We Women Writers
Inspiring and encouraging women to write, to develop a personal writing practice through exploring the real-life writing stories of other women
We Women Writers
Kim Ann - Creating Joyful Stories for Kids
In this engaging conversation, Kim Ann, a best-selling author of children's books, shares her inspiring journey from a young writer to a successful author. She discusses her experiences at community events, her motivation to write, and the personal stories that influence her work. Kim Ann emphasizes her love of creating happy, engaging books for children. She shares the impact of stories on young readers and the joy of connecting with them as she reads to them. Her dedication and love for writing children’s books shine through her diverse collection of titles. In this conversation, Kim Ann shares her journey through self-publishing children's books, emphasizing the importance of quality editing and illustration. The conversation also touches on her experience of the power of journaling and the challenges of navigating self-publishing, including the rise of AI in illustration. Kim Ann encourages writers to keep going and prepare because they must be when the right idea comes.
Quote:
“I journaled a lot, but it was on a laptop, and it just came from my brain through my fingers. I didn't think twice about any word that I put down in there. And that's what I tell aspiring writers. Let the words come out.”
Takeaways:
The Go On Vacation series was born from a creative thought.
Finding the right collaborators can enhance your work.
Journaling can help writers express their thoughts freely.
Resources:
Kim Ann: https://authorkimann.com/
Amazon Author Page: https://www.amazon.com/stores/Kim-Ann/author/B07R965196?ref=
Ten Little Sea Turtles: https://www.amazon.com/dp/1953774512/ref=
Ruby The Rainbow Witch (a three-part series): https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08PDZTQZ4/
Ninja School Rules: https://www.amazon.com/dp/1953774024/ref=sr
Jane Jones (00:00)
Hi there, I'm Jane and this podcast is designed for you. Five minutes of daily writing can change your world. Come with me as we explore the stories of women who transformed their lives through writing. Welcome to the We Women Writers Podcast.
Jane Jones (00:27)
Hello everyone and good morning. I'm Jane and I'm your host of We Women Writers and today we have with us Kim Ann and here's my little notes about her. Kim is a bestselling author, and she is known for her engaging and award-winning children's books. Her books captivate young readers and inspire a lifelong love of reading. Since 2019, Kim has published 30 titles. Amongst her titles include the Amazon's Teacher's Pick and Mom's Choice Award winner, Ruby the Rainbow Witch, Goldie the Puppy, and the adventurous Go On Vacation series. Kim's dedication to literacy shines through her diverse collection, which often incorporates themes of social emotional learning with such titles as 10 Little Sandpipers, 10 Little Swords Starfish, and 10 Little Sea Turtles, alongside the empowering and student favorite, Ninja School Rules. Kim is recognized for bringing her literary magic to life at local events, schools, libraries, national expos, and now to television with the publication of The Places We Call Home. Welcome, Kim, to We Women Writers.
Kim Ann (01:48)
Thank you, Jane, for having me. I look forward to today.
Jane Jones (01:51)
Okay, excellent. I'm so looking forward to this as well. We met at a little event that you have on the, is it the Huntington Pier?
Kim Ann (02:00)
Yes, Huntington Beach Pier, yes.
Jane Jones (02:03)
Let's start. I know I'm not starting where I said I would start. I apologize because I really am interested in the your commitment, not just commitment, but the desire to interact with people at a level that is very easy, so tell me a little bit about that place you go to at Huntington Beach.
Kim Ann (02:26)
Sure, so it's called the Huntington Beach Artisan Fair and they have it most weekends down in the Pier Plaza, which is the cement area next to the pier. It's a community event. It brings together different artisans as well as different experiences for the community. They have like a learning corner, which is where I primarily would be as an author. They have a creative corner, which they introduce new artisans to the community.
They have a giving corner, which is like a local nonprofit, and then the gathering corner where sometimes they have different talent or other artisans that she might put there. So, it's an event that helps to bring the family down and help the community have some fun things to do with their family and also for our tourists. So, I go down there pretty much every weekend. I have a booth and I set up and sell my books and meet the public and the kids and talk about my stories.
Jane Jones (03:24)
Excellent, which is where I met you and then subsequently found out that my granddaughters that live here have got copies of your books and they get read stories before they go to bed from reading some of your books. So, thank you.
Kim Ann (03:42)
Thank you.
Jane Jones (03:44)
All right, so Kim, let's start where I said I would start, please tell us a little bit about your writing journey.
Kim Ann (03:51)
Sure. So, I've been, I was one of those kids that always enjoyed writing. I joke and say that the first book I wrote, was nine years old. It was a rhyming book and I shared it with the librarian at my school and she loved it and put it on the shelf. So I say that was my first published book. It had a construction paper cover and yarn binding, right? So, I hope if anyone is sharing this podcast with their kids, they let them know, like, just, you know, do what you love and nine years old, you can publish a book.
So anyway, so I joke about that, but realistically, I always had a love of writing. I was a business major in college, but I took a lot of creative writing classes. And it was something I kind of just did on the side, usually like poetry. I'm gonna like roll forward a whole bunch of years. was in the computer industry. I decided that I was going to start doing some different things. I'm married to a lieutenant in the police department. And I have a 21-year old special needs son. So the way the kind of the story went is that I had a special needs son. He was one pound, 1 pound 11 ounces, and he spent 143 days in the NICU. I'll pause for a second because it's been long time. And he was so fragile. We weren't able to hold him for super long time. And I would go to the hospital every day and sit there.
Kim Ann (05:18)
24 hours a day and the nurse would say to me, you could reach him, Kim, he just wants to hear your voice. So, I went to the Dollar Tree one day, I filled up a basket with all the kids books they had. I go back to the hospital, I opened the little door on the isolate and I read and I read and I read and I read. Most time I was the only parent in there. The nurses would kind of come around and listen. And that's how I was first able to bond with my son Aiden.
So now he's 21-years old. He's in a special needs cluster at school. Intellectually, he's about a two or three year old. So, he still loves the children's books, the picture books. So, after I became a stay at home mom to take care of him, the day he was going to get discharged, they said, so you're going to quit your job, right, Kim? And I had owned a little smoothie shop at the time and I had some people running it. And I was like, well, I hadn't thought about that. They said, well, you know, he needs 24-hour care. And I was like, Hmm, yeah, I guess I am. So, this businesswoman became stay at home mom. And so, what better way than to make up songs and rhymes about everything brushing our teeth, walking, everything. And then I said to my husband one day, I'm like, I think I want to write a children's book. And I'm sure a lot of people on this listening to this podcast say that all the time.
One of the things when I'm at the pier, get a lot of husbands that come up and say, you're living my wife's dream.
Jane Jones (06:54)
Ohh, interesting.
Kim Ann (06:57)
So, I signed up, I went to some conferences they had locally and I arrived there for my two-day conference all excited to learn everything about children's books publishing. And it was really fun and I met some great people and at the end they had the Q &A board and someone said, how do I get published? And this is going back probably 10, 15 years ago. How do I get published?
Someone on the panel said, well, you can send your unsolicited manuscript to someone. It'll sit in a pile this high. And you may or may not hear from someone in a couple of years. And I left there very defeated. I came home to my husband and I said, wow, you know, I was really pumped up about this, but like the reality is this might not happen. So, I'm sure there's some people again listening that feel that way.
And so then a whole bunch more years went by and all of a sudden, you know, I was on Facebook, and I noticed like someone that I knew, my daughter did like the acting modeling thing because we live in LA and one of the moms published a book and I went on, and I looked at it, and I was like, it's self-published.
Kim Ann (08:16)
So, I spent the next year learning everything there was to learn about self-publishing, taking classes, reading books. And I said, okay, when I get the perfect idea, I'm gonna be ready.
Jane Jones (08:29)
When I get the perfect idea.
Kim Ann (08:33)
Because, you know, I'm gonna like go out there, I'm gonna get up to bat, I'm gonna swing, and it needs to be a hit, right? And so then one day, my friend was on Facebook, and she had the most adorable little two-year-old, and it was, you know, far past Halloween, and she was taking a picture of her, and she had her Halloween costume on, and these rainbow leggings. And she said, “I don’t know what it is. She wants to wear her Halloween costume every single day”. And I looked at her, and I said, “Oh my gosh, that needs to be a book character”. And Ruby the Rainbow Witch was born.
Jane Jones (09:03)
Excellent. Excellent.
Kim Ann (09:08)
And because I'm, you know, I'm kind of just like a rhymy kind of sing-songy person, it's an alliteration book. So, with the whirlwind twirl of her rainbow dress and a wave of her swirly-whirly wand, Ruby the Rainbow Witch was born.
Jane Jones (09:22)
I love it. That's lovely. Oh my god.
Kim Ann (09:25)
And it's fun because it's been like, I published that in 2019, I think. And then it's been sitting on a teacher's pick list for like three years. So that means that elementary school teachers amended it to Amazon. So, that was my first book.
Jane Jones (09:43)
Excellent, excellent. Was there any? I'm fascinated with that progression from somebody, you found somebody that did it, and then you go and you learn all about self-publishing, and then you kind of go, okay, now I need a big idea and I'm just going to wait. And then you, an idea popped up and then you move forward with it.
Kim Ann (10:04)
Yes.
Jane Jones (10:04)
I love that progression. Love that.
Kim Ann (10:07)
Thank you. So, then after that, like my next book was just something like totally different. So, I have a Go On Vacation series, and it's where do elves go on vacation? And that book came about, I think Facebook, I owe Metta a lot because I was, Ruby was kind of born from a Facebook post. And so, was where do elves go on vacation? Because it was, you know, after Christmas, everyone was sending their elf back to the North Pole, right? Their elf on a shelf. And I was like, man, it was like, post after post after post. And I was like, I had a random thought, like, okay, so if the Alves are working when everybody else is taking time off and the kids are out of school, when do they go on vacation and where would they go? And I ended up writing that book like in a weekend and anyone listening to this, use a professional children's book editor, I always do. So, if I say to you, I wrote it in a weekend, it does not mean it was done in a weekend, but I wrote it in a weekend, I sent it to my editor.
And she was like, Kim, I love it. She's like, it's short, it's cute, it's creative. I love it. So that was kind of my second book. And it would have been a one and done in that series, but my author friends would say common things like, my gosh, that was a great idea. Why didn't I think of that? And then I kind of went into panic mode and said, no, I better write more.
So, I wrote, where does Santa go on vacation? And then I said, you know, what other characters do kids love? So, I have mermaids, pirates, dinosaurs, dragons, unicorns. I'm missing something. But anyway, there's eight in that series.
Jane Jones (11:52)
Sweet, and so the genesis that you go through this, and again, I just want to pick up this, that your friends say, oh, that's a great idea, I wish I had thought about more. Where does it in your mind, or can you help us understand where it goes from hearing that to I need to write more?
Kim Ann (12:14)
I don't know, I think I panicked a little in thought. If I have a lot of author friends and they're like thinking that that was a good idea, is that going to, you know, are they going to come out with a book similar, like quicker?
Jane Jones (12:29)
A little, just a little bit of competition. Yeah, right.
Kim Ann (12:31)
Oh yes.
Jane Jones (12:34)
And at the same time, though, there's a little bit of like, wait a second, everybody that this is this is my idea. This is like, and it's like, I kind of with you know, and so then your mind starts running with it, because you you owned it. And the while the competition got you a little started, it's not to stop anybody or anything like that.
Kim Ann (12:56)
No, no, no
Jane Jones (12:57)
This is mine and I'm just gonna keep on going.
Kim Ann (13:00)
Yes. Well, and also like, okay, it was pretty well received, right? And I was like, well, you know, maybe I have something here, right? I mean, I think, you know, there's some terrible statistic out there and you probably can find it for your listeners, but it's something like, you know, 90 % of authors sell less than 200 copies of a book in their lifetime. So, there's something like that.
Jane Jones (13:24)
Yes, yes.
Kim Ann (13:26)
So, I was also like, okay, well, this is a good idea. It's so well received. I need to go with it.
Jane Jones (13:31)
Yep, yep, yeah.
Kim Ann (13:31)
I used it as a motivator.
Jane Jones (13:34)
So, there's a motivator and you're so happy about it. it's so, the who you are is coming through in these books.
Kim Ann (13:45)
Definitely. It's funny. You know, I mentioned about my son having special needs and I have a typical daughter, Kayla, who's amazing. And then I have a husband who is police lieutenant, but he was shot in the line of duty in 2006. He's 100 % miraculously recovered. it was tough there, little touch and go. And I had him and my son in the hospital at the same time. Right. So, I have like a long backstory. need another episode for that.
Jane Jones (14:19)
We might do one.
Kim Ann (14:23)
And I've written a lot of articles about that story. I did some magazine article writing before I made it into kids books. But anyway, there's a lot that goes on when you have a child like this. So, one of my friends said to me one time, and I had never really thought about it, but she was like, do you write about vacation books because you never go on one? And I went, maybe.
Jane Jones (14:50)
There doesn't seem to be any hint of discord or happiness, unhappiness or heaviness or anything about your communicating about where these things go on vacation. You know, I don't know.
Kim Ann (15:15)
It wasn't anything I had ever thought about either, I was like, was interesting. It was her perception. It was interesting. But I do write very, another author friend of mine once said, can you write happy books for happy kids? And I liked that, you know, because, and you guys are hearing me for the first time probably, but I live my life very much appreciative of things and I'm a very happy person.
And I love that that comes through to my books. And people say to me, this is my son, he's four, doesn't like to read. I'm always like, bring those kids over because they just haven't found the right book yet. And then I pull out a book and I read to them in my voice inflection the way I do. Maybe I'll instill a little love of reading or at least listening to stories to that child. So, I think that it is an escape and a way for me from sometimes the days are a little rough, but the stuff in my books is really just to make kids feel good. And for parents, when they're reading bedtime stories, a bond with their child and have a special moment and engage with each other. And that's my inspiration.
Jane Jones (16:30)
Yeah, that's what's popped, which is sticking in my mind is that somebody said, you're very happy and you write books for happy children. In my mind, I kind of went, well, what you're doing is you're very happy and you write happy books, but you're bringing out, showing a little light on the happiness that is within the child. Because if it's not there, you can't bring it out. And you can't, well, I wouldn't say can't.
You don't instill it in the child so much as you give them an experience of it and they go, and they gravitate towards it because they like it. And then they find in themselves more of that happiness. it, and then every time they read the book or they read another book like it, there's echoes of that. And so, the person can find a way through and, and find some happiness and find some thankfulness for where they are, you know.
Like I purchased the books and as I said, found out that my brothers have a number of them, but these, the kids kind of get used to seeing this type of artwork, right? Yes. And they get used to these and this, I'm going to show the Ninja School rules. Audio is never used, the video is never used. And you've chosen a really good illustrator.
And I'll let you enunciate her name because I don't want to get...
Kim Ann (17:55)
My illustrator is Nejla Shojaie. I met her when I was a new author, and she was a fairly new illustrator. And, you know, I feel very lucky about that. We met in an author-illustrator group. I posted that I was looking for someone to help me with my first book. And I had about 20 illustrators respond to my post. And I put out a little challenge to them. And this was for Ruby the Rainbow Witch, but I didn't tell them what the story was.
Jane Jones (17:59)
Mm-hmm.
Kim Ann (18:25)
I asked each of those people to draw me an illustration of a six-year-old happy little girl in a twirly dress with long curly hair, because my daughter has long curly hair. it's, Ruby isn't exactly like Kayla, but yeah, she reminds me of Kayla. And so that's all I had posted. And a few of them responded and a few of them didn't. And then the ones that responded, I said, “I love where you're going with this, know, would you mind adding some color?” And just so you guys know, like illustrators, they make their money that way. They support their families that way. So, when you do ask them to do something like that, it is nice to offer to pay them for their services, even if you're not going to use them. So, I did, you know, I gave them all like a stipend to take their strong, take it a little further and color it.
And then the next, I remember the next morning I woke up and I had an email from Nejla when I opened it. I got chills up my arms and I was like, that's it. She nailed what I was envisioning in my head. And then, so that's where that story started. So she's an illustrator. She's worked with a lot of different authors now as well, but she's very special to me. And I love it, working with her. She has some of my characters show up in other books, which is really fun.
You mentioned like 10 little sea turtles, and we talked about where do mermaids go on vacation. So, in my Where Do Dragons go On Vacation, one of the places is, you know, are they underwater dragons? And do they go swimming with their mermaid and their turtle friends? And so those characters show up over there. So, I think that's a fun little thing because, know, like you say, if your grandchild likes the books, they'll be like, look, you know, there's the mermaid or there's the turtle.
Jane Jones (20:12)
I'm going to pay close attention next time I read one of the books and just see if she, the littlest one, picks it up. And the older one probably already knows and she's maybe past it. Thank you for telling us about the illustrator because I think that's really important. And I really appreciate you saying that you're asking somebody to do something a little extra and they're giving you their creativity to pay them whatever something for their for their time and their creativity because they are giving you something and as you say people are trying to are supporting themselves in their families
Kim Ann (20:51)
Yes, yes.
Jane Jones (20:52)
And it's your that's another for me in my observation view That's just another extension of who you are in terms of your generosity and your happiness your kindness.
That that's just okay. That's right to do so you do it.
And thank you for making sure that other people know that. The other thing that you mentioned was using a children's book editor. Yes. And there's a lot of people that go to critique groups and the groups may or may not be helpful and often are not helpful. So, you go to somebody who you get some idea. Well, actually, I should ask you, how did you find your editor? Because I've got some ideas, but how did you find her?
Kim Ann (21:34)
So, you know, and when you first start this, you're going to make mistakes.
Jane Jones (21:41)
Okay, all right, we're good.
Kim Ann (21:43)
And I want to say, I think it was freelancer.com, which is a great website, but for this editor that I picked, I think I found her on there. And it was interesting because it was my first book. I was struggling a little bit with how to end it. And so I looked for an editor that, you know, was also a writer, like, I wanted to have like a discussion about the development of the story and if she had any ideas about, you know, where the end should go. And, you know, so she did her thing, you know, and I paid her, and I went on my way. And when it came around to do the second story, I was in this large, like children's book author illustrator group.
And I saw people like posting about like, whether they worked with an editor they liked or they were looking for one, because there's a lot of resources in there, right? And it was like saving posts. And so, when it came time for my second one, I reached out to a couple of them. And I was like, this is an alliteration book. It's the second one in the series. I'd like it to kind of sound like the first one. And I met up with this woman who had, her name's Shannon. She had just finished getting her master's degree in English or whatever, and she's been doing illustrating. And at that time, she was like more affordable. So, she's still in, but I mean, that is the reason I went to her the second time. And because that is a thing with children's books, It's, I see a lot of people post like, it's a great way to make passive income and it's a lot of work. It's a lot of marketing and it's hard work and you can't really skimp. you skimp, on your illustrator and you skimp on editing and things like that, you will never compete with the books in like Barnes and Nobles and traditional publishers. So, self-publishing, the way I do it and a lot of my author friends do it is we try to have our books equal or better than traditional published because self-publishing has a little bit of a bad rep out there. So, what I say like, it's gonna cost money upfront, you know, when you're starting out.
It will. Okay, so then I worked with Shannon and I really liked her and she, she did a great job on my second Ruby book. I said, “Would you take a look at my first Ruby book? It's already published. It's already out there, but I like what you've done here”. And also, there's like some rules with picture books and self-publishing you, you know, you can bend the rules where you want to, because you're self-publishing. But theres rules like on word count.
And this other editor had never even said anything with me. And I think that first revision was a little long. So, I gave it to Shannon and she did a bunch of edits on it. And it was like, one, so much better. And two, I realized like, I took someone's word for the fact that they were a children's book editor, which she was probably just an editor, not just an editor, but for like grownup books and not kids’ books, because we're different.
Like a lot of things are different. So, that had been all reworked. And then I took it down and republished it. People got like a fresher version of it. But anyways, so you have to kind of like see who you click with, like who you think is going to help you get the product that you want. And so I actually have a couple of different editors because when my 10 Little Starfish, 10 Little Sandpipers, and Ninja School Rules is a great example of this. So, Ninja School Rules was the orange one that you showed earlier. That was a book that I wrote for my daughter's Taekwondo master. So, she is a fourth degree black belt. She's been with Master Vo since she was a little girl. And he knew he was very supportive. He's a small businessman, you know, with several schools, but he was very supportive of the fact that, you know, this mom is going to go out there and try to be an author. And he said, “Ma'am, we should write a book”. I said, “What should we write a book about?” He goes, “You know, all the good parts of martial arts”. And I thought about that for a second. I mean, it really has developed my daughter into the woman she is, right? I'm a big fan of it. And I was like, interesting, you know? And so, we talked about it. He goes, “Well, they should be ninjas because all kids like ninjas and it should have different color uniforms because kids like different colors”. I was like, “Okay”.
So, when I wrote that book, I really wrote it for Master Vo to share with students and Taekwondo community. And he wanted to dedicate it to his father, Grandmaster Vo. So, in the back, there's a cute little image. And so, I wanted this book to be something a little bit different. So, the editor I used for this actually used to work for Disney. And she's amazing. And she writes her own books. She's... I've gone into Barnes and Noble, and her stuffs there. She's amazing. And so, I did hire her for that book because I wanted it to be, you know, the best it could be. And it was also a little bit different. So, you guys know if you read children's books, some are short and they rhyme, you know, some are longer stories. Some are alliteration stories, just different kinds, you know.
So, the story Ninja School Rules is just like, it's a social-emotional learning story about a child who wants to be a ninja with all of his heart, but he lacks self-confidence. So, it's a longer story with a nice moral and an end to the story. So, it was a little bit different than I was used to writing with my little, you know, rhyming little fun books. So, I used a different editor for that. So, there are editors that specialize in different things. And so, she was really helpful. I mean, I do school visits, and I tell the kids because that's the story I usually do when I go to school visits.
And I tell them, you know, like when your teacher uses the red pen, she makes a little corrections and you go, the first, the first run through of Ninja School Rules with my editor, it came back and I literally just stared at all the red and went, “Oh my gosh, did I do anything right?” You know, so we hopped on a call and she was like, “No, she goes, “You know, it's just different things. Like you need to change your point of view and this and this and this and this”.
Okay, got off the call, I took a deep breath and then I grabbed a glass of water and I was like, okay, let's do it. And that book is completely different than it was the first time I sent it to her. And so that was a really long talk about editors, but there's different books.
Jane Jones (28:41)
I appreciate it. I believe that it's really for me and there's a lot of things pinging in my head about things, but from the listener's point of view to understand that this is a passion. This is something that you do because you want to do it and you find lots of different ways and it's not about passive income. It's not about trying to…
You're sharing something that is going to make a difference to people in their lives long after you've published the book. And your commitment, and I don't, the commitment word, I trip over that word, your desire and follow through to go to schools and to read those things and to get the children to connect with the author. And by extension, they're connecting to the illustrator, and they're connecting to those characters in your book, and they are connecting inside their heads to something, and we don't always know what that is but that one if there's a little light that goes on and I'm going to ask you about that in a second and put a pin in that one is that when the light goes on it might not show up again for a while but it's there just like when you were nine, and you wrote that book, and now you're a librarian, put it on the shelf, that was like a, I'm gonna make an observation, that was, would be kind of like a little light bulb going on. Something inside of you pops up and just like, you know, and then it comes through, and then you go through all kinds of things, and life is life, life happens, and there's challenges, and we meet them and you have certainly met them.
And then, but then there's this little thing in you, there's this little light bulb that just kind of pops up and goes, I'm still here. And you've been reading stories to your son when he's in the hospital and when he's a tiny wee, wee, wee infant and like almost before he's a wee infant. And that part of you is developing again and the value that you had with the connection.
And I'm going to have to stop talking in a second, but this idea that this connection that you had with your son and the value that that brings to both you and him. And so I am, I'm thankful, I'm very grateful to you for having the opportunity to see your books and to have met you and to talk to you about this and then to have this conversation on We Women Writers because I do believe it's a really important progression for people that wherever they are on that continuum, know, I really appreciate that. And you are really generous because, you know, for me there's, you know, and when you're talking about being generous, you're being incredibly generous. I'm not paying you to do this. I don't pay any of my interviewees, my conversations, and because it's, and I'm not ever going to monetize the channel because that's not what it's for. It's very important to me that people hear this and that they take it without any concern that somebody's only doing this because now you're making income from the books but my feeling my experience of you is that that's hugely if it's not secondary is probably four five things down the line.
Delete31:36 to 32:31
Kim Ann (32:22)
Oh yeah.
Jane Jones (32:23)
In terms of the dollar amount because the amount of passion, the interest you put in and the time and effort you put in. thank you. Thank you very much. I wanted to come back to that thing I put the pin in about the light going on. When you are reading to children, do you ever see something in them where they're like all of a sudden something shifts in them?
What I would call a little light going on. Can you tell us about your experience of that when that happens with children?
Kim Ann (32:58)
So, I notice it a lot when I do like the school presentations. So Read Across America, a lot of times schools will book authors like myself to come and present to the students. And when I talk about being nine years old and my construction paper book and my crayon illustrations, I see a lot of kids light up because it's something they're doing that even their teachers might not know, maybe their parents don't even know that they enjoy writing their own stories or making their own books. And look, here's a grownup and she does this as a job. I see that a lot. It's really cute. Or when I talk about ninja school rules and I say to the kids, “Is there ever been a time where you're afraid to raise your hand because you might not know the right answer?” And then you see them nod.
You know, and so it's kind of like one of the things I address about believing in yourself and being confident. And when you try this, so the part of the Ninja School Rules is the things like be kind, respectful, believe in yourself. And then there's a little part of the story, which because I'm on the spot now, I won't remember it exactly. But it's like, but it's something like when ninjas believe in themselves, they always succeed. And then I tell the students, I believe in you. And I point to everyone in the room.
And, you know, I see them all like sit up a little taller and shine a little brighter.
Jane Jones (34:29)
I really appreciate that’s really lovely because there's a lot of really good, really, really important reasons for writing books and reading to children and to sharing these experiences with them because it's, it's almost incalculable. It just, and I kind of, I'm going to use a phrase, it doesn't sound weirdy, but it's, it's us feed your soul. It feeds a part of you that you just can't even articulate. You just know it.
Kim Ann (35:04)
Absolutely. And I always say, this came from a place of me needing to express myself outside being a mom. But I have the best job in the world, being mom is number one. But my job as being an author, publisher, is the best. Like on the weekends, my husband takes care of my son, so he's completely taken care of.
And I go down to the pier or I go to different venues and I get to talk to kids and read stories to kids and watch their eyes light up. And I come home and I feel like, you know, I've just made a million dollars. Like my soul feels like I made a million dollars. I didn't, but there's this, it gives me such like light and purpose in my life. I'm very blessed.
Jane Jones (35:59)
Yeah, and it absolutely shows and I probably comes from you being blessed internally and blessing yourself when you say about people believing in themselves and sharing that you believe in them. And the fact that, and something interesting you say was that you tell them, I'm a mom, but there's another part of me outside of being a mom and I do this. And so in my mind, I think, well, okay, so the listeners are, I'm a mom, I'm an accountant, I'm a baker, I'm a whatever it is, but there is this part of me and just maybe they don't even know about that part of themselves. And going back to what you said that husband said when you were at the “you're living my wife's dream”. And one of the other ladies that we had on here, Teri Bayus, said that most people like she said the overwhelming thought that people have when they're passing away is that I didn't write my book.
And so even if it's and lots of reasons but to just to believe and just to try it and maybe we could make we do it and in terms of we women writers the podcast is to inspire women to pick up the pen and write.
And just start writing, find a way because there is something in your environment that you can write. And people, that's a question I'll ask you in a minute, put a pin in that one, is that there is something in your environment that you can look, and say, and even if it's just your grocery list, write it using different script. Put some little pictures on it instead of words or something just do something with your hands that's writing something a little bit different is really inspiring, and to come back to the pin is that, do you write with journaling with your hand or do you work on the computer?
Kim Ann (38:09)
It's interesting that you said that because when you said, just write, when I back in 2006, when my husband was shot, and I was taking care of my son, and then now I had this, I journaled a lot, but it was on a laptop, and it just came from my brain, through my fingers. I didn't think twice about any word that I put down in there. And that's what I tell aspiring writers. Let the words come out. You know, and I do actually write stuff on notebooks too. So, it just depends where the inspiration, the time is where I am. I talk into my voice, my phone sometimes and text myself so I don't forget. So, like, don't let that hinder you at all. But when my husband was shot, and I had been journaling my little brains out, I got interviewed for a story for Long Beach Memorial Hospital about the trauma team and what a great job they did saving my husband and his partner.
And I jokingly said to the editor, well, I'll say, or the writer, was like, I'll save you a lot of time because a journal anyway. Like I said it just like that. So, we were at lunch, and she was asking me all these questions. And then at the end she said, “Would you send me like your notes?” And I said, “I mean, I can, they're not edited or anything. It's just, clearly what my brain was telling my fingers to put into the keyboard”. She said, “I'd love to.” I said, okay, so we have lunch. She's writing her story. I go home. I send her my notes. Then she called me back like two days later. And she said, “Kim, I had to wait till everybody left my office because she said, you have a real gift for writing, and I don't even know if you know it”. But she said every word I felt, and she said, “I literally was reading your story, and I was just crying.” And she said, “Have you ever thought about writing articles?” And she said, “Because I would love for you to write a story about your son and his journey.” And my husband was next to me, and I was like, and he says, “Well, say yes.” I said, “Yes, but will you help me? I've never done that before”. And she said, “Of course, I'll help you.”
She said, “Okay, all right, let's do it.” And then I did, I wrote a story about my son and that was like the first article I ever published. And that came from, you know, just journaling. So, ladies, if you're listening to me right now, don't edit yourself, let the words come out, whether it's through your fingers, into your phone, voice text yourself, whatever. I never edit myself right away. I call it marinating.
I write my stuff down or I'm out for a walk with my dog. I get very inspired on those walks, by the way. I text myself or I voice record myself. And then I put it away. I wait a few days and, then I listen to it, or I read it, and then I go from there. But I never delete anything either. I'm going to tell you that. Like I'll move it to the bottom. I'm like, it's not quite right. Move it to the bottom because you'll be surprised how like something just kind of shows up to you after a while, right? And you're like, I put that at the top, but that's like a great middle or that's a great ending. So just do it, Nike tells you.
Jane Jones (41:49)
I wonder how many ladies that are listening are finding that they can relate to that because they do make notes all over the place. They do make put things away, and they do wait, and they do kind of like they keep it but they don't really know what they're going to do. They leave it, and writers say just what am I going to do this? don't know. Maybe they're not even writers. Maybe they do something else, and they do some journaling, and they kind of the notebook sits on the counter or the electronic file just sits somewhere. And you just every once in a while, you know, find out, find your own way because there's so many different ways. of the things, and I'm really interested, I want to ask you about this, it, this is something that you, is this something that you were doing intuitively? You were just moving through and doing things, not following somebody else's plan, but your own and finding your own way through this, right?
Kim Ann (42:49)
And no, so yes, I mean, I think my progression from being a nine-year-old with a rhyming book to where I am now, it definitely was, I am one that has to, I'm very visual. I have to learn everything before. And so, I did, like I said, after I saw my friend write a book, and then I was like, I'm going to do that. I got a eBook on Amazon.
And then after I read the eBook about how to do it, I went to the author and I looked her up, and she had like a whole course, and it was self-paced, which was perfect for moms like us that are like, you know, 10 o'clock at night after the kids are in bed, you're like, I have this hour, and I was taking these, these classes and, I don't mind, you know, sharing because I consider her a great mentor, Evie Jones. But my husband would laugh because every time I'd watch a new module, right. She goes, “Hello, my Chiboo friends”, which is like children's book, whatever Chiboo stands for. But he would walk by and go, “Hello, Chiboo friends” because every night he would hear me listening to a module. But she had this like Children's Book University thing. And so, I rewatched, rewatched, rewatched, very visual, and took a lot of notes. And then I would get to that stage where in my plan to write a book, and I'd go back and watch it again.
I did a lot of stuff like that, and as you progress and you meet people, like I'm an author coach now, and I help people. I get a lot of people like you were talking about earlier, 10 years ago, I wrote this book and I want to do something with it now. I helped them do that. And I think like you were saying that someone's on their death bed and they wish they had wrote their story. So let someone help you. If you have that book somewhere, let someone help you make that a dream come true.
But anyways, so now it's like, I've kind of learned from a lot of different people, know, how to do Amazon ads, which is super important and how the producer for the PBS show found me was he was looking for a book on Amazon and one of my ads popped up. And so that's Brian Cohen, if you guys need to learn about Amazon ads. So, I've met a lot of great people on this journey. I studied a lot. I've done high-end coaching myself. With people that are specialists in those kinds of things or experts. And so now like it's a little bit different because it's like, I'm almost at that wash, rinse, repeat stage. So, like, cause I have like three more picture books and two more, two chapter books I'm trying to write. That's interesting when you go from picture books to chapter books, that's taken a lot longer.
But you know, it's like, I'm kind of on that wash, rinse, repeat. So, like, you know, I write it, I rewrite it, I rewrite it, I rewrite it. It goes to my editor, comes back, I rewrite it. You know, it's like, and then once it's good, then I, you know, I reach out to Nejla and she just gets me. So, and she does her magic, you know, and then I have someone that does the typography and the formatting, you know, she gets it from Nejla. We all share one big drop box, but you know, I've gotten to that point now, but yeah.
Jane Jones (46:06)
Yeah.
Excellent I'm really I am, I want to use the word impressed but that doesn't it doesn't say enough just being really thankful the journey that you've been on, and you continue to go on, and now you just mentioned that you do you're an author coach so somebody that's got a book that they wrote some years ago but they don't know what to do with it you know we're gonna put some in the show notes some you know things of how to email or you know website or something to get in touch with you but to read the books that you've written and looking for professionals and getting advice about exactly where to go so that they're not paying a lot of money for somebody just to take their money and not do anything.
Kim Ann (46:56)
We all make mistakes at the beginning and we learn from them.
Jane Jones (46:59)
Yeah, because there's a lot of people out there that will just say, yeah, I can help you. can help you. can help you and
Kim Ann (47:05)
I do want to say one of the biggest things I'm seeing now, so I help even establish authors with like their Amazon and things, because I'm pretty good over there. But one thing that we've been noticing now is new writers hire an illustrator and the illustrator is using AI, but telling them that they're hand drawing them. Yeah. So that's one red flag I want to put out to any of you newbie authors like really be sure, do your homework, make sure that you're really getting authentic illustrations. If you want to do AI, that's fine, but these people are misled when you were talking about like spending money. And the way you can tell is like the hands, things with the hands, like the fingers look funny, or I've noticed like two different size eyes, like just look for that kind of stuff.
Jane Jones (47:53)
They don't get the hands in the eyes. Those are really telltales. One of the things I heard somebody say a long time ago was to go to a bookstore, the section of the kind of books that you have, whether they're YA and the different ages in that or children's books, and just sit there and go through them, and you'll get a lot of the old, the old tried and true books, the real old authors and stuff like that. And okay, good. But there's a lot of the newer authors like yourself and look at those illustrators and then go on Amazon and look up children's books and look at the illustrators, the covers, and then they'll let you pop through a couple of pages and see what you like. And then just kind of have a little file of screenshots. When you do it and then go back a few days later and go through and weed them out, you know, until eventually nothing has to be done right away. And get somebody and find it. And it may cost you some money, but you know, or if money's tight, then find resources, find a way to you for to, you know, to find a way to get it done. But using people who understand the words that you're writing in a children's book and understand who you are.
And like you just said it, Nejla, she gets you. So that's really important that just somebody who thinks that they're just going to use AI to draw something because you can just go and do it yourself.
Kim Ann (49:35)
People are blessed with that talent.
Jane Jones (49:37)
It's, yeah, some artists in my family that, and you know, I kind of do the words and they're the ones that have the ability to draw and to create artistically. yeah, it's a, and there’s lots of different expressions of that. So, I really thank you for that little, you know, sort of heads up with people. If you're looking for an illustrator, just make sure that they're actually using it.
Kim Ann (50:05)
Make sure you use your editor first before you illustrate because you made a good point, Jane, when it's like, you know, the words, they're picture books. Well, I primarily write picture books. So, like 50% of the story is told with the words, and 50% is told with the illustration. So, if you don't edit beforehand, that might not be happening in that story.
Jane Jones (50:27)
Sure, that's probably the recipe why yours works well is because you have the story, you have this brilliant idea, and there's lots of reasons and value for doing that. And then you go to somebody, and you get some support with editing. And so yes, that's really what I want. That's okay. And then you go to the person that is doing the editing, the illustrating is writing for those words. So, they're writing. for the words that are the right words to communicate what's coming from inside, hear from you. And whatever other collaborations you have with, like is it Master of Vo?
Kim Ann (51:12)
Yeah, Master of Ninja, yes.
Jane Jones (51:14)
Yeah, and so yeah, I think it's pretty amazing. We probably have to wrap up because oh my gosh, I could be talking to you for hours.
Kim Ann (51:23)
I can talk.
Jane Jones (51:25)
My mom said I was born talking, so I have to be very careful. But just on, you've given us a lot of information, a lot of important things, but if a woman is, don't have any good ideas, I don't have anything to write about, nobody's interested in that, what piece of advice or a couple piece of advice would you say to that woman who's thinking that?
Kim Ann (51:50)
Inspiration comes from anywhere, right? When I rescued my dog, she was obsessed with socks. And I thought it was just the funniest, quirkiest thing. So, I do have Goldy the Puppy and the Missing Socks. And that book is loved on Amazon. Right?
Jane Jones (52:08)
Yeah
Kim Ann (52:09)
And then also just remember how I really started was seeing a post on Facebook with a little girl in a witch costume with rainbow leggings. And then, that's when my light bulb went off. So maybe their light bulb just hasn't gone off yet, but it doesn't mean that they can't start learning now the way like I did. I started learning because I knew I wanted to do this. And then I waited for the right idea.
Jane Jones (52:33)
Being patient, I really liked that. That's really helpful. I would like to dive in a little bit more deeper about your journaling and all those things, but we'll do that another day. Kim, I'd really thank you so much for your generosity and not just now, but in all of this and the part that your husband and your daughter and your son play in all of this. And I know that when we first met, I was with my granddaughters, and I was keeping an eye on them so I didn't stop and chat. I just got your business card. But one day I’ll come down without them and I’ll stop in, and we’ll say hello and pick up a couple of more books.
Kim Ann (53:12)
Awesome, sounds good.
Jane Jones (53:14)
Alrighty. Take care, everybody.
Kim Ann (53:14)
Thank you.
Jane Jones (53:14)
Thanks. Bye bye.
Kim Ann (53:17)
Thank you.
Jane Jones (53:18)
Okay. Bye bye.
Thank you for joining the We Women Writers podcast today. I appreciate you taking your time to listen in. I do hope that you've been inspired by this conversation. And I'd like to encourage you to pick up your pen today and write for five minutes. I would love to hear from you. Please subscribe and leave a review.
Until next time, take good care and have a perfectly lovely day.