shifting perspectives, our times becomes much harder. So the question is, you know, how do we support and strengthen research to build an undeniable case for reform? And beyond that, we must also, you know, center the voices of children and young people with lived experiences. You know, collective efforts they're not just, let me say, passive recipients of care, but I believe that they are active participants, you know, active agents of the change that you want to see. You know, by truly listening to them, we don't just improve our interventions, we improve policies and standards. We also foster trust, you know, and accountability, ensuring that, you know, the solutions we advocate for genuinely actually meet their needs. So, at the heart of all this, I think it's a simple truth that change is most powerful when it's informed by evidence and driven by the people it's meant to serve.
Speaker 5:So I still feel like and it's a huge challenge within the region because participation know, participation, especially, you know, child participation, especially for children, you know, involving children is still still, we still have a long way to go to involve, you know, children who are in care. But you know, those two, two, two things I feel like were not adequately addressed but, as I say, I feel like you know we only had two days. As I say, I feel like you know we only had two days.
Speaker 6:Yeah Over to you, phil. Yeah, stephen, thank you for those comments, and you know I already had mentioned earlier in this podcast listening to the children and the importance of it, and then to hear you talk about listening to the voices of children and young people with lived care experience is different, because that is you. You were a person who have a care experience. You spent part of your childhood living in a children's home and so that's powerful to hear from you and a powerful reminder that we need to include those voices. You know, as one of the topics that I think would be important to include or, you know, to focus perhaps a future Rising Tides conference on, would be how we can shift the mindset of the North American church, the North American Christian, both Protestant and Catholic. We've talked about how well-intentioned people have actually led to the separation of children from their own biological families.
Speaker 6:Last week I was in a meeting with a missions pastor at a church who grew up in Eastern Africa and I was talking to her. She told me about her childhood very briefly and I was explaining what we were doing and talking about children's homes and the impact they have on children and how there's different ways we can do this. And all of a sudden she paused and said when I was eight years old, my brother dropped me off at an orphanage and he stayed with my mother and I stayed in that orphanage. When I was eight years old, my brother dropped me off at an orphanage and he stayed with my mother and I stayed in that orphanage until I was 17. And here she was working as a mission pastor in the United States of America and I didn't realize that care leaver experience that she had.
Speaker 6:Wow, how can North American churches come to understand the impact of separating children from family? How can we help them see that and make transitions? You know, unfortunately, what we're seeing is for every children's home that begins a process of transformation, of expanding their care options. We're seeing new children's home that begins a process of transformation, of expanding their care options. We're seeing new children's home projects being started. We're seeing new children's homes being built, and I have a meeting coming up here with an organization that is actively building a children's home with a mall, a shopping mall that will be part of their self-sustaining plan, which is very typical for children's homes to include some type of self-sustainability plan in the dream. But how can we reach the North American church, particularly that continues to not only fund ongoing orphanages but also to start new projects? That would be a huge topic to address in future Rising Tide conferences, david.
Speaker 4:Yeah, thank you, stephen. It's really a key topic shifting the mindset and that goes a long way because, being with government and other stakeholders, we need to really emphasize on shifting the mindset and that's the only way they can buy into the ideas of, you know, working with those alongside colleague organizations. Well, thank you very much. So, thinking of challenges and solutions in transition care what is care to family-based care? From your experience, stephen?
Speaker 5:Yeah, challenges, yes, one of the biggest challenges is, of course, funding and you know money can be part of the solution. It's not the only solution. Money has also been the challenge because it has also driven the industry. It has incentivized quite many and scrupulous people to actually start these orphanages. But, you know, as long as financial support continues to flow into the orphanage model again, it remains an incentive, especially in contexts where oversight and, you know, regulation of child protection systems are weak. You know, without intention or redirection of resources, institutional care will persist, even when you know without intentional redirection of resources, institutional care will persist, even when you know better alternatives exist. So I feel like you know money is the problem. It is also the solution because it's sort of you can incentivize change with you know resources, with you know resources, you know.
Speaker 5:The second challenge is one of attitude. I feel like some children are viewed as fundamentally different to see if they deserve a separate, you know, standard of care, whether due to poverty, disability or other circumstances. So these perceptions feel harmful systems that keep children separated from families, you know, instead of strengthening the support needed to keep them together. And I would say you know strikingly many people pose orphanages, you know, in their own countries but continue to find them elsewhere, often unaware of the long-term consequences. You know, something that Phil did mention earlier. So, and then there is poverty, you know, linked up with you know finances, you know, are the most relentless. I would say it's one of the most relentless barriers. Extreme poverty leaves children vulnerable to neglect, to abandonment, you know, subsequently to institutionalization. So if we truly want to prevent, you know, family separation, we must ensure robust, you know, social protection systems developed or enhanced by governments, you know, that really help families to withstand. You know, economic shocks. You know, economic hardships, strengthening this safety. Safety is a message you know it's critical to reducing orphanages.
Speaker 5:It's also about, you know, safeguarding, you know, childhood itself. When we do that, good news. You know we can change this. You know childhood itself. When we do that, good news. You know we, we can change this. You know, with better funding strategies I think we've mentioned about, you know, uh, the the millions or billions of funding that get into this system. You know a shift in society, uh, societal attitudes, you know, and strong systems really to protect families from, you know, financial strain. I believe that we can create a world where really grow up and belong in families. Yeah, I feel like you know those are the main challenges that come to mind. I know there are other challenges, but I feel like poverty, the attitudes, existing attitudes and poverty through the funding, the struggles that families go through these are issues I mean. Poverty will always be there, I believe, but again, we need to change perceptions that poverty or disability or any of the factors that are mentioned can be reasons to put these children in orphanages. I believe not. Yeah, over to you, phil.
Speaker 6:Great, believe not. Um, yeah, um, over to you, phil, great, yeah, those are are terrific points, steven and I. I'd throw in a couple of other things. I, I do think you know changing these attitudes. I call them paradigm shifts that have to take place. Um, and I, I think you, there's a couple of paradigm shifts. It's that move from focusing inward to focusing outward. Focusing inward being focused only on the children living on our campus, all of all of our ministry is what takes place inside the walls we build, focusing outward into our communities, engaging with churches, engaging with governments, engaging with community leaders, engaging with families and preventing separation and then reintegrating children back to family. So that's the first one inward focus, outward focus. The second one is focusing on the model of care that we're delivering, towards focusing on what's best for each child.
Speaker 6:You know, so many times I hear people fighting about what's the better way to care for children. Is it better to care for them in the institution or is it better to care for them in family environments, and it's really the wrong question. I think that the question needs to be what is the best thing for this child, when we can personalize the care and say who is this child and what does this child need? What are their opportunities? Where is their family? Why did they end up in this children home and what would it take to get them to a different place? Why did they end up in this children home and what would it take to get them to a different place? When we can we, when we can make that kind of focus, uh, that that kind of shift. All of a sudden the model of care becomes secondary. And then the and the question, the to that answer. The answer, that question is what's the best place for this child? And let's develop the right solution for that child. If we have 30 children living on our orphanages and our children's homes, we're going to need 30 unique and particular solutions for each one of those children.
Speaker 6:The next big paradigm shift that I think about is the move from child-focused to family-focused. The children's home is focused on children, but as we began to engage in communities, we realized that our bigger challenge is to support vulnerable families and to come around them. As Stephen was saying, focus on economic empowerment, because poverty is such a big cause of children ending up in residential care. And the first thing that I would mention is, you know, I used to think that improving orphanages was an important goal alongside developing family-based care, but I've come to realize our first priority needs to be developing family-based care. But I've come to realize our first priority needs to be developing family-based solutions before we think about trying to improve our orphanages.
Speaker 6:As that story I told you in Honduras, they went from 40 children they got down to about six kids living on their campus at one point and they were able to really change that from improving their orphanage to make that very, very family-like with that few number of kids, while they continued to push to get those six kids into families. So, focusing on on the family, uh, as opposed to focusing on, uh, the individual child. Back to you, david.
Speaker 4:Yeah, thank you Phil and thank you Stephen. I totally agree with you on the challenges, as it is also my experience working in this part of the world in transition. Yeah Well, if these two sets of institutions I mean the government and organizations come together, we will experience a lot of positive impact or outcome in our efforts to transition orphanages. So how can these institutions, organizations and government work together to overcome these obstacles?
Speaker 5:I think, yeah, stakeholders, we do appreciate and acknowledge that.
Speaker 5:You know, first and foremost, the primary actor responsible, you know, for the care and protection of children in any context is, you know, is the government.
Speaker 5:And you know, as NGOs, we really come in to play that complementary role and to support, you know, this mandate. But, at the same time, I don't think we should shy off, you know, holding the government accountable. Um, as you know, the the whole issue proliferation of, you know, unregistered orphanages, of unregistered orphanages, and even just the whole system being broken is because at times I feel like we've really failed to hold the government accountable to the role of ensuring that children are well cared for and they are protected within their families and communities. So I feel like, yeah, there is that, you know, important role that the government has in terms of developing, you know, frameworks, you know policies, guidelines and standards, but they also have a role to play in terms of, you know, supporting children and families with necessary social protection interventions that reduce separation and abandonment. There is also another important point on coordination and to drive meaningful change, we must have a unified voice and aligned interventions. You know fragmented efforts, not only slow progress, I feel like you know they lead to wasted resources. So I feel like, yeah, there is need to see how we work together to ensure efficiency if you also clarity, you know of a shared
Speaker 5:vision of, you know, children growing up in families.
Speaker 5:And, let me say, beyond coordination, you know, again, it's looking at the issue from a very systemic perspective.
Speaker 5:I did mention about, you know the root causes of the problem being addressed and I feel like it's only the government at times that can offer our guidance to some of these organizations.
Speaker 5:But you know, resources can't be wasted in orphanages. We can make better use of our resources through, you know, supporting families and communities and you know we, as civil society organizations, can't go telling organizations how to redirect resources to such kind of interventions. It's only the government that can do that. So I feel like, yeah, indeed, with that universe without one voice, I feel like the government can really help in that aspect of you know, telling organizations this is where we can put our resources instead of here, because we know the harm that we are causing to communities. So, yeah, I feel like, indeed, for me that's the role of the government. You know, oversight, coordination, including, you know, making sure that we are working on one strategy, but you know, it's not always the case. I know, like you, I know in the developing countries there are all sorts of challenges of trying to bring people together, but I feel like us knowing the problem means that we should be improving in terms of working together towards this common goal.
Speaker 6:Thanks, towards this common goal. Thanks, thank you, stephen. Yeah, thank you, stephen, and great points, and I'll add just a couple of things. You know. The first thing I would say is that the children's homes and the government can work together, and particularly I don't know exactly the audience of this podcast, but the world that I'm in is particularly in the faith-based Christian and Catholic children's homes that sometimes would have a fear of government, that if they get involved with government, that the government's going to dictate their ability to share their faith with the children and families that are in their program, and so I often come across children's homes that have a great fear in trying to hold them at a distance. That's why you have so many unregistered children's homes in a lot of these countries. But I really encourage children's homes to invite a close working relationship with the local government. Casa Viva, costa Rica, cares for hundreds of children in foster care every year and works toward reunification and adoption and long-term fostering if needed, but we have an extremely close relationship with the government.
Speaker 6:I think somebody from our office is either in a government office or at least talking with someone from the local government local child welfare every day, and so that's important, and what we've always said is we're going to balance two things honor and respect with high standards. We feel like many people love to blame governments, but what we try to do is honor and respect the government and the government workers for the work that they're doing. We found, generally they are tasked with a huge job. They can get it right 99 times and that one time that they don't get it right goes on the national news. Nobody says thank you for the 99. It's that one that's on the national news that everybody wants to close the child welfare and fire all the people there. So it's extremely difficult. We honor and respect them.
Speaker 6:At the same time we hold them to high standards. It is in the Constitution, in the laws, in the policies of the government that they're going to act in the best interest of children, youth and families, and so we hold them to that high standard to act that way. And then we come alongside them and help them to do that, to accomplish the role that the government has. We help the government be better for the future. And you know, going back to that question of Christian, what we found is, you know, unfortunately oftentimes government thinks about the Christian projects and the professional projects and they're like two different ends of a scale. But we don't think that's the way that it should be. We think that it is possible to be 100% professional in the work we're doing and also 100% Christian. So we try to bring those two things together in the work that we're doing and find that the governments respond very well to that. David, back to you.
Speaker 4:Thank you very much. Great points from you guys and, yes, moving forward. We really want to know like funding as historically supported orphanages. How can we shift financial support towards family-based models instead? Stephen?
Speaker 5:Wow, yeah. So I feel the issue of funding it sounds easy, but I also do acknowledge the challenge that the people who find orphanages are different, they're diverse, but I think it calls for a lot of awareness raising. Really, we really need to make sure that we reach to as many audiences as possible. But also, I feel like there is a significant responsibility by the government, as Phil did mention, of actually giving a direction in terms of where the funding should go, and I feel like, for me, that's where we can achieve a lot if we want to achieve, you know, a significant change that the government, for example, in Kenya, we've been telling the government. You know we are not telling you to tell people where to put their money, but I believe, as part of your communication strategy, do communicate to orphanages owners and funders, telling them, you know we are asking you that we have this new policy direction.
Speaker 5:So why can't you actually? You know, start. You know and you know we've been given a timeframe. It's not like you know start. You know and you know we've been given a timeframe. It's not like you know, do this by tomorrow. You have 10 years to be able to do this. So, how, you know and you know the government has made a lot of effort, you know, to ensure that you know there are guidelines and standards that sort of give a sense of you know where they can put their resources. So I feel like for me that is key for this process of change, because you know it's hard and you know it's very difficult for us to know who exactly funds orphanages. I know we know significantly Christians but again, you know it's not just Christians who attend one church.
Speaker 3:You know there are different sorts of Christians.
Speaker 5:But again, it's not just Christians who attend one church. They are all different sorts of Christians.
Speaker 5:And so I feel like we need to do, yes, a lot of awareness in schools, in churches, in institutions, all that. But I feel like we need to ask ourselves where can we achieve more in terms of helping? You know, helping these resources to be redirected, and I think, from our case, it's also trying to do the modeling, showing people that it's possible. And you know asking. You know companies, corporates, you know this. You know, if you put your money here, this is the return on investment. But again, you know, these things take time. But I'm always saying I feel sad because you know, for every second or even minute or a day that a child spends in an institution, you really don't know what they're going through. Um, so I feel like it's quite urgent, but again, my hands, my hands, are always tired in terms of expediting this process. You know it's it's been over 20 years since I left care and at times I feel like you, nothing much has really changed. So I'm just thinking, you know, what can we do? Something that we can do to achieve maximum change.
Speaker 6:Not easy, but yeah, all right, thank you, Steve and Phil, yeah, so I would say that we have to. Everyone who's involved in the children's home needs to be part of this transition and needs to recognize their role and their responsibility that they play. If you, as a listener, are a donor to an orphanage, your first thought might be my goodness, I need to stop supporting that orphanage. And that's the wrong message. It's the message that we don't want you to hear today. What we want you to hear is you've been a part of helping create this children's home. There are some good stories that have come out of this. There's also some very difficult stories coming out of the children's home, so the right thing to do is to use your role as a way to help influence the children's home that you love towards change, and your role might be that you're one of 100 donors who are supporting that children's home. You have an important voice. You might be part of the leadership of an organization or work in an organization that is supporting children's homes. You have an opportunity to work toward change, and the way to start that is by asking questions. Understand who those children are that are living on your campus. Do they have moms and dads, extended family? Why are they living in this home? What caused them to become separated from their families? What would have to change for those children to be able to go back home? What is the children's home that you love doing to bring about those changes? And then it's not to stop supporting them, but it's to help them walk through this process, to expand their services, to be caring for children and families and to continue supporting the orphanage through that process.
Speaker 6:And I also think it's one thing about family-based care is that it does allow this change from the inward focus to the outward focus.
Speaker 6:It allows us to engage with the broader community in our locations and allows them to get involved in the funding. I think about a project in Paraguay that developed a new family-based care model there the first foster care program in Asuncion, Paraguay, or one of the first programs there and they were concerned about the funding for this new project that they were developing. But they took on the challenge to say what would it take to get local funding for this project? And so they began to approach local businesses, local leaders and local churches, and through that they've been able to achieve a lot of their funding coming from local sources, which is much more sustainable long-term as well. So continue to give to the children's home that you love. Help them, ask the questions, connect them to places like Helping Children Worldwide, to the Faith to Action Initiative, to other organizations that are really supporting those children's homes as they make transitions, and then walk alongside them as they make those transitions.
Speaker 4:Thank you very much. Great points there, and now we want to look forward and, like we said, we still have more to discuss and more ideas to share. So how do we keep the momentum going after the Rising Tide Conference? What are the next steps for this movement?
Speaker 6:David.
Speaker 5:Yes, what are the next steps? Wow, yeah, that's a great question. Steps Wow, yeah, that's a great question. I feel like one. We need to continue to mobilize, continue to organize. I feel like you know there's strength in numbers, and so I still feel like within those numbers again, it's not just numbers, it's knowledge that's there, collective knowledge. You know the collective experiences that are there that we can tap into to really scale up so strongly.
Speaker 5:I do feel like we really don't have room to work in a fragmented manner. The resources are few, but I feel like you know like just coming together really helps in terms of addressing issues to do with duplication of resources and all that. So I'm very, very much into. The next step is to organize better. I don't feel like we've really gotten to that stage, and how that happens I really don't have an answer to, but I feel like we really need to organize better, come together. I think also, the next step for me is also looking at the current challenges, especially in terms of resources. We really don't want to abandon children at this critical time of need. It's to ask ourselves, yes, how can we continue to raise resources, but how can we also continue to influence resources to be redirected to family care steps, you know, to family care.
Speaker 6:So yeah, I mean that's on top of my mind in terms of the next steps. All right, yeah, david, and I would add into that a phrase that I use is light little fires, as I'm seeing lots of small children's homes, medium-sized children's homes, even large children's homes, make steps to care for children and families and what does this child need? And they're finding ways to creatively engage in their communities with the families and in their communities. They're finding ways to bring churches in to be a part of the solution. They're finding ways to engage with government. I think, lighting little fires, getting little things started, and pretty soon those fires will join together and we'll see a big blaze that's a global movement of getting children into families.
Speaker 4:Yeah, David, before.
Speaker 5:I lose the point.
Speaker 3:All right, go ahead.
Speaker 5:Yeah, I just want to add to what Phil has said. I feel like change doesn't happen by chance. It happens through strategy. There is need for commitment and collaboration, and I feel we must not only define our purpose but also build a roadmap that takes us, you know, from the ideas that we've all shared. You know that we shared during the rising tides.
Speaker 5:You know, take that to action, you know, and from action to true transformation. So I'm really excited that we are starting to think about a clear vision, a clear mission and objectives after the rising tides. This can define who we are now, what we stand for, and also look at what sets us apart as a movement, and let me call ourselves a movement. But again it goes back to my point I think we really need to organise better.
Speaker 4:Thanks, david thank you very much. Indeed. We need to organise and continue working hard. So we talked about shifting the mindset, because we still have people who believe that orphanage is the best solution for vulnerable children. So what can you say to someone who still believes or who still have such beliefs, stephen?
Speaker 5:I feel like this is more like repetition because I feel like Phil has really mentioned a lot. But, yeah, there is undeniable evidence, you know, proving that you know families are essential sort of you know, the main main unit of society that we really need to protect, for us to ensure that children are not surviving they are thriving, for us to ensure that children are not surviving they are thriving. And I would say that, you know, when we know better, we have a responsibility to actually do better. So, you know, children don't just need, you know, the food, shelter, clothing, education. They need love, connection, a sense of belonging and identity.
Speaker 5:And the truth is, you know, children can't truly thrive in orphanages. Yeah, institutions as we know them they isolate, whereas families embrace a mercy. So I feel like, you know, every child deserves, you know, to feel included. And you know, I know, in the secular world there is a terminology that's really a concept of inclusion. But I feel like inclusion is often sort of used more in schools. But I feel like we need to look at the term inclusion, to look at children who are separated from families and say, you know, these children need to be included in families, they need to know that they're an integral part of the society, not separate from it. And you know orphanages, you know. For me they create barriers and you know I had a few mention about war. You know wars, you know. But families actually tear those barriers down and they ensure that children grow up, you know, with love, with identity, and you know their future is, you know, rooted in belonging.
Speaker 5:If we are committed, you know, to the well-being, we must rethink the outdated system and invest in what we now know truly works, and that's strong families. Over to you, Phil.
Speaker 6:Great. You said it very well and you know this idea of listening to the children is a great place to start in this whole thing. My friend, Hazel, was the director of a children's home in Costa Rica and she did some amazing and innovative things to make the children's home great and she developed some programs that gave the children freedom to leave the campus to go visit friends from school. She allowed them to save money to be able to go shopping mall and shop, things that kids in orphanages oftentimes never get to do. She did and she really provided some significant care. And she told me that she asked the children. She she decided to do a little survey and asked the children what else could we be doing that you would like to have that you don't have? And when she told me the story she said I almost, uh, looking back, think I was thinking it was going to be a pat on the back that all the kids were going to tell me how much they loved the changes at the orphanage and how great things were. And but she did ask the question. She brought the kids in one by one into her office.
Speaker 6:There were 26 youth and they were all adolescents and they're, you know 13 to 18 years, and all 26 of the kids answered her with one thing I want to live in a family. And it was a gut punch for my friend Hazel. She was expecting to hear how great the children's homework was, and what she heard, when she was willing to sit down and ask that question, was I want to live in families. Kids, children and youth know the difference between a family and a children's home, and as much as we make our children's homes as great as they possibly can be, children still want to be in family. Hazel listened and I give her credit for this.
Speaker 6:Hazel listened and I give her credit for this. She approached the Casa Viva Solutions team and we helped her develop the skills to begin finding alternative families. All 26 of these kids had been declared in abandonment. They were adolescents, as I mentioned, a difficult category but she began a mentoring program that got them connected to families. That mentoring program turned into foster care and then that turned into adoption. All 26 of those children left the children home and moved in with families, so it is possible to do this.
Speaker 4:So it is possible to do this and Hazel's story tells me we have to ask the questions, listen to the children and then work. Inspiring story for listeners and asking the children is really key in this aspect. As a last one, what keeps you optimistic or hopeful?
Speaker 6:about your work or this topic, Stephen. You go ahead.
Speaker 5:Thank you, wow, yes. So let me say I'm always encouraged by the fact that we are not just saying it is possible, you know, but we are leading by example. We are truly seeing change. You know, you don't see the kind of change that you see in hundreds of children being kept in one place. We always say it's one child at a time and we always say don't take the easy route, children. We know when you're intervening for children, it's not an easy route. It's actually, you know, what's in the best interest of the child, as Phil did mention. So I feel like you know every story of a child. You know that we place in a family and stays in the family. For me it's a story of hope, a story of inspiration and a story of restoration and you know that for me it's truly a comfort.
Speaker 5:It's, you know, just seeing one child that's, you know, being held and raised by, you know, a caregiver, a parent, you know whether it's a kinship carer, a child, you know, child being held by hand.
Speaker 5:I mean, it's that. It's not the mass care that we see and I always say, you know, it's not the factory of children, it's those individual stories. So I feel like for me that sort of really gives me hope every day, just seeing a child who is on the back of a mama carrying them. For me that's what we all need to see and it gives me a lot of hope that, you know, there is hope that other children you know get to enjoy that. Thanks Over to you, phil.
Speaker 6:Yeah, it is easy to be discouraged in this work, to be overwhelmed by the numbers. You know the estimates range from, you know, two to eight million children who are living in residential care today, and it's easy to be overwhelmed and to be concerned about it. But at the same time, you know, what gives me hope is when I hear stories, meet children, meet families that have been reunified and see those you know, seeing people thriving back in family-based environments. Laura and I were at a conference just two weeks ago and we saw pictures from an organization that's working with children with disabilities in Haiti and helping them get them back into biological and extended families, and it was beautiful, the stories that we were seeing. You know, we say, oh, wow, it could never work for my orphanage, it could never work in our situation. We're in a more difficult place, but we're seeing it happen in places around the world and we believe that it can happen.
Speaker 6:I was speaking at an event and a lady came rushing into the event right before it started and she said now, can I understand? Are you talking about moving children out of orphanages and into families? And I said, yes, I am. And she said well, no offense, I'm going to leave because where I live it's not going to be possible and I wanted to go to a different breakout and I was choosing between them. So I think I'll go to the other one. It's not possible. I said, ok, that that's fine. So she went and I said before you go, tell me where.
Speaker 6:Where is it the children's home that you're working with? She said Chihuahua, mexico, and, interestingly enough, one of the examples in my PowerPoint of a children's home that had transitioned to family-based care was based in Chihuahua, mexico, where she was telling me it was impossible. It is not impossible to move children to families. It is possible to do it, and when we see those children thriving in those spaces and we see the beautiful stories of coming around at-risk families and helping them come together and thrive, we see that we're fulfilling the biblical command and it's very motivating. So that's what gives me hope as well is those individual stories and people. David.
Speaker 4:Yes, stephen, thank you very much, and Phil, thank you. All. Right, I was thinking. I have another thought. Anything else you want to add before I close?
Speaker 3:No, David, just to say thank you.
Speaker 5:Thank you, david, thank you Laura for this opportunity, and I'm truly grateful to be here with Phil.
Speaker 6:Thanks, yes, and I'll add a thank you to you, Stephen, as well, David and Laura, and I'm going to I'll thank the listeners as well who have made it all the way through this conversation to this point. Thank you for your commitment to the children's homes that you love and care for, and thank you for your maybe newfound passion or maybe old passion to see those children cared for in the best possible place that they can be. So thank you to you, the listener as well, today.
Speaker 4:Thank you very much, guys, for coming to this show today. Thank you for joining us for this episode of Optimistic Voices. It's a big, big messy wall out there and there is no shortage of need, but we here at Optimistic Voices believe that with radical courage and radical collaboration, together we can change the world.
Speaker 3:Thank you, guys. Thanks for listening. If you enjoyed this episode, please subscribe, share it with others, post about it on social media or leave a rating and review. To catch all the latest from us, you can find us at Helping Children Worldwide on Instagram, linkedin, twitter and Facebook Hashtag Optimistic Voices podcast.
