Spreading God’s Love through Missionary Work

Host Dr. Brian Reynolds, Chancellor of the Archdiocese of Louisville, welcomes Father Charlie Dittmeier and Sister Susan Gatz, SCN, to discuss missionary work. Father Dittmeier and Sister Gatz share their lived experiences as missionaries, the impact of their work, and how it has deepened their faith life.

Transcript

SPEAKER_02 0:17

Hello everyone. I'm Ryan Rams, the Chancellor with the Archdiocese of Louisville. Welcome to our podcast series, What's New in Arch Lou. This show highlights the people and ministries of the Archdiocese, the Catholic Church in Central Kentucky. We invite you to join us each month as we welcome guests to discover more information about our local Catholic Church and our Catholic faith, in the hopes that it will deepen your own experience as you engage with your Catholic faith. This program is brought to you by the ArchLou Podcast Network. Well, folks, we made it to May. May is always a busy season in Kentucky. Those of you who are listening to us from beyond the country, so much goes on because it always starts with the first week of May, which means the Kentucky Derby. But we do more things in May than horse races. Obviously, across the country, lots of sacraments. It's first communion time and wedding times and graduations. So all of that is part of what's going on in the church. But we are going to do something totally different than that today. We have two great guests who are going to discuss the missionary work of the church. And I'm pleased to welcome Father Charlie Dittmeyer and Sister Susan Gatz. Welcome both of you. Glad you're here.

SPEAKER_01 1:27

Thank you. Thank you.

SPEAKER_02 1:28

Now tell you a little bit about them and they'll tell you, add something to this. Father Charlie is a priest of the Archdiocese ordained in 1970. So just recently celebrated another Jubilee year of 55 years, I guess. That'd be that right? Yeah. Yes. He returned home after lots of work with the Marion missionaries. He returned home in 2025, having served in Hong Kong and Cambodia since 1987. His local assignments before that was working with the Catholic Deaf community here in Louisville and at Angela Marisi High School. He also spent two years working with the Deaf in India. Father Charlie is a graduate of Columbia, St. Columba, St. Columba School here in Louisville. And we welcome you there and welcome you uh to be part of our show today. Sister Susan Katz is a good friend. She's uh a graduate of Presentation Academy, is a member of the Sisters of Charity of Nazareth for 60 years. That's impossible. Um she has served in leadership with her community as provincial vice president and president. She was the founding director of the SCN Office for Mission Advancement and has been a member of the Archdaws and Prison Ministry team since 2008. Okay, besides that formal introductions, let's have you tell a little bit more about yourself. Father Charlie, get us started. Tell us a little bit about you.

SPEAKER_01 2:48

Well, as you mentioned, I've been the last 40 years in Asia working with deaf people. I've just returned five months ago, and I'm sort of getting re-acclimated to what you Americans do here. Yeah. When I the last Mass I had in Cambodia, um one woman came up afterwards and said, Are you going home or are you leaving home? And I said, Well, it's really it's both. And uh I'm coming home, but it's not the home I left. Louisville has changed, the church has changed, the world has changed. So I'm just back now and um going to every meeting I can to see what's happening, who's doing it, and what or how it can fit into things.

SPEAKER_02 3:24

Well, you you I I notice you everywhere we turn. You're being part of many things that's going on in the diocese. We're glad to have you back here. We call it home for you.

SPEAKER_01 3:32

Thank you.

SPEAKER_02 3:32

But because we always we always used to brag about uh Charlie, who's doing our missionary work for our diocese in in the in Asia. So thank you for your long service there. And a little tidbit about Charlie. He's he he rode his bicycle here today. It was about a 40-minute bike ride because that's how he gets around this community. He did that in Cambodia, I guess, is how you got around. So you practice it in Louisville. Uh those roads in Louisville are not exactly like Cambodia. So it's a thank goodness. Okay. Sister Susan, tell us a little bit more about you.

SPEAKER_00 4:03

Well, uh, I grew up in Holy Family Parish, and you may be your office may be like where my first grade class was. Who knows? Because you all are now there at Holy Family, where the old school was. Uh, as you said, I went to Presentation Academy, and um I knew the Sisters of Charity of Nazareth from the time I was six years old. So when I was little, they fascinated me. When I got a little older, I admired them and eventually they inspired me to join the community. And so um my uh first mission actually was back at Presentation Academy. I was there for five years. Then after that, it uh my ministries took me um to places where it put me in um multicultural situations. I worked in a Mexican-American parish down in Texas, uh, a parish in Florida where we had both Hispanic and Haitian uh uh migrants, and I worked in rural Mississippi. Then I was in leadership in the congregation for a number of years, and because I was in leadership, I was able to then um visit all of the countries where our sisters are and be able to see what the work they were doing. So I feel really blessed to have had that kind of experience where it took me out into the broader world, the broader church to see the beauty uh and the interculturality of the church and the complexity of the church.

SPEAKER_02 5:34

Both of you have been to many, many countries and continents, I guess really. And uh it'll be great to hear some more about that. But I I want to start before we get into your personal stories of that uh information, tell us what I'd like to know what why does the church have a missionary goal? I mean, it it sounds like a strange question and maybe obvious to some people. But um when I grew up, missionaries were what we heard about were people somewhere off in far-off places taking care of small children who needed food or clothes. And so that that's an old imagery from seventy years ago. But I remember that growing up thinking about missionary that way. But the missionary work of the church is not just that, that's some of it, I guess. But tell us, um what what is the goal of a missionary work of the church? Maybe either one of you could just so big picture first.

SPEAKER_01 6:25

Um Charlie, can you well I guess for me uh thinking about it, I I going back to old childhood visions of missionaries. I was thinking about somebody teaching the rosary to people in Africa or something like that. And um basically I see it now is implementing the gospel, um, letting people know that God is there, that God is love, God loves us, and we're supposed to love each other, and trying to create the situations and conditions and give the resources to help them to to do that, to be at peace, live in their families and just enjoy life and being part of God's family and helping each other. So it it like you said, it's very a very broad picture.

SPEAKER_02 7:10

Yeah, very good. Sister Susan?

SPEAKER_00 7:12

I would go along with what Father Charlie just said. I think that um the what what we used to think of as uh missionary work was what we would now call cross-cultural mission work. And that's just one aspect of the mission of the of the church. And it it is, I mean, what was the last thing that Jesus said to his disciples is you know, go on out there to everywhere and let people know about God's love and mercy and help to build up a world that looks like the world that God has uh the vision for. Um and I think that's our mission as baptized, all baptized people are missionaries, actually. I don't think we think about that, but I think really we are. And in particular, I think if we think about how Jesus lived his life, who did he go out to? He went out to those who were on the margins, and kind of like Father Charlie said, to help heal, to help people live a full life. And I I think that's that's what we are called to do today. All of us are called to do today.

SPEAKER_02 8:24

And when we hear missionary, again, because of some of the connotations or even our uh early stories it we think of elsewhere. But but some of the same needs exist in our own country. So is missionary always away or is it here? How does how does how do you how do you resolve that question?

SPEAKER_00 8:44

Well, um I can uh when I thought about this question, I thought about we have sisters here in the United States, in Belize, in uh in Central America, in India, Nepal, Botswana, and Kenya. And in the US, Belize, and India, those ministries are um the S sisters of charity who are from those countries who are doing that work. In um Nepal, Botswana, and Kenya, we have sisters from India who are there doing the work. So it's kind of a both and. It's like you're doing mission mission work, you are doing that work of sharing the gospel uh in the country where you are. I how I kind of thought about it was why do we go to someplace else to do what to do that? And I think sometimes it's a it's a matter of sharing resources that we have some expertise, we have some uh some things that we can share. In the the historically, we went to some of those countries because bishops invited us to come, and because or because the Jesuits invited us to come, because they knew the community, and they saw that we had something that we could share with the people who were that who were there.

unknown 10:06

Okay.

SPEAKER_02 10:06

Very good. Okay, Father Charlie, get us into your story. Well, how did you get into this kind of work? You were into deaf ministry here locally, but how did you transition as a priest serving the deaf community in Louisville, Kentucky, to be a missionary serving the deaf in Asia?

SPEAKER_01 10:23

I got into deaf work from Father Jerry Timmel. I was taking courses and programs at Central State Hospital to work in mental health. And he before I was ordained a deacon, he wrote to all of us and said, Are any of you interested in getting into deaf work? And I wrote back and told him no. Um But uh he said, We're having a deaf summer camp, come and spend a week with us. I did, and I got curious. Some of the my last year in a seminary, I got myself assigned to work with the deaf community in Baltimore. And then I came back here and kept on going. And it just it just was something I really enjoyed, especially sign language. But one of the there were only like six or seven priests in at that time in the early, late 60s, early 70s, working with Catholic deaf people. And um, we would meet every year of the week before Ash Wednesday and just talk shop. What kind of sign language do you use? What how's your program work? And one year a priest from India came, a Holy Cross priest, and invited, he said, if any of you are ever interested in working with us, uh come and join us. Um I'd always, when I was a kid, wanted to work in another country. I was gonna learn the language so well they wouldn't know I was a foreigner. I ended up in Asia. They're always gonna know I'm a foreigner. But um, I ended up going to his, I went, spent two years in the deaf school in Bangalore, India, fell in love with Asia, came back, and Archbishop Kelly, I told him, met with him and said, I'd like to go back longer term. And I met Marinole in Asia. Could I join with him? He said, Oh, we could do that. So I became a Mary-noll associate priest. You're supposed to go five years and come get mission experience and come back to your diocese. I didn't come back. I spent 39 years with Mary Noll and um just came back last September. But uh it it was it was just wonderful just going there and a lot of the things, the the mission, the ideas of mission are the same, both here and there. Um as you mentioned, the resources. That that's what we were able to do, bring resources, bring training, sometimes bringing equipment, bringing programs of work, best practices and stuff. So things that wanted to do here, I did in Hong Kong and then later on in in uh in um in Cambodia. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 12:37

Why you? Why did you say yes to missionary work? You said it was interesting, you were curious, always but why you?

SPEAKER_01 12:47

Well I I I'm from a I'm the oldest of eight children, and we're a really strong family. I always thought we were just a normal family started until I started working as a priest with other families and found so many of them that were dysfunctional, and brothers and sisters hadn't seen each other for 20 years and had no desire to. And uh I I think it's that family bond. Um, and to me that that's sort of what the kingdom of God is, the reign of God. It it's all people, brothers and sisters, working together, loving each other, caring for each other. So, in a sense, that was part of my upbringing. But then uh there was a desire in me to kind of work to make that happen. Um that's probably why I became a priest, but also too working with deaf people and and just mission in general. Um, if I have something to offer, if I can do something that they need, then I I'd be really happy to do it.

SPEAKER_02 13:45

I I I watched you in in articles you've written for the record and and uh occasional visits back here over the last 35 years that I've known you. It's been it's been so interesting because most of the time Dawson priesthood is defined by what parish do you assign to. But here we have uh Father Charlie Jumeyer, who's a missionary serving the deaf uh and is a priest. So it's it's you added two characteristics that are less found in our Dawson priesthood. And that's something that we've always had fun as a local church being proud of with you. So I just wanted to thank you for that kind of thing. Oh, thank you.

SPEAKER_01 14:26

It's been a good ride.

SPEAKER_02 14:28

Sister Susan, tell us about the work you started to say a little bit about before about some of the countries you what's the work of the sisters of charity nazareth around the world? And and maybe you could tell us even about some of your visits if you want to, but tell us about your your time.

SPEAKER_00 14:41

Sure.

SPEAKER_02 14:41

Sure.

SPEAKER_00 14:42

Um well, how many hours do we have? Uh as I said, we're in uh United States, Belize, Botswana, India, Nepal, and Kenya. And the ministries there uh vary, um, but for the most part, we're um, you know, we have schools, we have health care of different kinds, parish ministry, social, social work in those different places. And um I'll just tell uh a couple of uh of stories just to kind of give you a flavor. In Belize, for example, our sister Carlette uh is a social worker. She is herself Belizean, and she began a program for the elderly there uh after she did a survey in one of the really um poorest sections of Belize City, and she discovered how neglected the elders were. And so she set up a program and she calls it Life, uh L-I-F-E, which means living in full existence. And uh so now uh she's with she has about a hundred elderly uh men and women, and they they're visited, they're what are their needs, they're helped with whatever their needs are. Sometimes their house needs to be repaired, go to the doctor. Uh they do fun things with them that bring them together for socialization. And so um, you know, once a month they have a uh a dinner for them and they all come together and and that sort of thing. The other thing, and so that's meeting the needs of those people. The other thing that it did is it raised the awareness in Belize of the needs of the elderly. And so uh it's a you know, when we work, we try to think how do we meet that need, but also how do we look at the system that isn't functioning for people? And so just bringing that awareness up uh has caused other people to think about well, what do we need to do in order to care for our elderly uh uh population?

SPEAKER_02 16:43

That's a great story, a very practical imagery. Father Charlie, do you was that true in Asia? Did did you deal with helping the community, the the world, the country, to learn about the deaf community and learn about Catholic faith?

SPEAKER_01 16:59

Oh, yeah, that very much. The worst part of deafness is isolation. If you ask an articulate deaf person what's the worst part of being deaf, they won't say, I can't hear. Um they'll say it's isolation. And that's trying to integrate people into communities. You just mentioned your LIFE program. We had something very, very similar. The average deaf person who comes to us in Cambodia has literally no language. We don't compete with the deaf schools. We take people, young people who have never been to school. They come to us, they're 18, 19 years of age, they have no sign language, no spoken language, no written language, they have never talked to a human being in their life.

SPEAKER_02 17:41

My goodness.

SPEAKER_01 17:42

And you can imagine what that does to you emotionally, psychologically, developmentally, and um life and engage helping people to engage in life. Um the American slang, you tell people get a life. They these young deaf people come to us, the first thing we do is teach them sign language. They have never even spoken to their parents. Um, you know, the and I can like you, I can go on for hours. You know, the um 80 percent of our education is caught rather than taught. Like right now, people listening to a podcast, they're that's this isn't a classroom, we're not teaching, but they're hearing something, and they learn about working with the Sisters of Charity or with Deaf Work or something. We we heal all these TV commercials with the diseases and acronyms and stuff I've never heard of before, um, you catch so much. Deaf people don't get any of that. And so you know the all they know is what they see with their eyes, and many times they misinterpret that. So the first thing they do when they come to us, we teach them sign language and they start talking, and they kind of explode because for the first time they can talk about their dreams, their hopes, or fears, what's going on. They can have friends, you know, never having talked to a human being, literally. And and then you know, they get a life, and it it just so good to see that explode.

SPEAKER_02 19:06

Help us with another vignette, help us, yeah.

SPEAKER_00 19:09

And I'd like to pick up on what you said about uh getting a life. And I think that in all much of the work that we do, what our sisters are doing is helping people get a life. Okay. Um another example is from India, and I visited there uh in Bhakti Yapur, um that there are slums. And so the children in those slums they call them rag pickers because every morning these young people, little ones up to into high school, they get up, they go out, they scour the city or the town to gather anything they can that they can sell bottles, rags, cardboard, whatever they can sell. And as a result of that, being out there in the morning, they don't go to school. So their life is really circumscribed. And and they would stay as rag pickers all of their life. Except Sister Lena there had a program where in the afternoon she had school. She taught them, she taught them to read, you know, taught them they were there together, they got affirmation, they got confidence, they they learned and and were able then to think about having a different kind of life, to have they could have a dream of going on to high school, for example, those kinds of things. So that that's just another example of how the work that our sisters do, training young women in in programs. I mean, uh in India particularly, the women are really down in the in society, and especially if they're poor, and our sisters have programs for them, they have co-ops that help these women gain personal confidence, gain skills, and be able then to support themselves financially and their families also. So that's the kind of work that that our sisters are doing around the world, actually.

SPEAKER_02 21:11

Sister Susan, the the the commu the community, and I don't want to stereotype it, but the Sisters of Tyranazareth, at least locally, are known for education and health care. Um and I know the social work and other things have gone on. I know there's other things. How does missionary work fit in in in in 2026? Now, how does the missionary work of the church fit into the Mother Catherine's original vision and the work and education and and there's another w wide open question here. Wha how does this work how does this fit into what the work of the Sisters Today?

SPEAKER_00 21:44

Well, um we kind of have a saying uh if Mother Catherine were here, she would go. And um, and I think that that's true. Every time we've made a move into another uh country and we've been invited into these places. We've done serious discernment about should we do it, should we not? Uh when uh when we went to Botswana, we spent a couple of years. We sent a team there to look, to meet, to see what were the needs, and and did we have something that we could bring to that? And I think that's exactly what Mother Catherine did. They were invited to go places or they saw needs that were not being met, and and they they went because they felt called to that. And that's what I see the our community doing. It's like we feel called to go to someplace and to share what we have. Okay. Very good.

SPEAKER_02 22:42

Charlie, how do Father Charlie, how does how do um the people who you were serving in that part of the world react to American missionaries?

SPEAKER_01 22:52

Surprisingly well, from an American point of view. Okay. We bombed the heck out of them in the Vietnam War. We weren't weren't at war with Cambodia. We dropped more ordnance on Cambodia than we did on Japan in World War II. We weren't at war with Cambodia. Um so and you can still flying over Cambodia, you see the bomb crew. They call them the bomb ponds, the B-52, just series of bomb ponds. Um but they they they loved what we did. Um a lot of the it's a very young population. A lot of the older ones were killed in the war. And then the Khmer Rouge came and killed, you know, they lost one one quarter of their population uh in the late 70s. So but now coming in and bringing skills, resources, equipment, programs, um, they like that. The government likes it too. If you're bringing in money and stuff like that, the government's all for you. They they certainly give us a lot of hassle for other things. But um i it basically we're we're well received. The church has a much larger footprint than its numbers would justify. There Cambodia has 16 million people. There are 5,000 Cambodian Catholics. Oh my goodness. We have parishes that have 5,000 people in one parish. That's the whole country. There are 5,000 Cambodian Catholics, 15,000 uh Vietnamese Catholics came in for because of the war. And then I had I had I was pastor of the English-speaking parish. We were the largest parish in the country with 800 people. Um so it's just just really, really different, though.

SPEAKER_02 24:27

Yeah. And you were before you were in Cambodia, you were uh I was 13 years in Hong Kong. And that was very different, I would think.

SPEAKER_01 24:34

Oh, Hong Kong is first world. I mean, the everything that could the United States has, Hong Kong has. It's probably better organized.

SPEAKER_02 24:43

Yeah, very good. Uh uh evangelization, you know, a lot of this, if you're if you were asked this question from the view of the church's theology, um missionary work is an evangelization activity. Um uh because it's bringing the good news that uh which is the ultimate goal of evangelization, meeting Jesus Christ. Um uh but where does uh talking about God, Jesus, faith, religion fit into the you're helping these women in life, um taking human skills, helping the deaf to communicate for the first time. Where's Jesus in this? Either one you want to pick that one up?

SPEAKER_00 25:26

I think the idea of um missionary work has shifted a little bit, uh perhaps. Um, and I think that in mission work, you are going to be the presence of Christ there. And uh and how you are you are and what you're doing is bringing that presence of Christ. In India, actually, it's against the law for them to proselytize or to convert. And so, for example, in our schools there, the children that we're teaching are almost all Hindus. The population of Catholics in India is very small. And so, so you're you're there, and what you're doing is you're teaching those children. They know who you are, they're that witness is there for them. And what you're doing is building up the reign of God because you're teaching those children values, and and whether it's explicit or not, they're going out of that school, not only with with what they need to do to live their lives, but they're also going out with values of know thinking about caring for each other, caring for the earth, knowing that there are those who are uh on the margins and the poor and that sort of thing that they might not have gotten, well they wouldn't have gotten if they had gone to a government school, for example. So you're you're building up that um that reign of God in India. It that's in India. Every country is different.

SPEAKER_02 26:59

But the guts, yeah, the and the famous line often used by Catholic charities around here and elsewhere around the world is that we're doing this not because they're Catholic, but because we're Catholic.

unknown 27:08

Correct.

SPEAKER_02 27:09

And I guess and that's good. Same would you, Father Charlie? Would that be the same kind of imagery?

SPEAKER_01 27:14

Oh, very much. You you you you mentioned presence and and for deaf people, everything is uh visual and they see what's going on, what we're doing. One of the guiding principles for me, in Matthew's gospel, you have two different visions of evangelization or two interpretations. Matthew 25 is the sheep and the goats, do this as for others as you would do it for me. Matthew 28, Jesus tells his disciples at the ascension, go out, make disciples of all nations and baptize them. I don't see our goal as baptizing everybody. I do see our goal as feeding people, clothing them, helping them marginalize. So it's very, very much uh, you know, just a general picture. I I didn't baptize one deaf person in Cambodia in 25 years.

SPEAKER_02 28:00

Wow. This is so so many more questions listening to these stories. Um can I ask a little more personal because we only have a few minutes here? Um how has the mission work that you both experience among your your communities, the people you you serve, the other sisters, the that marry no fathers and brothers and lay missionaries, how has it affected you personally? Because you've also had other things you've done in your life. How how does how what has happened to you because you've had these uh awarenesses? Can I ask that?

SPEAKER_00 28:37

Um I think for me, what it has done is um it's um it's opened my heart and my mind, but it's opened my heart to um to a world that's out there. I think if you if you don't go to another place, even if it's just going down into the West End, which may be different from what you know, you you think the world is like what you live. You think it's like the United States, and it isn't. And I think that it has opened that out for me. It's created a compassion in me. Um it's also uh kind of a softness of heart about people and needs. It also kind of hardened my resolve to um to look at the systems uh and the attitudes that are keeping people on the margins and to how do I work with other people to help those attitudes and those systems change. It's uh deepened my prayer life to try to so that I'm praying to try to see the world as Christ sees it and to respond the way Christ responded.

unknown 29:50

Very good.

SPEAKER_01 29:52

I I I think for me, uh my experiences have changed my the way I think about church, the way I think about God. I it's so easy to grow up Catholic in the United States, and being a Catholic means spending an hour a week in church. That's the the main function. Hopefully people pray at home and stuff. But in terms of what they're the they look for in a week, that that that one hour or so. And it but Cambodia is 94 percent Buddhist. Um like I've mentioned 5,000 Cambodian Catholics. Though going to church for an hour on Sunday, that's not part of their tradition. Um and but all the other things, the message of the gospel, the actions of Jesus, that's something they can see, something we can provide. And it when they see that, it gives us a chance to talk about why are we doing this? You know, why are we here? Um we're not here to baptize you, we're here to help you to understand that there's a God who loves us and make God more real, make love for you more real. I think that the whole idea of God and being love, that's really become something for me. I've always had the older I get, the more questions I have about God, faith and everything. But the basics, God is love, love is God. And so I and I start deaf people or anybody starts seeing love, and I say, Well, that's what God is, you know. So it it's it's been a my vision has changed, it's become much broader.

SPEAKER_02 31:22

You you see how our shows there's so much we could talk about, or our time's just about up here. So I've got one last question for you. Um if you give a a simple message to the Catholic community, um let's say our listeners, not just here in Louisville, but beyond, what what do you hope the Catholic people of the world understand about missionary work?

SPEAKER_01 31:46

I'll start with uh Pope Francis. He said, everyone is a missionary disciple. I mean, that's everyone. Both those words, a disciple and a missionary. And I would encourage all all Catholics to all Christians to find what can be your mission. And it's more than just going to Mass on Sunday. Find something in your life that you devote yourself to, that you commit yourself to. Um I mean, the simple things, like I've been working with Room in the Inn since I've came back come back here, that uh the program for the homeless. Uh last night I went to a meeting of clout. Um I I would love for every Catholic to, through their parish or through individual action, to be part of programs like that. Find something that you can do more than just Mass on Sunday.

unknown 32:35

Great.

SPEAKER_00 32:36

I would uh follow up with what Father Charlie said, and I think it begins by um realizing uh and paying attention to the fact that God loves you and really letting that sink into your heart. And once you do that, I think that then you realize God loves everybody else too. And so so how how then do you spread that love? How do you share that love? And I think, like you said, to look around where where is something that you have a passion about? Where is something that catches your interest, and and then you kind of put yourself into that, and there you find a way to continue to spread that love wherever you are and however you are. There are so many needs in the world, uh so many ways that you can love. And and and I don't think we think of ourselves as missionaries, but that truly is the life of the church. It truly is what we're called to do.

SPEAKER_02 33:41

Well, we're this local church, the Archdeslaw was proud of our daughter and our son, two people who have served so well around the world and and in your faith life, in your religious life. And we thank you for being a witness to us. I thank you for being on our show this month and for being part of this local church and what's new in Arch Lou. Thank you very much, and thank you, our listeners, for joining us. Join us again next month for another edition of What's New in ArchLouis?