212 - Bears, Dogs, Being Bored, Being Frustrated

Jack, Joey, and Lynne catch up on their summers, and each drops listeners one "tid-bit" of spiritual wisdom. Joey's summer included a bear encounter and getting chased twice by large dogs. Also up for discussion: is good customer service dying? Is boredom a thing of the past — and is that a bad thing? They dig into some surprising stats on how parents' obsession with keeping kids "safe" might be quietly hurting their mental health, and talk honestly about why Christians sometimes struggle to honor other people's journeys — landing on a simple, uncomfortable answer: it might just be a lack of love. Plus, some real talk on trusting your car's AI more than you probably should.

Hosts | Jack Hoey III | Lynne Stroy | Joey Svendsen  

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Producer/Editor/host: Joey Svendsen
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Transcript

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SPEAKER_05 0:00

I just wanted to make sure people were clear.

SPEAKER_01 0:02

It's been a while since we've done one of these.

SPEAKER_05 0:04

Don't you think that was a necessary qualifier? I said, your future one? That sounds silly. Well, of course it's your future one. You haven't started it yet.

SPEAKER_01 0:13

Sometimes there are people in my life who, if they would just let me finish what I was saying, all of the questions would have been answered.

SPEAKER_04 0:21

I don't know who that would be anything.

SPEAKER_01 0:24

So I'm gonna back all the way up to the first question you asked me, and then we'll maybe tackle the other one. What's your favorite beach? I hate you so much.

SPEAKER_02 0:34

Um sorry, Jack.

SPEAKER_04 0:42

I'm interested. I mean you are interested, but you're not sorry. I mean, if it hurts your feelings, I'd be telling me.

SPEAKER_01 0:55

Continue. With what?

SPEAKER_08 0:57

With what? The riding trip. Alright. You are about to listen to an episode that includes talk about a bear site, when you might need to kick a dog to keep safe, new cars, three bits of spiritual advice, whether good customer service is becoming extinct, the value of sitting in silence, the unlikelihood of a child kidnapping, how today's parents' obsession with safety is a disservice to their kids, how no one is ever truly safe, and why that's no reason to be afraid. And a story that shows how many Christians forget what love is when they talk on social media. Enjoy! Just because I don't believe or agree doesn't mean I can't learn from you.

SPEAKER_01 1:34

Once again, this past weekend, someone has approached us in the breeze with just making sure that we do actually like each other.

SPEAKER_02 1:41

The masses they were always there. It's just a great. Actually, my first time in a pool was uh in between high school and middle school summer camp when all the kids were gone. The adults went to the pool. It was really sad to be like this is this two hours that we have as a break is my first time in water. But it's fine.

SPEAKER_05 3:20

Yeah, yeah. And you take tell people you take a writing trip every year. For the last few years, yeah. And you just write every day for hours, like eight hours a day. And are you writing for your sub stack? So it's called Matter at Hand, by the way.

SPEAKER_01 3:35

Yeah, matter at hand.com. Um, I've got another one that I'm trying to um I've got all ready to go. Yeah, yeah. I've just got I've just got to kind of like about the future. I won't, yeah.

SPEAKER_05 3:45

Of course it's in the future because you haven't done it yet.

SPEAKER_01 3:48

I go, uh uh this is the fourth year I've done it, and basically I always go up with some projects that I want to work on. And I've kind of got my my schedule, which is exciting for me. Um, I don't know if anyone else feels this way, but like it's actually kind of really nice to have a schedule and be able to follow it um and not, you know, kind of be like, well, there are two things I'm doing today, and whatever happens in between those, I guess we'll see. Um and so it's but yeah, I mean, I set aside eight hours a day for writing. You know, anyone who writes and I was like, you're you're not writing for all of that time. Um, there is definitely a lot of time where I sit and stare and try to figure things out. Um, but it's always really productive. This year I wound up with really I worked on three things, and uh I ended up writing about 30,000 words.

SPEAKER_05 4:36

Dang. So and will most of this be on your substack?

SPEAKER_01 4:40

No, almost none of it will be on the substack.

SPEAKER_05 4:42

So this is writing for Jack that the world will never see? No. This is a book?

SPEAKER_01 4:47

Yes.

SPEAKER_05 4:47

Okay, gotcha. You don't have to go any further.

SPEAKER_01 4:50

Two books.

SPEAKER_05 4:50

Nice.

SPEAKER_01 4:51

So one is one is in the editing phase and one I just started uh when I was up there. Very cool.

SPEAKER_05 4:57

So very cool. Well, y'all, I I feel like talking like this is in my DNA. I really love the podcast, and I've taken a break from all of my podcasts, so there's so much stuff that I want to talk to you guys about, and I know y'all are gonna make fun of me for a lot of the subject areas that I want to bring up, and I'm okay with that. Um I'm quite okay with that. The title of this episode is gonna be Bears, Dogs, New Cars, Being Bored, and Being Frustrated. If the writing department will approve that, that's what it's gonna be called.

SPEAKER_01 5:28

Frustrated dogs, they're all just words.

SPEAKER_05 5:32

I don't I don't object to any of them. But I did ask you guys, and y'all may not have gotten this message because it was the same day as recording, and so you will be excused if you can't come up with something. But I I asked y'all to bring in a tidbit of spiritual advice before we get into a lot of nonsense. And I am going to be starting a segment for this podcast, and it's based on Deuteronomy 439. I'm pretty sure it is. And it starts off by saying this is your wonderful thought of the day. I think that would be in the living translation. It was the first scripture that I memorized, and I was on a living the living translation when I was like five or six. But anyway, we'll have people from CO staff, different guests that we've had, and they'll literally just pop in and give a little This is your wonderful thought of the day. Little minute to live. So I thought we would do this very informally, and so again, you guys are excused if you can't bring this to the table. But mine would just simply be to encourage everyone to suffer well, and what I mean by that is to meet it head on, and it can and will transform you if you allow God to transform you through your pain. Uh verse, we also glory in tribulations, knowing that tribulation produces perseverance and perseverance, character, and character hope. And I can just say through a lot of the suffering this year, I'm more free than I've ever been, you know, in the depths of my soul. And you know, I mean that sincerely, that there's been so much freedom through the trials, the fiery trials. And the analogy that I use is Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego. The fire didn't touch them, but it burned off their you know bondages. Did y'all bring anything?

SPEAKER_02 7:38

I didn't, but I do have something.

SPEAKER_05 7:40

Yes, please.

SPEAKER_02 7:41

I did read your message. I usually don't, but I did today.

SPEAKER_05 7:44

And I was like just for our listeners, you don't ignore them forever. It's just if I send you something that very day, you may not get to it. Or do you ignore my messages forever?

SPEAKER_02 7:56

I do not ignore your messages. But you don't like, yes, based on what's happening in my day, I may not. I keep my phone is perpetually on silent. And so I only look at it when I'm ready to look at it. So if somebody sends me a message, I'm not like it's not dinging all day long for me to check it. This is something that even over the past week, I've been, I would say be slow about sharing what what revelations you're having with the Lord. I'm just having a time where like I want to hold things special. I think I've experienced where people are quick to share what he's saying to them or what he's doing with them. And not that that is wrong in any way. I mean, that is what we do from the platform. That's how we encourage one another. That's what small group is all about. Um, but there are some things that I think are just for you and the Lord. Um, and I'm trying to learn what things are just for us. You know, even if he reveals something and then I'm watching things play out or I'm watching like something that he's revealed to me comes up in another way, it may not always be for me to share. It may just be for him to show me that I like he's talking to me, you know? And so I'm trying to learn like what things are just for us. Just like in any friendship, there are some things you don't share with other people. That has been like in the especially in the past couple of weeks, it's just been kind of sweet seeing things that I think are just for me and not to just share with everyone.

SPEAKER_05 9:24

So do you think also there's sometimes a timing deal to where it's just like this is between me and like God saying to you, this is between me and you right now. But then maybe later.

SPEAKER_02 9:36

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 9:36

But then there's also maybe some stuff that what you're talking about right now is I keep it between me and the Lord.

SPEAKER_07 9:43

Interesting.

SPEAKER_05 9:44

Jack, you keep everything between you and the Lord.

SPEAKER_01 9:48

I mean, listen.

SPEAKER_04 9:51

You got anything?

SPEAKER_01 9:52

Yeah, I was uh I also don't ignore your messages, but I also, in general, my group chat policy is wait for someone else to respond first.

SPEAKER_05 10:03

Um, I will say we talk about being introverts so much. I asked Jack probably two months ago, hey man, we really need to grab lunch. He's like, Yeah, for sure. Neither one of us followed up on it.

unknown 10:15

Right.

SPEAKER_02 10:17

We just delight in the idea that you would have lunch with each other. That's enough.

SPEAKER_05 10:21

It didn't hurt my feelings. I didn't hurt my feelings.

SPEAKER_01 10:22

You know what? Honestly, though, there is something to the idea like two introverts being like, we should, we should get together. And they're saying yes, and that's like enough. It's almost like we the same.

SPEAKER_04 10:32

We like each other.

SPEAKER_01 10:32

We we Yeah, it's the same as doing it. We just had lunch. Hello. Um Yeah, I no, I I was thinking about it, and you know, so well, actually it's it's relevant in terms of like the when you get a question like that, or at least when I get a question like that, I really try not to think about it too hard because I I really okay. Let me tell you what it is first, and then I'll explain it. So I think my thing is stop trying to be profound and stop doing trying to be profound in what you think God is saying to you and what you're reading in scripture. Like just pay attention. It's sort of like the the corollary to like when you when you're praying in a group setting, there's like that pressure to not sound like an idiot and you want to sound like you at least have it, like you know how to pray, right? And that your relationship with God is good and that you know how to say things that make sense. And um, and in general, I really, I really dislike group prayer for that reason because I just can't stop listening to someone, like listening to everyone and thinking, it's like, are they are they trying? Right? Are they talking to me or to him? Because a lot of group prayers, if you listen, people aren't talking to God, they're talking to everyone else in the room. And like that's not like, oh, they're a bad person. It's like it's hard. That's why I don't really like group prayer, because it's so, it's, it's hard not to feel pressured. So anyway, like I think we feel the same pressure when we read scripture, like we have to pull out everything. And it's like sometimes it's just fine to notice something, like, oh, that's nice, that's neat. And it's not like every time God speaks to you, He's he's not necessarily going to say something that's like gonna change your life.

unknown 12:08

Right?

SPEAKER_01 12:08

Maybe it's like, hey, what if you were a little nicer today? I don't know. Right? It's like so anyway, and I they for for me, because when it's like the like I'm I'm speaking at a church, not this weekend, but the next weekend. And anytime I have the chance to speak on the weekend, whether it's here or somewhere else, kind of my goal is I want people, I want to show people something in uh in a passage they haven't seen before, or something that maybe they haven't considered before. The tension I live in is I enjoy like noticing things, but I really want to avoid am I trying to impress people by including this? Am I trying to impress them? Am I trying to like am I pleased by this because I sound smart? And that's a hard tension for me to manage, because of course I like I like people thinking I'm smart or whatever, right? So, so anyway, so that's sort of like a I think that's really helpful for me. You know, don't worry so much about uh being profound in what you share, but also don't worry about being profound in what uh you're looking for or in the Bible. Like it's fine. And I just think you know, a lot of like church culture the last 25 years with like podcasts and YouTube and influencers and everything's being shared. So everyone wants to have like that, you know, like they they have this Bible. It was like a pastor thing going back 25 years, where it's like, I you know, I've noticed this thing in this Bible story, and I've written a whole book about it. It's like, you know, not every story has that. Yeah, you know, but anyway, so yeah, don't worry about being profound, either in like trying to impress people or feeling like it's not from God unless it feels deep.

SPEAKER_05 13:43

Yeah. That was very profound and impressive, Jack. Shoot. Feels really good to hear you say. I'm really glad I asked y'all the the uh to share. That was both of y'all very awesome. All right, real quick, and I'm just some of these names are I'm just man, can we get some patrons with some less difficult names to articulate? There's a couple of them here. I'm like, goodness gracious. But Courtney Granado, Marilyn Wolverton, Roy and Susie Chapman, Samantha Kohler, Laurel Basin, Jennifer Segroi, Anna Oliphant, not elephant, olifant, Susie Simmons, Christina Hardesty, Sandy Stafford, Mary Gillespie, Jalen Kirpatrick, Mark Dorensky, Aaron Friedman, Kimberly Wickersham, and LB Dancler. Thank you guys so much for your continued support for this podcast. Every single dime goes toward ministry efforts in prison. Shoutouts to Jim Wright. So, guys, I took two trips, uh, one to the mountains with my kids and one to southern Florida to see my niece get married. But I've got a video to show you guys of something that I've actually never seen something like this before. And I'm being told by my friend who lives in Asheville this is a very common occurrence. But Caitlin, why don't you show this first video?

SPEAKER_03 15:16

That is unreal.

SPEAKER_05 15:18

So this is basically traffic on the interstate, and that thing just crossed. If you're not watching on YouTube, it's a big black bear.

SPEAKER_06 15:30

Oh my gosh.

SPEAKER_05 15:33

Like, oh my gosh. Now, here's where we're missing Tamilix. He couldn't make today's recording, and I was so looking forward to seeing his reaction to this. And I may get the same reaction from you two. But I couldn't help myself. I pulled the car over.

SPEAKER_02 15:51

You did not chase that bear.

SPEAKER_05 15:53

I didn't chase it, but I wanted to get a better look at it.

SPEAKER_02 15:57

Ah, Joey.

SPEAKER_05 15:59

But listen, listen, there was a fence between the city.

SPEAKER_02 16:02

He can get over. He just climbed over the fence.

SPEAKER_05 16:07

So here's what makes it worse is my sons came also.

SPEAKER_02 16:12

All right, you put your children in danger.

SPEAKER_05 16:14

And and people will hear the audio as I'm speaking sweetly to the bear. Hey, hey, I'm sorry I don't have any honey for you. Now, watch what the bear does at the very end of this video. Alright, so we had pulled off on the side of the road.

SPEAKER_02 16:30

He's like, I'm just trying to hide in.

SPEAKER_05 16:32

Right. And I'm talking to the bear.

SPEAKER_06 16:36

All right. His name's Chester. Chester. Yes, Chester. Hey, buddy. I wish I had some honey for you.

SPEAKER_04 16:46

Did you see that? Like he literally did like a I'm warning you charge.

SPEAKER_05 16:52

And then that's when we got in the car and drove away. So my buddy Hain Griffin, who's been on this podcast before last summer series, he was on here talking about safety. He said, dude, those animals are so docile. Is it docile or docile? Same.

SPEAKER_01 17:10

Either.

SPEAKER_05 17:10

He said, personally, I don't think you put your kids in danger because I was feeling a little guilty. He's just like, dude, that that bear was not gonna do anything. But you think I'm crazy.

SPEAKER_02 17:20

Well, I two things. I think you're far enough away from the bear. Black bears typically you can make noise and they'll go away. But this black bear is used to being around people because he crosses this highway and jumps over the fence. That feels like he's adapted to this environment. But regardless.

SPEAKER_05 17:39

Yeah, National Geographic Lynn.

SPEAKER_02 17:42

Regardless of like how docile he might be, he's still a wild animal. So it's like we can say, like, oh, they're pretty docile, but like typically in the wild bears don't like to be around populated areas. So like the fact that he's comfortable is probably because he's eating around here, he's being fed, but he's still wild. So I think the general rule of thumb is just because he's friend shaped doesn't mean he's a friend.

SPEAKER_05 18:11

What do you think, Jack?

SPEAKER_02 18:12

No, I think you guys were fine.

SPEAKER_05 18:14

Yeah. Well You would have maybe done that with your boys. You've got two boys.

SPEAKER_01 18:17

Dad, I want to get a closer look. It depends. Dad, can we stop? It depends. I mean, it it it just depends. Well, black bears, I mean, if that's if if that's a different kind of bear, you'd be insane. Oh yeah. But black bears, there's actually a great video on YouTube of a black bear who like wandered into a family barbecue, and the dad just like opens up the little chain-link fence. He's like, get out of here. Like, just get out of here. And the bear just kind of like shuffles away through the gate. Like, if you want, if you gotta fight off a bear, you want to fight off a black bear. Yeah. Um, so no, I don't think you guys are in danger. I mean, it's still a bear, right? But if you if you gotta chase after a bear with your children, choose a black boat.

SPEAKER_05 18:56

Away to go. Yeah, yeah. I we I was at Yellowstone, and I we were pulling around a curve, and there were cars lined up on both sides. And typically it happened about three times, and we'd get out, and it's like, oh look, there's some elk out there. That's what we're all looking at. This third time, get out of the car, and I was like, What are y'all looking at? And they said, We just watched a grizzly bear chase this baby elk, and there it is right there. It was pretty far away, but you but still just seeing this grizzly bear eating a little baby elk. But what you said about any kind of different bear, like it really brought the moment home when a ranger out there said, if that bear moves at all, oh yeah, everybody in your cars immediately and drive away.

SPEAKER_01 19:45

There was the the um chosen 2021, I think, had a lot of nature footage in it, and all of it was original. And uh so our old video director, Sean Tillman, he was actually at Yellowstone with his family on a personal vacation months you know before. And so he pulled some of his personal footage from that, and there is absolutely a shot of a grizz a huge grizzly bear that he was he wasn't close, but he was closer than he should have been. But he stayed like near his car. Um, and there's a yeah, yeah, he got some crazy stuff, but a grizzly was one of them.

SPEAKER_05 20:18

All right. So as I said in the title, part of part of what we're gonna be talking about are frustrations. So I wanna this is frustration number one. Are you guys dog people? Which I'll say, y'all are dog people.

SPEAKER_01 20:32

I'm I'm not an animal person. So not a cat person, not a dog person.

SPEAKER_05 20:35

Right. So I used to think I wasn't a dog person until we got our dog that you saved that dog's life by telling me not to put it in the leave it in the car. Yeah, first. I literally almost killed our dog until Lynn said that dog will die if you leave it in the car for 30 minutes. I didn't know. I don't know anything about dogs. Now, having a dog, I'm like, I think I'm a dog person. Here's why I thought that I was not a dog person. I cannot stand when you walk into someone's house who owns a dog and they just think you want this dog jumping up on you, licking you. I remember doing premarital counseling with a couple, and the dog is just constantly sniffing me, like licking me, and they're not saying anything. I'm just like, can you please tell your dog not to? I don't want your dog around me. That's what I do not like. So I think I'm a dog person, but dog owner, I'm not a big dog owner person because most dog owners are just like, yeah, that's our dog.

SPEAKER_02 21:34

Well, of course you love our dog. I think it depends on the owner. That is frustrating to me. And I've had a dog and I loved having him, but he knew like when I had people over and we had food, he I would say go and he would walk away. Like he was not allowed to like jump on people, go up to their food, go up to their plate. And so I I equate that with training, and it's the same as I'm a kid person, but there are Kids who were misbehaved and they don't act proper. And so I think it's just a training thing where they think it's fine for their dog to jump. But I love dogs, but I do not like a dog that is not behaved.

SPEAKER_05 22:13

Yeah. So extending the dog frustration, I my dad who's passed away, obviously, his first cousin owns her parents' old house in Mill Springs. It's kind of near Saluda, Rutherfordon. It's about 50 miles from Asheville, and I can pretty much stay there anytime I want. So I had a couple of stints there this summer, three stints, one with my kids, but I do a lot of running when I'm out there and people don't have their dogs on leashes. I had two times where a big dog, I see it. I'm usually I've got headphones in, so I don't hear anything, and I see it out of the corner of my eye, a big dog running at me, and both times I said, Hey! And thank goodness the dog turned around. I'm like, people, you got to have your dogs on leashes, but I guess they're just not even used to people jogging on the street because there's just so few people there. But I don't know if I've ever told y'all this story, but y'all know I have kicked two dogs. I basically punted two dogs.

SPEAKER_02 23:21

Joey Spencer at Zcoast.org. Yes.

SPEAKER_05 23:23

Uh well, here's the here's the first time, and this was before I knew much about dogs.

SPEAKER_01 23:28

So there's a very good chance that this dog Wait, but like you you didn't know that they didn't like being kicked?

SPEAKER_04 23:34

No, I aren't you the one that just said that all your answers, all the questions are gonna be answered if you just let me talk.

SPEAKER_01 23:48

I now I now understand. Right. Here's the context. But you don't kick them.

SPEAKER_05 23:52

Here's the context is now I know you can look for a dog's tail. If it's up and it's kind of wagging, they're just like, hey, what's up? I'm here to play. I want to just meet you, sort of thing. And so I didn't know at the time this was Whalem was a baby in the jogging stroller. And I'm running around a neighborhood in West Ashley, and it looked to be a pit bull, not on a leash. It came up to me, like running alongside of me, like sniffing me. I was like, all right, but I hope it doesn't bite me. But then it ran to kind of get a little faster so it could run up on Wayland and the jogging stroller. And that's when I stopped and literally punted that dog's face. And right as I did that, the owner comes out calling off the dog, but then starts chewing me out. And I'm afraid this person's going to sick their dog on me. Uh, but anyway, it all fizzled out and I and I kept running. So that's what I mean before I knew anything about dogs. The dog probably just was saying, Hey, what's up? How y'all doing? So I find that acceptable. You find it acceptable to put the dog.

SPEAKER_02 25:03

You don't know what the dog's doing, and there's a baby. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 25:05

Right. No, I find that completely acceptable. I've I've had instances around like my neighborhood, not when the boys are little, but like where dogs just like come running, you don't know why they're running at you. And if you've got a little kid, you shouldn't be like, no, maybe they just maybe maybe they want to be a friend. Like you don't mess around with that because you can't like that's a half-second thing.

SPEAKER_05 25:26

Um so even if you saw the duh the tail wagging, because probably would still get what I learned is when the dog is mad and after something the tail goes down.

SPEAKER_01 25:34

Yeah, but that that stuff can change so fast. Okay.

SPEAKER_02 25:37

And he still could be being playful and hurt like big like dogs think that they're smaller. I don't well, I don't know that they think that they're smaller, but their nature is to play in ways that like even puppies will bite because that's what they would do with their other puppy brothers and sisters. And so there are still ways that like a dog is not trying to harm you, but could hurt a kid in their play. So the dog should have been on a leisure in a yard.

SPEAKER_05 26:06

Yeah, yeah. All right. Second time, and this is pretty intense. Uh I was jogging in the mountains in Georgia. I had my headphones on and I heard something. I turned around. Y'all, there was a pack of wild dogs. Oh, and what's crazy is the dog that was basically trying to bite me, you know, I mean, it's almost like a you remember back in the playground days where you'd take a kickball and you'd position position yourself and just, you know, you know exactly what to do with your legs to get the biggest kick you possibly can. I mean, that's basically what I did. And I learned that if if you kick that ringleader of a dog, they all go. But that was scary turning around seeing a bunch of uh wild dogs. All right.

SPEAKER_02 26:58

You probably need to like carry uh some bear mace. Yeah, when you go running in the mountains.

SPEAKER_05 27:04

Running in the mountains, yeah. That's a good idea. All right, let me ask y'all this. Do you guys have, as a general rule of thumb, do y'all have new cars? Like, do y'all drive new cars?

SPEAKER_07 27:14

No. No.

SPEAKER_05 27:15

Yeah. I my only car payment was the car that I bought my junior year of college. My parents matched the amount of money uh for the down payment. And then I remember my car payments were $179. Wow. And it was probably for about four years. We have not, I've never had a car payment since. Now, part of that is because of some very unbelievable generosity thrown my family's way. One time someone let us stay at their condo for about six months rent-free, and so we just put all that money aside for a van. And then that same person, like 10 years later, uh, we our second car just we kept having to get a second car, and we would try not to spend too much money on it, but then it would break down, and so he just bought us a new car. So very much so, we would have had car payments without those uh acts of generosity. But for two trips, the trip to the mountains with the kids, and then the trip to Florida with my mom, and you know, she basically funded that whole trip down to Florida. I drove brand new cars. Do y'all know how cruise control is nowadays? It's unbelievable. So literally, you set and people that drive new cars, they're like, Oh, welcome to 2026, Joey, but you set cruise control and it steers for you and it also also will break for you. Yeah, it does it all for you. Now, what I I'd be very interested to hear, somebody who knows about this stuff, it doesn't like if you take your hands off the steering wheel. Like if you do that for about 10 seconds, it'll it'll make like a beep beep beep and it'll jerk to basically say put your hands on the steering wheel, but you can literally put it on cruise control and just have your finger touching it as long as it senses something and you can't get in a wreck. I mean, it seems like it takes out the human element because now it's a a computer driving for you that is sensitive to distance between you and then the car. And so I'm not encouraging this, nor would I do this. But literally, y'all y'all know what it feels like to take a road trip and you're like, stay awake, stay awake. Maybe you're hitting yourself. Sometimes I would pinch myself to stay awake because I don't want to fall asleep at the wheel. You can nod off in a car like this and be fine. I'm not saying do it. You cannot.

SPEAKER_02 29:45

I have friends who have those cars. We usually take my friend's car when we travel. And if you're if your eyes go away from like in her car, if the driver, if she's like looking over for a second, it will also start to ding. So it will look over? Yeah, like it will sense. Now it might be the type of car that she has, but she, and it's I mean, she doesn't have like, you know, she's not driving a Tesla. But if she is like, even if her hands are on the wheel, if she and she's got it on that because it will slow down speed up based on the car in front of you. But if she looks away for too long, it will start to ding and it will say distracted, like driving distracted.

SPEAKER_05 30:23

Yeah, but what I'm saying is theoretically, though, how the car is maneuvering, if you bat it off, you're very it's highly unlikely you're gonna get in a wreck. Highly unlikely. Have you experienced these sort of new cars?

SPEAKER_01 30:37

Like Yeah, I had a loner when I do my car. It had some work like a year ago or whatever, and it had I didn't experiment with anything, but it had like that automatic braking thing turned on. I hated that. I don't like like I like the idea of something that breaks to avoid an uh an accident. I hate it as a normal flow of traffic because it it feels it because it feels so artificial. It's like this is not one I would normally, and I'm a pretty defensive driver, like I'm not aggressive at all. Um but I hated that thing. Uh yeah, I would turn that off as soon as I could.

SPEAKER_05 31:11

Yeah. All right. Frustration number two, customer service. Are you guys alerted by I was gonna say sensitive about customer service, but that kind of makes it sound like you get sad or uh hurt your feelings. But are you alert to bad customer service? Like, do you pick up on it? Like, can you believe it? I walked into Jersey Mike's yesterday. There's four people working there. Now they're all busy, but not one person acknowledged that a customer is standing there. I'm thinking the ABCs, you just say, Hey sir, we'll be with you in a minute. Not a word, not a word. So this is hilarious of a story. So we stopped at Cracker Barrel on the way to Florida. So me, my mom, my aunt, my kids, daughter's boyfriend, nice little fun family trip. First, the funny part of this is I ordered a steak at Cracker Barrel. I knew it wasn't gonna be a good steak. I wasn't expecting a good steak. Like, seriously, I knew what to expect. What were you doing? I knew what I was signing up for because I just wanted the taste of steak and I didn't need it to be great. All right, so I asked them though, they say, How do you want it? And I was like, pink, like medium rare, you know, a little borderline red. It comes out, and uh my son Wayland, he asked for it to be a little bit of pink. His is perfect, mine is like ultra extra well. And so we're kind of pressed for time. We need to keep going. So I'm like, whatever, I'll just eat this. They come and they say, Hey, how's the steak? I was like, Well, I mean, there's no pink at all. I asked for and they were like, We'll put it in the back, you know, we'll we'll get you another steak. I was like, I don't know if we have the time. Oh, we'll we'll we'll see what we can do. I was like, okay, so they uh bring out another steak, and she's just uh the manager he says, You want to cut into that right now? I was like, it doesn't really matter because I can't wait for another steak, so we're fine. Thank you so much. I cut into it, it's like extra well done again. And so the server comes out, so how's your steak? I was like, it's it's the same, no big deal. She's like, Okay, well, don't worry about it. The steak is on us. And I was like, Oh, I was like, okay, thank you. And I was thinking, of course it should be on y'all. I ordered it, you just brought out a replacement and it's still well done. Y'all, they bring out the check, and there is my steak dinner on there. And I basically said to the server, I was like, Hey, I'm still being charged for the steak. She's like, Oh, you wanted both steaks off your check? I was like, That's amazing. You gotta be kidding me. So the manager comes out there and says, Hey, is there a problem? I was like, Well, the problem is y'all are charging me for a steak. And they're looking at me like, well, you little greedy guy, you want both steaks for free? I could not believe it. And that was the manager. So I'm really getting to a place where it's like people aren't taught what good customer service is. That's just that is the easiest decision. You give the dude the steak for free, even if the second one came out, fine. You know, I told them that I was, you know, rush for time. So you guys, do you get bothered by bad customer service?

SPEAKER_02 34:17

I do.

SPEAKER_05 34:17

Yeah. You don't really let it roll off your back?

SPEAKER_02 34:20

Well, and roll off my back. I mean, I don't like challenge it. Um, but I do like there are places I won't go because I'm like, that was a terrible experience. I won't go back. So how about you?

SPEAKER_01 34:32

Yeah, no, I I mean, my thing is, you know, I don't mind a poor experience as long as they're trying to help. And by poor experience, I mean I like yeah, like like food coming out wrong or whatever. Like that doesn't bother me as long as someone there like is trying to fix it. Right. And is demonstrating this happen. Well, sure. And is demonstrating some kind of some kind of competence. Um like I'll give one. I went, you know, had a years ago, ordered like a birthday cake from a grocery store, and I can't remember what the problem was. I think like the the name on it was spelled wrong or something like that. So manager came out and he said, What can we do to make this right? And that ticked me off. And now, like, there are different views. I know I have a friend who's like, oh, that's like I would have really appreciated that. My nose, that ticks me off because like, why is this my well, why is this my problem free? You tell me what you're going to do. And the answer is it's free. That's the answer. Like, I that's the thing, is like the there is bad customer service that masquerades as good customer service. I hate that. Uh yeah, the the what can we do to make this right? It's like, this isn't really difficult. It's not complicated. In fact, as far as like the like I think like their little company motto is behind them, where it's like the if it's not right, it's free. I was like, listen, man, uh I didn't write that. You read wrote that. Um, so that irritates me. The other thing that irritates me is when it's a really small problem and it's like no one seems to know how to fix it, even though I could tell them how to fix it. I this happened a few weeks ago, or I was at a place and I ordered a coffee, and I I never order like anything other than regular coffee, ever.

SPEAKER_05 36:13

Um like no cream sugar.

SPEAKER_01 36:15

Well, no, no, no. I mean like I don't get like lattes and America. All the I just don't do that. Um but I did because I was going on a drive and I'm like, all right, like I'll get like a cold brew. And anyway, so it's like they they ran out of like the cream that goes on the top or whatever. And I can see that's what's happening because there are three of them engaged in this. And my deal is the the more people involved in solving a smaller problem, like the size of the problem and the number of people trying to solve it, the smaller the problem, the bigger the group of people, the less likely it's gonna be solved. And I just want to be like, look, I I think you just need to go in the back and see if there's more. Like that's what you guys are talking about, right? So that's clearly what needed to happen is just go make more check in the back. Because there were so many people involved in trying to solve this problem, they all went back to just what they were doing before. And kind of my deal about this is I will wait. I I really hate asking. It's like, hey, where's my thing? I hate doing that. Because I kind of want to see how long it takes for someone to notice that there's a problem. So, like five minutes later, you know, someone notices that I'm staying there, like, hey, what happened with your drink? He's like, I don't know. She went back, fixed it. It was out in 30 seconds. So it's like, I really appreciate that. Because like, oh, like I'm just waiting for a competent person to notice a problem because I know they'll fix it in literally 30 seconds, what she did. But that's the sort of thing where it's like a bunch of incompetent people trying to solve the simplest problem in the world, it will never get done. And that sort of thing drives me crazy.

SPEAKER_05 37:38

Yeah. That's yeah. I mean, yesterday at Jersey Mike's, I literally was like, I think good customer service is fading. Like people just don't know that when a customer walks in, you just address them. I I mean, I was even fine with waiting. I like I wasn't impatient. Like some people drive me crazy because they're just like, you know, they want to be have the the best experience and it's perfect. It's like, no, they're busy right now. You're not gonna be able to get your sandwich right now. I didn't mind waiting. Just like I'd love to be acknowledged.

SPEAKER_01 38:11

It's it I don't know that it's fading. I just think it's it's about it's probably fading at some places in the sense of it what depends like, is that of actual value in the company? And it's like, look, look, if you've got like 10,000 franchisees everywhere, it's like, yeah, it's gonna be awful because it you're really depending on the franchisee caring, regardless of whether it's a company value. If they don't care, it's not gonna matter. It's like raising kids.

SPEAKER_04 38:35

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 38:35

Right. If you, if you know, it's it's not that every generation complains about the next generation being like rude and not. It just depends on like how are they being raised? Are they being raised right? And so it's like customer service. You know, it's really not hard. It's just is anyone teaching them this stuff?

SPEAKER_05 38:51

Yeah. The behemoth, obviously, of fast food restaurants, McDonald's, but then right below it is Chick-fil-A. And I would say, as far as what did you call it? Bohemuth.

SPEAKER_01 39:00

Oh, there we go. Okay, that was right. You said bohemoth.

SPEAKER_05 39:02

Did I say bohemuth?

SPEAKER_01 39:03

Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 39:04

I was more of a like the What's the correct way? You the second one, behemoth. Oh, gotcha. Thank you. Yeah. No.

SPEAKER_01 39:09

No, I mean that was uh truly not not I less I realize this is a podcast where I make fun of you a lot, but that was genuinely a I'm always curious about how people pronounce things.

SPEAKER_05 39:18

I don't mind saying words improperly as long as people call me up.

SPEAKER_01 39:21

That's the thing, actually, I don't I never mind mispronunciations because if someone mispronounces something, that just shows that they taught themselves how to say it. Oh, it's embarrassing some of the words. It can be mispronouncing like most of my adulthood. I don't think anyone should be embarrassed about mispronouncing words.

SPEAKER_05 39:35

I used to say Minneanapolis. I thought it rhymed with Indianapolis, and I said that well into my 30s. Minneanapolis.

SPEAKER_01 39:43

That's a better name.

SPEAKER_05 39:44

It's a bit better. All right. I saw this on Instagram. Don't you love it when I start with the video? I do.

SPEAKER_02 39:52

That's my favorite thing.

SPEAKER_05 39:53

So this got to be true. This person asked Chat G BT. Pete P. Paul. I even thought about it. I even thought about it. I could hear the gears turning. What has fundamentally changed the world for the worse, but us humans haven't realized? The answer is the collapse of, this is what ChatGPT said. The answer is the collapse of unstructured time and specifically what smartphones and algorithmic feeds have done to boredom. The vast majority of human history, boredom was not a problem to be solved. It was a cognitive state that forced the brain into a mode we now call the default mode network, a kind of mental background processing where you consolidate memories, develop empathy by imagining other people's lives, generate creative ideas, and build a coherent sense of self. When you stared out of a window, waited for a bus, or sat quietly after dinner, your brain was doing some of its most important work. Boredom was, in a very real sense, the engine of the inner life. This really resonates with me a lot. It reminds me of what it sounds like you did out in your reading, your writing time. And I've read elsewhere when you get off of your phone, like the younger generations that are constantly flipping through reels, if you never stop that, there's never a recalibration. There's never like a resting place. And what I found really interesting in this summer series that we just finished, and I I ended up, I think the third time I asked this, so we we interviewed, I had a group of Gen Z, a group of Millennials and Gen X, and a group of boomers and silent generation. And so we had the same basic conversations with each group. And I remember I think by the by the last group with this question, I stopped asking it because I wasn't getting where I wanted to go. But I asked each group, do you think that we have lost the ability to be bored? And everybody's reaction is, oh, I'm never bored. I don't never have to be bored because I have my phone. And what I'm getting at is it's that seems to be somewhat of a problem. So I think the ship is sailing, but I'll ask y'all, do y'all value sitting and pondering andor praying or sitting outside and just feeling the breeze and looking up to the sky? Like, is this a value for you guys to be alone in your thoughts away from your phone? Like, would y'all value that? I mean, I for sure value that.

SPEAKER_02 42:40

Yeah, I do. I mean, I don't watch TV. So I've been doing that for a while. Um, and I don't have social apps on my phone. So, um, and my phone stays on silence. So I think um over the past few years, I have had more just sitting time. Even like with my roommate, sometimes I'll come home and we'll just sit there and there we might even like sit in silence in the living room for a while. We might talk, we might not, we might turn on a sermon or just sit. So I'd be a whole different level.

SPEAKER_05 43:11

So you sit and oftentimes not even reading.

SPEAKER_02 43:15

Yeah. Mm-hmm.

SPEAKER_05 43:17

And are you thinking, praying a little bit of both?

SPEAKER_02 43:20

Probably both. I mean, I don't, I I feel like over the past few years I've done it so much that I don't, I couldn't tell you, like, oh, what was I thinking about yesterday when I got home? Because a lot of times when I get home from work, I just sit before I start dinner. Um, and it just may be like that is how I decompress. I just sit there and it, we might talk. I might just daydream. I might just, yeah. So, and I don't, I can't tell you it's this time and this time. It just happens naturally of when I'm like, and I even when my mom comes to visit, the TV never goes off in my parents' house. Um, and it seldom ever comes on in my house. And so one time that my mom came to visit, I think it was the last time, it's when we were still doing the Sunday night service. And she likes to go to the evening, she liked to come to the evening service either Saturday night or Sunday night. And um before we stopped the Sunday night service, she's like, I will just go to the evening service. But I still served in Kids Coach. So I left in the morning and came back and I walked in and she was watching TV. And as soon as I walked in, she's like, I'm sorry, I'll turn this off. So it does like if people have noticed that I just it doesn't feel like silence to me in the same way that they think that being bored is an issue and it feels normal to them to always be distracted. I wouldn't even call it bored, even though I probably would have when I was younger. It just feels natural to have like free space margin that I'm not doing something.

SPEAKER_05 44:50

Yeah, like there were literally times when I would be outside with my friends in my childhood, and we'd be like, What should we do? Uh, you know, because there's not enough people to play football or soccer. Yeah. It's just the two of us. What should we do? I don't know. Kind of bored, aren't you? Yeah, bored. You know, mom and dad won't let us come inside and play video games. So we just got to figure it out. You got to think of something to do.

SPEAKER_01 45:13

Yeah, well, I I think figuring out what to do when you're bored is like a crucial part of growing up. Um, because I don't know that I'm ever bored anymore. I don't know if that is anything to do with my phone. I'm too busy to be bored. Uh, but like you like, you know, our our sons will sometime during like the summer, like I think we were like into like the first part of day one of summer. And my nine-year-old was like, I'm bored. And Larna's deal is like, sounds like a you problem, man. Like, good luck. Right? We're we're not gonna solve this for you. Like, go figure it out. Um, and we'll suggest like you read and draw and do whatever. And because they they don't they don't have devices. And so it's like go read, go draw, go outside. It's like figure it out. And so I think that's good. I think it's it's for people outside of childhood. I think it's more, it's less about boredom. It's more about the fact that in every minute it's possible to find something to entertain you. And so, for example, like when the the first like truly like I'm getting old moment that I had was when the boys were younger and they would we're like we're watching shows like through Amazon Prime, we have like the PBS kids deal. So they're watching, you know, like uh gosh, what was it? Like, you know, Peg plus Cat and and uh Wild Kratz. And they would they would do this thing where they were like, I want to watch this. Like, no, not that episode. No, that not that episode, no, not that episode. And they'd sometimes get like 30 seconds in, like, I want something else. And if I was like, listen, when I was your age, and I had this one, I was like, oh my gosh, I can't believe I'm dropping this, but it feels relevant. And a show came on that, and it was an episode that we'd seen or that we didn't like. We watched it anyway, or we went outside. That was the choice, right? Like you, you an episode would come on and be like, oh, I hate this one. And sometimes we watched it anyway. Or you went outside. Those are the options. And like that's more the problem, is at any point, it's easy to find something you want to put in front of your eyes, as opposed to, well, there's really nothing I want to do right now. So what do I do with that? It's in it is like a distraction thing, is a is a good way of saying it. Like at any minute, you can just put something in front of your eyes that's kind of fun.

SPEAKER_05 47:25

And it may be how I'm wired up. Like it's it's easy accountability for me because I can feel the disruption almost in my spirit, maybe even at an anxiety level, when I'm too connected to technology. And even though it's fun and interesting, when I step away and I just take a deep breath and I'm, you know, reading a book or just alone in my thoughts or go walk outside, it's a game changer. I mean, it really is. All right, two more things to talk about. Jack, we'll let you go after this first one. But first, basically give me some legitimize what I'm about to talk about when I say that it's research from Jonathan Hayde. If people don't know that is good, good research, right? Well, would he be a sociologist or is he a psychologist? I don't I don't know.

SPEAKER_01 48:15

Uh I don't want to get it wrong. I my inclination is sociologist, but I'm not sure.

SPEAKER_05 48:19

All right, so along these same lines, this is what his findings are. He polled a bunch of kids. How would you rather spend time with friends? Most of them, 45% said free play and in person. 30% said organize activity in person, so like soccer and gymnastics, and then 25% said online activity. So 20 more percent said free play in person than online activity. So Dr. Jonathan would say that the parents are the problem here. So a lot of information, but it's all very interesting. He says that uh parents don't give the freedom to go out and be free. Harris poll polled uh parents of 10-year-olds and basically said, Would you let your 10-year-old go play at a nearby park unsupervised? 60% of the parents would be worried about injury, and then 40% would be worried about kidnappings. Oh my gosh. And according to No one is coming for your kid. According to Warwick Kearns, the author of How to Live Dangerously, kidnapping in the United States is so rare that a child would have to be outside unsupervised for, on average, 750,000 years before being snatched by a stranger. A stranger. Now, my question is has the uprise in human trafficking changed this at all? Because I for sure kidnappings are very rare.

SPEAKER_01 49:56

Can I attack the premise that the rise in human trafficking as opposed to what when the entire world thought slavery was fine a thousand years ago? What uprise in human trafficking are we talking about? Because it's right in our backyard. I mean, I like that's a thing that I feel like I don't even need to look up. Yeah. To be like, like on what scale? I just I think the the idea, like worrying that someone is coming for your kids is insane. This is how I felt a lot about during COVID, where it's like, look, we're all trying to figure this out, but I really tried to be conscious of I don't want, I don't want to pass on, and I still feel this way about a lot of things. I don't want to pass my neuroses on to my kids. They don't need to worry about the stuff I worry about. I mean, and for forget like actual, you know, emergencies, pandemics, whatever. There's no reason that your kids need to worry about the stuff that you might worry about as an adult. That's an insane thing to do. That a lot of people do. It's like, you need to be thinking about this. They don't. They're children. They don't need to be thinking about any of that stuff. And like I know for for Laura and I, like when our oldest, because because my oldest tends to be like, well, I'm like make me, he tends to be cautious by nature. When he started, like when we would go to his younger brother's basketball games at the rec center, and he'd be like, Hey, can I go outside and wander? Be like, yes, get out of here. Like, I don't want to see you for the next hour. And he'd just go. And now, of course, it's like the there are a hundred parents everywhere. He's outside, but it's like, I don't know where he's going. You know, I know him and I know that he's a smart kid and he's cautious and he's not going to do anything crazy. But it's like, yeah, he could still get hurt. He could he could get hurt walking into the gymnasium where everyone is. Right. Like, I think the idea of it's possible to be safe is one of the most destructive ideas that we have as parents. Uh, you are never safe anywhere. Yeah.

SPEAKER_04 51:51

That's a good thing.

SPEAKER_01 51:52

No one is safe. And yes, it's a complete illusion. Right. Anything can happen anywhere. And that's and that's not a reason to be afraid. That's a reason to be like, well, I mean, like the the drive, the self-driving thing. It's like, yeah, and uh and that will protect you from a lot of things. It will not protect you from an insane person on the highway running from the cops, which is a thing that could happen. Should you worry about it? No. No, you shouldn't worry about it. It's like you shouldn't worry about the vast majority of anything that could happen.

SPEAKER_05 52:23

Well, it sounds like you're Jonathan Hayes' mentor. Let me read this.

SPEAKER_01 52:27

By the way, he's a social psychologist. Social psychologist. So you were right in two ways.

SPEAKER_05 52:30

All right, there you go. So this this really is so eye-opening. He says overestimating risks comes with a price. Without real world freedom, kids don't develop competence, confidence, problem solving in the real world. Independence and unsupervised play equals positive mental health outcomes. Organized activities is stress higher for parents. So basically, there's parents just like we got to have our kids involved in everything because we want to make sure they find their love. And I mean, literally all over the place all the time. Less independence for kids, more anxiety and depression in this generation. 2023 Surgeon General cited intensive care giving as one reason parents are more stressed than ever. And then he he closes this little tirade that he was on. He says, This generation longs for what most of their parents had time with friends in person without adults. Let's give it to them. So you guys would agree that parents are are too safe these days? Would you would you say that? Yeah, 100%. Too involved?

SPEAKER_01 53:40

Uh I uh that that that word does a lot of work. That's true. I I think I think that they're they're over involved in the wrong areas.

SPEAKER_05 53:48

Yeah, I would agree.

SPEAKER_02 53:49

I agreed. The even the 20% that prefer to be online because they're not going outside or they can't go to the playground by themselves, it's like it's actually far more dangerous for a kid to have unlimited access to the internet than like the you know, scary guy in a van with candy.

SPEAKER_01 54:07

Yeah, right. Like stereotype. I know when I worked, I worked at Barnes Noble for a decade, and the I would have parents come in and buy books for their kids, and I'm like, I cannot believe you were buying these books for your kids. You have you cannot have any idea what is in these books. And it's like, you know, but I'm sure that they were super involved in a bunch of areas that didn't need that attention, and then indifferent to plenty of places that needed their attention. And it can be hard to get it right, but I don't know. Like one of the things about like where um, what if my kid gets hurt? It's like, and it's I'm pretty sure he's built like all the other kids and it'll get better. It's like the thing about this is also another thing for adults, like going through emergencies and disasters and getting hurt. One of the things it teaches you is, oh, and then I don't think about that anymore afterwards, and it was fine.

SPEAKER_05 54:54

I love it. It was fine. I love the pictures of playgrounds that the three of us have. Oh, yeah, they smelled hilarious.

SPEAKER_02 55:01

It's like not just that like the stuff we did. What are you talking about, kid?

SPEAKER_05 55:06

Yeah, right. I'm curious how y'all would answer this question. And then Jack, you can go if you need to. Are parents too bent on making sure kids are successful and happy?

SPEAKER_01 55:16

Uh those are two questions. Um happy, yes. Um successful. I see that depends because I think that there are a lot of parents who don't care enough about their kids being successful. Because once kids are out of the house. Well, because once they're out of the house, you're like, all right, well, I guess I'm done being a parent. And I feel like, you know, one of the things I feel like like my dad and mom always did really well was, you know, like being willing to help. Like it was always a dialogue of like, you know, we want to know if you need help. Like, and this is like early on in Laura and I's marriage, right? Because now Dad when I have a conversation where he was like, Are we helping enough? And I'm like, yes. Like, and but I was always free to like the, you know, I knew I could ask for help, but I also know I could say, hey, we don't need that right now. That's fine. I feel like that sort of like the kids are out of the house, but you should still be invested in how they're doing and ready to help. And that's a hard thing. It's like, how much do I help? I don't want to help too much because you can't help too much. But I just know one of the things I feel like I've seen from a lot of millennials who are like my age, especially those with young children now, is I like I can't get my parents to be involved at all. Like they're not interested.

SPEAKER_04 56:24

Wait.

SPEAKER_01 56:24

Or it's like when I when they come to visit, it's all about like the, well, why didn't we go do fun stuff? So the grandparents. Yeah. They're self-involved. It's it's not like they're not interested in sort of like this new stage of life. And I I've I see a lot of millennial frustration with parents who seem uninterested in kind of like the idea that there's still obligations on them as now grandparents, but still like parents of their adult children. Right. Um, and but I think that's a subtle. It's like we hate the idea of of anyone having any obligations on us.

SPEAKER_02 56:55

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 56:56

Thanks, Jack. Thanks, y'all.

SPEAKER_02 56:58

Bye.

SPEAKER_05 56:58

All right, so Lynn, just you and I, frustration number three.

SPEAKER_02 57:01

Okay.

SPEAKER_05 57:02

All right, so you know Pastor Brian.

SPEAKER_02 57:04

We've got a couple of Pastor Bryans on staff.

SPEAKER_05 57:07

Brian Lewis.

SPEAKER_02 57:08

Okay, yes.

SPEAKER_05 57:08

Great guy. I I mean, I I would say humble in heart, wise, not argumentative, not a combative person. And I'm going to allow myself to be uh a little rough around the edges with this one. So we have an Instagram account just for this podcast. And so Pastor Brian was a part of our intergenerational summer series, what I've referred to a handful of times in this episode. And so he was on three different episodes. And the subject matter doesn't even matter as far as this discussion, but it he just so happened to say something about systemic racism and how a lot of people they just conveniently don't, you know, just kind of turned a blind eye to it. Well, someone left a comment along the lines of, give me a break. Are you kidding me? And here's where I allow myself to be rough around the edges. I don't know if this person was a Christian or not. I'd say there's a high percentage they were if they're following a Christian podcast. And I would say, How dare you? And what I would say, how dare you about again, not the subject matter, but if you can't allow someone to share something and an up in an opinion, a conviction, it's obviously a serious thing that they're talking about. If you can't just let that sit and take it in without basically literally, uh for lack of better words, canceling what he just said, discounting it as this person expressed in a comment, nobody should pay any attention to what this person is saying. So I just decided that for the so it was we did nine episodes, and for episodes four, five, and six, it had to do with uh church unity despite political differences, racism, and Christian nationalism. I just turned off the comments because I felt like if you don't get the vision of this podcast, and maybe this is a little bit overreaching for me, I just like I don't really care about your opinions. Like I I I do care about everybody's opinions just in general, but this podcast is meant to hear other people and value other people and their thoughts and just weigh them out. And so the posture of this person, I'm just like, to me, this just noise. If you want to have that thought privately, have it. But why do you think, Lynn, that just a thought that you disagree with in general is so offensive? Like this person was offended about Brian's opinion.

SPEAKER_02 1:00:02

Yeah, I think, and this goes beyond, you're right, it goes beyond subject matter. And this is something that Pastor Greg always says when something offends you, you always have to ask, why does it offend you? And so there is always something behind an offense that someone takes. And I don't know what it is for this individual. Um, but I know that any subject of race typically brings offense when those things come up, which is one reason why I don't love talking about race stuff, you know, when I would be like, uh-uh, we were talking about this stuff again. And it's because you get comments like that, or people you you have some outliers who don't want to sit and listen and hear different perspectives. Um, but I think that that is the case in every subject that we get, especially when you're talking about comments online, whether that's on YouTube or Facebook or Instagram, wherever it is, there are always going to be people that there is something going on in them. Um, whatever the fence causes, and it causes them to do something that we would all agree is like this isn't the platform for that, but it is the platform that people use. A lot of people are commenting on things in ways that aren't productive. And so that isn't shocking to me. I just think that um offense usually tells us something about what is going on in our hearts.

SPEAKER_05 1:01:26

So and I think, and this could be a stretch, but I think it offense in this context points to a lack of love. Like it feels to me that if you truly were a lover of people, how Jesus asks us to be, even to our enemies, then you would just have a desire to huh. So that's what Pastor Brian thinks. I'd like to understand his heart a little bit more. I'd like to understand where he's coming from because I love people, and that's a person.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:02

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:02:02

So I would love just to hear more instead of just hearing words offensive. Like, is that a stretch to say when you are offended by someone expressing conviction or opinion, and they're not saying any like Brian wasn't talking to that guy.

SPEAKER_02 1:02:20

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:02:20

He was just talking to anybody who happened upon this Instagram post or listens to the podcast. He wasn't directing his words towards this person. Do you think it's a lack of love in someone's heart?

SPEAKER_02 1:02:33

It could be. It could also be uh um holding on to like when you have a deep-seated belief and someone challenges that belief, it may challenge what your standing, what you know, like what you've built your life on and what changing that belief or questioning that belief requires. So it could be a lack of love. It could be self-pre, which self-preservation and pride are a lack of, you know, that all of those things speak to level of love. Um, but I think it could be a lot of things, but love would be rooted at it because at the end, if you love someone, you're willing to challenge or at least listen. That doesn't mean that your belief has to change. I know a lot of people who may disagree with that, but they would never approach it that way, and they would enter into dialogue about why they don't see it that way. So, yeah, I think lack of love could be a reason for that.

SPEAKER_05 1:03:34

Yeah, me too. Me too. Jack, who just left, is technically your boss, right?

SPEAKER_02 1:03:39

Yeah.

SPEAKER_05 1:03:40

Okay. Tell me the the best parts about him being your boss and the worst parts. Just tell me the worst parts about Jack being your boss.

SPEAKER_04 1:03:51

Do you think I was serious for a split second? I never listened to the case. You looked at me as serious.

SPEAKER_02 1:03:55

But I was giving you that, like, I'm not gonna answer this face.

SPEAKER_05 1:03:58

Oh, gotcha. I I thought for a second, maybe I've got Lynn. And then Lynn's thinking, are you crazy?

SPEAKER_02 1:04:04

No, I'm like, I was thinking, how will I respond to Joey? Because I know this isn't a serious question.

SPEAKER_05 1:04:10

What's one thing you like about Jack? Because I like Jack.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:12

Yeah, Jack, uh, there are a lot of things. I think that he's a great leader in the sense of like he is actually really good at coaching you through um tough situations or like helping you. Yeah, like if I'm stuck on like how I should word something or how I should navigate a dynamic or relationship, he's pretty good at like coaching through that.

SPEAKER_05 1:04:38

It's fun, Lynn.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:39

It's fine.

SPEAKER_05 1:04:40

Let's see it.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:41

Welcome back.

SPEAKER_05 1:04:41

Oh, thank you. Yeah, welcome back, D.

SPEAKER_02 1:04:44

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