Grief, Presence, and Creativity with Nicole Harp, Animal Communicator & Soul Painter

In this week's episode, Nicole Harp and I share our experiences with grief in the context of Nicole taking care of her mother who passed away from dementia last year and receiving my son's diagnosis of autism. We discuss what helped us process our grief, such as working with resistance, using mindful presence, and relying on our intuition to know that there is magic and beauty available in the darkest of times. Enjoy and much love, Kristen

Show Notes:

Nicole mentions her mentor, psychic and medium Sherrie Dillard. Learn more about her work and services at sherriedillard.com
David Kessler is a notable expert in grief. You can access his offerings at www.grief.com
Sandra Ingerman and Renee Baribeau host The Shamans Cave podcast
Learn more about spirit art from Anne-Marie Bond at The Portrait of Spirit

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Learn more about Kristen O'Meara here

Sign up for Kristen's newsletter, Spiritual Caregiving. The first edition is out in September! She has wonderful offerings for caregivers of children/teens/adults with special needs/disabilities.

The intro song “To Meet the Light” and outro song “Where the Light Is” by lemonmusicstudio

Transcript

Kristen O'Meara: 0:44

Hello everyone. And welcome to intuition talks. I am Kristen O'Mara and I am here with my lovely, lovely, lovely friend, Nicole Harp. Nicole, how are you? How are you? I am lovely today on this lovely Thursday. And it's you're going through heat wave. Is it like, yeah, well, I don't know you're in California. I'm in Norfolk, Virginia. It's 94 here. So that is, that's hot. My plants are looking a little droopy. Oh my gosh, it's warm. It's early for that kind of heat. It really is, poor planet. Oh, well, you know, Nicole, we've talked several times on Intuition Talks, and I want to make sure everyone knows who you are and all of the amazing things you do. So, why don't you just share a little bit with us. Well, thank you. Um, thanks for having me on. Um, always a pleasure. Uh, I, um, I read energy. So that's really simple. I'm an animal communicator, professional animal communicator. Um, and I paint souls. So I read energy, a person or being essence energy and paint, um, An abstract form that essence, um, so they're being, um, there's this one example behind you. Yes. I'm awesome. Actually, I'll just move the camera a little bit. So this is Austin's. over here, and this is mine. And everyone is so uniquely different as your eye color, your personality, your voice, your paw print. They're all so different. Yeah. As we are. And, um, then, then, uh, spirit, uh, sends me some words to kind of, because it is an abstract painting to help you understand, uh, what, um, soul's trying to express with the colors that I, and images and lines that I. Uh, channel. And so spirit sends, uh, uh, uh, writing, uh, words in a poetic form. Uh, that's how it comes out. And, um, that goes with the painting. So, And they're so beautiful to the one that you, that came through to you for Austin and myself was so validating. It was so spot on and it described Austin perfectly. It was just, it was very, it's a very validating, beautiful experience to have. This piece of our pieces of artwork because it, it resonates on a soul and a heart level. And You also get to see a glimpse of something that I believe is something that you obviously are seeing inside of us or outside of us, whatever that energy is, but that we don't see, you know, we're, we're in front of the mirror, we're getting dressed, but to have these pieces of soul art. Around you really, it helps change your perspective. It helps change your, you know, your perceptions of yourself and it opens your heart. It really does. And it, it energetically, it shifts the energy in the room, which I was really surprised when I hung them up, it felt like a different room. It wasn't that it was more beautiful or it was brighter because of the color. It felt different. And art can change the energy in a room for sure. But, um, but Well, what you're saying, first of all, thank you, because they should be healing, and, um, it's interesting to hear, um, uh, Sherry Dillard, she was telling us in the class, uh, she has a soul painting, a large one, and it's, it's a lot larger than that, so it's, it's four foot by six foot, so it's, it's, you know, it is like in your face, so she said it was almost like, um, A revealing almost like she felt on display. Oh, interesting. Yeah, I can see that. Yeah, she kind of felt like she had to get used to it. She was almost like shy about it or, or not, but, uh, Well, like vulnerable maybe. Exposed. I'm sorry. Exposed. That's the one. Yes. Yeah. And so she had to kind of accept that. Oh, that is me. And really what spirit wants us to know really is all remember is those gifts that we come in with right that creativity because the book I'm working on now is on creativity and how we all, um, you know, through intuition can access that. Uh, the elements of ourselves that are so creative, but, but art does it in a way that's, you know, with these, with the colors that resonate, they resonate with our chakras, you know, our auras, um, you know, color is so signifying and it's such a, you know, it's like playing a piano key, right? It all means something, it all, it all has its own stroke and beat. And so, and to see it every day and experience it, because art changes according to the state of mind of the viewer, To experience it every day, you're going to get something different from it every day because you're in a different state every day. So, you know, and I get to bring our abstract art into, into homes and help people understand it. Who really couldn't before, because they're actually looking at their almost a self portrait, right? Right. And I've shared with you that when I've looked at mine in particular, I see something different, you know, a week or two, you know, passes and I'll go, Oh, and I'll relate it back to myself. Um, and I'll go, Oh, that really, that mountain range, that earth, that earth tone, um, it, it means different things to me. So it opens me up to thinking about something, um, different about myself. More self awareness comes from it for sure. Well, thank you because that's beautiful that you said that. I mean, that's, you know, but there's the other thing to have one and never look at it. Right. Or never take the time. And to say, Oh, that's me. Or that's my, you know, and actually I feel I'm just in the process of painting my own and, um, you don't just have one soul painting because really, you know, you're, you evolve and you change. Hopefully you evolve. Hopefully people, hopefully we evolve and we evolve and change. So, um, I did the one and I'm going to, you know, do, do others and have them kind of up there, but it's not what I ever thought it was would be. And, um, You know, I'm just as perplexed. I'm like, Hmm, what do I need to learn from that? I'm not finished with it yet, but it is interesting. I bet. And I really, I mean, I commend you for doing your own because for me, just reading energy, um, in different ways, it's harder, uh, for me to do it for myself. I think when I channel my higher self, it's not, but, but tuning in, um, say in a clairvoyant or psychic way. Um, and I think maybe. With the caveat of, if I'm upset or in fear, it's more challenging. So I can see how this would be a little different where that's not the case when you're painting your soul. But I, I imagine that I'm just curious about your process. Maybe just, I should just ask, do you go into your mind a little bit more when it's your soul painting? Do you, is there more of like, did your ego get in the way or is it as, um, is it similar to doing someone else's? Well, you know, I, I had to, um, You know, I think our ego always tries to sneak in, but I had to kind of work something out when I started, you know, you, you know my story when I started painting those and I was painting like 50, I did that 70 over the summer, 50, or started with 20, and then another 50. They were coming so fast, I really didn't have time to get in my ego. Yeah. I just needed to get them out of me, they were coming so fast. Um, but, um. You know, I try not to be in my head about it because then I'm you're not then you're obviously you're blocking your intuition um, I just have a um I have a a pact a pack if you will with spirit and my studio that when I go in there Um, just like when you say, you know, mother father goddess, you know, we're gonna start your channel or your your session Um, I have a pack that when i'm working that I will not question that I will just let it come and trust what comes so, um When I go in there, I trust, I don't overthink it. Oh, I love that. And so you've created a sacred space where you have an agreement. I do. But you know, my innate knowing of, you know, I went to excellent school for design. So, you know, VC, so my innate knowing and painting being at being an artist for 30 years, Just, you don't, you know, it's just like something you do. You don't talk, Oh, I'm going to use the contrasting colors. That already is working in the back. So then if I can get that working, which I have, you know, mastered with the, with the painting and the trust. So then whatever comes out is I have to accept that may, like, I never thought that I put those colors together and I'm like, Oh, blue for me. Okay. And the minute I start to question is when things don't work out. So, but, um, I love it. An artist in their studio, you know, oh, oh, I love that. That sounds like a great book or a film artist in their studio. But thank you for saying that because um, uh, you know, you're not gonna everybody's not gonna Oh, I love that. Everybody gets something different, but I just love that. Um that you look at it, you know that you oh, yeah Not yeah, there's something on your wall that you actually experience experience On a frequent You know, frequently. Oh, absolutely. Thank you. Oh, you're welcome. Well, today I feel like we're just going to touch on a topic that I feel is, is very deep and very, um, important for both of us. And I have a feeling we're going to have some more conversations, uh, in the future about this topic and it's caregiving. It's, um, something that's very near and dear to my heart, taking care of my son, um, for 17 years. And for any parent or caregiver, whoever you're taking care of is an important aspect of your life. But we're going to be talking about what we've recognized and witnessed through the process that has opened up our minds and our hearts and our intuition. And Nicole, I know, um, that you took care of your mother for, for quite a while. And we both have. You know, stories and interesting, um, an interesting journey, uh, with that. So we won't be able to touch on everything today, but I think it's, it would be nice just to, to introduce this topic and we can continue as we, you know, as we, I think, I think we want to share like how, and everybody's got a way that. Um, you know, we all go through the we all we all go through the rain. Um, it's just how we get there, you know, from one, you know, we're all going to walk through the rain. But how are we going to get there? I mean, we're all going to do it. So I think we're just kind of talking about what, um, um, Allowed us to move through that, um, grace as much grace as we possibly can, um, and presence and love. Uh, I think it's just for us, but, um, I think everybody who's. grief. Um, even, you know, I was thinking you were saying that and I was thinking about our animals, right? Because like, um, you know, I've got Bogart here and he's 50, 15 years, 50, he's 50 now he's 15 years old. He's the world's oldest dog, 50. So he's 15 years old, but I mean, I know it's coming. And so it's just, you know, caregiving for an older animal versus a parent or child. It's the same, right? It's grief. It's, It's acknowledgement. It's loss. It's acceptance. You know, I think there's grief. I feel like if we recognize the cycle of life and and really, um, in our own personal work, come to terms with it as much as we can. And that will probably be lifelong. It helps. It helps to have that and not we were talking earlier before we recorded that. What I've done. in my work, um, my own personal healing work with Austin being diagnosed with autism. And I know you can speak for, for your experience, but I recognize when I was stuck in my grief, I knew I was in a lot of pain, but what really helps me is I was in a meditation class. It was a three year program I was in to learn how to read energy clairvoyantly. And the meditation teacher had a topic for the night, which was about resistance. And I had, I knew about resistance in other ways, but I, when he was talking about resistance, I was like, Oh, I really am resisting accepting. Austin's diagnosis, accepting my, um, experienced caregiving. Um, it's such a high, high level, um, being a single mom, there were, there's so many things, but I was really in resistance to accepting the situation. And it's just like what you said, it's like, we're all going to be in the rain. Like C. S. Lewis said something like we all have a burden, but it really, really, really Something about like, it really, it, it depends on how you carry it. There's, there's something about how, when we bring self awareness to our situations that throughout our life are going to have so many highs and lows, but when we're at a low point, it's so important to bring that mindfulness, that awareness, that present awareness and learn how to recognize where we're in resistance. Right. Um, and I think what you just said, being present, um, opposed to in your head about where, you know, for me, it was, I was just thinking about it today, coming back from work and coming to meet you for the, for the podcast. I was thinking, God, every time I get off that exit, I used to think, sorry, people, I might get like, start to, my voice might get high, but I used to think that would be the time I'm going to go see my mom. And it was always, you always, always dreaded it because. Because it isn't fun, right? Because you are face, you know, facing death. This, my mom had dementia for two years. And you said a long time, but honestly, she was so courageous. She, she left, um, out of the physical form sooner than, like she, it was only like a, well, uh, less than a year in a nursing home and then a year before that. Um, you know, and I, I knew, in fact, the 15th will be a year and I knew a week. We knew, I looked at her, she looked at me a week before she passed, and I knew she was going to do it, but I'm going to backtrack just a minute, but you said, um, we were both, you, you had mentioned to me and I had mentioned to you that I would, we were both on our journey of intuition and opening up, um, trusting our intuition, mediumship, psychic ability, whatever, you know, energy, reading energy, and Um, we were already there, which I think is really huge and important, and I was already thinking about and trying to talk to my mom about it, like, what happens when we leave the physical world? And I think wrapping your head around that, which I, you know, Sherry Dillard's books, um, I'm Still With You was amazing to, it's, it's, it's just, uh, I can't even say enough, um, I can't say enough about Sherry Dillard and, um, I just, she's just the authentic and the real deal. Anyway, and just such an, and the books are so easy to read, but anyway, I was reading that while my mom, already I was thinking about when you pass, you know, us in this physical presence. And then of course, communicating psychically and in, in mediumship with the animals who had passed, it was already there. Right. And I think that was crucial for me being able to get through this is understanding what you said earlier about. what happens and being okay, you know, that, that, that this isn't it, that it's, you know, when we leave the physical form, there's so much more. And I have a relationship with my mother and my family generations. And every morning I meditate, I spoused us too. And we will have sessions where we sit down and we talked to, you know, My spouse lost her parents a year before I lost mine, and we talked to our loved ones, and we get messages we could have never, never known, um, that things that had happened to, I mean, just, it's, um, infinite, the messages you'll get because you're, you're speaking to, um, you know, so, you know, energy that's, that's, um, that's transition. Um, And it's just phenomenal. So I know I'm never, I know she's still with me, and the book I'm Still With You, it's freaking true, they are. And so I think that, even though you don't know until it happens to you, I think just knowing, having a grasp of that, like, you know what? I know Sherry, and I wasn't there yet, but I noticed Sherry saying that, you know, I'm reading this and then it, you know, but I hadn't experienced it yet till like after my mom passed and I'm communicating with her, but just knowing or just having that hopefulness, you know, anyway, I'm no, no, I studying mediumship has. Um, and I mean, really just developing my intuition, learning how to read energy. It kind of just went in stages, learning how to do hands on healing. I was slowly from like 2009 onward. I was slowly waking up to, Oh, I'm more, I had this intellectual knowing, um, I've always believed in God. Um, I've had a difficult relationship with the God that I grew up with in Catholic school and growing up in that way. But, um, But I can't say enough about how important it is to develop our intuition and to learn to be still because that is, I feel like the groundwork to, to anything that we're talking about, um, to know that we're in resistance to know that we're. We're not seeing the whole picture because we've, um, we've been stuck in, and in a,, say a pain picture or a grieving, uh, perhaps too long, which really just means that we've passed like the six month, perhaps a year mark. And we're, we're out of balance. So grief can take years, but there are layers that I think if we have that intuition developed just enough in that stillness, just enough, we can go through these layers. They're not in a, we don't have to be fast about it, but I think we could just, there still has to be some movement, right? We miss, we miss those opportunities. Um, like what you're talking about, like sitting with your spouse and being open to, to communicating. Um, I didn't even know that though, but you talked about being present, like, yeah, you're experiencing every day with Austin, but if you get wrapped up in the diagnosis or the condition or the. Um, what is, then you miss those beautiful. Oh, but I did though for years before. Exactly, right. Yeah. You're exactly where you're supposed to be. You get it when you get it. But yeah, I think, um, the presence is what made me just, um, not miss the whole thing. I feel like we, you know, if you, if you're not present, you miss everything. And then the negativity comes when you're not present. Right. Because it's all the, it's all the, you know, but being present, we can, um, you can be an acceptance. And not even acknowledge, you know, knowing that you're there, but the, the presence allows you to feel allows you to take that time to open your heart and, um, you know, just not miss that moment, those moments, those moments, and the meditation helps with that and stepping, you know, to, to step back and not be reactive. But, uh, that, that's just what got me through it is the presence. And, you know, which, you know. I don't know. You go ahead because now I'm going to, I'm going to get up to here. Yeah. I, I just love, um, when, when I realized I was in resistance, that's when everything changed for me. Um, I saw everything differently. That's when I was able to get into the part of me that is, or acts as a part of me that is really creative and see Austin differently. And I know we're talking about two very different situations, but we're actually not able to see him in a way that I hadn't seen him before. And I, I understood that I was, um, that there was more in, in different creative ways to connect with him that didn't have to do with words because he couldn't have a conversation with me. Absolutely. And with, I would imagine with you, with your mother with dementia, um, yeah, she, she showed me parts of herself that I've always said it before. I mean, she showed me parts of herself that I, that, um, uh, all the pretense came down. Yeah, you went, you know, there's stages of dimension. She went, you know, when she went in fully in, you know, they spent half this time, half the time on the other side and half the time in this world, one foot in each world. And, uh, what, um, she ended up kind of evolving into is just, um, the, the most purest. Um, Being and light that she like, like she came into this world, just this, like, I can, it's like she came full circle. It's like we're all coming around, right? We're all coming around back to 12, we're all coming around to 12 o'clock. It's like she had just, you know, circled the dial and was coming back around to where she, how she came in, which is this beautiful love and light. She was courageous enough to do it. I was lucky enough to be present to not miss it. Yeah. That we, we healed our relationship because she was someone, um, that I had never seen and she made me someone I had never seen and was able to access my true calling. Um, the soul painting. because of this. I mean, and it was just, and what a beautiful way for me to handle my grief. And she was the catalyst for it. And it had been my whole life with my art. Right. Um, she was my, one of my greatest supporters and, and fans. And, um, so she, um, she helped like this, this, the art came through me and all that, that healing came through me through art because of her and witnessing it because we both chose to accept together and, and experience that. And, uh, It's, uh, I've never in my life ever gone through something like that. And, you know, I don't know, it was both our souls agreeing that we're going to do this. Right. That's right. I just see it as like this wonderful, like this, um, incredible gift. Like you both were giving each other these gifts and you had mentioned before and what you may, you know, I want you to be the one to tell the story that you wanted your mother to see a special painting that you made, which really was the beginning of. The soul paintings, right? Uh, uh, her heaven where I painted her heaven? Yes. Uh, yeah, so, well that, so, we were, I was trying, yeah, I was trying to talk to my mom about, um, uh, what happens when you leave the physical, but yeah, so I painted her heaven so that across from her bed she would, um, she would stare off and just, um, you know, I, I don't know where she was, but whether she was, you know, visiting the other side in her family, but I would, I, I saw myself that, but I created, um, just a space of color where she could kind of get lost in that and hung it across from her bed and that, um, Uh, that prompted a soul painting of mother and me and mom are both our souls. To you, I think back, it's almost like a tribute, right? It was almost like kind of going through, you know, our, our lives together and, you know, like looking through pictures. Yes. Yeah, so that was, um, and then that came out so, so easily and fluid and, uh, you know, and I realized that like everything I had been doing up to this moment was, you know, got me to, to where I was, I was exactly where I was supposed to be. And then I painted my, um, my spouse and her mother, and then they just started coming and I painted my dad and me and my dad had passed a couple years before, but they started coming and, um, my way of grieving and while and after. Yeah. Yeah. And what a beautiful way to do it. I mean, I'm, I can't, I can't tell you how lucky I am. So amazing. So courageous to, to do that. And, um, we both, and you know, um, anyway, I don't, well, I, I just, I'm so struck by lucky. I'm sorry. I feel just so it feels so lucky. Oh, and that, I mean, that's incredible. The gratitude and, um, And like you said, the grace, there's so much grace that, that I imagine you experience both of you. And it's, it's really helpful. I think. Um, looking back, um, during my own grieving, which felt like, um, an eternity really years and years and years, um, having that creativity, having that thing, um, to channel, right? Some people will have a journal. Some people will, but there's something about that that I feel like maybe it's, it's movement. Maybe it's exercise. I don't, I don't know. But I feel like heavy emotions. Like grief. I feel like we need that. What, what do you, I mean, you're obviously an artist and a painter and that's what you did, but I feel like there's movement that needs to happen with right. Cause it helps move the emotions. It helps us. There's something so important. Like I know whenever I ride my bike, I'm always going to cry. I'm just going to be like, oh, you know, yeah. Well, you do need to move it through your body, right? That Peter Levine or Vessel van der Kolk, your body keeps a score, but you do have to physically move it through your body, right? So if you could make, um, you know, a beautiful dance or, you know, write or pound on the piano or play some drums, uh, make some art, right? Uh, however you need to do it. I know writing doesn't seem appropriate, does it? Seems almost too calm to, uh, to get it. Right. Yeah. Yeah. I really feel that, um, creativity is, is, uh, I think when, when people think of that and I'm assuming, you know, I don't know, but I, I imagine the first instinct for people who don't think they're creative as well. I don't know how to do that thing. And we really do need to be exposed to different. Forms of creativity to know that's the other thing too. So, and then when we're grieving, the last thing we probably want to do is do one more thing, especially if we're caretaking other people, or we just don't even want to get out of bed. So one thing that I have always loved to do, one of the, the first like art therapy. things that was given to me as a teenager is the pastels. I just loved working with pastels because I could get messy. I could use my fingers. Um, yeah, very tactile. Yeah. Yeah. I just, in clay, I just feel that That's such a great thing. And I imagine for you, and you could share obviously for yourself, how, how did that help you move through the feelings and the emotions of, your mother passing and, um, I'll share that, but then I wanted you to share, tell me how you, um, you know, how, what your outlet was. Um, but, you know, just thinking about that would be so great because you can just, You know, I, I, I, I, I don't like clay, but, um, yeah, I'm just not enough. It's so funny. So I, I teach and it's just so funny. Ms. Harp doesn't like clay. Um, I don't, I can't stand it, but, um, just dries out my hands, but, um, but I'm a beauty person. So, but, um, Working on that first soul painting or souls of you and your mom, did that, Was that a, what was that like for you? Well, um, you know, I think, um, most people you don't even know until you experience it. So, um, uh, it was, uh, cathartic. It was, um, it was an emergence of another aspect of me. Yeah, just waiting to kind of emerge. Um, and it's still coming. And I think I thought, well, oh, you know, now that this is it's because like I said, it'll be a year and next Wednesday, a year from this week, a week from today, it'll be a year. And I thought, Whoa, is that it? Is that all I'm and I was like, and I like say to myself, this is no, this is where what I'll be doing for a while until I'm not hurt anymore. I mean, I just, I've just begun. And we've just begun. I'm just kidding. Um, but anyway, um, so, uh, but, um, uh, it's the best part of, um, making art and painting. It's the best part of me as an artist, um, to, uh, use my intuition and the channeling and the intuition and to, and to partner that, um, With color. So I'm the translation in the vehicle from soul to canvas. Um, so what is it like? It's like, uh, you know, a kidney candy store. It's, um, you know, you're calling it's a hundred percent in your body. I mean, what is it like? It's like, okay, this is where, this is what I was kind of, Oh, not quite there. But now I'm a hundred percent there. It feels like that. Like, you know, when you're in your flow. Yes. The flow. And, uh, you know, the right side of the brain, unaware sounds around you, um, that, that, uh, our mode of conscious it's like that, right? It's a conscious below, below conscious about, you know, yeah, for me, their time, it doesn't even like, I wouldn't even know it's three hours could pass and I, I don't have a clue. Right. What did you use? What did you use for your, um, the bicycle? Okay. Cool. You said. Wonderful. Well, that's now because I, I know that whenever I'm moving on my bike motions are coming up. Even stuff that I was like, wow, I thought I dealt with this, you know, just the emotions because I'm not a crier. I wish I was, it would be so much easier. My spouse taught me how to cry. Now it's hard to close it off. Yeah. So I have to, you know, I need to get on my bike. And I imagine I always have this like fantasy of people like, Oh, there she is on her bike crying, but, um, for me when I was going through those years of grieving, uh, what, what helped me was gardening, that was my outlet being outside back to nature. I was outside, constantly gardening and probably crying in the dirt, I imagine. Um, and I was. In that clairvoyant training program, learning how to read energy and doing these exercises that were like movement. I was running my, what they call running your energy. So for people who want to know more about this clairvoyant training program, um, Michael Tamora was one of the, teachers that taught The teachers that I was studied under, and he's written several books. One is called you are the answer. He and his wife, Raphael live in Mount Shasta. You can take classes from them. And he has all of these exercises in his book. So running earth energy through my body, through my chakras, Bringing down what they call cosmic energy, running those. So just running this energy was like the movement for me. So doing that for a very long period of time helped. Uh, now I'm really getting into the creativity part, like in a different way. So gardening was that, and now it's, I want to learn more about, about art. So. You showed me some things you've done before that. Um, Yeah. The spirit arc. Yeah. Is it like watercolor or, or some kind of liquid or, yeah, so it's the brush out paint. Um, that's it, yes. Asking, asking spirit, asking, um, for my spirit guides to show images in this paint while I'm tapping it on a wet piece of, uh, watercolor paper. So I just love spirit art. So I think just for folks who are listening. This is such a, a, such a complex topic and there's no real easy way to talk about grief. Everyone experiences it differently. Um, I was certainly flattened by it for years. It took me a long time to figure out what was happening and it didn't matter how much education I had. Cause I had account masters in counseling, but it's just, it's something that we all go through differently. But one thing that I think you and I, Nicole. We're talking about before that we think is so important to shares is to find a way, find simple simple ways to be present, find simple ways to be an observer of ourselves, however we can. Yeah, how can I grasp every single bit of. Emotion or feeling from this moment. Yes. And finding outlets, whether it's a journal, a therapist, um, our, our, our culture is kind of saturated with self help and how to do stuff. Like, I think there's, there are enough resources out there. I haven't read David Kessler's books, but he is a really great guy on grief. Yeah. He worked with Kubler Ross. Yeah. Yeah. Free classes. In fact, Amy did a free online class in a group and there's things you can do follow along, um, group, um, exercise, um, I mean, online exercises you can do. Yes. He's got a podcast. He's such a neat guy. I've only listened to, yeah, I listened to one interview that I was like, Oh, I love him. And then I read, uh, Kubler Ross's books just through graduate school. And then I. I was like, Oh my gosh, the resources are just insane. He's such an amazing person. I haven't read his books, but I do love the fact that he, with his work with Elizabeth Kubler Ross with her five stages of grief, he added another one, which is meaning. And I just, I love that because there is It's not wishful thinking. There is, there are lessons that we can learn, not lessons that have to be hard, but just like we wake up and go, wow, like you said, your relationship with your mom, there was healing that happened. It gave meaning to this really difficult experience.,I think the getting out of your head, not conceptualizing. I think the book, everything is amazing and we're going to, whatever, like works for people, but I think getting out of our head. Yeah. And that's where the creativity comes under the physical action you were talking about and not conceptualizing, but actually putting an action to it. Yeah. Is, is, is the key. Well that creates that creates, I think a space. Yes, a space that we can hold. That's the, what comes to my mind, like when I'm, I'm really in the thick of grief, like I've been in an IEP meeting, and I'm just going back to all this stuff. Um, how can I create a space that can hold something different? And I don't know if that's looking at a beautiful picture or going into the garden or, you know, laughter, humor, something to shift. And that's not emotional or spiritual bypassing. It's just creating an opening. For sure, um, an extension, right? An extension that's, that's not, um, um, where it was before. Right. It's kind of, like you said, if you're moving, allowing it to move through. And I, I just pictured when you said that you drawing. So if you're an IEP meeting, uh, IEP meeting, um, and you just start to draw and I just let, you know, let the lines open up, right. Yeah. It's like visualization, but you're actually physically drawing and you, you can see it. So it's going through you and out your hands. I mean, because that's, what's happening when you're drawing, right. You're, you're taking it in, um, you know, like the white lights going in and it's going on. That's a great, that is a great idea for parents for IEP meetings, right. Bring with them like a beautiful picture, something that really opens their heart. And have that in the meeting and they don't need to share it with whoever they're meeting with, they can just have it right in front of them. They can, or just like a pad of paper and then like, or they can just draw like a window or a sun. Yeah. Or draw anything. Anything. It doesn't have to be something you recognize, you know? Yeah, it could be scribbles. Like, I don't know. Mark making. Right. Yeah. Mark making. Um, yeah. I just saw that when you were talking about that, that would be. But I mean, it's in. Yeah. And, and then it's like getting out of your head about what it has to be. Right. What does it have to be? It has to, you know, um. I think that's what we're, we're, this, I think that's where we're going is changing our, this idea of self care and changing the way. We have to interpret or process and it's whatever. I think that's where the creativity comes in, right? How, what, what is, what feels, and that's trusting yourself and your intuition. And what feels right for you and doing that, right? Yeah. And not worrying about if we look silly or different. And not even being attached to an outcome. Like we, we can just go, Oh, this is going to feel good today. Doing this coloring thing. Like I've got my full coloring books all around. Cause I'm just like, I just want to color. And we don't even need to have like a plan of like, this is going to help me move through my grief. You know? No, I mean, you can't conceptualize. Yeah. You can't get it right. Conceptualize something. That's not, yeah. That doesn't, that doesn't origami into your box. Yeah, for sure. Just getting into, like you said, that I think it's connecting. What feels, what feels right to you, right? If you need to scream, you scream. If you need to make, you know, start singing at top of your lungs, you sing. If you need to run down the street, you run down the street. You know what I mean? What do you need to do? Whatever it is that you need to do, what feels right for you. I think that's what we're going to figure out in the next century. is doing what feels right to us. Um, you know, that's authentic to us. Yeah. Oh, I hate to interrupt. I got super. You're not interrupting me. I'm just, you know, wouldn't it be amazing if it was accepted in our culture to just act like a three year old, like if we needed to, like, Just screaming and just like running down the street. Talking about like, whatever that is, who's, who, I mean, what is someone going to do? Take away your birthday? I mean, you're not, what are you going to, there's no, you know, trouble. You can do whatever you want to do when I see kids, you know, like that, I'd be like, Oh, what a great way to get rid of some energy. Let me do that too. Hold on. I want to have a temper tantrum. Yeah, yeah, exactly. You know, I just like, I, I'll talk to you about off camera, uh, but what I was just thinking, but, um, What I just got. But anyway, I saw, I saw a kid break down at the library and I was like, that looks, you know, I felt, I felt so bad for the child, but I was like, that's gotta be just so nice you know how many able to do that? Yeah. You're like, you should say like, little look, little man. Yeah. Or child. Um, you know how many adults don't have the coping mechanisms that you do, I mean, there's so many You're way ahead of them. Yeah. Um, oh gosh. Oh, I love talking with you. I know you're going to take care of your babies because it's so hot. I just felt like, um, I should add that in my book or that's kind of where we're going is like this idea of, um, uh, that what intuition on what we need, like this idea of self care, what is, Accessible to us like to, you know, to like what we just said, like, that's where I feel like it's going, whatever it takes for you, you know, within reason, you know, no one's going to go on, but, you know, because it will get someone, but you know what I mean, but I mean, this idea of, um, That kind of being so in tune with yourself, like, what do I need? Right, right. You know, I feel like the energies are just, I don't even know what I'm saying because it's coming right now, but like, that's where the energies are gonna be so intense and things are so emotional and it's like, um, you know, what, what do I this moment right now to, or what do I need? Well, that's, that's the thing, right? We, and I think what you're saying is that, and it goes back to just my absolute, the most important thing I've ever learned in my life is developing my intuition. Yeah, it is. I mean that it is. It is getting your freedom back is being free. You don't need outside validation or confirmation, yeah. I tell you that's different from collaboration and you know. Oh yeah. But um, so I think that's maybe what you're talking about is that just knowing ourselves. And it's, it's lifelong because we're always changing and growing. There's always something more to learn. So yeah, that what we thought would make us feel good that at some point, well, we've we're a different person than when we thought. Yeah. And that's why I think it's not just, it's not just a three month class of, I need to learn how to develop my intuition. For me, it's, it's like I said, a lifelong thing, um, because then we can always take care of ourselves. We can self care just by knowing ourselves. I think what's made me feel the least, um, more connected to anything and not so ever, like I'll never be lonely again is communicating with spirit. Yeah. With, um, with, with the other side, mediumship work, which you could have never, I would have never said I'm a medium and I hate, you know, I hate labels, but. One of my gifts is talking to, speaking with animals that have crossed over. That is where my sweet spot is. I just, that's the emotion behind it. And that's kind of what I'm writing, you know, when school stops, I'm going to finish writing about, or not finish, but continue with the book on creativity. Cause it's all about the emotional, a person's emotional needs, like, and that's what I feel like. You know, we're driven emotionally, and that's what, you know, that's what resonates with people. That's what tends to communicate. It's not the conceptual, it's the emotional. And, um, you know, that's where the intuition plays in. And, um, I'll never be lonely again, and I want to spend more time communicating with the other side than I do almost in this world. You know, and it's like, Amy and I are always going, and we're like, you want to go in for a session? Yeah, we go in. And then, you know, I'm lucky enough to have someone to share it with, so we talk about what we experienced, and it's just phenomenal. I mean, I can't put words to it. I want everybody to do this, and I just feel like that's where it's going to go. Um, we're, I don't know where I'm going, but I know that's going to be a part of it, is this, Yes, helping people heal, get to this point where they can heal themselves. I mean, I can heal myself every day if I want, you know, pick a pick something I want to work on, put that out there as a message, ask my guide, ask my higher self, whoever. I mean, it's notebook after notebook, after notebook. That's right. Messages from the collection. And to go back to that, we need to know, we need to develop our intuition and know how to be still to even to do that work. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Oh, yeah. Yeah, it can transcend or, or it can extend to is a better word to the outside world. We can communicate with any life form trees plants. I know. And I know I'm sidetracking a little bit, but I'm, I'm, I've always been drawn to plants. I've gardened for years. It's a big part of my life and animals too, but plants for sure. And when I pick flowers that Ruby Rose, Ruru can eat, I ask, can I pick you? And I get nos. I'm Oh yeah. And then I pick, and if I get a yes, I'll pick a few and then I'll get, that's enough. Yeah. So, you know, and then I, then I go into this thing of like, Oh my gosh, I've been waiting for years. I've been pulling these poor plants out of the, you know, so I I'm very sensitive. So then I start like, Oh my God. So I have to have a balance of, you know, uh, but I think it's all, all life has a form of consciousness and so energy, so we can apply this to, to other forms of life. So if folks are listening, aren't called to communicate with the folks that have passed or spirit guides, we can also look to nature. Oh, that's in, um, I'm, I'm, you were saying flowers and me too, because of the color, but like, I just love trees. I'm just like, uh, yes. I love any, any, any, any, anything with the nervous system and animal wise in any, I love all nature. I mean, it is. And so then, and then you think, now I get into this again, but then you think, you know, well, how can I help the bigger picture because the, the planets and so much, you know, need and anyway, so I don't know if something really helps me about that. And then we'll close. Yeah. I'm listening to just in the last few months, I've been listening to recording anymore. I'm going to blow my nose. Okay. Good. We are recording. Oh, okay. But you're not going to put that on there. I've been listening to, um, the shaman's cave podcast, which I highly recommend. And I had Renee bear about on, um, a few months ago and her co host is Sandra Ingerman. And I. I have just, I've studied with people that she knows, um, Hank Wesselman and Anne Riley to learn how to do shamanic journeying, but I haven't studied with her and I just, I'm so in love with the podcast and I just adore these women. So she speaks on, on one of the episodes about how she is so concerned about the environment, like you said, and worried about the trees. And. These earth beings told her that our presence on earth is like a blip to them and not to be so heavy hearted about what's happening. And it's not to say don't care, but we know how we know how much pain and this is her. revelation. This is her experience. This is what she needed to hear. But for me, I, Nicole, I can't even watch documentaries about animals. I know, because I'm so heartbroken. I can't watch documentaries about the environment because I'm so heartbroken. It's too visceral. It's so much for me. Gut wrenching. Um, so when I heard that, it really gave me some peace. That's good. Yeah. Um, so just something for us to, to explore that podcast is really great. What is it? Shamans, the shamans cave. Okay. I'll check it out. Yeah. They're very, they're wise, wise women. And I just love, I love listening to them. All right. Well, thank you so much. Thank you so much for being here and thank you everyone for listening. Uh, again, this is a very big topic. I mean, grief is a process that some of us will go through for a very long time, but from our experience and I'm sure from those of you who've, who can resonate with what we're saying, there are ways for us to create those openings and, um, it really helps move, move the energy, move the emotions through. There's something beautiful to come from it and there's something so beautiful. Yes. I never ever thought I would get to the point where I could say that my life is, is just perfect. And with Austin and it doesn't matter the challenges anymore. It doesn't matter anymore. Cause of that spiritual, um, presence that's, that, that spiritual trust. Right. I keep talking and we'll be definitely always, always had your back. It will, you know, always taking care of you and it will continue to do so. Yeah. Thank you so much. thank you, everyone. Have a wonderful week. Much love. Thank you.