Episode 366: Lee Donaldson returns with more Dead Zero

Always happy to talk Dead Zero, having followed the project for so long, and in this episode we have the man himself, Lee Donaldson, back now we have seen the first chapter. We talk the future of the project, and funding options for fans and followers alike.

Follow the project here

https://www.instagram.com/dead_zero_feature/

and watch it here

https://whop.com/lee-don-productions-ltd/dead-zero-chapter-1/

Transcript

SPEAKER_04 0:00

Hey, this is Alan Mansprang, who played Sergeant Nicotine Crockett in Survival of the Dead and Diary of the Dead. And also Brubaker in Land of the Dead.

SPEAKER_00 0:08

This is John Russo, writer of Knight of the Living Dead. I'm Lori Cardill, and I played Sarah in George A. Romero's Day of the Dead.

SPEAKER_04 0:18

Hi, this is Ken Forey, Peter, from 1978's Dawn of the Dead. Arguably the greatest zombie movie ever made.

SPEAKER_00 0:26

And you're listening to Darren and Michael on The Undead Symphony. The Undead Symphony.

SPEAKER_04 0:34

The Undead Symphony. Thank you.

SPEAKER_01 0:58

We are recording. We are recording. Apparently there's a whole version of Jumanji that's just come out.

SPEAKER_02 1:05

Is that the one that was in between the original Jumanji and the uh and the remake Q type one that was set in the 3D house?

SPEAKER_01 1:14

No, it's called co it's called Ghostboard, but it looks like it looks like Jumanji but scary Jumanji.

SPEAKER_02 1:22

Yeah, it it sounds awful already. Oh I do you know what I actually really like the new Jumanji movies? I I do too, and I like the originals, the original as well. Yeah, I um the the um big mountain, baby I love your way. Every time that comes on that anywhere, I always think of Karen Gillen um dance fighting. She is good. Yeah, that was uh that's that's a very, very good film. And um, I think Jack Black is criminally, criminally underrated in that.

SPEAKER_01 1:48

Yeah, I I think all of them are all of them are good in it. All of them are good in it. I actually like the second one because I'm a big fan of Awkafina, who ends up sort of there is one I think there's one sort of scene in the second movie where like they look at a horse, oh yeah, and the horse sort of acknowledges what's been going on, and I just pissed myself as well.

SPEAKER_02 2:11

I like uh the bit that makes me laugh in the second one. Is I think it's the second one, you know, in the first one where uh uh the little fella, what's his name? Kevin Hart, eats the cake and blows up because that's one of his weaknesses, and then in the second one, they offer him a slice of cake and he screams and hit the plates away.

SPEAKER_01 2:27

Yeah, I think I think they're fun, they're fun, they're funned, you know.

SPEAKER_02 2:31

Do you know? And and that and that's the thing, those type of films sometimes you just need like a harmless movie. You do. You you can just put on with kids and go, do you know what? Like, this is just fun. And it it's it's very much like a modern Goonies, isn't it? Where you just put the.

SPEAKER_01 2:47

I was thinking, I was thinking the same thing. But to be fair, you know, for adults, they can't there are can't there's commonly this whole sub sub-genre of bursting fun. So ready or not, ready or not to have a gale and uh they they're going to kill you. Um all four of them are literally the same, not the same movie, but it you know, they're cultists or something, or occultists. And once they get, you know, they can't do what they did, they just explode. Yeah. And all four of them just have great exploding body fun, and it's like not taking itself too seriously. They've got a huge cast of you know, Andy McDowell and and uh Henry Cherney are the bad guys in the first one with Dylan O'Brien, and this in you know, in the second, ready or not, it's got uh uh Elijah Wood is in it, yeah. And so with Jessica Parker, it's always just for Michelle Geller. So the big names are going in these exploding body movies. Um I'm enjoying them. I mean they're fun. There's there's nothing there's they're not horror. I mean, technically they are, but they are comedy horrors with bursting bodies, which when an occultist comes after you and you know something happens and then they just burst, yeah. It's fun, it's funny.

SPEAKER_02 4:09

Yeah, and uh, do you know what I'm I'm loving at the moment in what we're doing? So, as you know, my oldest is uh is 15 now, or he's about to be 15 in a couple of weeks, and I say 15 for any um jobsworths who who's trying to shop me for letting him watch films he shouldn't. But um, but he we we recently watched Weapons um together. Have you seen it yet? I haven't no. What a great film that is, it's so so good. It's not a zombie movie, obviously, so it's not like it's a lot of it. It's a winch movie, it's but it's so well done, and it's really clever, and it's really funny because he's he's now at an age where he's like, Oh, could like can we watch some more like like adult e-type films in a sense you know, like no longer like Sonic the Hedgehog kind of thing, and um and we watched it, and it's so funny watching films where the certificate, as I know it sounds really silly, is aimed at the age group because like I think Weapons was a 15, he's a 15, absolutely terrified him. And I was laughing at the way he was jumping out at bits, and you know, like like there's there's there's a couple of real, real, real good jump scares in there that even got me. But you know, like as you're a bit older, you're a bit like oh, like a little bit more reserved with your jump in. But when we watched it was like, oh my god, like brock screaming the house down, and I'm like, Yep, it must have been a good one, but um, yeah, but and again, guess what's coming out soon? Again, just slightly into the horror, and then we'll go back to zombie side of the bus, evil dead burn.

SPEAKER_01 5:34

Yeah, I did see I did see evil dead burn as yeah, I thought about side of a bus, exactly the same as you. Um could have been the same bus, but uh could it could be, it could well be.

SPEAKER_02 5:44

No doubt.

SPEAKER_01 5:45

Um, if it's not the 102, the 460, the 139, or the three three twenty-eight, and ain't mine. Um but um yeah, I mean there's a lot of really clever horror. I mean, even though they're they're not really you know brain brain achingly clever, but things like obsession and uh backrooms and uh the past passengers, whatever it is, uh the passenger. Um, and they're just they're coming out all the time, evidence coming out all the time.

SPEAKER_02 6:17

Are we are we in a new wave of horror, do you think? Because um, because obviously weapons, like I say last year was excellent. Evil Dead Burn. I know it's deferred in a kind of little trilogy that they've done of the remakes, but Evil Evil Dead was very the remakes were very good and very popular. Um, and you are starting to see these very psychological. What was one where the couple lived in a house and they got stuck together? Um you know, you've got that, you've got the long walk, which isn't technically a horror, but it's a bit more of a thriller kind of thing. But you've got a lot of these psychological, sort of like Jordan Pill type stuff out at the moment. So yeah, is is this another debate for another time? Are we in a are we where we had the zombie boom of the early 2000s? Are we in a zombie boom? Are we in a horror boom? Yeah, don't know.

SPEAKER_01 7:00

I think so. I think uh A24 and Bloomhouse are just churning them out. Um, Mr. Lee Donaldson has joined us. Good evening. Good evening, Lee. How are you? I'm very well, thank you. How are you, sir? Well, we're both recording from a child's paddling pool full of ice because it is hot as anything in northwest London at the moment. South South East South East London ain't much better, mate.

SPEAKER_03 7:29

Yeah, I can imagine. I've got my I've got my bladeless fan in the background. I hope it's not too loud. I can't hear it.

SPEAKER_01 7:35

I can hear it. I can't I cannot hear it. So um, yeah, so ladies and gentlemen, Lee Donaldson is joining us after we went to Horror on Sea in South End a few weekends ago to watch the premiere screening of Dead Zero. Uh, how how was the experience for you, Lee?

SPEAKER_03 7:55

It was great. Um, obviously, it's it's my hometown and county, and um, you know, the festival themselves are very supportive of what I do. And um, yeah, it was just obviously when when you've been watching uh your work for many months on on a laptop and your phone, there's nothing quite like it when you see it on a larger screen with a decent sound system, just the ambience and the atmosphere of a room for the people, and it was uh it was great. It was a great test screen, and uh it was a proud moment because obviously for anyone who makes films it's it's a slog, you know, and it's it's great to finally see your work out like being watched by others, you know.

SPEAKER_01 8:37

Yeah, exactly. You know, and I guess uh you know, you kind of do a lot of this stuff in isolation, and you uh and you just don't know how it's gonna be received, but I thought it was really well received. I you know, yeah, there was a a um a round of applause that continued to go, I think. And uh yeah, I mean Michael and I thoroughly enjoyed it, didn't we, Michael?

SPEAKER_02 9:00

Oh, absolutely. Um, you know, we you would have heard our podcast, and other listeners would have heard our podcast. We'll we'll put all the cards on the table. We we drove over um over the QB2 Bridge and Made O Way, and and you know, me and Darren both sat there, didn't we? And we were like, we we have no idea what to expect from this, you know, we have no idea. It it's very much like an indie horror type thing. Um, you know, we we we're going into this very open-minded, but also not cynical is the wrong word, but you know, when you're thinking, I don't know what this is gonna be, will it have the Rasmus? But we watched it, watched the first 35 uh minutes or or 30, 30 plus that it was, and and I think Darren summed it up absolutely perfectly. If you was if you was to have the one sentence that was, I could have stayed there longer and watched a lot more of it. And I think that that's exactly what you want because you don't want to from a viewer's point of view, you don't want to sit there half hour into a movie and suddenly I I always um use the phone um scenario, Lee. I always say about you know, when do you start looking at your phone or if you're watching a film, do you notice your notifications pop up? You know, but we were so engrossed in the movie, you know, I could quite easily have sat there and watched up even longer of it. It was a very good production.

SPEAKER_03 10:09

Thank you. That's obviously that's half of the battle when you're when you're you know making or creating anything, whether it's a book, a film, a TV series, wherever it may be, you you you can only hope that the people who are um watching or reading where it may be believe it and and uh and you have all their attention because we live in a world in time where people's attention span is short and it's easy to be distracted. So when people like yourselves weren't looking for the exit um or weren't looking at the phones, that's really positive. Because naturally I want you to be engaged and and and and kind of absorbed into the story, you know. That's what it's all about. The imagination isn't it? It's all about being pulled into that world and believing it.

SPEAKER_01 11:00

So absolutely and I I I think the key the key thing for us was obviously you know, we've been supporting you since we you know for months and months and months, and so we're big big big supporters of yours or fan of fans of your what you've been trying to do. Um, so for the listeners, uh you were your your movie was like 31 minutes, was it?

SPEAKER_03 11:19

Yeah, so it's 31. We did we did cut out a smaller scene, but it is roughly 31 minutes. But the great the screening that you watched was the test screening at just over 31. But we have now refined it to be just under 30, so it can actually be in more film festivals.

SPEAKER_01 11:37

Uh okay, because they're because of the limit on the time to to class it as a short or something.

SPEAKER_05 11:42

Yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_01 11:43

Uh um, so yeah, so so for for the listeners, it it was roughly 30 minutes of uh of entertainment. Uh it was uh a squad of elite something, soldiers, uh, going in uh and they go into a complex, and the complex has other soldiers in it, and also it has zombies and they have to fight their way in uh and fight their way out. And it was kind of it was the I think you even described it as this is the exciting 30-minute like action sequence, it's action sequence with uh with the backstory to come. Uh, because you you're planning to make the rest of it into the rest of the feature, right? So you're planning to do the bit before and then the bit after uh of this this this 30 minutes.

SPEAKER_03 12:32

Uh yeah, that's right. So it it should be uh the ideal scenario is to get it to 90, but we said we're happy at 80 minutes. Oh yeah, for sure. So um but we've we've obviously we've already written the feature a couple of months ago, like the extensions, and we've been just doing a little bit of filming over the last month or so, just adding bits in. Uh but that's the uh the ending, the extended ending. So we still have more to go um for that backstory, like I said, because that's obviously for the audience who've seen it so far or are to watch it, that will give you the answers to what, where, who, when, and and such.

SPEAKER_01 13:07

Yeah, yeah, because I think that was the bit that because we we we watch everything, you know, we have we have no idea what this is gonna be, we're gonna sit down, we're gonna watch it. And when we when we critique something, it it's more to do with well, okay, well what what what's missing, or or what would we have done differently. And I don't think we'd have done much differently, but it was the fact that it is this is you know two-thirds into the actual story, you know. If the rest of it is background, we kind of need to know. I mean, only for completion. I mean, obviously, when you finish the feature we'll sit and watch it and enjoy and know the everything that's true, everything that's got happen. And it's only because we've got that bit, it's kind of like you've tuned in two-thirds into the movie, and now the the soldiers are going in, and then there's the big battle and stuff like that, and you go, oh. Um, so so I hopefully you didn't you didn't find our our podcast uh are negative because it wasn't meant to be negative at all. It was purely, okay, we need to know this, these things.

SPEAKER_03 14:02

You know, no, yeah, not not no, yeah, not not in the slightest. It was um it's exactly what I wanted to hear. The the the the questions that you're asking were obviously very uh valid, and ultimately there were questions because you didn't find it boring. You wanted to know more. So you wanted those questions answered rather than go, uh, do you know what it was all right, but I don't really care what happens, to be honest. I don't really care about the plot or the story of the characters. I just it was okay, but I'll easily forget about it. But because you're so interested and so uh um keen the in the sense of like, you know, from a non-biased perspective, obviously you support me and what we're doing, but as a as a viewer, you you you are you are intrigued, you know. And um so that is not criticism, it's actually the praise I want to hear or the feedback I want to hear because I've I've already hooked you. I have hooked you. So if you look at it from a sales perspective, trying to sell our products online, the first thing is a hook for the customer or consumer. So that's what we've done there. Um, naturally, we would have loved to have shown you a bit more for a little bit more context, but because obviously I'm such a high-level action performer and producer, it's more it's more so we did it uh because we wanted to have the proof of concept for the high level of stunts and action. Of course. And so for people who enjoy that more, they don't really need to be heavy on the dialogue, should we say, yeah? They just they just love watching people get blown up, being the shit out of each other, you know, shooting zombies. They don't need much more than that, shall we say, yeah, because they're happy with that level of violence and an action.

SPEAKER_05 15:44

Yeah.

SPEAKER_03 15:45

There's some people out there who still want more depth and more storytelling. And and it was it was for me, it was a difficult decision to decide do we go heavy on the action first for the showcase and the the the screener, or do we go for the the storytelling? But I felt for doing more of the previous stuff would have been a bit boring. So because we wouldn't have had enough time and money to do the rest.

SPEAKER_01 16:06

I think it would have been difficult to if you'd made the background store, the more pedestrian part of the story first, yeah, it would have been more difficult to get support for the rest of it. Because I think you're right. I think you needed to go balls out and get the action bits down because people like action, you're right. Uh people love people getting stabbed, shot, you know, and and the like, and fighting zombies and being bitten. And you know, so you know, especially in this genre, uh that because that's uh that's what we we love a bit of that. Um so so my actually Michael Michael hasn't said much. Michael, you you really enjoyed it too.

SPEAKER_02 16:45

So no, I'm just I'm just um no, I was gonna say, I'm I'll just uh like I said, I thought it was a good point, um, a good movie, and and I think a good point you made there. I I think it I think the zombie genre is so and and to a degree, horror as a whole is a really tricky one because like you said there, you know, there there's a lot of people who like the action and they like the explosions and like like like this the James Bond um audience, you know, you know, they like that kind of thing. But I think horror and zombie genre is is a really tough one because even though you've got such a simple premise, I don't mean your movie, I mean the premise is a whole of zombies, you know, someone's coming from the grave, they'll bite you, you turn, etc. etc. It goes on from there. But there's forum after forum after forum after forum of well, what started the virus? I mean, Dawn of the Dead 2004 is a great example. I know I always bang on about that movie, Darren, and people who listen to this podcast is one of my favorites. It starts, obviously, Sarah Polly wakes up and she gets um attacks and everything like this, and then you don't know, but then suddenly someone put in the forum. Well, on the back of the DVD it says it's a virus, and we're like, like, that's how much level they're really going into with trying to find things. And I think Darren made a good point as well, like he was saying, you know, when we left the cinema, you know, what is this? How has this gone? And I I think I think you've done a great job, and you've you've created a fantastic character dangle that will draw people in. But I just I just want I just want to touch on the point, you know, we we had you on, I think it was last year or the end of last year kind of thing, and and you mentioned the alphas. And you know, Darren and I, after we we finished the call, we were like, it'd be really interesting to see how they do it because obviously we've had alphas in 28 years later, we've got alphas in Army of the Dead, there's other movies where you can have a perception of what an alpha is, etc. But I left uh I remember we were sat in the car and in the in the car park, and Darren, I think one of the first things I said to you was that is arguably one of the most unique alphas I've ever seen in the genre. I don't know how he's managed to pull that off, but everything he said he's managed to pull off there.

SPEAKER_01 18:47

Yeah, it was interesting because you know when you said alphas, it's like, well, how is how are you gonna do it? Because you know, we are aficionados, we've seen like 400 movies from 50 countries, and we know this shit inside out and backwards. So it was really intriguing for us because again, as Michael said, it could be the 28 Days Later Alpha, who's just the biggest, um, because you are a big boy. Um, or it's or it's that you could be the first, which would be like the Alpha from Our Lord of the Dead, um, or you could have been the um just slightly smarter than the other zombies, like the bit the mechanic in Land of the Dead, but you went down a different route uh because you've you went down the you're still conversant and partly human um route, which we still don't know why.

SPEAKER_02 19:38

I was gonna say, but it doesn't give anything away though. Because you you're you're like you the character without trying to go down to so much. Sorry, Down, I'll let you continue. But the character clearly is under some kind of infection or some kind of curse or some kind of something, but you don't know what it is, and all of these other infected or zombies, or again, yeah, we we presume they're infected, um, they're under its control, but we don't know how. And he's walking through them like Moses Part in the Red Sea. It was so well done, and um it it left you wanting more. Sorry, Darren, continue.

SPEAKER_01 20:12

No, no, no, that's fine, that's fine. I think it was that because obviously we we know this shit, so it's um yeah, yeah.

SPEAKER_03 20:18

People are so confident when we first spoke that you wouldn't know because I've obviously not watched as many zombie films as you both have, however, every now and then someone comes around on this planet, whether they're a musician, they're a filmmaker, they're a writer, and they have something completely unique. And it can be a combination of years of inspiration and uh assimilating and consuming other content and IP, and then it just comes in like a light bulb moment. Um maybe they just see things differently. I mean, that's another thing as well, you know. Yeah, and for me, for me, sorry, um, with this one not without giving too much away, I knew there were so many layers that I was applying to this alpha persona that hadn't been done, hence why I'm so careful not to give too much away because it's something that big production companies would still they would want to use it because it hasn't been used, and it can be it can be refined and tweaked in so many ways, which would be great for zombie IP. Um, and this is what I said to think originally and spoke to you guys. I want it to basically kick start a whole new um storm and frenzy in the zombie genre where people are like, oh shit, what a great idea! And what why why didn't we think of that? What can we now create? What can we do from that? And then we might excuse me, then we might see uh more interesting and compelling uh stories that aren't just your your your your normal um low budget indie or or even you know high higher level of long term series such as Walking Dead, right? So um so yeah.

SPEAKER_01 22:00

So it's really good to hear that you two have identified that and were actually very, very like um surprised because that's I think that's the word I would use surprise because the the two of us did genuinely walked out out of a out of a because you didn't want to watch the movie that you you were tagged to. So we're sorry, baby backs or whatever you are called. Um but we um uh whatever it was, but uh but we um uh we went back into the car and we sat and I was like, I don't think either of us were expecting that. And the thing is that we could we could have, we mean the both of us as we were driving over, because it's a bit of a schlep, we're like, okay, so we had no idea what was going to happen, but we were like, okay, we've seen the trailer. Um, so maybe we we were actually playing with, you know, we're playing the hypothetical game. It could be this, it could be that, it could be that. We've seen all these different things, and in the end, it wasn't any of the things that we thought it could be, which is which I think is what hooked us um so much. And you know, our podcast about your 31-minute movie was 57 minutes long, you know, because we just talked about it longer than the movie was. I mean, it took us two hours to get there and two hours to get back, which was even a lot longer than that. But but we did nearly talk for an hour about a 30-minute movie because there was so much to talk about. Um, and I think that's really well, and the thing is we're not we're not blowing smoke anywhere, but it's just that it was fun, it was exciting. Um the only reason I, you know, I sort of listed all the things that I would need personally, which are to do with all the backstory stuff that we don't know yet, is because in my head I'm like, well, I've seen the you know 60 minute to 87 minute of this movie, and I need to know I'm trying to work out what happened before, and I just don't know yet. So I'm trying to fill in the blanks without really knowing what the blanks were.

SPEAKER_02 23:52

But ultimately, but ultimately, Darren, with that, and and this is the point, and I'm gonna say it again, it this is where it's it's a shame that it at this moment in time it's only like 30 30 minutes and change because it's like how much like how much ideas or how much is is, or even arguably on the cutting room four floor, that is the answers to your questions. We're just not able to see it yet.

SPEAKER_03 24:16

I mean, I mean there were there are some hints in the film. Um if you when you can re-watch it, um there is a close-up of Lucy's Bane being injected. Oh, okay. Uh, you need to analyse that a bit more uh for the timing of the film. And obviously, with the control thing, it's it's it's through sound. So you need to analyse that part as well because something happens with sound that would allude you to understanding a bit more of the control from the alpha perspective. So, because the the the to fill in the gaps, analyze the science fiction and analyze the sound, and then that that will help you more without giving too much away to anyone who hasn't seen it. Um, also, but you're still not going to fully understand, but when you actually do get to watch the rest of it, which you will, um, because I'm not gonna end this project as we're going you know full steam ahead, it's actually quite simple. Um, really, and usually the best things are the most simple, but you know, the basic things, people can overcomplicate, they can they can over-engineer or they can write too much, and it's a bit wacky. But this is actually quite simple and it works very well. And um, I think you and other people, when you get to understand that um motive from Lucius Bane, the the agenda, the the uh the drive, and also the the science fiction and whatnot behind it, you'll be oh okay, that's actually pretty that's pretty cool, and really simple. But why has no one done it? Well, again, if you look at um Hollywood and other examples, they stick to what they know. They're scared to embrace new new IP and new content because they think no, we'll stick to the directors we know, we'll stick to the actors we know, we'll stick to the scripts and also the film that we know.

SPEAKER_02 26:06

Which is the mark it's the Marvel and it's the Marvel and DC saying that shit.

SPEAKER_03 26:10

Same shit every 10 years, isn't it? But even some indie indie productions are the same. They're like, oh, okay, let's do what the guys are doing at ITN with all the Disney horror stuff, and let's let's do stuff like Terrifier and just make it really silly and over-the-top and cheesy. It's like, okay, it works for some people, but you do need to try new things sometimes. But a lot of people aren't willing to take that risk. Obviously, there's reasons behind it, money being the main factor, usually.

SPEAKER_01 26:36

Well, I think it's the risk, it's the risk element, isn't it? Where they go, people will you'll get bums on seats if you remake terrify the 50th time, you know. But unfortunately, I think you're what you've got a really good point. I mean, before you came on, Michael and I were talking about, you know, we do believe there's some sort of renaissance in horror at the moment because you've got movies like Weapons, Obsession, Backrooms, The Passengers, you know, all these movies that are coming out of Blumhouse and A24, the it they've all got either a clever premise or, as you said, a simple premise that people haven't thought of before. Um, and those guys are bringing out new stuff where everyone else is playing it safe because if they put a million down, they want to at least make a million back. So they're gonna go, let's just play this safe. Marvel, after wasting a whole phase on loads of new heroes that nobody wanted to see, are regurgitating the same old shit again in the next one with the same cast. So, you know, they're even bringing Rob Downey Jr. back who said, I'm not making any more superhero movies, I'm done with Iron Man. Here's you know, 20 million dollars. Can you come back as Doctor Doom? Yeah, why not? And I I refuse to watch shit like that. I'd rather watch something new and interesting. And I I think that capturing that. I mean, we're my I was talking to someone today, I think Random is talking to me. Uh he was basically he's he posted a picture, uh picture, he posted a clip of um uh the girl with all the gifts, which is a uh British British zombie. Yeah, I think I think I recommended. You recommended it, yeah. And it was just it was a British movie. I mean, even though it had a big cast because it's like Patty Consodine and and Glenn Close and Michael's favorite Jimmy Arton. Um sorry, it was it was uh uh you know a few tiers higher, but it was still just a clever concept, you know, and you need to just as you said, you need to find the hook. Uh, what what is gonna make people come back? And then you need to make when they do come back, the payoff needs to be remember um either memorable or at least unique enough to set yourself apart from the others.

SPEAKER_03 28:49

Well, that's what I believe I've done with so if we if we compare to Walking Dead, yeah. So as you know with that, um, there's so much more complexity to it through the storytelling of the humans always just fighting one another, yeah? And and the terrible, gruesome things they do to each other when they should be really focusing on just wiping out all the zombies, right? So, but what they do walking dead is so good is that you get amazing makeup and VFX all the time, by the way, yeah. Like just always really good makeup, even though it's old, it still stands test of time now. Um, and action, but then also really good storytelling. And because, you know, for me, I was like, we must do the action very, very well because people want to see really good makeup, they want to see good score, they want to see good action, high-level stunts, um, dangerous stunts as well, but they also want to have the contrast of the storytelling and the humans and the characters and the and the struggles they're having. So obviously, that's where I've drawn my inspiration from there. Because I think you know they do it really well, hence why it's such a long-standing franchise in many spin-offs.

SPEAKER_01 29:57

It's not it's not really about the zombies, it's about the survivors. Exactly. As like I think Mike and I always say that the the humans who survived the zombie apocalypse are normally worse than the zombies themselves.

SPEAKER_03 30:09

Exactly, yeah. So, what what we've done, what we've done with Lucius Vane is really when you get to understand more of, like I said, his agenda and reasons as to why everything is occurring in what you're seeing in the middle of the film, you'll be more intrigued and interested in that, in the insanity and the the the the the weird mindset he has, you know, the crazy, the because he's he's he's he's the maniac, obviously. So um that is what I want to be the hook there for the storytelling. People don't really care about the zombies, they're just there.

SPEAKER_01 30:44

Zombies are a catalyst for the rest of the story, right? So Michael and I always say, you know, the story is the group is living in this building, they're trying to get back to you know the way things were. Zombies come through, destroy it, they have to move on. The catalytic they're basically like a fire or an earthquake or piranha fish or something that is basically going to destroy what you currently have, destroy the status quo or shake up the status quo so much that you have to go and reinvent the characters and you know, because you're giving them an extra, you know, past element, you know, uh, and then they have to do something different going forward. So I mean this is probably because we can't have to show you that yet.

SPEAKER_03 31:23

You you're gonna be able to do that. Oh yeah, yeah, exactly.

SPEAKER_01 31:26

So the thing is, you know, you've got two people that are one interested in your project, uh, but two have an insane amount of zombie movie and horror movie knowledge. So we are trying to put I am basically, you know, I've got you know 400 movies in my head, and I go, okay, this element and that element, maybe this element and that element. I'm sort of putting all this like uh like a uh a science experiment together of all these different chemicals made from these different other components and other different movies, and that's how I do, you know, because I compare, you know, compare a contrast. I just I just saw a moody copy of Colony, which is uh the new big Korean one, probably will be the you know the zombie movie of the year for the international crowd. Um, because and that was really, really unique and what they did there. However, there were elements of it that you just went, oh, they did they didn't need to do that. Yeah, they didn't need to do that.

SPEAKER_03 32:20

But people people always you know, remember all all film, there's always going to be some things that are.

SPEAKER_01 32:26

Do you know what I did? I was I I classed it as a you know, I I I used the and the analogy of a bag of revels. Uh the Americans are going, What are revels? Okay, revels in the UK are like a a uh pack, a bag of sweets chocolate. They're a multi-pack of chocolate surprise. Thank you, Michael. Uh basically, but there are six different things. And you've got coffee, you've got uh a raisin, you've got biscuit, you've got honeycomb, you've got uh orange, and then you've just got chocolate regular chocolate or toffee, yeah, toffee, and then then biscuit, yeah. So you've got six different things. I really like all of them, but I know people that don't like coffee, so they're gonna hate one element. I know people that don't like fruit, they're gonna hate two. I know people that like fruit, but they don't like fruit-flavoured things, so they like the raisin, they're not gonna like the orange one. So basically, when you've got a movie like this, like this analogy I use used in the last podcast, it's like a bag of revels. Not everyone's gonna like all six of them, some people are gonna like a combination of them, some people will like all of them. And you basically you can't please everybody.

SPEAKER_02 33:28

So there will be a few elements in a movie that are cliche, there'll be true, you know, a few others, oh that's just you know you you get you get to the you get to the point where it it's the classic, isn't there? That there's only there's only seven real genres you can follow, or is it seven or nine? It's it's like the damsel in distress, the disaster, the love story, the betrayal, yada yada yada. And like Darren was saying there, like you're seeing a lot of things at the moment. I mean, like I said, we we watched Weapons, me and my son, the other day, and um you you're watching it, and I I don't know if you've seen Weapons yet, um Lee or not. Yes, but so you know, so so I'm watching it, and obviously I've seen a lot more films than my son, and about halfway through, I'm sitting there thinking, this is pop fiction if Jordan Peel did it. You know how they keep doing the different scenes from different points of view. Um, and then like funny enough, the other day we watched a we watched a Disney movie, um, because I've I've got another son who's six, um, Hoppers. I don't know if anyone's seen that yet. Um, and there's a scene where basically it's it's about um this is for listeners who haven't seen it, but basically it's about um like um animals and a dam's gonna fall down. So a person goes, what we'll do is is we'll put your brain into this beaver and we'll get you into the colony and help build the dam. And I said, This is avatar, but for children, you know. So after a while you do get to a point where it is the same stuff and it just unfortunately gets gets done over and over again. But that Darren, I think the Ravel is a good example. You just don't want too many people eating the coffee ones because no one likes them. Um, the only thing I was gonna ask Lee, just while it's quite fresh in my mind, you've obviously got our feedback, and you know, the I I really liked the atmosphere of everyone who watched the film in the sort of theatre sort of layout with us, you know. You could there was people who obviously was in the production, you could hear them chuckling at bits that they had done themselves, and it was and even though it was a horror movie with not a particularly nice concept to it in the sense of the story, you know, its injections and vampi uh zombies and all this, it there was a really nice feel to it. What has what has the other feedback been aside from ours of the movie?

SPEAKER_03 35:38

So the primary feedback is they just want to understand a bit more about Lucia Spain. Um that has really been like they don't understand how he's so durable. Um because obviously you see in the post-credit scene something happens, right? So um we haven't really had much feedback other than that. But everyone, uh you know, not not to not to be biased, but the feedback's been really good. It's only been like small things here and there, like uh, I wasn't sure about someone's expression, or I wasn't sure about you know this, there, like just just bits and bobs of VFX, little minor things. Um so overall it's been it's been very positive, but the the resounding like feedback is how the hell is Lucy's brain control on the zombies? Yeah, how how how how how how did he not die by being shot, burnt alive, and so on, you know, like the these are the recurring questions. Um and also when do we get to see more? You know, so there hasn't been much else. I mean, obviously, people have been very impressed with the stunts, we've had great feedback on the stunts. People who aren't even don't even understand how stunts are, they recognise that we've done a lot of stunts in it and quite interesting and dangerous looking uh looking stunts because I wanted to tick the boxes in this film by covering almost every stunt you can imagine in a movie with real people, not um AI, and not any type of VFX effects, it's just literally doing real stunts with stunt coordinator. So they've had really good feedback on that. Um some people said they weren't too keen on the dialogue between some soldiers, like you both said, actually. There was a couple people who didn't like it, they thought you know it's very um sexist, um, but then some people loved it. That you know, they they they liked the dynamic. The the the only other feedback had was that they actually um enjoyed and celebrate the two female leads. Oh, yeah. I mean, so yeah, so that there is the the the particularly Katie.

SPEAKER_01 37:51

Katie Katie was super. I mean Katie was stand out, yeah. Genuinely.

SPEAKER_03 37:55

Yeah, for me, in the very, very first edit um we ever did before any grading, any score or anything like that, when we just put all the pieces together and looked at it, she stood out to me. Um, and and a lot of people have said that, including yourselves, which is fantastic because she's such a strong, important character in that film and story. Um, and it was so nice to hear because I when I cast her, I was like, This she is, you know, sometimes to cast a directors we'll speak about, or directors when they cast an actor, whether they're new and up and coming or established as saying this person was born to play this role. For me, Katie was was that person for this role. Um, and she held that team together very well. And and and for me, really, really was like you know the star of the show. Obviously, for me, I've not really had my chance to shine yet as an actor because I'm so mysterious and elusive, as you see. Um, but that's fine. It was never about Lucius, even though he will become more prevalent in the the flashbacks, he's not he's not gonna be the same Lucius you've seen, by the way. That's one thing I should say.

SPEAKER_01 39:01

So um because that is one thing I think we we'd be picked up on is that there wasn't a lot of Lucius Bain in this. No, no, that's that's which is absolutely fine because he's done the nipple because this is this is the end, exactly. And if we did get an hour's worth of you know backstory, then it's predominantly going to be Lucius Bain and whatever's happened to Lucian Bain to Bain to turn him into what he is by the end of the movie.

SPEAKER_03 39:23

But it's also it's also as a producer, I mean you you probably know or you may not know, but some people there's some people in this in this country in particular who who have money and they have connections, and what they do with that money and connections is they basically make their own films and they make themselves a star of the show. So, and which is a vain vanity thing, right? So they they they can't get cast. This may sound rude, but they they tend they tend to not be able to be cast because they're not really an actor. So for me, when we wrote Lucius, I also said to the directors, I have to take a back seat here because I want to be the producer and the writer, and I want to be in control, I want to be in control of the production and make it a success, which means we highlight and celebrate and push the other talent within the film more so, hence why Katie and Jade, in particular Katie, had those more prominent roles to you know to showcase their amazing talent and and to to not hog the limelight. So there's also this is a personal reason behind it for me as a producer, and also in terms of the writing and storytelling, um, they had those those two female leads had to take a uh um you know they had to take the driver's seat because you see so many of these action films which are so mal dominated. Oh yeah and and and guys, I'm not trying to be woke and tick the boxes there like Netflix and Disney and so forth. It's purely this story and these characters need to be diluted and it cannot be mal dominated.

SPEAKER_02 40:50

So I think the thing is, I think the thing is Lee as well. Like, sorry to go, I've just to interject because I think you're making an excellent point. And ironically, like I I I watch of like a lot of um film film review um um YouTube videos, so like uh heavy spoilers, dead meat, all that kind of thing. And um I think that and again, this this isn't in a woke way at all, because I'm not particularly woke. I'm I'm I'm I'm I'm probably not um I'm probably a little bit left than most people, but I'm I'm by no means woke. But what I'm certainly, what my point is is I think to be a successful horror movie, um, you need to embrace strong female characters, you know, like like like like if if you look how the female role has evolved over the years, you know. Obviously, we had um, you know, in Psycho, and but I was gonna say you start with Psycho and other characters, but then uh but then you end up with like Ripley, brilliant, Jamie Lee Curtis in Halloween, one of the greatest horror uh one of the greatest characters, in my honest humble opinion, in all of horror, is Neve Campbell in Scream. She's absolutely exceptional.

SPEAKER_01 41:59

So and they re when they remade Night of the Living Dead, the granddaddy of all zombie movies, they made Barbara, who was a bit of a wuss in the 1960s version.

SPEAKER_02 42:10

In the 90s one, she was a badass, wasn't she?

SPEAKER_01 42:11

She was a badass. She basically said give her the shotgun.

SPEAKER_03 42:15

Yeah, and also these characters didn't need to be sexualized, right? No, absolutely.

SPEAKER_01 42:20

Oh, um exactly, they were strong characters. I mean, I would say what you made was a good point because I I, you know, again, I've seen fucking hundreds of these movies, but when I have seen movies where it is that purely macho male, you know, overly macho, overly, you know, macho cast, and well, not they're not necessarily cast, but certainly the characters, it just it you kind of turn it turns you off a bit. So I've seen loads where it's like navy seals versus zombies, or that there's a Dolph Lungwin one that is uh has a a similar feel to your yours in that you know the squad's going in to do something, um but again it was this overly macho group of you know a cut-down version of the expendables, uh but it just doesn't work.

SPEAKER_03 43:09

Boring, boring, you know, and and the thing is as well, sorry to cut you up. No, that's fine. Um you know, going back to obviously about having the strong female characters, a lot of the IPs, and you you guys have referenced Alien before, yeah? And again with Ripley. I mean, look, that we look at that franchise and that that um the films they've made with obviously Sigourney in it, she basically made those films a success because of how well she plays that character, yeah, how how her performances stand out. I think if they'd not used a female character, they would have not been as they are today, right? How how how well respected they are. So so we we so we we we we really were quite conscious of that when we wrote this, that it can't be that Jarhead only dominated um film because. This is a business as well, it's a show business, right? So I'm I'm making films to also make money to make more films and tell more stories, yeah. And and ultimately, my audience is male and female, so I don't want men only to watch it because ultimately you must have your audience, exactly. And I've I've got clients and acquaintances and friends who are women and they've seen the film and they really appreciated seeing strong female leads in it, but they also commented on what they liked about the male performers. They picked out a few of them and thought, yeah, that he was quite funny, or I liked him. He he looked cool, I liked how he looked. And I was like, that's great because I've now got people who aren't really into that sort of genre, or aren't really into that type of action film, but because they've got that dynamic of the genders in there, they've got, okay, do you know what I can watch and enjoy that and appreciate it. It may not be my cup of tea, but actually I would watch it with my husband or my partner or of my friends, maybe. And for me, that's that's that's successful because I've managed to convince more people from different age groups and and genders and so forth that it's worth watching, you know, and and they don't see it as stereotype and and whatnot. So it it it and this when you mention about how good Katie was, it was such it was such such so good to hear because yeah, I've I've I've always said, I mean, her Jade is very good as well, but but Katie's because obviously her role is so poignant with the Zero Squad.

SPEAKER_01 45:31

Um Yeah, we don't really know who who Jade was, to be fair. We will do, I guess obviously she's she's escaping at the beginning and then she's rescued. We don't really know anything about her, we don't know what who she is, don't know what she was doing at the beginning of the movie. Um obviously there was a reason for her doing what she was doing.

SPEAKER_03 45:49

Um whereas all the blanks in. So yeah, without spoiling, she that's just she has a very strong tie to Lucy's plane.

SPEAKER_05 45:59

Yes.

SPEAKER_03 45:59

Um, and and just before I forget, sorry, there's one other thing you mentioned about the feedback when you asked me previously. Um you two highlighted how good the zero squad work together, and you believe it. Yeah, so so for me, uh for people who don't know about this uh sort of thing, when it comes to firearms handling, there are many countries and not countries, companies and workshops in the UK that will claim to teach you how to handle firearms on set, yeah. Um, and actors and wannabe stunt people will do it, but really they look naugh, yeah, and it's not believable on set. So I was like, I don't want anyone, including you two, because I knew that you'd be looking more closely than most people. Um, I was like, I want these two to really believe my my military tactical team here, and that's why my armor, I was brought in to do the rehearsals with them because I was like, these people need to look like they are a solid unit, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 46:53

And it's something that a lot of people get wrong. I've seen I've seen a lot of movies where you go, they're not believable, they're just charging into rooms without covering each other and sometimes your guys from the from the off, you know, actually was that just after they got out and they go down that wall right at the beginning. And I argue, I just I just looked at Michael, went that they've got it right.

SPEAKER_03 47:16

Yeah, it's not you've got start wrong, and and that that was my feedback to the director. Oh, we don't need to do that much rehearsals for that because he doesn't really understand about firearms and how how to portray that because he's not a performer, he's a director, yeah. So I said to him, trust me, if we get the military squad wrong and how they handle firearms, how they move their commands, their interactions, even the words they use, the buzzwords, yeah. So if they don't say the correct words, there'll be some people there'll be some people out there, or even not people who aren't trained and understand it, they'll think, like you said, no, not believable. And straight away that takes you out of the believability of the story. You won't, you you you lose, lose interest because you think, no, these are that. I don't I don't believe it, yeah. So already I've lost my um the interest in the attention span from some viewers because they're like, I don't believe these guys.

SPEAKER_01 48:02

Yeah, they're not they're not convincing soldiers, whereas your guys most mostly were. And and I'll tell you what, I think a lot of people would watch Katie Stokes dragging injured, you know, injured um uh members of a squad out of a you know, out of a complex uh just as a movie by itself. Um you know, so I think well, okay, I think we we need to wrap up soon, but tell us about the the plan for the rest of the production going forward. Yeah, what's what's what's the future for DRM?

SPEAKER_03 48:35

So obviously I I'm so I'm currently self-distributing, so I'm trying to sell the current chapter one of the movie through my own distribution channel. So ideally, the fans of the genre, the people who are you know committed and love this, will continue to help me by purchasing to watch it and download it. Um, and obviously that would be fantastic because obviously it's directly helping us to speed up the process. But we are no matter what, continuing to self-fund and self you know, self-finance this production to get it over the line as the full feature to give you all the film you deserve because it it deserves to have a prominent stand in the zombie archives because I want it to be a modern classic. So where we're at, we are we have filmed some test footage, which I have shared with you too. Um we have more planned coming up uh this month, or sorry, in July. Um, and it's we're actively trying to find new investors, new sponsors. So you could be a business or an individual who are you know who wants to help support us to get more funding in to finish the rest of the film because the whole cast are behind it, they want to finish the film. Um and yeah, we're just slowly working behind the scenes to get more stuff done. But the you know, the the more investment we can secure from the consumers, so the to the audience, and also from private private um investors, the faster we can get this out there um in the mainstream. Now, you you guys mentioned Tubby or Tubi or whatever it's called. Um for me, I've always believed this film's too good to be on those free platforms. Um but I also feel it's too good to go straight to streaming platforms who also steal a significant amount of money from the from the creators. So my my goal has and always will be to go mainstream seminar and self-distribute in that manner. So that's that's the goal. Um I want I want it I want it to be like you know, um all the other current films we've mentioned that are in the cinemas right now, um like Obsession and so forth. I may not have uh a YouTube following behind me, but this is all part of the the process and you know the the building of the audience through various um interviews and and PR campaigns and film festival runs we're doing. So we've got loads of film festivals to go to, additional ones this year and next year. We're hoping we bring we build such a strong audience, we are able to finish by next year and have it in mainstream cinema, even though it's only limited run in a few select cinemas in the UK. Um, that's our goal. So I I want to see it on the big, big screen, you know, IMAX, something like that. I I it it's one thing see it in a small film festival, but see see your film on a big proper screen, Cineworld, ODM, wherever it may be, uh that's the ultimate goal. That's a dream. And I believe Dead Zero deserves to be there. So yeah, there's we're we're actively filming, but we do need help. Um, and the more people who listen to this and know someone, or they can just chuck a bit of money into it, sponsor us, buy even just buy the film like to watch where it is at the moment, that will help us speed up the process. Um, but whatever happens, it may take me longer than I I want, but I will finish this film.

SPEAKER_01 52:05

I mean, have you looked at grants and things like that? Is that an Essex film grant or something?

SPEAKER_03 52:12

Uh no, I haven't, but I'm always open to suggestions. Um, I mean anything can happen, you know, tomorrow phone call could happen. Uh, what I will tell you is that we're not we're not gonna sell out unless.

SPEAKER_01 52:26

Well, I think I think that was that was what I was thinking as well. If suddenly a a company came in and said, you know, we'll help you finish making the movie, you don't want to relinquish control because what it sounds quite clearly um is that this is your baby with the the existing production brew and cast, and someone else coming in and telling you what to do, it wouldn't really well.

SPEAKER_03 52:50

It's not gonna it's not gonna say well. If you if you if you look at JK Rowling, yeah, so she agreed to let them make the movies, right? But she says you must you must do this and you mustn't do this. There are strict terms on this agreement if you want to make these movies. So I would have I would have the same the same stance as her that it's my way or the highway. Because ultimately, people who have not been invested in your project from the beginning, they're never gonna have the passion, they're never gonna care as much as you do, and ultimately, no, 100% that can destroy and tarnish what you have, which is potentially golden.

SPEAKER_01 53:28

Well, it stops in being what you thought you you know, it's it stops your dream, it's it's it's alien three. So uh so the thing is, I think the best thing you said is that you know you're not gonna put a time limit on this, you'd like to get it all done by next year, which is you know, or the end of next year. I think I think there's enough of a product for you to to finish it. It'd be a real shame if you if you didn't, but I think you've got enough people to uh to push you over that line over the next year or so.

SPEAKER_03 53:58

So the only issue we have is that um it's it's it's obviously fantastic news for for Katie, but she's actually pregnant and expecting a baby, her child in November. So um there will be Lucia Spain Jr. Jr., yeah, exactly. So we obviously will will even if I had enough spare cash to start filming tomorrow, she can't film yet. So there's naturally going to be a gap there because as you know, people have other things going on in their lives. So, but we have the momentum, the casts are still very much involved and want to be doing more. We want to tell all the audience, including massive horror fans like yourself, the true story. Um, like I said, if it takes me longer, it takes me longer. Um but it will happen. But what we have so far, I'm very proud of. It's um it's obviously a stepping stone, you know, to the audience who are listening now who haven't heard me speak before. It's only my second movie in two years, and I've jumped from a 12 minute short to a 31-minute short. It's quite a big jump in a year, we're year a year apart. So I'm very proud of that. But I also am very hungry and ambitious and very competent at making more. So, you know, it's just the tip of the iceberg, really.

SPEAKER_02 55:10

Well, where can where can people find out more about? I mean, I know obviously we we tweet about it and and you've got your Instagram and all this, but just just for more publicity, more potential funding, that kind of thing. Where can because because we have a lot of listeners to to this podcast, and there might be some who who want to help out, you know, like I know you've got that link where you know, if you download the link, it you know, not not chuck a couple of quid in a cliche way, but you know, it every little helps, doesn't it? Um, you know, we where where can they find out more about Dead Zero, maybe help with funding that kind of thing?

SPEAKER_03 55:42

So for if they if they would like to watch and download it, they can um do so for 199 via what um WHOP, which is a platform that you can where content creators share different types of content on there, so they can they can watch and download it there. There's a lot of information about the film and trailers and teasers and whatnot. Um, there's also my business email. So if you've actually got uh people who want interest in sponsoring or endorsing or investing for co-producer credits or things like that, um they can also contact me directly through through through the what platform, as well as they can they can obviously contact you through Instagram if they if they so wish. But the details on the what are really where they need to go. We haven't we haven't made a website because we just want to kind of keep everything on what because we can we can have the we've got the proof of concept there for anyone, whether they're a an audience, the audience member who loves horror and just interested in watching it, or there's somebody thinking, okay, I'm interested in the project, so I want to get involved from a business perspective or or you know, just in any other manner capacity. They might even just have a contact. So the the the business email address is on there as well.

SPEAKER_02 56:53

Excellent. And and that's the thing, I mean, this is this is directly at the listeners now. Um I mean, for for what what did you say that was Lisa like one £1.99 or something? Um that's £1.99, and I think in the US that'll be about what $3, give or take a little bit of change here or there. Um you you're getting a fantastic production, um, half hour production, get less because they give or take a minute or two for less than a cup of coffee. And you think if you get enough of us, even if we get sort of 10% of our normal downloads um who would watch that, that that would still be quite a good little chunk that could go towards some production. So um, yeah. So sorry, Darren, if I'm using this as a little bit of a plug as well to help you out here, but I think it's I think for for horror movie fans, zombie fans, this would be a bargain at two pound a movie.

SPEAKER_03 57:43

It's also um, you know, you help the algorithm. So we we obviously trying to build a national or international audience. So we still have the Asian market to discover our work, the American market, the rest of Europe. So the more people who view the page, engage with the page, buy, it will help the algorithm for more people to discover our work and hopefully make it an overnight success because then then we can grow faster. The thing is, as we know, you can pay for unlimited advertising and marketing, but really what helps is word of mouth. The more people that engage and the more people that share in the community, the faster they'll be able to see a finished product and enjoy it. Um, if they if they're like I said, if they're fed up with watching the same thing, they want something new, they want something fresh, well, they're gonna get a lit here for what they're seeing so far. And if they want even more, all they need to do is just help us. Um, you know, very small fee. We don't need a huge amount to finish, by the way, either. So we're not asking for millions of pounds. Um we don't really need much because obviously we have we're doing it for the passion and the love. It's not it's not in any way trying to make ourselves millionaires and live on boats and yachts. We we we're passionate about telling compelling stories and kicking arse or kicking zombie ass, yeah. So it's um yeah, we just everyone's just gonna help each other out. And you know, we're we're we're the same, we support other indie indie um filmmakers. So we'd be very appreciative if the audience listening can just help us out. Like I said, it doesn't always have to be money, it could be just an introduction to someone to have another conversation to help the product uh the production move a bit more swiftly. So yeah.

SPEAKER_01 59:26

Cool. Well, um, it's been a pleasure as always.

SPEAKER_03 59:30

Thank you very much.

SPEAKER_01 59:31

No, no, we we we well it's I think it's mutual. Uh, because you know, we talked a long, long time ago before it came out. Now we've finally seen it. We did another pod on it, and we've done this one too. So we're in it for the long haul. Um, and hopefully the listeners, as Michael uh suggested, go and check it out, go check it on WAP. I think I downloaded it twice. Uh so um, and I've already chucked in some money anyway. So you guys go go and find it. Uh, I think you'll enjoy it. Uh, anyone that uh has spoken to us and knows us on social media knows we know our they knows that we know what we're talking about. So go find it, go find Dead Zero. Uh follow them on Instagram, follow Lee on Instagram too. Um, we'll include it in the liner notes as always. And uh yeah, go go check it out. Go check out Dead Zero, the game changing zombie movie.