Homeward Indy
Homeward Indy
Episode 36 - Nancy’s Homeward Story: “Don’t give up hope.”
Content note: This episode contains references to self-harm and suicidal ideation. Please be careful with yourselves.
Hello, Homeward Indy Listeners, this is Elliot Zans, co-producer and occasional host. I want to personally welcome you all to the last and pinnacle episode of 2024. Today I am privileged to present a conversation between myself and my dear friend Nancy as she shares her experience of being homeless in Indianapolis. This episode is both an indictment of systems and institutions and a love letter to the community of compassionate people who exist within and beyond those systems. While Nancy’s story is unique, the number of people who experience homelessness in our community is becoming alarmingly common.
Nancy’s testimony uncovers the raw challenges of homelessness—surviving on limited resources, battling health issues without adequate medical supplies, weighing medical crises against access to shelter, and facing systemic gaps within the shelter system. Her hard-won transition to stability is marked by moments of unexpected support, from friends stepping in during crises to compassionate healthcare workers who became lifelong allies. Nancy’s experience underscores the struggle for dignity and the transformative power of timely, compassionate assistance. She makes an irrefutable case for compassion, and a poignant call for those experiencing homelessness to hold fast to hope- a better life can be reached.
to be told that you're going to have breakfast and dinner and in between time you have to be out of the building from 7.30 in the morning until 4 in the afternoon. Where are you supposed to go? She put a $20 bill in my hand and I never saw her again. I never knew what her name was, but because of her caring, that got me to make myself get better, get better. I was so afraid of losing my spot at the shelter that I didn't seek any medical help whatsoever.
Speaker 3:Welcome to Homeward Indie, a bi-weekly conversation where we meet the people working to end homelessness in Indianapolis and hear their stories. I'm Elliott Zanz.
Speaker 1:And I'm Steve Barnhart.
Speaker 3:This is a friendly reminder that the views and opinions expressed in this program are those of the speakers and do not necessarily reflect the views or positions of any entities they belong to or represent.
Speaker 1:Welcome to our last episode of the year. I can't believe 2024 is already coming to an end and we're departing a little bit from the norm on this last episode. And I have Elliot here with me to talk about that a little bit, to kind of give some context to this episode. It's very touching. I'm sure you're going to be moved by it. But, elliot, why don't you tell us a little bit about how this all came about?
Speaker 3:Yeah, hi, good morning everybody, or whatever time of day it is that you're listening, time of day it is that you're listening. I am so humbled and grateful that this episode is happening and also it goes back to the roots of what you originally wanted. When we first proposed this whole series, steve had come and we were talking about a podcast and we were talking about centering the voices of those with lived expertise and we had a lot of concerns and reservations about exploitation and taking advantage of folks, but also wanted to showcase a lot of the work being done around the continuum of care in advance, building trust with providers, building trust with the community. As we've embarked on this project, huge thanks to everybody who has showed up and contributed and shared their stories and shared their experiences across this body of work. Today we have somebody who is so central to my life. Her name is Nancy and we met when I first entered this work in 2020. We met at the COVID quarantine, the COVID-19 non-congregate shelter setup, when I first entered this work and you'll hear more about it. She's a really incredible person and we have stayed in touch through the last four years and she said she was ready to share her story and that she wanted to, and it is my deepest honor to be able to present that.
Speaker 3:This episode is a conversation between me and Nancy. You won't actually hear me say much. It's Nancy's story and it brings all of this work and all of the experiences of people, all of this work and all of the experiences of people living through homelessness to light in a visceral and powerful way and I really want to talk about a little bit before we cut to that conversation. This showcases the why behind everything we do in our work in the continuum of care. Every system is made up of relationships between people and when we're talking about professions of care, they are created to replicate community ties that people might not have, that people might have lost or been severed from for all kinds of reasons Huge, big reasons, small reasons, any reasons. These systems replicate community and I think the really important thing about this story is that it is a story of community success.
Speaker 3:It is a story of Nancy's strength and grace and ability to receive care, even when that is sometimes the hardest thing for folks to do. It's very hard to be the bearer of everyone else's good intentions, it's hard to be in that, and you'll see, even through all of those spaces. She is somebody who has showed up in her turn and always tried to give back. She has given back to me in countless ways that I will never be able to fully convey to anyone, ways that I will never be able to fully convey to anyone, and I hope. In conversation with her recently, she said if this story moved somebody and brought more compassion to how they see folks experiencing homelessness because they are just people, people like everyone. This could happen to anyone. It just takes a few wrong things going wrong or going sideways or events that are totally out of your control. And if this story brings you any compassion for other people, then that is what Nancy wanted from it.
Speaker 3:So, yeah, that's excellent, and I would just add to that that for us that look on to those experiencing homelessness, nancy's story really illustrates how small acts of kindness can make huge differences in our lives yes, throughout this, this conversation, this story, you will hear of a lot of beautiful moments and a lot of hard moments, um, but it's the kindness that really got her through in a lot of it, hers and other people's.
Speaker 1:Yeah, anything else. Before we jump to the conversation, the story.
Speaker 3:I think I just want to tie this back to at the beginning of pretty much any meeting we have anymore we try and ground ourselves in, of pretty much any meeting we have anymore. We try and ground ourselves in the fact that any data we're talking about, any situation or process or work that we are talking about when we're doing this work together, is about sacred human lives, and so here is a window into one of those very sacred human lives. So welcome to Nancy. Hi everybody, Today is a really special day for me. This is Elliot Zanz. I am the Director of Strategy and Impact at CHIP now, but that's not really the role I'm sitting in for the purposes of this conversation. We've known each other for four years. I'm really grateful that she was interested in coming on to talk about her story and share I don't know the journey she's taken to be where she is today. So hi, Nancy, Thanks for being here with me.
Speaker 2:Hi Elliot.
Speaker 3:You're welcome very much. I guess I will start with saying I't know I get, let's talk about you.
Speaker 2:Do you want to introduce yourself a little bit? Yeah, um, my name is Nancy. I've lived in Indianapolis for 17 years. Now I'm down here from Michigan.
Speaker 3:We met in 2020, correct? Yep, okay, so the first time I met you was at one of the hotels, correct, it was still Candlewood, right? Yeah, okay, it was even before Crowne Plaza. Yeah, so this was when I had first entered the continuum of care as a super baby case manager, did not know what was going on, was doing my best, learning a lot from Barb, learning a lot from our peer support specialists, but, yeah, we met and then kept meeting for the next four years.
Speaker 1:Yes, Do you?
Speaker 3:want to talk a little bit about how we got to the point where we were intersecting. Yeah, sorry, that's a really big question.
Speaker 2:We actually the very first time I met you was at Candlewood and it was a point where I had already been homeless for a year and I'm a diabetic. I was out of all my diabetic supplies and I just happened to come across you in like the office and I asked if you could help me with that and you said yes, no problem, you know what size, you know everything did I need and I said I needed to run up to my room real quick to find out. Come back, gave you all my information the very next day, even though that day we had been switched to another hotel.
Speaker 3:That was the day of the move.
Speaker 2:Yes, you found me. You knocked on my door after I was in that hotel, Crown Plaza, for maybe an hour and you were knocking on my door with all my diabetic supplies and I was just amazed by that because I figured with the move that you wouldn't be able to find me. And you did. You made sure you did.
Speaker 3:I was very in touch with who everyone's room assignment was. I remember that. So I didn't know where everyone was, but yeah, I was very in touch with who everyone's room assignment was. I remember that. So I did. I didn't know where where everyone was, but yeah, I was happy I was able to follow up on that for you.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean that that was a starting point for me to actually start getting back to taking care of myself, because for that year and a half when I was homeless to that point, I wasn't getting any of my meds and I had so many problems at that time that I wasn't taken. But two of like 15 medicines I should have been taken, so that I even survived was kind of a miracle to me.
Speaker 3:I'm really glad you did and yeah, it's really hard to keep track of a ton of medications or even be able to pick them up when you aren't in a stable space.
Speaker 2:Exactly.
Speaker 2:I met with you concerning what my needs were. How much more help did I need? And thankfully for me, at that time I still had my car so I could get around, but you were also available with bus passes, you know, to get to where we needed to go, which was a great help. We had meetings about, you know, being able to find housing and I specifically remember the very first week of November that year we had a meeting and I can't remember all the people that were there, but I know some people from the city were there. You guys were there.
Speaker 2:We were told that housing was going to be found for all of us and I was just so doubtful at that point I thought we'll never hear nothing. And all of a sudden, it was a couple of months, it was like into 1st of January, and you were knocking on my door saying we think we may have found you something. And I'm like I was just in a point of disbelief at that time and you know, approval needed for everything. Everything took a while. It was the end of January and you were calling me saying you know, we have a place for you. We'll be moving you next week. And I'm like I couldn't believe it. It was just through. There was so much hardship in between all that. When I lost my car, when that was like the end of it for me, I didn't care anymore whether I lived or died, and you specifically helped me through that and I felt like maybe I do deserve to have this fresh start.
Speaker 2:And it was like a dream come true and, without going into specifics, that apartment did have certain problems, had to be moved out of there, had to be put in a safe hotel for a while. A month later I was put to where I currently am now, and have been for the past three and a half years the best place in the world, right on a bus line. So no matter where I need to go, I can get on it. Go where I need to go, need to get to the hospital for appointments, doctor's offices, I can get there. I don't have to worry about that anymore. And you understood that that wasn't what I needed, that I needed to be on that bus route to have any type of independence. Yeah, you have to be able to get around.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and when you're homeless and in a homeless facility, you're not necessarily helped a lot. You're not necessarily helped a lot Because when, for whatever, from November to June, I had been at a shelter.
Speaker 3:Of 2019 to 2020.
Speaker 2:Yeah, and they didn't. Yes, they gave you housing, but they don't necessarily want to work with you to get you out of your homeless situation, and I understand that for the winter contingency, you're not specifically there to receive their help other than to have shelter, a place for the night yeah, the overflow shelter situation doesn't have the staffing capacity to do a lot of supportive services, which is really unfortunate because that's also when we see so so many people come in.
Speaker 3:But yeah, it's and it's a system level capacity issue that we hit every year and of course, there's been a lot of frustration around that this year and every year. But yeah, as someone who was in that situation, I imagine that felt pretty isolating.
Speaker 2:I mean, and I hate to say it, but in that situation you're made to feel like a nobody, be told that you're going to have breakfast and dinner and in between time you have to be out of the building from 7.30 in the morning until 4 in the afternoon. Where are you supposed to go? They didn't help with bus passes to let you get somewhere. There was mornings when it was below zero and you were outside for whatever nine hours and I saw so many people get taken to the hospital with frostbite and other cold-related illnesses and it was horrible to have to watch that. But somehow I actually made it through and you have to follow what they want you to do.
Speaker 2:And for me, one of the worst parts was where there's one bathroom available which had three stalls for over 100 women, and in the morning they would come in and put three rows of toilet paper. You were told that was for the day, that's it. And within a matter of an hour there was no toilet paper. They would, and unfortunately there was women that would steal the roll of toilet paper. So it was crazy. You couldn't even have your basic needs taken care of. And for me because I had never even imagined that I would ever be homeless and need to take some kind of help, to not be able to have something as basic as toilet paper available to you. That was like a real rude awakening to know that so many more people were so much worse off than I was, so much worse off than I was, and I just wanted to be able to help. And any time that any of the leaders of the mission would ask you know, can somebody help us with this, can we have volunteers for this or that? I was always right there.
Speaker 2:I wanted to help, but then you had the others that said well, you know, you run this place, you guys should be taking care of it, which was unfortunate. But then you saw things that you didn't really want to see. You would see people bringing in donations of food or clothing, but yet at night you would see the employees taking that same stuff out to their car, and that was so disheartening. To think that somebody's donating that for us homeless people but yet they're taking it home and that was so hard. And for them to think that we couldn't see them doing that.
Speaker 2:I just didn't understand it. And for them to think that a stale donut or dry cereal is a breakfast that's going to get you through the day and I understand yes, they rely on donations for that. But to see some of that, going out the door with them was hard. Some of that going out the door with them was hard and if I could have left I would have just left had to learn day by day that I needed to follow what they wanted done, to eventually be for selected from a group of over 100 women who, because a pandemic had just hit, they were moving people For me. I was told at that point, in the very beginning, that they were taking those I want to say I'm pretty sure it was 55 and older and moving all of them out to hotels by the airport.
Speaker 3:Yes, because that was the COVID vulnerability risk. It was folks with respiratory conditions and over. It might have been 55. It kind of varied depending on who was implementing at that moment.
Speaker 2:But yeah, yeah, and I made sure. And for me, luckily, I had a case manager who helped me fill out the application to make sure we had everything filled out correctly and for her to submit that and for me to be accepted into that, there was like a three week period and I was asking every other day, you know, have you heard anything? Have you heard anything? And finally, when she called me into the office and she said you've been accepted, and for me it was two days after my birthday and it was like the greatest birthday gift I could have been given is to be moving out to somewhere where maybe we would have a little bit more individual attention and help us get through the homelessness, get into a place, help us get through the homelessness, get into a place. And without all of the different groups helping, I'm sure I would have been out on the street and I'm pretty sure I wouldn't be here right now because of all my health issues. There's no way I could have survived that.
Speaker 3:I'm glad you did. Are you up for talking about how homelessness happened for you? You don't have to.
Speaker 2:To a point. Yeah, I had moved down here to live with a boyfriend who had had a massive stroke, needed someone to take care of him, not that he couldn't do things, that he couldn't do things. His big problem was he had lost half of his vision, couldn't was suggested by doctors that he have care at the home, somebody with him because he could no longer drive, and all of that, and it was good for a while. But he had a history of heart problems, ended up going into cardiac arrest one day when we were in the car, which is a whole other story. But from there, we went through six or seven months of every week having three or four different appointments, three or four different appointments, and it got to the point where he was told, basically, there's nothing more that we can do for you at this point.
Speaker 2:So he made the decision that he wanted to go into hospice care, which the doctors agreed with, and it was May of 2017 when he went into that, and it was the best thing for him not to have to be going to all the appointments, and for me, because I was the one that had to take him to all of them, but to have to be the caretaker for someone who is in hospice was not something I was prepared to do, but I continued to do it and just felt so grateful, useless, alone and isolated. And yes, hospice can help you with that. They can relieve you. You know, whatever, he didn't want any of that. He only wanted me taking care of him. So I couldn't say no.
Speaker 3:Yeah it's a hard situation to be put into. Yeah, and he A hard situation to be put into, yeah, and he.
Speaker 2:I'm trying to think went into was gradually going downhill, but not so much that he couldn't do things. We did something almost every day just to get him out of the house which for me was a real hard thing to do because at that point he was in the wheelchair and to get him out of our apartment into the wheelchair, because we didn't have a ramp to get him out of the wheelchair into the wheelchair, because we didn't have a ramp to get him out to the car, out of the wheelchair into the car wheelchair into the car.
Speaker 2:To me was just so physically tasking that I was worn out and I was to the point where I felt I was going to have a breakdown, but we kept going. He was a person who liked to go to the casino, so once or twice a week that was where we went, where I was happy to take him because I knew he was happy when he was there. Yeah, and actually the day he passed away we were at the casino. We got home at 5 o'clock that afternoon, 10 o'clock that night he passed away.
Speaker 2:Oh, wow the nurse had been to our apartment about 6 o'clock that night he passed away. Oh wow, the nurse had been to our apartment about 6 o'clock that evening, said that her estimation was he had probably two weeks and within four hours of saying that he was gone he went into cardiac arrest again. And of course, being in hospice there's nothing you can do. But that was the beginning of my homelessness. We weren't married, unfortunately, see the need for him to make provisions for me once he was gone. So for me not having worked myself all those years, I had gone through all the money I had Taking care of him. Right when he passed away his children took everything. The only thing he made sure of was that I was able to keep his car. They got everything else.
Speaker 2:So of course I was depressed at the time, didn't really realize what was happening with myself. It was to the point where I couldn't make myself go out of the apartment, so I couldn't go out and look for a job, so rent wasn't being paid. I want to say probably that was in October when he passed away. In January I got an eviction notice because rent wasn't being paid. I was so depressed that I tried to kill myself and before I could complete it, something in my mind was telling me to reach out to a couple that had been our best friends, who eventually bought a house across the street.
Speaker 2:And I called them and I said you know, can I come over? I need to to talk. And she said, yeah, please do. And I went over and I told them what had happened and from there things just kind of snowballed. We had to. Their main concern at that point was yes, you need help, but you also need to get out of the apartment. They offered to help me have a yard sale to sell everything that I had. Obviously, there was nothing that I could take with me. What I could take was in our car.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And they set it up for one weekend. We did that and during that weekend I stayed with them because they didn't want me to be alone. That weekend I stayed with them because they didn't want me to be alone they basically handled the yard sale. I was just there with them, and that was like Friday, saturday, sunday. It was like Friday, saturday, sunday, monday.
Speaker 2:We decided that whatever wasn't sold that didn't want or even need, at that point we decided that we were just going to leave it in the apartment and I was going to walk away. Sure, they had. And part of all of this was that when we were done with that, they were going to take me to get the mental health help that I needed. And we went, we got all that done. I went to say goodbye to a couple of people that I knew really well in the apartment complex.
Speaker 2:They took some of my stuff, put it in their garage and stored things for me and purposely, in the middle of the winter, left their cars outside in the snow, in the cold. And that was when I knew I had some really good friends and they were checking on me at the hospital and it was so hard when I was released to still not have anywhere to go, and they didn't help at the hospital with making sure, once you were released, that you had somewhere you were going. So, unfortunately, I was in my car for a while until I finally went to the shelter, and that was just because it was too cold and I couldn't stay in my car anymore, not even thinking how dangerous it was.
Speaker 3:Yeah, thank you for sharing that. I know this is all hard to talk about. I want to talk a little bit about what was good after like what. I don't know who were your people. I know you talked a lot about me and I appreciate you. You're great, but I also know there were a lot of awesome humans who showed up across time.
Speaker 2:Yeah, I mean. I mean eventually, when I was at the shelter, I developed a blood clot in my leg and I didn't know what was happening, but losing my spot at the shelter, that I didn't seek any medical help whatsoever. And within a week at the shelter there's a lot of stairs that you have to use. I couldn't even take three steps and I couldn't breathe. Finally, one night I was going down the stairs and I got down there, couldn't breathe, had to sit, stand there for 20 minutes before I could actually get enough air into me where I could go back up the stairs. I went back up the stairs and three of the girls said you're purple, your hands are purple, your lips are purple, and a couple of them had known about my leg, that it was swelling. And they said you know, we're going to go downstairs, tell them they need to call an ambulance. And I said no, no, no, I'm fine. You were not fine. No, I was not.
Speaker 2:No, I know that I actually spent the night there at the shelter, not even realizing that the people on either side of me stayed awake all night and watched me to make sure that I was still breathing and I got up in the morning thinking I'm fine, because if I was still I could breathe. And I got up and I started walking around and I couldn't do it. I grabbed my bag and I said I'm going to the hospital, took about four steps, couldn't breathe. Oh there, I'll tell me the same thing again. And you're turning purple. Thankfully, at that point the girl who was my case manager walked by and she grabbed a chair and she said sitting there, I'm calling an ambulance. They called the ambulance but they had to get me downstairs because the fire department preferred that anybody at the shelter that they were going to treat be down in the main area instead of them having to come up to us. So they had to get me. The girls at the mission had to get me downstairs. And how I ever did it, I really don't remember that part and I remember when I got downstairs there was a couch there. They sat me on the couch, waited for the ambulance and the fire department to show up. Fire department showed up first, right away. They gave me oxygen because I was purple after having to walk down those stairs and ambulance came and after them, getting my breathing somewhat normal, took me to the hospital Community East and after explaining everything that was going on with me. They couldn't find anything Because all I kept saying is that my leg had been terribly swollen and they're saying well, it's not now we're going to run tests. But they were so backed up that it was six hours. As long as I was laying in that bed I was fine.
Speaker 2:At one point they needed a urine sample. Can you walk across the hall to the bathroom? And I'm not thinking that, no, I really can't. Sure I can do it. Got up, walked across, got in the bathroom, just felt like I was going to pass out. First thing I did was pull the cord in that bathroom and they all came running and they finally saw that I was purple, that I was purple and they made it a priority that I go get MRI, cat scan, a bunch of things. And the very first thing they did was a chest X-ray. And while they were doing a Doppler test on my legs, the doctor came in and said you need to stop that testing, she needs to have surgery. But because it was so important, because of the blood clot basically filling both my lungs, that I don't move because it could just burst and my heart would burst and all that, they wanted me at the heart and vascular hospital. They called an ambulance, had me transferred there. The minute they brought me in the door at that hospital they took me right to surgery.
Speaker 1:Wow.
Speaker 2:I had no idea at that point what was even going on. They're trying to get information for about family somebody to call. I'm like, I'm homeless. My family all lives in Michigan. There's nobody here for you to call. There's nobody here for you to call.
Speaker 2:And they saw that I was getting really upset and all the doctor said was don't ask her any more questions because you're just causing her a lot more pain.
Speaker 2:So they did the surgery and within I don't want to say four hours, I was in the cardiac care, intensive care, and I was in there for like three days and every time the doctor came in to see me he would say there is no reason why you're still alive.
Speaker 2:He said as much as you were moving around with that blood clot in your lungs, you shouldn't have survived that. And all he kept saying is that for some reason you're still here and I'm like I don't know what that reason is, but okay, and I had a nurse at that point who had been with me in the operating room and she kind of quickly heard the story of me being homeless and she put a $20 bill in my hand and I never saw her again. I never knew what her name was, but because of her caring that got me to make myself get better, even though I was going to have to go back to the shelter and all that. And through all of that I met a couple of nurses who now are like best friends, best friends, and without their help they eventually, once I did get housing, helped me get furniture and everything I needed for my apartment.
Speaker 1:Yeah.
Speaker 2:And they were like my guardian angels at that time, and they still are.
Speaker 3:Yeah, we had a Christmas party with one of them. Yes, we did.
Speaker 2:That was good, but it I mean it was a long journey from when I first became homeless to now.
Speaker 2:Had I known everything that I was going to go through? I don't think of myself as ever being a strong person, of myself as ever being a strong person, but I know I had to have been in order to get through all that Absolutely. And now I don't know. I just want someone to know that you know if you're going through homelessness, yes, there might not be a whole lot you can do about it, but there are people out there groups whatever that want to help you, that you know will do everything in their power to get you out of your homeless situation. And had I not stuck with all of that, I don't know what would have happened. Know what would have happened. But to be able to go through all that and to be where I am now, I want people to know that, yes, that can happen. You can go back to feeling like a normal human being again, and it takes a lot of hard work, but in my opinion, if I can get through that, just about anybody can.
Speaker 3:And I want to say for you that in this and having known you through so much of it and had the privilege to be with you through so much of it, you always I worked with a lot of folks with a lot of trauma and a lot of stress and, like you, had an immense amount of that, but you were always kind and you gave grace and there were a lot of points where you could have absolutely thrown your hands up at any one of us and been like you all have failed me.
Speaker 3:I'm out of here like I'm over this, and that does happen for a lot of people and it's understandable, because people do get very failed and it's not necessary, like sometimes it's systemic.
Speaker 3:Sometimes it is because some specific human did not show up in the way they should have or in good faith, but you always had grace for other people in all of that and I know you were always so kind to those around you and you were kind to me, uh, when we were in it, and I want everyone to be able to get to where you are, where it's better.
Speaker 3:Everyone deserves that and you shouldn't have had to go through any of that and I hope that we as a society, get our act together and really understand that we need to take care of each other and showing up and how important showing up for each other is, because you have also showed up for me. This has not been an entirely one-sided thing, though that might seem how the narrative rolls, but like we all have to be there for one another in this and I don't know, I guess what. As we're kind of wrapping up and thank you again because I know, this is so much um, what are some things you wish folks knew, whether folks experiencing or just like community.
Speaker 3:Folks knew about homelessness, like, how would you wish more people showed up in the work or just in community?
Speaker 2:just that people need to realize how huge the homeless population is, because I don't think the average person knows that and I certainly never knew that until it happened to me and I think if they knew how bad the situation was, at least I hope that more people would help, that they at the very least would do some type of volunteer work.
Speaker 2:I mean, I know for me at the shelter, just to have different groups come in once in a while and bring us dinner and to have a hot meal for a change was the greatest thing and I wish that I personally could afford to do that, to go to a shelter and help them, give somebody a meal. But even more than that, if they see a homeless person on the street, don't just automatically think you know that they brought that on for themselves. They need to know that. Yes, some people do bring it on themselves, but there are those like myself who have no control over what happens, how it happens, and we all just need a little help. And if somebody, if one person, thought that and got a group together and could help more people, at least in the very least. The city needs more actual shelter space and I don't know, somebody just needs to start helping everyone, and it's not going to be just one person. It's going to have to be a large group of people that can help, because just individuals can't do it.
Speaker 3:It takes a community to raise a community and to support a community.
Speaker 2:Yep to raise a community and to support a community, Yep.
Speaker 3:Is there anything other parting thoughts you want to share? I know, I don't know.
Speaker 2:Just that, whatever, don't give up hope, because there's always hope, because for me, that was the hardest thing was to not give up hope. Just think the whole situation is hopeless. I mean, yes, I did think that and yes, it wasn't just the one time when I thought about harming myself, but I think, because of all that, I'm now a stronger person and that's what everybody needs a chance to be.
Speaker 3:Thank you so much. You're welcome, glad to be. Thank you so much, you're welcome, glad to be here with you.
Speaker 1:Elliot, thank you so much for, first of all, the part you've played in Nancy's life and it's obvious she's played a big part in your life as well and as listeners of Homeward Indie, we're very thankful that you brought this story of Nancy to us. Anything you want to share as we wrap it up here?
Speaker 3:I think Nancy said it best when she said don't give up hope. I think that goes for all of us. I think a lot of us need that reminder. I want to thank you, steve, for all of your work on this and making this podcast happen. It's been an amazing couple of years and I want to thank every single person who's out there listening and doing their best and getting through the day. Thank all of you for joining us on the journey homeward.