How To Turn Your Skills into a Profitable Product Business w/ Jacqueline Snyder

Looking to monetize beyond services? Let's unlock prosperity with products! Join entrepreneur Jacqueline Snyder as we explore creating physical products aligned with your strengths and customer needs. From workbooks to branded merchandise, discover how to boost your brand's income potential. Ready to dive into the world of products?

IN TODAY’S EPISODE, I DISCUSS: 

-The critical steps to identifying what your clients truly need and how to enhance their experience

-Differentiation strategies to find and own your niche

-Jacqueline's personal journey from fashion mogul to product guru

CONNECT WITH JACQUELINE SNYDER:
Get to know more about Jacqueline Snyder: https://www.theproductboss.com/ 

RECOMMENDED EPISODES FOR YOU 

If you liked this episode, you'll love these ones:

• My Money Planning Process to Achieve Your Goals
• How to Get the Right CPA & Why It Matters
• Demystifying Your Credit Score & Does It Matter

RECOMMENDED VIDEOS FOR YOU 

If you liked this video, you'll love these ones:

• My Money Planning  Process to Achieve Your Goals: https://youtu.be/Ip7kLKXNj2Y 
• How to Get the Right CPA & Why It Matters: https://youtu.be/zj26Wwqe0bk 
• Demystifying Your Credit Score & Does It Matter: https://youtu.be/emgKYPy6Quw 

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Building Your Money Machine: How to Get Your Money to Work Harder For You Than You Did For It! 

The key to building the life you desire and deserve is to build your Money Machine—a powerful system designed to generate income that’s no longer tied to your work or efforts. This step-by-step guide goes beyond the general idea of personal finance and wealth creation and reveals the holistic approach to transforming your relationship with money to allow you to enjoy financial freedom and peace of mind.

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Take this free quiz to see where you are on the path to financial freedom and what your next steps are to move you to a new financial destiny at http://www.YourFinancialFreedomQuiz.com  

OTHER RESOURCES:

7-Day Money Plan Workshop: https://www.TheMoneyPlanWorkshop.com

Affluent Entrepreneurs Private Facebook Group https://www.melabraham.com/group/

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Transcript

2:02

This is the affluent entrepreneur show for entrepreneurs that want to operate at a high level and achieve financial liberation. I'm your host, Mel Abraham, and I'll be sharing with you what it takes to create success beyond wealth so you can have a richer, more fulfilling lifestyle. In this show, you'll learn how business and money intersect so you can scale your business, scale your money, and scale your life while creating a deeper impact and living with complete freedom, because that's what it really means to be an affluent entrepreneur. Hey, there. This one is a good one. I just had a conversation with a friend of mine, Jacqueline Snyder. She is one half of the product boss partnership, teaching people how to take and create product based businesses. And so I wanted to bring her on because she has a very unique background, a unique take on things, and a unique journey. She came out of the fashion industry creating fashion brands for some people you would know, but really started to help people to say, how do you expand your income or your income sources to have more income streams? By productizing either your knowledge, your skills, or something. You know, getting it out there in a way that you have income streams that are not derived from your time, but derived from your knowledge, your products, and doing it in a way that's a highly profitable. And we talk about the journey. We talk about the struggles, we talk about the steps and, and how to get it done. So enjoy this episode of the affluent entrepreneur show. This one's good, especially if you want to put some products out in the world. All right, enjoy. See in the episode. Hey there, Jacqueline. So, so good to have you on the show. This is going to be exciting because we've not had some of the conversations that I think you and I can have on the show before. So welcome. So excited to be here. Yeah. So as you all heard in the interview, Jacqueline's got an amazing story, an amazing past, and an amazing business that revolves around products, and it revolves around personal brands and product brands. And how do you do that? And if we're going to, if we're going to build multiple streams of income, this is one of the ways to do it. And she's. They've dialed it. Her and her partner have dialed this thing in. So let's start. Let's just go back a ways and just figure out how did you get here? Because you didn't start here. No. It's funny, I tell my kids now, I'm like, there are jobs out there that have not even been invented by the time they get older. Right? Because when I was growing up, it wasn't like, oh, you'll be a podcaster and a digital educator in the future, right? What was the Internet? So I, you know, I'm a creative, I've always been a creative, but I grew up in a time where it was like, go to college and be something big. So I was like, am I going to be a lawyer? Am I going to be a psychologist? What am I going to be? But I was really fortunate very quickly in college that I decided, you know what? I want to be a fashion designer. It wasn't, it wasn't one of those things that people tell you you can be when you grow up, right? You dream about it. But so I, I quickly changed course, went to school and became a fashion designer at like a top school school in the US, and was hired out of school and had these amazing opportunities straight out of graduation based on my portfolio to really work at big companies at a really high level. So I worked for a company called Cosabella, which is an italian lingerie company at the time, like Sex and the City and Jessica Simpson. And all these people were wearing products I made and I launched their first swimwear collection. So I was given this, like, cool opportunity to work. It's still like a mom and pop business still run by the family. But then this huge company that sold an even Marcus hired from there to work for a celebrity who had won an Emmy at the time and launched a celebrity collection. So I think I was just really lucky with getting access as a designer in my field, but almost working in an entrepreneurial way. And when I decided to leave working for other people and go out on my own, I kind of fell into consulting. But I started a company called designer Consulting co op back when I was 26 years old. Because they tell you you only have to know a little bit more than somebody else. Yep. And I knew how to make clothes and I was in Los Angeles, so I started just handing out flyers at the local coffee shop in the fashion district of LA and saying, like, I can design and develop and produce your clothing line. So I did that at 26. I didn't, I don't know what I was doing, what, I just did it. And I've had that business still since 2007. I still have it where it went from a full consulting agency with a large team to eventually, my husband's a broadway actor. We were talking about that and I had two kids and we were back and forth, the east coast. And so I ended up taking it from a physical location with a team to eventually, like ten years later, consulting only. But in that time, as I launched, I've launched over a thousand fashion brands for people, which I say I'm like 999 more than most people. I started my own line, so in that time, I created cuffs couture. So I became a product based business owner. It was a wearable wrist wallet that you could wear out to go dancing and not bring a purse, and Kari Underwood, Kim Kardashian, Karlie Rae Jepsen. Like, I had a lot of really big celebrities wear my product, and, like, our phones got bigger, and things just shifted. And I had two kids, so I ended up actually closing down that product based business, but that is how I found my business partner, Mina. And then we started the product boss, which is a podcast, an education company, and we can always talk about that. So cool. Because you wouldn't anticipate going, because first off, the fashion industry is cutthroat, high competition, high pressure, and, you know, and yet you were able to actually navigate it in a lot of different ways where some people can't even get their foot in the door. Yeah, I was really lucky. I think it was the school that we went to that it's Otis College of Art and Design, but they placed us. So my friends have been at Nike since we went. You know, they've been at Gap, so they placed us. But I think the luck that I had was I was offered the job by the. It was a $25 million company, but it was a more of a mom and pop. So if I had gotten the job at Gap or Nike, I probably would still be there. I don't know that my journey would have taken me here, even though I am an entrepreneur. Because you. Yeah, because. Because you had the ability to look at it more from an entrepreneur's perspective, much more versus a career. And nothing wrong with the careers path. But, yeah, I was raised by entrepreneurs. I'm first generation american. Like, they just scrappy and they created stuff, so maybe I wouldn't have worked for people, but I did, like, the safe route. Right. I did want to the $150,000 salary out of school versus trying to figure this out. So, yeah, I think that just the exposure and maybe being from Los Angeles and just the exposure to different things shifted for me, because I know my friends that went to gap, they started with just, like, pants and figuring out fabrics. Right. They had a very small. I have a friend that left gap and came to me to help her start a line, and she didn't know the whole gamut of what it goes into production, because you work in such a small capacity at these bigger brands. So because I think I did have that exposure to everything, I was able to become a consultant and a coach, do it for myself, and then just have so much more knowledge. So I'm curious if you had a, because, you know, launching a thousand brands, like you said, 999 more than anyone else, if you had a specific process that you took people through, that you followed, that actually increase the possibility or the probability of success for your clients? Yeah, I think yes. Obviously it was figured out along the way. I've had the business for like 15 plus years at this point, but the process was very much so. People come in and they're like, I want to start a clothing line. Like, I have a really good example. A woman who was 6ft tall wanted to create a tall women's line. Great. And so she'd come to me and she'd give me all of her ideas and I want to make bathing suits and activewear and evening gowns. And basically she's thinking department store level. So I think one of the biggest things, and this is something we continue to teach now, is like really like niching down to the biggest need in the market. There's room for everybody but niche down and be known for something. So excuse me. Once I kind of established that with people and it was like, what is the most needed thing in the market? Then the process of the overhead was less, like the startup costs were less, and then it was like, let's go through this development. Most of my stuff is domestic and then things have changed. So at that point it was like, how are they going to get to the customer now? You can access customers and like for free through social media. But definitely, like, it turned into a process that I, you know, I have like a, if they want to do it in three months, I can get it done in three months. If they want to do it in six months, like, I have a whole checklist of what to take them through. So cool. But I think that the key, like you said, and this is something that a lot of folks miss and I hear it all the time, whether they're trying to do it online or just a business in general, is they don't niche down. They don't, they don't know the pervasive need that they serve and they don't know the people that have that pervasive need at a level that they can speak to it very directly. And yet I don't remember who did the quote, but if we solve the more helping people solve their problems. The money follows that, you know, and I, you know, I don't remember who, who. And I just butchered the quote, but what the heck? Yeah. And I, but I think that's the, that's the thing for those of the folks that are out there sitting back saying, I need, I want to generate more income. And I don't know how. You all have talents. You all have skills. You all have things that people ask you about the things that you had a journey. You had a journey. And, and sometimes we get pushed into, like you said, some people got pushed into gap. You got moved into this role, but we get blinders. I almost did the same thing. I was at one of the big, big consulting firms in downtown Los Angeles and had, they had their way, I'd still be there. I would probably be, oh, I don't know, 30 pounds overweight, stressed out as hell. We wouldn't be having this conversation. I wouldn't be enjoying life. Not that they don't. There's plenty of people that do that, but it wasn't for me. And we get caught in this channel. And yet you've managed to create not only that success, but to parlay that success and say, I've got some strengths that I can use a lot of different ways. You have, in effect, created a personal brand, you know, via your consulting, your coaching, your mentoring. You, in effect, still have a product brand. And you have a virtual brand, an online presence with, you know, prop, you know, with Mina. Yeah, product boss and all that stuff is just. And yet it all parlays off of how you saw the skills that you have. Yes. It's epic listening to you say it back. And the thing is, is that, you know, some, especially at your young age. The same. Benjamin buttons that was with Mina. And so Mina is my business partner. She lives in Iowa. I was living in Los Angeles when we met. So how would we both find each other? We had found each other through a podcast where it was on the Biz Chicks podcast. And Natalie had mentioned Mina and said she sells a product, she sells a label, labels on Amazon. And if she ever wanted to be an Amazon expert, she could be. So it was that idea of sort of, hey, you do something and if you wanted to ever sell your expertise, you could be. Mina's cringing because she never wanted to coach a single person. Like, introvert. I have a product business. Amazon's going to sell it for me. Me. My ears are perking up and I'm like, cyber stalking her on Facebook. And I reach out to her and this is with my cuffs company. And I was trying to liquidate it. I was trying to get rid of it. I was like, hey, would you ever be open to chatting about getting this on Amazon to liquidate? So we. That was not what I ended up doing, but we ended up talking. And I think at that point, it's when we realized there was such a gap in the market for people speaking to product based business owners. Everyone talks to service. We would listen to podcasts and be like, oh, they're talking about opt ins. How can I make an opt in for my product business, right? Do I need a download? Like, what do I do? And nobody really ever tackled the financial aspect of products because there's so much that you have to pay out cost of goods, like, everything before you ever make a single sale, versus I'm going to put my voice on Instagram and sell a service. So we really connected in that way. And I think what was interesting, and we do, like, Myers Briggs tests and, like, we do all these things, and we realized that we're actually one half of a brain each. Like, we don't share a single letter in Myers Briggs. Like, we're very similar in opposites that we complete. We were so fortunate. I don't know how we found each other. Like, our destiny is like a line, but we took what she knew, which was like, Amazon and subscription boxes and, like, this kind of. We used to call it the new way of selling products. And what I knew, which was traditional manufacturing, selling wholesale direct to consumer, brick and mortar retail. And we combined it, and we're like, why don't we teach people? And we were talking about this. Our signature program is called multi stream machine. I know you teach this a lot, but they say a millionaire of is a millionaire from seven streams of income. Well, it's the same for product based businesses. Like, you cannot only rely on Etsy because Etsy can shut down your store. You can not only rely on your brick and mortar because there could be a global pandemic that closes the whole thing down. Right? So it's like if we think about Nike, they're sold in many different places in many different ways. They're selling wholesale. They're selling direct to consumer. They have brick and mortars. They have partnerships. So that's sort of what we decided to integrate in this, like, multiple streams of revenue for product based businesses. But I don't know how we got there. It was. It was true. It's like in reflection now, five years later, we're like, wow, everything we've done to that point, led us here. But 1520 years ago, I would have never told you that this is where I would be. And I think that's the thing for all of you to think about. It's like we can't know our destination but be open to the opportunities as they arrive and think like what if, like what if I try this? What if we try that? What could happen? And just kind of go with it? So, so cool. Because I learned something and I wrote about this in my first book from Brian Tracy. He talks about the corridor principle and he said the doors of opportunity are in the corridor. And too often we confine ourselves to a room. We stay inside of what we know and what is expected of us by career, by society, by parents, by sibling, by spouses. And we never get out in the hallway where the doors are to say and then be open to the possibility because look, I'm a freaking accountant, okay? And I just got back from speaking to, I don't know, 200 people. And then you two weeks ago is 2000 people. Accountants don't do that, you know, but being open to where your skills conserve, be open to where they, they may take you. There's opportunities there. And I think that that's, I think that's why the two of you also came together is to be, you were open to this possibility. And you know, you mentioned about the multiple streams and Etsy could shut you down. And this may be hard for some people or confronting for some people that are wage earners, but if your only source of income is your salary from the company you work for, you're not recession proof, you are in jeopardy. And my wife worked 22 years for one company and then they downsized. You know, after 22 years, she survived every other downsize, but they let her go and she's back working and doing great. But point being is that when we take control of our own income streams, when we take control of how we spend our money, when we take control of our own wealth building, we're not depending on government, we're not depending on a company, we're not depending on depending on anything else, handouts, any of that stuff. That's when you become recession proof. That's when you become damage proof. It doesn't mean that you're not going to get some debts. Trust me, it hurts when it happens. But if you start to see those opportunities, the strengths like you have, even if you are working for a gap, assuming that you didn't have any contractual limitations working for gap, you could still do coaching, you could still have this other income stream. You could still do some of these other things that if then all of a sudden you decided you want to leave gap or they decided they didn't want you, they wanted a separation. You weren't left high and dry. And I think that's the beautiful thing of what you're creating and helping people create. Yeah. And I think, and the thing is, is that I was lucky because I was at UC Santa Barbara. It was really hard to get into. And I remember friends parents were like, your parents are letting you leave a UC to go to art school? That was like, the thing. I was like, I can't believe they're letting you do this. And I think I was very fortunate that I'm a first generation american, so they didn't grow up here with this idea of, you have to go to college, you have to stay in these boxes because they were already new to this country and figuring things out. And that's something Mina and I align on because she's also first generation America and her family's from, like, refugees, so. And then my husband, I mean, there are streets in Los Angeles named after his family. Like, they are like true Californians. And he thinks very differently than I do. Right. He has a very different approach. Like, he would rather work for people. But guess what? Broadway was shut down. Right? Like, the pandemic shut it down. And all of these actors were out of work and they didn't have health insurance and they had no way to get paid and no, you know, and so the thing there was like, I actually remember during that, I like, he's very fortunate. He's married to me. Our spouses, if they stay with us, let me tell you, they're the saints in the relationship. Doesn't listen to the podcast I'm on. No, but it was like, he came home, Broadway shut down. And I was like, you have have a following. Let's get on your Instagram. And I was like, I'm coaching ten people. If you guys want to learn voice, if you want to keep your voice going, I'm coaching ten people. We closed 40 people that night on Instagram Stories. I'm, like, in there sending PayPal. You know, I love that. I love the, like, the chase. But he would have probably stopped and been like, that's it for me until we reopen. And I, and I, and if you're listening to this show, you're already somebody who likes to. To learn and figure things out and know what else is possible. So I think staying open to that. The worst that's going to happen is it doesn't work. Nobody's going to know. If he had booked zero people, nobody would have known except for us, and we would have tried a different angle. So it's just like. But we thought ten people, and we got 40 people. I mean, that was the cash influx we needed at that time. That kind of then set him up for what was next in his life. And you wonder how many of his colleagues sat back and did we zoom called Cass. Like, there was a lot of calls. You all remember these times. And I remember one of the women was, like, underneath a blanket in her bed in a dark room in a New York City apartment. And I was like, one, thank God we live in New Jersey, which I never thought I would thank God for, but I had an outside, and then I was like, God, like, they've just come to a stop. So it was the people who got scrappy and creative and thought, well, what else is possible? Let's just try it. That really, I think it's proving to yourself things that are possible. You know, here's the other thing that, and I know that you're helping your husband now create something, which I think is an interesting conversation to have, because he can only, he's, you know, he's a Broadway actor, and he can only do so much, and that life is a rough life, and you can only do so many shows, and at some point, you're coming off the road, you're trying to figure some of this thing out, and then what type of a thing? And this is a challenge for people that either have knowledge, information, experience that they want to share. We get caught into a one on one or, or consultative type of relationship is the only way to deliver it. And when you do that, you put an extreme cap and ceiling on what you can make, how you can make it, and the control of your time. And I think that our wealth needs to be measured in time and not dollars. But by creating products, like you're teaching, like, you're working with them, by creating products, you're actually taking the knowledge, the skills, the passion, the. All of that stuff, and you're able to, in effect, put it on the shelf and expand the reach, because now you're delivering it instead of once a night, you can deliver it a thousand times a night because they, they all buy it. Yeah, I think so. He, he's an actor. It's always been about what's the next job? Because you have a great job. Like, he's been in big movies, and then there's no work. I was listening, listening to a podcast with, is it Ben Affleck? It was on, like, the smart list podcast. And he was like, I'm unemployed. I'm like, if Ben Affleck thinks he's unemployed. You know, does he borrow money from JLo? I don't know. So I know his residuals are much higher. So, you know, the thing is, is that people want to feel of use, they want to feel of purpose. And I think being an actor is obviously hard. There's a lot of rejection. It's like in audition, audition, audition. No, no, no. Oh, my gosh. I got a role. And he's doing tv and film and stuff like that now, but he's been voice coaching a little because he knows I coach one on one. He knows I have the podcast. We have digital courses. And he's. And I'm like, you have no idea the ability and reach you could make if you go one on one or if we build a course for you. But my husband is probably leans more to being an employee mentality. Like, that just is how he is, and he needs someone to kind of push him forward. So I, like, woke up one day and I was like, I have this idea. And it was this idea for products. He teaches voice, and it was products to go with what he teaches of his voice teaching. And I was like, this might be easier for him to sell than selling himself. So we're coming out with products that are going to be around. He's like one of the best voices in the world. He, like, Deena Menzel and him have duets together. Like, we've done show. Like, he's been in a show with her. So we're going to do that. And then I want him to tack on the teaching piece to the back end of it. Here's the product. Here's how you use it. Here's how to get a better voice. Right? And so, and so he can still do the teaching. He might be able to create a course or something on the back end or like a membership of sorts of. He has the access to Adina Menzel and are really good friends. The guy who's starring in Hamilton on in Hamilton. Like, we know people. So it's like, who do you know? Who can you connect with to kind of be your initial influencer? And then also this idea of like, let's sell a product. And here's the kicker. We teach the multi stream machine lots of ways to sell wholesale, direct to consumer. You could ship Etsy, you could do in person. But for, again, like my husband, we teach Amazon and I was like, let's fulfill on Amazon. So then I know also he doesn't have to worry about getting an order and shipping it. We just need to get that Amazon machine working. He just needs to do the marketing and then the rest will happen for him. So, so that's kind of like the journey I'm on, a journey back to being a product boss, but I'm really excited about it. Like, it's something I keep thinking of because I'm like, this is a cool idea. And I think a lot of service based people are experts at something that, you know, that there might be a tool you can create or source. Um, people do it with workbooks and journals and stuff, but there might be something physical because there is a return to the physical as well. People also want to get something sent to them in the mail or, or the flip side, like oura rings. Do you know the oura rings? Yeah, but it's a membership. You buy the product and you pay monthly for the app. Right. So there's a lot of ideas also now around products that also have like that SaaS component to it or something that's like a reoccurring payment that they don't have to keep selling product, but they can sell the back end service of it. And it's really just kind of getting out of our own way to be able to think that way and say, well, what else can I do with this skill? Or is there another way to do it? I know. So this is a lot of my colleagues. When I belonged to the National Speakers association, they saw themselves as speakers and speakers only. But when 911 hit, no one was doing conferences. And so they were like the actors, they were, they were stuck. And, and I fought and fought to try and get them to look at it differently. And I said, you're a messenger and you're caught up in the vehicle. I said, but what other ways can you get your message out to the world? And I think that when you look at what your husband's doing and what you're helping people do is you're taking stuff that allows them to extend their reach by creating products that are ancillary or to supportive to their core skills. The things that they've developed, they got their 10,000 hours in and everything. So how do we if we trying to land this for them? And someone's sitting back saying, hey, this is interesting. And I know I need another income stream. I know I want to do something I have something, what are, like, the first one or two things that they need to start thinking about. And I know that we're gonna. We're gonna give you a access to a template or tool that's gonna help you, but I just want. I want to start to land the plane for them so they, they know, hey, what do I need to do. First to really, you know, a big part of it is first thinking about, like we talked about in the very beginning, the niche or a need. Where is there a gap in the market now? Some of the things I'm coming up with for my husband's thing, it's not. We're not reinventing anything. We're actually sourcing, and I'm just sourcing them in a different. In a different way. So I think, first off, think about your business and think, what does somebody need? What could be in addition to. To support my customers or my students? I will say a lot of people, if they're service based, they might come out with physical planners, workbooks. I feel like that's the very first thing that people do. What I'm not talking about here is, like, adding swag to your company. It's not like selling them a t shirt. That is a saying that you say, sure, you can do that, but that's not expansion of your knowledge. So it. It could be. I'm trying to think for an account, and I'm trying to, like, wrap my head around something for you, but, you know, it could be a workbook, right, that somebody works through for you. Yeah. Um, if it's an organization system, I know somebody that sort of helped with organizing actually have it, and it was file systems of organizing, like your home documents, your kids things, you know, things like that. So, depending on what you teach, there might be a product you're constantly buying, or you do your service, you're buying that you're buying from somebody else. Can you turn that into something that's just branded of yours? Can you improve upon something? So I think that's the first thing to think about, because people like systems. The home edit ladies have done this perfectly. Yeah. The home edit, their home organization, we all watched it during 2020. You know, they went to the container store and they bought a whole bunch of containers, and they use them, and then they branded their own containers. I have their egg holder. Nobody really needs an egg holder, but I have it, right? We have an egg holder. Clear acrylic, amazing home edit. Right? And so it was like, they took stuff that kind of existed, but then it was. It was the buying into their method, buying into their brand. So I think, think about that. Now. One of the biggest things Mina and I teach is not to go so broad. We're not talking about coming out with an entire collection here. Find a niche and maybe find a bestseller. Find a. A honed in product or a couple products that would help with what you're doing. So if my husband teaches voice, then we have three products coming out that are going to help them have a better voice. And that's it, right? Yeah. So I think that's what I would say to get started is like, start to brainstorm, get dreamy, and think about what that is. And then the second part of this is like, it would be sourcing. I think that we're going to give you all a worksheet of what to think about. So how to source. Are you going to make it or manufacture it is going to be something that's already made that you could just put your logo on, because it can be very simple. And I think then thinking, okay, do you want to be the one who fulfills it, or do you want a partner like Amazon or something like that to fulfill for you? And I think one of the keys when you're in this phase is the tendency for us is to filter it. As we're thinking about it. We're going, oh, that won't work. That won't work. And we're scrapping the idea before we ever give it a chance. And I think that the filtering, put the filtering aside, like you said, dream a bit about it and. And be more around, not how to do it, but you know that it's possible. And you can do the filtering later. You can then prioritize those top one or two ideas that you're going to truly focus on. But the tendency is that the ideas never even get out of our mind because we filter it in the mind and we just never. It's like you're in the car conversation with my husband. Because I get really dreamy. Like, if you imagine, like, a cone coming out of my head, like, it just keeps going wider and bigger and bigger because I have this idea, and he's like, but how, you know, how much is it going to be? And, like, he goes into such, like, minute details of things, and he starts talking about how long something's going to be. And I'm like, no, no, let's just think the big idea and see if it's possible. Then we can come back in. So that's the part for all of you. And I think being a. I am a true visionary. Without Meena, probably nothing would get done. So try and lean into the visionary side and just get dreamy. Your dreams are not going to cost you anything. And the most it's going to cost you is time of research and asking people if they'd be interested in it. Then if you're like, okay, there's something here, then you can choose to decide what's the next step? Do I take it and find samples? Like, what do I go next with. With it? So, um. But exactly, like, don't filter yourself. Like, I want you all to think, like, what if, like, put the question mark at the end, um, as you're thinking through. Yeah. Because it's just as. Just as easy to say, what if with a positive ending, then. Then it is. What if with a negative ending, I'm going to choose the positive ending and I'll deal with a negative ending if it comes. Yeah. And it was an idea. And, I mean, and then, you know, you'll have your cap. Like, I. When I started cuffs couture, I spent $20,000 like, I was 26 years old. That's a lot of money that I had saved from working. And I spent 20 grand. And then this is how I actually work against things. I say, okay, I'm going to make that $20,000 back. What am I going to do? I'm going on a trip to Europe, but I wanted to see if I could make that money this summer. Instead of just pulling from our savings, could I do it? And I was like, great. And I kind of put it out there. And whenever I put a number out there, I can actually attract it and. And get it back. It's a weird thing. So put a cap. I'm going to spend 20 grand on seeing if this is possible, and I'm going to figure out a way to make that 20 grand to fund it. You could do that with a couple clients. Fund it, test it, and just get dreamy. Yeah. There's just so many different ways. So. So don't squash the idea before it ever gets out of your head. Yeah, yeah. Um. God, I could we. I could talk with you for gosh days on this, because I love your attitude and the expansive thinking that you just kind of go. You kind of come at it, everything with this. It's all possible. It's all possible. And it's just. Okay, what's it going to take? Does it make sense? And that kind of thing. And I just love that because there's so much in society right now, that's stifling us, that's holding us back, that's telling us we can't. That, you know, and, and you don't look at the world that way, and it's, it's, it's. It's a cool contagion to have. Yeah, I think. I think that's the thing, right? Like, if people have always, I was thinking, like, people have always tried to say, well, that's not possible, or, um, that's not for you. Even the way I grew up, like, it was sort of like, well, women don't do that. Women stay home and they cook. Right? Like, it was like this weird thing, even, you know, when I was growing up, and it was like, no, like, I'm going to just dream big and make whatever happened happen. And I think there's, if I can pass that on to anyone, try to be around people that do think in that way or listen to podcasts that people think in that way. Because when we're around naysayers or people that don't dream as big as you, they're not entrepreneurs. You're an affluent entrepreneur because you thought differently than other cpas, and you, you know, like, like, you have to be able to think a little bit of more of, like, what's possible, and then don't. Don't listen to the people. They can't see it for themselves. But you've got the vision, so go with that. And I can imagine, especially in your husband, actually, both of you, the fields you went into, you know, the. The probabilities of success are not high. When you talk about the volume, the volume, people that go into acting or fashion and everything, and the tendency. I remember my mom even saying this to me about my son because he wanted to go into computers, and my mom, and she did it from a loving heart. But she says, is there a lot of people doing computers? And isn't it a lot of competition? But I always look at, I say, well, even if 5% make it, who's to say that we're not in the 5%? You know, that's the biggest difference between Mina and I, because, again, remember, her family is tied on refugees, like their first generation, very different. Her parents came to America and then went straight into, like, the meat factories in Iowa. And we had this conversation because we both came from that. But I said, well, when you were younger, like, wasn't anything possible, like, you could be president when you grew up? Like, that was, you know, like the ask, what do you want to be? And they're like, a president or an astronaut. And she's like, no, absolutely not. And so for me, I'm like, oh, I didn't realize that simple sort of allowing me to dream anything and not saying it's not possible was such a part of my mindset of possibility, versus she was like, no, no, I was never going to be president, you know, so. Or have the potential. So I think. I think it is interesting. And, yeah, with my husband, too, his parents were all on board for, like, him pursuing greatness, and he is, like, one of the biggest Broadway actors out there. And, like, it's hard because people come to us and they want us to tell him, like, oh, should my kid go into ballet or pursue this? And we're always kind of like, we believe in education, but if your heart is set on it, don't kill the thing your heart is set on, try it. And you can always pivot. It's not the end. Yeah, I'm with you 100%. I believe in education partly more for the fact that I like my son. You have to mature a little. They do. He was a year out. Now, he started his business at 16. So all of a sudden, he started his business at 16, and he's in his. Going into his final year of college. Sends me a text. I'm out speaking, and I get this text from saying, dad, you know, I know I'm supposed to go back to college, but I don't think this college thing's gonna do me any good. So I'm thinking of not going back. I'm, like, going, first off, I'm out of town. You don't send us in a text. Okay. So I just said it was like, we'll talk when I get home. And so he ended up finishing his last year because I said, you can make all the adult decisions you want, but. But you don't adult halfway. You adult full fledged. So that means that if you decide to not go to college, then you take on all your bills, you take on all the responsibility of being out there. And he did the math and says, you know, another year, college ain't so bad. But the reason I wanted him to finish was not for the education because. But it was for him to finish something big, start something big, commit to it, and finish something big, and then go through that socialization experience, which a lot of people missed in the pandemic. But. But I think that there's. There's some things out there that you get a chance to expand. Oh, I remember people didn't know how to do their own laundry. Do you know what I'm saying? So it's like, it's, um. And there was no YouTube at that point, so. Yeah, I mean, I. I agree. And it is that thing of, like, and of course, it's not for everyone. And we're in digital education and there's so many opportunities, like, I teach people every day that don't have a college degree, how to make millions of dollars selling products. But there's an element of education and fast tracking your success. And like you said, finishing something big, finishing something that feels uncomfortable. Yeah. And I'll say something before we close out about this whole idea. College, your college process, I believe, is a degree process. This is to get a degree. Your education is lifelong. So if you think that when you graduate, you get the degree, whether it's a master's, PhD, bachelor's, whatever, you're done. You're mistaken. And your education is just starting. And I'm constantly learning. I'm constantly. You're doing the same thing. And it's that desire to grow and learn and be more. Not that we're not satisfied, but to just. Because I know that if I learn better communication, I'm better in my marriage, if I learn all of that, I just want to live a better life. And the only way to do it is to start getting educated. So I take all kinds of courses, I read all kinds of books. So y'all out there, you ain't done until you're done. I mean, like, done done? Like 6ft underdone. You're. You're always doing it. And even then you're researching where you're going to be. 6ft under. No, there you go. I agree. I think as long as you still have this veracity, like, this veracity of, like, we're voracious learners and we want to know what's happening and things are changing so fast and staying up on that and then pivoting as needed. But you'll know that if you're learning, like, you'll know how to pivot because you'll be getting that input. So good. So good. So tell us you, you're putting together something that's special just for. Just for us. So tell us a little bit about that. Tell us how they can find out more about you and what you do and everything. I just. I want them to be around your kind of thinking. So y'all listen up and make sure that you follow what, what she's doing because it'll only help. And you know what? She's good energy anyways, even if you don't go down that route. Well, we right now are at the product boss. So anywhere you listen to podcasts, come over, follow our show, the product boss. It's Mina and I always talking product based business mindset, blending, sort of. We don't talk about balance, we talk about blending. We're both parents of younger kids and have the things like school age kids. So the podcast, now, the thing I'm going to put all together for you all is what if you want to start a product based business, you have an expertise and you want to start a product based business. Some things to think about so you can head to the product boss.com tae. Theproduct boss.com tae and we'll do that. And if you heard this and you want to connect with me, send us a DM over on Instagram. Just say you heard me on Mel's show and I'd love to connect with you there as well. Wow. So good. So good. We'll make sure that we hook everything up in the show notes. Y'all should be following them. You all should be in their sphere. You should be listening to their show. It's good stuff and it's pointing you in the right direction if you're looking to try and look for other opportunities, because being in the sphere, ideas will come. Just be in that sphere and let the ideas come. Get in this, get in this game. Because the one way, because a lot of people are asking, well, there's a rest session coming and does it matter to you? I said it matters to me, but it doesn't matter to me because I know that I've done it right. So you all do it right. Control your earnings, control your assets, control your destiny. That's what it's all about. And what Jacqueline and Mina are teaching and what they're doing is helping people do exactly that, too. So thank you so much for taking the time and coming on the show and us having the conversation. First time we really had a chance to chat. And we've got similar backgrounds. Similar. I'm first generation american, too, so we're. Both in Southern California, so yeah, we. Ought to get together. Yeah. Thank you for having me on the show. This was so, so amazing. And thanks for listening. Thank you for listening to the affluent entrepreneur with me, your host, Mel Abraham. If you want to achieve financial liberation to create an affluent lifestyle, join me in the affluent entrepreneur Facebook group now by going to melabraham.com group, and I'll see you there.