The Sugar Daddy Podcast
Ready to normalize talking about money? Then welcome to The Sugar Daddy Podcast. Every episode will get you one step closer to your financial goals. Whether that is learning how to invest, budget, save, retire early or simply make better money choices, Jess & Brandon have got you covered in a way that's easy to understand, and easy to implement. Tune in as they demystify the realm of dollars, so it all makes cents, while giving you a glimpse into their relationship with money and each other.
Brandon is an award winning licensed financial planner, and owner of Oak City Financial, with over a decade of experience and millions of dollars managed for his clients all over the United States.
New episodes published the first three Wednesdays of every month.
The Sugar Daddy Podcast
93: Writing Our Own Rules: Details of our Post-Nuptial Agreement
Most couples unknowingly agree to their state’s version of a prenup when they sign a marriage license. But what if you could rewrite the rules to actually reflect your values?
In this episode, Jess & Brandon share why they created a post-nuptial agreement after nine years of marriage—not as a plan for divorce, but as a blueprint for how they handle money, co-parenting, and conflict with intention.
They walk through how they worked with attorney Aaron Thomas to build a post-nup that protects their family, outlines their financial responsibilities, and brings them closer—not further apart.
This is the conversation every couple should have—but most don’t. Listen in and find out how designing your own rules can bring more clarity, connection, and peace of mind to your marriage, and why protecting your assets “just in case” can help you feel more confident than ever in your relationship.
Visit prenups.com/sugardaddy to learn more about fair prenups that help couples plan for a healthy financial relationship.
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Notes from the show:
Episode 78: Why We Decided on a Post-Nuptial Agreement
Episode 28: Love, Money and Law: A Deep Dive into Prenuptial Agreements with Aaron Thomas
Aaron Thomas, Founder of Prenups.com
This episode is sponsored by Prenupscom. The truth is, every married couple has a prenup a set of rules that defines your legal and financial relationship with your spouse. You either choose your own rules or use what your state gives you. At Prenupscom, they write prenups that actually help couples stay married. Their specialty is fair prenups that help couples plan for a healthy financial relationship. Don't let the state decide your marriage rules. Make your own. Visit prenupscom. Slash sugardaddy to learn more. That's prenupscom. Backslash sugardaddy and get the prenup that helps you stay married. Already married? No worries, they do post-nuptial agreements too. That's what Brandon and I did after eight years of marriage. In today's episode, brandon and I will be discussing what we put into our postnuptial agreement. We will have been married for almost nine years this year and we decided on a postnup for our financial portfolio. It made sense after talking to Aaron Thomas, our family law attorney and the founder of Prenupscom, and so, if this is of interest, we hope you'll stay tuned.
Speaker 2:Hey babe, what are we talking about today?
Speaker 1:Today we are talking about what we put in our prenup.
Speaker 2:Yes, yes, oh no, our postnup. Oh sorry, okay, let's start I'll say we've been married for almost nine years now, so it was kind of a little bit late for a prenup.
Speaker 1:Yes, well, you know the prenup. Apparently we don't know the difference, but apparently is maybe an easier process since you haven't already combined assets. But for us, the process of getting the post-snap was actually extremely easy. It took less than 60 days. We actually the whole family had the flu during the process, but I think had we not had the plague, we could have easily knocked it all out within a month. So it was painless. What did you think?
Speaker 2:No, I definitely thought it was painless and it also helps that Aaron Thomas' process is very thorough and he's very consultative in regards to how he goes about the process, because obviously a lot of us don't know what a post-nup or a pre or prenup should entail. So they walk you through their process and there was a lot of things that, like we didn't even think would be talked about during the postnup.
Speaker 1:We very quickly realized that it's really just about creating your own rules, right, and so every state that you get married in has a prenup already in place. So when you sign that marriage license, you are signing a prenup, and I guarantee you you didn't read what it said, because I know we did not read what it said.
Speaker 2:No, no idea what North Carolina's is.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and I'm pretty sure that the rules that we have now come up with in this post-nuptial agreement process are much more in line with what we actually value, what's important to us, than what the state of North Carolina in our instance, whatever that document says that we signed many, many years ago. So for us it was really more about understanding the importance, kind of we're designating it as insurance for our love, right, we hope to never actually need it, but now we feel better having it in place and, honestly, part of it was we wanted to help educate our audience about what the prenup and post-nup process is like, what kind of things you can include, what we included. It's all about honest and open conversation for us, and so we wanted to give you some insights into what is actually in our postnup and why we decided on those things.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and if you're a new listener, you haven't listened to other previous episodes that we have. We had Aaron Thomas on a while back and that completely opened our eyes and changed our viewpoints when it comes to post-nups and pre-nups.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so it's kind of a progression. You can listen to the full episode with Aaron that we did a few years ago. We'll make sure to link it in the show notes. Then we did a kind of a hey, we're in the middle of the process, here's what's come up for us, and now that we have a, you know, signed, sealed and delivered document, so to speak, we wanted to do a follow up to let you know you know high level what is in our post map and why it was important, and some things that we learned along the way that we think would be important for others to know about as well.
Speaker 2:And I definitely want to emphasize that. You know, if you're listening to this episode and you're thinking like, hey, I don't have a lot of assets, me and my wife or husband or whatever partner are not going to break up, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah all the head trash that we had before I highly encourage you to listen to that episode with Aaron Thomas because, like Jeff said earlier, you know you already have a prenup for each state that you live in. There's one already written, so his biggest take was why not write your own? Also, through the process of creating a post-nup or a prenup, you talk about a lot of the financial stuff that a lot of people don't talk about before they get married or even during their marriage. So it really helps you to actually iron out and have these conversations around money that you should be having, or you should have had, prior to getting married, and it gets you on the same page as far as how you want to actually navigate your finances. Now, obviously, it's a little bit different for Jeff's, not because we have these conversations all the time, but it definitely brought some things to light that we hadn't actually thought about.
Speaker 2:All right, real quick, I want to speak to the person listening who feels like they can't work with a financial planner yet because they're carrying a lot of debt. First of all, I see you and I need you to know you're not broken, you're not behind, you're just in a tough season. I created something just for you because I've had people reach out who are serious about changing their money story. But the full financial planning package just wasn't the right fit yet. So I built a new service through Oak City Financial that's focused completely on debt reduction. No fluff, no shame. You'll get a one-time planning session, a personalized payoff strategy, your own financial dashboard and monthly coaching. If you want extra support while you climb out, it's $300 to get started and $100 a month if you want that ongoing guidance, that's it. This is about helping you get unstuck, not making you feel like you failed. If this sounds like what you've been needing, go ahead and schedule a call with me. The link is in the show notes. Let's take the first step together.
Speaker 1:Well, and one thing that I think that was really important and eye-opening for us that we talked to Aaron about is, let's say, we would have done this in our 20s, right? Or if you're first getting married and it is a prenup, but maybe you're a young professional, you don't have a bustling 401k, whatever that is. It's not necessarily about what you have right now. It's about what you are building in the process of your marriage, and so if you're thinking about your career progression, what you're able to contribute to your retirement accounts and the money that you're making over time, that's where the significance comes in, because you're building and growing your wealth individually and together, and so you want to protect those assets yeah, definitely.
Speaker 1:So you start the process by detailing your assets and your liabilities as an individual. So I basically wrote down everything that I own, so all of my accounts, my retirement accounts, my savings, my checking, my debts, etc. Brandon did the same and then, basically, a net worth statement is created from that. So that is just the baseline of, as of this date, what do you have in these accounts and are these accounts yours? So that was very simple. This is something that we were able to put together pretty quickly Again. These are conversations that we have all the time, numbers that we are aware of and look at all the time, and so for us nothing came up that we weren't already aware of in either category when it comes to assets or debts. But this is something you might want to consider as you go into the process that you will be disclosing what you have, so you know if you haven't been very honest, if you've got some secret accounts.
Speaker 1:This is the time to have that conversation, before you put it on paper, because it is going to come out.
Speaker 2:In all honesty, if you have secret accounts at this point in time and like you're getting ready to get married or you're already married, I would say that there's some other issues that probably also need to be addressed as well.
Speaker 1:Yes, absolutely. We've always been on the record to say we believe in having separate accounts, not secret accounts, and that's something else that we talked to Aaron about is how do we want to structure the money in our home, and that, I think, is a really interesting conversation, regardless of if you're a new couple, you know, or you're planning your life and your you know your marriage together, or you're established, because we go through different phases of how money comes into the home, right. So I work a corporate job, so I have a steady income. You know, I have my 401k, my match, health insurance, etc.
Speaker 1:Brandon is a business owner, so he puts a lot of the money that he earns back into his business. I would say that, no, two months are the same. You know, sometimes he's onboarding multiple clients, sometimes there might be a lull, and so for us it works well that I have a consistent income and he has a flexible income. So those are things that we wanted to also kind of point out, because money flows differently, and so we decided to go with the what is it? The inside out right, where you put everything into one pot and then you take out what you need for your own individual kind of spending.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's what it was.
Speaker 1:Okay, I know Sometimes I twist it up in my mind, but inside out you dump it all into one pot and then you pay your communal living bills from that, your groceries, your home expenses, etc. And then you separate out whatever you, if you decide on this, what you want for your individual spending money. That then goes into your own account.
Speaker 2:Yeah, so basically the structure of that is is that we have a joint checking account together and the money that we're, you know, making, you're getting paid on a you know, whenever you get your paycheck, it goes into the joint account and then that's divvied up in regards to how the bills are going to be paid there and whatnot, and then you separate out, like any additional spending money that you want to have for yourself.
Speaker 2:So let's just say hypothetically you know bills come to $5,000 for the for the month, our money goes in there. But if we put in, say, $8,000, then maybe Jess takes out an additional $2,000 for her spending and everything like that and I take out an additional $1,000 on my end.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so you can do this. We talked about doing it based on a percentage. We talked about it based on just equal amounts. I am the higher earner, and so we also talked about me getting more spending money for myself in my personal account than Brandon. So those are those conversations that you want to start thinking about. Right? Does it make sense to split things 50-50 if one partner is earning significantly more than another? Right? I feel like you see things like that on different social media posts all the time, like, why are we splitting all the bills down the middle when my partner makes four times as much as me? So, again, we're not here to tell you what your rules should be, but these are the things that you can start thinking about as you potentially prepare for a pre or a postnup, because it's going to be an important part of the conversation how do you want your money to work in your household?
Speaker 2:Also too, is doing a deeper dive into some of the quote unquote discretional spending which are needs, but they're not the same amount spent each month. So, for example, a lot of the stuff that the kids need, like clothes and stuff of that nature, just buys. So obviously she also like she makes more, but then also she needs more money. More money for that anyways, because she's the one that's handling those transactions.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean I'm the one replenishing the kids' clothes, buying birthday presents for when we go to parties, booking vacations. I naturally, in our relationship, am the quote unquote spender, which obviously we don't like that term because it's dumb but I spend the money because I'm the one handling a lot of those just expenses, naturally, you know, buying things for the classroom party at the end of the year and teacher appreciation and all of those things. So it makes more sense in our household for me to have quote unquote more spending money, because I spend more, I need to spend more because I handle it all Exactly.
Speaker 2:I don't do.
Speaker 1:Exactly. One of the other things that we basically said is our retirement accounts are our own, but we will be contributing the same amount. So Brandon obviously is an entrepreneur. That doesn't mean that he can't have his own retirement accounts. You know, I get a company match and so whatever he puts into his retirement account percentage-wise, I'm going to put into my retirement account and vice versa, and we'll decide on that on an annual basis. We just want to make sure that we are both equally contributing to retirement, regardless of the fact that I get a match and he works for himself. So that was something important that we wanted to put in there.
Speaker 2:Well, the biggest thing there is that God forbid something happens and we do end up getting divorced is that that's already been established, that her retirement account is hers and my retirement account is mine. That's what the postnup was for, because, as I have said in previous episodes, I started my finance career working for Fidelity and what's called a defined contribution so your 401k plans, 403b, stuff of that nature, and what I would often see sometimes come across on calls is what's called a quadro. I can't remember. The top of my head it's an acronym. I can't remember what it stands for.
Speaker 1:The top of my head it did come up in our meeting though, but basically what?
Speaker 2:it is is that when you don't have those postnups or prenups in place to say, hey, if we were to separate, then your retirement account is yours and my retirement account is mine, then what happens is to say, traditionally the man might be the one making more money, he has a larger retirement account. Say, you have a wife that's a stay-at-home mom. She didn't have a retirement account, so now she's entitled to half of his.
Speaker 1:As she should be.
Speaker 2:I'm not disputing that, but I could tell you that when those calls come across, I'm talking to the person who's the owner of the account and they're having to split theirs. They're not necessarily happy.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no, and I get that. And that's where we wanted to come in and just say what's yours is yours, what's mine is mine. We're not splitting it. We're also in the age you know. Our parents are getting older, they're boomers, and so, you know, eventually there will likely be some sort of inheritance coming, and so we also designated that your inheritance is yours and mine is mine.
Speaker 1:Now, one of the clauses that we put in which I thought was really good and Aaron suggested this is that if you put money from some sort of a windfall inheritance, big bonus, whatever it might be into your joint account, that it needs to have a document attached that says this is now becoming joint property. And so if I get an inheritance and I put it in my account, brandon can't say anything about that. It's my inheritance, it's already defined. Now, if I choose to use that on family vacations or home improvements or to buy him whatever I want, that's totally fine. But if I put it in our joint account, we need to have a statement notarized saying that this is now joint property, and I do think that that could help eliminate any kind of confusion of well you know, when everything was good, I put down this deposit on the house or this or that and now you owe me half.
Speaker 1:No, we're not doing that right. I mean, that's come up in my own family with a down payment on a house that was my mom's inheritance and my parents then got divorced and I still have to hear about it to this day, like I'm tired of it. I don't want to have those conversations. If I'm contributing something from a windfall, a bonus, a whatever, and it's going into our joint account, we will have a statement notarized that says this is now basically our community property, this is our joint property and we can't bring it up later. And I think that that just avoids some of those things that just come up because people are emotional about their money and we want to avoid all of that emotional you call it head trash that comes with giving money when you're in a good place, but then when you're not in a good place, then you want to be pissed about it.
Speaker 2:Yeah, it's just one of those things where nobody goes into marriage with the preconceived notion that they're going to get divorced.
Speaker 2:But the reality is is that around 50% of marriages end in divorce.
Speaker 2:So the idea behind this is is like any of the minutia when it comes to the splitting of money, let's get that out of the way in the beginning, while we're happy with the hopes that we never need to use it, but if it does come to that day, then we've already taken care of it and even that scenario. So especially with us, like you know, since we do have kids, I think, if you got to the point where a divorce happens, that if you could take all that stuff that could potentially lead to you guys not liking each other during the divorce process take that out of the table since it's already settled then that could be will lead to a better relationship post-divorce, which obviously would be helpful when you have kids involved in the scenario. I feel as though, like for people that get divorced when they have kids, a lot of the stuff happens during the divorce that makes things just even worse, yeah, and then that leads into negative interactions between the parents when it comes to co-parenting as divorcees.
Speaker 1:Yeah, and you can't put. We do have almost like a clause about our children in the post-snap and we'll talk about that momentarily, but you can't actually put any kind of custody or child support information into your post-nup, so it can only pertain to the two people that are married. It cannot contain information about any other people and or minors. But we basically put in a clause of like here are the things that, while we love each other, while we respect each other, while we're happy, we expect, in the event that we do dissolve this marriage and so we'll get into some of those things From a high level we put in there that we're going to have an annual money meeting where we talk about how much have we spent, how much have we saved, what our retirement accounts look like.
Speaker 2:It's basically like a mini state of the union right Of like our household We'll have more than one a year, but our postnup does have that. You know, we at least have one year.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so we'll talk about our assets, our debts, disclose any changes in income, review the previous year spending, budgeting for the upcoming year, discussion of retirement contributions, subscriptions, reoccurring expenses, insurance policies for auto home, reoccurring expenses, insurance policies for auto home, health, medical disability, identifying large expenses that are coming up, and then upcoming travel budget conversations. So those are things that we talk about anyways, but if that is not something that you're currently doing, you can put in there that at least once a year you will have designated time, and you could even put in there that you're going to sit down, maybe with your financial advisor or financial coach or whoever you might be working with, to make sure that that happens and you don't just keep putting it off. So I thought that was something good to have in there.
Speaker 2:No, I agree.
Speaker 1:The other thing that we put in is that, aside from the inheritance belonging to the receiver, is that anything above $500 taken out of the joint account needs to have a discussion first. But then we also, because I said listen, if I'm at Costco shopping for the annual family barbecue, I'm going to spend more than $500. I don't need to stand in line to call Brandon to make sure that I can buy these burgers and hot dogs. So we put in there that that is aside from the general household expenses.
Speaker 2:It's also like a single item, like you're going to buy one item itself that costs $500 or more as compared to like oh, you went shopping.
Speaker 1:Or you went grocery shopping. You're going to buy multiple items.
Speaker 1:Yeah. But again, if you're not used to maybe sharing the expenses, looking at the accounts together, you don't want large amounts of money, whatever large is to you. You don't want large amounts of money coming out and then somebody goes to swipe a card and then you're surprised because you know there's thousands of dollars missing. So we just put that little clause in there. That way we're encouraged to have those conversations and if one of us wanted to spend 500 or more out of the joint account, we would just either send a quick text message or pick up the phone and have a quick conversation and then decide how to move forward from there.
Speaker 1:One thing that was interesting that came up for North Carolina, because we put in there that we are not going to, in the event of us dissolving our marriage, we are not going to pay each other alimony. I've said that from the very beginning. I'm like I'm not paying a grown man. It's just not going to happen. But the state of North Carolina does not actually allow that to be in a post-snap, and so we have a clause in there that states that we are taking our own financial responsibilities and that we have enough assets and means to cover our own expenses outside of alimony, so we would hope that that would pass in a court of law. It's not something that I think we're super concerned about, but legally we could not add the statement in North Carolina, so something to keep in mind.
Speaker 2:Yeah, essentially, the clause was to provide context of what our wishes were at the time that we did the posting up. So, like she said, hopefully if it ever came to that point of a divorce, then the court would be like. You know, this is what you were talking about, this is what you wanted this time. You might be angry now and want something different, but this is what you wanted.
Speaker 1:Right. Um, one thing that I think and I, as I've talked to some people about this, I really was more interested in the logistics of, like, what happens if we were to split up right, Because we do have children, we do want to, of course, be happy co-parents, we want to.
Speaker 2:We own a home.
Speaker 1:We own a home, we want to minimize the amount of disruption they have in their life, and so we talked a lot about. Well, who moves out? What does that look like? How much time do you get to move out? Let's say we dissolve our marriage. I mean, brandon probably can't go out within the next week and find another apartment, right, so how much time does he have, or do I have, to move out?
Speaker 2:Like what's a reasonable time.
Speaker 1:We decided Brandon's moving out. That's in the post-nup. So Brandon, according to our post-nup, has 60 days to find a new residence.
Speaker 2:And also just to be clear to those people out there like for our situation I don't speak to everybody else's situation, for our situation I put in the post-nup that I would move out because that was my choice, that I think, from a structure standpoint, to keep things as normal as possible for the kids. And I think from a structure standpoint to keep things as normal as possible for the kids, I think as a father you can try to do as best as you can to quote unquote be 50-50 with a mom, but the reality is that majority of the time that's not the case. So I wanted them to be there stability-wise with her more if we went through that process of transitioning.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so Brandon has 60 days to move out and another 30 days after that to remove all of his things from the house. Let's be serious. Brandon has a laptop and some clothes. Like that's all he's getting.
Speaker 2:I am not, I am not like. So everything in our house from a design standpoint, I have not put any input. I shouldn't say that. I wouldn't say I haven't put any input in.
Speaker 2:I've always asked you, she always asked me, but I'm not good at that, so I'm like whatever you want. If I have something where I'm adamantly like, no, I do not want that, she's like okay, you don't have a lot of opinion, so I'm going to listen to you on that one, but 99.9% of the stuff she's done, so like it wouldn't necessarily be anything for me to take. However, we did put in there like a reasonable amount of our joint assets would be specified, would be given to me to purchase furniture for a new place.
Speaker 1:Yes, so Brandon gets a $5,000 allowance. Again, my concern at this point, if we were to get a divorce, is not Brandon, but if our children are going to be with Brandon in whatever new living situation he's going to be in, I want them to have a home with Brandon. So we did put a clause in that you get to take $5,000 from the joint account to furnish your new place. So in my head I was like listen, I don't need this man on Facebook marketplace buying some old rank mattress, no like don't buy things on Facebook marketplace.
Speaker 1:I'm just saying again, this is like you know, we're happy and then now we're not. So I'm thinking about my children, our children in this event of no, they still they're used to sleeping in their own nice beds with nice bedding, and I mean they're spoiled right, their own nice beds with nice bedding, and I mean they're spoiled right, like we have a great life, so we need to maintain that, and so I didn't want to do the well. Who gets this bed and who gets this sofa? And what about this table?
Speaker 1:And no, just go to rooms to go furnish your place, get the kids what they need. Here's money from the joint account, and so those are the things that I'm really glad we talked about. We talked about them with Aaron. We said, well, what do what do people do? What is in your prenup or what's in your post up? You know we talked about these scenarios and now that it's outlined, I feel great Like again. We don't ever plan on using this, but in the event that we did, it's already written out for us. We don't have to now be pissed and angry and exhausted with each other and figuring out, well, when are you going to get your stuff out and how much time do you have? And well, no, I don't want you taking money from the account. It's already decided. We decided on it while we're in love, while we respect each other, while we're good.
Speaker 2:It's also like any planning that might be seen as like quote unquote a negative situation. You do the planning when the situation is not occurring and it makes it so much easier so that if that situation does occur, you already have the plan in place. I mean, it's like what's it like for? Like a business, like crisis planning.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah, and like um uh succession planning right, like um uh succession planning right, like I mean that's.
Speaker 2:I mean like important you think about anything like I mean even just like, think about from like a standpoint of, like you know, first responders, stuff like that they're running through this stuff they're running through this stuff and practicing when it's quote, unquote, not real right so that when it is real, they know what to do. Yeah, so this wasn't a morbid conversation. It wasn't anything that we got emotional about because, like I said, we're planning for something that we hopefully never have to use.
Speaker 1:I mean, I think we were probably the exception here, but we probably nerded out about it, because I loved this conversation. I loved this detail of, like, what happens, how much time do you have, how much time do we have to separate our bank accounts? How much money do you get to furnish your new apartment? Like I love that because now we know and we don't have to talk about it again.
Speaker 2:It also kind of like I'm trying to think of, like how I want to phrase this, but it also opens you up to understand the conversations on certain topics that maybe you haven't had before, and what your partner's thinking is.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I mean, was there anything that we weren't aligned on, though?
Speaker 2:No, we're the exception, I would say, though, because we have these conversations all the time, and, honestly, I think, out of all the financial conversations we ever had, the only one where we were slightly not aligned with initially.
Speaker 1:But then we're kind of on the same page was college paying for our kid's college.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I think that's pretty much it.
Speaker 1:Oh, that's something else that we talked about right Of like we don't know. Let's say we did get a divorce in 10, 15, 20 years. We don't know what our financial standing is going to be, what we're going to be earning. So we did talk about things like well, can we split, you know things with our minor children 50-50. So like what, if you know what, if we are getting them cell phones and cars? And what about prom and senior trips?
Speaker 1:And so we talked about those things, and Aaron again made very valid points and gave us his professional, you know expertise on not putting in the postnup, that everything would be split 50-50, right, Because then you can run into areas where maybe, while you create the postnup, that makes sense. But then life happens and now it's not feasible for one parent to still maintain a 50-50 split when it comes to buying a car, things like that. And so we basically put in there that we will share the responsibilities as equally as possible for anything above and beyond child support. So if there were, I mean our minor children would still be involved. If we were to get a divorce, child support would obviously be handled in family court. And so these were for expenses above and beyond. Right, oh, you want to take our kids to the Bahamas now for their birthday. Is that a reasonable expense or do you need to cover that yourself?
Speaker 2:Well, technically, child support only technically comes into play if you decide to take the other parent to child support for child support. Which we would hopefully not do, yeah, so like you can like manage the expenses before that if you are on good terms.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 1:And handle it that way also. I think the really good thing here and we even put in again you can't actually add your children to the postnup or the prenup, but you can put statements in of. Here is what we agreed upon as part of this process. So something else we agreed upon is that neither parent would live more than 30 miles away. Right, I think neither one of us would even want to do that, so that seems easy enough. I think we also added in there that we would do a week on and a week off. I was very adamant about that.
Speaker 1:We're not doing a midweek change. I'm not doing a Tuesday, wednesday, I'm not doing it. You get the kids for a week. I get the kids for a week. You get a chance to miss them. No, of course we don't want to be apart from our kids for a week, but I see in that work life how difficult it is, especially if you travel for work, which I do how hard it is to manage one Tuesday here, one Friday there. To manage one Tuesday here, one Friday there. It's a nightmare and it's exhausting for the kids.
Speaker 1:I was a former teacher. I knew exactly when students were with one parent versus another parent. It's a disaster. I'm just not doing it. So we put in there that we are agreeing to one full week on, one full week off. We didn't put anything in there about holidays. But again, our goal with all of this is to remain excellent parents to our children, and so those are the details that we would, of course, work out, you know, on the back end. But those core kind of day-to-day living, you know, not moving the children from their base school, things like that were really important to us because we want to maintain the quality of life that they have and not let our you know, our relationship be a burden to them. So that's really what we were trying to maintain as much as possible.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and you know, like, specifically like for myself, my parents got divorced when I was five. So you know, I grew up my brother and I grew up being raised by my mom. So like that thought process of what I experienced as a kid went into you know the conversations that we had for the post-nup because, like you said, the 30 mile radius was so that we could both be present in the kids' lives and without having to uproot them per se, so like they could stay at the same, like so, for example, one week with her, one week with me, they're still at the same school, they're still able to do all the same activities and everything like that. So that's one of the main reasons that we put that in Cause. Also, like I said, I was very I, we didn't need I don't even think just how to bring that up Like that was one of my things were like we need to be in close proximity because God forbid that happens that we got divorced. I need to be there.
Speaker 1:Yeah, well, and to change schools and teachers and, like you said, extracurriculars and all those things that are in your community. You know they happen within a certain radius and so we just wanted to maintain that as much as possible. Yeah, there's also some other clauses that we put in counseling clauses, mediation and then family counseling. So counseling is for Brandon and myself. Either one of us could initiate a request to go to counseling at any time throughout the year, and the idea there is that within 30 days, your first session needs to be scheduled and you have to have three sessions within a 90-day window. And what I thought was also great and this is something that came from Aaron is whoever initiates the request for counseling has to present three counselors that are already insurance approved to the other person, and then the other person gets to decide. You know, based on the bios or profiles, who they would want to go with as far as a therapist, so that there's not well, you chose this person. They're clearly on your side.
Speaker 1:Yeah, you're both part of the process, um.
Speaker 1:And then you, there's also, as part of that, you can extend a request. So let's say you go to three counseling sessions, it's going well, and one person says, hey, I would like to continue, um, then the other person you know can respond accordingly, but there's a minimum of three. If we decided to, after those counseling sessions, go through with the divorce, then we have to go to mediation, and that can include the children. So this is where you figure out some of those remaining details that are not already in the post-SNP, which again I thought was great because we're trying to raise happy, healthy children. You know emotionally healthy children, and so we wanted to bring them into that process as well. And then we also have a family counseling clause where we allow the children to be part of the therapy process so that they can work out, you know, anything that they need to, with us or by themselves, so that you know again, they're getting the support that they need. So, all in all, you know a counseling clause, a mediation clause and then family counseling as well.
Speaker 2:Yeah, that's important too because, like you know, obviously talking about mental health on all levels is much more of a you know talked about subject matter now, where, you know, my parents got divorced in 1988. So it wasn't really a big thing and I think that myself and my brother definitely, probably could have benefited, definitely, probably, definitely could have benefited from some form of, you know, counseling at that time to help get through that period.
Speaker 1:Yeah, yeah. We just want to give our kids the resources that we think they might need during a transition like that. One of the other things that came up is, if we actually decided to go through with the full divorce, that we should also go into binding arbitration following mediation. And there were a couple of benefits for arbitration that we didn't realize, but it offers several advantages over the traditional court litigation, including speed, cost effectiveness, flexibility.
Speaker 1:And then Aaron's big point was confidentiality platform or a podcast or you're in the public eye, et cetera. If you don't want all your business out on the street and you don't want somebody that can just pop into the court hearings because technically you can do that, you need to have an arbitration clause in your post-nup or your prenup. So I thought that was really great. Aaron says he recommends it to all of his clients Definitely, of course, the high net worth individuals, celebrities that he represents, et cetera. But he did say, because we have a quote, unquote public presence, that he would recommend that for us as well, because otherwise, if people catch wind, they could just be sitting up in that courtroom taking notes and then you end up on the shade room, I mean that's what happens.
Speaker 1:So I thought that was really interesting, and that's certainly not something we knew about and or would have known about without Aaron's guidance and expertise. Yeah, on top of that, I think what's really important here is you're making your own rules right, so come prepared with the things that are important to you, that are top of mind. I mean, there was even like, hey, what about my points and miles? Right, I'm the one who, strategically, like we're using this credit card, I'm the one doing it all, so, like, if this doesn't work, I want to keep all my points and miles.
Speaker 2:I think that's fair.
Speaker 1:But the point is, ask whatever it is that is important to you, right, and have a conversation with your partner to determine how you want this to go. I mean, yes, you can talk about your kids and you can have clauses in there. One of the other things that we talked about is like how do you introduce a new person, right? Let's say, brandon moves out and moves in with a buddy, right? Okay? Well, I need to be comfortable with that, first of all, because now my kids are living with somebody that I might not know. But also, what happens if you know the divorce is final and he starts dating or I start dating? What is the rule for introducing somebody new?
Speaker 1:We also talked about things like our aging parents. How do we handle an aging parent moving in, whether it's temporary or permanent? What does that look like from a financial point of view? Right, we will be exhausting their health insurance and retirement benefits because we don't want to take on the financial strain of now having an elderly adult in our home and us taking over all of their financial burdens. That's not going to be good for anybody, especially not our relationship.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and that comes from, like you know, we know people who unfortunately maybe didn't have this conversation beforehand and then a parent moved in and that parent maybe isn't contributing, you know, as they maybe should, to household expenses, so that starts to stress your expenses. Right Now you're paying for another person being there.
Speaker 1:Yeah, no thanks. So those are all the things, you know. We're just kind of taking the experiences of the people around us, the conversations that we're already having and the things that are important to us, and we shaped that into the rules, kind of quote unquote for our love insurance, and I feel great. I mean it's something we could always go back and revisit. I mean, it is a document that you can make updates to, but I feel like we're in a really good place. We put in there what is most important to us for right now and I think the basics are covered right, like the no alimony was important to me. Keeping our retirements accounts separate was important to me, you know, making sure that your debt is yours, which you don't really have debt besides your car. And then I have more debt because of my student loans.
Speaker 2:Oh, one of the point we talked about is is that um, the mortgage is in just his name but in our postnup we put that that is still a joint asset.
Speaker 1:Yes, well, it's an asset and a liability. Yes, it shows up on both. So Brandon is on the deed, but the mortgage is solely in my name. But if we were to dissolve our marriage, I am just as much responsible for it, for the mortgage. Yeah, so we could. There's like a first right of refusal.
Speaker 1:If, let's say, I wanted to sell the house but Brandon wanted to keep it, well then he can buy out his portion, for example, or we sell it and everything that goes into selling the house and what we make from the house gets split. So, even though he's not technically on the mortgage, we did define it as a joint asset. So you can do that with any properties or other assets that you have and determine, regardless of who's on the actual loan, who would be responsible. Or is it a shared responsibility? So great, call out. So all that to say. You get who would be responsible. Or is it a shared responsibility? So great, call out. So all that to say. You get to make your own rules. That's what this was all about for us in the beginning and I'm so glad that we did it. Hopefully we'll never have to use it, but, as far as you know, helping educate people on the process, obviously for the podcast, but then also we really now do consider it part of a comprehensive financial portfolio, so I feel great about it.
Speaker 2:I mean, and we told, we've told all our friends that you know they should really think about looking into doing that and, honestly, one of the biggest takeaways that I took from it is that there are so many things that can happen in a marriage that lead to divorce, and one of the top ones is financial stress. So if you could take away any of those potential areas that could lead to divorce, then that just sets you up for a higher probability of having a successful marriage. So if you take that financial stress aspect off of the table by having these conversations, having certain things in place, that leaves less things to have to worry about and can't predict the future. But I think that puts you in a much better place to stay in a happy marriage, because there are a lot of people out there that are probably married and not happy, but the idea is to stay in a happy marriage.
Speaker 1:Yeah, I feel great about it. I'm glad we did it. No regrets.
Speaker 2:And I highly recommend using Aaron Thomas, like process was so easy so easy.
Speaker 1:His team was great communication, easy scheduling, um you know he works with you know uh individuals in several States.
Speaker 2:So he's located in um Georgia but he works. Like I said, we're in North Carolina. He works with people in several other states.
Speaker 1:Yeah, so reach out to Aaron. We have an affiliate link just for tracking purposes so that if you hear about Aaron on the podcast.
Speaker 2:Yeah, we're not getting any money from it.
Speaker 1:Yeah, if you hear about Aaron from our podcast, he wants to know and he's a really great resource. He shed a lot of light on the process things that we should consider things how they're standard, you know how they're done, kind of in a standard way If we asked about non-standard things, what that would be, how we should phrase them, etc. So absolutely great experience and I'm so glad we now have this done and checked off the list. Yeah, so if you have any other questions about our specific post-nuptial agreement, feel free to reach out. We're pretty much an open book. There are a couple of clauses in there that state that we can't talk about certain things, but for the most part, we have shared everything that is in our post-nup and we hope that this was a helpful episode for you.
Speaker 1:Don't forget Benjamin Franklin said an investment in knowledge pays the best interest. You just got paid Until next time. Don't forget, Benjamin Franklin said an investment in knowledge pays the best interest. You just got paid Until next time. Thanks for listening to today's episode. We are so glad to have you as part of our Sugar Daddy community. If you learned something today, please remember to subscribe, rate, review and share this episode with your friends, family and extended network. Don't forget to connect with us on social media. At the Sugar Daddy Podcast, you can also email us your questions you want us to answer for our past, the Sugar segments at thesugardaddypodcast at gmailcom, or leave usa voicemail through our Instagram.
Speaker 2:Our content is intended to be used, and must be used, for informational purposes only. It is very important to do your own analysis before making any investment based upon your own personal circumstances. You should take independent financial advice from a licensed professional in connection with, or independently research and verify any information you find in our podcast and wish to rely upon, whether for the purpose of making an investment decision or
