The Conscious Salon
Welcome to The Conscious Salon.
Here for the real talk salon owners actually need.
The Conscious Salon Podcast is where salon owners get clear guidance without the fluff. Hosted by Nic & Tess, we break down leadership, team culture, money, client journey, systems and numbers into simple moves you can use this week. Expect straight talk, real stories, lots of laughs and practical frameworks that help you lead well, grow profit, and have a life outside the salon.
You will hear from salon owners, industry leaders and working mums who have done the hard yards. We cover mindset that holds under pressure, meetings that improve your team culture, and the habits that build a self led team.
Follow the show and start with leadership posture, client journey design, and money mindset.
Listen in, implement, and stay conscious.
The Conscious Salon
We put our Salon Manager in the hot seat
Freedom sounds amazing, until it bumps into your need to control every detail. In this episode, we sit down with Tae, our salon manager, to unpack how control quietly creeps into salon leadership, and what truly shifts when you replace micromanagement with trust.
This isn’t theory, it’s lived experience. We get real about giving someone a title without real power, double-checking that crushed initiative, and the moment we realised our “supportive” words were actually restricting action. Tae shares how that dynamic led to burnout, why stepping away became necessary, and how it ultimately helped all of us rebuild leadership from the ground up.
We talk systems and mindset: the foundations that now keep our business steady without a founder’s hand on every lever. You’ll hear how we made “bring a solution with your problem” a daily practice, defined what true ownership looks like for team leaders, and shifted client loyalty from one stylist to an entire brand experience. The result: smoother operations, stronger culture, and profits that reflect teamwork, not heroics.
If you’re a salon owner craving more time and trust, a team leader stuck between responsibility and permission, or someone ready to step up, this episode is your permission slip.
Ask better questions. Share power. Drop the control habits that keep your team small.
👉 Hit subscribe, share this with another salon owner who’s learning to loosen the reins, and tell us in the comments: what’s one control habit you’re ready to release?
To follow our journey:
Instagram @aheadhair_
@the_conscious_salon
This episode of the Conscious Helen Podcast is brought to you by Revlon Professional Australia. Welcome back to the Conscious Helen Podcast. We are doing a little bit of a rogue episode and we've got our co-pilot Tay Tay here. Hello. Anyone who we've always got you here. We've got you. We don't but I didn't announce myself. We like from Nikki. It's Nikki and Tess. The same people that you trust to be on this episode every single week. That's right. Tay Tay, Tay, for those people who don't know who you are. Can you give us a little intro?
SPEAKER_00:Oh, oh. Um I write you an intro.
SPEAKER_02:Wait, you do yours and I'll add to it.
SPEAKER_00:Okay. Um, so I work with Nick and Tess at ahead. I manage their salon um in Bentley. And I also work with their with Conscience, which is so exciting. Um, we are a little tripod, and I'm just so grateful to have all the opportunities that I do. And I just yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Tay Tay is massively underselling herself in the conservative. Tay has been with us for a decade. Yeah, let's just go with that. We're actually 20 years together. But we've had uh we can't work out exactly how long, but many happy years together.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:So Tay originally came to us um way back in the day. You were actually our second team member that we'd ever had. Or third, actually. No, second. No, third, because then we got rid of one not long after.
SPEAKER_01:No, Tay was Tay was our second.
SPEAKER_02:Were you the oh anyway, either way? Yeah, which was such an incredible thing. But yeah, you were literally a little baby when you started. And Taya has truly been such a driving force of us being able to do and operate and show up the way that we do is through I truly think we have learned so much from you and like gotten so much more conscious as like humans, as leaders, as like visionaries, because of the way that you've like truly shown and taught us so much. I actually remember I think you were like still an apprentice and quite early into your um apprenticeship. And I was like, your manager.
SPEAKER_01:I remember you calling it really early. I did. Yeah, I can see that.
SPEAKER_02:I was like, yeah, yeah, manager, she's she's the she's the leader. And you have you've um, and then we've had um you also step into the conscious salon as well. So Taya is not only leading our team and truly like a visionary with it, like as much as you say you run the salon for us, you run the salon. That's your team. That's 100% your team, your work. That salon has really become your space. And now getting you in for the past year in conscious, where you have been supporting our group container with their teams, with motivating our one-on-one clients and their teams, with adding in your perspective, with um facilitating with us with breath, with um retreats, with all of the goodness with being here today, you know, with the podcast. She really is just we are able to work the way that we do because of you. So that's what she really is to us. She's our wingwoman. So we're very, very grateful.
SPEAKER_03:Thank you.
SPEAKER_01:But Taito, we wanted to get you on the potty to talk about something that's been on our mind a lot recently, and we're really noticing a trend in the industry, and it's about control and salon owners wanting to control everything.
SPEAKER_03:Yes.
SPEAKER_01:And when we were talking about this yesterday, you gave a really interesting perspective. Do you want to share what happened yesterday?
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, so we were talking about the episode and we're talking about control and how it's been playing out in a lot of salons. And I just thought it's very interesting because a lot of people see you guys and see how you live your lives and you have the freedom and the flexibility and be able to expand and grow and do all of these adventures, but they're not seeing how you've changed and adapted your leadership or um how you have just trusted in me and the girls so much to be able to allow that growth. Because if you were still as um hands-on in the business, like you're obviously still in the business, but still doing all the back-end things and all of those things, how you expected to grow or have the time to be able to do this, you know, next chapter of your lives. So I think it's really interesting that business owners want this, but they don't want to let go of that. 100%.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:And that's what we were talking about yesterday.
SPEAKER_01:It's like it comes up everywhere. It can be micro things like, you know, being the first person that you talk about on your website, and then there's like a big photo of the sell on founder. It can be minor things like um really leaning into when a when a client says, like, you're the only one who knows my hair, and really playing with that and not actually boosting your team when you have the opportunity to. It can be the, you know, that person only wants to see me.
SPEAKER_02:That's like such a- It can literally be like, no one can make the teas as well as what I do. Like the way that I make a cup of tea is more special than anyone else.
SPEAKER_01:But I'm trying to speak to those cell owners who may not necessarily recognize it and be like, oh no, I'm not controlling. And they want the freedom and flexibility, but they want to, oh, that client only wants to see me. Yes. You know, I'm the best person to teach my team. I'm the one that's going to all the courses, right? And then I'll come back and teach my team because I'm too scared to make a financial investment in them in case they leave. So we started to really unpack this, and then we were talking about how we see it play out in the industry. And then Tay did share with us, like, you know, how you guys were once upon a time versus how you are now. Yeah. And we said, that's what we need to talk about. So Tay, I want you to be as candid as possible. I don't want you to hold back and I don't want you to try and spit out a polished version. I don't want you to try and spit out a polished version. Yes. I want you to talk about the really challenging times of how we used to lead.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah.
SPEAKER_01:And then we'll go into the how we lead now.
SPEAKER_00:Definitely. I think, especially because I was so young and so new to it, um, I had no idea what I was doing. So I was like, this felt like this felt right. And I think for the time it was definitely the right thing, and I needed, you know, a bit more support. But there was definitely times where, you know, you're like, oh, I'm gonna get you to do the ordering. But when you do the ordering, I want you to send it through to me so then I can double check. And I think there were so many things where I had this response, it almost felt like here's this ownership of something, but then also I'm gonna take it a little bit, yeah. Or like I trust you, but I only trust you this much. Um, so I think, especially being so young and trying to grow my own confidence and self-trust and everything, I think it was like two steps forward, three steps back, sort of thing. And I noticed that when I was in that time, I would almost be trying to think of what you guys would be doing, but not think about what it was intuitive to myself.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_00:Um, I'd be like, oh, I think I should do this. But I'm like, oh, but would Nikki do that or would Tess do this differently instead of just going, no, this feels right to me, which is where I'm at now with where our relationship is and how much you know you guys have helped me grow and how much I have grown personally. Um, but yeah, it was just like the little things that you guys weren't ever controlling. Like you weren't, you definitely gave me a lot of room. But I think in the way that we were, I think, especially because I was the first manager in your salon, we were developing the role together. It was always changing, it was always um flowing and moving. It was kind of sometimes it was like, well, where do I kind of fit in? Yeah. Does that make sense?
SPEAKER_01:I was so disempowering is the word that I like think about. It's like giving you that, it was so boundaried, like now that I think about it, giving you that responsibility, but with the boundaries. Here's the the square that we want you to sit in. Not teaching you to listen to your intuition and and trust yourself. And really it was disempowering of like when you said the ordering thing, I was like, oh my god, I remember doing that. Just send it through to me so I can proof it beforehand.
SPEAKER_02:Like, fucking Nikki, do you build order yourself, Charl. Realistically, what we were doing then is being like, do an order, then like pretty much just write it out, and then we'll do the rest, and then we'll do it, and then we'll auto-generated anyway. So we'll just sit the button and send it the reading. Well done. That's definitely good. I think when I think back to those days, from my perspective in terms of leadership, I feel like I was like, Yep, like I'm gonna give you a title and you're gonna do amazing, but I'm also gonna like be right next to you and watching, and like anything that you know you say that I don't agree with, I'm gonna like that. Was the part that I saw where I was like, let's do it like this though instead. And you'd be like, Yeah, okay. And I'd be like, Yes, good job. It was like so you didn't have any of that. I like it was truly that like I know that we were micromanaging you and we were trying to like show that we were giving control, but we actually gave nothing. It was like, yep, you've got like I truly felt like we gave you a title and a space where we'd have meetings, but it would be like, I've got this idea. No.
SPEAKER_00:I don't even think we had regular meetings. We did not have meetings. No, it was it's really interesting because when this came up yesterday, um, and you're like, you know, we want to talk about how it used to be. I think like obviously with how we are now, I was like, oh god, like what was it like? I couldn't even remember. But it's interesting because you guys are always so supportive, you always really built me up. And it was like, it wasn't like this whole negative experience. And I think this is what people think about when they think about micromanaging and like not giving, not empowering your team. It's not that you're just beating them down the whole time and they're having a terrible time, but it's also not giving them the opportunity to grow as a person and into their role fully. Yeah. Yeah, wow, that's huge.
SPEAKER_01:I think a lot of salon owners will be listening to this, or even team leaders will be listening to this, being like, oh, yeah, that's the situation I'm in. Yeah. So how did it feel for you, Tay, to have that sort of set up for like at the time? How did it actually feel for you?
SPEAKER_00:For myself, I think it was really good to have a lot of support because I definitely did like we were tripod, we worked with everything together. But then I also feel like I was almost a little bit lost into like doing things, but then also being like, oh, I've got to like double check with this, or should I should I just sometimes things would happen when you guys went in and I'm like, should I just take control or should I message? Or I don't want to over. Yeah, I don't want to be like they're not in here. I don't want them to feel like they're have to be in here, but then I also don't want to make the wrong decision and then go from there. Um, but yeah, it was um but also like on the flip side, like I we talk about it all the time, and I'm like, I didn't feel like it was a bad experience at all.
SPEAKER_02:Like, okay, what do you want for lunch? We're gonna do a big order.
SPEAKER_01:I really appreciate that we've had the time to heal this in terms of working together again. Yeah. Because when you left and moved to Queensland, so much of me was like, especially when we redeveloped, like we we um started made the course The Conscious Leader and we rewrote everything and got so much more um in intentional, I guess, about the role. And I really had a realization when you're in Queensland of like fuck, we did this girl dirty. Like we we did the best we could with what we had at the time, of course, but we could have done it so much better. And I'm so grateful that we've had the opportunity to heal that because when you came back to Melbourne and we said, Do you want to go back into leadership? We had an opening for leadership. Yeah, you actually initially said no.
SPEAKER_00:Yeah, I did. Why did um I think personally myself moving, I had gone through a lot in that three years. I think I lived in about eight houses and moved states and lived in a van and all the things. So I think at the very time when I first moved back, I was like, I'm not mentally ready to be looking after anyone else but myself. Um I really need to just, you know, get back in tune with myself, really work out where I want to be, what I want to be doing, and you know, find my passion for hair and being in an environment like that again. Um, but also I was just like, what will this look like? How will I? I think because I wasn't in a great place mentally, I was like, how can I then support you guys and also support a team and you know, then be there for everyone else.
SPEAKER_02:I'm so glad that you touched on that because I feel like it would be fair to say like you're fully in burnout. Oh, for sure.
SPEAKER_03:Absolutely.
SPEAKER_02:I remember us having the first like couple of months, it was just like, don't worry about anything. We're just gonna like keep rebuilding. We're just like honestly, because you'd be like, Oh, I need to do this and this and this, and like you'd be it's like, yeah, we're not fixing anything. We're just gonna like you, your body needs to catch up with like what because you have you'd had a massive couple of years traveling around, you know, you then you were touched just had a flash of you working in the the food delivery business. One day Taylor is doing a I think we were on um FaceTime or something, and you had your phone set up, and it was the you had to give like six weeks or something that was letting them know like they were like tail sandwiches with the party parts downstairs. You did such a like massive, like, which is amazing for growth, but then having that like you really did like we're even you needed that time to like heal and and let your body catch up with your oh sorry, your brain catch up with your body. But I remember saying to you, like, we're gonna be looking for a new team leader. Like, do you want to do it? You were like, No.
SPEAKER_00:I think I said I was like, if you guys really want me to, I will.
SPEAKER_02:Super inspiring. You'd be like, Yes.
SPEAKER_01:But I then, but it was a really great invitation to look at like okay, why was that like obviously you there's so many factors in this, but it was a really good invitation for Tess and I to look at, like, and we really said to you, this role is gonna look so different this time.
SPEAKER_00:Absolutely, yeah. And even just coming back as a team member, and I think that was a really good transition for me coming back being a team member and seeing how the things were changing and like what it would really be, yeah. Um, and like where I would take ownership, where we would work together, where um, you know, I really fit into it. Yeah. Um, so I think and seeing all the structure and things that had changed and how seamlessly things had already flat gone through and having the time, I was like, okay, I think I can do this.
SPEAKER_02:We'd learned our lesson. We'd lost her once. We're gonna do that again. But I think even with that, like you are such a natural-born leader. So even though you were, I even was watching it in the salon with how much it would like shift out, like even with you coming back and not being in that role and like declaring like I'm not. There was still the team that was like, Taya, what should we do? What should we like? And you were really stopping yourself, being like, oh no, you know, someone else. You know my brother. But with that, and I also want to talk really candidly, which I know we have before, but like when Taya left, we had differing um responses. So Taya let us know. I reckon it was like, what did you say, like eight months? I think it's like eight advanced notice. Eight months notice.
SPEAKER_01:But I was like, this feels like not enough time.
SPEAKER_02:And we had really different responses, you know. Nikki was like very emotional and was like, oh wow. I think actually she said to Taylor, like, I just need a second, which was I also think was the right thing. So took a moment.
SPEAKER_01:She came in. How did you feel hearing that?
SPEAKER_00:Um, I was actually on the tram on the way into a course. Um, and I think at the time I was definitely like, I think I was just a bit shocked, but it was also, I I think I didn't deliver it very well either. But I was so anxious, like so, so anxious, because I just I didn't want to let you guys down. And I was just like, it's not, I didn't want you to think it was you. Um and I think I was just in my own head about it all. And then it happened, and then I remember leaving your house and I walked down the stairs and I called Josh in the car. He's like, How was it? And I was like, it was good. I don't know what I feel. It was like, it was all the emotions, but it was like, it was like a breakup.
SPEAKER_02:It was well, it was funny because Nikki was bothered receiving the breakup, but it was like, you know, leaving. And Nikki was like, Are you understanding? I was like, Yeah, she said eight months. I was like, I'll change your mind. But it did, but then when you did actually go, I that day I was like so shocked. And like I truly think like in mourning, like I remember Taya's last day. I like couldn't speak. Clients were like, I don't know why I was on the floor. I should not have been working physically on the floor.
SPEAKER_01:Because I had a public home.
SPEAKER_02:But it was like, I like literally Taylor Taylor Taylor, Taya was peeling me away from her as like to get out the door because I was like, oh God, it was a real moment. Very dramatic. But we learned so much, and I think that was where we could actually take that time and reflect of like, cool, what do we need to change? How do we need to and it was never with the intention of getting Tay back, it did, you know, naturally happen the way that it should have. But with that, it was never about that, it was just recognizing, wow, we did not set this girl up for success. Yeah. Which is why it didn't work. And I think what we had is really and losing ego and actually sitting in that self-audit of like, cool, if if it was all perfect, I mean, I get travel and I get all of these things, but there also would have been part of you that have been like, yep, I don't want to do this anymore because we had not set you up for success. Like it was not it was not a fulfilling role. Whereas now with how we've pivoted and you know, we we have that transparency and that trust and that um and I also I want to acknowledge that it is because we have like a true sistership and you know, deep, you know, we're best mates as well. But we can switch flip between those roles and have them being effective and productive. Because even from when you know I've been team leader versus you, I cannot do what you do because of the way that and acknowledging that and recognizing and celebrating that, I feel like there are so many owners who think that they are the ones that can do everything perfectly. They're the most talented, they have the best client connections, they have um, you know, their best way of looking at everything. And I'm here to humble you guys because I thought that and I was wrong. And the reality of this is our salon is more effective, like profitability-wise, um, like productivity-wise, like with how the girls are motivated, inspired, like the alignment, the culture, because we have someone in there who embodies that better than what we do. And it goes down to like truly now with it, I look at ahead and I'm like, I own it and I get to support the team, but the talent, the culture, everything else is a credit to you and the team because that's what you guys create in there. And it's trusting that and creating that foundation between us where truly letting you step into it rather than you know. I honestly feel like when I think of it back, it's like, you know, if you were gonna go and move something, I'd be like, and that's yeah, it's you summed it up with the ordering thing.
SPEAKER_01:I'm like, oh my god, I'm such a douche. Um, Tay, I wanna, before we wrap, I wanna end on some fire things, like some like fast action steps. So we're gonna give two fast action steps that a salon owner could take who's listening to this, going, oh fuck, that's me, and I really want to change. And I want you to give two fast action steps to a team member who's in that position of being micromanaged, but they've just like had the realization that that's them. Yeah. All right, cool. Tess, you do one and I'll do one. I'm gonna say one of the most powerful things that I changed about my leadership when we were putting you into this position and to swap the micromanaging. When you came in to me with a problem and we teach our whole team to do this, we always train our team to be solutions focused. So if they come in with a problem, they also have to be coming to us with at least one solution that they see fit. So it trains our girls to come up to us and say, Hey, I'm just letting you know that we have this bottleneck. However, the way that I best see fit for this is X, Y, Z. And they all of them do it and they're still refining it and still getting better at it. But we really encourage them to do that. So the best tip that I could say is sit down with your team leader and actually have a conversation around, I am going to be asking you to come in with any problems, you're gonna be coming up with a solution as well. And when you come to me with a problem, I'm going to ask you, what do you think you should do? And that's something that we say every single day.
SPEAKER_02:Always.
SPEAKER_01:I love that.
SPEAKER_02:Um, I think what really changed for me was not just saying what I thought and like how I thought things were gonna be, like actually sitting with my team leader and having a conversation around what you thought. Because what I realized in this was that what I was seeing and the experience that I was having with team is very different to what was happening day to day and the reality of it. And I always go back to that thing of we've got two ears and one mouse, so we should be doing twice as much listening as we are talking. Sit with your team and work out, your team leader, sorry, and work out what it is that they see is gonna be the best way to move this forward. I think that's a both a really important one.
SPEAKER_00:Okay. I feel like for team leaders, I feel like the major thing that I hear, especially working with a lot of the girls in um our container, is getting really clear on what their expectation is on both sides. So having ownership over your role and really set like getting um clarity around what's your responsibility, what's you know your boss's responsibility, and you know how much you guys want to collaborate on things or how much is ownership of you and how much you can run with things. Because I think once you do that, you have so much more confidence in doing an order or you know, having a conversation with a team member or that sort of thing. Because I think sometimes things will come up and you're like, oh, should I should I talk to them first? Should I, should I not? So I think getting really clear on what the boundary.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, yeah, yeah, absolutely. I love that. That's such a good one.
SPEAKER_00:I love that, guys.
SPEAKER_01:This is huge. I think this is going to be really pivotal. And if you're feeling, you know, something come up right now, if you feel a bit triggered or if you're feeling like, oh shit, this is me. Know that once you acknowledge something, you can make those changes and to really empower your team leader to be that person who can own the team. Like Tay says, my team, yeah, my salon. Like she really does take that ownership of it and it's incredible, and that's available to you guys, but we have to be willing to loosen the reins and be willing to really shine the light on our team.
SPEAKER_02:So Tay, can I just ask one more really quick one? Because I know we said two. What about for a team member who wants to become a team leader who may not already be in that role? What would you what would be one piece of advice that you give them to put themselves forward?
SPEAKER_00:I think shoot your shot. Shoot your shot. Like have the conversation with your, like with your boss and say, this is something I want to get into. If I'm not ready now, what can I do to prepare for me to get into this role? Where do you see where I'm at now? Where do I need to grow? Where do I need to improve? What do I need to do to be able to get this? Because if you're hungry enough, then you'll go and do what you need to. And I think sometimes you might not be ready in the moment, but it may just be small tweaks to be able to get to that part. Yeah, it plants a seed. Absolutely. I love that.
SPEAKER_02:Thank you. Great.
SPEAKER_01:Thank you guys. Thank you, Tay Tay, for sharing your beautiful brain. Thank you guys for listening to another episode of the Conscious Alan podcast. Love you guys. Stay conscious.
