The Resilience Development Podcast

Phil Airson ON: Better Relationships

November 21, 2022 David Ogilvie Season 1 Episode 10
The Resilience Development Podcast
Phil Airson ON: Better Relationships
Show Notes Transcript Chapter Markers

Are you struggling in your relationships? In this episode, David speaks to a relationship coach about what we can all learn from his profession. He gives us some great tips on how to improve our relationships, both romantic and platonic.

Phil Airson is a Jay Shetty certified coach with a background in counselling. He helps people worldwide improve their relationships and I asked him to share some of his best tips. If you're looking to improve your relationships, then this episode is for you!





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Hi everyone. My name is David Ogilvie. And this is the podcast where I explore what it means to live, feel and work better. Have you ever experienced a relationship problem and wondered what to do next? This week, I talk to relationship expert and coach Phil Essen about his work helping people supercharge their connections and his advice on getting more from your relationships. Here goes. So, Hi Phil, welcome to the Resilience Development Podcast. I'm glad that you're here. Yeah. Thank you very much. Glad I can be part of it. And yeah, thank you for having me. Yeah. I'm looking forward to chatting to you because you're all about relationships, aren't you? Because you're a relationship coach. Indeed. Yes. I'm a relationship coach. Yeah, when I think about when I think about resilience, right? I I always think people tend to think resilience is a personal attribute. We forget that it's also about the people around us and our environments. So for example, you know, think about Cinderella, Cinderella she's epitome of resilience isn't she. she's got positive mindset. She's going through lots of adversity, but she keeps cracking on in exactly the kind of way, but then you forget and you go - Well, where should, where would she have been without her fairy godmother or if you if you're watching the Disney version, where where would she be without the animals, that help her hide and things like that, in other words relationships? Yeah, absolutely, and you know, it's it's not just the good relationships in there. It's the ones that she had with you know, the with a family the ones that weren't so nice and anyway, it's it's about what we can get from, not what, sorry not what we can get but what each relationship can teach us. That's what's really important. Yeah, what each relationship can teach us, that's interesting because I find, there's a saying, all right, I think there's a saying I might just made it up, you can choose the quality of your life by the quality of your relationships. Yeah, that that sounds like a saying that I've heard before right but, ummm It's true. It's true. And that's not just the romantic relationships, but it's the ones with the family, It's the ones with friends, the ones with everyone, and maybe most importantly the one with yourself, because in every relationship you're going to be there, right? Yeah, yeah, you are. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, so it is about building that kind of awareness isn't it? Awareness of self, awareness of others which I think, because often always makes me... it's obvious now doing what I do, right? It is really obvious. But our thinking impacts so much around us on a daily basis, it impacts how we think, how we feel and those those kind of relationships. So, it's why I wanted to chat with you, wanted to get all, I want to get all the Insight. Sure. I wanted to get some kind of, possibly maybe a chat about things that people would probably want to ask you if they were me and get the, if you coaching lots of people getting the Insight, because I'm kind of going - We're all coming through the pandemic right and that that most people I talk to that's impacted their relationship with self. Yes. And also with others and maybe we could start you know, if I ask you. are you seeing that? Are you seeing more people now than you were pre-covid that kind of? Yeah, absolutely. So so yes two fold for that, one kind of zoom and everything made me take my business International. So I work with people all over the world now, which is wonderful. So, obviously there's more people from that. But yeah. Just to kind of take it back and what I always like to do is like just slow it down a little bit. When we are in a relationship... what I believe is the real, ummm, the the benefit, the real gold, the real nuggets to take away from the relationship, you know, I talked earlier about what we learn, is that nothing is better in our world than a relationship for reflecting where it is we need to grow as people and where we are not free, and what I mean by that is our partners will show us areas of life that we we are holding on to some belief or holding on to some value or holding on to some opinion that that is causing us a little bit of Anguish. Right? And I'm gonna get back to the pandemic point of this but it's all important. So, what I would always kind of start off when I work with people is getting them to look at their relationship and look at what's the, what's the lesson I'm trying to, what's the lesson that that life is trying to teach me here because I think subconsciously, we always are trying to to learn that lesson and be a little bit more free, a bit more peaceful. And I think that's why people end up in the same kind of bad relationships over and over again, right because the, the mind wants them to learn this lesson. But okay, we haven't learned it, so we'll get that same kind of person again, that same kind of person again till eventually it feels like a lesson's learned and you can move on and you feel a little bit freer, or maybe it's a lesson of, right, I need to respect myself more, I need to love myself more, I need to stand up for myself more or make my voice heard a little bit more. But whatever it is, each relationship can teach us a little lesson. So, going back to what you were asking, the pandemic has intensified that and intensified because people are spending so much time together in their relationships, they're almost forced to be self-reflective and see the things that these relationships are trying to teach them and if they're not, don't have that awareness and they're not trying to learn, that can ramp up and ramp up and ramp up and, man. Yeah that's caused a lot of issues, I'm sure you can imagine, you know if the lesson is... Ummm, about they need to learn to respect themselves or that that's their kind of next level is to learn self-respect. And they're not getting it and they're not getting it and they're not getting it and they've got nowhere else to go. That can be super super intense. Does that make sense? Yeah. Yeah. I'm kind of thinking Covid amplified everything. Sure. We're suddenly forced to be with people, you know, people, people that we love dearly and have good relationships. Yeah. But we need to be with them all the time. Yes. Right? And probably you would have been forgiven for some of the things that you are perhaps not learning. But if you, if you're with somebody all day every day that becomes, it can be a downward spiral if you're not careful. There's a kind of limit isn't there? Yeah, absolutely, though there's part of the this I our subconscious that wants to learn this lesson, and that's why, when we do get into those relationships over and over again, you know when I mentioned the same type of one we don't necessarily know why it's happening but it's because our subconscious wants us to learn this lesson, wants us to grow in this area because it'll bring us some Freedom, some lightness, some a little bit of peace. And yet, in day to day life when there was no Covid you could maybe not learn the lesson, go to work you're not really being involved in it, but it's like it's persistent. It's seeing that again and again seeing your seeing what where you're not reflect back to you over and over again, and if you're not like I say if you're not aware, then yeah, it's gonna be frustrating. It's gonna build up. It's going to create Hmm. This this feeling of wrongness I suppose. Because I'm listening to you. I think it sounds Philosopher... I can't even say the word! Philosophical. Thank you. Thank you Phil, a bit philosophical but it's got a real practical practicality to it, isn't the? No, for sure it does, yeah. Because you kind of think, I'm I I think, I don't know but I'm sure I've read somewhere divorce rates have gone up for example after the pandemic. Yeah, absolutely and and you would expect that and yes, it does sound quite philosophical but it's also kind of deeply rooted in my background in Psychotherapy in kind of the' Freudian' way of looking at things and a lot of things like that. So there is neuroscience behind it, but, but. Yeah. It's trying to make that a little bit more understandable and accessible, for, to help people move on and yeah, I would expect divorce rates to go up but not just because people aren't learning a lesson or what have you, but sometimes because people are and you know that and really being, not being hammered because that sounds brutal, but both seeing that lesson come up over and over and over again and and learning it and seeing it and not having any space to breathe from it can really kind of... If someone suddenly learns a massive way to respect themselves, and sees how often they're being disrespected then, yeah they can recognize that that relationship doesn't work for them, you know, so sometimes especially during Covid, it's not just not learning lesson, but actually really learning the lesson can also cause that a little bit because people are looking at you know, it's the same reason a lot of people have changed jobs. Because they've looked at it and seen - Okay. Does this actually make me happy? Does this suit what I want to be and who I want to be? And yeah, a lot of times people have moved jobs, but it's the same with relationships. Yeah. It's interesting because I was talking to somebody earlier about my sense of the world at the moment and the sense of what I'm seeing in the world is many people are questioning - Do I belong? You know do I belong in this job? Do I belong in this relationship? And, whether and it... belonging is in itself based in relationship, isn't it? Yeah, of course it is and it's something I know a lot of clients and I know a lot that you know, I myself when I was younger certainly really struggled some, to kind of come to terms with about where, where do I belong? And, ummm, I often find when I work with people there is a, there's this unspoken sense of wrongness and I don't know how else how else to describe it really but of that that they are out of place, that they are wrong and not for any particular reason, but it's more just a feeling. And you know they can be in, they can be part of a group and on paper fitting well, but it still feels wrong or in a relationship and it's going well, but it still feels wrong, and what that would normally indicate to me is a bit of introspective work a bit of looking at - Okay, why do you think you feel wrong? Is there something you're not accepting fully about yourself? Normally? Yes because everyone's got a little bit of that. Yeah, it's interesting because I mean I mean 10 years ago I left banking, top talent, director in banking and I handed in my notice and everybody was surprised, including me, right, including me, and what was really interesting was I was really.... I went through quite a lot of emotional turmoil going, I've got a team here that we've gone through a lot, I really like the job, everything to your point, my point is everything looked good on paper. Yeah. Including, including me but something didn't quite fit, right? I knew what it was. It was two things one is we had a chief exec that said, let's build a bank that we can be proud of. Yet, we were laying people off and I was involved in that and it didn't quite It didn't quite fit with me but what was interesting, was... As I was thinking of leaving, I obviously had to have aconversation with my wife. Sure. And to this day, I remember, she just said to me what are you afraid of David? And suddenly it came out of my mouth and I'd not thought about it - I was like, I'm really scared that I'm gonna mess up and we're gonna have to go back and live in my parents' bedroom. And I looked to myself and raised my brows and heard what I said. Wow. Yeah. Right? And she said what? I said yeah now that now that verbalized it that's exactly what I think and she said but you are so much more than that now, you're not that little kid. I had a difficult childhood, didn't have a bad childhood I had a difficult childhood. You're not that little kid. You've you've built so much in your life and you've got so many resources. There's absolutely no way we would ever be going back to your parents and living in the bedroom with two kids. Yeah. Right, but as you said it and I think that's probably a good example right of...ummm, I had a relationship on paper outwardly at work that looked a lot people would have wanted my job and it would and you know I wanted my job I liked it. But then I wanted to do something different, there's a tension in me that I didn't quite understand and then when a verbalized I was like, oh it's like a big, big weight had lifted off my shouldn't and the the ending to that story is after I handed in my notice the amount of people when the discovered at what I was going to do, which is what I do know, they're saying we... you'd be really good at it, we thought you'd have done it edges ago. Yeah. And the only person standing in the way of me, was me with my own questions, thoughts and beliefs and and I didn't have anybody to run it past. It's like an echo chamber. Yeah, and that's it, right, that's almost like a great example of two relationships there. The one you had with work that didn't quite fit, well, three really, so the one you had with work, didn't quite fit once your away, the one you have with your wife and how you can how she can reflect or certainly give you feedback on where you're at and see it's so easy for us to see that in others and so difficult for us to see on ourselves, right but once you said it and she said that oh, yeah, of course, that's obviously the answer because she can see it where we can't and that that's a beautiful thing there you and then the third one at play there's the relationship you have with yourself. And obviously there was there's a little bit of the the inner child there that needed to be heard and and comforted in that way, you know, even if it's just verbally it's ... Yeah, it's a fascinating little story there with with the three types of relationships that you can look at. I think the reason it's interesting is as well is, at the time I did it my kids were... just thinking back now, they'd have been 7 and 13. Yeah. Right, there isn't a day now that doesn't go by when I'm so glad that I was around for them. So, there's an extra relationship because you know, I was commuting two days a week. I wasn't around. Umm, just getting up, being there for breakfast being there with those kind of things and even my kids, kids say it. They kind of say - Ahh, you know Dad, you're different. And I was thinking I don't think I am, I think I've kind of returned to my true self. Yeah. But of course, they'd not, they'd not seen that so, I think it's that kind of I think my point is as I'm thinking about is this real benefit because we're such a connected, we're so connected with people around us that it's not it's not one dimensional, isn't it? I suppose if you develop one relationship, it has an impact... elsewhere. Yeah. You must see that. Yeah, absolutely the the I didn't start off as a relationship coach. I just start off as general life coach, but whatever people came to me for it always came back to relationships. So that's you know, it's a big reason I kind of moved into it. But yeah, absolutely right if you can focus on this area, it has such a huge impact. On work, on your life outside of work on walking down the street, on the family, on your partner and on how you relate to yourself, you know looking every day in the mirror. It really is that kind of, it's dropping a stone in the river and watching the ripples go out, it effects everything. And yeah, that's beautiful that that's something I can relate to you know. I have not baby twins now, two-year-old, but toddler twins and and I get to spend a lot of time with them and my four year old son as well, and and it's a beautiful thing and you can feel, that you can feel that that unspoken importance of of that connection of that bond of that love when you can really focus on it and know how to be there. It sounds like that's exactly what happened for you. You mentioned earlier on that you you're International, right? You can work with with anybody. Do you I don't know load the question, but do you think given that you've got that International experience that we're all the same underneath? Yeah. When it comes to relationships? So I I believe that that at all of our core everyone wants to be loved and feel free. I know that's my sound a little bit hippyish, A little bit like something The Beatles would write but essentially it is, you know, even if people want money and cars and all of that kind of thing really they want, they don't want that, they want the feeling that they think it will give them which is usually freedom and being loved. So yeah, there are different setups and structures to these relationships and to the people but at the end of the day that's what it comes down to people want to feel love, accepted and peace and that's really what I work with people to get. Yeah, I don't think that is hippie. I look at Psychology and belonging. Yeah. Right belonging is is key to our well-being and I also look at you know, look at some of the marketing that's out that 'Financial Freedom' it all of its based on that basic need to feel free. So it it might sound happy to some but actually if you look at it practically in real life and you look at it from a basis of psychology, is you know we're marketed every day based on freedom. Yeah. That desire for Freedom. Absolutely and people can often get a little bit muddied when I talk about freedom, but but it's because you know a lot of people can say well, you know, Phil I am free, I can walk out the door, I can do whatever but it's more an internal freedom of freedom from the the feeling of not good enough or not enough in some area or the feeling of of pressure of to be someone else or the pressure to you know succeed at work, whatever it is that those those internal things that were not free in and when I say relationships are there to kind of for to teach us and to show us where we're not free that that's what I mean. Because if you can really tap into that I do believe that what everyone's looking for. So, I think financial that just on that one sales bit you mentioned, I do understand what they mean by Financial Freedom. It's essentially not having to attach yourself to the idea of money worries basically, isn't it? Yeah, I mean, yeah, just go on YouTube and this will be on YouTube on YouTube in a bit, you go on YouTube. You've got the fire movement, you know, the financial Independence is all about about freedom, and I'm kind of as you were talking I was thinking to help understand and it is a question. Perhaps it's more about freedom to choose? Yeah. Rather than freedom to do anything. So for example, you might go, you know, I might not like it but I understand where I'm coming from, it fits in with my values. Sure. And I've and I've made a choice and that in itself is empowering and liberating. It might not be wonderful, it might be divorce for example. Absolutely. But you've you've felt you've had the freedom if that's the right word to make that that choice. Yeah. And what's beautiful in that is just to kind of go a little bit of a layer deeper than that, it's, it's the and you know, this can very nicely goes to into you know, what we've talked about resilience. Is the confidence and self-acceptance to know that whatever you choose that you are enough, that you are,okay, you can survive it and and still make that choice and that's real freedom. Because if you're making the choice, if you can look in any scenario, you can make a choice, you know for the most part. But if you were saying going for a divorce because you believed you were this horrible person you need to get away from you know, that the person's better off without you that's a different energy you're carrying and you'll make different decisions and different thoughts and say different things from that place as opposed to I'm good enough and I understand that this person is just not right for me, and therefore I think a divorce is the best option and there is a freedom in that and what you would can say and think and create from there as opposed to you know the much more negative side of things. So can I ask you then? Because that's we're hooking on divorce. Right? I feel like it's gonna ....what what would you say the top three things that people come to you for for help. What the kind of top three issues if you like or sources that they're wanting to look at and work on. Yeah, absolutely. So number one with the bullet is they believe that the other person needs to change in some way. So whether that's listening more, being more present earning more money, you know, having more romance all of that kind of stuff, but their belief is the other person should change more. The second one would be the feel up their voice has not been heard in relationships, romantic or otherwise and third one, I would say that they are aware that their relationship with themself isn't great so confidence or you know, whether that's to speak up on make decisions or how they look or how they feel They would be the big three for me. Do you notice any difference between men and women? Umm, yes. Oh, absolutely. Of course, I mean at the core no, but on the surface yeah. It's a lot more, It's a lot, often a lot more work to to get a guy to to realize the value of going that deep in that introspective because you know, I know especially up north the it's drilled into you that that's not really the way to be, you know, you don't go, you don't go down a mine or to a shipyard and start, you know spill in your heart. But but when you when you get that person there it's it's huge right? But yeah, that would be the main difference, I would say. What I would say as well, is that that...umm, women with with confidence issues that can take a little bit more work. Guys just probably kind of need a bit of a nudge. But yeah, they're the main differences. I would say. Yeah, because I find in our resilience programs, we find Imposter syndrome and we find it generally more prevalent in women. Yes. And what always surprise, it doesn't what it doesn't surprise me because no I'm looking for but what surprises me is, on the outside these are very confident, very successful, very professional women. Sure. And you just never guess. Yeah. You would never guess and it tends to be, what Louise's noticed in our team is coming more towards menopause. Right, Okay. Is there a particular kind of life stage that you find relationships are really tested, you know, we've talked about big big events like the pandemic are there any particular life stages that really kind of test relationships or points that people might be you know, if there's somebody out there going you know I'm of a certain age or I'm doing this and feeling alone and a bit of a like they are is it just them are there any any points in life or any things where you would go? No, actually I see a lot of people around this. Yeah, so, so new parents often hit a roadblock because as you're aware, it's it's life-changing in a way that you can't really tell anyone. And so that can be a real kind of trigger point for people. It's often to do with with work related things to be honest. There's often some connection to work. But really it is just to kind of go back to the the imposter syndrome thing that you were mentioning when when we're younger remember growing up you kind of create this idea of yourself and who you're meant to be so, you know, I am shy, I am outgoing, I am you know easily lovable, not lovable, whatever it is when we pick up all these messages and reinforce them over the years, you know, I've done I'm sure you know all about that with you with your coaching work but when we can hold on to that idea and no matter how much we progress up the ladder we've still got that idea ourselves that's never been addressed or challenged. And so if you're really successful, but you've got a you know, I know that one thing that about my parents always used to say to me was, you know, if you don't work hard you'll end up working at Burger King. It was all Burger King for some reason. I don't know why we don't have a Burger King around here. But anyway, and I had a really like notice that keep coming up, you know as well as you like yourself. I worked in the bank and as well as I did there that would always kind of play my mind anytime like oh and you know, that I should really be working in Burger King. Oh, I know that that that's a bit of a silly example, but if you've got those thoughts that are untested and unchallenged and you're moving up your mind is always thinking, well, this is us out of our comfort zone, we're not where we should be and that can really ruin careers and damage careers and people as well if it's not probably looked at so what when I work with people I always try and get to the root of it because it's quite often just a bit of a sticky plaster going on it, isn't it? It's like oh, you know the promotion makes us feel good for now that must be over that instead of looking at that and finding out why you can't fully accept and enjoy and all that kind of thing. Yeah, I get it. It reminds me of again. I used to work in London City, senior level and I'm working with Consultants from all around the world all the big names, right? And I constantly had in the back of my head and I never really realized it right. I'm just a kid from a council estate. What do I know? Versus that person who's gone to a big prestigious American University and it didn't matter how many times people told me how good I was or how good the slide decks were and the presentations and things like that. I had that little nagging bit in my head. And and I think I've outgrown it now. Yes. I've had to become self-aware but I probably say more so I didn't do it deliberately, but I kinda go I wish I wish I'd have been able to talk to somebody about that much sooner and had it played back to me. Yeah. Or played to me. Because you love that Echo chamber in your head and nobody's questioning it. But and if people hear it, if people could hear it for a little volume button that people could turn up I suspect from the work I do as well. Most people would go - What? You're saying What what to yourself in your head? Yeah. Absolutely. I am I did this course once on on it was relationship of the self, actually. It was a couple years ago. One of the exercises was to at the end of the day write down all of your inner dialogue you have with yourself and how you talk to yourself. But but write it, write in the way that you think it and it was horrific. It was brutal and when people can do that and see how they actually relate to themselves. It can be quite shocking and one of the analogies. I like to use, you I say like to use I've made up this analogy to get a point across a while ago with a client and I hate it and I don't think it works, but everyone seems to connect to it so I'll just keep using it. But it's like if you took this old beaten and and broken chair, and you put it in my house or you put it in a mansion or you put it on the streets or you wet or in a school hall, wherever you put it. It doesn't matter where you put that chair, it is still a chair that needs some attention and some some repair. And and it's the same with a person if you don't really look at the person and do the the work on the person no matter where you stick it whether they become a millionaire whether they live on the streets. They're still gonna have the same issues, and yeah. No, I like that. No, I get it. I get it. I like it. Cause I was also thinking as well, It some of it is environmental because you could put that chair in some environments and some environments would appreciate it for what it is. Yeah. Yeah. Others would go look at that old chair. Exactly. Some people would go look at that beautiful piece of furniture that just needs a bit more attention. So again, it's it's that person and environmental fit as well. It makes it really interesting. Yeah, absolutely. It does, there's a great phrase I've heard and it's we can't change the content, so we have to change the context. Yeah. And it's not, changing the relationship always but sometimes how we're perceiving things and how we're looking at things. That can make the biggest difference. And that's that's one of the real benefits of working with the coach, isn't it? I mean, I'm biased because I am a coach. Yeah, coaches are the best. I get it. And it's challenging that perspective. I've got a question for you though as well. I know you have a counseling background as well, right? I do. Because I kind of think, and I'm not, some people wouldn't approach a relationship coach because they're thinking do I really want to admit relationships are not great and then to go to somebody who's got a therapy background. Yeah. They might go. Oh, no, right. What would you say to somebody like that? What's the difference between a coach under therapist? What does, what does a coach with the therapist background offer, offer that other coaches don't? Absolutly. 2 questions there. So, I worked as a therapist for a long time and I always found it was like finding a boat that had sank at the bottom of the sea and pulling it out and finding out what made it sink. Okay, and it's very useful to know, it's it's very it's very helpful. But what coaching adds to that is it repairs the boat and it plots somewhere for it to go and it goes on the journey and it might change the destination and it might have you know, as corny as it sounds, adventures on the way, but there is that side of things that's not just so remedial as as therapy was it's not all just about okay. Well, why did this happen and what because I always found therapy said, right this why you are the way you are. See you later. And you just kind of left there, like I don't know what to do with this. Like where do I go? The coach's job is to is to look right? Where do you want to be? Yeah, so I do that side of things will look at why you are the way you are and what's causing you these issues, but it's also about right, where do you want to be and going on that journey, and it's being a lot more aspirational and a lot more. Okay, let's move forward and it's not just about looking in the rear view mirror all the time. Yeah, that's how I think about the the two therapy is about the rear-view mirror. Yeah. Whereas coaching is about the kind of looking through the window and going. Absolutely. And going forward and both have a place right? Yeah. Yeah, that's it. On what you need and I guess you bring, because I'm not therapist, I'm a coach and I know where the line is and. Yes. Ethically I have to draw that line, I'm guessing actually you've got you can Flex. And that's it. The, my therapy background Is there as a tool you know, it's there when when we need to go there but it's only if it's going to be an aid of the person getting to where they want to get to. Yeah, I suppose I'm gonna go back because I don't think we explore that the the the other events and live stages that people would come to, are they because I'm kind of I want anybody listening to it to Go - Oh, yeah that that's me and go and then equate the context and go - Yeah. Oh, yeah, that's me. I could do with talking to Phil. Yeah, absolutely. So In in the in the context that you put I would say. Yeah new parents was as often a trigger from it to come to me. Yeah, I've worked with people who are students and I've worked with people who served in the Vietnam War and everyone in between and and that isn't it's it's when there seems to be this persistent problem with the relationship where there's a repeat and pattern or a stop that you just can't get past and and there's there's this feeling that that's certainly I felt and other clients have felt and people have felt where you just you you maybe go to work or you go out somewhere and you just left thinking. I don't know what's happened here. Like how have we ended up here? How do we get away from it? I don't know what's going on. That's kind of where I would come in or if you the other one would be what we talked about earlier where if on paper it looks great, but you just you can't feel it. Yeah, that's where I come in as well. And what would you say to somebody who kind of would go look I could that resonates with me, so I'm a new parent it all looks good on on paper, but it doesn't feel great. But I'm a little bit unsure. I'm a bit unsure about talking to a relationship coach because it's a bit, you know isn't admitting that I've got it wrong or What would you say to somebody? So so what I would say to somebody in that instances it's not that you've got it wrong. But it's maybe more that your perception of the situation just needs adjusting slightly. So it's like, you know when you looked at those pictures and it's like is it an old lady. Oh then that's actually oh it's a picture of a young woman and then you see it and you can't unsee it kind of thing. It's it's a bit like that where you haven't necessarily done anything wrong because things can only be made wrong by us believing that they're wrong. So therefore it's all on our head. Anyway that that that's not the road to go down today, but it's more about changing how you look at your relationship. Look at yourself and look at how you relate to the world. And and yeah, yeah, it's that kind of thing. Yeah, I I get you and perhaps wrong was the wrong word because as you thinking about those images from thinking about the rabbit and the duck one. Yeah, you know, you look yeah exactly first and it's been proven hasn't it that around Easter time more people see that rabbit, you know, in other words it's that kind of attentional bias and I suppose I suppose if you're in a difficult relationship and you try to work it out, then it will constantly be, you're constantly have that kind of attentional bias and I suppose coming to work outside of that working with somebody really not not just only helps you challenge your own perspective, but doing it in an environment where you're kind of you're not getting that bias because we that's how we work, we're designed to kind. Of course. See we see see the See the rabbit rather than the duck at Easter. Absolutely and and you can you can feel that come in when you start thinking that the other person's 'quote un quote' wrong all the time. It's always the other person. It's always them doing something. It's always them. It's always where they are and I would put to you that not but it's the way that you're perceiving that thing. Yeah. So if you hearing that kind of black and white thinking it's always them. Yeah. Yeah, every everything they do. It's never me. Yeah signs aren't they? All the exact opposite? It's always me. It's always me. It's always me, neither of them are realistic or right? Yeah. Yeah because I often think well, it's not them or us, know them on me It us, it's not always or never, it's sometimes and it's not everything and nothing, it's somethings. Yeah, in other words we're not in that black and white. So if you've noticed in very black and white thinking that's probably a sign, isn't it? Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely and it's it's 9 times out of 10. It's the way we're looking at something and again, I didn't mean to come on and throw so many analogies but I use this one and again it sometimes works. But if I was to put a pair of shoes in a big school hall and 10 people had to walk past it and 10 people walked past, don't care. There's just some shoes on the floor shoes on the floor, but person number 10 comes along and there's been shoes left out at home, she used to get in trouble for making a mess when she was younger. She nearly tripped over some of the kids shoes this morning. and and it's just it it's a trigger for and suddenly those shoes represent something, that that make her fly off in a rage. You can see that those shoes don't actually hold anything because 9 people have just walked past and haven't even noticed it but it's the lens through which she's viewing it that's creating the problem. So that's what we need to look at in the relationships. Totally get that. Yeah, totally because I mean I'm from a I'm from a, I'd say disadvantage background. Yeah. So I like to keep things nice and tidy and clean. I get that oh yeah! I've got I've got say the rest of my family. No not as much. Yeah. Yeah. And sometimes sometimes a find myself going 'eeerrrrggghhhh' kind of kind of thing and it can impact and it you back to that self-awareness, aren't you? Exactly. And understanding yourself... Because, I always think I always I always think our thinking has such a big impact on our lives every single day on our relationships and everything else yet, we don't stop and think because we're not really taught those those skills. I'm gonna ask you right? Yes. I'm gonna ask you for some, if could you give me and anybody listening three tips, if you if, for better relationships three tips that we could take away right from this what would those tips be? Because I you know, me and you chatted before I've seen you on on linkedIn you have 9,000 followers, so you obviously know something about relationships, right? Yes, you know something right just um, can you give us just a few few tips based on on your work and your insights that people could just take away and try today and go do you know, what? Oh, yeah. That's that's good! Okay. Yes... the first ones not really something you can try but it's a way to consider life being that with that will cause an effect. You'll see what I mean. So I want people to consider that no matter what they do in life, you cannot change what anyone else thinks, what anyone else feels or what anyone else does and it you if you do it's under duress and it'll create a toxic environment that will create resentment. So all you can ever actually focus on is you and how you show up, so, focusing on you and creating the best version of you to show up to that relationship is the only way to improve it never, never the other person because you can't affect what someone else does. That's number one. Yeah, yeah. The second thing that I would say is for people to slow down and what I mean by that is we are always under the belief that that things need to, we need to be someone else really really quickly. So our relationship needs to be this amazing thing or the or I need to be this amazing partner. I need to look super you know attractive for the beach, but I need to do it, you know yesterday needs to be done done done. And what I would encourage you to do is just slow down a little bit and look at where they are now and and look at the things that are there and available for them now instead of getting so far out into the future because If you consistently tell your brain that or I'll be happy when, I'll be happy when the relationships mended. I'll be happy when they change, I'll have when I change whatever it is. You're telling your brain. Okay happiness is out there in the future. And the problem with that is we can't live in the future. We can only live day to day when I live in right now. So all your brains here is happiness isn't here right now, happiness isn't here right now, and we can also only be here right now. So just getting people to slow down and try and show up as best they can in the present moment. I think that would be the other thing. And a bit a big one that I use a lot and it comes up quite a lot is have a look where you're living your relationship through expectation because living through expectation is guaranteed to to cause discomfort and pain because what you're saying is I believe that that the universe or that life should go a certain way. And you know, if I don't know anyone who has that power, right? You can't make life go a certain way. But if you're living through expectations, you have a belief that that's something should go or someone should act a certain way and life doesn't work like that, ever really. And so you're always going to be disappointed. You're always going to be upset. That's like if you got up and expected so the the sky to be yellow every day. You're just going to wake up frustrated and angry and annoyed. Even if you expect it, even if you believe it should be that way. It's not so, have a look with where you're looking living through our expectations of the other person and try to think what life would be like without that expectation. Ask yourself, what would the relationship be like if I didn't have this expectation or this belief that someone should be different? And start to introduce a little bit more of acceptance. Now when I say that I appreciate that some relationships are different. I'm not saying if someone's in abusive or a horrible relationship that they should accept that. But it is it is what it is and you know, things can't be different because they're not right now. And and just kind of living into that acceptance a little bit. That would be my third bit. Yeah brought broad tips for every day relationships. And I think you know the the three are if I remember them correctly and I'll just summarize them are don't try control other people. You'll only be disappointed. All you can really do is take ownership for yourself. Right number two is don't live in the future, enjoy now and present and slow down. Thank you and then kind of related to that is is don't live a life of expectation. Correct. Right, so three good tips. So I've got one last question if I'm here Phil. Yes one last question. If you could go back and give one bit of advice to you younger self. Now that you know all this stuff about relationships. What would it be? Ummm, do you want the answer in terms of relationships? Or do the answer in terms of of just the knowledge I've picked up as a coach?However, you like whatever you think. Sure, so I would go back and I would explain to myself that no one can ever abandon or reject you you can only ever abandon or reject yourself. And what I mean by that is people other people can only be somewhere or be somewhere else. They'll be here or be somewhere else, but it's it's what I made, that mean that caused so much, you know difficulties as a child and as a teenager and things like that and I would hope that younger me gets it. Younger me probably would not or just wouldn't care or whatever. But yeah, that is the biggest bit of advice and I do think that does would go into relationships as well, you know, because that was a big thing for me growing up. Because I felt rejected as a kid. I wanted to people please all the time, right and that's how I came up because I didn't want to be rejected again. So I'd go above and beyond to be nice to the other person and then that was not was a healthy thing to do. So, yeah, if that that's another thing I work with people on but that's what I would need to work on. Yeah, there's a whole host, thank you for sharing that. Yeah, there's a whole host of things in there. So if people are listening to this and go, you know what I think I quite like to look up Phil, quite like to work with him. Where do they find you? How how can they find you? So yeah, I'm on LinkedIn. Just Phil Airson. a i r s o n or on my website. That's it. And we'll we'll put links in all the usual places. So sure. This will be on YouTube and it will direct people to where, so, it's been an absolute pleasure talking to you Phil. Hey you to David, I always like to always like to chat about these things, and it's been a very interesting chat. Yeah, I think people are going to take quite quite a bit aware from from this and I hope it's made people two things. Right? I hope it's made people think about their relationships. It's given them some tips to improve the relationships, but the other big thing is I hope it's encouraged some people to reach out and go, you know, what I could do with working on on my relationships. I could do with some hints and tips and I hope they get in touch with you. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. I'm always willing to to jump on a call with anyone it I I do hope people, it gives people at least to pause to reflect on where they're at. If that's all it is then then perfect. Brilliant. Well, thank you so much for your time Phil. Alright, David. I'll see you soon. Cheers man. So, thanks again for joining me on this episode. If you'd like to talk to Phil directly or you're thinking about a relationship head over to and I'll see you again next time.

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