A Not So Perfect Start: Building Caring Classroom Communities with Author Trudy Ludwig

What if the best start to a school year is not a perfect one, but a caring one? In Episode 203 of the Adventures in Learning podcast, Dr. Diane welcomes back author Trudy Ludwig to talk about her new picture book, A Not So Perfect Start — the first title in her new The Caring Classroom series.

Trudy’s books have long helped children, families, and educators make the invisible visible, exploring topics like big feelings, anxiety, perfectionism, friendship challenges, empathy, belonging, and the courage to try again. On Episode 203, we explore how classrooms become true communities, why mistakes are essential to growth, and how books and play can help children practice the social-emotional skills they need to navigate a complicated world.

In this conversation, Trudy offers practical wisdom for the new school year, including suggestions for empower tools to help children respond to and navigate hurtful behaviors. Her central message is one every child (and grown up) needs to hear. We all want to feel valued, seen, and heard.

Chapters

• 01:42 Making the invisible visible through story
• 02:25 Introducing A Not So Perfect Start and The Caring Classroom
• 04:14 Being in a community vs. being part of one
• 05:49 The SEL needs educators asked Trudy to address
• 08:46 Anxiety, perfectionism, and emotional resilience
• 12:42 Literature, play, and practicing big feelings safely
• 16:41 Trudy’s “empower tools” for responding to hurtful behavior
• 20:59 Bringing A Not So Perfect Start into schools this year
• 22:11 Resources for creating a caring classroom community
• 25:34 When students write the next chapter
• 28:31 Why kids are bringing Trudy hope

Why listen

• Discover why A Not So Perfect Start is a timely read-aloud for preschool and early elementary students.
• Learn how stories can help children build emotional vocabulary, resilience, and a stronger sense of belonging.
• Hear practical ideas for using picture books, role-play, story walks, and student-created sequels to make social-emotional learning active and meaningful.
• Take away Trudy’s age-appropriate “empower tools” for responding to rudeness, meanness, and bullying.

Links and resources

• Listen to Trudy Ludwig’s first appearance on Episode 8 of the Adventures in Learning podcast
• Purchase A Not So Perfect Start and check out Trudy's catalog of books
• Find classroom activities and lesson plans for Trudy’s books
• Visit Trudy Ludwig’s website

Call to action

Start the school year by choosing care over perfection. Read A Not So Perfect Start with your students or family, then invite children to talk about the moments when they feel worried about making mistakes. Make space for them to name big feelings, practice an “empower tool,” create a class community agreement, or write the next chapter for one of Trudy’s characters.

A caring classroom is not a room where everything goes perfectly. It is a place where every child knows that mistakes are part of learning, and that they belong while they figure things out.

Transcript

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SPEAKER_00 0:00

Welcome to the Adventures in Learning Podcast. I am thrilled to welcome back one of the very first guests we had on the podcast. Trudy Ludwig is an incredible author. She really has a sense of empathy, of knowing what kids and educators and families need to know to be able to be their best selves in this world. I use her books all the time when I'm out on the road helping to build connections. Her books work really well with Steve Spangler's Energy Stick. And I'm so thrilled to be able to welcome her back to talk about her brand new series and her newest picture book, A Not So Perfect Start. Wonder, Curiosity, Connection. Where will your adventures take you? I'm Dr. Diane, and thank you for joining me on today's episode of Adventures in Learning. Trudy, welcome to the show. Thank you. It's an honor to be here. Oh, I am so happy to have you here. I have to tell you, your books really do work so well for STEM and STEAM. And I think we talked about this when you were first on the show. But I've found that the power of one, which I see you have behind you, the invisible boy, they work so well when people are thinking about how do I build connections? And then you build it into creating a circuit. And next thing you know, you've got all the teachers in the room holding onto an energy stick and thinking about how do I help my kids feel like they're visible. So what I wanted to start with is how is it that you are able to find the words to make the invisible scene?

SPEAKER_01 1:42

I think what it is is trying to come up with a story that kids can really connect with the characters in the story and their thoughts and feelings and what's going on. And I'm also hoping that it helps to connect readers with other readers, actually. I think it's really important for kids to see themselves and can relate to the characters in the story. So I try to instill in my stories an age-appropriate voice, an authentic voice that kids can relate to.

SPEAKER_00 2:18

Well, and I think that definitely comes across. And I'm wondering, can you share a little bit about the brand new series with us? Oh, yes. I'm very, very excited.

SPEAKER_01 2:27

I actually have the book here. I'm going to hold it up so you can see. Here's the book. So when I was asked by my publisher, you know, to work on a picture book series for little ones, uh, preschoolers to grade two, I initially reached out to social emotional learning experts, librarians, and lower elementary educators to ask for their wish list of what are the kinds of picture books that they still need to fill that resource gap to help them address the common issues they see occurring in those classrooms. And so I got their wish list back, and there were common themes or issues that kept cropping up among the feedback that I got. And so I picked the top three to focus on with the approval of my editor. And so the first book of the caring classroom is basically start of school. It's introducing the classroom, it's introducing the kind and cary teacher, Ms. Howard. And I got to create the students, which was really fun, and plant the seeds and their behaviors for upcoming books. So you get a little sneak of maybe what the next books will be be about. And so what I wanted to do is have an umbrella term for a community because classrooms are microcommunities, actually. And so I love this. There's this quote, a saying that said, being in a community is not the same as being a part of the community. So I wanted to have something that shows what being in a community is like. And I thought this would be the perfect vehicle for it. So feeling valued, feeling seen, having a voice. And that's when I came up with the term, the caring classroom for the series.

SPEAKER_00 4:13

And you just said something that really resonated with me because you talked about the difference between being in a community and being part of a community. And I know we were talking a little bit about this before we came on air that I moved to New Hampshire a year ago. And while I may be in a community, I'm not yet part of it because it takes time. How do you help kids understand that difference and what they need to do to actually be part of a community?

SPEAKER_01 4:42

I think part of that is paying more attention to the people around you and seeing what their strengths, their weaknesses are. We all have strengths and weaknesses. And as in this first book, that we feel like if we don't come across perfect, or if we make mistakes, we won't get the approval of our friends or our peers. And, you know, we're all, we're all struggling, right? And just because you make mistakes, that's not who you are. And actually, mistakes lead to growth. And I love this quote that is shared in a book I'm just starting to read called Becoming the Bison. And it's talking about uh social and emotional learning. And what the author said is that growth does not come with comfort. If you're comfortable, there's no growth involved. And I it really resonated with me. And so I wanted to show that in the story where there are problems that these kids need to address and try to overcome as best as they can. And to me, that's the bottom line for emotional resilience, right?

SPEAKER_00 5:49

That makes a lot of sense. And I'm curious about the wish list, you know, because we have a lot of early childhood educators, elementary school teachers, and families who are listening to this. What were some of sort of the top issues that emerged as you were talking to people?

SPEAKER_01 6:02

Well, for this age group was big feelings in how to manage them, identifying big feelings, uh, naming them. I love what this one teacher shared with me when I had done another podcast on literacy. They said kids can't understand emotions or manage their emotions until they have the emotional vocabulary. And I thought, wow, that was really powerful, really hit me hard. So what I tried to do is name some, you know, big emotions in the first book. Perfectionism, with kids are scared of making mistakes. Um, they're scared that if they do something wrong, their peer or their the the adult in their world won't approve them or or or love them or like them enough, right? Another big thing is tattling versus reporting, which is going to be my next book that comes out. And what I wanted to show is in my books, I want to show growth mindset, how we are more than our labels and little things can help us evolve, right? And be become more resilient. So that's a big one. Another one that I've been working on, which was really interesting, is I have already written a book, sorry. This was here we go, this book here, sorry. And my editor said, you know, it's okay if the teachers and SEL experts want you to address that same topic, but at a lower grade level. And apologies was one of the big ones too, is kids are saying sorry, or I'm, you know, I'm sorry, or they don't want to say sorry for something. And how do you show kids what it means to do a heartfelt apology for big and little hurts? So those are the top three. You know, other parts were kids that get distracted very easily. And I included that with the personality of the character. So I I co-mingled some of these issues together with the boy who's like a bull in a china shop. You know, he doesn't think before he he moves. He's got a kind heart, a kind and caring heart. But sometimes he doesn't realize what he does. And he just figures if he just says sorry, that's that's all he needs to do. So that's what I'm trying to do is show these personalities with, you know, it may not just be one big thing that I'm showing. There's some other little things going on in the background, right? With kids and their personalities.

SPEAKER_00 8:25

Well, and that makes sense because we don't live in isolation. Like none of these issues take place on their own. And if you're talking about a community, you're gonna have perfectionism that's side by side with the distracted child, with the bull in the china shop, with the inability to say I'm sorry. All of that coexists in the same space.

SPEAKER_01 8:46

And then the other part too is anxiety was another big issue. It's been skyrocketing. And it wasn't just uh since the pandemic, the pandemic pretty much turbo boosted anxiety levels with kids. And so the first book that I had done to address anxiety was I I have my collection of books here, so I can't. I'm glad you have yours because as I told you, mine just got shipped back. Brave every day and anxiety. And so when I write on the topics, I actually research on that issue. I read the books and articles by experts on what they recommend, what they don't recommend. And so that helps me, you know, frame things. But then I also look at my own inner child. A lot of times, authors, when we write, we write to solve problems for ourselves in some way, right? And, you know, I have an anxious personality, my kids have anxious personalities. So I really had to think hard on, you know, where do my anxieties lie? And can I put them in categories, which I realized they were in three categories, the what if I can't, and I'm scared category. So that really helped me to frame my story. And then with the care caring classroom series, I got to revisit anxiety, but from the perspective of a perfectionist, you know. So again, that's that background going on with the perfectionism. So it's not, as I had said before, it's not just one particular issue. There's this overlap. So you can see how it can play out with a personality.

SPEAKER_00 10:23

That makes a lot of sense to me. You know, and I think about the many kids that I've taught. And you're right, anxiety is huge. And it's not just with our littles. I mean, it kind of takes its way all the way up the scale, whether you're, you know, 18 months old, eight years old, 28, 58, 78, it feels like it's just exploding in our society. And I think that the more we can do to be able to help people through that and figure out how do we have resilience, which I think is one of your favorite words. How do we help people find the resilience to live through anxiety and live with it?

SPEAKER_01 11:02

Right. I think as I share with parents and educators when I do adult workshops, you know, I just we love, we'd love to get rid of all the hurt in our kids' world, but we're not going to. Let's be realistic. And I let the kids know this as well in my presentations with them. I said, but what caring grown-ups are really good at doing is helping us get through the hurt. That's what it's all about, helping us get through that hurt and how we manage to. We may not, we're not going to get rid of a child's anxiety. That's not realistic. And I try to be more realistic with my stories. I don't want to say, poof, like magic, if you do this, it disappears. Right. What I'm trying to do is put it in a perspective where I'm not pathologizing it. I'm not writing clinical books. I'm just talking about, you know, we all have anxiety to some degree at some level, some more than others, you know, and that requires professional help. But the anxiety that we're all living in in these times, you know, really, I don't like using the cliche unprecedented times. I mean, throughout history, there's always been anxiety and then trauma, you know, ever since humans have been around, right? The problem is 24-7 access to all this information for kids. And the kids are sponges, they're picking up on the anxiety levels of the parents in the world, the caregivers and educators. You know, they can see what's going on. And, you know, social media feeds into it a bit more. So it's it's nonstop for these kids. So that's where I'm trying to figure out how I can help them just manage a little bit better and see that they're not alone and that there's nothing wrong with them. This is very normal to feel these feelings.

SPEAKER_00 12:42

I think that makes a lot of sense. And as you're talking, I'm sort of thinking about the different ways that I know I've paired your books, and I think other educators have as well, with the idea of learning through play. Right. Because I think that that's part of helping kids be able to cope with these big feelings, being able to work things out is through their play and giving them opportunities to play. And often that kind of goes to the sideline as soon as we hit the swinging doors of kindergarten. It used to be that play was a much longer process. And it's kind of like, oh, now you're in school, time to play is over. And that's such a critical part of how kids process and make mistakes and try things out and figure it out. And I'm wondering, you know, are there ways that we can use literature in a meaningful way to encourage play as kids get older too?

SPEAKER_01 13:38

Absolutely. I think that books are wonderful supplemental tools with adult-guided activities to do play and to engage with one another and problem solve in safe social and learning situations, right? At home and such. You know, they're also very proactive because, uh, for example, with my books on bullying, the child may not be experiencing it right away, but it gives them an opportunity to see what's going on. If they're not on the receiving end, they're likely to be on the bystander end to see what's going on and to empower those kids to know what they can do without risking their own safety. So it's a way to try on different problem solving techniques. And they can do it in in, for example, in classrooms, they could do plays or performances. I do a lot of role play with the kids in activities where I know this sounds kind of weird, but in my school assemblies, I invite kids to come up, insult me, you know, say mean things to me. And then I role play, I have these little toy tools, you know, power tools. I call them the empower tools. And I associate a particular skill with that tool. And so, and I make the kids repeat what that skill is every time I use that tool. I go through my whole host of starter tools to show how we can respond without being hurtful back when somebody says something hurtful so that we can break that learning cycle that we have of, you know, bullying. Oh, I like that.

SPEAKER_00 15:09

Imagine a space where curiosity drives innovation, where empathy fuels collaboration, and where learning feels less like a task and more like an adventure. My message isn't about adding more to your plate, it's about changing how you see the plate entirely. I'm Dr. Diane Jackson Schnorr, and through the power of purposeful play, I equip leaders, educators, and organizations with the tools you need to unlock creative problem solving, deepen human connection, and build resistant ecosystems of empathy and innovation. Attendees will walk away not just inspired but empowered, with immediately usable strategies to spark curiosity in teams, to lead with empathy, and to infuse learning into their everyday cultures. You'll learn how play isn't child's work, it's the secret weapon of the world's most effective leaders and change makers. This is not a feel-good talk that fades by Monday morning, it's a movement. A shift in how we engage people, solve problems, and lead meaningful change. My talks and workshops are shaped by decades of experience in education and a transformative message that connects across sectors. Whether your audience is corporate, educational, or nonprofit, they'll leave ready to rethink what's possible, both personally and professionally. Because when we learn and lead through play, we don't just change organizations, we change the world. Check it out at drdianeadventures.com. So, what would be some of the power tools that you would encourage kids and teachers to employ or impact tools?

SPEAKER_01 16:48

Well, what I do is I show that in the book Concessions of a Former Bully. I actually wrote this book because I wanted to give the crux of my presentations with kids in this book for schools that can't afford to have a visiting author, or also as a point of reference after my visits so they can refer to it. Because I don't like to think of myself as a one-stop shop when you're addressing a particular issue. I think of myself more as a springboard, you know, so that they can promote character growth and social emotional learning throughout the academic year. But in this, I also have my empower tools. So what I usually do, I break it down so it's age appropriate. So for kindergarten through second grade, they start out with six starter tools. One is a very basic one. And what I explain to kids is sometimes they work and sometimes they don't. And some become less effective as you get older. But they're important life skills to learn to have boundaries. And if a tool doesn't work, you need to switch to another tool. For example, the basic tool for everyone is the stop tool, right? Cut it out, you know, stop it. And I tell the kids, if the kid who's saying something hurtful apologizes after they say it, that's when you know they're being rude. That's not bullying. If they stop but they don't apologize, that's no when they're being mean. But if they don't stop, that's when you know they're bullying. So I would switch to another tool. So for me, the stop tool, and I explain to the kids, it helps me under understand whether when somebody's saying something, are they being rude, mean, or are they bullying me? So that helps. Another one that's very effective is asking the question, why? You know, somebody says, Well, you're old. Why do you think I'm old? Because you have wrinkles. Why do you think old people have wrinkles? And saying it calmly, and it just distracts the kid, right? This is what we're doing to change, change the dance step, so to speak. Another one would be a get away. This is not the same thing as ignore it. Ignore it means you're still physically in the presence of the person who's saying hurtful things. When I walk away, I'm physically removing myself from that situation if I can, and then go to a safe space with peers who could be allies or grown-up I can report to, pay attention to who the witnesses are, and I let kids know chances are if they're saying hurtful things to you, look and see if they're saying hurtful things to other people. It's nothing personal, it has everything to do with them and not with you, right? So then you can be an upstander to some other kid that you know that's having the same issue. Another one is like when they say you're old, just one word, just very neutral, like so, whatever, who cares? And your point is, you know, just say it very calmly because kids who are hurtful, they're trying to push your buttons. They want to make you mad, sad, or scared. They want to take your power and friends away. So don't let them see that your buttons are being pushed. That's a big thing, because they're not getting what they want out of it. And then we have change the subject, distract the kid by talking about something else. You know, grown-ups and kids, we love talking about ourselves. So, you know, bring up some questions, you know, or compliment them on something. Another tool that's really effective, and kids really love when I do this role play is when somebody says something hurtful, like you're old, I just I'm gonna do an old lady dance and I just act so goofy and I explain to them, and it's really hard when the kid is seeing that, it's hard for them to be hurtful when they're laughing and smiling, right? And it's I explain to the kids, it's humor in a harmless way. If you have to put someone down to build yourself up, you're crossing the line into bullying. So humor in a harmless way. And actually, that tool is often used in high school students because it's a very safe way to distract a person and a playful way to distract. So those are some of them. There are more that I have, but these are starter tools. I share with the teachers, you know, have the kids come up with more tools to add to your tool belt. I asked the teachers to make posters of the tools to remind them for the kids to use them on the playground because most of this hurtful behavior occurs on the playground and it trickles back into the classroom, right? So this is part of emotional resilience building.

SPEAKER_00 20:59

Oh, I like that. Now, with a not so perfect start, I know that it came out in June and you have been traveling all summer, sort of sharing the book. As we approach the start of the new school year, do you have more plans to be in more classrooms? How are we getting this book into the hands of the educators who need it?

SPEAKER_01 21:19

Well, I just came back from a literacy love festival. Love it in Naperville, Illinois, uh, hosted by Anderson's Books, which is a great indie bookstore, and sponsored by some publishers. And so there were 22 authors, graphic novelists, illustrators that were there to work not only with educators and share our new books, our new releases, and also our backlists, but we also got to work with kids too and to promote literacy and the love of writing. I do have school visits coming this fall, and I also present at national conferences like. The National Council for Teachers of English. You know, I try to go to the conferences just to get, you know, access and also with school counselors and social emotional learning experts.

SPEAKER_00 22:11

That's wonderful. And as I'm thinking about the book and sort of thinking about getting this out to people, what would be some of the things you would suggest for setting up a caring classroom community as teachers are prepping for their new school year?

SPEAKER_01 22:26

I think that there are some great resources that educators can use as a reference. If there are particular stories that the teachers really love to use, I would ask them to do a search, use their search engine, their favorite search engine, and then type in in the search bar the title of the book that they're going to use with the class, and then follow it by lesson plans or activities. So there are so many ready-made lesson plans and activities that are out there that have been done by school counselors and also been done by other educators. So you don't have to reinvent the wheel with those activities to have with kids. There are wonderful books like Bianca Schultz's 101 books to read before you grow up, which also has information and talks about what you can do with. You also have a John Shu with a forward by Catherine Applegate, The Gift of Story and the Importance of Story with Empathy. There's, I must have left it at one of the conferences, but Joelyn McCarthy has layers of learning, which is wonderful because she has the books and what you can do with the book. So, you know, you don't have to waste your time trying to come up with something new.

SPEAKER_00 23:42

It's already there for you. Exactly. And I would even add to that, if you haven't done it already, subscribe to the 365-day picture book calendar that I've put out for you as well. Because each day you get a different picture book. You get questions that are designed to build inquiry and empathy, and you get ideas for a STEM Steam extension you can do at home or at school for free.

SPEAKER_01 24:06

That's right. And also check the authors' websites. You know, a lot of authors just add to their websites resources with activities and lesson plans.

SPEAKER_00 24:15

I have that on my website. I know, and yours are amazing. I have used them before, and it's just chock full of goodness.

SPEAKER_01 24:21

Yes, as well as a lot of my books come with ready-made lesson plans too, you know. So this is a new book I wanted to share too that was came my way. I think I mentioned this to you earlier when we were just catching up. Yeah. It's called Becoming the Bison Becoming the Bison. And it's a new book by Kim Gamarose. And it's about uh the future of education and social emotional learning and how she's really working to help teachers really focus in on managing the classroom better and managing it, how we react to things that are going on in the classroom. It's really very well done. And but anyway, so this this is a new book. I'm still I'm about halfway through, but I think it's a really good uplifting way of like we can deal with things even when things are so crazy as educators type thing.

SPEAKER_00 25:16

Oh, those are some great recommendations. And I know you've got a long history of doing sort of those class visits and building those connections with educators. So I imagine you've got some really cool things that people have done with your books over the years. Are there any favorites that you want to share with us? I can share a recent favorite, which is really cool.

SPEAKER_01 25:38

So there is a teacher, Mrs. Zimmerman, and this was, I think, in Virginia, I think Frederick Douglass Elementary School. And she worked with the boys group. And the boys were reading my book, Sorry. And um, she said they really were asking, Have you done a sequel? I said, No, I haven't done a sequel. And the boys wanted to do a sequel to find out what happened with the main protagonist and his friends. And I said, Sure, you're more than welcome to do a sequel. So she got a grant to work with the kids to for them to create their own story. They were the illustrators and the writers for this amazing book. It's called I'm Sorry for Real This Time. And they have Charlie, the character who was the kid that was not making good decisions, and how he really started to work through what an apology really means. And so they dedicated this book also to me and to other kids. And it was done by fourth grade boys group, and then they became fifth grade boys, and they were there too as the advisory for the next group. And so the grant allowed them to publish this hardbound book and distribute it in their school district to the other elementary school classrooms and to the school libraries. Oh, that's a good idea. I thought that was so cool. So well done. And the book is not only in English, but it's also in Spanish. That's it. So it has the English story and then the Spanish underneath.

SPEAKER_00 27:14

Oh, I love that. And knowing Frederick Douglass Elementary, they I actually do know that school. You know, they are an immersion classroom. And so they're they're dual language. And I love the fact that they took the story and really immersed the kids in creating the outcome. Yeah. That's one of the most powerful things we can do with a book is to allow kids to take it on and make it their own.

SPEAKER_01 27:37

Exactly. And so it gives them a sense of um accomplishment doing something like that. So that's another activity that I recommend for teachers to do is have the kids create their own books and then read it to the younger kids. The upper grades could do that, right? Absolutely. The other thing is I've seen high school students, they, well, the high school, they did a story walk for the power of one, which I don't know where it is. Yeah, I see it right behind you actually. Behind me, the power of one. They did story walks where they created with uh QR codes so kids and adults who work with the kids could, you know, focus it on the QR code to find out what's going on. And then they did that as the capstone senior thesis project because they had they had two elementary schools sharing a forest walk in between and they made it in the forest walk for the kids.

SPEAKER_00 28:31

Oh, I love that. You know, there's so many ways to bring a book to life, and it's just creating that time and space for kids to engage and to be able to use their empathy to build those outcomes. Um which kind of takes me to my last question for today. What's currently bringing you hope?

SPEAKER_01 28:50

Kids, the kids are bringing me hope. They're honest, they're caring. It's a shame that, you know, media we were talking about that really focuses on fear to get attention. But in my travels around the country and talking with kids, you know, remotely around the world, they're they're decent, they're kind, they're caring. They're not just our future, they're our present, right? And so I have so much faith that they can do better and be better than a lot of the poor adult role modeling going on in this world, right? So they give me hope. This is why I do what I do, you know. I'm trying to find resources or create resources that weren't around when I was a kid or that I wish my kids had, you know, at the time that they were going through it. You know, we we all have different stories, but we have the same heart. And that's what I want to do is go beyond labeling, you know, race or ethnicity. Take that out. But inside, we all want to feel valued, be seen, and have our voice heard.

SPEAKER_00 29:55

That makes so much sense. And that brings me hope as well. Trudy Ludwig, thank you for joining us on the Adventures in Podcast. Adventures in I'm gonna try that again because I just blew my own podcast name. Um, so we'll go back to that. That gives me hope as well. Trudy Ludwig, thank you for joining us on the Adventures in Learning Podcast. If you're listening, I encourage you to run out and get a not so perfect start so that you can maybe have a perfect start to your school year. Thank you for joining us today.

SPEAKER_01 30:25

Truly my pleasure. Thank you, Diane.

SPEAKER_00 30:28

You've been listening to the Adventures in Learning Podcast with your host, Dr. Diane. If you like what you're hearing, please subscribe, download, and let us know what you think, and please tell a friend. If you want the full show notes and the pictures, please go to drdianeadventures.com. We look forward to you joining us on our next adventure.