#4: Pastor Al Peratt Sr. - Ex-Con turned Chaplin

Allen Peratt, Sr. is a pastor, chaplain and cancer survivor whose story has taken him through abuse, addiction, military service, trauma, loss, imprisonment, and eventually, salvation.

From the moment he was born on April Fools Day of 1948, it was clear he would face many challenges.  Pastor Al's earliest years were marked by abuse, time spent in foster homes, and his parents struggles with alcoholism. As a teenager, he and his family became Christians, and Al eventually began attending seminary. His own struggles with alcoholism took over and he was expelled from seminary and turned away from his faith, eventually falling into a lifestyle of addiction and crime that would ultimately land him in prison.

Through his unlikely journey, Al found his way back to God. He has devoted the later years of his life to helping others through Christ!

From the Pit to the Pulpit Book:
https://www.amazon.com/Pit-Pulpit-Allen-Peratt/dp/1792353804

Meet Pastor Al:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hQCb8HDWCCg

 FB:
https://www.facebook.com/pastoral.peratt

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Transcript

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SPEAKER_01 0:00

Here comes a sanded. Here comes a side and I say it's all right. Oh, Pastor Al, thank you so much for being with us here today. I am grateful for our friendship. We have known each other now for almost a full decade. Through Volunteers of America when I served on the board. And now being a full-time employee through VOA and you are our chaplain, it has been just an honor to get to know you and the work that you do, not only in our community, but in our nation. So thank you for that. Thank you for serving the Lord in such a profound way. It is it's beautiful. So thank you.

SPEAKER_00 0:53

Thank you.

SPEAKER_01 0:54

Yes, you're welcome. So I I I know your testimony is so powerful and there's so much to it. There's a lot of um a lot of stuff because you go all the way back to California many, many years ago. And so I'd love for you to just share with us, and I'm gonna just let you roll with the city.

SPEAKER_00 1:14

Oh gosh, thanks for having me. Um I really appreciate it. It's a privilege, always a privilege to be able to share uh the power, uh, majesty of God and the change in people. And you know, I uh was born and raised in San Diego, California. Um, you know, upbringing was real strange for me. I would immediately, my first thoughts um that when I give my lectures is going back and being a little two-year-old boy and uh being subjected to alcoholic parents and fighting. And so that's my first recollection of life. And when we work with people in recovery, we say, go back to the first recollection of thought. And it's not a pretty thought, you know. We didn't have things like PTSD and moral injury back in those days. We had um, you know, but buttercup. Yeah, get back on the horse, you know. So anyway, um, when my dad remarried, this is out of uh 1948 I was born, so it was right after World War II. Um, so we were in foster homes. And if anybody's ever lived in a foster home, you immediately recognize that you're different. Uh you're really not accepted. They're doing it for money, and they either put up with you. Or I remember Christmases where me and my brothers were stuck in our bedrooms while they had Christmas out in the living room. And so all these little thoughts come back to me later on when my first prison psychiatrist told me, think about you know what you've been through. From that to a stepmother that was very rigid, very on one side taught us boys how to make it set the table, make our beds, do the things that we weren't being taught in foster care. And on the other hand, she was pretty tough. And uh so I got a lot of belts. And that was back in the belt day. You didn't just get talked down or put on restriction, they called it grounding, I guess they started. Anyway, um, you know, but they got Christ in their lives and turned their lives over to God. Southern Baptist tradition, I don't know if you're aware how strict they are, but they were even more strict back in the day. But that's what I went from alcoholism parents. My dad was a naval career submariner in the Navy. That's why we're we were in San Diego. He was an Illinois farm boy. But um, you know, being raised in San Diego, beautiful town. You got Mexico 30 minutes from home, the beach 30 minutes, and the mountains with snow 30 minutes. So, I mean, anything and everything. Um, but I was still feeling alienated all the time. So I got in some what they call mischief, nothing really bad. Uh I don't know why they didn't call it JDC back then, but I went in once or twice to that to get my mind right, as they say. And uh anyway, um the Christian home was very rigid, and so I was very rebellious. But I went. And I went for a couple of reasons. One, it was safety. Uh she wouldn't beat me at the church. She beat me after the church, but she wouldn't beat me in the church, you know, and then I really liked what the message was. I didn't get this Jesus thing, but I really liked Heavenly Father with his open arms and Luke 15 open arms, you know, welcomes the prodigal. But anyway, moving on, I got molested in the church, and so I was already kind of warped at that time. It was my dad's best friend, a deacon, and he befriended me, and then things got uh carried away, and I won't get further into that except that it is it affected me all my life. I'm 74 years young this year, and it's still visions and things come back to me where, you know, I know I'm in a good place here today, but um it's always a struggle. And so um at that time, you know, I I got out of um high school diploma. I've always been successful in academia or any of that kind of stuff. It comes easy to me. Uh I guess I got a certain intelligence that I can figure things out pretty well. Uh could be a danger later in life, but anyway, um yeah, and then I went to California Baptist University afterwards, so I didn't have to go to Vietnam yet. And um, you know, if you went to school, got grade C and above, they wouldn't draft you type stuff. But I had a life-changing um thing. I was on the basketball team, and the fellows would always go out afterwards, and they never included me. Uh, evidently they thought I was too Christian. And um, one night I had a bad night on court, and they said, Come on, don't be so down, come with us. They gave me a fake ID, and we went to a topless bar down in Lake Elsinora. We were up in Riverside, California by that time, where the seminary is, and I just uh with that beer and the naked ladies, and I thought I was in sinful, sinful, you know. But for some reason it gravitated towards me where I felt comfortable after the alcohol started seeping into my spirit, my soul. And, you know, I really believe as a Southern Baptist trained young man that the Holy Spirit is in grindwelt within you, as it says in the Bible. And so it never leaves once you accept, um, except you can walk away. And I started walking away after that. And I got kicked out of seminary, ran to the military because I heard you could drink 10 cents a pitcher, and I said, Oh boy, I'll go be a soldier. So everybody in my family went Navy, like my dad, submariner. I went army, the rebel, of course. And that was during uh heavy time of Vietnam. And uh we were being trained pretty, pretty strict, and then I went to advanced infantry training and learned a little bit more in depth how to kill people, and um that really changed my mentality of being um that nice little Christian boy to a warrior for our nation. And, you know, as I was on my way to Vietnam, um a commander came to me and said, you know, you've been put in too much college and you know how to type, and we need a clerk over in Germany, so you're not going to Vietnam. So again I felt rejected. Um I went through a deep dive, and of course I ran to alcohol. I didn't run to Christ. By that time I was fully mad at the church because when I was molested, I had a picture of Jesus on the wall, and I kept saying to that picture, jump down out there and stop this man from what you're what he's doing, and nobody stopped him. And so anyway, uh so I was pretty, pretty rugged by then. And uh so, you know, drinking Germany, I mean, known for beer. And then one night another substance came into my life called hashish. I was by that time Sergeant E5, highly successful in the intelligence division. I was a legal clerk, and I've always been successful when I put my mind to things, you know. And uh, and yet these guys had me when I was half drunk one night smoke a bowl, they call it a pipe full of hashish. And that initiated me into I'm not really the police or I'm not really an informant, I'm one of the cool sergeants, and boy, did I take off on that. So I always say to people in recovery in my recovery lectures, I had three awakenings. One when I was saved in a Southern Baptist church as a youth, two when I drank alcohol, and three when I started drugs. So everybody can have awakenings of sorts at some time, and it depends on what we put our spirit, our soul into. So I went all in. Um during the day, I was uh Sergeant E5, I'm called a DD 214, honorably discharged. I did my job, I served my country, but I did it. At night, uh the biggest party are going. And so I smuggled 40 pounds of hash back to LA where my real mom lived. I finally found her at 21 years old, and um boy did I have a wild time. It was Janice Joplin, Jimi Hendrix, all the crazy stuff going on, hippie stuff, and the bikers I was really gravitated towards because they lived their own life style, and they talked about a brotherhood and we're family, and I really liked that talk, and I was looking for something like that, even though my own family was there, and one half were Billy Graham's and the other half were outlaws. Yeah. So, you know, um, but LA was like I got introduced to a lot of more drugs. Uh I started uh selling my hash to a major motorcycle gang, and uh then they asked me to go down to Mexico because I'm a San Diego boy, and I had connections down there. We didn't call it connections, but uh foreign exchange students that played on our sports teams. And their uncle was in the Tijuana gang, and they didn't call it cartel yet. So I went down there and boy did I look important because they they fronted me a complete bale. A bale is 35 kilos, 2.2 pounds each, and of marijuana, and I brought it across, and within hours we were going back over the border to re-up, and so I became quite and you know, you get that little power thing going on, and um yeah, I really they called me a major smuggler after that. And so I did uh some cocaine um deals and I got behind on payments, and I had to do the deal that I never wanted to do, and that was with heroin. And that's what my demise was, my first prison um sentence. I got busted for smuggling a pound of heroin across the border to pay my people down to Mexico, and uh I ended up going to Chino on a five-to-life, San Quentin, a little bit of Folsom before they kicked me out to fire camps. We were we were then in the forestry department, so I've been able to experience hardcore maximum security all the way out to fighting fires and feeling free a little bit, thinking I'm gonna hit the streets. And by that time I had met my my wife of 48 years, um, she was a young lady in the community, also had been sexually abused, and of course using drugs, that was the attraction. And uh, we had a child after I got out of prison, and uh, I thought my life would go on and be good, you guys. And you know, I you can fake it till you make it, but if you're faking it too long and you don't go to any spiritual entity, you're gonna go to the dark. And I went to the dark, and my wife got involved in a major lot of friends of ours are in were in major motorcycle groups down in Southern California, but this one particular one loved to front my wife, methamphetamine, because you know I was the guy behind her pushing her, keep your money up, make sure you're paying, because she was partying hardy, and uh, and it got real wild in my home. And here's my son, and and so we put him in a separate room thinking we're all cool, and one night I'd had enough, and I said, This is it. I don't know why I said that, but I believe it was a Holy Spirit moment. However, you know, the devil, the dark force does not want it to happen, and so my wife came at me with two butcher knives and cut this eyebrow out, and you can see the scar there, cut my thumb off. You know, I gotta remember I marry a very beautiful woman, but when she's on mass, she is uh she's got the big S on her chest. And so anyway, we separated by my choice. I grabbed my son and moved to a place where they said wasn't many drugs or alcohol. Rapid City, South Dakota. Somebody lied to me, didn't they?

SPEAKER_01 14:20

Yes, they did.

SPEAKER_00 14:22

Because everywhere you go in America or the world now, you can find a substance, you know. So immediately somebody's knocking at my door when I uh we got there and a major motorcycle gang out of Rapid City. If you know anything about that area, you know what I'm talking about. I won't say names out of respect for clubs. I I don't do that. But uh he had me a joint and hand me a beer, you know, and I often thought, you know, if the church would have knocked on my door that morning, would my life have changed? Anyway, question for thought. Uh and so I I they knew all my background by then because they got a hold of people. I mean, the motorcycle gangs of America, they're enemies, some of them, but when it comes to information about people that are gonna be involved, as they call it, they knew all about me, man. But they also knew that I had a good reputation. So they put me in charge of um the outer limits bar, the topless side, and I ran the bar and I ran, you know, the bounters and all the way to the announcer. Some nights I would be up there at the mic, because I have that propensity towards. I believe that in high school I had was on the speech team, and impromptu extemporaneous was my gig. And um, I think it served me well along with uh some Holy Spirit stuff, but I was using it for the wrong spirit. And my wife and I got back together. I told her to bring some product up, so she danced at the club, became the top dancer, of course. She's a very beautiful woman, and here we go, off into the darkness again. I mean, way deep this time. And I believe that, you know, God in Psalm 40 tells us, you know, that he will bring our feet and put it on a rock if we seek him in the darkness going down the pit, you know. And as you can tell, my book says from the pit to the uh pulpit, yeah. And so I really believe that um you know, people come to me because of their credibility. I mean, in my soul, you know. I know a lot of people. Yes, you do, Al. I I don't know their names half the time, but I know their faces. Something about that. But anyway, um, I I remember at that time a lifer coming into my life. Used to be the informer, so you can imagine how big and tough reputation was. And him and I sized each other up, and uh he said, I hear you're wanting to change your life, man. He goes, Let's take a walk. See, that's prison talk for we'll go walk laps around the prison track. And a lot of ministry within the walls is done by that. I've talked to you a little bit about that. And um the lifer, the ex-enforcer, um, and I'll say his name. He allows me to say his name, Reed Doc Holiday. Woo! Um some of the conversations we had, and I started, you know, after attending um my necessary uh treatment um in order to get parole early, of course. You know, there's a reason, but everything I do it, but it made sense to me. And especially when it started talking about higher power stuff. I was alright with the Heavenly Father, I wasn't alright with Jesus yet, because that picture on the wall.

SPEAKER_01 18:03

Yeah, yeah. Trauma.

SPEAKER_00 18:05

Yeah, I mean, you know, so a lot of people they think that because they give their testimony like we're doing today, oh, that'll change somebody's life because they're so excited. That's true, but the work starts after. It does. Because there's so much trauma and unbelief, and look at the world we are in today with the line and all this stuff. And I listened to the slifer, you know why? Because I could watch his walk, man.

SPEAKER_01 18:32

Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 18:33

I I watched him because if he was phony, I I want nothing to do with it, you know. I went to church and there was a preacher there strumming his guitar and asked me if I ever had any Christian background. I told him about my history a little bit. So he asked me if I would sing. And uh see, I was trained to be a music minister in seminary. Okay. And um, I love music, man. Any forms of music, as long as it doesn't have cussing in it.

SPEAKER_01 19:03

Um it's so it's powerful.

SPEAKER_00 19:05

It is music is powerful. It moves the spirit and it brings me out of my soul to the from the dark places, you know. But anyway, so I started the ball and chain choir in Springfield, Mike Durfee Unit back in the day. Uh, went to treatment, walked the yard, walked the yard, talked, talk. And I can't tell you a specific date, except my clean date is July 4th, 1989, that I rededicated my life personally and went to that preacher with that guitar and said, I need to tell you something, man. I'm back. And he just, you know, kind of looked at me and because he hears that a lot from prisoners, said, Well, I hope you make it, and whatever I can do to help you. See, I needed to hear that. Um, my folks had sent me a Bible with my name on it. They always did that when I was in prison thinking, and I finally sent it back to him and said, I went to church, you know. Funny, uh, quick little story that that lifer went to church every Sunday, would knock on my door, hey, my name was Nasty Al back in the game. Hey, Nasty, you want to go to church? And I go, get out of here with that, blah, blah, bling, bling bling. And he'd laugh and move on. And it went on for that for close to a year until I got that Bible on a Saturday. That next Sunday morning I got all decked out, you know, my wonderful little prison blues. And he knocks on the door. Hey, nasty, you want to go to church? And I said, Yeah, uh, hold up, man. And all I heard was I thought, uh-oh, he fell down the stairs. It shocked him so much. But he dropped all his books and he walked back. He said, Did you say yes? I said, Yeah, I'm coming back to church, Doc. Let's go.

SPEAKER_01 20:53

That's why we should never give up on people.

SPEAKER_00 20:55

Never, never, ever. Even on your deathbed, you give testimony because those seeds might be the last seeds you get to plant. Yes. Amen. You're right. So anyway, um, it was at that time my faith was tested again. The feds came after me on what's called a RICO racketeering influence corrupt organization. It's a legislative act for uh people that organize, they call it, you know, and lead criminal behavior groups. And that was me. Um, I got rolled up, got brought back to Rapid, and now I was already doing a seven and a three for the state, and now the feds were looking at me for 160 years, 20 years each uh charge, eight of them. And uh, you know, how are we doing with time? We doing cool.

SPEAKER_01 21:49

And so we're doing good, Alex.

SPEAKER_00 21:51

Okay, and so anyway, um, so you know, it was at the time that I started going to this group, Narcotics Anonymous, and I started sharing with A little bit about my faith walk. And it was in the Pennington County Jail that I had this revelation that don't worry, uh I'm in charge. And you know, it's like, you know, John 8 32, when uh John's telling people, you know, you shall know the truth, and the truth shall set you free, is I no longer held on to anything. And uh I didn't give up my people. I didn't have to do that, but I did have to tell the judge I was guilty, and so uh the first step says we admitted, and I admitted, you know, and I felt free for the first time in a long time, and you know, he he said some other things about uh pretty nice positive things about what I had been doing in prison so far. So he he got it down to a five to forty, and he gave me the five, and he ran it concurrent. That means along with my state time, didn't find me a penny of the million dollar fine that he could have fined me. Wow. Inside the court, exactly God just moving hard, and by that time I'm I'm calling his son Jesus, you know.

SPEAKER_01 23:15

Yeah, for sure.

SPEAKER_00 23:16

And especially acknowledging Holy Spirit, of course. In the courtroom was um Sheriff Tom, um Kevin Tom, and he was the DCI uh uh guy that busted me. I had a major role. It was FBI D E ATF. And, you know, years later, I get this letter after I get out of prison and start going to church. I anyway, I had three things I could do: go to church, go to work, and uh go to meetings. That's all for the first year. And I had 90 seconds to answer the phone, otherwise they were gonna roll me out and bring me back because I was such a bad guy, you know. And I made every phone call, I gave every urine test. I I was free, man. You know, John 8 36 backs it up. If the sun sets you free, you you you're free. And then the exclamation point, indeed, I yelled out in my sermons, you know. And I mean, from that point forward, it was really a blessing. I mean, I never imagined I would ever be chaplain. I was going to the county jail under Sheriff Les Hockey, and back in that day, he believed in ex-inmates coming in and talking to inmates, you know, future inmates. And so I led up the first Bible study of Mini Hawk County Jail. I was astounded. I was only out of jail 18 months when he asked me to do that. My church, Ridgecrest Baptist Church, um, now Restoration Baptist Church. And of course, I brought set free into that, my own biker church, the first biker church in South Dakota, by the way, with over 200 people at a time would show up. And, you know, that's a little bit down the road, but I went to Keystone and uh just as a speaker, and eventually they asked me to hear fist steps. So I I in my career have heard 30,000 fist steps and counting. Um I still give lectures there. I don't do fist steps anymore.

SPEAKER_01 25:21

That's a lot of lectures. I've been there, Al. I've done my own fifth step.

SPEAKER_00 25:25

So yeah, how cool. And so, you know, all these things started coming together to where people were asking me to speak and at churches and at events, and I I always give credit to God because you know, you don't go in and speak about yourself. You go in and speak about what God has done through you. And it took me a long time to learn that. Some of us have to go to the penitentiaries, some of us have to go to the darkness for a while to realize that it's real. And for those that are in recovery, I do a lot of family groups, and a lot of families come up crying and we're hugging because I became a family member. My wife didn't want to quit for a while. So I learned how it was to feel that way, you know. And so, anyway, uh the success part: do everything, walk the talk, keep going to meetings, get a good church, find a good sponsor, a Christian mentor, plus a A-A-N-A sponsor. Get all the support you can get because you're in for the fight of your life. And, you know, some of the things like you'll see this pamphlet that's made of me, and anybody can have one by getting a hold of you guys. And the book is uh, I'm sorry, it's 20 bucks for a signed copy if you ever want to took my life savings to do it. 31 years of material there. And then I brought this to remind myself, so maybe you might want to ask a question or two at the end. Is um my wife told me, well, why don't we ask for a pardon? You've done so well, honey. You know, wives are so cool about that. We know that, don't we, brother? And so I said, I don't want one from the the state. And she was stunned, and she said, Why? I said, Because I know people that have got them that really weren't doing what they said they were doing. I want one because I did what I was supposed to be doing. So 14 and a half years, four administrations, the first black president of all time read my file. And out of nine guys that year, I got this presidential pardon in 2011 from President Barack Obama.

SPEAKER_01 27:44

It was a good one. Wow, Al, and for something for those who don't know what a pardon is, can you just explain what a presidential pardon even means? Yeah. The extent of it.

SPEAKER_00 27:54

It's a full and unconditional pardon for the conviction, like I said, my RICO bus and then all my state bus. The president has designated direct empowered, the pardon attorney has his rep representative to sign this grant of executive clemency.

SPEAKER_01 28:11

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 28:12

So I did a podcast with National Geographic recently on the traffic series, Meth in the Badlands. And well, the lady at first wasn't gonna do it, you know, like what you guys, you know me, you know. You know what she said? Just like the Argus leader and a few others just said, we don't believe this is true. So they do fact check. Well, they got a hold of the FBI, got a hold of DEA, got a hold of everybody, right? And my uh all my charges are sealed. So they were wondering if so then they started getting hold of California and a few other people in prison, and then they're going, oh, this guy's real, you know, and he's paid his dues. You know, I've been shot, stabbed, run over, running from gangs, uh, down in Mexico, a hospital. I did a full body cast. Um I've got metal in four parts of my body. I uh I I just say I went to war, man. Uh, and all of that, you know, I think it came from uh not just the molestation, but because I didn't have people that understood. Yes. And that's why I like doing these things. So um yeah, I'm beat cancer twice.

SPEAKER_01 29:28

I was gonna have you go there. Yeah.

SPEAKER_00 29:30

Uh I had basically the tongue cancer, stage four. I died once in the hospital room with people praying over me, and I didn't see a picture of Jesus like some people claim they do. I just didn't. Uh, but I was in a black vortex rushing, and I believe it was to go to heaven, and the breaks went on, and I came back. I woke up. I thought I I thought I didn't make it, you guys. I thought I was in hell because I woke up in the VA hospital. It was so noisy. And my wife, thankfully, was there going, Welcome back, welcome back, you know. And so, I mean, I'm still dealing with a lot of math, my jaw's broken right now because of the radiation coming at a certain angle, and it beat all this part. This is all metal, and this is all hardware, you know. But I'm kind of not just an old soldier, but uh I'm a believer, man. Yes, you are. I believe that God brings us through so many different things for his glory and his testimony, like what we're doing, and good people like you that believe, you know, and want to share. I I think it's a blessing. I'm here this morning. Thank you so much.

SPEAKER_01 30:41

Thank you, Al. I when you first were telling me your story, uh, I I mean, just like Amos hearing it for the first time today, and all of our listeners, my mouth was open almost the entire time listening to what you've gone through. And yet you never gave up, you never had a sense of turning your back on the heavenly father, your heavenly father, especially in the last 30 years of full-on ministry. Like you have been full steam ahead from everything you've gone through because you know the pain and the suffering that you go through when you're in those moments, and you don't ever want to see other people go through that. And you know there's redemption and you know the power. Once you have Christ on your side, it is so it's just beautiful. It's a beautiful and it's fun to be able to pay it back. And I love that you have spent the last 30 years dedicating your life not only to Christ, but everybody around you. You're such a servant. Yeah, and so thank you. I know you hear that a lot, but thank you over and over for what you've been doing.

SPEAKER_00 31:41

You know, the veteran community came together and um they built a ramp for my wife and I, a covered ramp. Yeah, and man, my whole trailer court is just envious, you know. But I have a flagpole in my front yard, and I have dedication to the soldiers that didn't make it home because they're the heroes, you know. So people come by and I find them in my front yard because I have a light, a solar light at night, you know, and they pray and they marvel at what our country has done for one of their soldiers. Isn't that cool? Yes. I mean that coming up to Memorial Day and that it's so important for us to remember our people. Wow.

SPEAKER_02 32:23

You know, what an what an amazing story. I'm looking at your book here, and it's only about a half an inch thick. Right. I feel like that's a just a fraction of what that book can be. Because you've got such a rich history. What do you say to someone who is scared? Speak to that person who is in a position where they want a life change, but they there's they're afraid for their life, but they're afraid for their family's life.

SPEAKER_00 32:48

What do you say to that person? That's amazing you're asking that. I'm dealing right now with a young lady that got wrapped up in the math world, and there's this particular individual who wants to kill her. Um really I started looking at what we have out there in every program. I go, Well, we don't deal with that kind of thing. So luckily the police department has her in children's inn, but that's only for 30 days, you guys. Yeah. And you know, I know some Christian organizations like Freedom Cry in them that can really help out, but it's dangerous. We've seen at Keystone where they snatch them when they go to Chow. They'll snatch them. They've been waiting, they've been prowling. This is the enemy, man. And I believe that people in America need to take this serious, that there are people that want to get out and they don't know how. And you know, for my little voice, our chaplain line, our prayer line, it's off the hook sometimes of people saying, What can I do? So thankfully we're getting better. But I really think the Christian community can step up and do more to help people. I mean, they may not say, I'm gonna be a believer, and that's the bummer part about our our community is we want you gotta be saved right now, and you gotta you know, some people they gotta work. I mean, look at what I did in prison. It took me a while because of the trauma I'd been through. So, what are the things? Well, I'm 74 years young, so it's on your community, young people. It is to figure out. I mean, we're such a great nation, but we let people fall through the cracks. And um I like that question that you said because it's so relevant.

SPEAKER_02 34:42

I think it's it's so easy to close your doors, to go inside, close your doors, and turn on Netflix. Yeah, forget about the world. And we've got to go knock on our neighbors' doors, we've got to ask questions. And Heather's doing a great job, especially with this podcast and just people in her life. Yeah. Really, really peeling back the layers and finding out, are you okay? It's it's so Midwestern to say, how are things? How are things are great, you know? And no one asks a second question. It's almost weird to say, Oh, I'm actually having a rough time. I have this have this need.

SPEAKER_01 35:09

Oh, there's so much shame that's wrapped up in that. There's so much shame, and that's it's a big reason. Excuse me. Yeah, there's a big reason why we uh close those doors. We're also we don't wanna we don't wanna know what's going on.

SPEAKER_00 35:26

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 35:27

It when when I worked for Teen Challenge almost a decade ago in Minneapolis, I I couldn't believe how much meth was going on in that Duluth Minneapolis area. And it's scary, and you don't want your kids around it. You don't want to hear about it, you don't want so it's like this seclusion of all those people that have got messed up in it. And there's just a small little army trying to help and trying to conquer this evil that is going on and then turn turning our back, and that doesn't that doesn't do your kids any good, that doesn't do the future generations any good at all. We have to step forward and we have to be able to open our arms, open our doors, embrace these people and by how being the light, being those who represent Christ, and we're the hands and the feet. And you know, being here in Sioux Falls, South Dakota, we're we are pretty protected. Yes, we have a lot going on, but in our little community, we do have a lot of incredible soldiers that are that are boots on ground trying to help a lot of the different populations um that are that are struggling right now.

SPEAKER_00 36:30

Well, Heather, I'd like to just jump in and say something. I'm the first ex con. Now there's another ex con that's been allowed to go back behind the walls of the South Dakota State Penitentiary. I go to the federal prison, I've gone out back to San Quentin, I've gone to Sing Sing, I've gone to Angola. But I'm gonna tell you this we are in, you're right, an area of the nation where we're kind of secluded still a little bit. And the fellas that are doing and the gals that are doing time down up here, when we go in and do our programs, they are hungry. Yes. The thing is, is that it's after they get out. There we go again. You know, what are we gonna do for these people that they could literally be reunited with their children? We have the New Star program at our Volunteers of America Dakotas. So I at Keystone doing my part back in the penitentiary, I'd still do one worship service a month, and then some things with Lifelight and Josh Brewer and that crew. You know, uh Legion Riders, I'm a retired chaplain from that, but I still show up. You know, if a 74-year young guy that's been shot, stabbed, run over, and should be beat down and laying in his recliner can still get up and do. I mean, look at the Bible. The Bible gives us examples of there's no retirement, you guys. Yes, if you are hurt and you can't do anything, become a prayer warrior. Yes. I mean, we need people to jump up and start being counted here, you know.

SPEAKER_01 38:13

Yes, we do.

SPEAKER_00 38:14

Thank you guys.

SPEAKER_02 38:15

Amazing. I've got the book in my hand. You've got pictures in the middle of your family, your beautiful family. Yes. What a neat thing to see. How do how do people get their hands on the book?

SPEAKER_00 38:25

Well, it's from uh on the back will be the ISBN number. If you want to say it slowly, all they gotta do is type that into Amazon and they can order a book. However, I'd like to sign a copy for them. So I am gonna have a book signing at Crossroads and some other stuff. So be alert to maybe we'll put it on your site when it's gonna happen. But they can buy it um over Amazon. And I would say this not because I want to sell so many books, but I now have a pastor up in Duluth that's that prison up there. Yeah, that he is now buying books at my cost to send in with the fellows. He does ten books at a time. They're signed and they're hitting inmates. And so I encourage people. This is the book that will tell you a story about how to get out of the darkness, man.

SPEAKER_02 39:21

Thank you. Well, we'll put a link to the to the book and the podcast, and thank you for this for this copy. I look forward to reading it. And and uh I know I I feel like this is the first book. Do you feel like there's another uh expanded edition?

SPEAKER_00 39:33

Well, Dennis Hoffman, my CEO and lead minister, he wants me to do a follow-up. And this time, if I am able to do it, my wife's story will be included.

SPEAKER_01 39:43

Yes.

SPEAKER_00 39:44

It's hard for her because she relives things, but that would be so effective to see us as a team, husband and wife, you know. And then I do have a book coming out with reflections. I don't know what we'll call it, might be reflections, with Volunteers of America Dakotas. Uh Dennis Hoffman has just made two flash drives of the pandemic. Every week I send out a weekly reflection to Volunteers of America, and some of them are off the chart.

SPEAKER_01 40:15

They're so good.

SPEAKER_00 40:16

Yeah, really cool stuff.

SPEAKER_01 40:17

I've been privy to all of them.

SPEAKER_00 40:20

So that'll be coming too. Thank you for that. Yes, appreciate it.

SPEAKER_01 40:24

We are here to support you, Al, and your ministry and what you've been doing. And so anything that we will we'll make sure that all this information is available for all of our all of our listeners and so forth. Awesome. Yeah, thanks for having me, you guys.

SPEAKER_00 40:37

Been a blessing. God bless.