Real Life Investing With Jason & Rachel Wagner
“Real Life Investing” with Jason and Rachel Wagner is a multifaceted podcast that blends insights from real estate, entrepreneurship, family life, and political discussions. Known for their candid and engaging style, the Wagner’s explore how their conservative values shape their approach to both business and life. They often discuss their personal journeys in real estate, offering practical tips on topics like how to buy a house or investment property while navigating a challenging housing market.
In addition to real estate, the show frequently delves into entrepreneurial lessons, highlighting the importance of mindset, perseverance, and staying focused on long-term goals. They are open about the challenges they’ve faced and provide valuable advice for anyone looking to head into entrepreneurship or seek the best version of themselves.
Dinner table conversations are central to the podcast. The Wagner’s discuss their experiences balancing various topics that families face, while often featuring guests who share similar journeys. Political conversations are explored from a conservative perspective, particularly when they touch on how these beliefs influence their business decisions and personal growth.
With a blend of relatable stories and expert advice, “Real Life Investing” is a show that appeals to a wide audience, from aspiring entrepreneurs and real estate investors, to those seeking inspiration in their personal lives.
Real Life Investing With Jason & Rachel Wagner
48. The Unexpected Shift To Homeschool with Kate Salas
Homeschooling has been getting a ton of buzz lately. However, many curious parents struggle with feeling like that they can homeschool their kids successfully, especially if they aren't specifically trained to be teachers. Well today we sit down with Kate Salas, a mother of three, who recently found homeschooling during the pandemic and has not looked back at traditional schooling since.
Kate walks us through how her family ultimately made the decision to homeschool, even though her husband is a public school teacher. Kate shares how she utilizes co-schools and a neighborhood network of homeschoolers to help maximize the experience and provide tons of social interactions. Kate also describes her day to day, mindset, and offers plenty of tips on how any parent can effectively pull off homeschool.
A super relatable episode that every parent with young children should hear!
Welcome back to another episode of the Real Life Investing Podcast with Jason and Rachel Wagner. We have another special guest with us today and we're actually building all off the topic of homeschool. So we just did an episode with Leslie Durenberger and she was just like a total pro at homeschool. Our next thought was well, from this conversation we kind of wanted to bring in somebody that was maybe not so much of a pro, but like someone that's out there actually doing it too with the younger family and is committed towards bringing homeschool into their life and just kind of hearing like how it's all been going. And so Kate Salas is here to join us today and actually Kate and I go really far back to high school.
Jason Wagner:Probably even Probably elementary school. Elementary, yeah, yeah.
Kate Salas:Because you were in Kelly's grade, my sister yeah.
Jason Wagner:Yeah, that's right, and we probably haven't spoken like on the phone or like in face-to-face Since high school.
Kate Salas:Since high school, Probably yeah.
Jason Wagner:And so this is like an awesome conversation. So thank you for coming and thank you for being here. Okay, so the main point is homeschool and how long have you been doing it and what drove you to homeschool, and tell us a little bit about your family and you know kind of what you work with.
Kate Salas:Yeah, sure. So my husband is a public school teacher and we have three kids. My daughter is eight, my son is six and my the little one is two, and we always thought we would three kids. My daughter is eight, my son is six and the little one is two, and we always thought we would public school. We went to public school. It was very much like even in a small group we were a part of, there were six couples and we were the only couple choosing public school.
Kate Salas:Everyone else was doing homeschool or private school and at the time I felt some conviction about it but I was like, no, this is the right choice for us. We're involved parents and so that was kind of our mindset going forward once we had kids and were leading up to kindergarten, but even backing up from that, the preschool. So our daughter, our oldest, was three when COVID hit and they stopped the year abruptly, you know whatever. They ended up starting halfway through the next year. But it was mask mandatory and my husband and I kind of saw through the smoke a little bit early on and we're like this is not effective. I mean, I understand if you're wearing the N95, you know there's certain elements that sure might do something. But the cloth mask that they were wanting these four-year-olds to wear wasn't as effective as they intended it to be, I don't think, and we did not like it. But we also struggled with like, well, she loves going, so we'll just bite the bullet, fast forward going to kindergarten.
Kate Salas:I had so much, I don't know, I mean turmoil a little bit, but just feeling I was already being that mom calling the curriculum director of the school, asking all the questions, because I am like culturally, socially, politically, that's something that's very interesting to me, it's something I pay attention to. And there were a lot of concerns, especially, like I said, my husband being a public school teacher, he sees a lot of that day to day. I mean, he's a high school teacher, so it's not quite the same, but he's in the know of what's going on. So we ended up enrolling her and then, about two weeks before school started, they said mask mandates were going back and I was like we're not doing it, we're done. And I was like we're not doing it, we're done. And I was like but now what? I wrote my email withdrawing her. I mean, my husband and I were on the same page but I was like I did not think homeschool was going to be for us but a one income family. Private school was not really an option either. But I was like, well, we'll figure it out right.
Kate Salas:I knew one person at that time that homeschooled and I reached out to her and she helped me get involved with a co-school that was in like a couple towns over and our first year we homeschooled I guess I'll just shorten this part and we can move on to the next question but homeschooled that first year with just my daughter pregnant. Second year my son was in preschool at just like a local church and she went to the same co-school. And then last year was our third year. We were at a different co-school that started like a completely different education methodology that we had been doing before classical education and that is where we were going. This coming year will be our fourth year homeschooling at that same co-school doing classical Christian education.
Kate Salas:So is a co-school the same thing as like a co-op, or can you kind of explain that yeah, no, so a co-op and I know if people didn't listen to Leslie's episode they should definitely go back and listen to that because she had so much knowledge in there to share too. But co-ops are often parent run and so like if we had, say, all of you guys had kids there, you could teach a ton like a business class to some high school kids. Say, you're really good at a different skill, whether it's a subject, math or a different skill, sewing, all these kinds of things. It's a way to have community get some help with some of the education. But it's all parent-based and it's usually not tied to any sort of other curriculum you're doing at home, whereas a co-school can be. Our particular co-school is very it's. We have the same lesson plans. So if my kids are sick for a day, I have the lesson plans at home, I have all the material. I just do it at home that day or whenever they're feeling better. And so a co-school is much more like. The one we go to is called Alaterra Academy and Alaterra in Latin literally means alongside. So the idea and Leslie talked about it too was co-schools typically, anyway, are very much we like.
Kate Salas:I am still the primary teacher. The teachers know that I am the primary teacher as the parent, and they are there to offer support and so, especially as you get into some of the older grades, they offer maybe some of the bigger teaching subjects. So if math isn't, you know, I happen to be married to a math teacher, so I'm not really worried about it. But theoretically, like, oh, I'm in algebra, I don't remember algebra. I know some people can get a little bit worried about that. Even if you don't go to co-school, I think you can manage. I think it's very doable. The curriculums are so helpful and there's other options online courses and other things for your kids. But theoretically, these teachers will teach some of the main subjects and then I go home and help practice and repeat and do do a lot of the like, digging in work, but they teach like they would potentially introduce the topics, so we, but then it has like a classical element to it. So there are some co-schools that aren't I mean plenty that aren't classical education focused, so are you present?
Jason Wagner:you're? You're present when you go to the co-school. No, so we drop them off. That is different too. I'm sorry, I forgot to mention that. So we we have it two days a week present.
Kate Salas:You're present when you go to the co-school, no, so we drop them off. That is different too. I'm sorry, I forgot to mention that. So we we have it two days a week and we drop them off. It's from nine to three and so in the in those days and again, I can't speak to everyone, but for our particular co-school they have art, they have gym, they have recess, they have a. There's a playground where we do it. Our particular co-school is like satellite campus, if you will.
Kate Salas:It was founded in Nebraska and we happen to have mutual link. A friend, one of the parents here, knew them and as we were at the first co-school we were at, her name is Kate as well, and she was trying. We were all kind of brainstorming. We want something that will help us prolong homeschooling, because that's one of the things that becomes hard for a lot of parents is they either feel isolated, they feel ill-equipped and they feel sometimes like I mean, I have three kids. There are plenty of homeschool families that have four or five kids and you're like, oh my gosh, like this is a lot, and the people that started it in Nebraska, that was their case. She's like I have been homeschooling for like 10 or 11 years now. I'm feeling the weight of like every day doing this. What can I do to help make this like finish this strong for my other younger kids?
Jason Wagner:Sure.
Kate Salas:And so that was really, you know, nice to have this. They have so many elements to provide community for the parents, trainings, but also for the kids to have some. They have so many elements to provide community for the parents, trainings, but also for the kids to have some of those fun. Because that was one of the things that I struggled with when we considered homeschooling. I was like I remember my winter sing or I wanted to go on field trips and you feel like, are my kids not going to get those experiences? But that's one of the reasons I loved the co-school option is because you still get those things. We've gone to Brookfield Zoo, we've gone to plenty of other places farms and Epic Air and all these other things that it's like they still get those experiences. You don't feel isolated. You have mom friends that are doing the same things as you. You could be a room mom, but you are still in charge of your child's education. You know who you are entrusting your kids to for those six hours a day.
Rachel Wagner:So yeah, that actually sounds like a really nice hybrid setup where there's still like a little bit of traditional sense of going for a full day with your peers and without your parent there, but the parents, like you said, is alongside the teachers. You know exactly what's happening and then you get to take it home, so you kind of have a nice hybrid. I like that.
Jason Wagner:Yeah, honestly, that sounds very attractive.
Kate Salas:And Leslie mentioned it too there are a lot of co-schools. I mean, obviously I'm far away, that it wouldn't be practical for you guys to go there, but I mean there are a lot popping up and I think I saw I think she said in her thing there were like 95, maybe she didn't say it, but I read it like 95,000 micro schools nationwide already.
Kate Salas:Yeah, and which is also potentially different than a co-school. But there's just so many options and even people who choose, like the traditional homeschool route, like all at home, there's still ways that you can get involved in your community and have so many of those things. I think. One other thought I had too, as I was thinking about all this was like when professional athletes or actors they homeschool and people have, they don't bat an eye at that, they don't think anything like oh, that's odd that you know Simone Biles probably was homeschooled a lot.
Kate Salas:Like she had a tutor, I'm sure. And no one thinks like, oh well, she's missing out. Yes, there's so many, so many things that have to be like rewired. When I think, when we when we think of what homeschooling actually can be for our kids.
Jason Wagner:Yeah, oh, absolutely. Is that true about Simone Biles?
Kate Salas:Most professional athletes and Olympic athletes are homeschooled. I, I don't know her exact situation, but they can't typically train and the hours that they train like. Jordan Childs moved to Texas from Washington to train at Simone's gym and so sure she could have enrolled in a school there. But when you're enrolled 40 hours a week you know five, five days a week, six to eight hours that doesn't leave as much time to train as you do. I mean, I remember Sean White talking about plenty of, but I guess it's just like, oh, we truly don't think anything. Like, oh, that's weird for them, but it's just. You know me as a suburban mom who's like, oh, I want some of the freedoms and benefits that homeschool offers. Well, that's weird. Like you're depriving your kids of things.
Kate Salas:So and again things that I had to rewire in my own brain as we embarked on this journey.
Rachel Wagner:I think like as the kids get older. That is something that I think is so fascinating to me too. If they have an interest or a talent in something that you can really foster for them and give them the opportunity to really master that and have opportunities in their true interest, that that really interests me and that came about when I was training with dance my dance coach she, she was homeschooled in high school and you know she danced professionally with the cowboys and now the lovables and has opened a lot of doors because she was able to really focus on dance and gymnastics 100, yeah, so I think it's super cool yeah, yeah, yeah.
Jason Wagner:so you said the co-school is two times a week. Yeah, yeah.
Kate Salas:And that's different too.
Kate Salas:I think most most co-schools probably are two, maybe, like one of the micro schools we were considering for our second year was three days a week, and it was because the other thing that I people, when you think of homeschool and I know I struggled with this, like reframing is it's not public school at home and it's not going to take you six hours to teach your kindergartner what they need to know, because most public schools have full-day kindergarten now, which is, I mean I could give you a list of reasons why we've continued. We started homeschooling because of mask restrictions and social distancing, started homeschooling because of mask restrictions and social distancing Like what kind of. We have also seen the like significant detriment that that caused on kids and I just was like I'm not setting my my first four and like this is how you're going to start school. We don't want you to be fearful of this stuff and that's not to say you don't take illness seriously, but what we knew by that point a year and a half after the pandemic started, I was not fearful of COVID.
Jason Wagner:Yeah.
Kate Salas:We had all had it.
Jason Wagner:Yeah, yeah, we were the same. Specifically remember we were sending Scarlett to daycare and she was still not two. But the moment that she turned two we had to slap a mask on her and it's just like oh, happy birthday and what changed from yesterday to today? Literally nothing, nothing nothing and how did that make any sense? It didn't make any sense and like we lost a lot of sleep over it, yeah, and ultimately we pulled her right. We pulled her out of a couple daycares pulled.
Rachel Wagner:Her got kicked out.
Kate Salas:Yeah I mean, you know, they kicked us out. We said we're leaving. I was actually just telling this story to somebody. Daycares Polder got kicked out.
Rachel Wagner:Yeah, I mean tomato tomato right, like whatever you know. They kicked us out. We said we're leaving.
Jason Wagner:I was actually just telling this story to somebody recently and, yeah, we could tell it again, because it's kind of funny thinking back on it At the time it was not funny. But basically, chicago had lifted the mask restriction and we were, you know, we abided by it If we, if we dropped him off. Okay, we knew that she was going to have it inside, but we were adamant about, well, if she goes outside, take it off right. And so that was our, that was our wish, and they did a pretty good job of a fairly good job of making sure that it was off. But then, as soon as the mass restriction was lifted in chicago, it was like okay, tomorrow you don't have to wear a mask, all right.
Jason Wagner:So that we thought that that would also mean for daycares and schools, and that wasn't the case. And they said, well, wait a second. Well, just because the city lifted it doesn't mean that we're going to lift ours. And we gave them what I don't know A full, probably 48 hours to like make up their mind. And we got no guidance and that they weren't changing anything. And so I fired off an email and I said parents need to know it's no longer a requirement. Why is it still necessary and the lady came back. The director came back and said Jason, this is very insensitive. You're very insensitive to all of our teachers here who are extremely worried about this lifting. And I was just like. I mean, this is the type of teachers, teachers who are worried about themselves more than their children.
Rachel Wagner:They were fearful of the children. Oh yeah, exactly, I mean again my husband's a post-school teacher.
Kate Salas:He had the same nonsense. People are well, we don't want to get sick. These kids can carry so much germs, he's like. Since when do we put the health of adults above the health of children? Yeah, Especially toddlers.
Jason Wagner:Yeah, I'm so glad you said that. Because that was just like all right. You know, we're withdrawing literally after that comment, because I'm just like these are the people that are teaching the kids and we just don't want, we just don't want them.
Kate Salas:Yeah, I mean I have. I still go through the drive through at Chick-fil-A because it's my weakness. They're large. Dr Pepper gets me as a five like masters over here but they there's a woman there that's still, and I know she's got to be early 20s now, so she was in high school when all this happened still wears a mask outside in the drive-thru and I'm like people's brains broke.
Jason Wagner:Yeah.
Kate Salas:They broke and bring it back to the education how much that mask impeded small children from. I mean, I think I don't remember what exact organization one of, the whether it was the AAP something they just changed the guidelines for when kids should be talking because it was cute. Oh yes, they just changed it, it was like kids by two should be saying this many words and they just changed it because they weren't yeah, because they were masked, yeah, they didn't see phases for three years or whatever, which is so important for like brain development, seeing the shape of the letters, as you're saying, I mean again.
Kate Salas:I could go on and on about that, but yes, it's, it's wild the detriment that measure of, you know, protecting public health caused and we just moved on. You know no accountability and yeah, just to this point.
Jason Wagner:I just love how the standard is just getting lowered. You know there's so many examples We've talked about it recently. There's so many examples of just like the standard, which used to be a higher bar, is now all of a sudden just being lowered, and it's because of things like this.
Rachel Wagner:I wanted to ask you, going back a little bit to the co-school and then kind of like your schedule, can you share a little bit of like what does your weekly schedule look like? What does your daily schedule look like? Because I know you mentioned it's not you're not bringing public school home, so you're not doing school for six hours a day. So how do you structure your day? What do you include? What does that kind of look like?
Kate Salas:Yeah, so I mean I can share, obviously mine. That's one of the things that, as you get to be a part of these Facebook groups and ask people's opinions, it is so cool, honestly cool, to see how different you know. I have a friend who is phenomenal. She was a public school teacher. She is like, so wise. I go to her for so much. But she has this little chart that she has and the kids wake up and they go through, they check off, you know, ate my breakfast brushed, my teeth got dressed, and they have to do these things before they start.
Kate Salas:I'm a little bit more, probably because I'm not a morning person, but I'm like I we get up. If my kids are not awake by 730, because I have late sleepers I will wake them and then we have breakfast relaxed. We do some of our memory work during that time. So in classical education, one of the and maybe I'll get to that in a little bit, but part of classical education is memory work, which is in the grammar phase of. That is a lot of repetition and so they have new memory work each week. So we'll put that on and just check off part of school right there while we're eating breakfast and, depending on the weather, sometimes I would let them go to the park first because it's, or even in our backyard Somewhere. Just get some time outside. Especially my son they can. Having that time to expel some energy really helps, especially with him focusing later. So I try to let him play a little bit, clean up the kitchen and then for a while while my daughter was taking two naps. I would do a good chunk of school then and that morning nap and again for kindergarten, for second grade it is. I mean most people would probably say, and I would agree, it's an hour to two max of work at that point because you're so focused You're sitting there walking through it with them, and even my two excel pretty well in math. So if it's not a new topic and we're reviewing, sometimes they finish it before Like I'm still doing something and they'll finish it. And I would say that's one of the quick side notes, not a downside, but just something to consider.
Kate Salas:When you consider like a co-school option that's very cohesive with you, which is something I wanted you don't necessarily have the flexibility to go ahead, so you kind of stay on track, which is good to keep you on track if that's a struggle. But sometimes my daughter's like can I do this next page? And I have to be like, no, you got to wait for you know tomorrow. But on a home day, yeah, we'll do some work, we'll stop, we'll have lunch. I often make them have some like alone time in their room so I can clean up and I can get ready then for her afternoon nap, where I will do much more of like our.
Kate Salas:We use a curriculum called Logic of English for their language arts, which practices cursive and phonics and a lot of you know. So funny, I'm redeeming my own education as I go through this with them, because there's I'm like I don't know why you use CK instead of K, but now I do, because it, you know, follows a short vowel sound. It's like there's things that I'm learning and anyway it costs more of my time at that point. So I use the time when my toddler's asleep to try and give that focus time. But we then can do more arts and crafts playing. My daughter is loving the piano, so she'll do piano during the day. We have a piano app on her little tablet so she'll sit and do that for at least a half an hour, 45 minutes. I let them have a show here and there. We have other homeschool friends in the neighborhood so we can hang out with them, but it's very like I am not someone that is super rigid. If we work at the homeschool table we have our dining room is kind of converted into our homeschool area. If they want to do their reading, I make them read for. I don't make them but that's part of what we do is they read for and my.
Kate Salas:I have two kids who love reading, which has worked out well, and even a friend I met the other day talked about how she's like my daughter used to love reading but now she like is losing that and she's even losing this joy. As your daughter and I didn't want to I'm like no, she's not, you know like she doesn't have this pressure that she has to get. I mean, she has truly read more books than I have hands down. Um, oh my gosh, she's. She's a phenomenal reader but like loves to do it as a hobby and I enjoy reading but I often fall asleep. Very much relaxes me and so she. She loves it and she's able to do these things that she loves. My son is so crazy about presidents. I mean he could tell you, and part of our memory work is learning all the presidents. So both of my older two know all the presidents and he's six. You said he's six, wow.
Rachel Wagner:Yeah.
Kate Salas:He knows that we don't have a 47th president yet, but he knows what years they were in office.
Kate Salas:He knows how they all died, when they died when they were born, because he found an interest in that and he has the freedom to spend so much time doing that and because one of the other things that if you send your kids to a traditional school five days a week, when they get home and maybe not as much in those early grades, but they have homework and then they have activities and dinner and baths and bedtime routine they don't have as much time to give to some of those interests that they have. And that's been.
Kate Salas:One of the things that we love is that we have that built-in free time for them to play together, for them to foster these sibling bonds, that I get to have this time with them. And that's not I mean I know there are, that's not to shame any parent who puts their kid in a traditional school. I know there are plenty of people who would love to have that time and they feel like they can't, whether it's because they feel like not equipped to do it or they need that extra income. I mean I think there are sacrifices that we for sure make by doing this I can attest to that but also that, people, you can make it happen. I mean I have a friend who's now the director of our co-school. She was a public school teacher and for two, maybe three years, every day when she got home she did their homeschool at night. So I mean totally worked her butt off, but she valued them having a slower paced, focused education with the worldview that she and their family have. And so I mean there's so many reasons, people.
Kate Salas:I think 25, 30 years ago people were running to homeschool and now people are running away from public school, and so the motives are a little bit different.
Kate Salas:But I think, as I've been in it, there are so many reasons we've continued to stay as opposed to cause. That first year I thought like, well, once they get rid of the mask mandates, I'll keep up on the curriculum concerns and I'll I'll be that parent who's there and knows what's happening. But the benefits just have so far outweighed and of course there's challenges, right, but there's so that have outweighed my option to send them to public school and we just are really happy with what our days look like, what their lives, their quality of their sleep. They're not getting up. I mean, I have friends who have to get their kids up at 6.30 in the morning to get on a bus at 7.15 and then they go to afterschool care. It's just like so much on them and again, that's not to shame any parent that's in that situation. It's just, I think, when you consider, if you are able to do it, the benefits that these kids have of having a slower paced life by homeschooling, it's so worth the challenges and the sacrifices that you might make.
Jason Wagner:All right, I got a couple of questions here. This is very inspiring and very fascinating, so thank you for sharing all of this. I mean you and I went to the same school. You just said wake up at 6.30, get on the bus at 7.15. Like that was literally my exact schedule. Get home, go to school bell rings at 2.30. You got after activities. Maybe you do go to an aftercare A lot of times. You don't come home until six, Like you're right that's. That's a lot so.
Kate Salas:And your parents. We only get these kids for 18 years under a roof. I mean some of us are blessed to have them a little longer, but then it's. I mean, that time is so fleeting and I think that's one of the things that all parents recognize. But if there's ways to make it work that we get more of that time, sorry, continue with your question.
Jason Wagner:So you probably have the exact same schedule I had growing up and you don't wish that you were doing that with your kids, Like really whatsoever at all.
Kate Salas:I mean there are times where, like I was at the park for example, the other day we were at the park and there were two little girls that were playing that looked close to my daughter's age and my daughter's very friendly. She's not like overly outgoing, but it's one of the things I encourage when we're at a park If there's a kid playing by themselves, ask them to play with you Like, especially if she's there with her friends.
Jason Wagner:Oh, I love that.
Kate Salas:And these girls like didn't acknowledge her, which they weren't being mean, right, but it just like made me sad because in my head I'm like if she went to public school here, would she know them, would she have the opportunity to play with them? And as we continued, my son, who doesn't know a stranger walked up. He said hi, what are you guys doing? And one of the girls was like mind your own beeswax and leave us alone. And I didn't. I saw him by himself and when I asked him what happened, that's that's what he told me. First, you know, the mama bear in me, my, my heart was so sad because he was so sweet and he was, his feelings were genuinely hurt. But then I'm like I'm glad that Vivian isn't playing with them, because that's one of the other things that you get to have a little bit more control of, especially when they're young. People talk about you want your kids to be in public school, to be socialized, right?
Jason Wagner:Yeah.
Kate Salas:Do I want other second graders, third graders, teaching my kids how to socialize, teaching them how to treat people. When someone just kindly approaches you at the park, it's not like he rang your doorbell and asked what you're having for dinner, like you're at a park playing and he just said hi, and you were so nasty to him and I'm like no, and I was so grateful. I felt like the Lord really helped in that moment, made me feel like you were doing the right thing, because there are three other homeschool girls the same exact age in the neighborhood. We just didn't have to be at the park with them that day. Vivian has friends in our subdivision that are very kind to her, and she has other friends, and that's just in our subdivision. That's not to mention the other friends that she has at co-school or at church or at gymnastics, all these other things that she does. And so there are moments where I'm like, oh, is she missing this? But, like I mentioned, our co-school does a really good job of it. Like they had yearbooks this year that they got to sign their yearbooks, and so it was like I'm so grateful for the skills of other parents who are organizing the field trips, organizing the yearbooks.
Kate Salas:Like you know, I have a different role in some of the ways I volunteer there, so there are things that I think you know every situation has a plus and minus. Would I love a little bit more time to clean my house and read a book without being tired and feeling like I'm not go go going, yeah, but I could also do a better job of putting some of those boundaries in myself right, getting a sitter so that I have more time. It's always a growing experience. But when I look at one option versus the other, for right now I don't see us going back to a traditional school, public or private. And that versus the other, for right now I don't see us going back to a traditional school, public or private. You know and that's the other thing with homeschool is you can reevaluate. I mean, illinois over-regulates every freaking thing except homeschool, which is fascinating and fantastic.
Rachel Wagner:Stay out of it.
Kate Salas:You know like let us because when I remember telling my parents that cause my family was not on board when we started this journey, they and my mom, I love her. She never butts into my parenting. She's so respectful of that and she didn't butt in. She wasn't rude, but she did ask questions and that was the first time she's ever like asked questions to be like are you sure this is the right thing? And I think, going into year four now you know, she sees she's still going to birthday parties, she still has friends, she still gets to do so many of these things that would she still say that like it's the choice she would make, or that she would have wanted me to make.
Kate Salas:I don't know, but I think with time she's seen the fruit of that. And yeah, it's. Who knows? You could also decide you want to, and we had people from our high school that were homeschooled I don't want to put them on blast on here, but homeschooled through eighth grade and then went to public high school, and so you can decide with each child. We have friends who At our school yeah.
Jason Wagner:I don't even know those people. I probably do, but I don't even know Wow.
Kate Salas:But they like, and I have friends who have one kid in public school, one kid at a private Christian school, and then they're homeschooling their other two kids that are part-time in their public school.
Kate Salas:So you can evaluate each child at each season of life and make different choices. Now I will say one of the things is, a lot of times, going into high school, you do need to make that decision before, because a lot of high schools will not accept, like, if you decide, okay, sophomore year, they want to do driver's ed, they want to do sports, they want to do all these things at the high school, you're not guaranteed that they will accept them as a sophomore. They may have to restart at a freshman level, and so that would be the only thing that, like I've learned and again I'm not a pro there could be, you know, different circumstances in certain places. But that is one of the things that I've been informed was that, going into high school, you do want to have that decision kind of made at that point if they're going to continue homeschooling or go to a more traditional setting.
Jason Wagner:I have so many questions there's I know there's there's so much here I wanted to. You talked about a little bit of backlash not really backlash, but just like your mom asked questions. Right, I think that's what very common fear would be, which is just, you know, telling your parents or telling anybody in your family, or just like your friends, who are just so accustomed to this is how we do it. You know just the response back. But you also have this other side of things, where your husband is a public school teacher, like that's a whole nother thing.
Kate Salas:Yeah, what like yeah, what is the?
Jason Wagner:response there. And first off, how'd you get him on board? And second, like know, is there comments that have been made to him about, like well, why don't you know you're a teacher here? Why don't?
Kate Salas:you send your schools here. You know what I mean. It's just like a very simple question Right.
Kate Salas:So he um, it didn't take much to get him on board. He was, like I said, we're both and I think a lot of times really well-meaning parents just aren't aware of what is going on. I think, on my way here this morning listening to a podcast, it was like people who are trying to live counter-culturally, who are aware of politics and our cultural world, are a sliver of a sliver of the people, and so I think there's so many parents who just aren't aware that you know, at my husband's school there are tampon machines in the boys' bathrooms. I mean, he had a group of boys come up to him and said can you send our petition to have the tampon machines removed from our bathroom? And he's like I can't get involved, but like tried to convey as much as he can, like keep going.
Kate Salas:But like, but like tried to convey as much as he can like, keep going. But like there, I mean he sees the kids coming up, he sees the quality of education is not what it used to be, and that I mean I have three siblings that are teachers. I'm married to a teacher and three of my seven siblings are public school teachers. So this is not to say that there aren't phenomenal teachers who care, who aren't doing all of these things that we're concerned about as parents who aren't pushing agendas, but there's only so much you could do based on curriculum, based on you don't know necessarily the teacher, but even the friends Like I can't for sure say this like cause I don't have. I didn't see the article myself, but there was supposedly an article at one of the schools he used to teach that there was a litter box, I think. Even I don't know if it was on this podcast. It's very close to here.
Rachel Wagner:Yes, yes.
Kate Salas:So in the bathroom because of the furries and it's like we don't even teach our kids reality, like that is a problem. And again, if you are a parent that is aware, you can do some of that, but you are also going, you are trying to deprogram 30 to 40 hours a week of what they're getting. So even the best well-meaning parents could still struggle with that. And that's not to say that that every I mean, cause here's a nice high school kid trying to sign a little petition, you know. So there are kids that are aware and like eyes open to the craziness. But to first say he was not a heart, I'd have to twist his arm to really be like, okay, we'll give this a shot. He could not stand to see our kids in masks. We not in Chicago, we were the people going into the stores without the masks who were getting stopped.
Jason Wagner:Oh, you're defiant.
Kate Salas:Yeah, and I am like Enneagram 9, do not like conflict. I am nauseous every single time I'm walking in. But I felt so strongly about this issue that I was like I'm going to do it. And they just asked ma'am, can you put a mask on? No, thank you, I just kept walking and you get looks from people.
Jason Wagner:Yeah.
Kate Salas:But now, when you see the people in masks, I'm like this must have been what they felt, like where. I'm like what is wrong with this person?
Rachel Wagner:And that's probably what they thought of me, but I'm hoping now that they're like okay, this whole thing was a farce. I do think a lot of people have woken up to that and are seeing it. There's still some stragglers that are probably too far gone.
Jason Wagner:There's certainly some stragglers. Yeah, certainly some stragglers. We came across some the other day couple thoughts come to mind.
Rachel Wagner:When you were talking about the playground experience with the other kids and the peers, what would you say to somebody? And I've got my own thought on this too that I'm guessing is probably going to align with yours. But I'm curious if somebody were to say to you well, you're overly sheltering your kids. And so when they grow up, how are they going to handle conflict or someone being mean to them? You know, do you worry about that at all? How would you respond to somebody you know thinking that yeah.
Kate Salas:Well, I didn't shelter them, I exposed them to that right, they were at the park and they had that. They have siblings, they have friends that they're going to potentially get in conflict with and I can't protect them forever but I can try to help them recognize good character, what a good friend is. How do you, how do you appropriately handle that Like? And we can do that as parents, but if you have any kids under the age of six months, you see any child with another sibling, oh, someone knocks over my, the baby comes over and knocks over my toys. Well, how do we respond? And you get to kind of coach them a little bit on the proper ways instead of hoping that the other second grader knows the kind way to handle conflict. And I think I would not deny that there is some sheltering that goes on in that. But I also think it's sheltering, like I'm not sheltering them at 18. Because people have said that I mean full disclosure.
Kate Salas:I'm sure I thought that before I entered homeschool was like, well, they're not going to be exposed, especially having like, we are Christians, our faith is very important to our family and when you look at the world, we don't live in a Christian culture anymore or world, and so they are exposed to adversity everywhere they look, the music, the shows that they watch. I'm not keeping them in a bubble Like they go out. Often I think people poke holes with arguments like that and again I get it Like I was one of those people at one point who definitely had my questions. But my option is do I shelter them from having really mean friends and potentially impacting their self-worth or self-esteem, or do I help put them in environments where they get to learn what a good friendship is at a young age? And I think if I have to choose one or the other, I'm going to choose the one that's going to. I mean, the amount of kids on like depression medication, anxiety medication, is astronomical compared to even when we were you know young and not the world, but younger.
Kate Salas:And so it's just like why? Why are kids so? Mean the exposure to social media at these ages? I mean a kindergartner on a school bus with a fifth grader there are plenty of fifth graders who have a phone I mean the stories that I have heard of school bus encounters my daughter went to. She's like I really want to ride a school bus. I was like I don't care, if you ever go to a public school, you will not ride a school bus. Like I will drive you to school. Before I put you on that thing. Like I remember, even when I was in like school going on a school bus, the conversations that were had were not appropriate when you have a sixth grader, because it was a middle school and high school bus so there's, a sixth grader with some seniors like it's just not appropriate.
Rachel Wagner:Yeah, well, there's no one supervising, I remember that there's nobody. The bus driver is driving the bus you know, and then there's this huge amount of space for all these bus drivers also law enforcement too at the same time?
Jason Wagner:yeah, yeah, you know well now.
Rachel Wagner:Yeah, they don't have to be, but yeah yeah, no, I, I mean, we used to.
Jason Wagner:the bus was crazy, the bus was a party.
Rachel Wagner:Yeah, it was a party. So I can't imagine the party happening now With the phones.
Kate Salas:I mean the exposure to pornography at such a young age yeah.
Kate Salas:It's just, it's like there's so many things that and we know, based on studies, the effects of pornography on kids and on adults and it's like there's so many things that I'm like gosh, yes, I am sheltering my kid from that, sue me. I think that is worth them, maybe not getting to do all of the traditional things and I know Leslie talked about it too that there are little proms and there are other things, Whether you choose to engage in those or not. Even the. So, like I said, we were like the satellite campus, the main campus in Nebraska. I think they have over 350 kids in their co-school.
Kate Salas:So it's like two days a week. You're getting that. And then you also have the opportunity to have, if your communities are big enough, you get. I mean they're on sports. My kids play sports on a soccer team. They go to gymnastics, they get to do there's like theater programs that you could put your kids in. Like there's so many ways for kids to one, be socialized, but two with other kids. But when in the world are we I mean, are you around 35 year olds every day?
Kate Salas:No, your kids aren't either Like, but in the classroom, when they're there for four days a week, they are with only 20 to 25, sometimes 30, depending on what area of the country you're in Six-year-olds, and then those same ones, a seven, all the way up till high school, where there's a little bit more variation. But my kids, you know one of the things we did we had a currency, we were doing money in one of our lessons. And one of the things I love about homeschool is you get the opportunity to go and do life in the real world and so we took them.
Kate Salas:We were talking about money and my son realized he's like I don't have a $50 bill in my piggy bank. So we practiced counting how much money. We explained what a bank was and who a teller was and how we could exchange our bills. And he wanted certain coins. So I called he wanted a $2 bill. I called he wanted a $2 bill. I called the bank that we go to. I was like do you guys have these things? And they said yes, that we could exchange them. So brought my kids in and they practiced talking to the teller, asking them, telling them what they wanted, counting out their money, switching it, and they get to learn what these things are.
Kate Salas:We go to the grocery store. They get to scan. My daughter loves putting my card in, waiting for it to be done and pulling it out, helping bag the groceries and carry the groceries to the car. Like just so much thing. Like so many things that I think on weekends, if you don't have your kids during the day, you're rushed, you're like I'm not letting you do this and that's understandable, right, like there are many times I'm like, oh my gosh, just let me put my card in. I don't want to do this right now, but I know that they're learning, they're watching and they're getting these experiences that I mean. And one of the mom, there's a woman in the bank and she's like do you homeschool? The amount of times that that's been said to me and every single time.
Jason Wagner:Really.
Kate Salas:It's. I can think of four different occasions that I've been out with my kids in public and they have said, do you homeschool? And I'm always like, okay, what's coming next? I'm like, yeah, and she's like your kids are so well-behaved, they're so kind, like it's. And again, this is none of this is meant to bash kids. In a traditional school, I'm sure there are hundreds of thousands of wonderful kids. I mean I know there are. It's not I'm sure I know there are. But just the benefit to be able to see these things and experience these things daily is such a gift and it's it is reassured when you, when you hear people ask and then affirm what you're doing, which is nice to hear.
Rachel Wagner:So I want to ask a little more about, like, the behavior stuff, because I I feel like I have studied not studied but just learned so much about homeschool over the past couple of months. It's so intriguing to me I I really do feel like it's probably the right path for my kids, especially my oldest. Yet I think I'm still waiting to see what kind of learner my youngest is. But I am fearful, like my biggest hold back is my confidence in my ability to do it and do it well and have my kids like, listen to me and be able to learn from me. And because I feel like what I've noticed is when they do come home from school, that first, like day and a half is a struggle.
Rachel Wagner:There's a lot of outbursts, there's a lot of defiance, there's a lot of arguments between the two of them.
Rachel Wagner:I'm just like man, like I don't know if I could handle this every day. But then, like by the end of Saturday and Sunday, I'm like, well, okay, like they seem to be a little bit more relaxed, a little bit normal. So in my mind I'm like, is that how it is If you homeschool, like they're always more that end of Saturday, sunday behavior, or are there ebbs and flows? I assume there are, of course, ebbs and flows, but, just like in general, I feel like everyone's got such a positive take on it and I'm just curious, like did you ever have self-doubt about your ability to get them to listen or get them to learn from you, and is that ever come up in a reality? Cause I hear from everyone they're well behaved, they're calm, they're well adjusted, they have a love of learning, and so it's not a struggle, because we had homework like this last year and it was such a struggle. And so in my mind I'm like well, how am I going to get her to read with me if she hates doing homework with me?
Kate Salas:I guess just kind of sorting through that self-doubt. Yeah, and that's totally not. My kids are not perfect. They absolutely have outburst, my son especially. I think one of the reasons that it could be hard when kids come home is they've had to be on all day, right, they had to be well-behaved, they had to be a good listener, they had to not burst out when they wanted to, and then they have to come home and do more work, and so they're just like I'm done, I'm in my safe place, I'm in my home with my parents and I don't want to do this. And I can tell them that I can't tell my teacher I don't want to do it, but I can tell my parents that. And so I think Leslie mentioned it too.
Kate Salas:There's this theory of like de-schooling or unschooling rather, where a lot of times if you pull kids from a public school situation, that is a good approach, just to kind of like, hey, let's reset and kind of reframe what education is. But do I have issues sometimes with them wanting to do it? For sure, but I give them a choice like okay, if you want to spend 20 minutes now playing basketball, we do have to finish this later. To spend 20 minutes now playing basketball. We do have to finish this later. And I mean, some people have theories like why do they have to finish it? You know, like depending, if they're on like and that's not me, and that's fine because I'm like no, there are things in life you do have to do when you don't want to do them, right. But you don't have to be there for six hours, sitting still for the majority of that time, or sitting focused maybe not always still, but especially as they get into the older grades, they're sitting at a desk until those five minute passing periods.
Kate Salas:But you get that freedom to find what they love If you know that they need that, to spend some energy being outside. Go on a morning walk, start your day, have breakfast, listen to fun music, go on a morning walk or your backyard or whatever you're going to do. And I think a lot of people find that their kids, when they're not forced to have to do it at a particular time for as long as they do, it's not as hard to get them on board, especially when you find curriculums and different learning styles that work for them, because a public school teacher can do their absolute best, but when they have 25 kids they can't pay attention to each kid's learning style and they try, they try so hard. I mean, I know how much work my sisters put in as a kindergartner and fourth grade teacher. But it's just, you can only do so much.
Rachel Wagner:And you're strapped to the curriculum right With the school.
Kate Salas:Yeah, and one thing I wanted to come back to that you would ask Jason about the coworkers, a lot of the people that he works with. He loves to tell people he loves to oh yeah, he's an Enneagram eight, so he's like let's, let's, let's say an eight, yeah, so he's like, let's go, and so he'll drop it whenever he can.
Kate Salas:Um, but even at the first co-school we were at, there were four public school teachers that had their kids there. There are so many public school teachers who are not sending their kids to public school.
Rachel Wagner:I'm finding that too. So I feel like, as I started like learning about the homeschool thing, all of a sudden I found like half a dozen homeschool moms. A lot of them started at the school we're at and now they're home, but there's two that were previously public school teachers.
Kate Salas:I'm like whoa, yeah, and again it's not. I mean, I know Leslie talked about Wirepoints. I don't know if you guys are familiar with that website or Instagram page much, but they share a lot of information on, just like, the quality of education, where the because that's one of the other things that's different with traditional school versus like a homeschool is that there's focused on different things. A lot of times traditional school is focused on standardized testing scores, student focused, whereas, like specifically in our case at classical education, it's much more full. Like human, you want to teach them to be critical thinkers. You want to teach them how to think, not what to think, because when you think about our tests, we were always evaluated by tests and papers and I mean there's countless stories you could find of people who I mean there was just one in the news this week of I mean it wasn't this week, it was maybe I saw it this week, but it was about this past spring where a kid said that they did that there were two genders and the teacher failed them and it's like, first of all, they can't even write what they believe to be true, whereas, specifically with classical education, once you get to that rhetoric phase which is their high school phase of learning. You're teaching them how to articulate and communicate. I mean almost like defending a thesis is the end goal. You've learned all this knowledge and you've learned how to understand it and put it together Like I kind of think of it as in the early stages of classical education it's the grammar, because that's what used to be called grammar school, right, and so that's a lot of repetition chance.
Kate Salas:My two-year-old knows the first 18 presidents. She has no idea what she's saying, but she's learned that song. And so the idea is, you learn these things at a young age so that when you come to the middle school time, the logic phase, you're starting to piece these things together. And then, as you're piecing them together, you don't have to think like, oh, the area of the circle, I need to learn that formula. You already learned that formula over. You pressed it for years in the grammar phase.
Rachel Wagner:So now when you have to figure out the area of the formula.
Kate Salas:I mean, I don't know how it was for you guys, but before tests I'm cramming remembering the formulas, yeah, and then I have to remember.
Kate Salas:Okay, now that I know the formula, maybe I have to actually figure out, like solve the equation.
Kate Salas:Well, the idea is that stuff is because when they're in the grammar phase, their brains are sponges you guys know that and so they're able to just absorb soap, which is why my son knows all this stuff about presidents, because his brain is just like taking it all in. So if you're teaching your kids what are the ingredients for a peanut butter sandwich over and over and over, Well, then they figure out in middle school well, how did those ingredients go together? Oh, you put peanut butter here, and bread here, and jelly, whatever. And then by the time you're in high school, you're able to teach someone how to do this and what these ingredients are, and you're able to piece it all into one like use all the knowledge that you've gained and be able to articulate that and think critically on I mean, that was a very simple example, obviously but think critically on how issues in the world like that you're not being told what to think, that you have to say this on a test to get these things, but, like, have a true, deeper understanding of the content.
Jason Wagner:I mean, how many times have we talked Rachel where it was just like boy, I wish we would have learned that in school. Like literally probably anyone you could talk to, you could say what do you wish that you would have learned in school? And a lot of it has to do around finances. It's amazing to me because majority of people have no idea like how to budget, like know how much money they make. Just personal fun.
Jason Wagner:Or even like how much money they spend. That's such, like a simple piece that was always missing in the school system. Or even like how to buy a house, or how to buy a car, like all. These are all things that are.
Kate Salas:You know, everybody actually does, right and especially as we push kids to college, where college is increasingly becoming. Forget about the like agendas of that, just the price, right. And I remember like, well, how am I? I'm seeing the price of the university of iowa and I was like you'll just take out loans, like. And she was telling me that because that's what they were told to tell us right Like they weren't, it wasn't like you'll be able to pay it back and I'm like, yeah, 15 years later, I'm still going.
Kate Salas:You know, like one income family, it's very hard to catch up on some of those things, and so it's like those things are really important for kids to know. Like hey, sign these papers that make it seem really fun for four years, like you will be paying and not to not do it if it's absolutely something you need or want. But just be prepared, know what's coming ahead, know what it means to buy a house, what is a mortgage, what is PMI, like all these things that I had no clue until I'm in the situation I have to learn, like on the job, and that's really intimidating as you're approaching adulthood. Like, yeah, or you are an adult at that point. Like okay, now I'm figuring out all of these things which I could have made different decisions. That was a brilliant point.
Jason Wagner:Yeah, like it gets very intimidating when you have to learn on the spot, when you're in that situation when we should have been teaching it to your peanut butter and jelly sandwich, like we've been teaching this over and over again since you were a young age and now you're at the point of you could just put it all together, like it just it, it flows and it makes a lot of sense, but ultimately it comes down to you having control of what goes into the head right and what the sponge is absorbing right and having wanting to because your kids are being, because people like oh, homeschool kids are indoctrinated, yeah.
Rachel Wagner:Yeah.
Kate Salas:So we're public school kids. We were all indoctrinated with some worldview, some beliefs.
Jason Wagner:Yeah.
Kate Salas:Right, Like and that's. It's very. That's why we want to teach our kids to think critically, to look at all the information you're gathering, to draw your own conclusions, to draw your own beliefs on things I'm not saying. I can't make my kids be a believer in Jesus.
Rachel Wagner:I can't.
Kate Salas:I can tell them who Jesus is. I can tell them that he died on the cross for your sins and he loves you more than anything and wants a relationship with you. That's for them to decide. But I get the opportunity to openly and freely talk about that worldview and how that impacts our beliefs on so many different things. But my kids are free to make whatever decisions on those issues that they're going to make.
Kate Salas:I mean, how many times do we know people who don't have the same views as their parents? Right, oh, yeah, it's you don't. And they went to public school. They weren't indoctrinated with their parents' beliefs and they still have. Like, you have the opportunity to make your own decisions as adults. But if you believe in something, you obviously strongly enough you want your kids to be exposed to that, and if you send your kids to a Christian school, that's great. Maybe they, maybe they will get that if that's something that's important to you. But whatever it is, I know there's so many people that really value just being outside. Like that's. One of the other things that we love about homeschool is we have the freedom to be outside a good portion of the year. Obviously in the Midwest, you know some. Some of those winter days are real cold and you're like.
Kate Salas:I'm not. It's really nice to have a fenced in yard. I'm like you two are old enough to go play out there by yourself. Yeah, but you know you get the freedom to do so much more like exploring and hands-on learning and fun, like they're only little for so long, like you want them to have fun and that is what develops a love for learning is when they're enjoying it. And so when you have kids that push back a little bit if they're not expected to be on and be good for six hours, five days a week, to then come home to you and feel a little bit more you know squirrely you can find what works for them, and especially in kindergarten, first grade, as you're establishing routines, it is not, I mean, it could be 20 minutes here, 20 minutes here, 20 minutes here, like it's not as intimidating.
Kate Salas:And again, coming from someone who made the decision with no clue what that was going to look like. I did have multiple friends that, like I said, were homeschooling, but I didn't even think to ask them. I just thought of this one friend and I was like, just tell me what to do. You know, as I'm pregnant and puking I mean literally her first day of kindergarten. I'm puking in the parking lot because I have hyperemesis when I'm pregnant and I get super sick. So I'm like puking on the sidewalk and then like, all right, let's go walk you in 15 minutes before it comes back, cause I puked seven times already on the way here.
Kate Salas:So it's just there are challenges. I don't want to make it out through rose-colored glasses, but you figure it out and you just pick your heart right. Every there's a mantra for life being really good with your budget is hard, but so is being in a ton of debt. Yeah.
Rachel Wagner:Yeah, pick your heart. That's great. That's such a great point. I was going to ask, too, what does like as the mom in primary homeschool, what does your prep time look like Like? How, what did the curriculums look like, I guess? Or what do you have to do to be prepared to do a lesson?
Kate Salas:I think that is different for everyone, but because of the setup we have with the co-school, they provide a, they provide a lesson plan for you, so I don't have to come up with, like, what are we going to? How long is it going to take to move through this issue, this topic? It's timed out for you. So, again, there's so many different philosophies, hundreds of thousands of curriculums out there I mean maybe not a hundred thousand, but thousands for sure of curriculums that you can choose from to decide what is a good fit for you and your kids. But I don't have a ton of prep time in planning my year because I chose an option that has someone that kind of really guides you through it. If you don't want to do that, I have a friend and I think it's probably I don't know she probably spends, she likes to do like months at a time, so she'll spend like a few hours on a Saturday just like planning out that month and then she has it like blocked, if you will, in that way. But as far as just like actual day-to-day stuff, because I have the lesson planned on probably 20 minutes, making sure I have all the materials that I want, that I have my teacher books out. Because, again, in my particular curriculums it's like the teacher reads the bolded part and then some version of the unbolded part is what your student is supposed to get out of what you talked about.
Kate Salas:So it's very user-friendly, I think, for people are so intimidated. They're like I know nothing about teaching, and that's not to say, oh, you don't need to know anything, you can learn. But also there's so many tools that help you do it. Well, because I saw a post from a mom. She ended up becoming a principal and then she left to homeschool her kids and she's talked about.
Kate Salas:She's like while you were in college, like you don't get a ton of time like practicing the actual teaching. They're teaching you so many things that are not like here's how you actually do the job day to day, and so many teachers will tell you that that that first year is like a whole nother year of school for them because they are learning as they go, which makes sense, right, like we talked about, until you're on the job. I mean, I know another friend, I think she went to Northern. They did their student teaching like one of the first semesters so that then they could maybe it wasn't Northern but somewhere that was like earlier on in their educations that they could then come back and talk about it. I was like that's a really good idea instead of having it be your last semester.
Kate Salas:But yeah, you can figure definitely some prep time. But if you're doing it without the help of somebody else, there are still curriculums that do a ton of the like that lay out really well for you what you want. And I know a lot of people homeschool through summer too. So you can decide like, hey, we do six weeks on, one week off, that's what our co-school does, so we get a week break. So if you're finding like hey, this subject didn't really click, you can use that time to really dig in.
Jason Wagner:What I wanted to ask you was you just said you might go through summer. Today's Friday.
Kate Salas:We're in the summer.
Jason Wagner:What are you doing today?
Kate Salas:Nothing, I don't. I'm not one of the people that do it through the summer and again, I think that's because our schedule is set up so that we have breaks throughout the year and are able to finish Like we. We definitely focus on the times that we're on, but it's still. That's not five, six hours a day, that's two. An hour and a half maybe was for my kindergartner last year and two for my second grader, and so today they, they went to the park yesterday and my daughter ended up having a fever last night, so she's probably resting watching TV, but the other two, I mean, we'll just hang out, We'll play. They like to go to camps and stuff like that too. But our summers are pretty much more like a traditional summer, not as heavy with school.
Rachel Wagner:Yeah, I wanted to ask we didn't really touch on this too much what was your background, kate? Because as you talk about this and articulated them like, you sound like a teacher to me. You're teaching me so much right now, but what? What is your background?
Kate Salas:So I got my degree in sociology, which without a master's degree does not give you much, I'll tell you that. So I actually wanted to be a teacher. I wanted to work with kids, so I thought that was what I would do, but decided after like a couple of years in college I was going to move towards more like social work. But I went sociology so I could get a degree and be done, because I was ready to be done. But then after that I worked a lot of different places. I did work primarily at early childhood center with toddlers as my main group, but I've done some like a handful of things. If I ever go back outside of the house I would probably want to do. I either want to become a doula, a postpartum doula.
Rachel Wagner:Or a doula, is that something?
Kate Salas:you should want to do as well.
Rachel Wagner:I don't want to do that, but I think, should we ever have another child, I would hire one. Yes, I think they. We ever have another child? I would hire one.
Kate Salas:Yes, I think they're incredible for what they offer to people. I'm having kids, so I will not be having a doula, but I think, as I look back, that would be fun. Or I worked at a nursing home as a caseworker and a lot of my residents were mentally ill or some of them were more just geriatric, but I think I would potentially go back there. There's a huge need there and not a lot of people want to work with the elderly.
Kate Salas:Kids are a lot more fun and I think there's a lot of similarities between working with the elderly and there's obviously the nursing side of it, where you're administering meds and changing bedpans, things like that. But mine was more like the emotional helping, working with the families. So I think ultimately probably something with people, but I didn't have like a set career that I was in before having kids. I kind of tried a few different things and I want. One of the other things I wanted to say was I know she had talked about a few resources, but Leslie did in the previous podcast but, some of the other things that I think are that I didn't again.
Kate Salas:When you don't know anything about it, you're like what do I do? Like even just community centers have? There's one by us, they have it's called a gym and swim, and it fills up within like an hour of opening. I think once and you mentioned it too Like once you started, you're like, oh my gosh, there's homeschoolers everywhere.
Rachel Wagner:Yes.
Kate Salas:And they provide so many different things, whether it's classes, art classes or ceramics or archery. There's so many different avenues. I mean, youtube alone has a ton. Obviously I don't want my kids watch YouTube unattended because it could be dangerous, but I sit with them and that's where we, that's where the he, my son, has learned so much of the president stuff. I mean, his favorite book is his president encyclopedia but he, I love that.
Kate Salas:We've watched so many videos and that's how he's learned things about how tall they are, and so there's just like resources and places that you don't necessarily think of a typical like school setup. And there's also I mean, the library has museum passes, they have events and classes. Obviously you can get a ton of materials between books for pleasure or academic stuff. And then the Facebook groups. Like I mentioned earlier, the homeschool community is some of the most supportive people I've ever met. They want you to thrive and to enjoy what you're doing, and so they are so open and free with like. They don't gatekeep any information like, oh, here, do this and do this, and sometimes you're like this is a lot. But once you, you know the amount of Facebook pages that people are like, hey, I want to do this or hey, I'm playing my kid, what is here? I mean 10, 15 people respond to these posts because people are like yeah, we'll walk you through it. And so I think if people are considering homeschooling, it is so much more doable and less intimidating once you take the leap. But getting yourself to take the leap feels like very daunting.
Kate Salas:It's not something you grew up doing Like. I was not someone. I mean I have friends who like knew from the time they were pregnant like I will homeschool my kids. That wasn't us, and so I was very much like pulling together, which is why probably my personality really appreciates the co-school aspect, where I have that support, have that guidance, but that I'm still in control of it. You know, I don't get to pick the curriculum. The curriculum is picked for me, but for me I enjoy that because otherwise all the choices would probably be a little bit overwhelming. And if I find something that I want to supplement with, I can, because we can do that when either over the summer or if school and as they get older, a lot of stuff becomes. From what I've been told from friends who have older kids self-taught, like they are doing a lot of. I mean there's online classes, there's so many, you think even Spanish, because someone asked well, how would they like learn a second language?
Kate Salas:And I'm like there's so many apps that teach you about like they can look at the books, but then also like I think, like I don't know if I'm allowed to say Duolingo or something like that, like by name but things that you can utilize that are just free to anybody I mean maybe not free, but like free to access. You can. You can get to this stuff very easily that have such a like and they do it on their own time and and you could do it as needed. So there's just so many resources that people don't think of. I think, naturally, that once you start dipping your toes in, you can see that they're all over.
Rachel Wagner:Yeah, I. I just recently joined the Facebook group. It's like the Northwest homeschoolers group, or something on Facebook and just like perusing through the pages there's, there's so many things that you can participate in, learn from, even like get curriculums from other people who are? Selling them or giving away for free to learn Like it's. It is actually almost overwhelming, I think. The amount of activities available, groups available, there's so much, so, so much that I just never knew about.
Kate Salas:You know, and it's right here right, you know it's cool yeah, and you know, when you talk about people who are like, oh, you're sheltering your kids, you're like I don't necessarily know all these other kids yeah, that my kids are going to potentially be interacting with. But you get to decide those things and you just have more of like a say in what your kids are exposed to ultimately for good and bad friends, information like curriculum, all those things it's a lot more tailored to them.
Jason Wagner:You gave a really good argument. Yeah, well, thanks. No, it's. It's honestly really inspiring and I'm really glad you were able to come on and share.
Jason Wagner:Should we wrap, cause I mean, this is, I feel like we could keep going, but keep going. There's like so much more that we want to talk to you about. But yeah, just for the sake of time here, why don't we? Yeah, why don't we wrap? So at the end of our show, we always just kind of do like what's the biggest takeaway from the conversation, and to me, my biggest takeaway here is that what you talked about really connecting how your son is so into the presidents, and the only reason that he's had that is because he developed a passion. And the only reason he developed the passion was because he had the time. And so when you have the time and you're not such on a structured day you have freedom of thought and freedom of will to really develop that passion. And I think, honestly, I think a lot of times, majority of adults don't have passions, right, because were we ever given the time to develop a passion?
Kate Salas:Not in our culture, not in the Western world.
Jason Wagner:We are go, go, go and that really clicked for me when you said that, and it's just wow, you're right. If it really comes down to, the statistics are showing that you don't need to have six hours of nonstop sitting and listening and repetition to really learn something. You can get it done in a much more efficient manner. 20 minutes, 20 minutes here, 20 minutes there you have the rest of your day to all of a sudden. Well, what do I really want to do?
Kate Salas:Well, and even you introduce playing like if you're playing grocery store at your play kitchen and you have fake money as one of your tools that you use to homeschool. Oh, I want to pay for this my daughter. Can you be the cashier? And she has to count out the money. Like you're teaching. They're learning in ways that isn't set up at a table, where they're just looking at a worksheet. You know like you can learning all day long, even if it's not just that structured set 20 minutes.
Jason Wagner:So that's awesome.
Rachel Wagner:Yeah, I mean that that ties into what my biggest takeaway was going to be was learning life skills and learning through watching, participating in mentorship, like your example of going to the store and having your kids do the scanning and doing the pain, and you know how many kids go out into the world and like can't figure out how to pump gas or just do like basic life skills as we got to, like buying homes.
Jason Wagner:Oh my God, how many people don't know how to pump gas.
Rachel Wagner:Yeah, yeah, I mean because they're you know they. I mean because they're you know they're not sheltered, but they just they haven't had to do it yet and they're not necessarily with their parents when those things are happening. And so your kids are out there learning all of these things that they're going to do for the rest of their life, and so it's not going to feel scary, it's not going to feel intimidating to them when it's time for them to do it on their own. So that is something that I just key is especially for me, as I'm like sitting here thinking about no, I'm too intimidated, I can't do it. It's like, well, pick my hard right. Is it going to be hard throughout the days when I'm trying to figure it out, or is it going to be hard at night when I'm trying to force two hours of homework? You know, it's like what's a better setup for the kids and better outcome for them? Pick your heart, it's all hard.
Jason Wagner:It's all hard.
Kate Salas:Yeah, and you can always pivot Like that's. The thing that I think I also really am grateful for is like if I ever get to a point that I feel like they're missing something that I can't provide, I can either find an option or, if I think a public, private anything is going to help them. I can make that choice. You're not specifically in Illinois. We are not stuck.
Rachel Wagner:Yeah.
Kate Salas:You know cause. There are other States. We've considered leaving Illinois, probably like many of other people have, but like one of the reasons it's great to stay here is because even in other States, like you have to test yearly, your homeschool kids have to be tested yearly. Like we don't even have to register our kids to be homeschooled, so it's yeah.
Rachel Wagner:That's a great point too. We had somebody reach out to us after we had the Leslie podcast that she shared that she was homeschooled for a couple of years and then was public school for a few years. Back to homeschool for a year or two and then public school after that, and I was so fascinated but I'm like, well, wait a minute, how did how did that work for you? Were your transitions really hard? You know how was it going by? And she's like it was fine. It was fine, you know, and it just matched whatever their family dynamic was doing at the time. They were traveling one of the years and different aspects of moving and I was just like wow, like everything, just like opening my eyes. You know, it's like this isn't an end, all be all. It doesn't have to be. If something changes for your family or for your kids, like you adjust, you just keep going. Yeah, it's really interesting.
Jason Wagner:Yeah, yeah, exactly, kate, your biggest takeaway from this conversation.
Kate Salas:I think, ultimately is just like parents, I don't think we can sit on the sidelines, kind of go against them. Whether it's little boys and girls boys specifically not being able to be active during the day, like you have to be intentional in their home to get them that opportunity to be out. Whether you're sending them to public school, even if you're a little concerned about some of the curriculum, make sure you're asking good questions. Make sure you're asking good questions, like I just don't think parents, even if you don't choose to homeschool, I think you don't I don't think you really have the option to just like send them and hope for the best anymore. I think that with between social media, so many other things that are up against our kids while being, you just have to really be an active parent and and pay attention.
Jason Wagner:Yeah, yeah, yeah, I and I definitely see that. Yeah, that's great Boy. You had a lot of great stuff. Yeah, yeah, yeah, all right. Well, thank you again for coming. If somebody wanted to reach out to you, would that be okay? Like you know, it kind of seems like there's a lot of questions and, yeah, I feel like people just need resources. Would you be okay with yeah? Pass along a number or something.
Kate Salas:Yeah, I've given my email. Sure, the easiest way, sure, say it now, or? Oh, if you want to if yeah, I mean it's just my last name dot, my first name solace.
Jason Wagner:dot caitlin at gmailcom yeah, cool, yeah, awesome, awesome, okay, thank you so much. Thanks for listening. This was totally jam-packed and I'm so glad that we were able to do a follow-up episode. And I'm also, do you know Leslie? Because, okay, no, no, I've never met her.
Kate Salas:No, okay, well, maybe you guys should meet because she was great, she had so much and that's why I was listening to hers. I was like, okay, great, I can just, cause there's so many technical things that she talked about with the history you know the Rothschild and all these things I was like, just go there, cause she listened to that podcast. She did all that I don't have to. I could just share my experience, so yeah.
Jason Wagner:Yeah, that was just a few episodes ago, so check that one out if you haven't listened to it. But, kate, thank you again, and everyone.