Ep 5: Shawn Dougherty - The Journey That Built an Entrepreneur

Shawn Dougherty, Founder and CEO of Volonic shares her personal career journey including her wins, misses and a-ha moments 👀 This is a must watch for all the business-minded people. If you have imposter syndrome, this one will make you feel empowered and inspired. Just us for this this edition of  Liftoff Business with Jeanniey Walden🎙️

Explore topics including👇

🚀Choosing the right team

🚀Beginning your network & entrepreneur journey

🚀The value of healthy debates

🚀Learning from the past

🚀Work-life blend

👠The BEST shoes to wear
+ so much more!

Don't forget to share with your friends and family. I would love to hear your opinions, so comment down below. Thank you for watching

Transcript

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I'm so excited today to have Sean do. With me. She is the founder of Nik, and I'm gonna let her tell you all about what it is. You're gonna be blown away, and if you don't have one already, you are gonna want one. But more importantly, you're gonna be inspired by Sean's story of how she got to where she is professionally and also personally. And we might even get to convince her to tell us about her newest edition. Welcome to the show. Thanks a lot. Thanks for having me. So, Sean, um, there's so many things that I wanna talk to you about today and. being challenged on figuring out what order to go in. Yeah. But let's first talk about, um, you know, where you are today with vol because you've created one of the most incredible brands and one of the most needed brands for the entire world, given where we are today. So tell us a little bit about what it is. Maybe we, if we don't mind, maybe we take it just a step back just for the audience. So they understand, you know what, what built me up to Lana? Yeah, absolutely. And, um, and because I think it's, it's just so relevant, right? Because it's, it's, it's, it's, it's the next chapter of my life, but there was a chapter before it that really, uh, set the tone for it. Great. So, so real quick, like, background on me. Um, I'm from not, I live in Newport Beach, California. We're here right now, Newport Beach. Love it here. But I'm from Kalamazoo, Michigan. Started my career in med. Uh, as Trier Medical Fortune 500, it was an amazing experience. Um, one of the things that was so amazing about it is that we did almost all of our own manufacturing in-house. And so, you know, um, being fairly young, early twenties, um, for me to actually experience what it was like. For surgical beds to, to, to be able to walk through different departments, uh, in those facilities and see how every single part was being made was, was, was probably one of the most influential things that ever happened to me in my early twenties. Right. Yeah. Because I'm this young kid who's very curious and I, and I immediately get. To learn how things were made. Yeah. And it changed my life forever. Uh, shortly after that, I relocated to, um, Phoenix, Arizona, and I, uh, I got involved in the car audio industry and, and uh, that was an industry I had always seen myself getting involved in. Um, but because it's so cultural, I mean, every, there's just, it's so authentic and it's so innovative and creative and, uh, it's something you buy as an accessory, as an expression of. Uh, so I worked in the car audio industry for, for, for 10 years and brought tons of products to market. They also did a lot of their own manufacturing in-house, but it was during the, the nineties when we were also sending everything offshore. And so, um, You know, I was able to, um, spend about a decade, uh, traveling around Asia, first starting off in Korea, and then going to Taiwan, and then to Southern, uh, China, Hong Kong, and, and Southern China, Shenzhen. Uh, and, um, I got to learn how things were made abroad. Um, shortly after all of that mm-hmm. I left, uh, corporate America and I started, um, uh, my own company called M Station, which I'm sure nobody's heard of. Uh, and, uh, and then shortly after, Um, we made an acquisition of a company out of, um, Burlington, Vermont called Mofi. And Mofi was a fairly young company, had been created by a high school kid, and they made cases for the classics and the iPods. Mm-hmm. if anybody remembers what those were before the iPhone. Anyways, it was an acquisition purchase and we merged it into, um, we required the assets and we merged it into M Station, M Station eventually. Went away. But we, uh, we ended up bringing to market a product that you may have heard of. Um, by the time we sold the business, we had sold 20 million of them. So lots of people had them. Yeah. But it was called the Mofi Juice Pack air. And then we also pioneered the portable power station industry. So, uh, in 2000 and and seven, we made this acquisi. Uh, on the heels of the first iPhone coming to market and instead of just being a case company, because that's not what me or my partner wanted to be, we had a, a much more technical background. Um, we decided to turn a, a case into an intelligent case and that product became the Juice Pack heir. Um, and a year after we brought it to market, um, we, uh, we loaded it into Apple stores. And so, um, you know, we took a, a company that was doing 3 million in revenue, uh, and um, was selling to a few retailers and in about a 12, uh, month period, we stood up a global operation Wow. To accommodate, um, a load in, into Apple. Yeah. And, um, it was, it was an experience. Um, it was, uh, it wasn't. Um, it was messy um, but we did it and, uh, we had a lot of cleanups to do and obviously everything had to evolve to be, become more streamlined. And, uh, but then we ended up loading in all the MO products to at and t and Best Buy and Verizon and T-Mobile. Um, and, uh, we were iterating with Apple, uh, for every. um, which there's a new iPhone every year, uh, that people, people think that they're, they're diff they're the same. They, they, they come out every two years, but there's, that's not how it works, Um, and so, um, you know, we were fortunate enough to be one of Oprah's favorite things. Uh, we did collaborate. We were the first consumer electronics company to do a collaboration with Supreme. Wow. And, and Murphy to this day is still doing drops with. which is something near and dear to my heart. I haven't, I love the Supreme brand. Mm-hmm. Uh, we also did, um, um, a power jacket with opening ceremony. Um, we did collabs with Undefeated, um, McLaren, red Bull, and I could go on forever and ever and ever. Uh, but then ultimately we did a collaboration with, um, Valentino in Paris. Mm-hmm. And we, uh, we basically, um, redesigned one of our power station. And, um, for the rouge absolute line in 2015. And, uh, we went, I went, um, on a charity, um, ride with, uh, a company called Cash Rocket. Uh, and then we did the drop in the Netta Porte stores in London. And, um, And that's sort of what has propelled me. I sold MO in 2016, um, when I was at the Valentino headquarters, uh, in Paris when we did the drop, I, I looked around the room and obviously all the products were gorgeous, right? Yeah. All of'em. Yeah. I mean, how could they not be as Valentino? But a lot of the creative directors were still, you know, had been in those positions for 20, 30 years. Right. And they were still using flip. and, um, a consumer with a flip phone isn't necessarily my demographic. Right, right, right. Flip phones, we don't ever remember having battery problems with flip phones. Right, right. It's just, it's just the iPhone really, and things like that nature. Right. So I knew I was a, I was a little bit early and I was early, and then in the coming years, um, you know, I sold morph in 2016. Mm-hmm. and in the coming years, almost all the fashion, um, C uh, all the fashion brands started to retire those older, uh, creative directors and bring on new millennials. Mm-hmm. um, to take on those roles. And I think that there's been, um, a new appreciation, uh, and an evolution that's occurring that in order to really finalize your wardrobe, you have to take into consideration the technology that's in your hand. True. Because it's not going anywhere. No matter what you put on, you're gonna have a. In your possession, in your pocket, and it's gonna come out of your pocket and be in your hand. And so finally, um, and we started seeing a big shift finally in 2020 when Louis Vuitton launched its first pair of headphones in collaboration with Master and Dynamics, which is a manufacturing partner. They initially brought them to market for$960, roughly, could not keep them in stock. Raised the. Uh, um, to 1100. Couldn't keep'em in stock since raised it a third time to 1200, um, and still are having a great deal of success. Um, so a$1,200 pair of headphones that they can't keep in stock. Mm-hmm. pretty amazing. Right? And it has a wireless charger, uh, in the bottom of the housing that Louis Vuitton does not actually advertise that it's there because most of the wireless chargers in the. and I can say this, uh, on behalf of Mofi because I am, I created a lot of'em, or was part of the team, right. That created a lot of'em just don't really compliment a Louis Vuitton product. Mm-hmm. um, they're, they're, they're not reworkable. The, you know, they're, they're, they're using off the shelf, uh, chi technology. They're, they're made out of plastics. They're sonically, welded together. There's a gamut of, of, of different reasons why you can't mate. So, that you buy from Louis Vuitton up with even something you buy from Apple, right. To a certain degree. Yeah. You know what I mean? Mm-hmm. So, um, in 2019, um, I came across some amazing technology, uh, on the wireless charging side of, uh, the world. And I decided to bring to market, uh, the first, uh, luxurious consumer electronics company. And the name of that company is Vol. And, and Volo is an Italian word and it stands for taking. and we believe, um, that based on what we've created, we're changing. We're we're helping the industry evolve and, and we're changing how the accessories are placed in the house. And they're, and, and then it's just like any new industry, right? Yeah. It has to evolve. Mm-hmm. But, um, I remember, you know, on the MOI side, having people over and, you know, I couldn't have been prouder of moi. Right. But when you're having a dinner party, you know, when you've got all the cords and you got all the plastic and they're not necessarily the most aesthetically attractive thing in, in the home. Right, right, right. I mean, they're functional. Right. And we tried to make them as attractive as we could consider. you know, where the retailers wanted the price points, but they weren't, they, they were not fashionable pieces of art. And what Vol brings to market is, um, highly functioning, true wireless charging that sits dormant, um, until you put a CHI enabled device on it. Mm-hmm. and can be fully customized to make any environment. Very nice. And they're fashionable pieces of art for the home. Yeah. Yeah. That's great. Yeah, and it's, it's amazing. So I don't think I knew your early day story. I knew all about Mofi. Yeah. I knew about Nik, but I don't think I realized it started with hospital beds, It started with hospital beds. Now we go all the way back to that beginning part of your career. What made you choose that first job? Were you just looking for a job? My first job, I needed to find a job that paid me benefits so that I. Start my own life. You know, it was funny. I, I, I, um, I went to Michigan State. Yeah. I, I didn't stay for very long. Um, wasn't my, wasn't my, wasn't my gig. I, I really wanted to go to work. Um, and the best company to work for in Kalamazoo, Michigan, uh, one of the best companies to work for was Stryker Medical. Nice. And so I, um, I'm very, uh, tenacious, yeah. And extremely. And so I basically set out on a journey to figure out how I could get a job there. And I went to Manpower and I said, so I hear you're the hiring agency for Stryker. And they said, that's right. And I'm like, so what do I have to do to get a job at Stryker? Um, and they said, well, you know, you have to take a gamut of different tests and usually we place people with the highest test scores. Mm-hmm. I said, oh, okay. That sounds realistic. I said, how many times can I take the test? They said, as many times as you want. Really? And I and I said, isn't an average score? You know, thinking like SATs, ATTs, right? Yeah, yeah. Yeah. And they're like, no, it's not an average score. It's your highest score. I'm like, well, sign me up. So I sat down. Wow. It didn't take me at all forever. And I had a hundred on all the tests and boom, I had a job at Stryker. That's awesome. That's awesome. And uh, and, you know, um, it was initially on the, on the manufacturing floor. Um, but that was okay. Uh, learned a lot. Yeah. Uh, but within months, um, I was moving up the ladder, um, and I eventually, uh, was. A purchasing agent. Yeah. And that was a big deal. I was in my early twenties. Yeah. Yeah. I bought my first house when I was 20. That's fantastic. And, but it wasn't, um, as much as I loved it and enjoyed the experience of it, I really had always had, uh, the dream of living in southern California since I was, I mean this, this big, oh my God, everybody knew that I was not staying in Cal, Michigan permanently and that I would live in southern California. So I had an opportunity, you know, probably four years into working at, at Stryker to, to relocate to Phoenix. And it wasn't all the way to Southern California, but it was darn close And the car audio industry was, And, um, and so there I went, I went to, I went to Phoenix. Uh, I went to work for Orion Industries. Mm-hmm. um, got, it was a very interesting experience. I mean, so thick in culture, like, I mean, we lived and breathed the brand. Yeah. And you, we loved what we did, and we loved who we worked with, and we loved the success of it. And we loved competing and putting our, you know, SBL competitions, who's got the loudest subwoofers, you know, highest quality, loudest sound, all of that stuff. That culture, uh, really shaped me. And, um, it motivated me to want to create that for myself. And I did that with Mofi. Mm-hmm. and I'm doing it with vol. and um, and then it's been, it's been quite the ride. That's crazy and great to hear. It's like just unstoppable nature, interested in learning, just pushes you forward. Yeah. So question for you about Shenzhen, right? Yeah. So, so during my career I got to the point where I had never launched a hard goods product. So I want, so I created a company for. Wearable technology line of jewelry and found a product manager that understood what happens in China. Went out to Shez and the first thing he said was, just note, this will be copied within two weeks and you'll be undercut should you get to market. So what are your biggest takeaways from manufacturing Perspective, like advice that you learned that people don't tell you when you're first starting to get. Yeah, I mean, boy, I've heard a lot of horror stories from people in, in, in, that have tried to do this in China. Um, so patents are very important. Mm-hmm. Um, but you have to remember that they're expensive and, um, uh, they're only as good as your ability to defend them. So tho those things are really important, but really, really, I mean the truth. Yeah. Yeah. Um, so file patents. File a patent in the us. File a patent in China. File your trademark here. File your trademark in China. You, you have to make sure that you do and you can wait to file it in the rest of the world. But if you're gonna manufacture in China, right, file your trademarks and your patents there as well. That's good advice. Um, and then pick your manufacturer wisely. Mm-hmm. And any product that's extremely successful will be copied. Mofi, um, was the number one copy. Consumer electronics products. Almost seven years after we launched an Apple in 2008. And I've spent a great deal of time in my career, uh, defending that ip. Yeah. And, um, working with different law firms and, and different organizations in order to protect the integrity of, of the brand and to, um, shut down those counterfeiters. That's it. Good advice and, but, but it's also, I mean, the, the best form of flattery. Yeah. Oh, of course, course. I mean, so it's like, you know, careful what you wish for, right? You want a product that's gonna be extraordinarily successful, people are gonna copy it. Yeah. You know, it's just, it's just having a plan and knowing how to deal with it. Yeah. And it's like pr it's all good. Yeah. I mean, it just builds up and boosts your brand as well. So you move into this role where you're the worldwide global leading Yep. With five global locations. Entrepreneur from Moi's standpoint, Uhhuh, How do you decide. Who to surround yourself with in business to make sure that Mofi continues to grow quickly and effectively. People that you can trusted you tap into people that you knew in your network over the years. Did you look for the best in the industry or the class? How did you decide who were. The key people you could trust and build that group. You know, honestly, I mean, that's a really tricky question because it was, it was probably one of the most difficult aspects of growing Mofi was the pace in which we were growing. Mm-hmm. and I was, you know, in my early, almost, almost 30 when I started, maybe 32 when I started Murphy, and. and I, I had a network but not anywhere near like the size of a network I have now. Right. And so, you know, some of the people that I was able to pull from, from previous endeavors where we worked together, I think were by far some of my best employees. Um, but finding teams that, that worked well together and that could come into an environment that was scaling at the. That we were scaling, um, was very difficult. I mean, you know, my father-in-law told me that the answer to all of my problems was to find a whole bunch of MBAs, and, um, and I was like, uh, uh, you know, he, of course he's an mba, but yeah, and I'm not. And uh, I was like, oh, okay, okay. All right. You know, that was not the answer. No. Just so you know. That was, that was bad advice. That was really, really bad advice. you know, you, you really have to take your time when you're hiring and when you're growing that fast, it's hard. But I found that not everybody can operate in an environment. Not everybody can support culture. Mm-hmm. So the culture fit is super important. Right? Super. Yeah. And not everybody, um, no matter, even if they're super, super smart, Can walk into an organization and can see what it's missing and it can establish, help establish processes and procedures in order to help it grow. Yeah. Uh, in a healthier way. Yeah. Many people are just, they think they can and they like the idea of it. But they get into the actual business and see how fast things are moving and they start to spin. Yeah. And so it's something that, you know, it was really hard for us. I think we tried to grow too fast because there was demand and we definitely hired too fast. And it, and it hurt the business. Yeah. And so I would, my advice to another entrepreneur would be, take your time, take your time, um, tap into other people that you bring in. Their networks if your network isn't big enough. But the fastest and the best way to scale a business is to scale it with people that you know you can trust. Mm-hmm. and that you've worked with before. Yeah. Yeah. Well, and there's that interesting time where a company pivots where you have to have entrepreneurs who are very bold and not afraid of anything to get you that. Market validation and market fit. And then you need to shift to what you said, bringing in the people that are focused on building process and procedures so that you can scale efficiently. Yeah. And that is often a different type of person, so it is so it can be really tricky, right? Yeah. Yeah. Because people can get their feelings hurt along the way, right? Oh, for sure. I mean, it's, it's tricky for sure. Um, but human capital without a doubt is any company's most valuable asset. And so spend a lot of time, have a great VP of hr. We had an amazing, uh, VP of hr, um, sit down with them and plan to put people in positions where you know that they can be successful. Right. Uh, we did a lot of promoting to failure. Yeah. And, and we did it out of pure necessity. Mm-hmm. But it's, it's, it's, it's not the, it, it, it's. The easy answer, but not the right answer. Yeah. Yeah. So you've all this experience from just being this tenacious 20 year old to moving into this global growth. what are the key insights that you took away to vol and you're like, all right, I, I learned this the hard way the first time around. Mm-hmm. so I'm gonna make sure that I do it right this time. And it's made your life so much easier. Yeah, well sometimes. You know, I, I remember a lot of, so we made a lot of mistakes at moi, like there, I mean, the bi, uh, you know, a book of mistakes, right? If there was a mistake to be made, we made it so we, we learned the hard way in, in a, in a lot of different ways. Um, so many things. I mean, when someone shows you who they are, yeah, believe'em. That's a good one. That's a really good one. And, and, you know, And when someone that truly loves you, like a spouse Yeah. Um, observes something. Yeah. Believe'em, Um, when more than one person tells you the same thing mm-hmm. don't disregard it. Like take it in and really think about it. Yeah. But I'm not saying believe him, but consider it. Yeah. Um, and you know, I, I, uh, we were in such a rhythm, you know, I. I didn't look at things, um, with the clarity mm-hmm. um, that I should have in some cases, and I could have prevented a lot of problems that occurred down the road. Yeah. Had I have not, had I looked at it head on and not ignored it. Yeah. That's so interesting. And, and so I mean Yeah. Yeah. Save yourself the time. it's great. So for someone who's like newer and just getting into business, I'm hearing you say the same things and I hear so many people say, create a network, rely on your network. Yep. Have a group of people that you can trust. Yep. Always listen to them. Don't be afraid. Take risks. And by the way, you are going to screw up a thousand times and it's fine. Learn from it. Yeah. And when, you know, even to today, you know, one of the things I didn't do at Mofi is when I really knew we shouldn't do something at, at some point, I just. you know, I was just like, fine, we're gonna do it. Right? Yeah. Yeah. Um, not, not, not this chapter in my life. Yeah. Like if I absolutely, positively know because I've been here before that we shouldn't do that because I've tried it two or three times and failed each time and I, I won't stop. Right. I, I, I mean, we might agree to disagree and, and, and, you know, obviously somebody has the opportunity to make the decision. but I, I won't let it go. Yeah. It's like we have to do this and we have to do this right. Or we need to not do it at all, or we need to just pause for a day. Yeah. But I, I, I really try not to make mistakes and I, and I try and learn from the past and, um, And if I don't agree, I'm gonna continue to tell you I don't agree and we're gonna have to keep debating. Yep. But that's a good thing. But that's healthy. It's healthy debate. So it sounds like a lot of people that work for you or with you over the years, if I went back to them and called them up right now, they're not gonna come in the door or anything. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That if I ask them one takeaway that they had, it sounds like they would say that you probably, um, made. think more strategically about the steps they were taking and become a better person as a result that they could take to their next job. Do you think that's fair? I think that's fair, yes. I mean, I, I, I can't think of a single person who, you know, hasn't gone on and tried to start their own business in the space or wouldn't be able to say I'm not, I'm not telling you Working at MO was easy. Right. But I'm gonna tell you, they all wore MO sweatshirts every day. Yeah. I mean, they love the culture of the. Yes. And to be a part of something that grew so fast mm-hmm. um, ha has to have had an absolute positive impact on all of their careers. Yeah. Hopefully they're using it that way. Right. Um, but definitely a huge impact on, on a lot of different people. That's awesome. So let's shift gears a little bit from work to. life outside of work, and life outside of work. Yeah. I know. It's integrated all as the same thing. We, during the pandemic, a group of us started to call it work life blend because it just all blended together. Yeah, yeah. But what are the things you focus on to take your mind off of work, to give you the ability to think more clearly about work? Oftentimes people go on vacation and it gives them the ability. process, things they're not even considering, and come up with better ideas and, and bigger insights. Refresh them to bring them back. Yeah. So, um, I like to get together with a lot of my friends here locally and almost all of'em are entrepreneurs too. Yeah. I didn't have that network, uh, in, in the MO days. Um, you know, I, I was relocating every two seconds until we made it out here eventually, but now I do. And, um, I think. W talking, talking things through. It's like the, they, they don't have a horse in the race. And, and, and, and, but we all have similar problems and, and uh, really just, just being like, this is what I'm dealing with. What do you think? Yeah. Um, you know, I just told you I spent eight days in Cabo. I worked the whole time. Um, but was able to do it in a, a beautiful setting, working, and then throw some play in there. Yeah. Yeah. Um, you know, the iec, you know, like all the people that the iec mm-hmm. um, brings to, you know, my Rolodex and these are all CEOs, like, you know, like yourself, who I can call and say, Hey, this is, I'm stumped. I'm stumped. I don't know what to do. I'm, I'm haven't come up against this problem. And so getting the advice of others, there's not a problem that all of us col, we've, we've all collectively yeah. Dealt with every Okay. Possible problem. Could potentially For sure. In my opinion. Yeah. You just gotta keep asking until you find the person that can help you. Yeah. Find that right answer. That feels right. Well, and I love as you, as you like, move up in your career and, and you become, More successful, you find that more people are willing to help you with the bigger issues. It's, it's not this, it's only see on tv, it's not this competitive fighting. I mean, sometimes, I'm sure competitors are always still focused on how they stay one leg ahead of it, but everybody truly wants to help each other succeed. Cuz we've all been there. We all know what it's like to run into that challenging issue that you just don't even know where to turn to solve. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah. So last question for you is about your. On becoming an entrepreneur, is there an age limit where it's too late for you to try and do something on your own? Or can you be inspired at any age to go out and follow your dream? Wow, that's a tough one on the age thing, right? Um, it's not for everybody. Yeah. Um, it's, it, it's not easy. Mm-hmm. um, or everyone would do it. It's extremely. Um, it, it can be, it can be even more than extremely hard. I mean, it's lonely and, and, and having that network makes it not so lonely. Mm-hmm. but I remember feeling lone loneliness at MO a lot. Yeah. Like being at the top, you know, everybody thinks, you know, you've got all this stuff, you have all this, but you all the worries. Right, right, right, right. It's like, um, so I wouldn't say that there's ever an age where you can't be an entre. Um, I, I, I, I, I suggest that, you know, I, I believe that the American dream is real. Mm-hmm. and that everyone deserves the right to pursue it. And, and nobody, nobody should tell anybody anything different. Yeah. Just know that it's not easy. And, but nowadays, you know the word founder mm-hmm. and the word entrepreneur are so prevalently used that, and, you know, you can go to, you know, Techstars or there's, you know, octane or mm-hmm. There's just a ton of different places that you can. or you can meet, meet like-minded people and you can put together a solid business plan, an mvp, all the things that you need to do to quantify whether or not you really have a good idea. Yeah, yeah. And it's all about having a good idea. Yes. Yeah. I took a company, I took the wearable tech company through Techstars. Oh, there go. There you go. I know firsthand what it's like to be put through the ringer. I mean, and. It's the, an immersive amount of learning and opportunity, which is, which is pretty crazy. So Sean, you're totally stepping up in every aspect of the world in life. We didn't get to talk about your puppy, but we are gonna talk about the puppy at the very end. Yep. But before we get to the puppy, I just wanna say, you know, the show's called Stepping Up and it's about incredible people who have just never backed down from a challenge. but you know, I'm a firm believer that every great story starts with a great pair of shoes. So tell us about your shoes that you love right now, Yeah, so I just bought these, um, and they're called Bernie Mavs outta New York, and I got'em in Laguna Beach at a boutique store where they sell mostly Italian clothing and they're super comfortable and I love the fact that they have crystals on the side. I am a crystal fan, just so you know. I have a long history of making crystal products, love things to sparkle, but typically what I wear are, uh, a new brand, uh, called Rothi Roth's. Okay. And I hate socks. Um, I just, I've never cared for'em. Uh, they're, they're just a pain. And what I really like about the Roth's is that the insole, you can buy extra insoles. And so I have this big stack of insoles and I always, I'm constantly put'em in the washing machine. You wash'em, and then you lay'em out to. And then when you're not, when you're wearing your shoes without socks and, and, and they come in camo and, and, and all kinds of different colors, you can pull the insoles out and put new insoles in. That's so cool. So not wearing socks is not a big deal anymore. That's amazing. And so those by far, and they're so comfortable, I literally could run down the street in'em. So That's awesome. And, and they look just like this actually minus the, the crystal. And you have four dogs. You just got this brand new puppy, four dogs. Brand new puppy. Yeah. Um, are you, do you have to keep the shoes away from the puppy? You have to keep the shoes up. the dog. The puppy will definitely go for the shoes. Um, uh, and do you tell all of your, like, work challenges and problems to the dogs to look for advice? I know when I had a dog, I would just sit with the dog and just say everything that was going on because at the end of the story, no matter how bad it was, I'd get a kiss and that made me happy. You know, I don't really talk to my dogs about my problems. Uh, that's never really occurred to me. Um, But, but they do bring me, um, a great deal of peace and comfort when I'm holding them. Oh, and, and, and, uh, for everyone that knows me, it knew me during the Moy days. I had a, um, a white and, uh, red-haired, um, Bellum, uh, cavalier King, Charles Spaniel named Callie, and she was very frequent at the office. Mm-hmm. And she'd sit on my lap in the conference rooms and sometimes even sit on the conference room tables. I mean, she, she owned it. Yeah. And, uh, she passed away a few years ago and, uh, I just, after having one on order for two years, just on Sunday, Picked up. Um, another, um, one that looks just like her. Um, she's seven weeks old now and, um, she, her name is Queen, even though I'm calling her Queenie. Mm-hmm. And, uh, she is the fourth edition to our, our dog family. We also have two children, two girls, two grown girls, and now we have four dogs. Wow. Yeah. So. Wow. Play a busy household. You're welcome. Thank you so much for coming on the show today and sharing. Thank you for having me. It's always good to see.