Sidewalk Conversations
"Let the one who thinks he stands, take heed lest he fall..." (1 Corinthians 10:12)
Standing strong and remaining true to your calling is no easy task. No one sets out to crash and burn. In fact, it's actually the opposite, most people want to stand strong, remain effective, and be true to their values all the way through to the end. But, it is really hard to do.
In these interviews, Piet Van Waarde (a 40 year veteran of pastoral ministry) has heart-to-heart conversations with ordinary people about what it takes to stay faithful and effective in the things that matter most.
Sidewalk Conversations
**SPECIAL** The Genius of the "AND" with Shaina Zavala | Part 2
**Join us for a special summer series of conversations with Shaina and Piet about the genius of the "and." We are so excited to share this 4-part discussion with you AND for the launch of season 4 of Sidewalk Conversations this August! If you enjoy this episode and want to check out all of the things Piet is working on, head on over to the Piet Van Waarde channel on Youtube.**
We are exploring "the genius of the AND" – the powerful concept of embracing both conventional and alternative approaches to healthcare rather than viewing them as opposing forces. Through personal stories about cancer treatment and childbirth experiences, we examine how breaking down false dichotomies can lead to better, more informed medical decisions.
• The tension between holistic/natural treatments and conventional medicine creates unnecessary division
• Fear often drives medical decision-making, pushing people toward either/or thinking
• Personal experience with cancer treatment reveals the value of drawing from multiple approaches
• Childbirth provides another example of how the medical establishment creates false choices
• Seeking multiple opinions and perspectives leads to better informed consent
• The "genius of the AND" allows patients to benefit from both conventional and alternative approaches
Always seek multiple opinions and gather information from different sources before making important healthcare decisions. This approach will help you get the best care possible rather than limiting yourself to a single perspective.
So we are back again.
Piet Van Waarde:I love this If you've been joining us or are joining us right now.
Piet Van Waarde:We have been talking about the genius of the end, that we live in a world that often puts things in categories it's either this or that, and we're talking about the genius of the end. And last, we were talking about this in the medical field, and so I wanted to kind of start by saying that one of the tensions I've felt in this journey with cancer is that there is a group of people that are very much oriented around holistic, natural, non-toxic treatments and they look at very suspiciously at the modern medical, you know typical oncology, urology, and the same is true on the other side. Yes, they look at these guys, they're wackos, they're just out for your money. And I found myself and this has been like experientially true where I'm like why should we make that a neither? Or Can we not say, hey, there's some stuff that's valuable over here and there are some things that I need to take advantage of here, and I just don't understand why there's such animosity between those two circles, because I think the genius is in the end.
Shaina Zavala:Yeah, it's crazy. I mean I can't even imagine the level that you're dealing with that or have dealt with that. But even for us, like, so we decided to do a birthing center, and that was like you would have thought. I asked to have my baby by myself in a field somewhere. You know what I mean Like, and so you have a bunch of of. You know, the traditional medical field is like, why would you do that? It's so dangerous, all this other stuff.
Shaina Zavala:And then, like you said, on the other side, you know they are so and both are so quick to lead with, like the numbers and the data and the stats. You know what I mean. And it was like for me, they're like, they're going to kill you. They're going to kill you, you know, and it was just like, ah, and it's overwhelming, you know, and it right, having a baby is very common. But then you feel this pressure and it just makes it just, it's just so, it doesn't have to be that way. And so for us it was like finding a place where, where they accepted both, and I'm so glad that we were actually able to find that. Like I said, I had a really difficult pregnancy and so I had to go see some specialists and things like that, and so every time I would go, you know, it's like almost like a pointing the finger and it was difficult, until the very end, of being able to have a respect and again bring those things together and I just never understood why it couldn't be both.
Piet Van Waarde:And I think one of the reasons why the appeal of the either or scenario is so compelling to people is because it's built on fear.
Piet Van Waarde:Right, so you don't want this to happen?
Piet Van Waarde:Yeah, so therefore, you should do this, or you don't want that to happen, so you've got to go here.
Piet Van Waarde:And that fear really plays in. And in fact, I lead a group right now of fellow cancer warriors, and one of the things we I mean, we're in week, I think, 13 right now and one of the things we talk regularly about is how fear is at the core of so many of the decisions that people make, like it's not because there's some positive thing that they hope will come out, it's that, well, I'm going to do this because I'm afraid that this other thing might happen if I don't. So, whether it's chemo surgery, any number of things, like the doctor says, if I don't do this, you know, while on the other hand, it's like, well, wait, I want to make decisions that are more like optimistic and positive, and I think that's why the genius of the end is so important, because you can say I want to take advantage of all the things I know here and all the things that are available to me here, and that feels a lot more positive.
Shaina Zavala:And it feels really trivial to think about it this way, but for me it allows a person to make like almost like informed consent on my decision. I have information from this, I have information from this and this is what I'm choosing to do. And again, I just don't know why, like that sounds so, like yeah, that makes sense, and I just don't know why it's not already framed. Why is it not framed that way? Why is it just like? I am, you know, the leading expert in this and take what I say at face value. You know, and so I know, what my husband, martin, when he was doing a cancer journey with his first wife you know they he was saying you always go get, you know, multiple opinions and you always have to go talk to different doctors and the holistic approach and that's how you're going to get the best care. Because just taking something at face value, that fear component is always going to be brought in for sure.
