"Child Care Chronicles: Unpacking America's Parental Puzzle"

Summary

The hosts discuss the challenges of childcare and the rising cost of raising a child in America. They critique a TikTok video that criticizes working parents and explore the naivety and lack of research behind the video. The conversation shifts to the American Family Plan proposed by the White House, which aims to make childcare more affordable and accessible. The hosts express their concerns about the plan's implementation and the current political climate. They also highlight the importance of acknowledging the difference between perception and reality when it comes to parenting and financial struggles. In this conversation, the hosts discuss various topics related to parenting and societal issues. They touch on the impact of universal basic income, changing societal views on parenting, the cost of childcare, gender roles and stay-at-home parenting, the challenges of being a stay-at-home parent, the different experiences of parenting, the need for government support, oversight and superfluous spending, the American experiment and government policies, the challenges of solo podcasting, and engaging with listeners and future plans.

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Transcript

Pete (00:00.743)
Hey my unfiltered friends, welcome back to another episode of Dad's Unfiltered. I'm Pete and as always, I'm joined by my co-host, Chris. How's it going, buddy?

Chris O'Neil (00:11.45)
It's going Pete and that is me the Chris Parenting in one of the most expensive states in the Union Yeah, that's me and what I do well, uh, no good

Pete (00:21.695)
Yeah.

You know, it's funny is on that topic, they were just talking about how the national average of rent was coming down, but it's going up in the state that I live in. Ain't that a big fuck you to me.

Chris O'Neil (00:37.29)
Yeah, yeah, not for everyone though. Thanks so much. It's going down, I swear. Yeah, yeah, sure it is.

Pete (00:41.536)
Hmm.

Pete (00:45.311)
Well, you want to have all the good stuff? Well, it's going to cost you.

Chris O'Neil (00:48.082)
That's true. Well, there is, I don't necessarily say exciting topic today, but interesting and expansive. We have some, we definitely have some fun coming. So, and obviously, it's something we've been talking about. It's been making headlines. It's obviously...

at the forefront of everything we're talking about right now, and that is child care in America.

Pete (01:21.935)
Absolutely man. So before we get into it, I really do want to say thank you to Courtney for joining us last week. That was a nice long hour and 45 minute conversation of which I had parted ways a little bit early because I Yeah, it was a good comfortable conversation except for my bathroom break.

Chris O'Neil (01:29.984)
Mmm

Chris O'Neil (01:35.222)
I think that was the longest episode you've ever had.

Chris O'Neil (01:41.81)
It was, Courtney was fantastic. We'd love to have him back. Cheers. Cheers Courtney, thanks for being on.

Pete (01:45.799)
Yeah. And I will never, never eat Taco Bell on recording night.

Chris O'Neil (01:51.452)
That is a dad's unfiltered first, for sure. And if you don't know what we're talking about, go back and watch the episode. Or listen to it. Excuse me. Or listen.

Pete (01:54.957)
Yeah.

Pete (02:00.091)
Or listen, yeah. So today, in the notes of the episode, I'm going to have the link for the TikTok video that we're going to be talking about, and as well as a link to the White House plans and family services. So it's going to be a nice, wild ride, I think.

Chris O'Neil (02:19.276)
Yes.

Chris O'Neil (02:23.338)
Yeah, and for those of you who don't know, the White House came out with a family plan that we're gonna talk about today. So let's dive right in. And first, Pete, you're gonna talk about that TikToker that questioned the priorities.

of working parents and this thing blew up and she went viral because of it and clearly she you know young girl a little naive didn't really see where this might be a problem and had no idea this was going to go viral so there you go.

Pete (03:00.063)
Yeah.

Pete (03:04.679)
Yeah, first I gotta say it was interesting to watch, a little bit of a pain in the ass, and it was like one of those things where you like, kinda just wanted to like smack the person that was saying it, cause you're like, how could you think that? But at the same time, I also turned into that Michael Jackson meme of him eating the popcorn while I scrolled through all the comments. Oh my God. It was amazing to see how many people were just pissed off about this TikTok video.

Chris O'Neil (03:16.319)
Yeah.

Chris O'Neil (03:22.834)
Oh yeah in thriller movies

Pete (03:31.675)
So basically she criticized working parents for focusing too much on their careers instead of their kids. She was responding to a lady who said that millennials can't afford to have children. Which is true. You know the more you look at it, it is a struggle. And not even just for millennials. I mean it sucks all around for everybody. So to give a little background. She's only 22 years old.

Chris O'Neil (03:54.606)
Oh yeah.

Pete (04:00.807)
So at that age, I mean, let's be honest, we're all a little naive, a little green in the gills, as it were. We don't really know what the fuck is going on.

Chris O'Neil (04:07.33)
Well, and not for nothing, man, but we are literally still not fully developed yet. Our brains do not completely develop until we're 25. So we have to remember that too. As much as we want to say 18 year olds are adults, we do not. So basically she was still a child trying to discuss challenges of adults that she

doesn't have the experience for. So.

Pete (04:37.915)
Right. Another thing about the video which was frustrating was she didn't really do her due diligence. It didn't feel like she was prepared. She just did it as a kind of knee-jerk reaction. The lady that she was rebutting said that the average cost to raise a child today is $237,482 to raise it from birth to 18. Had I known that there was going to be that kind of investment, I would have quit.

Like cigarettes, man. All the money I have saved just not smoking. Could you imagine what I would have had if I just kept my dick in my pants? Oh, so she didn't understand where that amount come from. Now, that is the national average that is everywhere. You search it on Google, it comes up, and it's right there in your face. She also didn't understand what it included. So the cost includes food, because we all need that, rent.

Chris O'Neil (05:08.774)
Yeah, right?

Chris O'Neil (05:13.429)
Ahhhh...

Chris O'Neil (05:34.926)
video.

Pete (05:35.467)
Clothing, because we need roofs, we need clothes. Insurance, we need care so we can work. Clothing, transportation. The basic necessities. It's not including the extra things, the vacations, the bullshit, that sort of stuff.

Chris O'Neil (05:37.463)
We do.

Chris O'Neil (05:50.922)
Right, all this superfluous stuff. Yeah, this is just basic survival.

Pete (05:56.027)
Yeah, so here I am thinking, I'm like, she's 22, but then in her video, she also mentions that she is one of 11. So that made me wonder, is she the oldest or is she the youngest? I needed to know on like what spectrum she's like, cause she uses her family as an example of, you know, having kids and being able to manage. So I went and I looked through her TikTok, she, oh, sorry.

Chris O'Neil (06:03.819)
Yeah.

Chris O'Neil (06:18.89)
Well, and just quick, like for in case anyone has not been aware of this, it's basically it was a big controversy on TikTok and she lives in Southern California. She has she's one of 11 as Pita is saying, and she just got destroyed.

As you said eating popcorn just reading the comments. So it was basically like it went viral for all the wrong reasons and She is a 22 year old Southern California Catholic girl who comes from a you know a two-parent household Stay at home mom dad's an executive, you know, so it's it She's coming from some privilege. So let's just put it that way and then that's I just wanted to add that

Pete (06:54.269)
Yeah.

Pete (07:14.975)
So anyway, I went and I looked and I found, she did a video of her family and the kids and the ages. It was a couple years old, I just did the math. Her oldest sibling is 35, she falls in at 22, she is like the third last set of kids because there's another one and then they had twins afterwards to round it all out to 11. So.

Chris O'Neil (07:26.655)
Hmm.

Pete (07:43.591)
with a 35 year old, so that would put their parents, yeah, so that would put the parents at.

Chris O'Neil (07:43.902)
Oh yeah, she's eighth. Got it.

Pete (07:54.831)
having kids in the 80s. Oldest would have been born about 89. So back then, in 1989, the average cost to raise a child in the 80s was $198,765. Right? Not bad. That's just, you know, the average for the 80s. It's not anyone any particular year, right? Dude, it's fucking, it's $100,000 less than it is to raise a kid now, so fuck yeah.

Chris O'Neil (08:14.729)
Not bad.

Right.

Oh yeah! Fucking A it is. Absolutely.

Pete (08:26.912)
So, and then in 89 I'll assume that that's when they probably purchased their house because you know they're gonna pop out some little ones in rapid fire.

Chris O'Neil (08:33.453)
Hmm. Perhaps, yeah, right, 11? Jesus.

Pete (08:37.023)
And so the average home cost in 1989 is $120,000 for a house average. The average home cost in 2024 is $387,600. So right there, fucking the average home cost has jumped 200,000. The average care for kids is up another 100,000. So we're batting against us. Now.

Chris O'Neil (08:46.558)
Ah.

Chris O'Neil (09:02.823)
Mmm.

Pete (09:07.847)
This is the best part of the argument. And this shows just how naive she is because, you know, living at home and everything has been set and I learned from cheaper by the dozen man, it's like the bulk seriously, like they were making out all right with that. They get all those tax credits. You know, I mean, they're, they buy in bulk and they, they save, you know, they, if you do it right, you know, it shouldn't really be too much of a burden, you know, couponing, but then you have to have that time.

to be able to do all that shit.

Chris O'Neil (09:39.766)
Well, yeah, but the other factor there is like having that many kids, you have built in childcare, not for the first couple, depending on how close they are. But once those first couple of kids get a little older, they obviously start taking care of the younger ones. So you don't have to pay for childcare. Obviously having that many kids has its own issues. But you also have all of that. So.

Pete (09:53.061)
Mm-hmm.

Pete (10:01.151)
Right.

Pete (10:05.119)
So now, here's where it gets fucking interesting. All right, so we've heard how much the home cost has jumped. We've heard how much it's jumped to raise a kid, right? In 1989, the average median household income was $51,681, right? You wanna guess what the average medium is in fucking 2024?

Chris O'Neil (10:12.289)
Right.

Chris O'Neil (10:28.762)
I'm gonna guess it hasn't risen that much. I'm gonna guess 55,000.

Pete (10:35.127)
Oh man, you're fucking generous. $53,490. So, we have to spend more, and we barely make enough to cover that shit. So, I mean, I'm not trying to-

Chris O'Neil (10:45.458)
I knew it was low, I, oh Jesus. Everything has gone up except wages, yeah.

Pete (10:52.519)
Yeah, yeah. And I'm not trying to be an ass. And yeah, sure, priorities can play into the way that you do it. You know, you can plan ahead, you can save, you can do all that stuff. And my brother and his wife, you know, they had a whole plan. You know, it was, you know, they dated, they got married, they got their house, then they had their kids, once they were all set.

Chris O'Neil (11:16.074)
Yeah, and not everyone goes through a plan, for sure.

Pete (11:19.451)
No, I'm like the fucking Kool-Aid man, man. I just crashed through the wall, had a kid. And then I had another kid because a baseball team won a World Series.

Chris O'Neil (11:24.91)
Ha ha

Chris O'Neil (11:28.818)
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Pete (11:30.647)
And look at where that ended me. You know, I mean, not that that's the end all for everybody in that situation, but it was definitely not a happy ending for moi.

Chris O'Neil (11:37.162)
No, for sure.

Well, and I think that's the bigger thing too, is with...

with her just assuming that this is, oh, all you have to do is this. You know, and I think that no matter how old you are, obviously her age comes into account here, but no matter how old you are, saying to someone, well, all you have to do is this, and you're not going through what they're going through, you could just shut the fuck up. You know, so, God, oh God.

Pete (12:10.511)
Yeah, it makes me feel like the French girl in Better Off Dead, given John Cusack the directions. You go that way, really fast. If something gets in your way, turn.

Chris O'Neil (12:17.535)
Yeah.

Chris O'Neil (12:25.662)
Yeah, fantastic. No, and I think like, and honestly, so many people came down on this girl. And I think the bigger thing here is it's not necessarily about her naivete that is the issue. It just, her doing this opened up a conversation about this in a very specific way, because it showed the fact that

Pete (12:27.764)
Right?

Pete (12:52.873)
Yeah.

Chris O'Neil (12:55.402)
Like, we have to recognize that everyone's situation is different, right? And not all families have the same circumstances. Parenting decisions are incredibly personal. But there is a major difference between priority because her the statement that she made was. Oh, child care is included in that cost. Well, you really only need child care if you're choosing to prioritize your career.

Pete (13:07.847)
Yep.

Chris O'Neil (13:24.722)
over your children. That was the big controversial statement that she said. And it's like

Pete (13:29.275)
Right. Yeah.

Chris O'Neil (13:33.778)
Okay, first of all, many people don't have a choice, because if they don't work, they don't have an apartment, they don't have a house, they don't have food. It's not like, oh, I just, I wanna grow myself in my career and fuck my kids, right? That's kind of how it seemed like it came across, was you have a choice, and you're just choosing the wrong choice.

Pete (13:54.397)
Right.

Chris O'Neil (14:02.59)
as opposed to the necessity the fact like we talked about that before the fact that a woman had to bring her child to work with her any died at work in an accident because she couldn't afford child care yet she's this it's so fucking horrible

Pete (14:15.777)
Drowned in the grease trap. That's fucking disturbing as hell. I just wanted a french fry, mommy.

Chris O'Neil (14:24.138)
Well, and, dude, I just wanted a french fry, mommy. So her thing about, again, I care less about her place of being naive because she's 22. Like we were all idiots when we were 22. But it brought up a very important acknowledgement.

Pete (14:45.403)
Yeah. Fuck man. Yeah.

Chris O'Neil (14:53.57)
that so many people, especially, you know, previous generations talking about, oh, well, we just need to work harder and we have to do this, this and this. And no one who are making no one who's making those arguments is acknowledging. The real world financial economic changes that have happened since they were doing those things. So.

Pete (15:21.415)
Yeah.

Chris O'Neil (15:21.95)
it's just and it's coming in from like a book ended subsequent generation perspective because that is her experience with her family and how she was raised you know and i she started talking about all i didn't mean you know poor people in one you know parent households in you know uh... in her

Pete (15:31.147)
Mm-hmm.

Pete (15:34.623)
Right.

Chris O'Neil (15:47.878)
apology video or uh... you know whatever that was supposed to do which obviously wasn't apology was just kind of a reiteration it was a let me explain videos what it was it was that idea that yeah i'm not disagreeing with you i'm just explaining how you're wrong yeah so it's the fact that it brought up the idea that so many people

Pete (15:56.457)
Yeah.

Pete (16:01.235)
I'm gonna tell you how you're wrong.

Pete (16:10.623)
Right.

Chris O'Neil (16:17.01)
are viewing the current struggles of parents as kind of their own fault, right? And believe me, I'm not saying that there aren't bad decisions being made and people that shouldn't be doing certain things if they, you know, all right, you're at this place in your life, maybe don't do this because you don't have the money to do it. You know, I'm not saying, you know, it is what it is. I'm just acknowledging the fact that there's a difference between

Pete (16:39.228)
Right.

Chris O'Neil (16:47.17)
people being frivolous and then demanding that, you know, social services or government takes care of us, which is what she was saying. Like you shouldn't expect the government, like no one's responsible for taking care of your kids but you and like, now there's a reason why that phrase, it takes a village. There should be community. There should be all of these things that can help, you know, we give to, yeah, help a brother out. Yeah, fucking A.

Pete (16:56.874)
Right.

Pete (17:12.691)
Brother out.

Chris O'Neil (17:15.698)
we give to society, society should give back to us. That is the, that's the reciprocity of living in a society, right? So, yeah, go ahead.

Pete (17:23.931)
Yeah. I'm pretty sure that that's why I pay taxes, right? It's like so they could help us and build up our infrastructure, but I don't see shit. We got a bridge in a town over that they've shut down and it won't be open for another like 10 years. It's like it's over by your cousin's house. No, because they can't afford it. Yeah, it's the bridge right over fucking Beverly that goes over by the train station.

Chris O'Neil (17:28.374)
Yeah, fuckin' A! Right!

Chris O'Neil (17:33.302)
Yeah, so.

Chris O'Neil (17:40.139)
Cause they're not gonna fix it. Oh no shit.

Oh, Jesus.

Oh, yeah, yeah.

Pete (17:50.463)
fucking amazing. It's been shut down for like, it's already been shut down for two years. Yeah, yeah, it's fucked up.

Chris O'Neil (17:51.947)
By Josh's house, right?

Yeah, okay. Yeah, I remember the last time I came out. Yeah, and it's, it's just the disconnect that so many people have with their own experience and not to get into other topics because we have enough to talk about today, but just an acknowledgement of this is kind of true across the board with

Pete (18:00.7)
It's insane.

Chris O'Neil (18:22.838)
people assuming, especially online and social media and everything, assuming that, oh well you should live your life this way because this is how things are. You can't say that. You have no fucking clue how this person experiences life. Because you have no connection to their experience. You have no connection to their experience of other people experiencing them. And, you know, like do some fucking research before you start

Pete (18:41.802)
Right.

Chris O'Neil (18:52.01)
just throwing shit out like well in my experience it's this way so it's this way for everybody now you're gonna be brutally attacked online you know so again this 22 year old girl has a right to be young and naive but she also has to deal with the consequences of spouting shit like that and assuming that people are just gonna avoid or ignore it you know because it's on the tongues of

Pete (19:15.976)
Yeah.

Yeah, you know, it's funny. For me, it opened up more things that just piss me off. Like the cost of raising a child jumped fucking more than 19 percent between 2016 and 2021. The fact that we only make like a marginal bit more than people did fucking 35 years ago.

Chris O'Neil (19:20.295)
other people that are not as young and stupid issues

Chris O'Neil (19:30.414)
Okay.

Pete (19:48.047)
Like, and then they expect everything else, like we're supposed to be able to afford a fucking house And afford raising a child and they still pay as dick Like it doesn't it doesn't add up Like in a way I'm more mad at that girl for making me look into this shit and then get pissed off at how life goes

Chris O'Neil (19:53.441)
Yeah.

Chris O'Neil (20:01.41)
Well, no.

Chris O'Neil (20:09.456)
I get that. Well, no, and think about it this way, right? If services are more expensive, inflation has raised the price of everything. And we're paying companies, we're paying companies more of our money.

Pete (20:19.211)
accept our pain.

Chris O'Neil (20:25.558)
but we're not getting paid as much. So that includes the people working at those companies. So the only conclusion is that the higher-ups are hanging on to more of that income, AKA profit. And this is what I find so fucking fascinating. They have the balls to call it profit. When there's, when, like, we talked about Walmart, right? How a huge chunk of their employees are on welfare.

Pete (20:31.869)
Oh yeah.

Chris O'Neil (20:55.01)
They have full-time jobs and they're still on welfare. But yet, Walmart has some of the biggest profits in the world. And I don't think we can call them profits until the people who helped you create those profits are taken care of.

Pete (20:59.901)
Yeah.

Pete (21:13.563)
They actually just announced that they're offering, there's something to do with management positions and I just saw an article on it and I should have paid more attention. But they're gonna be like one of the highest paying like retail jobs. But I think it has to do with being a manager of a store because they just, people don't wanna do it anymore. People don't wanna do any of that shit.

Chris O'Neil (21:35.372)
Okay.

Chris O'Neil (21:39.115)
Yeah.

Pete (21:40.731)
Yeah, was it the article on CNN? But it's beside the point.

Chris O'Neil (21:42.39)
Yeah, those... Just gotta put the damn robots in there. They can fold all the clothes and put them back on the shelf and people just jam, try something on and then just jam it back in the shelf.

Pete (21:54.079)
But I mean, yeah, nobody wants to do that shit anymore, man. It's it's like I get it. I totally fucking get it because like. The more I interact with people, like the more I see, like shit's changing, it's so weird, like.

Chris O'Neil (22:07.654)
Oh yeah. Well, and that... Yeah.

Pete (22:10.895)
Even people driving. Drivers have gotten so fucking batshit crazy. I have noticed more fucking trees being run into, more street signs being run over. Fucking people just driving like absolute assholes. It's bonkers. And I do door dashing. Oh, dude. Every time I'm always out. Yeah. So like, Jan is like, she's like, why do you drive so cautiously? I'm like, have you seen all the fatalities of things that have been there for decades?

Chris O'Neil (22:24.907)
Really? More?

Oh, because you're always out there, yeah.

Pete (22:40.603)
And now they're all run over? Like, fuck me, of course I'm gonna be... It's just nuts. I couldn't... I wouldn't want to work face to face with people anymore like in a retail setting.

Chris O'Neil (22:40.691)
Yeah.

Chris O'Neil (22:51.83)
Well, and as this is the issue too, right, with previous generations are all talking about how, well, this is not happening anymore, and this isn't working anymore, and, you know, people aren't going through these experiences anymore. And I am fully in agreement and on board with the idea that as a young person, you need to develop your social skills, you need to develop your work skills, your work ethic, your, you know, ability to

Pete (23:15.351)
Mm.

Chris O'Neil (23:22.71)
trade basically because that's what we're all doing right to trade your efforts for someone else's benefit so a service that you then get a financial benefit for that you can then go in pay thing pay for things in your life and I don't think there's anything wrong with that I like the ability to trade and money has allowed us to trade value instead of things the problem comes

Pete (23:26.515)
Yeah.

Chris O'Neil (23:49.81)
with all the bullshit extra, you know, profit before people are helped appropriately. And the fact that. Well, and that ties into that, the fact that wages haven't gone up and everything else has. And. All the new technology, the Internet, social media, all of the changes to how we interact socially. And yet so many people are saying, well, we still have to work this same way. We still have to live our lives this same way.

Pete (24:13.629)
Mm.

Chris O'Neil (24:19.618)
We can't because society and the world are not that way anymore.

Pete (24:27.187)
Right.

Agreed. By the way, I'm never going to have 11 kids. That's like fucking, like, no fucking way.

Chris O'Neil (24:34.718)
No. Well.

Chris O'Neil (24:40.982)
Everyone here knows I snipped that possibility right out of me. So definitely not having 11 kids. Sticking with the two, I guess. But rounding it out in this whole thing, like again, I think it was of benefit that this girl's video went viral and all of these conversations being had. Because.

it acknowledges the point again, that there's a perception of what things are. And then there's the reality of what things are. And unless you're living that reality, you can't comment on what it's supposed to be. If you're not having that experience, especially like if, if you do your research and you come in with some opinions and, and some acknowledgments, potential solutions, fantastic. But if you're just spouting off some shit like, well, this is my experience. So you should do it this way. Yeah. Don't do that.

Pete (25:34.699)
Hmm. And the more I fuckin' research, the more I wanna drink myself to an early grave, this is fuckin' depressing the way it's goin'. I gotta be honest with ya. You know, and we're all just doin' our best to provide for our families and give the kids that we have the best possible future, and it's just like shoveling shit against the tide. You know?

Chris O'Neil (25:35.747)
Don't do that.

Chris O'Neil (25:44.103)
Yeah.

Chris O'Neil (25:56.97)
Well, dude, my wife and I are in a position now where most of anyone who's listening probably already knows I am the stay at home dad. My wife is the current sole breadwinner. That's just how it worked out. Story later if you haven't heard it. But she slash now we are making more money than she's ever made in her whole life. And we're still just kind of getting by.

So we don't have to hover over the bank account, you know, number like we used to. But it's still like, we got to be on point with what we're spending and how we're spending it, because it could very easily go down the tubes. Like just because we're making more money than we did five years ago, doesn't mean we're just rolling in it either. That's what's so amazing. It's like, how is this much money coming in? And this much money is going out.

and we're supposed to be like, if this was 20 years ago, we'd be solidly middle class. But like, I think what wasn't the number that I saw recently is something like the basement of the middle class is like $120,000. If you're not making $120,000, yeah, because basically the middle class is just disappearing.

Pete (26:58.835)
because you have two kids.

Pete (27:21.024)
I don't know. I know I'm probably...

Chris O'Neil (27:28.339)
if not at all, completely disappeared.

Pete (27:29.307)
Yeah, I know I live firmly below the poverty line. Like, I...

Chris O'Neil (27:35.031)
Yeah.

And I did for years. And I am incredibly grateful that my wife has worked her ass off the way she has, and we have the opportunities we have now. But that said.

The fact that the White House just came out with a...

Pete (28:00.387)
That's not just, it's a couple years, it's a couple years but it's still a plan.

Chris O'Neil (28:04.59)
No, all right, sorry. Relatively speaking, just came, it wasn't last week, but this is connecting to what we're talking about. It's called, or they're calling it the American Family Plan. And we'll see how it goes. I'm hopeful, but I'm also prepared for, you know, it being a whole lot of nothing. But obviously speaking like we're, like providing for families.

Chris O'Neil (28:37.133)
They release this plan and it addresses a range of issues including childcare. So this is kind of like the hopeful solution to everything that girl's video was talking about.

Pete (28:50.759)
Right. Well, yeah, I mean, it's a pretty comprehensive plan. The goal really is to make childcare more affordable and accessible for working families so they can get more tax money out of us. You know, it includes investments in childcare facilities and expansion of the childcare and dependent care tax credits. Also support.

Chris O'Neil (29:01.96)
Right.

Pete (29:12.171)
for the care workforce. The other thing though that worries me is time is ticking on Biden and if it shows, I mean, that orange bastard might come back. I mean, and he did a number on a lot of that shit. Yeah, I mean, it's amazing. Like, I mean, he wanted to cut social security and there's so many people that depend on that shit. You know, it's, my hopes are pretty much,

Chris O'Neil (29:27.014)
Oh, he'll just... yeah. Oh yeah.

Pete (29:41.679)
In neutral on any of this happening because of the way that the Senate and Congress are fucking the way that politics are the fact that I mean, it doesn't look good that biden will hold on to his spot. So I don't really foresee this going too far into the future But it's nice that they have a plan

Chris O'Neil (29:58.054)
Yeah, and well, and again, well, and just for everyone's full awareness, a quick little summary of what it's supposed to do. So the American Family Plan is a proposal by the White House aimed at providing significant support to American families. It focuses on initiatives related to child care, education, and paid leave.

Some key elements of the plan include providing free universal preschool for three and four year olds, making community college education accessible for all Americans offering paid family and medical leave and expanding access to affordable childcare, which is obviously the big one we're talking about. The plan also aims to address economic inequities and invest in the care economy by raising wages for childcare workers and supporting the development of home care workers. Um,

The American Family Plan intends to be funded by increasing taxes on wealthy individuals and families, which, once again, we'll see how well that goes. But the big things, like the five things that it's really addressing, universal preschool, affordable child care, excuse me, accessible higher education, paid family and medical leave, and investment in care workers, which all sounds great.

Pete (31:01.429)
Right.

Chris O'Neil (31:20.106)
It's just a matter of let's see if they put their money where their mouth is.

Pete (31:21.083)
Yep. You know...

That was one of the things also too about Europe is a lot of the countries offer free higher education for citizens like Germany I think London England does but I'm not entirely sure but yeah I mean all those things would be great I mean

Chris O'Neil (31:34.44)
Yeah.

Chris O'Neil (31:42.53)
That I don't know.

Pete (31:46.491)
Especially with fucking I mean the way that everything goes I mean then you get an education and then you go to have the family and you also have to add that fucking debt of Your higher education on top of the fact that it costs you x amount of dollars to raise that fucking kid The thousands of millions of dollars that you paid for that fucking house the car all that shit Yeah, I can see why Millennials are pumping the brakes

Chris O'Neil (31:57.152)
Oh yeah.

Chris O'Neil (32:05.833)
Mm-hmm.

Chris O'Neil (32:11.062)
Yeah, yeah, absolutely, man. Well, and that's the thing, too, is like, it would be one thing if it was still worth it. But so much of higher education just isn't worth it anymore. You know, because it used to come with a guarantee like you have a college degree. You are guaranteed a spot in a company for life and then you get a pension. That doesn't exist anymore. And college degrees.

Pete (32:26.377)
Yeah.

Pete (32:36.207)
No, because they sold that shit so much and they didn't want, and they didn't focus on the fucking trades, so now the scale has tipped back the other side, and now they need to build up the trades, and they're offering the money for that more so than the other shit. But now they've all made us not want to do any of that shit. Do you want to go and pick up trash? Do you want to fucking plum and empty out a fucking, um, a cesspool? You know? No.

Chris O'Neil (32:44.746)
Yeah, well there's that too.

Chris O'Neil (32:56.343)
Yeah.

Chris O'Neil (33:01.134)
Well, yeah, well, dude, look at look at like back in the 50s, working at a gas station was a noble pursuit. Now you looked at like, you know, you're a hick, or you're you're, you know, some backwards dude with no education in or teeth, you know, like, you're looked down on so much, as opposed to someone who, you know, it's that age old thing, like, hold your head high, you have a job.

Like that's, that again, that doesn't exist anymore. You know, the pride of simply having a job and being able to contribute to society because immediately it's like, okay, well.

Yeah, so you're saying I need to have just this undying civic pride and it's my responsibility as a citizen to be informed and you know do my part and Then being a part of this society When I need something to help my family You're like go fuck yourself Yeah, it's not really a big incentive to keep doing it, you know

Pete (34:10.652)
Right?

Pete (34:15.667)
Yeah, I mean, and like some of the things too that they're offering and they're talking about, like the universal preschool, like that was one of the things that Sweden, I think it was Sweden does, that they offer school like from early ages all the way up through like grade 8 or something like that or age 8. So that way the parent can go to work. Yeah.

Chris O'Neil (34:31.954)
Oh yeah. Oh, and Finland too.

Pete (34:37.787)
You know, I mean, that would be something that would be helpful. I mean, because if you're going to pay a shit, you might as well let us both work. Right. I mean.

Chris O'Neil (34:38.155)
I think it's...

Chris O'Neil (34:43.434)
I think it's Denmark and Finland, it's not Sweden. But anyways, the Scandinavian countries. Yeah, there we go.

Pete (34:49.811)
you can correct it and look back at the other episodes and find out. Hit pause, go listen to that one, come back.

Chris O'Neil (34:56.714)
Yeah, do that man.

Chris O'Neil (35:02.133)
Um...

Pete (35:02.739)
But yeah, I mean, all this stuff. But I got to say, I do have, in Massachusetts, we have paid family medical leave.

Chris O'Neil (35:06.047)
Well yeah, and-

Chris O'Neil (35:12.53)
And that is, that is obviously nice. And we talked about that, that we talked about the benefits that Massachusetts has on the list of, you know, states that actually have decent services.

Pete (35:13.982)
It's a new development.

Pete (35:22.28)
Yeah.

Pete (35:26.299)
Yeah, but you know honestly I don't even know what the requirements are, how you even get it. I'm sure that there's a lot of red tape and hoops to jump through, just like everything else around here. But it's there, I just don't know how you access it or what the conditions are. Like getting a medical cannabis cut.

Chris O'Neil (35:36.138)
Yeah.

Chris O'Neil (35:42.09)
Well, and that's the other factor too. Yeah, there you go. Yeah. Well, and that's the other factor too. It's like just because something is there doesn't mean it's easy to access or that it's, you know, that you're going to get it. There may be qualifications that just, you know, sorry, you're shit out of luck, you know.

Pete (35:46.983)
I uh... Why do you need it? Ah shit.

Pete (35:58.844)
No.

Pete (36:02.727)
Yeah, that was one of the hardest things. Like, and so I was a single parent, in case you're listening, TikTokker, which you probably aren't, but whatever. I was a single parent and I only had the one income and I went for food stamps and such and assistance and I was denied. I was told I make too much money, but I could barely keep a roof over my fucking kid's head and feed them, but I made too much.

Chris O'Neil (36:11.627)
Ha ha

Chris O'Neil (36:24.577)
Yeah.

Pete (36:30.307)
I asked them to do the math for me, but they refused. Show me. Show me how I make too much money.

Chris O'Neil (36:33.39)
Yeah, well, and there's the other factor, because it's based on a number, not reality. It's based on a number that, if that number isn't changed...

Pete (36:40.275)
Oh, they base it pre-tax. Dude, they base it pre-tax. Which is the best. Like, but you're taking half of that shit. Yeah.

Chris O'Neil (36:48.103)
Awesome. Yeah. Yeah, that's yeah. And see, and let's be honest, of course, there are people gaming the system. There are people trying to get something for nothing. It's like, I want to sit on my ass and just get supported. Why the fuck would I work if I could do this? Of course, there are those people. But it was like, I don't know if. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I don't know if I mentioned this on a previous episode, but I recently

Pete (36:58.621)
Oh yeah.

Pete (37:04.138)
Right?

Pete (37:07.817)
I know some of those people.

Chris O'Neil (37:16.442)
a psychologist who's against the universal basic income because he had a client once who I had a cocaine addiction. And it's like, it's not a good idea to have the universal basic income because he would have had access to money.

And the only reason he's still alive is because he didn't have any money. Because if, as soon as he gets money, he's going to go spend it on cocaine. I'm like, okay. And what about the thousands upon thousands upon thousands of other people who don't have a cocaine issue, who just can't get ahead and they're there. The neighborhoods are falling apart and they're turning to crime because it's the only way they can survive. But, you know.

Pete (38:00.188)
Right.

Chris O'Neil (38:08.662)
Well this one guy, that's why we can't have it for anybody. Fuck you.

Pete (38:14.535)
Well, the other thing too is, you know, if they took the time and funded rehab programs instead of just throwing fucking drug offenders into jail. But that's a whole other episode. We're talking about raising our children, not about drugies. So the guy down the street with the cocaine habit...

Chris O'Neil (38:25.668)
It is, it is, it is.

Chris O'Neil (38:29.95)
Yes. Well, and to that... And to that point, obviously, going back to parenting, societal views on parenting are changing, like we're talking about. That is the whole point. The idea that one parent has to stay home while the other one works is just... It's not even... I mean, it's outdated, but it's not even just outdated. It's obsolete. It's most of the time not possible.

Pete (38:45.81)
Mm-hmm.

Pete (38:58.568)
Now it's a fucking dream.

Chris O'Neil (39:00.374)
That's what I mean. It's like you have to be making so much fucking money as an individual to allow your partner to stay home. But interestingly enough, and we were in this situation too, it's cheaper for me to be a stay at home parent than to go and have a second full-time income and pay for childcare. It is actually cheaper, and that's true across the board for most.

Certainly most of the people that I know and that I've talked to in the stories that I've heard so

Pete (39:37.371)
My kids, like for me, that's a good instance, is with healthcare. I get offered insurance through my job, but I have to do it on an individual plan. I can't do the family plan, because that would take up my entire fucking paycheck. Because the amount of money that they wanna take from me would eat up everything that I made, and then I wouldn't be able to fucking live. And then I'd get fired because I don't have a house or a billing address that they could send my fucking paycheck to. The circle of life.

Chris O'Neil (39:42.88)
Mm.

Chris O'Neil (39:51.241)
Oh, yeah.

Chris O'Neil (40:03.254)
Well, there you go, right? The paradox of the book. Well, and on the flip side, though, we're obviously in a major transition, and I'm really hoping it equalizes at some point, but the fact, the positives of all this is that so much more responsibility is shared. It's very much a partnership and a team effort. It's not the very strict gender roles that it used to be.

And I'm not knocking gender roles. Like if that works for you and your relationship, fucking fantastic, awesome. But to assume that everyone has to do it that way, or they're doing it wrong, or you know, that's where the problem comes in. So.

Pete (40:43.133)
Right.

I'm happy to wear an apron and stay home. I don't give a fuck. You want me to fold laundry? Okay. Sure.

Chris O'Neil (40:49.594)
Yeah, fucking A. Yeah, I do what has to be done. And you get it done, right? And and the that putting the ego aside of the dude, I on a daily basis, I still have anxiety about the fact that I'm not bringing in an income like it. It it wrenches at my subconscious programming because I'm the man and I should be. Quote unquote.

Pete (41:00.157)
Yeah.

Chris O'Neil (41:19.69)
You know? So...

Pete (41:21.045)
Hey.

Go fuck yourself.

Chris O'Neil (41:23.894)
What?

Pete (41:28.095)
There you go. Fuck you, you don't have to go to work.

Chris O'Neil (41:29.246)
Nah, yeah, see, I'm just saying. Oh.

Pete (41:34.491)
Let me come over there and kick your conscience right in the balls, okay? How about that? Step on that fucking cricket.

Chris O'Neil (41:39.21)
No, well, there's the other part of it. There's the other part of it. Oh, you lucky bastard, you get to stay home all day. Yeah, and I don't get to punch out. I am working until like from the moment, I'm not saying this to you, I'm saying this to anybody. Like I wake up in the morning and I am doing something work related until anywhere between eight and 10 o'clock at night.

Pete (41:51.708)
Yeah, I know.

Chris O'Neil (42:07.654)
And if it was a night like last night when my baby daughter had a major fever, it goes into the night. So that's the thing too. It's like the assumption that, that you don't have to go to a job. So you got it. You're living on easy street.

Pete (42:27.943)
Fuck, I know it's not that, but I'd much rather be my own person than fucking... ..a slave to the system.

Chris O'Neil (42:35.758)
I hear that too and I'm not knocking that either. I mean, and the biggest acknowledgement I can make, and I think this is so important, is the back and forth between, again, the gender role issue and you know, it's, well, it's harder to go to work. Oh, well it's harder to stay home. Well, it's harder to do this. It's harder to do. Each, each of those things have their pros and cons, you know, hard versus easy.

Some of it's mental, some of it's physical. Depends on the job, depends on how many kids you have, depends on the house, right? It's not either or, it's just different. I have been on both sides of the coin. I have been the sole breadwinner, I have been the secondary income, and I have been no income, and the stay at home parent. I have been able to go through all three of those experiences.

Pete (43:21.071)
that sounds like more than two sides

Chris O'Neil (43:24.83)
Well, the middle, the side of making all the money, the side of making none of the money and the middle of making half the money. But again, it's just the stressors are different. I sometimes I'd rather go to a job and not have to deal with the home shit. Sometimes I'm like, fucking am glad I don't have to go to a job. So, you know, it changes day to day.

Pete (43:26.399)
Sorry. You said two sides.

Pete (43:50.835)
Tell your wife you want to strip. That's how I want to make my money.

Chris O'Neil (43:53.102)
Hahaha

You can uh...

Pete (43:56.955)
I want to be an exotic dancer to the blind.

Chris O'Neil (44:05.238)
Nice. Very nice.

Pete (44:09.447)
They don't know if I'm clothed or not.

Chris O'Neil (44:09.733)
Ahhhh...

Well.

Pete (44:13.607)
Well, I think, uh...

Chris O'Neil (44:15.07)
Um, yeah, and the, the roles have evolved. Like you said, it's great to see the, the shift towards the inclusivity and supportive policies, uh, that the, uh, the supposed plan is, is thrown out there. Hopefully something will come of it.

but.

Pete (44:39.707)
One day, maybe. It's gonna take more than just one guy in one office. It needs a, it's a monumental shift of everything. It has to be state, federal.

Chris O'Neil (44:41.735)
One day.

Chris O'Neil (44:47.115)
Oh.

Chris O'Neil (44:51.391)
Absolutely.

Pete (44:56.027)
Everything has to there has to be a shift and everybody needs to be on the same page That's the other part that that's troubling is that I think for a lot of that stuff It being left up to the individual states is kind of sucky I I'm not saying that they the government should like monitor everything But there are definitely things that the government should be helping with like the childcare the schooling stuff

Chris O'Neil (45:19.02)
Yeah, I.

Pete (45:26.047)
that should be widespread across the board. And there should also be, I think, fun.

Chris O'Neil (45:30.436)
I like it.

Pete (45:36.448)
other financial assistance programs as well. The things that they have in place. A lot of them that they have kinda are almost set up to screw people too. Which is unfortunate.

Chris O'Neil (45:47.754)
Well, the other factor with like with the programs and stuff, the big issue is, and I think most people most certainly, certainly our audience listening would understand this, that the oversight and you know, superfluous spending.

that the federal government does is just insane. There are programs that date back 30 fucking years that don't apply anymore, but they're still getting funding because no one's weeded through them and shut them down. Because it's just so much to deal with. You know, and that's the bigger problem is there's money there. We've all seen the movie Dave. We made maybe we just need Charles Groban to come in and yeah, to come in and do the budget for us.

Pete (46:20.209)
Yep.

Pete (46:30.011)
You already referenced it a couple episodes ago.

Chris O'Neil (46:37.826)
I actually equate it to what you're saying. I equate it to the Marvel, the MCU. And I will quickly explain. The idea that in the beginning when Favreau started doing Iron Man, right? And then they were going to launch into all of these movies that connected the characters and the Avengers and all of that. The note from the studio was, this is your movie.

You can make it how you want. But if you're gonna be a part of the MCU, you have to hit these points in your movie. As long as you hit these points in your movie, you can direct it how you please. Right? And then DC came along and was just like, yeah, it's your movie, it's your movie, it's your movie, but we're gonna connect them all. But because they didn't have stipulations of, well, it has to be this, and this, it just was a clusterfuck and it didn't work.

Pete (47:35.915)
Yeah.

Chris O'Neil (47:36.862)
as well as the MCU did. So from a state versus federal perspective, I view it that way. Like, federal government, hey.

You need some universal childcare. You need this, you need this, and you need this. How you implement that is up to you, but it has to be there. That would be, and that's how it's supposed to work.

So if it worked that way, I'm all for it.

Pete (48:09.471)
I don't think it'll happen in our lifetime, but maybe one day.

Chris O'Neil (48:13.273)
Well, the American experiment is still only a couple hundred years old, so there you go.

Pete (48:19.567)
And also, I don't think we'll be getting Charles Groton to do any taxes anytime soon unless you're planning on doing that through a seance. Ha ha ha.

Chris O'Neil (48:23.906)
Yeah. Probably. Probably not.

Pete (48:30.719)
So, but anyway guys.

Chris O'Neil (48:32.979)
Well, yes, that about wraps up the conversation. Thank you as always, fellas, for tuning into us, the Pete and Chris Show, or aka Dad's Unfiltered. And I hope you appreciate that we stay unfiltered. We do this for you guys because we want to show you the real raw...

stuff of life. We don't want this veneer. We want these to be real conversations that you can get involved in and discuss real issues that we as real fathers are really going through, right? So there it is.

Pete (49:03.955)
Right.

Pete (49:14.891)
Pretty much. Good thing Courtney was here last week when I had to go to the bathroom because I don't think anybody would want to listen to you talk to yourself for the 15, 20 minutes that I was gone.

Chris O'Neil (49:23.222)
probably not we had a good decent conversation too

Pete (49:27.655)
I had to pause it and then we get all confused. Oh my god, that would have been such a mess. I was just thinking about it.

Chris O'Neil (49:32.746)
You know I could do it though, right? Like, wha- fuck, is Chris still talking? Jesus. Ha ha

Pete (49:39.891)
Well, no, I mean, because I thought about I was like, how does anyone even do that by themselves without having somebody to talk to? Like, Jesus Christ, I listen to some of these. It's terrible. Well, I mean, it's not terrible, but it's got to be difficult. Well, scripted, well fucking rehearsed.

Chris O'Neil (49:46.814)
Oh dude, it's... Yeah, it's a challenge.

Chris O'Neil (49:53.77)
Well, it's like being a stand up, man. You've got to have you're basically having a conversation with yourself and you have to do it as if you're having a conversation with the audience. So, yeah, it's a skill for sure. For sure. Well, and fellas, as always, we love hearing from you, so feel free to reach out on our socials, share your thoughts on today's episode on the Facebook page. As always, you could reach us.

Pete (50:08.895)
I don't think I could do it.

Chris O'Neil (50:22.214)
at twodadsunfiltered at gmail.com. That's the number twodadsunfiltered at gmail.com. And yeah, we're gonna be coming out with some new stuff soon. We're working on a membership program. We're trying to get you guys some more high quality content outside of just the podcast. So stay tuned for more info on that.

Pete (50:52.451)
Excellent. Alright guys, until next time, dads, keep being fucking awesome. AI wrote that.

Chris O'Neil (50:58.73)
an A.

Chris O'Neil (51:02.646)
Yeah, we could care less. Just be yourselves.