Nosferatu (1922 & 2024)

This week we do a compare-and-contrast between Robert Egger’s Nosferatu and the 1922 German silent film it's based on. We deep-dive into the mad production story of the original, why Bram Stoker owes Nosferatu an apology and somehow pitstop at Yoga Hosers and Robbie William’s new film Better Man along the way.

References
Watch Nosferatu (1922) here
Yoga Hosers (2016) trailer
Shadow of a vampire (2000) trailer

-----------
If you love what we do, please like, subscribe and leave a review!

Edited and produced by Lily Austin and James Brailsford
Original music by James Brailsford

Instagram
TikTok
Email us

Transcript

Unknown: 0:00

And it's like, oh, she's Gorgie. I would love to suck her blood. Welcome to groovy movies. My name is Lily Austin, and my name is James Brailsford, hello, hello, and this week we've got a double bill for you. We have. We are discussing two movies, Robert Eggers, 2024 Nosferatu, and the film, it was based on the original 1922 version, directed by F W Murnau, yes, a classic of like German expressionist cinema, which you know as a young film student, that comes on your radar very quickly. That and the Cabinet of Dr Caligari. Well, I was lucky enough to see Nosferatu, I believe it was two years ago, on the 100th year anniversary of the film at the Prince Charles. Oh, nice. Yeah, they did a screening with a like a live accompaniment by a violinist and pianist, Hugo Max, which was fantastic, one of the other James in my life. And it was brilliant. And then I re watched it last week in preparation for this discussion, and was a bit unsettled by the fact that the score was very different in this version that I watched, because actually, something I didn't realize was for reasons that we'll get onto there isn't that most of the score doesn't exist anymore, and so every time the film is released. I mean, there are lots of versions online, or you go see at the cinema, there is an interpretation of the score rather than the original score. Yeah, because some silent movies had a specific score composed for them, a lot of them didn't. It was like improvised by whoever in the fleet pit was playing the piano that week. But yeah, with this, I didn't realize, until kind of doing a bit of research, that it did have a score, but yeah, I saw mine at the screen about five years ago. I think it was actually in some kind of underground maintenance station for underneath the Thames. So you basically went under underground. And it was like around Halloween time. So it was all very spooky. About 200 of us packed into this like underground. It felt like a warehouse, and yeah, we had a like, a pianist and a percussionist playing along. It was great. The atmosphere was cool. Yeah, I would strongly recommend if you're going to watch this film, I think you can, you can find it online. I will add a link to the show notes, but I would recommend not watching it that way and seeing it in a cinema. If you can find a re release periodically, you'll find it at cinemas like the Prince Charles. But the thing so much that I learned this week doing this research, I didn't realize that Nosferatu is an illicit version of, oh, a knock off, a knock off. Yeah, of Bram Stoker's Dracula, yeah, it's mad, isn't it, and it, it's almost beat for beat. It's just the same with, with, with a few with it. Well, all the names have been changed for copyright reasons, or they didn't stop Bram Stoker's widow from still suing. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So that's the thing. So the film was made in 1922 by a German production company called prana films. And this production company was put together basically to make this film with this idea that this was going to be the first in many gothic horror movies, cult themed films. Yeah, and I it's such a shame, because I'm so fascinated by this, by this production company. Apparently one of the two members was an occultist, like they were obsessed with the occult and all things kind of mystical and a little bit spooky. It was interesting as well to kind of do the research again, to realize, like, okay, so what is there are any difference, and the one tangible difference is the fact that in Nosferatu, daylight will kill him, whereas in the Dracula, which people forget in the original source material, it doesn't kill him. It just reduces his powers. He can't transform, for example, during the daytime, so he's still able to exist. And it doesn't. It's not deadly to him. It just kind of drains him of most of his powers, and that I had no idea. So now, of course, when we popularly think of in the pop culture, when we think of vampires, that's one of their traits, isn't it that sunlight is deadly to them, whereas that's actually not from the source material of dracunosferatu. It's a little bit like how all of Superman's characteristics and traits, they weren't created in the comic book. In the comic book, he could only leap buildings in a single bound. He couldn't fly. But in the still frames of a comic him leaping over a building looks like a man in mid flight. So when they tried to do that for the T for the film adaptation, when it was like a mini series back in the 40s, it looked ridiculous having a man jumping. So let's make him fly instead. So then the. Makes we're like, oh, you know what? Flying looks cool, so we'll take that, you know? So, and then the radio show, you know, the faster than the speeding bullet, is it bird? Is it a plane? No, it's Superman. That was the introduction to the radio play. So the point is, these different mediums kind of created the pop popular culture view of what Superman is a little bit like here, where we've got two different versions that they've smushed together in our heads, and that's now the definitive when actually one's a rip off of the other, they've both got slight different elements to it, absolutely, absolutely, unless we forget Father Christmas, he never used to wear a red suit before. Coca Cola. Are we sure that's for real? Is that definitely for real? Because that sometimes I'm like, Are you sure I don't, I'm seriously from Coca Cola. I don't is that's a good point. I don't know. James, I I'm not. I do not have the capacity to fact check this. I'm I'm too racial land right now. But if any of our listeners want to rise in and clarify, I'd really please leave a comment. Yeah. So, yeah. So, yeah. Nosferasu was just a completely illegitimate rip off because the novel was very much still in copyright, and so the film came out, was a huge critical hit, and was on course to be a commercial success. But of course, Bram Stoker's widow got wind of this illegal adaptation, and sued prana films, and so they completely understandably, because, as we said, basically nothing has changed, just names, but the story is exactly the same as the novel. So she won the lawsuit, and prana had to was basically bankrupted, and part of the agreement of the lawsuit was to destroy all copies of the film. Thankfully, a few were saved, and that is why we still have it to stay. But that's part of the reason why we don't have the score anymore. Like so much of the material is gone, which just seems like insanely devastating like it sort of kind of is akin to the fact that, like lots of old films in that time, once they'd been made and released, were were destroyed. There wasn't the sense that we should be preserving this. This is part of film history. When this film is regularly referenced as one of the films that was like essential in defining the horror genre. It really It set the terms, the parameters for what horror would become. Yeah. I mean all the very stylized sets and the quite shadowy lighting that was a hallmark of German expressionism, which Murnau also directed the cabinet of Dutch Caligari, which is a very similar looking, very similar kind of style film as well. Because, because you're quite right, it's remarkable that around this period of being film history, period being Film History didn't really exist in 1922 because the movies had only really been invented in 1895 feature film lengths were kind of only just coming in around that time, I think, or, you know, like the longer feature so, but they were just seen as disposable entertainment. You know, you made your money by releasing it once, and then there was no TVs. Didn't exist. TVs were like another 20 years if we'd invented so there was no way to reuse the material now. So, yeah, they weren't really seen as these kind of things that should be preserved for future generations. But yeah, it's, it's really hard to kind of express just how important these early films were they? Because, yeah, she said, in these very early days of cinema, these films were what were creating film language. Now, when we watch a movie, we all can read a film. We all speak film. But this language had not yet been defined. And so it's an interesting thing when you when we look at these two films, this recent remake and the 1922 version. Because I wouldn't say that the 2024 film is like a super terrifying scary movie, but it does elicit some creepiness, some dread. It's got those classic hormone nightmare ish, it's a gothic horror, is rather than an out, in and out terrifying horror. It's like an atmospheric gothic horror. I would my feeling was, yeah, yeah, absolutely. But it does give you this, like creeping sense. I think it pushes the right sort of buttons, whereas, if you go back to the 1922 version, and realistically, it's not scary for for a viewer watching it now, it's not a scary film, and it's kind of amusing in some places, but it was terrifying at the time, and it was, like you said, the coming up with the shadowy lighting, the way Nosferatu looks, the creepiness around him, and his physicality, all of that was so crucial in like creating what now today is considered much more scary than that. So it's like it's a super important film, even if I'm going to be honest, I It's like a very interesting movie to watch, but I I find it does lag to me a little bit. You know, it doesn't have the pacing that we're so used to now. Because. Yes, of course, films in those days were sort of shot almost like theater productions, you know, so that the camera movement isn't quite that, but it's technology is very crude. Sound. It's like, Yeah, you can't really judge them by modern standards. But yeah, they're more to be appreciated than you know. You can't really be like the audience were back at the time. You got to remember, only like, 20 odd years earlier, people were freaking out because there was they were seeing themselves on the screen. I mean, the cliches that the train arriving at the station made people run away in fear, although I've heard that actually that was the 1940 remake they did in 3d rather than the original. Anyway, so that's where that urban myth came from. But the point is, yeah, we our tastes are more refined. We're way more senior literacy. Yeah, it might not scare you the same which is why this remake is interesting. Because, you know, I think for a modern audience, it's probably giving you a sense of the the dread and the kind of the unease you would have felt if you're watching the original in 22 Yeah, absolutely. And I kind of say that, just just because I've seen a few articles talking about how the new Nosferatu isn't as good as the original, and I just find it impossible to compare these two films. They're in completely different worlds. They do are doing even though the story is essentially the same, it is really impossible to, and I think a little bit pretentious to say that, to be honest, because you just can't compare these two films made in such different times under such different in such different contexts. I think the one thing that is fair to say is that certainly I don't think this Nosferatu will have any kind of the same impact that the original had on cinema just because of where it was placed in history, you know. So that's the one thing you cannot absolutely say that the original was fraud does but Yeah, which one would I rather re watch right now? The 2024 remake. Okay, that's good to hear, because we need to discuss your viewing of this movie. Yeah. And I will say, like, absolutely You're so right. It not only is hugely influential to film history, but also to Bram Stoker's Dracula itself, the novel, because, despite the fact that his widow sued about this film, that book was not a big hit. It hadn't done particularly well after it was it was published in 1897 it was this adaptation, it was Nosferatu that made the book popular and popularized it and and the kind of solidified Dracula as a the concept of the vampire that we all know to this day, it solidified in cultural in the kind of the cultural mind. I didn't realize that, yeah, I assumed that it was a knockoff film because they couldn't afford the rights, because the book was such a popular hit back in the early 1900s No, it was the opposite, because it hadn't done it done it had, like a modest success, but they basically, I think, thought we're a German film company. I That's an Irish author. No one's ever gonna see this movie. We'll get away, but we don't need to bother getting the rights. We're a small startup film production company. Let's not film production company Exactly, exactly. So, yeah, it's, uh, actually, Bram Stoker has a lot to thank Nosferatu for, despite their like fraudulent ways. Well, again, it's like they're they're interacting with each they're in dialog with each other. As I think, I think you would say about these kind of things, aren't they? And even this modern the remake is like in dialog with the original version in 1922 because there's references. There's kind of like things that are adapted and recreated to some degree. Yeah, yeah. So should we talk about it? Talk about the let's talk about the differences, because actually, much is the same. It is very much like a straight reboot. I would say there's only, there's only a few kind of crucial things that are different, but the skeleton of the story is very much the same. A creepy man, a creepy estate agent sends his employee to visit, count, door lock. I aka Dracula. Not far too No for our two don't get the lawyers on us. He's Nosferatu, not Dracula, yeah, I'm saying counterlock. That's what he's called in the book, counter in the room, in the film version, counterlock, ie aka Dracula. Oh, sorry, sorry, yeah, because the AKA, he's Nosferatu in the film, because they're like, Oh, he's not really Orlok. He's Nosferatu anyway, yeah, sorry. Oh, my God, too many, too many different words, which they don't do in Dracula. In Dracula is Dracula, right? They don't, he doesn't have a pseudonym. And then he's like, Haha, really, I'm Dracula. Well, I think, I don't think he's really, like, Nosferatu is the, allegedly, is the Romanian word for a vampire. So in the novel, this word comes up at some stage, but apparently there's like questions about the etymology of this, of this word, and what and where, and whether or not that's actually accurate. But anyway, so I think I mean, I feel like it's not like Nosferatu. I feel like Dracula and all. Lock are the two other Dracula has changed to orlock, and in both, and in both, Nosferatu is like, when I'm looking in the text, ah, it's a vampire. I feel like Nosferatu is the placeholder for vampire, because it sounds a bit more dramatic. I mean, I'm, I have to say, I feel like Nosferatu is a way more creepy title for a film Dracula. So I'm, it was a good that was a good shout on their part, yeah. So anyway, so we follow Thomas Hutter as he goes to visit count or lock and, and this is a man who's newly wed to a woman called Ellen. And when he meets Dracula, sorry, when he meets count Tor lock. The main difference we find is that in the 1922 version, the story is basically that count Tor lock encounters this estate agent, and he is there very much to do his job to sign off the papers so that the count can move, can move into a house in the in the German town where Thomas Hutter lives, and then he sees this picture of Ellen, his wife, and it's like, oh, she's Gorgie. I would love to suck her blood. The big difference in the 2024 version is that it's all premeditated the sucking Ellen hutters blood. This isn't something because he sees the picture. She called him in her youth, called him to her, and was then kind of followed by him, kind of haunted by him for years after. And now he has discovered that she is married and is very jealous. Wants to get back over there, and I guess get that with her, yeah, and I watching, watching it at the remake, I couldn't remember if that was how the plot went in the original. So I think it's much better. It makes it much more interesting. I think it plays into the kind of the Gothic creepiness, and also this feeling of dread that everything's already been preordained, that this is already like, it's almost like the fates are set before the film even started, you know. And there's references throughout to to Ellen's character having had mental health issues when she was younger. So, you know, it all ties together. You know, there's your own. And I think the kind of von Helsing character, played by William Defoe, says that in another time, she would have been like a high priestess, that she's got some kind of spiritual, cosmic connection to the other world that unfortunately drags Nosferatu into the orbit of all these people, yes, and this very much contextualizes the film In 2024 because in the original, Ellen Hutter is pretty much purely a damsel in distress. You know, she is an almost collateral damage towards the end of the film, okay, she offers herself up as the sacrifice. So she kind of is the hero, ultimately. But it's very much, yeah, just at the tail end of the film, this, this comes up, whereas, from the beginning, Lily Rose Depp's character, her version of Ellen, has a lot more sort of agency and power. And like you said, it's kind of, it's her story from the beginning. You know? She doesn't, yeah, she's not brought in later on to be this, like sacrifice. Robert Eggers was saying that it was important in this film. It's very much Ellen's story, whereas in previous versions, it wasn't like, like you've said, whereas, and you get that impression, you get that feeling. Mean, the very first scene involves her kind of being summoned by Orlok, and there's like a shadow on her curtains and lit rooms. It starts with her, and it feels that as well, like a lot of the the film is pretty even with how much time it spend with the characters. A lot of the times, in these kind of, in the in the these films, it's with the kind of Thomas Harker, or here It's Thomas Hutter that this, lot of the film is spent with the male characters. Basically, they're the ones saving the day, and then right at the end, Ellen comes in and saves the day. And I think also I was interested, because I couldn't before I re watched the 1922 version, I couldn't quite remember if the element there's a big part of the 2024 version that in order for count or lock to suck Ellen's blood, she has to, she has to consent To dissolving her marriage, essentially, and like re asserting her vow to him, something like this. So there's this kind of the storyline of consent and a woman's kind of sexual independence that's quite interesting, like very strong sexual themes in the 2024 version. And I was sure that that was an addition to the story, but actually the consensual element was there in the 1922 version. So I wonder, I have, I have to admit, I haven't read Dracula, but I suspect that was there in the original two so I was kind of interested to see that that part of the story is there from the beginning. But it's just like. Brought out further and, like, made and kind of brought full fruition in the 2024 version, yeah, I think in, like, especially Francis Ford Coppola's Dracula. And, I mean, I read the book years ago, so I can't remember, sure, but the very sexy, sensual films, like, you know, vampires are sexy, apparently, you know, four, they're all okay, they are sexy, but I think Ellen hutters character being her sexuality and her kind of shame and fear around it, and then kind of almost reclaiming it and then using it, weaponizing it herself in order to save the day, that's like an interesting evolution of that aspect of the vampire story. So I was, like, very pleased with that. And also I was super pleased with how camp and how much they leaned into the the melodrama of the Gothic genre. I found the film thoroughly entertaining. And, like, I was laughing throughout, like, definitely not scary, but very entertaining. But yeah, I really, I really enjoyed all that bit of it. How did you feel about the film, James, I sensed you had some trepidation about it after seeing it. Well, I wasn't sure at first. I mean, like, I've seen the Northman, and it left me a bit cold the Northman. I really admired the ambition and the production design, the visuals, it's like, it's immaculate. This is Robert Eggers, last film. Robert Eggers, previous film. I never watched the lighthouse, and I've not seen the witch either, but, but I wanted to see this, and I was worried it would be more of the same. And it's not. It's a beautifully crafted film, like the atmosphere and the tone and the way it's all put together. So yeah, I loved it, and I went to see it at Dolby cinema, shot on film as well. A lot of the film is done. There's a lot that I loved about it, and it won me round after being a little bit a bit cool towards it going into the Northman that actually, no, I had a great time at cinema, and I loved watching it shot on film. Looks beautiful. You know, the kind of like de saturated color palette, lots of stuff happening in the shadows, like, which really placed the strength of film. And, yeah, he looked wonderful. Had a great time. Yeah, yeah. I think, I don't think it's like a completely perfect film, but I really enjoyed it, and I think it, it was exactly what you would want from this kind of a movie, and that's reflected in the box office. It's, it's, it's done really, really well. It's, yeah, I'm glad about that. It's because, because his last film flopped. And the thing is, I went to see the Northman because I wanted, because, even though maybe I personally felt a bit cold by it, it's exactly the kind of film I need to be championing. It's like, these are the kind of films I complain aren't made enough. Which are author directors making non franchise films who were either original scripts or, I mean, Nosferatu is, he couldn't really say it's a franchise film, but it's certainly, it's an interesting take on some material. Yeah. So it was made for 50 million and so far, it's gross 139 million worldwide. So it's doing very well. It's the highest grossing horror movie of 2024 Ah, great, that's cool, yeah, because, yeah, horror. Oh, by the way, the cinema, that was the thing Dolby. Went to the Dolby cinema. Normally go to the Dolby cinema. All the films are advertised, are all very prestige, fancy pictures. This it was horror, horror, horror, because horror is making money at the box office and and the thing is, horror is like, say, you say this so far, this is the biggest box office return for a horror film of under 24 million, because it's also quite an expensive horror film, because they're making horror for usually about half the price of Nosferatu. So basically, 2025 is going to have a lot of horror, I think a lot more than last year. Yeah, I'm happy about that. I thought it. And the thing is, Lily, right? I don't know about you, because I've got a nervous disposition, so I don't really watch horror as a genre, but all of the trailers for the film are chatting to my partner. Went together and we said they all look really interesting. They look way more interesting than the kind of majority of just mainstream pictures that are random. But neither of us quite like horror films. Just just get scared and then they can't sleep at night. Lily, I know that. I'd say nostrils was my kind of horror film when it's it's more about the Gothic vibes and it and the kind of almost like the fan service to this, to this well loved story, then, like, really making you jump. And I that that works for me a lot better. I was, I was, I was happy with that. Nice to see as well. I was reading about the making of it. Lots of you know, it was, vast majority of it practical. CGI only used, they said, actually, that they tried to do the big things practically. And then there were certain logistical, health and safety stuff where they were forced to use a green screen. But you'd never think they had to use a green screen, because they weren't like fancy set pieces. So, you know, and that shows as well. The whole thing feels pretty real. I don't think I'm watching a green screen, or I'm watching, you know, they shot most of it. A studio as well, but it's beautifully lit. The cinematography is great. You know, you get that feeling that you really are in these dingy, pre electrical lit houses with candlelight and smoke everywhere. Yeah, absolutely. And let's let us not forget the rats. I read somewhere that Robert Eggers used like 50,000 rats. I want to say, I may have not got that number quite right, but it was like, sounds like a lot of disturbing amount of rats, for sure. But yeah, he was, he was saying how in that, like in the shot where they set the krypton fire, that in the foreground, they had real rats, and there was perspex to stop them. They were in perspex boxes so that you couldn't see the box, but you could see the rats, and they wouldn't go everywhere. But then in the distance, then they use CGI rats, because obviously they're further back in the frame. So the hero rats are the real deal. Just all the stuff that you meant to do when you make a good film that feels like, why is this special? This is how you do it. Yes, actually, I did this moment. Yeah, when I read of this, this rat stat, I believe it described it as 50 of like, 50,000 rat actors were cast for the film. I really love the idea of being like, really sorry you haven't made the part. But do do we will keep your mind for any of the rat parts we have in our future work. God, you'd be devastated, wouldn't you, if you were passed over yet again. It's not you love, it's just you haven't found the right role yet. So we need to talk about Robert Eggers a bit more, because Nosferatu is sort of his. There is definitely a metaphor that I can I can use, but I don't know what it is, but it's, yeah, it's a movie he was always destined to make. It seems, yeah. I think every director has like the film. That is the one that the film for them, you know. So going back to Nolan, who managed not to reference too often, but for him, it was inception. That was a film that he'd had bubbling in his head since he was 15 years old, and absolutely same with Robert Eggers white whale. That was what I was thinking of. It's his white whale. Ah. But the thing about his white whale, I was thinking the Moby Dick thing, because what we think is that like these, that what the reference is, the white is, but isn't that like that? You can never capture him, never catch Yeah, whereas, okay, good James, that's good to know. I'm so glad this isn't being recorded. I haven't read the book, so somebody please tell me, uh, tell me if that is what it means. Anyway, we're touching on a lot of classics that we need to read, that we haven't read. Yeah. Um, but yeah. This is that. This is similar for Eggers. This is the film that he's had bubbling away since he was a kid. In fact, it's connected to his entire journey as a filmmaker, because actually, he staged, like an amateur dramatic version of Nosferatu, I think a school play version when he was younger, and he directed it at the costume to the production design, kind of pulled it all together, and it got such a word of mouth and reputation that I think somebody saw it, and then they asked them to stage this version of it professionally. So that kind of got his break, like at first in theater, but then I guess that kind of rolled into film. Yeah, yeah, that was what kind of inspired him to go into filmmaking. And then for a long time, he was a production designer, before he made the witch, which I have seen, and it is good. I feel like it loses its way in the end. I was a little bit unsatisfied with the ending, but I feel like that is a classic issue with horror films. It's kind of hard to like watch you set up these creepy and amazing kind of set piece. It's kind of be hard to follow through. So I'm, I'm glad that I feel like this movie, he kind of finally lands the plane. You know, he's, he's gotten his stride. But, yeah, I read that after, after the witch. It's, it was, it was like seemed, then to be that that would be his next film, Nosferatu. He was getting, gathering funding to make it at that stage, which he, he described it as feeling ugly and blasphemous and the ego maniacal as a filmmaker to do that. You know, this is such a iconic movie in film history. And, I mean, he's not, he's not wrong. And to be honest, I think it's good that he, he made the northmen, he made the lighthouse in between, because those films, I don't think either of them are totally perfect. They're like, definitely on the right track and doing interesting things and a bit different. And then, and I feel like with this one, he probably learned a lot of lessons. Yeah, no, B, I think he said that an interview already is that he kind of is very glad it didn't work out as it did, because he's just got better. Both him and his cinematographer learned lessons on those previous two and I think it definitely shows in Nosferatu. I mean, I have only seen the northmen, but this is certainly an improvement over that in every respect. Yeah. And the other thing I will say is that because he began working on it a few years ago, there was a very different cast attached. At that point. It was going to be Anya Taylor joy in the part of Ellen and Harry Styles playing her husband. And. Hard. Oh, my God, was this around the same period when he was getting, well, he got cast in Duncan. Yeah, I think it was after that. What was it? What was the one we saw for the dark? Don't worry, darling. Oh, yes, I forgot about that. He had that breed. He had a bit of a I don't have any complaints with him as an actor, I have to say. But in particular, I feel like Anya telejoy can completely see her in this role. She would have done a great job, but I really loved seeing Lily Rose Depp in the part, because I think it was, I think that she is often dismissed as an EPO baby, and she hasn't yet had that kind of truly breakout role. You know, there have been a lot of false starts with, you know, the idol and whatever else. What was it called Hoser yogas. Some yoga hoses. Oh, I don't know what that is. What is that? Well, I think that's her debut. It's, it's just check out the trailer. That's all I will say. Look, just what the fuck okay? I'm okay. We will add a link to the show notes to that as well, and I will be looking at it after we've finished recording. Well, I she, I think she is fantastic in this film. She really like she carries the film. I mean, there are great, fantastic performances all around her, but she really helms it. Her. Her British accent is Pitch Perfect. And she just really does a great job at being melodramatic in keeping with the tone of the film, but also actually bringing real heart to it. And I thought she was fantastic. So I'm excited to see her in other things, because she is obviously also beautiful. So it's always a joy to see her on screen. Yeah, yeah, very beautiful. And I had dismissed her with a Nepo baby, especially because I hadn't seen her in the idol, but I've seen the trailer for yoga hoses. And I was like, Jesus, that little baby, she was very good in the idol. There are some things that are good in the idol. I thought that really, yeah, the first, the very first episode is actually has got some good scenes with the like, with her, like people, with her agent and whoever else, but the act that anything with the weekend is just absolutely horrific. So that's just a that's a side, a side. Take, wow. You actually watched it, though, Lily, you're one of the few I know. Well, I was just so intrigued because of the whole crazy story around the film. I was intrigued, but not, not quite enough to cross the threshold of watching it. But I was intrigued. I skipped through most of the sex scenes because they were just too excruciating and and genuinely like disturbing and not in a way that felt useful to put myself through. But it did. My takeaway from it was Lily Rose. Death is a great actor and I and a great singer and dancer, and I look forward to seeing her in something good. Yeah. And the other thing I was because the there's a possession sequence halfway through the film in Nosferatu, which is almost like a textbook, really well executed, like, you've seen this kind of thing before, like, you know, there's a woman in a bed, and then suddenly she's levitated off the floor and a backs arch. But it's, it's beautifully done. And I was reading about the maker, and they're saying that people think that it maybe has been CGI where they've twisted limbs, but they said, No, that's Lily Rose depths is like physicality. She's a, she's got an excellent kind of physicality with her body, and that they didn't really do any, you know, she's kind of arching herself in those positions. I mean, they've got, like, supports for her and all sorts of stuff, but I don't think they did anything to kind of digitally distort her body. I don't think, wow, that's, that's amazing. That's very impressive. Yeah, and again, that, again, takes, I think, takes me back to the like, sort of sexual element of the film, if you will. Lily, I didn't think it was this kind of podcast. Well, let's just, I just was so struck and taken with that part of the film, which I, we have already gone into a little bit, but I just, I just want to say that I think that it's interesting. We we're going to be talking about baby girl next week, and that movie is very much, uh, like, uh, an evolution of the 1990s erotic thriller. And I think it's interesting that this film, film is coming out now. Okay, it's like around 100 years after the the original Nosferatu came out. So it's not surprising that there's a remake, but I think it's interesting that another genre that was very big in the 90s, aka the Gothic Horror has is back with this adaptation and and there is almost like, there's like a bridging of the like baby girl and Nosferatu do have this common this, this common subject matter of a lot of it is about like a woman's sexuality and her shame around her sexuality and her finding the strength to put her shame aside and kind of own own it, if you will, with different outcomes, of course, between baby girl and osferatu, but I think that there's definitely that. So I'll be interested to see if we get any more Gothic. Adaptations, like in the in the years to come, in the next couple of years, because it's a, I just find it, it's an interesting part of the of the 90s film genre. You know, you had entry of a vampire, sleepy, hollow, Bram Stoker's Dracula, even, which I love, absolutely. Love that film, really. And, you know, you know, I was, I was watching it because, just because it's like, so bombastic, it's too much love. It's too much for me. Oh, I know he's like a rich stew. It's like a rich stew. The thing that I the film that I've not watched, but I was, I was struck watching this, this remake, was like, Oh God, of course, Willem Dafoe was the lead actor in Shadow of the Vampire, which I need to watch now, which is all about. It's a fictionalized version of the making of the 1922 film, with the premise being that the actor, Max trek, who plays Count Orlok, is actually, really an actual vampire. That's the whole premise of the film, so and to to kind of disguise the fact that he's killing people, they make it into a film he's acting, but he keeps knocking off the cast and crew as they're going through I think that's the gist of it. And so I bet Willem Dafoe was was cracking out the anecdotes from 20 years prior, when he was on Nosferatu set. Yeah, that's so that's so pleasing that he was brought back to this one. And he's another excellent performance from Willem Dafoe, like, you know, you're in safe hands when he's in a film. Yeah, absolutely. And I think Willem Dafoe, I'm getting the feeling he's like the Michael Caine for Christopher Nolan. This is Robert Eggers as, like, you know, get him in because, you know, he always brightens up a scene when he's in it. He's so good with other actors as well, even though he's very kind of, like, you know, he's got this over the top quality. He never, I don't know, he just, I think he's really good with other actors. I think he gives them something to bounce off. Yeah, you're right. He doesn't, he doesn't steal the show, even though he could easily, yeah, it's like, that's like, about that's a very good balancing act, you know? He gives enough character and eccentricity, but he doesn't drag the whole film towards him like, I absolutely love that, that kind of quite small scene with him and Ellen, where he was saying that they're kind of discussing that she needs to sort this, that she's going to have to sacrifice herself, you know, and he's saying that you would have been a, you would be high priestess in the life. And it's, it's a really nice kind of smaller scene, you know, yeah. So I think overall, those are two films that you should see, the original and the and the remake and, you know? And if you fancy, if you fancy, treating yourself, I would strongly recommend hunting it down at a Dolby cinema. It's like, like Robert Eggers has gone on record him and his cinematographer saying it is our preferred, preferred way for the movie to be seen. So, you know, I went to see exactly as the director wanted me to. And I have to say it was, it was very luxurious experience. Yeah, it is, yeah, we didn't really talk about it that much, but it is a beautiful looking film, like you can see where the money man, it's a very rich it gives you. It really does satiate that, that if you're into the Gothic type of film, it really does, like hits the spot, yeah, and it's nice as well. Budget conscious film makers, it looks way more expensive than $50 million it looks like a lot more money has been spent. Which means that they're, you know, they're really put they really are filmmakers were trying to craft something with whatever they've been given. Yeah, yeah, that's true. Even, as I said, I was thinking, actually, it looks more like it costs more than 50 mil. It looks Yeah, especially when you read all these Ma, when you read about all these bloody Marvel films that keep getting re shot and the budgets are 400 million, and they look like cheap, cheap crap. And the Robbie Williams movie that's just come out. Like, what on earth? Let me look it up. What that's cost? I'm going with 100 million, 100 million, 110 I'm gonna go with, how did you know, oh, my God, just vibes. I just like, you know, it's one of my favorite things. I'm like, What's the budget? What should it have been? What do I think it is? Yeah, yeah, yeah. So the so the Robbie Williams movie, better man, was 110 mil, so more than double the budget of of Nosferatu. And hey, look like I haven't seen it, so, so I really keep comment, but I suspect it doesn't look as expensive as Nosferatu does. Well, yeah, let us know if we're wrong. On that rather tangential note. I know God, we seem to always go off on a tangent towards the end and get off from the from the original sub garden that we get to fucking Robbie Williams. I will never know anyway. Well, on that note, thank you all for listening to another episode of groovy movies. Yeah. Thank you very much. And if you could leave us a like or a nice review, it all helps get this podcast out and about into the world. So we'll see you next week. Bye, bye. Groovy movies is produced. And edited by us, Lily Austin and James Brailsford. And James also produced the theme music. Follow us on Instagram and Tiktok at groovy movies pod, or email us. Groovy moviespod@gmail.com for more information about the films discussed, check out the show notes you.