Tax Reduction Podcast
Introducing your host, Boris Musheyev, CPA. In this podcast Boris debunks the tax code by teaching you simple and effective tax strategies, so you can keep the most of what you make. His mission is to help you cut taxes and build wealth using the power of proactive tax strategies. Every episode you will gain a better understanding of how the tax code is designed to be in favor of money-making entrepreneurs like yourself.
π Download FREE PDF: 7 Write-Offs Every S-Corporation Business Owner MUST Know: https://www.7taxwriteoffs.com/?utm_source=podcast&utm_medium=homepage
Tax Reduction Podcast
Episode 56. How To Pay $0 In Taxes Using Real Estate
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If you want to know how to pay $0 in taxes as a business owner, this video is for you. I sat down with Rod Khleif, a real estate investor, entrepreneur, and host of one of the largest real estate podcasts in the world (Lifetime Cash Flow), to break down exactly how he pays $0 in taxes using real estate, and how you can do the same thing.
Rod has owned over 2,000 houses, owns thousands of apartment units, and is currently buying senior housing facilities in Texas. He also famously lost $50 million in the 2008 crash and built it all back. In this interview, we cover his comeback story, the mindset shift that took him from making $8,000 a year to over $100,000, and the exact tax strategies he uses to pay zero in taxes year after year.
First, Rod explains why 90% of millionaires either made their money in real estate or invested in it, and the main reason is the tax benefits. We talk about how the tax code is literally written to encourage real estate ownership, and how full-time real estate investors can legally write off their entire income.
Then I break down the real estate professional status and the 750 hour rule, what it actually means, and how business owners can qualify to write off active income against real estate losses. We also cover passive investing for business owners who don't have time to be an operator, and how passive losses from real estate can offset passive income.
Next, Rod and I get into cost segregation and bonus depreciation, the two strategies that allow real estate investors to write off 60 to 70% of their investment in the first year instead of waiting 39 years for commercial property depreciation. I explain how this works for S corporation owners and high-income business owners who want to reduce their tax bill fast.
We also cover the BRRRR method (Buy, Renovate, Refinance, Repeat) and how Rod uses it on apartment complexes and senior housing to pull money out tax-free for his investors. If you want to understand how real syndications work, how investors get their money back, and how the cash flow gets split between operators and limited partners, this part is for you.
Finally, Rod talks about the opportunities in real estate right now, why properties are selling for 35% less than they did in 2022, and why senior housing and assisted living are some of the biggest opportunities for business owners looking to invest passively or become operators.
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π Download FREE PDF: 7 Write-Offs Every S-Corporation Business Owner MUST Know: https://7taxwriteoffs.com/?el=podcast&htrafficsource=buzzsprout
*Disclaimer This material & presentation content is for informational and educational purposes only. This material and presentation content is designed to provide general information regarding the subject matter covered. It is not intended to serve as legal, tax, or other financial advice related to individual situations. Because each individualβs legal, tax, and financial situation is different, specific advice should be tailored to the particular circumstances. For this reason, you are advised to consult with your attorney, accountant, tax preparer, and/or other advisor regarding your specific situation or your clientβs specific situation. The information and all accompanying material are for your use and convenience only.
Zero-Tax Hook And Setup
SPEAKER_02If you want to know how to pay zero dollars in taxes, then this podcast is for you. Because right now I'm bringing on a guest. His name is Rod Cleve. He's an entrepreneur, a businessman, and an investor. And he pays zero dollars in taxes. So I actually brought him on on my podcast and talk about how does he pay zero dollars in taxes and how is it even possible? So enjoy this interview, learn, and start paying zero dollars in taxes.
SPEAKER_00Welcome to the tax reduction podcast for money-making entrepreneurs with Boris Musheev. Boris has helped entrepreneurs across the United States collectively save millions of dollars in taxes with the power of tax planning and advisory. The only way you, the business owner, can save money on taxes is by using proactive tax strategies. And this podcast is all about saving you money on taxes. Boris will share with you in-depth and easy to understand tax reduction strategies that you can implement in your business within 30 days or less. Let's jump into today's episode.
Rodβs Story From Immigrant To Investor
SPEAKER_02All right, everybody. Welcome to our tax reduction podcast. And today we're actually going to do something a little bit unusual. We have a guest, Rod Cleef. Okay, and uh we're gonna talk a little bit about him uh in a second. As you guys know, we always introduce tax strategies in this podcast. Well, Rod is actually a real estate investor, and uh he's a seasoned real estate investor, he's an entrepreneur and a host of I think largest uh uh podcasts for the real estate, right? Uh Rod, a lifetime cash flow.
SPEAKER_01Largest real estate podcast for commercial real estate pretty much on the planet.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, I'm just because your team said you've got over 20 million downloads already. Yeah, it's closer to 30. Actually, closer to 30, actually. All right, and you yourself own thousands of properties and you build uh businesses in the past, and now you're coaching a global community, and whose students now basically own your students own uh multifamily uh units. And what's really interesting about your uh background, what I read is that you have a pretty big comeback after losing a lot uh after 2008. So that kind of shaped you up to be who you are today and to uh shaped you up from that experience. So would love to hear more a little bit about you and that comeback story from 2008. I think it was 50 million dollars that you lost. And then I want to touch on tax angles of it, Rod. How you know investing in real estate helped you on taxes, your students and everybody that you touch. Sure. So I'll let you say it there.
SPEAKER_01Well, there's a reason 90% of the world's millionaires either made their money in real estate or invested in real estate. The main reason is the tax benefits. I haven't paid taxes in years. It's a reason Trump didn't want to show his tax returns. He doesn't pay taxes. If you're a full-time real estate investor, you don't pay taxes. That's the way the tax laws are written to promote uh, you know, property ownership and encourage property ownership. So it's a beautiful thing. But so I'm a Dutch immigrant, you know. Think wind wooden shoes and windmills. Immigrated to this country when I was six years old, and my brother Albert, my mother's vancha. By the way, I lived in Israel. I can see I used to speak Hebrew at one time. I've forgotten it all, but I just thought I'd mention that because I saw that you are you're Jewish. But uh, you know, so immigrated when I was six, uh, ended up in um Denver, Colorado. We didn't have much growing up. Uh in fact, I remember we ate expired food, believe it or not. That was an expired food store. Uh, drank powdered milk with our cyril in the morning because it was cheaper than real milk. And trust me, it sounds better than it is. And I wore clothes from the Goodwill and the Salvation Yarmony all the way through junior high school until I got a job at Burger King, lying about my age because you had to be 15 and I was only 14, but uh that way I could buy my own clothes finally. And you know, I'm sure you've got listeners had it harder than I did, maybe have it harder now with all the craziness, but I knew I wanted more. And luckily, my mom had an incredible work ethic. So she babysat kids so we'd have enough money to eat. And with her babysitting money, she invested in the stock market, but also invested in real estate. And uh first real estate acquisition was a house right across the street she bought from us when I was about 14 for 30 grand. When I was 17, she told me she'd made$20,000 in her sleep that had gone up$20,000. I was what, and this is when$20,000 was a lot of money, mind you. We're talking 1977. And I was like, what? You made$20,000, you didn't do anything? Screw college, I'm getting into real estate. So I got into real estate, made about$8,000 my first year,$10,000 my second year, but my third year I made over$100,000, which back in 1980 was some pretty decent money. So what happened between year two and year three that caused me to 10x my income? Well, what happened was I met a guy that taught me about the importance of mindset and psychology and how really that's 80 to 90% of your success in anything. Only 10 to 20 percent is the tax strategies, the real estate strategies, buying, building businesses. It's really doing it. And, you know, and fast forward to today, I've owned over 2,000 houses. I've rented long term. I own multiple, I own thousands of apartment units now. I'm actually buying senior housing now as well. Uh, in 2006, my net worth went up 17 million dollars. And you might say, wow, and I said wow, and I got a head so big I could barely fit it through a door, and I thought I was a real estate god. And you know, when that happens, the God will give you a nice little smack down. Well, that was 2008, like you mentioned. I lost$50 million conservatively in 2008. And so, what I'm known for talking about, I mean, I know we're gonna talk about tax strategies, but I'm known for talking about the mindset it took to have 50 million to lose. This is what I talk about in my boot camps and in my podcast is mindset and psychology. And really the mindset it took to recover from that as well, to the success that I'm blessed to have today. So, you know, that's uh that's my story in a very quick nutshell. Um, I love it.
SPEAKER_02And there's a lot of there's a lot to unpack uh from what you said. Uh first of all, I we're definitely going to dive deep into how you can pay no taxes, right? That's number one, and how you are successful in doing that. But before we do that, I think a lot of listeners and a lot of successful business owners, they're very good at making money. They get very good at it, and they know that they can use real estate to save money on taxes. They don't know how to get into it, and they don't know how to make money in real estate. So you just said that in your early ages, I think you said your first real estate, you made 2,000, then 6,000, then 10,000, um, something along the lines of that.
SPEAKER_01Actually, eight, ten, and twelve, and a hundred, really, because I I started focusing on mindset. But yes.
SPEAKER_02So can you say, can you first talk about like how do you make that$8,000 in real estate?
Goal Setting And The Mindset Engine
SPEAKER_00If you have a tax preparer, then you do not have a tax advisor. The only way you can save money on taxes is by using proactive tax planning strategies that only a tax advisor can give you. Boris put together a free PDF for you, the business owner. Seven tax write-offs every S Corporation business owner must know. In this PDF, you can find seven tax strategies that you can start using in your business to instantly start saving money on taxes. Click on the link in the description below for a free download.
SPEAKER_01What does that mean? Is that a good idea? I got my real estate brokers. Yeah, no, I got my real estate broker's license right when I turned 18, which you could do back then with education. I could have had my own office. They got smart now. You need some experience to have an office. But uh, I was smart enough to go work for another broker, and that's the gentleman I was talking about that taught me about mindset. But uh no, I was selling real estate. I was I was going out there and listing properties for sale, um, and then uh for two years, and then then I had that mindset shift and I started buying properties, and that's when I that's when I started making a lot more money. But you know, it was mindset that caused me to to take that leap. And um and yeah, there's the answer to your question. What shift in the mindset though, Rod? There's a lot of pieces. I mean, we could we could that to unpack that would take a little bit, but but basically the first piece is you've got to create a hunger. And um, you know, if you come to one of my boot camps, the first thing we do for the first hour is goal setting on steroids. Because how do you get anything if you don't know what it is? And um, you know, people spend more time planning a birthday party than they do designing their lives. And doing your goals is designing your life. In fact, if you're listening, even if you're not interested in real estate, I uh I do a goal setting workshop. It's at my link tree. It's free. You I'm not gonna try to sell you anything, it's like an hour long. There's a guide you can download. If you go to rodslinks.com, at the bottom is my goal setting workshop. There's a guide, like I say, you can download. It's rodslinks.com.
SPEAKER_02I'll put the links in the show notes.
SPEAKER_01Yeah, yeah, but but but do that. Have your spouse do it, have your kid, if they're over 10 years old, do it. Design your life because that's what creates that desire, that hunger to actually go out and do it. You know, a lot of people are are comfortable, Boris, or they're fearful, or they have limiting beliefs and that hold them back. And and so you've got to create that compelling, you know, the goals that are compelling and measurable uh to uh to get you to take action. So that starts there.
SPEAKER_02So one thing when I started my business, I started doing a lot of self-development and you know, in you know, obviously changing my mindset about a lot of things. And I've noticed that my wife was a teacher at that time, and I was like, whoa, we're we're having this big shift. My mindset is going this way, and she's a teacher. We need to make sure we're on the same level. So it took me two years to convince her to quit her teaching job, come work with me in a business and run this business together. Now we're successfully doing it for about five years, and she caught up on that mindset. So, what you're saying about have your spouse watch it and have your spouse do goal setting, it's absolutely critical to the business success before you even start having that big tax bill or start investing in real estate.
SPEAKER_01I agreed. No, I agree completely. It's uh my hats off to you. I my if I had uh I it's an ex-wife now, although I still love her dearly. But if we'd worked together, we would have imploded. So I my hat's off to you. But uh, you know, I will tell you, um, you know, your children as well. If they're over 10 years old, for God's sakes, have them do it, design their lives. But uh so it starts with goal setting, and then the next piece you have to make a decision. So when I lost everything, I reassociated with my goals. But it's the same thing, it's the same pathway if you're just getting started or you want to get going. So it starts with the goals, then you have to make a decision to actually do something, you know. And I don't mean dip your toe in the water, one foot in, one foot out. I mean, it's done. You decide it's done, and then you then you have to take that first step. And back then, you know, I made a decision.
Losing $50M And Building Back
SPEAKER_02You had a pretty big fall in 2008, so 50 million, I think you said conservatively. How do you come back from that? What's what mindset? It's a it's a mindset now on a different level. You know, it's everything that you built up up to that point, and now it's you have to develop a new mindset to have that come back.
SPEAKER_01No, it's honestly it's very similar to just getting started. It's like I said, I reassociated with my goals. I mean, listen, I hid under a rock for a couple months feeling sorry for myself, but then I got uh you know, I'm like, okay, enough's enough. I reassociated with my goals, got clear on what I wanted again, uh, made a decision. Enough is enough. I started another company. Uh yeah, but you got to take that first step as well. You gotta actually take action.
SPEAKER_02How long did you allow yourself to be under the rock?
SPEAKER_01Uh, two or three months, probably. Yeah. Um, yeah. I mean, it was painful. I thought I was set, thought I was set for life, Morris. And and, you know, I really thought I was set for life. And it just imploded. I mean, listen, in my defense, countries went bankrupt in 2008 and nine, Iceland, for example, you know, and uh, and I by the way, I was only at a 30% loan to value. That's all I owed. And I still crashed and burned, just to give you some context. People are like, oh, you were overextended. No, I wasn't. But uh anyway, and so so yeah, I reassort associated with my goals, made a decision, took the first step to get going and pull myself out, you know, um, pushed through fear and limiting beliefs that I had, you know. When I immigrated this country, Boris, I didn't speak English, got thrown into school, found out what bullies were for the first time, got my butt kicked occasionally, hadn't learned how to fight back yet. And then my mom, proud Dutch woman that she was, sent me to school in wooden shoes and those leather shorts the Germans wear for Oktoberfests, crack cocaine for the bullies. So I got my ass kicked again. And, you know, I came up with this belief system that I wasn't good enough. I used to ask myself, how can I show them I'm good enough? And, you know, and so a lot of people have these limiting beliefs. So if you're aware of them consciously, drag them out into the daylight, look at them with your adult rational mind. You'll recognize that they're BS. There's a reason the acronym for belief systems is BS, because they they are, you know, we believe they're real, but they're not. And you know, I used to be afraid to raise my hand in front of a class of 10 kids, and now I speak in front of thousands of people a year, typically in flip-flops. Okay. So, you know, you can you can push past these limiting beliefs. But uh, you know, that's that's that's kind of what I did.
Real Estate Professional Status Explained
SPEAKER_02I just pulled myself back up. I appreciate you sharing that. I think uh I think we as entrepreneurs that battle is every day on different levels, obviously, on different levels, not a$50 million loss level, but we all have the a few dose levels. So I appreciate you saying that. I do want to jump in a little bit, pivot into uh what you do in real estate, uh, what type of a real estate, and then how do you how how have you achieved that? So I want to understand exactly what you do in real estate and how do we can apply it to the listeners who are listening to pay zero dollars in taxes being in real estate.
SPEAKER_01Real estate, real estate. If you if you do real estate, I forgot what the the the hours are for the real estate classification, you know better than I. How many hours do you have to do?
SPEAKER_02700 is 750.
SPEAKER_01Okay. You do real estate for 750 hours a year. You can pretty much write off everything you do in real estate. I mean, it's extraordinary. And so uh, you know, but what I do is is, you know, I've owned 2,000 houses. I rented long term. I own thousands of apartments. I've got six assisted living facilities under contract in Texas right now. Screaming deal. There's incredible opportunity right now in real estate, by the way. A lot of people in trouble because of the interest rate uh going up. They got adjustable rate debt, expenses are higher. So there's incredible opportunity right now. But uh, and senior housing is another incredible opportunity, you know, 8,000 people a day turning 80 in this country. But, you know, I buy, I I teach people how to buy these larger uh real estate uh uh asset classes like apartment complexes, like senior housing, like retail strip centers, like you know, industrial flex space, uh mobile home parks, uh, you know, uh you name it, uh senior house, uh student housing, you name it. So and and the thing with real estate is it takes money, but it doesn't have to be your own money. There's so much money out there looking for a home, and and that ties into tax benefits as well because you can actually invest passively in these real estate transactions and you can offset that passive investment uh with uh you know tax strategies like cost regregation, like uh bonus depreciation and things of that nature, uh, which are extraordinary. Where sometimes you can write off 60, 70 percent of your investment the first year.
SPEAKER_02Yeah, and also like you don't even need to the 750 hour participation if you have a passive income already. Correct. Because the passive income can be written off by the passive losses. So the whole 750 hour rule comes in, is also you have to do be invested more than 50% in your time in real estate. So, but if you're investing in successful real estates, like you're saying, multifamily, which it produces cash flow, which then can be written off by doing cost segregation and accelerated depreciation.
Cost Segregation And Bonus Depreciation
SPEAKER_01Yeah. Have you I'm sure you've explained what cost segregation is on the show, but for those of you that haven't heard it many times, okay. Well then we'll but you can go ahead and explain it again. We always get news. Yeah, I mean, every every real estate asset class has depreciation. And basically you're able to depreciate everything above the ground. I mean, from the concrete to the roof to the walls to the, you know, you're able to depreciate. Well, I'm sorry, back up. You're able to depreciate the uh the non the everything isn't that's not the dirt, okay? And because it's got a remaining life. And you know, there's there's a typical straight line depreciation. Uh, what is it, 25 years or 20 years? I I don't pay attention to it. So uh commercial is 39.
SPEAKER_0239 and commercial is pay attention because you use cost segregation just like a lot of it.
SPEAKER_01I don't need to know it anymore. Exactly. You know, I depreciate most of it in the first year or two. So what cost segregation does, instead of waiting 39 years, you're able to massively accelerate that depreciation. You get an engineer to go through and rate the remaining life on every aspect of the building, from the walls to the floors to the windows to the doors to the roof, you name it, and they put a remaining life on it, and you're able to massively accelerate that depreciation. So it's a beautiful thing.
SPEAKER_02Ron, let me ask you this question, right? And I want to like pivot to this, right? So we've all seen, like you mentioned, Trump paid zero like$400 in taxes. What was it, like 2016, 2017 or something when they released his tax return? Um, or 2005 and 2006, whatever those years are. And a lot has to do with real estate. When he was in that debate with Hillary Clinton, she said he writes everything off. He's like, You made that law. I'm just kind of taking advantage of it. We all know this is available. And business owners, a lot of business owners, they know they know that they have to do this to be able to write it off and invest in real estate. But it's always time. And how do we change their mindset to be like, hey, we know you have a baby, which is your business, and you're making millions of dollars, and I've got a lot of clients that are netting hundreds or millions of dollars in their business, right? And it's the time commitment, right? To buy a multifamily or to invest in a multifamily, it takes time, Rod. So how do we how do we break that and how do we make that happen for a successful business owner so they can use all of those benefits and really reduce their tax liability?
Operator Or Passive Investor Playbook
Why Now Is A Buying Window
SPEAKER_01Well, there's two options here. One, they can become an operator, which is what I teach. I have a virtual boot camp pretty much every six weeks, and it's like less than a cost of a lunch to go attend it, and I don't sell anything there. So there's that. You can become an operator and do it yourself. But yes, you're gonna invest time. But I've got people that have done it part-time on the side with a full-time W-2, high-paying W-2 job, kids, church, soccer, everything, and they eclipse their income in a year. Okay, so it's doable. Yes, you're gonna grind for a few years like most people won't, but you'll live the rest of your life like most people can't. So yes, you can do it on the side with a business or with a job. But the other option is to do it passively. You invest passively in a real estate transaction, and you're, and again, take advantage of the tax benefits on the passive income. Okay, you can't do the active income, but if you, you know, if you do it full time and you do it 51 per 51% of your time, you can write off all of your income, including active income. It's it's extraordinary. So, you know, it just depends on what you know, what your bandwidth is, what your desire is. Um, but you know, we get I'm raising$7 million right now for a uh six assisted living facilities in Texas. Unbelievable deal, by the way. We're paying$40,000 a unit. You can't build one for less than$250,000 a unit, and these are nice buildings. Screaming deal. Um so you know, that's what's out there right now. There's incredible deals right now in real estate. You know, there's a lot of fear, though. That's the problem. You know, Warren Buffett's famous quote: be fearful when others are greedy. There's been a lot of greed the last few years, but the flip side of that is be greedy when others are fearful. And there's a lot of fear right now. So if there's ever a time, it's right now to get into this. I'll give you an example. I've got a 200 unit asset in San Antonio, asset we call them assets. It's a multifamily property apartment complex. And right next door to this 200 unit I own is a 300 unit that sold for 43 million and 22. The bank got it, brought, dropped the price to 28 million. I wasn't interested unless it went to 24. You invest based on cash flow. Somebody bought it, I think, at the 28, but you're thinking 43 to 28. That's what's out there right now. I've got an SEC attorney that does syndications for my students and for I, you know, where we syndicate and we take down these large apartment complexes. Syndicate means you pool money together, you raise money, and you go buy these, you know, these assets. And another another strategy I want to touch upon, which let me just finish that thought. So that SEC attorney basically told me on one day he got six foreclosures of apartment complexes on one day clients. That's what's going on right now. So just to hammer home the fact that there's a real opportunity right now. Sorry to interrupt, I just wanted to finish that thought. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02No, that's perfect. I was just going to speak to your point. When you have such a real estate, like for example, you're raising a fund of seven million dollars for a real estate. That real estate goes in the market, which I'm guessing you probably do next, and you tell me if you do this or not. You you go back to the bank and be like, hey, we got a higher rent roll. We want to finance under this, and you take the money out, pay out, pay back your investors, and they receive that tax free. Correct.
SPEAKER_01They don't pay tax on it until until the property's sold. You don't realize, and see, that's that's called the Burr method at a high level. I do it at a high level. It's buy, renovate, refinance, repeat. I do it with apartment complexes, and I'm doing it with senior housing. We buy it, we renovate it, we get the value up based on because the value is based on a multiple of the net income called the NOI, the net operating income. We get the value up, and then we get we refinance it. We get our investors all or most of their money back. That at that point the returns are infinity because they have no money in, and that money they get back is tax-free, like you said.
SPEAKER_02They you don't pay tax until they never sell from you with probably losses on the depreciation, either that they can use either in the same year, depending whether it's tax situation or push it to the future when you sell the property or they have other passive income.
SPEAKER_01That's it. And if you never sell, you never pay the tax. It's a beautiful thing. Uh so you call that a non-operator, uh uh non-operator investor, right? Well, that's passive, that's passive investing, where you're basically investing as a limited partner. Like if you want to invest in your money in this deal, I'm raising seven million for it. Unbelievable deal, by the way. Again, I'm I can't keep me up nights. It's that exciting. Uh if you want to invest in that, uh, you'll you'll get first year very good write-offs because we're going to cost segregate. And uh, and then at some point we will uh return your money, and then you're in it for infinity.
SPEAKER_02Um can we do can we do a hypothetical example of what I would look like in the first year for an investor?
How The Assisted Living Deal Works
SPEAKER_01The entire time I'm actually, I don't know when this airs. I'm actually doing a webinar on it tomorrow night. But uh um if you want, you know, there's some complexity to it because you know uh uh I I would, you know, the whole business model, why we're buying it, what we're doing to to to get the revenue up. Uh I mean it's cash flowing right now, but but it's it's um uh we're we're we're basically stealing it. I mean, it really is an expensive. Extraordinary deal, but you know, we're going in, we're we're raising seven million, we're getting debt. Uh, I think the purchase price, um, I've got so many plates spinning and so many deals work in this one. I believe it's 20 million. So we'll get debt around 12, 13 million. Um we will um stabilize these assets. We're not taking care of the seniors. I we've got an operating partner that's extremely successful. Okay, 93% occupied in their other assets right now in Texas. They are in these three cities, San Antonio, Houston, and Dallas, where these six facilities are, and they're at 93% occupied. These facilities are at 70% occupied, but we know that he he knows he can bring them up to that level. And um, you know, what we're doing, just the structure of this deal is our investors get 70% of the cash flow. We get 30%. We're not taking an acquisition fee, which is very common, where we you charge a fee up front and you take that. So we're not taking an acquisition fee. It's a 70-30 split. The investors get 70% until they get all their money back. Once they get all their money back, it goes to a 50-50 split with us the operators. Um, we do have a caveat in there because we may, you know, um, we may want to keep it. If we decide to keep it in this case, we have the option to buy our investors out, which is unusual. But we do in this case, if we if the if we give them, I think it's a 24 or 25 percent uh internal rate return, total return over the life of the of the project. Interesting. So yeah, but 2024 to 25 percent return is uh is better than a sharp stick in the eye. Let me just say that. No one's gonna be unhappy with that. So anyway, that's that's that's I I'm pretty sure I I articulated that one correctly.
SPEAKER_02Um so so for so our takeaway, and we're gonna wrap this up, right? So our takeaway takeaway is that number one, real estate can absolutely reduce your taxes to zero if you are an operator in real estate.
SPEAKER_01This oh this is why 90% of the people that that are millionaires either invest in it or made their money in it. That's a fact. That's that's not me getting it for a fact.
SPEAKER_02I know, I know, that's a fact. But see, not everybody knows how to use these facts, but it's also very important to have a the to to have uh to distinguish these two things, right? Operator, which means you are also in uh that's what I teach people. That's what I teach people how to do. That's what my boot camps are on. Where even though with passive, there's still a lot more benefits, they can offset their passive income, they can refinance tax-free, take the money out, right, or you know, carry over their losses to the future. So there's a lot of benefits. The question is where and how to get started. And I would feel comfortable. Here's the answer to share some of your concepts.
Wrap-Up And Where To Get Help
SPEAKER_01Here's the answer: get your butt to my boot camp. Okay, I do a virtual boot camp. I've got, I don't know when this airs. I've got one June 13th and 14th. There'll be one six weeks after that. It's$47 for God's sakes. I don't sell anything there. It's two days of training for$47. Yes, I give you an option to look into my coaching program. My coaching program is the most successful in the world. Uh, my students own about 300,000 multifamily units under my tutelage, something I'm very proud of, which is more than everyone else combined that teaches. Okay. Uh, they own tons of senior housing, tons of self-storage, tons of student housing, tons of mobile and parks. But come to my bootcamp, go to rodslinks.com. Rodslinks.com, my bootcamp site is there. It's$47. Hell, the bonuses are$3,000. You get my deal evaluator software, my document library, and and uh, and you'll leave knowing how to do this. Whether or not if you want to go deeper with me, you can, but I don't sell anything there. So yeah, if you're serious, even if you're gonna invest passively, don't give your hard-earned money to someone unless you understand the business. At least attend to have a basic understanding how these deals are, how they're valued, how they're presented, because I present, I show you how I present deals, and uh, and you'll learn a ton. And and we have a lot of fun. I I don't lose anybody. People come and they stay the entire weekend uh because I, you know, I spend a lot of time on mindset too. That's why my students are so successful because they actually do it. Um, and so um, yeah, it's a lot of fun. Again, rodslinks.com or text links to 72345. My goal setting is there, my my my my podcast link is there. There's a bunch of free books there that are really good, best in class books. They're not crap, they're really good. Uh, and my boot camp site is there. So yeah, if you're serious about this, here's the thing: there's so many opportunities right now, Boris. There's opportunities to buy businesses, there's opportunities to buy real estate. 10,000 people a day are turning 65. They have businesses they want to sell. You know, there's 8,000 people a day turning 80. They need assisted living. There's so many opportunities. So, you know, what I would say is pick your vehicle, decide what it's gonna be, go learn it. Start learning it right now. Even if you've got a business or you are uh, you know, uh, or you know, you you're thinking about doing a business, you can do this side hustle in real estate or you know, looking at but buying businesses, yeah, there's just so much opportunity right now. And and that's that's my that's my message. And you know, AI is gonna remove a lot of things, AI is gonna enhance a lot of things. So that's another component of this that's that's very exciting. Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_02No, I appreciate you coming on the show. I appreciate you sharing. I'm sure a lot of business owners that listen to this podcast to reduce their taxes opened up their eyes even more, and hopefully they can go and check out your link. We'll put it in the show links. Go to that boot camp,$47, whatever. It's like a uh cost of coffee. Uh as a marketer, I can tell. The reason there is even a cost to join a boot camp is to see if you're serious enough. We don't want to waste our bread.
SPEAKER_01Exactly. I would do it for I would do it for free, but then you wouldn't take it seriously. Even the 47s. I mean, we used to charge three or four hundred dollars. We're like, screw it, let's just have them come and uh you know, and and you know, it's I love it. Obviously, I love it. When you love what you do, work is play, right? And yeah, I can tell you love what you do. I can see I can feel your passion as well.
SPEAKER_02So I'll tell I'll tell you something interesting. Sometimes business owners come to us, they say, tell us about a strategy that you're gonna use on my taxes to reduce it. So if we give them a strategy before they pay, like, yeah, I'm not sure I want to do it. But after they pay thousands of dollars and you give them the exact same strategies, oh my god, I absolutely love it. It's funny how that works. Yeah, that's funny. It's all right, anyways. Rod, thanks so much and uh pleasure having you.
SPEAKER_01Thank you, buddy. I appreciate it. It was a pleasure to meet you.
SPEAKER_00That's it for today's episode. Be sure to check out the description below for some free tax reduction resources that Boris put together for you. If you're ready to work with a tax advisor on your tax planning, be sure to schedule your call by heading over to www.taxplanningcall.com. That's www.taxplanningcall.com. And be sure to subscribe to our podcast to be notified when the next strategy is released.