Operating Room Nursing with the OR RN Mentor, Yasmin Sharifi

My guest this week is Yasmin Sharifi, an operating room nurse with many decades of experience. She’s here to give us a glimpse into, as she says, “what really goes on behind that red line.”

Yasmin didn’t initially set out to be an OR nurse. She started her career in med-surg but quickly encountered burnout due to a nursing shortage and inadequate patient-to-nurse ratios, often sharing 35 patients with another nurse. Realizing this was not sustainable, she transitioned to the PACU. When she was offered a chance to move into the operating room, she embraced the opportunity and discovered her true passion.

Yasmin pointed out that in 1990, there were no formal orientation programs for OR nurses. However, resourcefulness is a nurse’s superpower. She joined the professional organization AORN, purchased relevant books, and trained herself to adapt to the role.

Fortunately, those days are behind us. Nurses entering the operating room today receive a comprehensive education and an orientation period that lasts nearly a year. And if you think being an OR nurse means you won't have to interact with patients and their families, Yasmin dispels that myth completely.

We discussed the dynamics among the operating room team members, the egos involved, and the common goal that brings them all together: the patient. I’m confident you’ll enjoy and learn from our discussion.

After being in charge for almost her entire career, Yasmin has now taken charge of her own business, OR RN Mentor. Here, she provides expert insights, practical tips, and real-world experiences designed to help others thrive in the OR. Now that’s what I call giving back.

In the five-minute snippet: it’s 80’s rock for the win. For Yasmin's bio, visit my website (link below) and check out my CE library to see if you can earn CE's just for listening!

CNOR Certified Perioperative Nurse

AORN Association of Perioperative Registered Nurses

IFPN International Federation of Perioperative Nurses

Contact The Conversing Nurse podcast
Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/theconversingnursepodcast/
Website: https://theconversingnursepodcast.com
Your review is so important to this Indie podcaster! You can leave one here! https://theconversingnursepodcast.com/leave-me-a-review
Would you like to be a guest on my podcast? Pitch me! https://theconversingnursepodcast.com/intake-form
Check out my guests' book recommendations! https://bookshop.org/shop/theconversingnursepodcast

I've partnered with RNegade.pro! You can earn CE's just by listening to my podcast episodes! Check out my CE library here: https://rnegade.thinkific.com/collections/conversing-nurse-podcast

Thanks for listening!

Transcript

[00:01] Michelle: My guest this week is Yasmin Sharifi, an operating room nurse with many decades of experience.

[00:08] She's here to give us a glimpse into,

[00:10] as she says,

[00:11] what really goes on behind that red line.

[00:15] Yasmin didn't initially set out to be an OR nurse. She started her career in med-surg, but quickly encountered burnout due to a nursing shortage and inadequate patient-to-nurse ratios, often sharing 35 patients with another nurse.

[00:31] Realizing this was not sustainable, she transitioned to the PACU.

[00:36] When she was offered a chance to move into the operating room,

[00:39] she embraced the opportunity and discovered her true passion.

[00:44] Yasmin pointed out that in 1990,

[00:48] there were no formal orientation programs for OR nurses.

[00:52] However,

[00:52] resourcefulness is a nurse's superpower.

[00:56] She joined the professional organization AORN,

[01:00] purchased relevant books, and trained herself to adapt to the role.

[01:05] Fortunately, those days are behind us.

[01:08] Nurses entering the operating room today receive a comprehensive education and an orientation period that lasts nearly a year.

[01:17] And if you think being an OR nurse means you won't have to interact with patients and their families,

[01:22] Yasmin dispels that myth completely.

[01:26] We discussed the dynamics among the operating room team players,

[01:30] the egos involved, and the common goal that brings them all together:

[01:35] the patient.

[01:36] I'm confident you'll enjoy and learn from our discussion.

[01:41] After being in charge for almost her entire career,

[01:45] Yasmin now has taken charge of her own business,

[01:49] OR RN Mentor.

[01:51] Here she provides expert insights, practical tips, and real world experiences designed to help others thrive in the OR.

[02:01] And that's what I call giving back. In the five minute snippet:

[02:06] It's 80s rock for the win.

[02:26] Well, good morning, Yasmin. Welcome to the podcast.

[02:30] Yasmin: Good morning. Thank you, Michelle. Thanks for having me.

[02:34] Michelle: It is my pleasure, Yasmin.

[02:37] I'm trying to remember where we met and I think,

[02:41] I think you reached out to me and you filled out the "Be My Guest" form and I saw your bio and it was very interesting and said, yeah, let's talk.

[02:53] So that's why you're here today,

[02:56] Do I have that correct?

[02:56] Yasmin: Yes, I did.

[02:59] Michelle: Yes. And you are an operating room nurse and we'll talk about all that. I haven't talked to an operating room nurse specifically.

[03:07] I've talked to a lot of players in the operating room, so CRNAs, RNFAs,

[03:15] folks like that.

[03:17] I've been wanting to talk to an OR nurse,

[03:21] Because I know that you lend a different perspective.

[03:24] So why don't you give us an introduction into,

[03:30] you know, why you became a nurse and how did you get into OR Nursing?

[03:35] Yasmin: Sure.

[03:36] So the journey started 36 years ago.

[03:41] I really didn't know what I wanted to do out of high school,

[03:46] and my friend was going into nursing, and I thought, oh, that sounds really great, because I wanted to go into medicine and healthcare and taking care of people. And so that sort of started that whole journey, if you will,

[04:01] went through nursing school,

[04:02] graduated, worked on a medical surgical floor in a teaching hospital,

[04:08] and in New Jersey, and then moved to California. And when I moved to California,

[04:14] I thought, oh, that's where I want to go, back to a med-surg unit.

[04:18] And I got a job on a med-surg unit and realized that I actually had burnout from med-surg. I just,

[04:27] I couldn't do it. The passion wasn't there anymore.

[04:30] And so I started looking for something else. 

[04:34] I was about two years into my career as a nurse, and I started looking for something different and found a job at a surgery center.

[04:44] And they hired me without experience,

[04:47] and that was sort of the beginning of my or career 35 years ago, I stepped into that surgery center. They actually hired me as a PACU nurse.

[04:59] And a week into it,

[05:02] the director of the facility says, hey, do you want to try the OR?

[05:06] And I thought, oh,

[05:08] sure, it looks interesting. I mean, I don't know what's going on behind that red line, but I'll give it a try. I was young. I was willing to,

[05:16] you know, try something new, and it was all good. And that was the beginning of it, and kind of the rest is history. I started there, I trained,

[05:26] I kind of learned on my own. I, you know, gathered information. I joined AORN.

[05:31] I bought the book, and sort of started my own Periop 101, if you will. And by the time I left that facility, I was in charge of it.

[05:41] I was in charge of the OR.

[05:43] And then, you know, it just went from there. And I've been in it ever since and just absolutely love it.

[05:49] Michelle: So that is a fascinating story. And one thing that popped out right away was that only two years into your career, you were all already feeling burnt out.

[06:01] And what do you think contributed to that?

[06:04] Yasmin: I think it was.

[06:06] Well, it definitely was 

[06:09] The job itself. I just, you know, it was funny. I have to. If I think back right now, I took a job on a medical unit thinking I was going to experience what I experienced at the teaching hospital, not realizing that even at the teaching hospital back in New Jersey there were no ratios.

[06:26] Let me just put that out there. We didn't have ratios and we were in a huge nursing shortage crisis.

[06:33] And when I say crisis, I tell you I was working the night shift with only one other nurse and an NA and we had 35 patients and we split the floor.

[06:44] And I didn't realize what I was feeling at the time until I moved out here and took a job. And it was,

[06:53] even though there were ratios, I think back then, I'm not sure it was. I think I was just feeling the trauma from what had occurred and I thought, I just can't do this even another day.

[07:05] It was hard work.

[07:07] I was a new grad. So, you know, as new grads, you've got these rose colored glasses and you think all is well and you're doing the work because you're finally an RN.

[07:17] But until you step away and step into a different environment, I don't think you realize, oh my God, that was not good.

[07:25] That was really hard.

[07:26] And I think that's what I was feeling. And so I just needed the change. I just, it, I wasn't really doing anything for my patients and that wasn't good or anything for myself for that matter.

[07:37] And I wasn't loving it like I did when I graduated. And so at that point, point you really start to need, you need to start looking at something else because I didn't want to lose that passion.

[07:48] So I think that that would have been, if I look back now, that's probably the reason why.

[07:52] Michelle: I think that would just resonate with so many nurses, especially nurses that started when we did. And like you pointed out, there were no formal orientation trainings. Right, right.

[08:07] You just,

[08:09] you said yourself, you know, you joined AORN and we'll talk about the professional organizations and those benefits and you just started learning what you needed to know. And I think for so many of us that started way back, you know, 30, 25, 30, 35 and more years ago, that's what we did.

[08:29] And also,

[08:30] you know, we didn't have ratios.

[08:33] Exactly what you said. And,

[08:35] and I've heard from so many nurses that have worked on,

[08:40] you know, large med-surg floors about splitting the floor with another RN, sometimes with an LVN and having to also look over the LVNs patients.

[08:53] And you know, I always say, thank God I practiced in California because we have some of those things in place and,

[09:04] and I think our patients are better for it and we are better for it too.

[09:08] So thank you for sharing that, Yasmin.

[09:11] Okay, so I'm kind of looking at a lens of,

[09:17] Let's say I want to go into OR. I'm a nurse and I want to go into OR.

[09:22] How long is my orientation going to be?

[09:26] Yasmin: That's a great question.

[09:28] So the Periop 101 is a six month training program and that seems to be the standard that most organizations are turning to nowadays.

[09:39] If you go to a big hospital,

[09:41] you're going to get that formal training, which absolutely is great because they lay it out for you.

[09:48] I've talked to a lot of nurses who have taken up, taken jobs at surgery centers or smaller hospitals. And when I say small hospitals, we're talking three, four operating rooms where they, they teach you as you go sort of thing.

[10:02] There's no real formal training.

[10:05] I believe that the Periop 101 really does set a very strong foundation and it, and it gives you what you need to be a great OR nurse. So if you could find that, that would be great.

[10:18] But to answer your question,

[10:19] it is a six month program. So once you're done,

[10:23] there is still some training that needs to be done.

[10:26] You graduate, but you still need that on the job. As I say, training and experience that comes once you step into the or. So it's a three month didactic,

[10:37] three month working the OR with a preceptor. And then what I like to do is give the nurse a month or two on their own with a buddy, if you will, preceptor buddy at arm's length,

[10:53] sort of in the wings if you, if you need that help.

[10:56] I think or nursing training truly does take about a year to be confident and able to run a room on your own without real issues.

[11:10] So I would say about eight months to a year. But it also depends on the nurse.

[11:15] Some learn very quickly,

[11:17] really pick it up fast.

[11:19] Some it takes a little bit of time. And that's okay because it is a completely different environment and it could be overwhelming at times. So I tell people,

[11:30] don't look at your buddy across the way.

[11:33] You know, take your time and learn it and it will come.

[11:37] But it's anywhere between, I would say, six, eight,

[11:40] nine months,

[11:42] a year max to really be confident and comfortable in the OR environment.

[11:47] Michelle: Okay, well, that's a good basis. It seems like,

[11:51] that's not enough time.

[11:55] Um, but you know, how, how long before, as a nurse, how long do you think before I feel like I'm not new anymore at it?

[12:07] Yasmin: Oh,

[12:08] I would say anywhere from two to five years. At five years,

[12:15] you don't feel the newness anymore.

[12:19] I hate to put.

[12:20] I hate to say,

[12:22] you know, put some

[12:24] A timeframe around it because again,

[12:26] it's very specific to the person.

[12:30] But I think at two years you're feeling comfortable, like, I've got this. And at five years, I think you are,

[12:38] I wouldn't say expert, but, you know, you do feel like you are no longer a new nurse.

[12:44] I have spoken to a lot of nurses at that five year mark who still feel like, oh, you know, this could be, I'm not an expert. I still feel like it's kind of new to me.

[12:56] So it's also their perspective. Right.

[12:59] But I would say anywhere between two and five years.

[13:02] It's a huge learning curve, the operating room, because it's nothing like any other type of nursing. And so I think nurses have to give themselves a little bit of grace when it comes to the operating room because the environment is so different.

[13:16] But I think at five years, you could comfortably say that.

[13:21] Michelle: And I can imagine that in that span of five years, the way technology is going,

[13:26] it's like, probably new things come in all the time,

[13:30] new techniques, new surgical techniques, but you're seeing new surgeons come and go and they have their own set of, you know, preferences. So that sounds like it's right on.

[13:43] And also with other nurses in other specialties too. I think it just takes that amount of time to feel comfortable and not like, I'm the new kid on the block.

[13:55] Yasmin: Yeah, I would agree.

[13:58] Michelle: So can I go right into operating room nursing from nursing school?

[14:05] Yasmin: Yes.

[14:06] There was a time years ago, when we graduated, when I graduated, we graduated 35 years ago.

[14:12] You needed to have two years of med-surg experience before entering the operating room.

[14:18] Those days are gone.

[14:19] We no longer require that.

[14:22] And we need nurses. And so we will take new grads. And new grads do great.

[14:29] They do phenomenally well.

[14:32] So we're happy to have them.

[14:35] We love the excitement that we see on their faces and the desire to be in the OR. So, yes, you can.

[14:41] You can come with experience from another unit, or you can come as a new grad. We would love to have you. So no requirement.

[14:50] Michelle: I'm so happy to hear that.

[14:52] And that's been kind of my resounding battle cry through my whole podcasting journey is like, can we just get rid of that two years?

[15:04] You have to do something that you don't particularly love, that maybe is not your passion, and, and wait until you can live your passion.

[15:14] So I'm so glad that's changing.

[15:17] So if I did,

[15:19] let's say I did go out of school onto a generalized floor, like a med-surg floor,

[15:26] or, you know, what kind of experience is helpful if I'm going to transition into the OR.

[15:33] Yasmin: Well, I would say that your assessment skills,

[15:37] you don't want to lose those. The thing about the OR, what I tell nurses all the time is unfortunately, everything that you learned in nursing school sort of goes away because it's so different.

[15:49] There's just,

[15:50] you're not doing IVs, you're not putting NG tubes in, you're not dealing with drips or pumps or anything like that.

[15:58] But I will say that you want to make sure that your assessment skills are strong. You want to be able to assess your patients preoperatively, intraoperatively,

[16:08] and post operatively.

[16:10] And your Foley skills will become highly used because we do put a lot of Foleys in,

[16:18] but that would be about it.

[16:20] You start to learn different aspects of nursing that you never knew existed.

[16:26] But that would really be it. That's why it, you know, whether you have experience or not, we,

[16:33] it doesn't really affect your learning in the OR because it's just so different.

[16:39] Michelle: Very good.

[16:41] Okay, well, here's a question that I've been burning to ask you.

[16:45] So I come from a family of lots of nurses and most of them are operating  room nurses.

[16:50] And I did not choose

[16:53] that specialty.

[16:54] And you know, they would try to get me to, hey, you need to come over to the OR. And I'm like, no, you know, I like what I do.

[17:02] I like talking to families.

[17:04] I like talking to my patients.

[17:06] I think it's a big misconception that when you work in the operating room, all of your patients are going to be asleep and you're not going to have any patient interaction.

[17:17] So is that true?

[17:19] And if you do have patient interaction, what kind of interaction is that?

[17:26] Yasmin: So not true.

[17:28] We do have patient interaction. We have it in the pre-op setting when we go to meet our patients and do our pre op assessment. What I tell nurses is our job is tough in the OR because we only have a short period of time to really make an impression on our patient and to really connect and bond with our patients.

[17:49] So that pre-op assessment is really crucial.

[17:52] It's critical to the patient's wellbeing knowing that they're being taken care of.

[17:58] And you have to do your best to make that connection with your patient. But absolutely in the pre-op setting we go and meet our patients, we talk to them, we ask them questions, we get to know them.

[18:10] Sometimes their families are there, we get to know their families.

[18:13] We unfortunately don't have, you know, hours and days to be with them and really get to know them, but we do spend some time before surgery talking to them and getting to know them.

[18:25] And that really does make a difference in how the patient does afterwards as well. Just knowing that they're in good hands. So it's really important for the nurse to make

[18:36] that connection with the patient. So,

[18:39] nope, they're not asleep the whole time.

[18:42] There is some talking that has to be done and some interacting and some assessing and you know, looking at things that have to be done before they go to sleep.

[18:52] But remember, 

[18:53] you are the last person they see before they go to sleep. So you are there to comfort them in the OR,

[19:00] hold their hand and make sure that they go off to sleep comfortably. So pretty important job I think,

[19:08] Michelle: Man, so important.

[19:09] And from a patient standpoint. So I,

[19:14] I had a mastectomy in 2009 for breast cancer and I was really blessed that my sister-in-law was an OR nurse at that time.

[19:25] And so she was the person that got to, you know, take me into the OR.

[19:31] And she was the last person I saw before I went to sleep. She was the first person I saw when I woke up.

[19:39] And so that was really cool. And that person,

[19:44] and I've had some other surgeries too and I can vouch like that person, that OR nurse is so,

[19:50] so important.

[19:51] And I think they have to be really on their game and have a lot of emotional intelligence to understand exactly how vulnerable patients feel when they go into surgery.

[20:07] Yasmin: Absolutely.

[20:09] That you bring up a very good point is I often tell them, put yourself in their shoes, right. If that was you,

[20:16] how would you want that OR nurse to take care of you?

[20:19] Because it's a scary time whether you're a nurse or not.

[20:23] As a patient, things change and especially patients who don't know what's happening,

[20:28] they really rely on the OR nurse to comfort them, answer their questions and make sure they're safe. And that is a big job,

[20:37] but an important one. So you have to take it seriously and understand the vulnerable position that they're in.

[20:45] It's very scary going to sleep and not being in control of anything. So these are the things that we learn as we learn how to be a really good OR nurse.

[20:55] These are the important things,

[20:57] I mean, you can circulate and set up the case, but the patient ultimately is the center of all of that. And you have to take that in mind.

[21:07] Absolutely, yeah

[21:08] Michelle: Yeah, that's fantastic. So is there a certain personality type who goes into operating room nursing?

[21:17] Yasmin: Yes.

[21:18] You have to be someone who,

[21:21] number one, is not afraid to speak up. You have to be someone who is extremely vocal,

[21:27] tough skinned,

[21:29] and I mean that. We talk about that in nursing, but truly in the OR, it requires 

[21:35] I say a strong personality, but someone who advocates for the patient because remember, your patient's asleep and can't really speak. So you have to be that person to speak up for them.

[21:47] So it has to be someone who isn't shy,

[21:50] is willing to speak up when someone else isn't tough-skinned,

[21:56] resourceful,

[21:58] organized, extremely organized.

[22:01] And yeah, I think those, those are the important ones.

[22:05] You're dealing with a surgeon who could get unruly sometimes. So you have to be able to put them back into place.

[22:15] Michelle: I love that. Could get unruly.

[22:18] Yasmin: Yes.

[22:19] Michelle: And see,

[22:20] this is primarily the reason I did not go into operating room nurse nursing, Yasmin,

[22:27] Because I'm not that type.

[22:30] So who is in charge in the operating room? Is there like a person that kind of everyone looks to,

[22:39] to call the shots?

[22:41] I would venture to say a lot of people think it's the surgeon, but I don't think that. But you tell me.

[22:49] Yasmin: You are correct. Even though the surgeon is the one doing the surgery.

[22:53] I always say the nurses run the operating room. And they do.

[22:56] We are the ones who,

[22:58] aside from the physicians, have a license. Right. So we are the ones who manage the room and make sure that we are practicing according to standards and policies and protocols.

[23:09] But there are many layers in the operating room. We have charge nurses, we have supervisors, we have directors,

[23:16] and we escalate as need be because sometimes you need added support in a room if a surgeon is not wanting to follow the rules as they're laid out.

[23:29] So, you know, nurses are able to call the charge or the supervisor for assistance.

[23:34] And I advocate for that all the time because I think you get more done in numbers. Sometimes you need that,

[23:41] that person to help support you and help, you know, explain what needs to be explained.

[23:48] But, you know, the nurses in the room are the ones in charge. I tell them that all the time.

[23:53] Don't be fooled. It's not the surgeon,

[23:56] it is you.

[23:59] And don't forget it.

[24:00] Michelle: Yes. I love that. I love that you're teaching that. And we're going to talk about your teaching in a little bit because that's such a huge thing to be able to teach the new ones coming in.

[24:12] But, yeah, I would think a lot of people,

[24:14] lay people, think, you know, yeah, the surgeons run the operating room. And I always laugh when I hear that.

[24:21] I'm like,

[24:23] I don't think so.

[24:25] Yasmin: Yeah, no. News flash. They don't.

[24:30] Michelle: News flash.

[24:31] Okay, well since we're talking about personalities,

[24:35] let's talk about personalities. There are some big personalities in the operating room.

[24:43] So a lot of type A's, a lot of alphas.

[24:47] How do they all play nicely in the sandbox together in the operating room?

[24:55] Yasmin: First of all, I think the most important thing is to understand is that there is a patient on the table that should be our focus.

[25:03] So all egos and whatnot need to stay outside and we need to focus on the patient.

[25:10] When you have players in the room like that, I think as an OR nurse,

[25:15] you have to read the room and know what you're dealing with, who you're dealing with,

[25:22] and then address as needed.

[25:26] Sometimes there are,

[25:27] you know, I say this, the battles to fight. Some you fight and some you don't. Hills to die on.

[25:33] There are. And then there are those that you just let go.

[25:37] And if you don't know, then you call for help and help manage that.

[25:41] But I think as an OR nurse, it's important to understand the players in your room. I think once you start working and getting to know who all of your players are, you start to understand their personalities and then you, you better manage your own because you know just how they are going to react.

[25:59] And that's part of OR nursing as well, is handling different personalities.

[26:04] Because every day is a different day. Every day it's a different surgeon and a different team. And you just have to understand how to manage them and, and work with them and communicate with them.

[26:15] And communication is key.

[26:18] It is of utmost importance in the or clear communication and being able to articulate your needs and just being aware of what's going on at all times.

[26:33] So it's a little bit of a juggling act. There's a lot going on that you as the OR nurse have to manage.

[26:41] Patient, personalities, procedure, you know, the three P's of all.

[26:48] And it's a lot. But I think as you get better at it you become more proficient.

[26:55] It becomes a little easier. But sometimes you have to call in some for some backup help,

[27:02] call for backup.

[27:06] Call the calvary.

[27:08] Get your resources in,

[27:10] because Dr. so-and-so is in a mood.

[27:15] Michelle: You know, I think back to all the OR nurses and a lot of them are my, you know, my brothers and I,

[27:21] I just think they, they have to have such a,

[27:24] a high level of,

[27:26] again, emotional intelligence to,

[27:29] like you said, read the room and figure out what they need to do when they need to do it.

[27:34] And it's a real gift that you guys have. So thanks for talking about that.

[27:39] Yasmin: Thank you.

[27:41] Michelle: So let's talk about professional organizations.

[27:46] My listeners know I'm a fan. I've talked about them a lot.

[27:50] But specifically for the operating room nurse,

[27:54] there is the big one, I guess is the AORN.

[27:59] And then there's also,

[28:02] I did find the IFPN, the International Federation of Perioperative Nurses.

[28:09] But Yasmin, talk about the benefit of those professional organizations for nurses.

[28:16] Yasmin: Oh, wow. I've been a member of AORN since I stepped in the OR. I think without them I probably wouldn't be where I am because they really set the foundation.

[28:28] Organizations such as AORN are great for resources,

[28:34] CE's, learning modules,

[28:37] information,

[28:38] articles,

[28:40] and anyway, I mean, they really help you become a better OR nurse.

[28:46] They are, they have definitely evolved over the years.

[28:49] A lot of what they produce now is evidence-based.

[28:53] If you look at the standards,

[28:55] standard practice book, they've changed the name a couple of times.

[28:59] Everything is based on evidence.

[29:02] And that really helps drive nursing and nursing change. Right. Based on that evidence.

[29:10] And so, and they've done a lot of work around that. So they really are the gold standard when it comes to the OR.

[29:17] And I just think that they're just a great resource to have in your back pocket because they have just so much to offer when it comes to learning and strengthening your skills as an OR nurse.

[29:28] And then if you have questions, you always reach out to them and they can answer your questions for you too. If you have a practice question that's come up that you can't find the answer to, well, you just turn to AORN and they,

[29:39] they can answer it for you.

[29:41] So, yeah, 

[29:43] I just came back from AORN just a couple of weeks ago. They were in Boston.

[29:47] It's just a great,

[29:49] very valuable resource for OR nurses, especially when you're new.

[29:53] A great place to start and buy your standards book.

[29:57] Michelle: Yeah. And I would add to that, like you said, conferences,

[30:01] a great networking. They probably have listservs like many professional organizations do. So if you're a nurse and you're wondering, you know, what's going on in other operating rooms or you have a specific problem, you can reach out and get a lot of feedback.

[30:18] And I was definitely,

[30:21] I loved being a member of the National Association for Neonatal Nurses NANN for many years and found that to be very helpful in my

[30:34] practice. So.

[30:37] Great.

[30:38] And then talk about certifications.

[30:41] So I know There is a C.N.O.R. certified perioperative nurse.

[30:48] And are those things required or are they just nice to have talk about that.

[30:54] Yasmin: Well, they're not required in most organizations, but they are. And I don't think that they're a nice to have. I think they're important to have. And one of the reasons why is certification states and it means that you are an expert in the field that you are working in.

[31:15] And so I, I wear my CNOR with pride because it just tells me and everyone else that I know what I'm doing.

[31:23] I understand the standards, I practice to the standards,

[31:27] and that's the type of nurse I am.

[31:30] And I think that's what certification sort of does. It kicks you up a notch. It gives you,

[31:35] it tells your patients, it tells people around you that this person knows what they're doing. They know the standards in which they're practicing in, within and around. And so I think it is important to have.

[31:50] And a lot of organizations are now reimbursing you for taking the test, which I think is great. Some organizations give you a bonus for having it. I never had that.

[32:00] I just wanted to be certified because I knew what it meant.

[32:05] It's a nice to have on the resume. But again,

[32:08] I think it's more than that.

[32:10] And that's why I've had it for so long. I think it's an important part of what I do.

[32:15] It is a part of what I do. And I think every OR nurse, after you've completed the two years of experience should definitely sit for the CNOR.

[32:27] Michelle: Yeah. Yasmin, I would echo everything that you just said. I again, I like you. I wore my RNC-NIC certification very proudly and many times. The family,

[32:43] because it was on my badge, you know, they would say, what does that mean? What do all those letters mean?

[32:48] Yeah. And I took a lot of pride in explaining like this is like some rigorous testing and it shows that, you know, 

[32:57] I've kind of went above and beyond and I'm practicing at the gold standard. And I think they appreciated that. And I think our colleagues also appreciate that. Maybe our institutions appreciate it.

[33:13] I know a lot of institutions really encourage nurses to get certified and they are reimbursing nurses for that. So I think that's great too.

[33:22] But yeah, thank you for speaking to that. I think it's very valuable.

[33:27] So we are going to talk about your teaching now because you have a business 

[33:32] And you teach nurses how to navigate the operating room.

[33:38] But talk about that and talk about why you started that and just what it's all about.

[33:45] Yasmin: Yes,

[33:45] so I started OR RN Mentor because I, number one, love to teach.

[33:52] I am a nursing director and I don't get to teach as much as I like to. I actually love being in the OR and to this day I put on scrubs and I go into the OR because I love meeting the new Periop students and I love teaching them and I love talking to them and 

[34:14] It's so important for us who have been in around for 30 plus years to share with them what we know and I love sharing what I know and talking about the OR because I love it so much.

[34:26] But the OR RN Mentor came about because of that and because there isn't really a lot out there when it comes to CE's for OR nurses.

[34:38] AORN is the only one that I'm aware of that I've ever gone to for CEs.

[34:45] So there's not a lot out there just specifically for OR nurses. So OR RN Mentor does that. It provides CEs specifically for OR nurses along with support in OR nursing.

[34:59] We have a blog, we have a newsletter, anything around OR nursing that can help our new nurses navigate the overwhelming OR environment and,

[35:12] you know, just get comfortable in it. There's a lot of angst. Sometimes it' can be a little scary at times,

[35:21] a little stressful. And so we want to just be there for them and let them know they're not alone and what they're going through is not unusual and it will get better over time.

[35:33] But we also want to provide that education resource as well, so.

[35:39] Michelle: Well, that's fantastic.

[35:41] I love first of all that you are mentoring other nurses. I think again, it's just a wonderful thing to do.

[35:49] Nurses that had been in nursing when I got in mentored me and I mentored other nurses throughout my nursing journey. And I just think it's so important and, and I love that you are providing CEs because that is something that we all need and you know, even better that they are tailored to the operating room.

[36:13] So very cool.

[36:15] Thank you yeah.

[36:17] You know, I thought of this question.

[36:19] It came up during another conversation,

[36:22] and I just want to see what your take on it is.

[36:26] So what do you think?

[36:28] Do you think OR nurses, circulating nurses should also be able to scrub?

[36:36] Yasmin: Yes.

[36:39] So to answer your question, yes, I think they should know how to scrub, however,

[36:43] and the reason why is when they know how to scrub it and then they go to circulate, it just gives them a different perspective,

[36:52] and it helps them to understand the procedure and anticipate needs, the surgeon's needs.

[37:00] The problem with that is that scrubbing in and of itself is another six months of training and something that you have to do day in and day out,

[37:15] because every case, every surgeon is a little different and there's just so much involved.

[37:23] So not that or nurses should not scrub. I absolutely think it is very helpful to circulating,

[37:31] but it just becomes another training experience that a lot of organizations can't afford,

[37:40] and so it makes it very difficult.

[37:43] However,

[37:43] I think OR nurses should take advantage of opportunities and ask for that if they want it.

[37:53] And what I mean when I say that I myself learn how to scrub not because they want it to teach me, but because I want it to learn.

[38:03] So every time I had downtime, there was an opportunity I would ask, hey, can I scrub in this case?

[38:10] And I would do that as many times as I could.

[38:12] Rather than going and sitting in the lounge or getting another coffee break,

[38:17] I would forego some of that and get in the room and scrub.

[38:21] So I think it's something you also, if you really want to learn how to do, it, you have to take advantage of downtime and ask if you can scrub into a case so that you can learn how to.

[38:32] do that. You may not become proficient,

[38:36] but at least you will have an idea of what it is and what the procedure is and actually just get some exposure to it. So that's a tough one.

[38:46] Michelle: Well, thank you for weighing in on that. I had this conversation with one of my other guests because the institution where I worked for many years,

[38:55] we had an OR that was for C-sections and, you know, like emergency obstetrical procedures, you know, emergency D&C,

[39:09] stuff like that.

[39:10] And we had scrub techs and we had a clinical educator for labor and delivery that was very much one of these people or nurses that said,

[39:23] you know, circulating nurses need to know how to scrub in case of an emergency.

[39:29] We never accomplished that in our institution in labor and delivery anyway. And I think it was for primarily the reasons that you stated that it's very difficult to take that person away from circulating and put them in a scrub position and teach them how to scrub.

[39:48] It takes a long time.

[39:50] So thank you for speaking on that and for your perspective on that.

[39:56] All right. Well, gosh, we've talked about a lot. Yasmin, is there anything else that you wanted to weigh in on? Anything else that you wanted to talk about before we close here?

[40:06] Yasmin: I encourage anyone who has any inkling of the OR, OR nursing to do some homework. We would love to have you. I think,

[40:18] if you are looking to get into the OR,

[40:21] I do know that there are hospitals that provide some internships.

[40:26] Some schools actually give you a day or two in the OR as a rotation.

[40:32] Reach out to OR hospitals or nurses.

[40:36] Directors, charge nurses, ask if they do any kind of volunteering in the or internships in the or. That's the best way to find out if the OR is for you.

[40:48] But I love it. It's been my home for 35 years. I can't imagine being anywhere else.

[40:55] I enjoy it still to this day.

[40:58] Love circulating and scrubbing and try to get in there as much as I can. But it's been great to me and I'm happy to,

[41:07] you know, help anyone who needs to figure or navigate that world out.

[41:13] Michelle: Fantastic. Yeah, I know our listeners can't see you, but I can see the smile on your face

[41:20] And the glow that you have when you talk about it. And it's so wonderful to have, like, this passion and this deep love and commitment to what you do. 

[41:33] It's life changing. So I can totally see that. Yeah. And thank you for that great advice.

[41:40] So where can we find you if people want to reach out and have questions for you, Yasmin?

[41:46] Yasmin: They can find me on Instagram @orrnmentor. They can DM me. They can send me a message.

[41:53] They can email me at hello@ORRNmentor as well.

[41:57] And I'm happy to assist anyone who has any questions.

[42:02] Just reach out and we can chat.

[42:05] Definitely.

[42:06] Michelle: Perfect. Well, here's another loaded question for you. Is there someone you recommend as a guest on this podcast?

[42:16] Yasmin: Ooh, well, I have a mentor of my own who helped me start ORRN Mentor, which was Cat Golden. I don't know if you've heard of Cat.

[42:31] Michelle: Oh, my gosh, yes.

[42:34] Yasmin: She's great.

[42:34] Michelle: Of course. Who hasn't heard of Cat Golden? Yeah.

[42:37] Yasmin: Wow, she's great.

[42:39] Talk about going from peds nursing to entrepreneurship and something completely different.

[42:46] And then there's also Erica Browning. But I know you've had Erica on your show before,

[42:52] so. I love Erica too. She's great. I love her.

[42:55] Michelle: She's amazing. Yes.

[42:59] Yasmin: There's some great nurses out there. Off the top of my head.

[43:02] Michelle: Okay, cool. Well, I'm going to hit you up and see if you can make an introduction. That's fantastic.

[43:08] Yasmin: I will, definitely. Yes.

[43:11] Michelle: Thank you, Yasmin. Thank you. I appreciate it. And man, I appreciate you reaching out and wanting to share all your knowledge. And you certainly have done that today,

[43:23] so I appreciate it.

[43:25] And you know, at the end,

[43:27] Yasmin, we do the five minute snippet. It's just five minutes of fun for everyone to see.

[43:35] When you let your hair down and you're not that operating room nurse, the entrepreneur,

[43:41] the instructor, you're just Yasmin. So you ready to play?

[43:46] Yasmin: Ready to play.

[43:48] Michelle: It's just five minutes.

[43:50] Yasmin: Okay? 

[44:30] Okay, convince me to live in your hometown.

[44:34] Yasmin: Oh, great weather. Beach, mountains. Yeah, just fantastic weather. Weather. Weather doesn't snow and it never falls before below 50 or 45 degrees.

[44:53] Michelle: Oh my gosh. Sounds amazing. 

[44:57] Yasmin: We've hardly had any rain but I don't think that's a good thing.

[44:59] Michelle: Right? I know. That's true. Very cool. Okay, what's been your best purchase under $100.

[45:09] Yasmin: Oh my God. Under $100? My best purchase. Oh, wow. I was gonna say my OR shoes. Those were actually at a hundred dollars.

[45:22] Michelle: Oh, that's close.

[45:25] Yasmin: That's a tough one.

[45:27] Michelle: I know. It is.

[45:28] Yasmin: Maybe we'll see. My OR shoes.

[45:30] Michelle: Okay, your OR shoes. Okay.

[45:34] Yasmin: Yeah.

[45:35] Michelle: What is playing on your OR soundtrack? Because we didn't talk about music in the OR. But you guys play music in there, right?

[45:45] Yasmin: We do.

[45:46] For me, it would be 80s music all the time because I'm an 80s girl. So it would be a lot of 80s music,

[45:55] but it's always the surgeon gets to pick.

[45:58] So we have a little bit of say.

[46:01] Sometimes they'll tell us we could pick, but yeah, we let the surgeon pick.

[46:06] Michelle: He or she is not in charge of the OR, but maybe they can be in charge of the music.

[46:13] Yasmin: That's right. That's right.

[46:16] Michelle: Okay. When I'm working out, I feel_______.

[46:21] Yasmin: Oh, amazing. I love to spin. And it is a non negotiable for me.

[46:27] Exercise is part of everything I do. Has to be,

[46:31] because I can't be present for everyone if I don't feel good about myself. So it is very important.

[46:37] Feel great.

[46:39] Michelle: I love how you prioritize that. And you're like my daughter. She works out and she's like, I have to work out, like, for my mental health.

[46:50] Yasmin: Like, yes.

[46:51] Michelle: You know, and I was talking to her about it last night and I go,

[46:56] where did you get that from? Because, like, I,

[46:59] you know, I didn't get that. And I was telling her that I was going to be talking to you today and that,

[47:04] you know, exercise was really, like, crucial to, you know,

[47:09] your well being. And I said, maybe I can ask Yasmin to, like, send me some of those waves, you know, through. Through the airwaves.

[47:18] Yasmin: Definitely. Definitely. It keeps you on your toes in the OR too, because you do a lot. Yeah.

[47:25] Michelle: Yeah. I mean, okay, I know you love to travel, so what is the first thing you do when you get to your travel destination?

[47:36] Yasmin: Oh, find the best bar and restaurant, eat and drink.

[47:44] Michelle: How come travelers are such foodies? Right. They always want to. As soon as they get there. Like, they want to talk to the locals,

[47:52] find out where the great places to eat are. Where. Yeah. That's amazing.

[47:57] Yasmin: Yeah.

[47:58] Michelle: Love it. Okay.

[48:00] Yasmin: Find the best tacos.

[48:02] Michelle: Tacos. Yes. Okay. I'm a layperson, and you and I meet at a party, so tell me you're an OR nurse without telling me you're an OR nurse.

[48:16] Yasmin: Oh, wow. Scrubs, coffee and music.

[48:26] Michelle: That's great. Just those three things.

[48:29] Yasmin: That's it. Scrubs, coffee, music, gotta have the coffee and gotta have the music in the room. Yes.

[48:37] Michelle: Love it.

[48:38] Wow. Thank you so much, Yasmin. You did great on the five minute snippet. I knew you would because you're an OR nurse and OR nurses have a great sense of humor.

[48:47] Yasmin: You have to. Thanks, Michelle. That was good.

[48:52] Michelle: Yeah. Have a great rest of your day.

[48:55] Yasmin: Thanks. You too.