Murder in the Bayou, The Jeff Davis Eight

Eight women were found dead in Jennings, Louisiana. Nobody’s been held responsible.

That’s the case.

This all happens in Jefferson Davis Parish. Small town. Water everywhere. Canals, drainage ditches, roadside drops. If you’ve ever been down there, you already know—there are a lot of places where something can be left and not found right away. And when water gets involved, whatever was there doesn’t stay long.

We walk through it from 2005 to 2009 and stick to what actually holds up. Where the bodies were found. How close they were to each other. What lines up, and what doesn’t. The problem is, there isn’t one clean pattern. Same general area, same kind of recovery locations—but the details don’t lock in.

Then you get into who these women were. Same circles. Drugs. Unstable housing. Survival sex work. Whether it should matter or not, it does—because it affects how fast people react when someone disappears.

And then it starts to break down.

There are reports and allegations tied to local law enforcement. Some of it documented. Some of it coming from people in the community. We keep that line clear. But once that gets introduced, everything gets harder to trust. People stop talking, or they never talk in the first place.

We also run it through Kade Mercer to see if this even fits a normal serial case. It doesn’t really. No clean escalation. No consistent method. The only thing that holds is access—access to the same group of people, and access to places where bodies can be dropped.

At some point, you’re not looking at a clean theory anymore. You’re looking at a mess.

And that’s where it still sits.

Listen to the episode, then decide for yourself what you think actually happened in Jennings.

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Transcript

Bayou Roots And Small-Town Proximity

Andrea 0:00

You're listening to Things I Wanna Know.

Paul G 0:06

There are places where the ground doesn't just hold water. It holds memory. South Louisiana is one of them. Swamps that don't drain, canals that don't rush, heat that doesn't lift, French roots, old habits, and ways of handling things that don't always make sense if you're not from there. Jennings, Louisiana is not a big place. It doesn't need to be. Places like this don't operate on size, they operate on proximity. People overlap. Lives overlap. Problems. Overlap. If something happens, someone usually knows something. Or at least they think so.

Music 0:58

Down and Jenny. By the waterline. Same road. Same kind of nice. Then it's gone again. Nobody nobody still staying.

Paul G 1:57

This case spans two thousand five all the way to two thousand nine. In Jefferson Davis parish in Louisiana. And it's still still not solved.

Andrea 2:11

Still not solved?

Paul G 2:13

No. And there's a whole range of reasons why it's not solved.

Andrea 2:17

I mean, that really wasn't, I guess to me, that does not seem that. 20 years ago. Yeah. I think what, 2005, Alex was born to 2009, that was when pretty much Melissa was born. So to me, that doesn't feel that long ago. But yeah, I guess technically.

Paul G 2:36

I was still on insurance.

Andrea 2:38

Yeah, my kids were babies. I guess that that 20 years doesn't seem that long ago. But I I guess in retrospect it is. But that's really sad. Like there's nothing, no DNA, no smoking gun, no we'll get into it here.

Paul G 2:53

So let's see. Um eight women. Eight women were murdered and found in the bayou.

Andrea 3:02

Eight.

Paul G 3:02

Eight. Uh same geography. Uh and they all kind of knew each other or tertiarily and knew each other or something like that. And uh everything that I got here is documented uh with by what remains are you know what is reported, and it's a mess. It's a mess giant mess.

Andrea 3:25

So after 2009 it just stopped?

Paul G 3:29

I 2005, wasn't it? 2009, yeah. 2009, yeah, it just stopped.

unknown 3:34

Wow.

Paul G 3:34

I was in Colorado, so you can't blame me. What?

Andrea 3:41

What a thing to say.

Paul G 3:42

Well, I mean I have an alibi.

Andrea 3:44

All right, law enforcement, if you're listening, it's not Paul.

Paul G 3:46

I have an alibi.

Andrea 3:47

But I mean, I'm just like mind blown by that. I mean I mean there people mess up.

Paul G 3:54

Yeah, but it's low population down there though, too. There's like nobody lives there. Not really.

Andrea 4:00

Like what's what major town is it close to?

Paul G 4:03

Jennings that's in low country, uh, which is by you. Right? What uh water, it's everywhere. Uh and you it wouldn't make sense unless you've seen it. There's it's it's right at the water table, right at the ocean.

Andrea 4:21

Oh, that's forget right.

Paul G 4:22

It's not at the ocean though.

Andrea 4:24

When did Katrina hit oh five?

Paul G 4:26

Yeah, I think. I have to look it up.

Andrea 4:30

Uh yeah, because I I I remember.

Paul G 4:31

So it has a bunch of drainage canals cut through neighborhoods. You saw Stuttgart.

Andrea 4:35

Yeah.

Paul G 4:36

It's similar to that, but denser and not cultivated.

Andrea 4:41

Really?

Paul G 4:42

Yeah. Um those drainage ditches that you saw on the side of the road.

Andrea 4:47

Yeah.

Paul G 4:47

They used cut right through the neighborhoods.

Andrea 4:49

Oh wow.

Paul G 4:50

Yeah. Um, and it does it in Stuttgart a little bit too. Because it's not the bayou, but it's uh the delta.

Andrea 4:57

Yeah, I do remember we were driving to Florida, like it's definitely like looks like wet kind of like marshland kind of thing. Yeah. Which was different if you've never seen that before.

Paul G 5:06

But ditches, uh deep ditches on all all all sides of the roads. Every road has two ditches on each side and they're deep, right? And you don't have to go far to find a place where something could be left and not immediately found because it's just brush, no one really mows it back because it's a ditch and it's full of water half the time.

Andrea 5:29

Wow. I didn't think about that, but dang.

Ditches, Canals, And Vanishing Evidence

Paul G 5:32

So the social environment of this place, too, also matters, uh, just as much as the geography. Uh many of the victims moved within the same overlapping net or moved around inside the same over overlapping network, so they kind of all knew knew each other.

Andrea 5:49

Okay.

Paul G 5:50

They're all tied to drugs, unstable housing, survival-based sex work, things like that.

unknown 5:56

Oh wow.

Paul G 5:56

Well, there's not a lot of jobs.

Andrea 5:58

I mean, uh, is this a very like poor world community? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

Paul G 6:02

Extremely poor. Um, it didn't def doesn't define them, I don't think, but it definitely I identifies them.

Andrea 6:10

They're like, let me guess, classically known for sex workers, therefore probably ignored.

Paul G 6:15

Yeah, maybe. I mean, yeah, these are all these are all the the not the B players, but the D players in society.

Andrea 6:25

Well, the heavily drugs into drugs processes.

Paul G 6:28

Well, they're just poor, and they got nothing better to do and you know, South Louisiana, you saw it. I mean, it's nothing to do down there, man, except for drink and smoke.

Andrea 6:39

And sad thing though is these people probably have been met by I don't know, I'm guessing here, if they're into prostitution or, you know, sex workers and they've probably been arrested before for drugs or for that. And that doesn't exactly um you're kind of.

Paul G 6:54

Yeah, it kind of defined how quickly people reacted when they just disappeared.

Andrea 6:59

That's awful.

Paul G 7:00

Right. Uh and you know, people disappear in this place is for t days at a time just because there's nothing to do there, so they go to the big city, go to Montville or New Orleans or Baton Rouge or you know, anywhere but there. So they're used to people just taking off and leaving and coming back eventually. You know?

Andrea 7:21

Interesting. Okay. Never thought about that.

Paul G 7:23

Uh so back in May 2005, uh Loretta uh Chasen, Chia Chison, I don't know. Uh she disappeared, and but she was found in a drainage ditch in a drainage canal just outside of town. First body. Right? She wasn't buried, she wasn't concealed.

Andrea 7:45

Uh she was just left in a ditch.

Paul G 7:47

Yeah.

Andrea 7:48

Just out there for everyone to see.

Paul G 7:50

Yeah. No, it didn't didn't suggest planning or anything. They just put her in the water. And you know what, you it doesn't matter if they planned or not. When you throw somebody in the water, what happens to all the uh the evidence?

Andrea 8:00

The evidence is washed away.

Paul G 8:01

Yeah, that water disintegrates it, just gone.

Andrea 8:04

That's horrible to do to a person. Just literally throw them on the side of the road like trash.

Paul G 8:08

Then in June, Ernestine Patterson, she's found uh in a rural roadside area within the parish. And the parishes are counties. They they call that's the only state that calls their counties parishes. But the reason why they say rural roadside area is because the reporting from the official reporting places like police and coroner and things like that, they disagree. They did they all say different things.

Andrea 8:35

Really?

Paul G 8:36

Yeah, yeah.

Andrea 8:37

That's not good.

Paul G 8:38

No, it's not good at all. Uh so they're within weeks of each other that these two go these two ladies died.

Andrea 8:45

So May and then June.

Paul G 8:47

Yeah. Then in September, Laconia, Laconia Muggy Brown in September. She's found within the town, or within the parish limits, I guess. And now she's the third woman found in four months.

Andrea 9:04

They don't think like, ooh, alarm bells, we had a pattern here.

Paul G 9:07

Same general environment, same exposure, same type of recovery thing, you know, blah, blah, blah. And they still don't have a clue, no arrests, no suspects, no nothing. Right.

Andrea 9:17

Does this even make the news at this point? Probably not.

Paul G 9:20

Yeah, I think it made the news because there's a documentary on it, and you see a lot of news footage on it. So maybe it made these three made the news. I mean, three people dying in a place that people don't get murdered.

Andrea 9:31

Yeah. That would I would hope would like gain some new news attention.

Paul G 9:36

Maybe because you know, if it was socialite dies, it would be all over the place. But this person's, you know, hanging out in bars and things and using drugs. It's you know, not everybody wants to know about that.

Andrea 9:50

Still, I mean that's a pattern. The same disposal, I'm assuming, same kind of particular finding a ditch or in inside town, outside of town, or whatever. That that screams pattern.

Paul G 10:03

Yeah. Just thought toss them over the side. Um according to later reporting, though, uh, people in the community began connecting the women through shared acquaintances and overlapping drug activity. And so they started talking about who could have done this, who could have done that, who did she knew, right? But still there was nothing going on. There's the police, nothing. Not really. I mean, they looked at it, they logged it, put her in the county morgue, you know, all that good, all that good stuff. And then uh 2006, nobody looks like it kind of cleared up a little bit. Still nobody doing anything about it. And uh, family members were later quoted in reporting describing uh their that they were extremely frustrated with the law enforcement and the governmental entities not doing anything, not with just with the lack of answers, but with how slow they think the everything is moving.

Andrea 11:00

Well, I mean, if you think about it, I mean I can only imagine what it's like to be a victim's family, but they don't tell you everything for a reason.

Paul G 11:08

Yeah. But for the entire year, no nothing happened in the in the parish.

unknown 11:12

Nothing.

Andrea 11:13

Like he whoever this person is had like a d downtier.

Paul G 11:17

Yeah, it's just nothing happened. And then 2007. Uh Kristen Gary, she disappears and is found in a ditch or in a another one of those areas within the parish because again, they describe the different areas in the different reports.

Andrea 11:41

Okay, how d this town doesn't sound like it's very big. It doesn't sound like a lot's going on. How can you get this so confusing about the area? I mean, I I don't understand.

Paul G 11:52

And then a few months go by, in September in 2007, Crystal Benoit, she disappears and is found just like the others. Okay, five women now.

Andrea 12:06

If their friends can figure out that they knew each other, why can't the cops figure out some underlying connection?

Paul G 12:12

Well, at this point, you're right. I mean, about this time reporting uh begins to reflect a shift, right? The family members are quoted expressing concern that the victims' lifestyles affected how aggressively that the cops were pursuing it.

Andrea 12:28

Well, this has kind of been a pattern for a lot of cases where it's been like people who are sex workers are kind of like, oh, she's just a prostitute or sex worker. She knew she should have known better. This is a high-risk lifestyle, blah, blah, blah. They're still human beings. I mean, this has happened in lots of cases.

Paul G 12:42

Well, you know, if you go get down in those really lower parts of Louisiana and in Alabama and Mississippi and whatnot, where there's not a lot of population, you go back in time about 30, 40 years.

Andrea 12:54

Yeah, you do. I mean, we've driven through there and it was I grew up around there, so it was very eye-opening when we were going to Florida.

Paul G 13:02

Yeah. I have relatives that live in this part of the country. Not in Jefferson Parish, but near Yeah.

Andrea 13:09

I just even the billboards and stuff that we saw.

Paul G 13:12

The billboards.

Andrea 13:14

Yeah.

Paul G 13:14

The billboard in Pensacola that was on the way to Pensacola.

Andrea 13:17

It was in Alabama.

Paul G 13:18

It was in Pensacola.

Andrea 13:20

Was it in Alabama? I don't know.

Paul G 13:21

It was in Pensacola. I saw another one on the way to. Yes.

Andrea 13:27

And I wanted to, I was like, wow, you don't see this in Arkansas. I was gonna try to get a picture of it because I knew nobody would believe.

Paul G 13:35

We used to be able to turn the burn, but now you're gonna have to watch out.

Andrea 13:39

I mean it was a giant billboard. So I remember going, I was like, is gonorrhea an issue down here?

Paul G 13:46

It must be. Well, it is an airport space, so there's that.

Andrea 13:49

Yeah.

Paul G 13:50

Um, so advocacy groups, they begin raising concerns and uh they didn't want to they weren't trying to prove misconduct. Uh their implication whenever they were complaining about this stuff was neglect of the community at large. Well, if you don't have money, you're not gonna get help.

Andrea 14:11

Well, I mean, I don't know how police departments with very tight budgets handle stuff like that because you want to treat everybody the same, but how do you have we don't have money, you don't have money. I mean, what do you what do they do?

Paul G 14:24

Oh, they're broke down there, that's for sure. I mean, they might not be broke. I don't know. Maybe things have changed since then. I mean it's 20 years ago.

Andrea 14:31

I would hope so.

Paul G 14:34

Then in 2008, so they had another respite, 2008. I would be wondering who's in town during this time and who's not.

Andrea 14:42

What's going on in the town or what's going on in the environment? I'm thinking like, okay, I just listened to the documentary again on BTK's daughter, and uh it was very interesting, by the way, Netflix. But you know, he had cooling off periods too, and he was raising a family.

Paul G 14:56

Yeah, maybe who knows a 20-year cooling off period.

Andrea 14:58

Yeah, but like I'm thinking, like, okay, maybe after Katrina, things weren't so great down there. Yeah, I don't know. Just a guess.

Paul G 15:05

It could be somebody coming in from New Orleans, too.

Andrea 15:07

And then the next thing was like, what is going on in the town or in the area, or that would keep a cooling off period, or is this person married, has a family, or I mean, it's very interesting that it's like a year stretch and then all of a sudden he he or she starts.

Paul G 15:24

Well, he waits again from September all the way until May 2008. That's what's six, seven months. And Aurelia, Aurelia Jackson, Aurelia, I can't pronounce it. She's same thing. Exact same MO.

Andrea 15:40

Are they like missing? Are they all like I I don't know. I'm just guessing here. Like I I the red like districts of towns is not in my forte, but I'm guessing, do these women like, if they kind of know each other or go in the same circles as drugs, is there like one bar where all these people collect, or is there like a in the documentary there was there was just a couple places that they hung out.

unknown 16:01

Yeah.

Paul G 16:01

I would think that somebody'd notice if it was the same place all the time, wouldn't it?

Andrea 16:06

Can you not go in there and like talk to people and like you know think? Hey, there's this one guy that comes in every Wednesday and he's kind of creepy. I mean I Yeah.

Paul G 16:15

So now, and then after she's found, there's a three-year period.

Andrea 16:19

Three years.

Paul G 16:21

Uh and it become it starts to become it's a three-year period if those over those three years.

Andrea 16:29

Okay.

Paul G 16:29

Right? Uh it becomes something that exists in the background of the town. People are like, oh yeah, that happens.

Andrea 16:35

Oh my gosh. They're just like, oh yeah, it's like another day.

Cooling-Off Gaps And Open Questions

Paul G 16:38

Yeah. So we go from 2008, right? Or 2007. No, that's Christopher Benoit. Yeah, May 2008 to August 2009. Year and a half later, Nicole Gilroy disappears. And she's found in Jennings in the town. Gilroy had previously been identified as a witness in a 2002 case. This is kind of one of those things that's interested interesting. She would have been identified in a 2002 case as a witness involving alleged misconduct connected to law enforcement.

Andrea 17:18

Oh.

A Witness Link Sparks Conspiracies

Paul G 17:19

And this is where it throws the whole kink in the wrench. Or wrench in the kink. Actually, it's wrenching the never mind. Yeah. Um, so here's where the conspiracy theories start to fly.

Andrea 17:32

Oh, yeah. If it's got anything to do with somebody in and they're not doing anything about these women that are dying.

Paul G 17:37

Well, that's not not that we can see anyway.

Andrea 17:40

But if law enforcement is messed up in any sort any form or fashion, people are gonna run into that as like conspiracy theory big time.

Paul G 17:48

So the whole community's now talking about this, and even though this fact doesn't explain what happened to her, uh, it now inserts itself into the middle of this whole thing. And you can see why all of a sudden it just breaks down. Because now not only are the people that they're hanging out with suspects, now we've got police that are suspects. And it's not unheard of. Remember this. It's it's happened in MENA.

Andrea 18:16

Oh, yeah, yeah.

Paul G 18:17

With the kids on the tracks, yeah. The freaking prosecuting attorney, the special prosecutor, was the guy running the drugs into the county.

Andrea 18:25

Uh, you I still think like you didn't think about that. They probably didn't know, but they didn't know.

Paul G 18:29

They didn't know, but but but you see what I mean? So it does actually happen. It's not like we're pretending.

Andrea 18:35

No, yeah.

Paul G 18:36

This is a thing. It's like what? And then just a few days later, another lady, Whitney Dubois, she's now uh found in the same same circumstances. Two victims from rapid succession.

Andrea 18:54

And then what after that there's nobody?

Paul G 18:55

And then after that it's over. Nobody didn't happen anymore at all.

Andrea 19:00

That's so strange.

Paul G 19:03

Yeah, usually they they ramp it up and then it gets worse and worse and worse and worse until they because they're losing complete control, and that's how they get caught, most serial killers.

Andrea 19:12

Sounds like to me, whoever this person was probably just moved somewhere else.

Paul G 19:15

Bundy got caught that way, just frenzy kill at the end. Yeah, no, and he failed at it miserably, and that's what got him caught.

Andrea 19:23

Yeah, he nine-year-old girl, that's awful. I mean, I mean, he yeah, I've I've read some stuff on that too, and he just messed up at the end.

Paul G 19:31

Yeah, yeah, yeah. So all of the victims are females, all are tied to Jennings, Louisiana.

Andrea 19:37

Okay.

Paul G 19:38

Most share overlapping high-risk environment that they live in. Right. Bodies are recovered in canals, ditches, and roadside areas. Again, they're not completely written down perfectly. So you have to construe a little bit when you figure out where to figure out where they're been found.

Andrea 19:57

Okay.

Paul G 19:57

Um the cause of death is always variable.

Andrea 20:03

So that's different. Normally they most people do the same type thing.

Paul G 20:06

Or it's undetermined.

Andrea 20:07

Right, yeah.

Paul G 20:08

Undetermined. That just reminds me of the Arkansas corner.

Andrea 20:12

Exactly, yeah.

Paul G 20:13

Didn't know what the hell he was doing.

Andrea 20:15

Yeah, yeah.

Paul G 20:16

Right.

Andrea 20:17

It was just blatantly like idiocy there.

Paul G 20:21

So at this point, though, local law enforcement now has to deal with state police and f FBI. Because it's on everybody's radar all of a sudden.

Andrea 20:32

Well, yeah. A witness that was gonna have you guys being bad law enforcement people.

Paul G 20:36

That's what yeah, uh, national attention out of that one.

Andrea 20:39

State police need to come in.

Paul G 20:41

Yeah. Um so they formed a big task force to go in and figure this out. Obviously, it wasn't big enough. And then they also came up with an eighty-five thousand dollar reward. But even that has it, it's even that is somewhat in dispute because in my research I had to use approximately eighty-five thousand. Because that's not always right. I think part of the problem is that uh when we're talking about this rural um Louisiana, it's just there's no reporting. There there's there's there's not really a news agency, they have to come in from out of town.

Andrea 21:26

Oh, wow, really?

Paul G 21:28

Yeah. So I can see why all this is getting messed up. There's they're not, you know, here in Northwest Arkansas, you and I grew up in a in a smaller area, but we still had the big three ABC, NBC, C B S.

Andrea 21:41

Yeah, and we had uh our local stuff that was what I mean.

Paul G 21:46

Yeah, they were here. And so we're everybody was used to knowing everything that went on. But if you wanted to know something that happened in Newton County, which is just two counties over, it didn't get reported very much, did it?

Andrea 22:00

Not that I remember.

Paul G 22:01

You might have heard about it in Harrison.

Andrea 22:03

I don't really remember growing up unless you watch national news. You really didn't hear anything like that on the five o'clock news. I mean, not like it is now.

Paul G 22:10

Exactly. Um, so family members in interviews describe delays, lack of urgency, a sense of their cases were not prioritized. And they they believed it's because those girls were drug users and were like prostitutes and stuff.

Andrea 22:29

But one of them was gonna get the law enforcement in trouble. I wonder, did the rest of them have any tie into that?

Paul G 22:35

I don't know. So the journalistic investigations raised concerns about potential conflicts of interest. So what when the news finally showed showed up in town, they were talking about conflicts of interest relationships between individuals in the community and the actual law enforcement officers. Now, some of these are documented, but they're not proven in criminal findings tied to the murders. Um they allege that connections between some of the law enforcement personnel and the local drug drug networks, in other words, they get kickbacks or something like that. So some of the hubbub that they can pass around that they're paying them off. Stuff like that. And this is coming from the family members and the other. Yeah. Here's the thing about that though, because I know a lot of folks that are on that side of life because I'm everyone's friend. It doesn't bother me.

Andrea 23:32

Yeah.

Paul G 23:33

Because I know I have if there's anybody on this planet that's got boundaries of glore, it's me.

Andrea 23:38

Yeah, that's true. And you're friends with everybody. Yeah. And you don't judge.

Paul G 23:42

I don't care. You're a human being. What's the matter?

Andrea 23:45

Yeah, you've you've talked about people that you've been friends with that have probably had a little bit shady of a past, but you were still friends with them.

Paul G 23:52

Yeah. I mean, I'm not gonna run them. I'm not gonna bring them over and let them stay in the house. But yeah, but you were always very kind to people, but it's I'm not gonna write them off just because they're a little shady every now and again and try, you know, unless they're shady towards me, then they're out.

Andrea 24:07

Yeah, you do have that one defined rule of don't mess with you.

Paul G 24:09

Right, right. Don't don't but was it what I when you first came over to see me at my house?

Andrea 24:13

Uh don't I just remember last time? Don't take my stuff, don't break my stuff. Don't burn my stuff.

Paul G 24:18

And I had to add them, don't burn my stuff. It was don't take my stuff, don't don't break my stuff.

Andrea 24:24

Yeah.

Paul G 24:25

Don't take my stuff, don't break my stuff, and don't don't set my stuff on fire. Don't set my stuff on fire.

Andrea 24:30

I do remember going fire park.

Paul G 24:34

So there you go.

Andrea 24:39

I hope she was so drunk out of her mind she didn't realize what she was thinking.

Paul G 24:42

Goofing off and thought she was and it was a joke between her and I too, because I was I was like, I'm editing a new rule.

Andrea 24:48

To add some burn someone's stuff is a joke.

Paul G 24:52

She didn't mean that she didn't mean to. It was an accident.

Andrea 24:54

An accident? What would you have a match and it ooh it accidentally lit something on the road?

Paul G 24:58

No, she was screwing around. It was fine. I'm just saying, I have a hard time with that one. I actually don't remember because it was so innocuous, innocuous. I forgot what she did. To be honest with you.

Andrea 25:10

Well, yeah, that's good.

Paul G 25:13

Yeah. And she thought it was funny. I thought it was funny, and it just kind of stuck for me.

Andrea 25:17

Because I remember going, okay, these rules are pretty clear.

Paul G 25:20

Yeah. So I know these, I know some of these kind of people. You know, if they're really bad, I don't deal with them because it's you don't want to have people like that surrounding you.

Andrea 25:32

Yeah, I agree with that.

Paul G 25:33

Because they rub off on you.

Andrea 25:35

Yes. And their problems become your problems really quick because you gotta be careful of the company you keep or keep good boundaries, at least.

Paul G 25:45

So I can I know that the what what they're probably thinking is they're shifting blame because that's kind of what that those folks do a lot. Not everybody, but a lot of them shift blame. It's not my fault I'm poor. It's not my fault I'm using drugs. It's your fault for doing this to me, which caused me to do that, so it's your fault. Because they shift the blame. So they're always looking for a place to shift the blame to. So it makes sense why they would try to shift the blame to cops. Even but the problem is because of that, knowing that about this kind of group of people, uh they get written off. What if they're right? What if it's true? It's hard to get anybody to listen because they push everything off like that.

Andrea 26:37

I don't know if necessarily all of them do that. I think that I didn't say all of them. But you know, but I think like maybe I understand the family's point of view because it's a really small town too. It's a small town, and I it's I'm not making excuses, but they it's common for them to pick people uh and who knows, maybe a lot was going on at that.

Paul G 26:59

I doubt it in a small town, but well, they say witness in intimidation. They were intimidating the police were intimidating the witnesses to say this or say that.

Andrea 27:09

Really?

Paul G 27:09

Yeah.

Andrea 27:10

Oh, that's not good.

Paul G 27:11

Yeah, that's according to the people on the ground, not the cops.

Andrea 27:15

Oh, well, I mean, that was common back then. A lot of cases have gotten in trouble for p coercion. I mean, the West Memphis III, for example.

Paul G 27:24

There were many individuals that they thought so suspect they suspected them, like in the community suspected them, but obviously there wasn't enough evidence to ever do anything about it.

Andrea 27:36

But it's weird that this person just stopped.

unknown 27:39

Yeah.

Andrea 27:39

Either they stopped because they moved, they died, or they're already in jail.

Paul G 27:44

Yeah. Well, they were a whole what three years or a year and a half went by, they might have been in jail. It sounds like a normal sentence for robbery. You go you get thrown in jail for robbery in a state that's full of the prisons are full.

Andrea 27:58

Or drugs.

Paul G 27:59

Or drugs, yeah. You get a ha a half ounce of marijuana you're gonna do 90 days at least.

Andrea 28:04

I mean, that makes sense. I mean, yeah.

Paul G 28:08

Especially in Louisiana, they're known for their bad prisons.

Andrea 28:12

Yeah, isn't there one of them they have out there that's like a big giant farm or something?

Paul G 28:15

It used to be, and they don't do that anymore.

Andrea 28:17

I think there's a documentary on it.

Paul G 28:19

Oh that was part of that one lady's case that um they were doing it here in Arkansas, uh, and the river lady we had.

Andrea 28:27

Oh, yeah, that lady.

Paul G 28:29

Yeah. Where she lived on the river and her her her great aunt or whatever went in and shot the guy right there in the courtroom.

Andrea 28:39

Yeah, yeah, because he killed her dad.

Paul G 28:41

Yeah. And uh, but she was in one of those prisons, remember, where she if if she didn't let them prostitute her out, they extended her sentence.

Andrea 28:50

Yeah, I mean, uh it's kind of horrible what how prisons used to be.

Paul G 28:54

And I yeah, I and that mentality main it maintains it's very hard to root that out because it becomes, well, this is what's just what we do.

Andrea 29:02

That's the you know, I think we have a lot more rules. I'm not saying that every pr person that goes to prison needs to have like a plush, fluffy bed cell and you know, get whatever they want brought to them, but they need to be at least treated humanely, and women should not be raped.

Paul G 29:18

Well, neither should men. Exactly. Men should not be raped in prison either. Exit only, my friend. Exit only.

Andrea 29:24

Exactly.

Paul G 29:26

Just saying. But uh uh it's like there's no clear escalate escalation like we'd normally see. Yeah, so all the patterns are broken. There's eight victims across four years. The only pattern is they're female and they're in within proximity of the in the county.

Andrea 29:48

They're all found in ditches, right?

Paul G 29:49

Right, and where they're found. But there's no clear escalation, there's no clear signature, they're not all killed the same way. Uh and so all you have is geography and and gender. Because they're black and white.

Andrea 30:05

Oh, yeah.

Paul G 30:07

That would I mean it breaks everything that we know about serial killers.

Andrea 30:12

Maybe they're not related.

Paul G 30:16

You know, it could very well be possible that they're not related. It could just be really I mean, it used to be that bad down in the south back in the day. And if you don't have any money, that can I mean who knows?

Andrea 30:31

It could be if they're not no more d isn't it common that they s tend to stick within racial lines, like Usually. Usually, yeah.

Paul G 30:40

And so Yeah.

Andrea 30:42

I wonder though, did these women if the town was having issues and the cops are not exactly m upstanding, some of them at this point in time, maybe they were all killed for different reasons. Like if they all talk, they all kind of knew each other, they had the same like drug circles, they had the same maybe prostitution circles, maybe they all kind of knew the gossip, they all kind of knew.

Paul G 31:04

Yeah.

Andrea 31:05

I mean, who knows what they saw, what they witnessed, what they were privy to in conversations, that maybe each of them had a a particular thing that maybe needed to be silenced.

Paul G 31:17

Could be. I mean, it I it's just a thought. Well, there's really no we I've done a lot of research into into the pathology of this. And if you look at Dahmer, it's the same thing over and over and over.

Andrea 31:33

Yeah, same thing.

Paul G 31:34

Casey, same thing over and over and over. BTK, same thing over and over and over.

Andrea 31:39

Bundy was the same until the last one.

Paul G 31:41

Well, yeah, Bundy went was the same until he went on a spree when he when his mental physic mental capacity finally fell through the cracks because everything he had was gone, because all his control he had was gone.

Andrea 31:53

Yeah, and then he did was doing the same thing until he hit it hit a nine-year-old.

Profiling A Pattern Without A Signature

Paul G 31:58

So yeah, yeah. And so I asked Cade Mercer.

Andrea 32:06

Mr. Cade.

Paul G 32:06

Mr. Cade, our our AI profiler. Because he can know that the the AI knows every can know everything about profiling, but I cannot.

Andrea 32:17

I'd be curious to know about Cade Mercer what the farther along I get in school, but you know.

Paul G 32:22

Right. Uh and so I asked Cade, and he says, eight women over four years is one small operational zone. As one small operational zone is not subtle, but it's also not clean, exactly what we were talking about. The method doesn't hold in the victim, but only the victim pool does. That means the common denominator is less likely to be a ritual, like a serial killer, and more likely to be access. He just happens to be around them. Uh access to women living at the edge, access to places where the bodies can be dropped, and it's just if you've ever been out there, it's easy to hide something. Access to the community where disappearances won't be won't trigger an immediate statewide hard stop. Right?

Andrea 33:14

Okay.

Paul G 33:16

If the allegations around local corruption are false, they still matter because they tell you that the town believed about its own protectors. They didn't trust their own cops.

Andrea 33:30

I mean, it sounds like it.

Paul G 33:31

I mean, if it and if the town believes the police are compromised, witnesses will talk less. And especially if they're drug users and committing felonies when the cops aren't around, they're not gonna talk to them. No, they're stupid.

Andrea 33:46

They're gonna keep their mouths shut for their own perseverance.

Paul G 33:49

Exactly. Um, they're gonna talk later or talk sideways, it's it says Cade. That alone can cripple a homicide investigation when you can't get any information. And I guess that's true.

Andrea 34:02

I mean, that makes sense probably why they don't have any leads, is they don't trust them.

Paul G 34:05

Yeah, they're not. Who's this guy we've been watching on the on the HBO all day today?

Andrea 34:10

Joe uh Kendra from um Colorado Springs.

Paul G 34:16

What is his what is his um catchphrase?

Andrea 34:19

Oh my, my, my.

Paul G 34:21

Oh my, my, my. Yeah, that guy. We've been watching him, and you know, the first thing he says is if nobody's gonna talk to you, you get a real problem. You gotta rely on forensics. Well, these people are in these women are in the water. There's no forensics, and they weren't killed there.

Andrea 34:37

Who knows? Okay, say you know something about these girls, these women. Okay, I'm just gonna I know as an example. I know something about these women. I'm gonna keep my mouth shut.

Paul G 34:46

Yeah, I'm not gonna talk to the cops, especially if you're doing illegal things on the weekend.

Andrea 34:50

I'm gonna keep my head low and hopefully be. No. Okay. It's called schoolwork. That's illegal. Then I'm screwed.

Paul G 34:58

Friends, if you're in Afghanistan, it would be illegal.

Andrea 35:02

I'm not enough. Am I wrong? Probably.

Paul G 35:09

So the first question is not whether one corrupt deputy killed eight women. The first question is whether the environment around these women was already so compromised that the offender's singular or plural could work inside that confusion without fear.

Andrea 35:24

Sounds like it.

Paul G 35:25

Yeah, it's exactly what you're doing.

Andrea 35:26

If you know the town ain't gonna do anything, and that they're paying, they're you know, kind of probably involved in the drugs, maybe in some aspects. I don't know. I'm just talking. In other words, they're kind of have a little bit of corruption. It's it's party town if you're a criminal.

Paul G 35:39

Yeah, yeah. And when and they got nowhere to go. And they're not the homicide detectives, they write speeding tickets and arrest drunks.

Andrea 35:50

Well, that's not their fault either. And I mean, but I mean, there's a lot of small towns that that's a problem. They have to have someone else come in. I mean, and that you know, they probably only have like well, they had eight murders, but some towns have like one murder a decade. I mean, you know. Yeah.

Paul G 36:04

So according to the AP, who reviewed records of the of this area, they described women accusing deputies of rape, coercion, and sexual trafficking schemes uh w while they were inmates in jail.

Andrea 36:20

I wouldn't talk.

Paul G 36:22

Yeah, I guess.

Andrea 36:22

I wouldn't say anything if I knew this was gonna be.

Paul G 36:25

AP also reported that Nicole Gilroy, the last of the eight found, had been a witness in a 2002 jail case.

Andrea 36:35

That's probably your link to finding it out right there.

Paul G 36:38

Yeah. Uh not because not because of her death proves a police link, but uh but because she sits at the overlap between victim pool and prior misconduct act uh allegations. So what we know about people who kill, there's always a common link.

Andrea 36:59

But wouldn't they get her first and not the rest of them first? Well, I I don't know.

Paul G 37:04

I mean, you wouldn't think talking out loud, like it would make sense to me that if this is the person that maybe it was uh they kill her last till no one knows that she was their main pro main target.

Andrea 37:18

Or maybe it w a crime of opportunity, or who knows, maybe I don't know, maybe she like said stuff for these other people. I it's just a I'm just talking.

Paul G 37:25

I know what I well that's all we got in this is talk. Uh the the AP Ethan Brown told AP, the Associated Press, that the most insistent of the victims was uh Nicole.

Andrea 37:46

Really?

Paul G 37:47

Yeah, yeah. That police that she was the most insistent of the victims that the police were behind the killings.

Andrea 37:55

Uh maybe that's the reason why she passed away.

Paul G 37:58

Maybe. We don't know that though.

Andrea 37:59

No, but it's a specul. I mean, uh who do you gonna believe? I mean, the family members are upset and angry as they have every right to be. Police department's not on the best terms with the public or doing or uh E did some work on this.

Paul G 38:12

Oh, really? Yeah, and they summarized the law enforcement angle, but by noting the relationship between local law enforcement and some of the victims raised eyebrows.

Andrea 38:24

Oh.

Paul G 38:24

Including claims that some victims had clients in law enforcement.

Andrea 38:29

Oh, there you go.

Paul G 38:30

They were Johns. The cops were Johns.

Andrea 38:34

Wow.

Paul G 38:34

How about that?

Andrea 38:36

That sounds like the whole situation is just one giant pot of message.

Paul G 38:40

Not proof of homicide participation, but it's highly relevant to bias witness intimidation and compromised interviewing.

Andrea 38:50

Yeah, because if this this woman you're interviewing is also the person that you slept with the other day. And gave her a hundred bucks. And gave her a hundred bucks, then there's a little bit of conflict.

Paul G 39:00

Yeah, there's a conflict.

Andrea 39:02

But you can't go tell your boss, hey, I can't I can't interview her because I gave her a hundred bucks and slept with her last week. You can't say that either.

Paul G 39:08

So I don't know what WWL is. I should have looked that up better. Um one of the newspapers and later summaries tied to the case described a 2007 ethics violation involving Jeff Davis, chief criminal investigator, Warren Gray, buying a truck suspected of relevance to the Kristen Gary Lopez case from an inmate arrestee. So he bought a car from somebody that was on the, you know, like a witness or something for or involved in the case with somebody that did another crime.

Andrea 39:47

Is this town so small that they can't do business with anybody that isn't already like probably involved in something that's illegal? Yeah.

Paul G 39:54

Oxygen, the channel oxygen summary says Gary was fined 10 grand by the Louisiana Board of Ethics, but but cleared criminally.

Andrea 40:06

Really?

Paul G 40:07

And later promoted to head of the evidence room.

Andrea 40:09

Oh, that's lovely. Yes. Oh, that's great. You're gonna put that guy in charge of evidence.

Paul G 40:13

It's it's more of an ethics problem, evidence, confidence problem, and not proof of any kind of murder or involvement in the murder.

Andrea 40:22

But if you're doing shady stuff and you have an ethics violation, you should not be in charge.

Paul G 40:26

And if somebody wants to sue us over this, talk to Oxygen because I'm just quoting them. You know what I mean?

Andrea 40:32

Yeah, I'm just laughing because I'm like, you got an ethics violation. Well, you'll have you in charge of all of our stuff for conviction.

Paul G 40:39

Yeah, remember, people listening and whatnot, is none of this been proven except for the $10,000 fine against this guy.

Andrea 40:46

Yeah, we're just reading off of other stuff. Normally we don't cover big cases like that, but Paul was in the mood for a Louisiana Bayou case.

Paul G 40:52

I wanted to talk about Bayou. I wanted to make that song at the beginning of the show, to be honest with you.

Andrea 40:58

Yeah, yeah, I okay. Just a side note for everybody. Paul is very much invested in the music that we play. Yeah. Because that's what he does. And he was playing all these different ones, asking me what I thought of them, and I had to explain to them that they all sound the same to me.

Paul G 41:15

They did, because they're very very small differences. Him having the whole, you know, I know what I'm doing media stuff here.

Andrea 41:22

He's the one that picked it because I'm like, it all sounds the same to me. Yeah. And he always looks at me like I'm like, you know, like crazy, but it does all sound the same to me. But he always picks the music. Well, you can pick the music. No, uh, you're good at the music.

Paul G 41:35

This is why I picked the music, because I say you can pick the music, and she goes, Yeah, I'm not gonna do it.

Andrea 41:39

Well, because I'm not good at it. And some a nurse going back to school to be a mental health practitioner.

Paul G 41:45

Yeah, yeah, yeah. I get it, I get it, I get it, I get it. Um, and then on top of that, the sheriff's office thought rumors about police involvement were serious enough to do a DNA swab of all the officers.

Andrea 41:58

Oh my gosh. Are you serious?

Paul G 42:01

Yes. CBS News reported that investigators required local police to Jefferson County Parish to submit DNA in an effort to address rumors and clear law enforcement of involvement.

Andrea 42:16

Oh my, please tell me that they've turned over the police department. It's better. I mean, think about that. It's so bad. It doesn't validate the rumors, though. You gotta swab all the cops to be like, we're gonna see what you're all up to.

Paul G 42:29

Then they bumped the reward to 85,000, which means that it's really stuck because in 2009 the reward was 35,000. Crime stoppers. Ruff McDuff, the crime stopping dog.

Andrea 42:43

Oh, yeah, I forgot about that. Yeah, yeah.

Paul G 42:46

So the so there's some say that the serial killing framing, serial killer being the guy doing it, may have distracted from a more contaminated reality. Uh a task force formed in 2008 and initially worked from a serial killer hypothesis, is what they worked from. But several later treatments of the case, including Ethan Brown's reporting from the news organization, argued that one clean serial killer theory doesn't fit. No, and we discovered that right off the bat. It doesn't work.

Andrea 43:21

I mean, I think they maybe tried whoever, if it was like several different people, they probably just did it because it was just convenient to put them in the ditch because it would like wash away everything.

Paul G 43:32

Yeah. Well, and it's great play. You can throw somebody in the ditch and no one's gonna see them, especially if you're out there in the middle of you know, middle of nowhere. Yeah. Because this is all rule. Right.

Andrea 43:45

And if you're uh law enforcement or someone who has slights a bit of intelligence, you would know to put them in there.

Paul G 43:51

Yeah. So there's definitely a low confidence in any of the investigation that went on during this.

Andrea 43:56

So it could be more than one person, more than likely.

Paul G 44:00

And in your in your point it could be absolutely valid and and it's six eight different women killed by eight different people.

Andrea 44:07

The statistics in that in a small town though have got to be off the charts wrong.

Paul G 44:12

Well just eight people dying in a town less than fifty thousand and w within three years is or five people dying within three years in a small town like that, then no, that's that's not statistically correct.

Andrea 44:25

But at the same time, they can't it's all a big jumble hot mess that they're never really gonna be able to find the answer.

Paul G 44:31

So we have to remember that we can't claim that the deputy deputies had clients among the victims. Right. As a hearsay.

Andrea 44:41

Yeah, it's rumors.

Paul G 44:43

And we can't claim that certain officers were tied to local drugs, because we don't know. Nobody's gone to jail over it.

Andrea 44:50

No, it's just our hypothesis theory and slightly opinion and talking, so nobody's come sue us.

Paul G 44:55

That's somebody else's idea that we're just passing along as a summary of this thing.

Andrea 45:01

Yeah, we're just talking it out.

Paul G 45:03

And then the claims witnesses were intimidated can't be substantiated. Nobody's gone to jail for that.

Andrea 45:12

No, and uh you can't prove it unless it's on camera.

Paul G 45:16

Misconduct, though, uh, has been documented in the police force because the one guy got fined 10 grand.

Andrea 45:27

In state police game.

Paul G 45:28

Yeah, and yeah. So at this point, they still don't have any idea who's killing this guy who's killing. It could be a drug dealer. It could be a drug dealer. They and and they they all got mad at him and ganged up on him and and screwed up his business or ran him out of town for a week or whatever, and he decided to come back and take his revenge. I mean, that's a plausible thing, too.

Andrea 45:51

Yeah, they could have got arrested. That's why they had the cooldown periods.

Paul G 45:54

More than likely it was a man because all these women were through tossed in a ditch. They weren't, they didn't were lay where they were killed.

Andrea 46:01

I can't see a woman doing it because I Well, I mean, she'd have to be a strong woman to make it. She had to be a very strong woman, yeah.

Paul G 46:07

And that's possible.

Andrea 46:08

I mean, there's some women out there that can whoop my whoop my booty.

Paul G 46:12

Yeah, and there's some men out there who can whoop mine. Yeah, so there's a lot of men out there that can't, but I some can.

Andrea 46:18

Yeah.

Paul G 46:18

So don't be coming over here thinking that you can let's go bowl. No, I said some of you can.

Andrea 46:24

Some of you can't.

Paul G 46:25

Well, a lot of you can't.

Andrea 46:28

Notice how he says a lot.

Paul G 46:31

A lot's more than half.

Andrea 46:33

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Paul G 46:34

But it's not more than most.

Andrea 46:37

Yeah.

Paul G 46:39

Words mean things.

Andrea 46:45

So it's sad that these women passed and we have no idea who killed them, and we have no idea what happened. We have an idea what happened based upon where they were found, but we don't really have anything else, and this person or persons is getting away scot-free.

unknown 46:59

Yeah.

Paul G 47:00

Yeah. They're not, I don't think they'll ever get caught. I think this one's dead in the water unless because there's no DNA. There's no evidence. There's nothing. You I mean, where's the concrete? And these days you have to have concrete.

Andrea 47:14

You can't just Yeah, there's nothing substantiated or anything like with unreasonable doubt. I mean, there's too much what-ifs.

Paul G 47:21

Yeah, exactly.

Andrea 47:22

You don't even have a suspect or any idea how to get to a suspect.

Paul G 47:26

More than likely more than likely what happened. I I my supposition is the town is so small and the people are so related and know each other. Because that's what happens in a small town. Everybody's that's my uncle, that's my cousin Bele.

Andrea 47:42

That's somebody that's known by marriage or whatever.

Paul G 47:45

Yeah, yeah. More than likely what happened is is somebody killed these women. And since they can't figure out who did it, because they didn't want to spend the resources on 'em, because they were prostitutes and drug drug users that an inc an incompetence in the investigation or lack of caring. An incompetence is something that you can claim and even the most competent person in the world, they could be incompetent if they'd had a bad day. You know. So it it's it's variable. I think they just didn't know what to do. They don't have that many murders. And it was all mishandled because of the lack of training, because they're not exactly the best paid police force on on uh in the United States. They did probably what they thought they needed to do, and that's all they did. And now we have this giant mess where everybody's pointing fingers at everybody.

Andrea 48:54

Yeah. I don't know.

Paul G 48:58

And if there was any kind of corruption going on, you know, maybe one cop that doesn't work there anymore. Maybe it was the jailer. You know, and they killed him in you know, killed him by accident in the cell or something like that. We don't know. That's the problem. There's no evidence because there's just no evidence.

Why The Case Stays Stuck

Andrea 49:22

So it's basically gonna probably just stay this way. It'll stay this way until somebody talks.

Paul G 49:27

Yeah.

Andrea 49:27

Somebody opens up.

Paul G 49:29

Deathbed confession, more than likely.

Andrea 49:31

Or maybe nobody really knows anything.

Paul G 49:34

Maybe it was a drifter. I mean, it would explain the gap.

Andrea 49:41

Yeah.

Paul G 49:41

I still think it had something to do with the women itself and something to do with I think the victimology is the only way you're gonna feel able to get even nearer what happened.

Andrea 49:52

Yeah, but I there it would have to take some like if like I said, if I was the person knowing that some some stuff was going on and how I could get wrongfully imprisoned, I would keep my mouth shut until I had to talk.

Paul G 50:04

I don't know. Do you think the the way it was proposed the DNA swab of the cops was that we're just trying to regain the trust of the people. Would they do that? Would they go that far to regain trust of the people, or do you think they were they wanted to know if they were onto something?

Andrea 50:22

Maybe it's a little bit of both. But I would think that they would have to voluntary consent to that.

Paul G 50:31

Not if it's a requirement of your employment. Especially in Louisiana, they don't they do not care. It's Louisiana, man.

Andrea 50:44

I mean, like if someone was to come up to you today and say, in order for you to work at Walmart, the media job, we needed a DNA sample. Would you cough it up?

Paul G 50:53

No. It's Walmart, I don't care.

Andrea 50:55

I'm just giving an example off the top of it.

Paul G 50:56

Depends on where it was working. You know, if the president called me up, or whoever, governor or Gavin Newsom called me up and said, I want you to work for me and I'm gonna pay you a million dollars a year, but you got to give me your DNA, I'm gonna put you on two-year contract. I'd be like, two million bucks? Okay, here. Have my DNA. Because I didn't done anything wrong.

Andrea 51:18

I haven't done anything wrong either. I always like joke with my brother. I was like, you know, my our dad was adopted. I said, We're gonna have a knock at the door one of these days, and one of our relatives is gonna have done something bad. And we're like, oh, our dad's adopted.

Paul G 51:32

I was expecting to get a knock on the door and say, Are you my father?

Andrea 51:36

Because you go if you put your DNA on Jedmatch, which is I've done too. It says in there to disclaimer that the cops will have it. I'm like, I have nothing to hide. But we joke about you know, like and you know, familiar DNA, family DNA, and caught you know, the guy in California, what's his face? But uh, we were talking about that. It's like an ongoing joke about how we're gonna find family members. Right. This is probably the only way we're gonna find family members, but uh I I don't know if I want to be found as a family member.

Paul G 52:04

Do I have to pay child support?

Andrea 52:06

They're over 18. I don't I don't know how that works.

Paul G 52:09

Do I have to pay back child support? No, I don't think I should because I didn't know about them.

Andrea 52:13

I agree with that. I agree with you on that one.

Paul G 52:16

But that's my that's my fears that I'm gonna get a you might father.

Andrea 52:21

I'll be like, well, you look like him. Come on in. Dang it.

Paul G 52:27

You're supposed to protect me from stuff like that.

Andrea 52:29

I can't protect you from crab.

Paul G 52:31

You can too. You can put a shield up or a piece of wood, and if somebody tries to throw a crab, you know, you can that's that's no. I always take everything so literally, don't I?

Andrea 52:43

Pretty much.

Paul G 52:46

Well, so you're going to be a nurse practitioner eventually. Yeah, so hopefully. Yeah.

Andrea 52:53

This is the first semester of the city.

Paul G 52:54

You're not gonna fail out of that.

Andrea 52:56

No, but it's definitely time consuming, but it's worth it.

Paul G 53:00

Me, I'm just learning about the human mind.

Andrea 53:04

Yeah, psychology classes.

Paul G 53:06

I'm gonna have I'm gonna be damn near a psychologist by the time I'm done.

Andrea 53:10

Yeah.

Paul G 53:11

If I can figure out how to get it for free, I would totally get my doctorate.

Andrea 53:15

Grants and scholarships.

Paul G 53:17

If it if I can do it for free, I'm in. But that's what I've been doing. I've been learning about psychology, I think. What's what are my next classes? Is uh next is gonna be abuse, drug abuse, drug abuse, and child abuse and uh and oh, it was the the I'm taking classes now for um abnormal human behavior. Oh yeah.

Andrea 53:38

Or something like that. Something like that, yeah, I do remember. Something like that.

Paul G 53:41

I'm like, please, please, please tell me we're gonna do this. And it's it says it's based in criminology. So yeah, I'm gonna learn why people steal cars for sure.

Andrea 53:53

He's gonna apply some of his knowledge to this podcast. No, we do need to get better at planning this because it's kind of hard between our schedules with school.

Paul G 54:00

Well, I'm taking the anatomy course. No, it's not an anatomy course, it's the language of what? Uh Language of medicine, which is harder, it's just as hard or harder than her anatomy classes years ago.

Andrea 54:16

Somebody asked me, and I'm like, God, I don't remember. That's like I was in A and P computer.

Paul G 54:19

Did you even know it?

Andrea 54:20

That's the I recognize it, but I'm like, I can't tell you what that's about because it's I had anatomy like uh 20 plus years ago.

Paul G 54:26

This is supposed to be the language of medicine teaching me how to read medical jargon.

Andrea 54:30

Well, I'm gonna have to learn how to some of these diagnoses again because to pass the boards. But you know, for everyone out there, just bear with us. We try to post these things, but they may not always be weekly, though we need to get in the better habit of it, though.

Paul G 54:44

Well, that stupid course is just memorization. And I'm I can't memorize anything. I have so for me to be able to understand anatomy, I would literally have to take a bone, break it apart, and search and say, what's this called? What's this called? What's this called? Yeah. Because yeah, I can't. This is you know, I the only reason I know a humorous, I thought a humorous was a leg for a while. But the only reason I even know that word is because I saw a meme of a little girl in a yellow raincoat carrying a bone, going, I found this humorous. Yeah, it's a humorous bone. But that's the only reason I even know it. So I'm having troubles. But then again, I'm passing my other classes with 102%.

Andrea 55:31

Because you're not writing like a freshman, you're writing like an actual person.

Paul G 55:34

Oh, yeah, they hate my writing because it's like it's like reading another paper from a white paper.

Andrea 55:40

Well, the teacher likes it, but um the kid. I mean, you when you come right out of high school, and yeah, I mean, I don't know, I graduated high school.

Paul G 55:47

A lot of these people aren't high school people.

Andrea 55:49

So, I mean, you are having to learn how to write. I'm having to learn how to write papers again because I've been out of my other master's program for a while. So he writes very eloquently and you know, very well.

Paul G 56:02

I write like a an English scholar.

Andrea 56:05

Somewhat, yeah, you do. So for kids, you know, that are 18 and 19, they're like having to figure this out. And he's already got it down to put down pats.

DNA Swabs, Life Updates, And Goodbye

Paul G 56:15

Well, I do have you know awards for my writing, after all.

Andrea 56:19

So there's so what should we cover next time?

Paul G 56:22

Uh do we want to do another murder thing?

Andrea 56:26

We can.

Paul G 56:28

Well, of course we can. I mean, we can we can also cover Bozo the Clown.

Andrea 56:32

Did he commit a murder?

Paul G 56:34

Yeah, I don't know. He might have. He'd drink it online. I do know that.

Andrea 56:40

Uh yeah, I can't think of anything.

Paul G 56:42

We should cover the best quips of Kennedy from Louisiana.

Andrea 56:46

Oh, that guy.

Paul G 56:46

That guy's hilarious.

Andrea 56:48

He's so funny.

Paul G 56:49

Not talking about his politics. We're just talking about his just what he says.

Andrea 56:53

The stuff he says, you should follow him because I mean, even you may not agree with his politics, but the things he says and the way he says it just is hilarious.

Paul G 57:00

You said the that one is looking a guy straight in the face and he goes, You may not be the dumbest person on the planet, but if that person dies, you should be worried. And he just off the cuff told this dude that. I'm like, oh my god.

Andrea 57:17

I would just he should just like have a book or something with all the funny stuff he says.

Paul G 57:21

He should do a weekly, a weekly rundown of everything that he's done that week and just show clips of him berating people.

Andrea 57:29

The guy's funny. I mean, he says things that are very factual, but he says it in such a way that's just like funny.

Paul G 57:37

Yeah, it's hilarious a lot of times, actually. I wasn't that's fun. I could never say that things to people's face.

Andrea 57:46

I couldn't either, but he gets away with it, probably because he's a senator, right?

Paul G 57:49

No, I think it's just because who he is. And he didn't care.

Andrea 57:55

Um, next week we could cover true crime, or we could try to cover something medical if I could come up with something interesting.

Paul G 58:01

Well, medical mysteries would be cool.

Andrea 58:03

Oh, I've got to research on that one, but yeah.

Paul G 58:05

Just watch the episode of House and figure out which ep which where they got theirs from because they've already done the research. They have these weird medical things.

Andrea 58:13

Yeah.

Paul G 58:14

And somebody, it's a medical mystery that somebody figured out and they turned it into a TV show.

Andrea 58:19

Well, they there's obviously a lot of them because house was on a while.

Paul G 58:22

Well, I'm sure they had to stretch for a while.

Andrea 58:24

Well, yeah, you're writing it has to be appealing to the people.

Paul G 58:27

Well, I'm meaning they had to stretch their. Let's just open a dictionary and find the most obscure disease and let's give them that.

Andrea 58:33

It's hard for me to watch the medical stuff because half of it is completely wrong.

Paul G 58:38

The pit is you seem to be pretty you hate the pit, and there's a reason why.

Andrea 58:43

I don't hate the pit. I love the show The Pit. It's awesome. But the problem is, is I read it at work and I lived it when I was on this bedside nurse.

Paul G 58:51

So she was the charge nurse. So the girl with the Boston accent in that emergency room, that was Andrea.

Andrea 58:59

That probably was me.

Paul G 59:01

Well, no, I mean that's the same job you did.

Andrea 59:03

Yeah, it is the same job I did. Yeah. But um it's hard for I need a break from it, if that makes sense.

Paul G 59:09

The most experienced person on the floor who's not a doctor ends up being the charge nurse.

Andrea 59:16

Or most of the time you hope that's true, yes.

Paul G 59:19

Yeah.

Andrea 59:20

But nurses out there understand that sometimes it's whoever's been there the longest that has to be.

Paul G 59:24

I think they just told you you were gonna be charge nurse. Is that what they did?

Andrea 59:27

Yeah, one day they're like, You're charge nurse, and I was like, excuse me. Why me? I have kids, I've got to go. And they give you a dollar more an hour. It's not worth it. $12 more. I told one of them one time, you can keep your $12 and shove it. This is not worth it. This is a very rough job, but you know, it's gotta be done. Someone's gotta tell you.

Paul G 59:53

So when we sit here and talk about this stuff, we actually have the credentials to back it up. At least I will for sure. You already do. I just need to I will have all the psych stuff that you that the the college offers. I'll have it all.

Andrea 1:00:06

I just need to be careful because of becoming a practitioner, I can't diagnose in the state of Arkansas. I mean I can, but I have to have the physician sign off.

Paul G 1:00:16

Yeah, yeah, yeah. But you can give your suppositions about someone that's not your patient.

Andrea 1:00:20

Correct. I can do that as long as I'm very clear that I'm not diagnosing.

Paul G 1:00:23

Yeah. So when we're talking about Dahmer or somebody like that, you can say, I think he has.

Andrea 1:00:29

Yeah, I I don't know how much like criminal stuff I'll cover. Probably not much, but Yeah.

Paul G 1:00:34

You said you aren't gonna work in prisons.

Andrea 1:00:36

I do not want to work in a prison.

Paul G 1:00:38

I don't want you working in prison either. Those guys will jump you. I think it They'd be like, Who's a hot doctor?

Andrea 1:00:42

No, it's because I give drugs. That's the only reason why they want to talk to me.

Paul G 1:00:45

And you're a hot doctor.

Andrea 1:00:46

I don't know about that.

Paul G 1:00:47

But uh She will not accept the fact that she's actually a hot, you know, hot doctor.

Andrea 1:00:52

I'm glad that you feel that way. Oh that's all that matters.

Paul G 1:00:55

Okay, well, we'll pretend that's all that matters.

Andrea 1:00:59

Anyways, enough about me.

Paul G 1:01:01

Yeah, yeah, we gotta go anyways. We're running over. So we're past our time.

unknown 1:01:06

Are we past our time? No.

Paul G 1:01:10

Oh, you mean for the podcast? Yeah, yeah.

Andrea 1:01:12

Oh my god.

Paul G 1:01:13

Whispering. Everybody's like, this will go awkward. Well, welcome to the show. All right. So if you like the show, go to Paul G Newton.com. You can buy your swag there. We've got some really cool shirts. Now, the shirts you'll like, I promise you, if you go to our website, my website, Paulgnewton.com, and go to get your swag, you will find a t-shirt there or a sticker or whatever that you will find funny and like and will be proud to wear it.

Andrea 1:01:38

I might just buy the cap and just for shit's and gangbulls are crazy.

Paul G 1:01:42

I want the one at the donuts.

Andrea 1:01:44

That one's not bad too.

Paul G 1:01:46

I'm just here for the donuts and pride.

Andrea 1:01:49

That's a very true statement. Donuts are great.

Paul G 1:01:53

So I guess that's it, right? That's it.

Andrea 1:01:56

Alright. Bye. Bye.